GOD that's infuriating. I get it pretty bad myself, being brown, muslim, and occasionally sporting a beard doesn't help, but I went ahead and made myself a fake Press Pass over at http://bighugelabs.com/badge... and have found 9 times out of 11 (yes, that's right, 9/11) that's all it takes to get an idiot copper off your back. That, and tell them you're an Intellectual Properties Lawyer.
- Almond Butterscotch
Ah I shoulda explained. So I did some googling and apparently it's only this bad on RAW and not JPEG. I'm kinda drunk now so I'll test this theory out tomorrow.
- kinobe
odd. sounds like an interesting effect worth playing with? Do you really notice the difference if you shoot the same photo in RAW and JPG?
- Thomas Hawk
It's more the application than it is the camera.... here's a link http://photo.net/digital... which is one of many discussing this problem. It appears the problem is because the S90 is so new there aren't any profiles for its RAW files yet so the beta profile that Canon or Adobe (I'm a lil tipsy so not everything I read is coming thru) has provided is over-correcting a barrel distortion that is not actually there, hence why JPEG shots are okay.
- kinobe
So more reading, looks like people who use the Canon supplied app don't get this problem but those who use Adobe (LR or PS) are getting it. I see it with LR 2.5, LR3 is taking its own sweet time to import all my photos so I can't tell..... and funny, I just took 2 test shots (on RAW+JPEG setting) and 1 of the 2 RAWs has ridiculous barrel distortion when viewed thru Picasa 3..... I'm quite confused and need sleep so more on this tomorrow gnite
- kinobe
that was a good thread. Pierre made some good points, especially towards the end. The impersonation issue is an interesting one. Clearly the Flickr Community Guidelines read "Flickr is not a venue for you to harass, abuse, impersonate, or intimidate others." Sometimes people are allowed to break this rule, sometimes they are not. For example. Someone can take my avatar (something that...
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- Thomas Hawk
damn, I just realized that this last paragraph on my part was finger pointy. I hope Flickr doesn't nuke this group.
- Thomas Hawk
I wonder if the Flickr Staff read this? Thomas Hunk has been deleted.
- Adam Harrison
Thomas Hunk was one of the better trolls. Definitely gave me a double-take most times it posted.
- Stephanie Keating
oh no! flickr staff read this? *coughs* ... i love flirck i love flickr help i love flickr helf forum i love flickr help forum thugs ...
- Mo Tabesh
Heather has an account here on FriendFeed. She's blocking me.
- Thomas Hawk
Where hasn't she blocked you? How she treats you, you'd think she was a bitter ex.
- Adam Harrison
"On 7 August I received the following email "Hi veggiesosage, In joining Flickr, you agreed to abide by the Terms of Service and Community Guidelines. Specifically, you must not abuse, harass, threaten, impersonate or intimidate other Flickr members: flickr.com/guidelines.gne If we continue to see further harassing behavior through comments or FlickrMail, we will take further action that may include termination without warning. Regards, Zack" I replied the same day asking for an explanation as I honestly am quite sure that I have not harassed anybody, nor impersonated anybody for that matter, and I also complained about what I considered to a be wholly false accusation. The only thing I can think of is that my account has been hacked but I really can't see how that has happened. I chased it up 22 Aug, and 24 October yet have had nothing more than acknowledgments. How do you persuade flickr staff to treat you in a reasonable manner and a) not make false accusations without explanation and b) reply to complaints? vs"
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
Rather then threaten Flickr members with account termination and then refuse to follow up on their original accusations via email, Flickr ought to take FriendFeed's approach and simply give people the tool to block other users. This would make far more sense and could probably save Yahoo some money by not having to pay salaries and benefits for a censorship staff. It would also result in far less aggravation for their users.
- Thomas Hawk
Adam I remember her from her case that she posted in DMU before it was nuked. That will be an interesting one to follow. It would seem to me preposterous that flickr would nuke an account because they didn't believe the person was the gender that they said they were. This case feels almost over the top to me. We'll see how Flickr comes back and responds. It does seem like there is almost a daily barrage of people complaining over having their accounts deleted in the help forum.
