Religion, is based on all sorts of war, no? - Mona Nomura

Yes, Mona, absolutely! More wars have been fought over conflicts of religion than anything else. But I'm getting at (not so elegantly, I confess) one faith in particular - how can all these so-called Christians hoot with pride every time we blow something up? - Anthony Citrano

If the targets aren't of their religion it's easy to dehumanize them. And for a lot of hardcore religious people there's nothing better than having someone to 'save.' - sergiooo

How can anyone trust religion is my question war is more logical then *give peace a chance* but then again i am a depressed cynic - Cecil Sandus

everyone needs a time out - CW™

I hoot for pride when we defend the country not just cause we blow something up. I'm not a Christian that believes peace will solve all our problems. See we have evil in the world and saying you just want peace to a person holding a gun to your head or saying you want peace to some one flying a plane into a building doesn't work. - Colide81 (James)

There is a time and season for everything except hypocrisy. GOP loves fail whales;) - Roney Smith

I don't think Christ would have even gone for defensive stuff. He was a bigtime pacifist. I personally support defensive military action as a last resort... but how Christian is it to attack people who are not a threat to us? As in, optional wars? - Anthony Citrano

Or even: revenge? - Anthony Citrano

It depends on the reason behind the war. (And yeah revenge is definitely not a good reason.) - Rachel R.

Rachel do you ever feel it congruent with Christianity's tenets to attack those who are no threat to ourselves? If so, when? - Anthony Citrano

I guess I don't know what you're talking about. - Rachel R.

Is it in keeping with Christianity / Christ's message to attack those who pose no threat to us? You said it depended on the reason, I'm trying to explore that. - Anthony Citrano

You said "How can a true Christian be pro-war" and I said "it depends on the motive for the war". That was the question *I* was answering. - Rachel R.

So then these pro-war "Christians" have opted for a rather selective interpretation of Christ's teachings, I guess. I just don't get how one can opt for war - that is, to proactively start wars - and be a true Christian. - Anthony Citrano

How can anyone be blanket "pro-war"? I mean does that mean "any war for any reason anywhere"? That's the part I don't get. I can't see how anyone, Christian or not, would say that. - Rachel R.

+1 Rachel - Shey

Anthony: there are a multitude of selective interpretations of the teachings of Christ, that's why there are almost innumerable denominations of the Christian religion. - FFing Enigma (aka Tina)

Read up on St. Augustine and the Just War doctrine - Jeff Quinton

@Anthony Christ was a "bigtime pacifist"? It is a misconception that Christ was a pacifist pushover. Christ got angry. Christ was sarcastic. Christ spoke his mind. Whether or not you believe in his teachings, there were times in his life on earth that he wasn't peaceful at all. - elroy

+1 elroy - Shey

Familiar with Just War doctrine, Jeff... along with many other things invented centuries after Christ was dead. Might as well bring up the Crusades. I'm sure Christ would have been pretty psyched about that. - Anthony Citrano

Elroy most theological scholars see Christ as a pacifist. I'd be very interested in hearing anything he said that you interpret as encouraging aggression against others. - Anthony Citrano

The most well known example is when Jesus kicks "money changers" out of the temple of Jerusalem. He kicked tables, used a whip, and was angry at all of the sin being carried out. - elroy

@Gregory: sometimes our thought-rays pass one another like ships in the night, but this one resonated with me. Well put, and thanks. - Anthony Citrano

Many think of God as this big warmy and fuzzy Santa kinda figure. When you look at the Old Testament you see things were fairly cut and dry: you are either on the team or not. I cannot remember who, but He was upset with a leader because they did not destroy EVERYONE in the city. No spare the kids, be kind to the women, etc. everyone. So to your question: if a group believes they are following the direction of God, that is how they do the things they do in His name. I think for the modern mind it is extremely difficult to grasp the concept that to God there is no gray area. Having said that I do not presume to know His will as it relates to wars. Sometimes unfortunately those in power or with the microphone do. - Ruth Ferguson

An atheist trying to prove a point about Christians using Christ is like McCain trying to win over Democrats with socialism. There's a little lack of credibility. - Shey

Yeah Ruth you're dredging up the troublesome Father, though - with all that Old Testament speak. I was just talking about the Son, and those who claim to follow him. Your last sentence hits it best (and is probably why we're in so much trouble.) - Anthony Citrano

The same way many are pro life (anti abortion) and pro death penalty. With a lot of hypocrisy and self righteousness. - Jeff P. Henderson

Ruth -- Old Testament cultism is awash with genocidal racism. It may be its most distinguishing feature. - Sean McBride

But Anthony, the Son says He is one with the Father, there is no separation. However I see your pt, we do not see the level of anger in Jesus generally that was shown with God. He does come across as kinder to a degree. However, He had a different purpose. As someone said online today - He was a community organizer...LOL. But you have to keep in mind that I believe He said that He did not come to change the law, but to fulfill it. - Ruth Ferguson

This is one of the most puzzling, and troubling concepts to understand. If true that Bush's claim that God gave him the word to go to war, what kind of God does he worship> Another thought, how can one call himself a God loving christian and approve the deaths of 132 people (while Governor of Texas). No offense to those who call themselves Christians, but their actions and what is in their hearts should be seriously 'vetted' before making the claim. - jcunwired

Ruth, if there is no separation then we mustn't use separate proper nouns. ;) We see two different gods in the Old and New Testaments, as you allude to.... and Christianity is a recent thing, supposedly springing from Christ's life and his redemption of mankind. It's hard for me to see these people who call themselves Christians torturing and murdering innocents. It's not something Jesus would have been very keen on. - Anthony Citrano

@Jody - exactly. - Anthony Citrano

OT: militaristic ethnocentric nationalism. NT: pacific trans-ethnocentrism, trans-nationalism and universalism. It's a huge cultural and ideological divide that probably can never be bridged. Contemporary Christian fundamentalists have for the most part entirely abandoned the NT component of the tradition. They cite Joshua much more than the Sermon on the Mount. - Sean McBride

While I am not personally *for* war, I don't think that being a Christian specifically dictates that I can't be *pro-war*. I think that there are lots of justifiable reasons to be at war - justice, human-rights protections... I'm not at ALL saying anything about our current conflict, but in general I have no problem reconciling the two. - Hal