- Thomas Hawk
And what happens to transgendered folk? Those who are biologically male and mentally/emotionally/in every other way female, and wish to represent themselves as such (and vice versa)? It seems to me that this is a legitimate concern.
- Stephanie Keating
Stephanie, I can't find it now. I should have taken a screenshot. He may have deleted it. It was earlier this month.
- Thomas Hawk
I've been looking for that thread myself and having some difficulty finding it. I remember it clearly. Could the butthole have deleted it?
- Roger
Thomas, do you remember what the thread was discussing?
- Roger
I thought it was Pierre's first post back but I could be wrong.
- Thomas Hawk
Here's the Searcher saying that I "get away with posting stolen content" all the time. Nice that he's allowed to do this in a forum where I can't defend myself. http://www.flickr.com/help.... Seems pretty fingerpointy to me.
- Thomas Hawk
I just assume FLICKR offers no support but like an exclusive nightclub, I put up with the abuse. It's that good.
- sean808080
I don't mind the no service part as much, I just mind the deleting people's content that doesn't belong to them for stupid reasons part.
- Thomas Hawk
I can buy one lens, what should it be? I have a canon 300D, the standard 18-55 mm, a 50mm 1.8, and a 70-300mm that I rarely use... (if you know my stream) what would you suggest? or should I forget the glass and just save for a 5D body?
How much do you have at your disposal? Personally, I just bought the 28-135, and my sights are next set on the Tamron 17-50 (I know where I can get it relatively cheap).
- Stephanie Keating
Forget the glass and go for the 5D body.
- Thomas Hawk
kinobe you read my mind, I'd like them all... but I think your right TH, I find many of my shots just don't hit the mark, too much noise... the 300D needs a trade in.
- charlotte
I was amazed by how differently (and better) my lenses worked when I moved from a 20D to a 5D. The full-frame CMOS is AMAZING with the non EF-S lenses. It really uses them to their full potential. If I were you, I'd upgrade the body.
- Steve Dorsey
i LOVE my 85mm f/1.8 and it's not terribly expensive
- Ryan Dearth
i don't think charlotte needs 85mm. she does a lot of landscapes.
- Mo Tabesh
Charlotte, I'm not sure about the crop factor on Canon bodies, but the 20mm f2.8 (if it works on the 300D) would be good for both street and landscape shots that you do. It would distort slightly, so not great for the architectural detail stuff, but I'd heartily suggest a Tamron 90mm for that. Both are quite affordable and high quality. I know people are recommending bodies, but I've always been of the opinion that glass is more important.
- Ryan MacLean
Wide L lens are *great*, but very expensive. I love my 24mm and 14mm, but these are over $1,000 each. I'd say the best value for the money at this point would be for Charlotte to upgrade to a full frame sensor. The 5d makes sense to me here now at this point. Later on wide L lenses definitely, but they will be even more impactful for wide angle stuff with a full frame camera.
- Thomas Hawk
from iPhone
That said, I just noticed the recommendation was a 5D mark I (not mark II as I had thought), I've been eying one myself, and it can be had for a good price used at this point.
- Ryan MacLean
Ryan, that's a fine lens, I'd rather invest in better L lenses though myself. Saves money over upgrading to L lenses later.
- Thomas Hawk
from iPhone
Ah I didn't realize that it wasn't an L lens (I'm of the Nikon religion). Seems like the first thing I would get with a used 5D, then the nifty fifty and some lens adapters so I could use old lenses. Also just noticed how many lens choices C has!
- Ryan MacLean
Thanks everyone... some great suggestions, you've helped me sort my priorities... new body it is, and the L's later, starting with a wide one... I'll start my hunting, if you see anything in your net travels with low actuations please let me know :)
- charlotte
What would you be using it for? Landscape? Portraits? Concert photography? Macros?
- Adam Harrison
Lens wise, I'd like a wide for landscape/cityscape shots, and also something for abstracts.
- charlotte
I own a 50mm f/1.4. It's a great lens and very sharp, but the color isn't as good as my 24-70 f/2.8 L. I keep reaching for that L glass. It's very addicting. Personally, my next purchase is a wide prime for the 7D I have on order (shoot a 40D now, want video for work). Unfortunately, there isn't a good mid-priced prime in the 24-35mm range. They all have too much chromatic aberration or softness at wide apertures. The 24 L is the only one I like.
- Greg Benedict
I also have an EFS 10-22. Pure madness that forces you to get up close.
- Greg Benedict
5D (body only) costs an enormous 2700. It is full frame, a real class camera and you will take great photos with it using a standard 18-55 mm. But you are taking a lot of lovely close up family shots. So why not get the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 that costs just 439? That Sigma is not perfect but gets good reviews. I am saving up for the Sigma too, together with the Canon T1i. I have the money,...
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- Saul Davis
nice gallery there Saul, thanks, I think the body upgrade is the right way forward for me though, a long term investment, there are some good deals about for second hand, and a few places still selling new for low 2,000 US.
- charlotte
not meaning to offend, but those HDR shots are among the worst i've seen - way overcooked to the point of cartoonishness, and the halos along the edges are a sign that the photog hasn't really mastered the technique.
- johnny action
I'd like to distantly meet up my boot with that motherfucker's camera.
- Pierre Honeyman
apparently they get huge Federal subsidies to make up for the losses from operations. From wikipedia: "The final bill, spurred on by the September 12 Metrolink collision in California and retitled "Rail Safety Improvement Act of 2008", was signed into law by President Bush on October 16, 2008. The bill appropriates $2.6 billion a year in Amtrak funding through 2013." Seems taxpayers subsidize a great deal of train travel for people.
- Thomas Hawk
It's a shame. Before I got my dog, taking the train between Portland and Seattle was one of my favorite ways to travel.
- Adam Harrison
I gotta shoot more trains. I wonder if AMTRAK goes away at some point. Seems sort of wasteful spending so much taxpayer money on it.
- Thomas Hawk
It's no more wasteful than spending oodles of taxpayer money on air travel or auto travel.
- John (bird whisperer)
Do we spend a lot of taxpayer money on air or auto travel?
- Thomas Hawk
Federal tax money pays for TSA and air traffic controllers. Most airports are built and maintained by quasi-government agencies. Think of the billions of tax dollars that go into maintaining local, state, and federal roads.
- John (bird whisperer)
I think it is a myth that European train travel is "affordable" (not sure about Asia). In my experience it is quite expensive if you want to travel distances like those in the US or Canada. The reason why train travel in Europe is functional is that it is ubiquitous and because generally destinations are relatively close. If you want to get from any place to any other place -- the...
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- Brian Sullivan
Don't those federal tax dollars though that go to TSA and air traffic controllers etc. come from federal tax surcharges on airline tickets? I'd bet that for most people highway travel in a car doesn't cost the Govt. on average of $32 per person. Who knows, I could be wrong on that though.
- Thomas Hawk
Don't the ridiculous gasoline taxes in Europe subsidize their money-losing rail system?
- Dave Roth
LOL @Glen. Californian's are in a league of their own :)
- Roberto Bonini
Believable. Considering a train tix can cost as much or more (in most cases) than a plane ticket, I can see how they're losing money. When it comes to spending that much cash, time becomes an issue. Scenery and experience aside, if it takes me longer than driving AND costs 3x the amount of a plane ticket, guess what I'm not taking?
- Anika
I sure hope it doesn't go away. Gasoline will eventually run out. We need passenger trains to move more people per gallon of fuel expended. Amtrak needs a huge overhaul. And those TARP funds would have been better used to repair & maintain existing infrastructure as well as to expand it.
- Spidra Webster
Why not promote trains, that are higher density, more efficient, between common destinations. And why is public spending on trains a waste, if it serves more people? $$ that goes to building roads thus promoting even more fossil fuel dependency - is that a good idea? We made a huge turn in the 50s and removed rail systems in our major cities. We need to turn it around again.
- anna sauce
Best part about taking the train vs. plane: I can bike to the station, put my bike on the rack, ride however many miles, and then bike to my destination. Personally, I'd be quite happy if not a damn dime of my taxes were spent on highways that my bike is not allowed on and on running airports that I'm presently avoiding because I'm sick of airlines finding new ways to add surcharges.
- Wirehead
I dunno, I thought the train prices in Europe were pretty affordable... even for night trains you only had to pay an extra 60-100 euro for a sleeper car, usually. Way more affordable than buying a car, paying for insurance and gas, probably. And damn, those trains go *everywhere*.
- Stephanie Keating
I would take the train more often in Canada if A) they were more affordable, and B) they were faster, and C) if they went to a greater variety of destinations.
- Stephanie Keating
And how expensive are train trips to siberia from moscow??
- Roberto Bonini
So I'd assume that all of those gasoline taxes go to repairing the roads and all of those airline surcharge taxes go towards maintaining the TSA etc. Am I wrong on this or are all forms of transportation equally subsidized by taxpayers. I was just surprised to learn that AMTRAK lost so much money per passenger.
- Thomas Hawk
Amtrak argues that airports and highways receive far more subsidies than they do. I can't find Amtrak's position paper right now but here's an argument along similar lines: http://www.trainweb.org/moksrai...
- Stephen Mack
I wonder how much we could save on the highways in California if we got rid of 90% of the California Highway Patrol. I'd be all for getting rid of them.
- Thomas Hawk
They will stick around. They would just get a bailout from the government.
- Spencer
Then again, I wonder how much money the CHP actually ends up making for the state :D
- Victor Ganata
CHP and speeding laws in general are unnecessary. It's ridiculous that people get tickets for driving 85 mph from SF to LA on I5. That's just stupid.
- Thomas Hawk
Since there were a few questions about rail travel costs in Europe, here are a few examples for Germany: the high-speed ICE (and slightly slower IC) trains travel at hourly intervals between all major and minor cities. You can get an annual rail discount card for 25% off @50 Euros, or 50% off for 200 Euros. A 400 km trip to Berlin on the high-speed train takes about 2.5 hours and costs...
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- Nils Sandin
@Spidra, they are when they give me speeding tickets for doing nothing that really endangers anyone's life, myself in included. Setting up speed traps just to hit people in their wallet for something that is no big deal (which seems like 90% of what they do). Driving 85mps on I5 down to L.A. and on other major highways shouldn't result in a speeding ticket. Just another example of govt....
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- Thomas Hawk
There is some data showing that higher speed limits mean higher rates of mortality. http://www.ajph.org/cgi... I suppose the pertinent question is whether people's behavior really change with increased enforcement.
- Victor Ganata
I bet if everybody drove 30 mph we'd have lower rates of mortality as well. The point is that it would not make sense to force everyone to drive 30mph to save a few lives. My driving 85mph on I5 (which I've done dozens of times) in no way endangers anyone. The odds of my getting in an accident statistically between driving 70 and 85 are statistically insignificant. Yet having to pay...
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- Thomas Hawk
Amtrak is another example of a failed government run program. They charge $2.00 for a can of Coke and they can't make a profit? I'll bet a private company could find a way to make a profit there.
- David C. Cooper
Just because you don't like the inconvenience of being ticketed for breaking a law you knew about ahead of time doesn't mean the CHP is unnecessary. If you don't like paying a $300 ticket, don't speed. It would be very difficult for small city police departments to chase suspects across many counties. The CHP has jurisdiction over the highways and what happens on them.
- Spidra Webster
Thomas, if you're driving that fast, you deserve a ticket. My families' lives are worth a lot more than your $300 ticket. SLOW DOWN! ><
- David C. Cooper
CHP has jurisdiction over more that the highways. The CHP is California's state police force.
- David C. Cooper
David, have you driven I5? Everybody's driving 85 up and down I5. Really I'd be more in the way if I drove slower. I don't feel that I'm putting anyone's lives at risk at all by going with the flow of traffic at 85. Certainly if I was convinced in *any* way that it was dangerous, I wouldn't be driving at that speed with my own kids in the car. I don't have a problem with the CHP if they...
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- Thomas Hawk
If there is no downside to losing money, you will tend to lose lots of money.
- Alex Scrivener
Thomas, yes I've driven I5 for the past 20 years, and if everyone is driving 85 then who do you think are all those people you keep passing?
- David C. Cooper
Just drove through germany, they feel really safe and I kept getting overtaken though I was driving 110 mph :-)
- Ricardo Liberato
hum..it would be sad if passenger trains go but maybe that will make it possible to build that super speed train they keep talking about in CA>
- Anna Lynn M.
CW, it's a bit of a catch-22, if more people took the train, it'd be cheaper. The way I compare the govt. investment in fossil-fuel options (car/air): you don't have to have a ticket to drive 280. If I had to pay for driving 280, we could really compare apples to apples. But since hte govt. has subsidized the oil industry, and created this network of freeways that we don't have to pay...
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- anna sauce
There is no practical way to take Amtrak between Atlanta and Chicago (coincidentally [or not] the two cities with the busiest airports in the US). If they don't eventually do a massive expansion of the passenger rail network, it will continue to be useless for the vast majority of Americans. And yes, I am a bit jealous of the east coast folks that can make practical use of Amtrak. I wish I could.
- Scott Coulter
hmmmm.. not sure. Most exposures are pretty fast, less than a second. Unless I'm doing tripod, motion, night type stuff. I've gotta revisit my total exposures taken number sometime. Plus I need to shoot more. Going to go shoot the Haight tomorrow afternoon. Was thinking I might take BART to the airport and hang out down there this afternoon today.
- Thomas Hawk
I'm thinking I need to hang out at the airport more and shoot. I ought to be visiting SFO at least once a month. Garry Winogrand has a book of airport photos that I put on my amazon wishlist yesterday. I think airport photos will age really well. I've seen a couple of Winogrand's and they hold up really well.
- Thomas Hawk
Do people still get hassled by security for shooting at airports?
- Adam Harrison
saw someone get hassled yesterday as a matter of fact
- James Cox
from IM
I don't think it would be that hard to write a perl script to get the exposure from the EXIF information, if the images are jpegs, and then total everything. But let's assume on average you shoot at 1/125th of a second. If you reach your 1,000,000 picture goal, that would be 8000 seconds, or a mere 2:13:20. So, in about the length of a movie, you could fit your million pictures. Why are you lagging. ;)
- Adam Harrison
Even if they were RAW, reading the header in Perl should be a snap. That said, we should be able to use the flickr API to snort all the EXIF in none fell swoop then tabulate the data.
- Ryan MacLean
There's also a really good Flickr API in Python. We could make a GAE page that has a live update of TH's combined exposure times with milestones and everything.
- Pierre Honeyman
My most frequently used shutter speed is 1/320. Aperture f/2.0 by far.
- Thomas Hawk
A million pictures at 1/320 each is just a hair over 52 minutes. If your wife complains about how much time you spend behind the camera, share that stat.
- Adam Harrison
Brilliant. Let's see if that works this evening... if you guys don't hear from me tomorrow, blame Adam!
- Ryan MacLean
Hey, this is fun! Most used aperture - f/4.0; Shutter speed - 1/250s; ISO - 400; Most used lens - EF 50mm f/1.4 USM
- tabbr
Okay! Announcing Shuttertime! The amazingly hacky hack to count the number of photos you have on Flickr with different shutter speeds, and the total time. You can get it here: http://www.whirljack.net/softwar...
- Jeremy Brooks
It requires Java 1.5 or higher. Unzip the archive, cd to the directory, and run java -jar Shuttertime.jar
- Jeremy Brooks
You must run it from a command line. It will go through your photostream and count up the total exposure time, and the number of photos at each shutter speed. It's probably buggy. It was hacked together in a couple of hours. If will take a LONG time to run against TH's photostream.
- Jeremy Brooks
I have to step away from my desk for a while, but if somebody with a relatively small photostream could test it out, it would be much appreciated! Again, the URL is http://www.whirljack.net/softwar...
- Jeremy Brooks
f95? At what point does no light at all get in? O_o
- Adam Harrison
Ok, found a bug already. But then I fixed it. Same routine: download, unzip, cd to the directory, and run java -jar Shuttertime.jar from a command line. You can get the latest version here: http://www.whirljack.net/softwar...
- Jeremy Brooks
Hey Jeremy, I tried your program; works like a charm. Total exposure time: 631.2803 seconds. Total photos: 96 Average time/photo: 6.575836 seconds. I have a few long exposure shots that increase the average.
- tabbr
That's pretty cool, Jeremy! Seems to work for me too: Total exposure time: 184.17387 seconds. Total photos: 836. Average time/photo: 0.22030367 seconds.
- Chris Martino
Here's mine: Total exposure time: 3791.551 seconds. Total photos: 10989, Average time/photo: 0.3450315 seconds. There's a little weirdness on some photostreams I have tested on, so consider it a beta still....
- Jeremy Brooks
Version 0.4.0 should be more accurate; it looks for more specific EXIF tags. It seems that some photos have odd values for the shutter speed; those are not counted now.
- Jeremy Brooks
i wasn't about to run your beta version
- bluetick
"From what I gather a Flickr Community Manager received a report of offensive content in a post on a Flickr Community. Instead of taking appropriate action, which would've been to delete the post, or warn the community administrators, she simply deleted the whole damn thing. According to the person who wrote the below letter, there were over 5000 active threads and conversations. I don't even want to guess as to how much time was put into it, or wonder how many references and links were lost. This brings up a lot of questions about whether or not we actually own what we post online, if it can simply be deleted at the whim of an employee with a skewed perspective or that's having a bad day. In my case, I can back up my blog every day, and if Blogger (Google) ever decides they don't want me anymore, I can just import my data elsewhere. It'd be rough to start over with broken links and all, but at least the data would be maintained. As far as I know, there's no such option in Flickr for...
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- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
doesn't link what group was deleted and who did it.... if it was heather - it's really getting interesting. if anyone finds out, do tell..... edit: oh it's dmu ffs, nevermind.
- bluetick
The page accepts comments. You could always fill in the details.
- Adam Harrison
"Good advice, I guess. In the end, I chose a Glendale clinic because it was close to home, offered "superior professionalism" and had an appointment time that worked for me. But I was a bit nervous on my way to see the doctor. What if I got rejected? Not that I've heard of that happening to anyone. The open secret is that it's a cinch to get a marijuana "recommendation" in California. A "recommendation" isn't a prescription, but it would allow me to visit a dispensary and buy my buds."
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
I heard on the radio this morning that California is looking to legalize recreational us.
- Adam Harrison
they totally should. It's sort of silly really that pretty much anyone can go to a doctor's office, claim migraines and get a recommendation to buy pot. Why not just legalize recreational use and tax it?
- Thomas Hawk
The idea of being officially registered as a federal criminal (the current arrangement) is off-putting to many. Legalization would make things a lot less murky.
- Jason Wehmhoener
from iPhone
The same thing was said for licensed growers. I know a few people who considered growning for clinics and clubs, but didn't want to put their name on an "arrest me" list. But a lot of people did start growing, and I think most are doing fine. Reminds me when the feds raided a farm in Santa Cruz, so the city of Santa Cruz deputized the farms as a big "Fuck You" to the DEA.
- Adam Harrison
Heheh... I like Adam's "recreational us"... Typ-o or not?
- SAM
Jason, you're not necessarily officially registered. You can get an ID card from the state but that's optional. Legally all you need is from the doctor, and presumably he/she follows confidentiality rules. If you're a member of a co-op that gets busted by the DEA, the feds would have your name, but there are plenty of places to go that don't record your info. That said, I'm for...
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- Lo the Baker
""Today is the beginning of a journey back to respect," said Yahoo CEO Carol Bartz in a meeting with financial analysts at Yahoo's headquarters in Sunnyvale, Calif. "Yahoo was the big shining star in the mid-1990s and mid-2000s, and then somehow we weren't so shiny anymore.""
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
Today is the beginning of a journey back to respect? The stock market obviously doesn't think so. YHOO's stock is down 2.5% this morning. If Yahoo wants my respect they can start by not destroying my data -- especially without warning. More hot air BS from Carol Bartz.
- Thomas Hawk
Plus Google doesn't nuke your group because one of their community managers doesn't like "your freedom."
- Thomas Hawk
I think there's a lot of blogger.com/blogspot or whatever bloggers who would beg to differ.
- Richard Lawler
Are you really aure you'd want delicious turned into something like Y! Bookmarks or Flickr into Y! Photos? I'm not.
- Andrea Grassi
from iPhone
I keep waiting for TH to get hired as an upper level manager at Yahoo, so he can whip Flickr in to shape from inside the company.
- Adam Harrison
Stock ended down today over 4%. Much more than the overall market declines today. I don't think the analysts put much short term faith in Bartz's big analyst day today. Respect is a two way street. If Yahoo wants respect, they need to give respect. And that starts with treating their users better than they have been. Personally Bartz's message today was as hollow to me as their current $100 million marketing campaign that Yahoo is under new management, Yours.
- Thomas Hawk
going through a rough spell, wishing you the best Pierre
- Wendy Martyn
sorry you're feeling demotivated Pierre. The whole flickr situation has been pretty disheartening to me as well leading to a lack of motivation to even fight it much anymore.
- Thomas Hawk
Take it easy Pierre. Ring me up whenever you want to do some visual wanking. ;) Wish you luck in the job hunt as well.
- Ryan MacLean
now I'm intrigued about what Pierre and Ryan get up to together over the phone :-O
- squacco
Will you guys stop gawking at my photostream while you're on the phone? It's getting real dirty!
- Cynical
First guess.... Fluffer in the gay porn industry?
- Adam Harrison
I wonder how much fluffers get paid... and if it's by the "fluff" or the hour...
- Stephanie Keating
Close, but that would be a volunteer position!
- Ryan MacLean
Joking, obviously, in case people elsewhere stumble here and wonder what I actually do for a living... Not that there's anything wrong with volunteer fluffing.
- Ryan MacLean
I know what he does and I have no idea why he's ashamed of it. I'm applying for a job at his company (not getting anywhere though). Then again, I used to work for Diebold Elections, so I guess everywhere from there is "up".
- Pierre Honeyman
I'm not ashamed of it, I was merely joking! As a general rule, though, I try not to advertise who my employer is :) Adam, I suspect you and I are both in very similar positions.
- Ryan MacLean
Probably. I'm our king of kickstart, sendmail maven, general people sr. linux sysadmin.
- Adam Harrison
Imagine something similar on the Windows/Mac/networking/Security front with a dash of linux noobness.
- Ryan MacLean
I kinda care. I'd like to reunify...somehow. Sigh.
- Stephanie Keating
it's funny when people try to "force" a unified pool by "banging the other pool", or when people think of themselves as "the real one". it's somehow sad to see people who never participate, come up with nasty comments to stir the shit. it just sucks.
- Mo Tabesh
It does suck. I still think the whole situation sucks. A lot.
- Stephanie Keating
I don't participate as often in the Flickr discussion groups because the attitude seems to have become very much "your concerns are really nothing, why are you still talking?"
- Stephanie Keating
i'm not sure when we became "them". funny we never complain. and i still think of every one of them as members of the community.
- Mo Tabesh
I don't know where this latest split even came from FFS.
- Pierre Honeyman
Pierre... any luck with developing a help forum post? Maybe it would be good to re-open the communication channels.
- Stephanie Keating
I think a lot of it is people like Jake trying to fan the flames, trying to create discord. As far as I'm concerned the situation is less than optimal but I suppose I blame Flickr more than two pools which is something I see as pretty minor. If Flickr is just going to nuke DMU again in 6 months, it's hard for me to see the point of participating in a group on flickr beyond a photo pool....
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- Thomas Hawk
I think that there is still a lot of resentment with Beebo's/Superchou's DMU etc. I think a lot of their "unification" talk was just them trying to create more chaos out of the situation. It seems like many in their group are mostly interested in gloating over flickr's nuking of DMU and trying to use the situation to create disharmony.
- Thomas Hawk
Stephanie, it's got nothing to do with luck and a lot to do with being to stressed to give a rat's ass.
- Pierre Honeyman
Fair enough, Pierre. Do you see yourself giving a rat's ass anytime soon, or would it be prudent for someone to try to hack something together? Though, I suppose what with Flickr pissing off thousands of users with the new profile changes, the prospect of engaging in some healthy dialogue is probably slim to none at the moment anyways.
- Stephanie Keating
Meh, every change that Flickr does pisses off thousands of users. I'll write something, but it's going to take more emotional investment than I've got right now.
- Pierre Honeyman
It's strange that Flickr would rather force a good long standing user like James and his incredible collection of mannequins out of flickr rather than simply bend on the issue of unmoderating his account due to photos of mannequins that depict nipples. It shows that they simply don't care about their users or their contributions to the site. Flickr should adopt friendfeed's approach....
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- Thomas Hawk
Thomas, exactly. It's like Flickr only has one tool when there's a complaint and it's some kind of censorship. Flickr needs to deploy more tools so that the communities on Flickr can organize themselves without any staff interference at all. Staff interference should be rare and exceptional, and right now it isn't.
- Pierre Honeyman
Ivan, yes, rather than trying to force Flickr to fit the mold that Flickr thinks it should fit Flickr should let it's thousands upon thousands upon thousands of users make their own Flickrs that they are happy to live in. It would save everyone a lot of grief.
- Pierre Honeyman
I hate to say it, but I think you are right in comparing the evolution Flickr and Facebook, Ivan. Flickr is headed the same way Facebook went after year 2, and it's not going to be nice. Y! probably wants to churn as much "networking" they can out of a photo sharing site and a lot of the "features" are going to get in the way... It may be better to hedgehog (to borrow a term from Good...
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- Ryan MacLean
I'm not opposed to "networking" if it's well done, but gimmicks like picture tagging does not improve the core networking problems Flickr has. It's a shame they can't merge with LiveJournal, how I think is one of the best social networking sites out there.
- Adam Harrison
The problem is that Heather and her team are unwilling to relinquish control over making flickr in their image. It doesn't matter if empowering users though hide features and letting users create there own flickr would work. it's not how Heather envisions her censored utopia and only the flickr staff and their sycophants count in terms of what direction they should go in unfortunately. Others are blocked out and like me kicked out of the help forum.
- Thomas Hawk
Look Flickr already can "ignore" content. We see that in our recent activity stream. They could apply this technology to other content as well. But to empower users this way threatens the need for censorship and threatens Heather and Terrence's very jobs in fact. How many censors does friendfeed have on their staff? None. How many times have they censored the site? None.
- Thomas Hawk
TH - that's what I was hinting at when I was talking about paradigm shifts. There are others though. LiveJournal certainly does have a lot of features that work well. FriendFeed does too. Twitter, Digg, Wikipedia also have very friendly innovations that help make things better. I think this is about more than simple censoring issues, the fundamental approach needs to be changed. I...
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- Ryan MacLean
Pierre... the response that your comments got was pathetic... the Cabal just doesn't get it. They claim to "get it", but they really, really don't.
- Stephanie Keating
The Cabal is nothing more than a group of sycophants looking to see who can get today's little nugget of praise from someone on Flickr's staff. The point is, give people the ability to hide users and their photos and you largely do away with the need to censor. Instead Flickr staffers probably confuse the Yahoo execs with talk about the huge iceberg of porn that sits underneath the visible tip of flickr and scare them into thinking that they need a team of vigilant censors to avoid PR fallout.
- Thomas Hawk
Meanwhile, people like Heather use their positions to engage in community shaping for their own ego driven purposes. Flickr will be "Heather's Flickr" not your flickr not my flickr (like the Yahoo ads say). Rather than discourage users to the point of quiting, true community leadership would instead seek to empower users and create a much more inclusive site.
- Thomas Hawk
anyway ... we are now to blame for the splinter, for the low quality of the lightbox shots, for the n00bfest, for sharing the lightbox, for having a separate pool. is that all or am i missing something? because i don't mind to answer all of the above.
- Mo Tabesh
We'll call you Jesus Mo. You've taken our sins, now we just need to crucify you. ;)
- Adam Harrison
as a unsaved noob, I really do not understand the split with the Wendy dmu - would rather there be only one dmu group - just another damn opinion I know. I understand all the uncensored stuff, and agree that ff here offers the best current option - just wishing there was one ring to rule them all -
- Ventri
You guys are not understanding something. For almost everyone, they love flickr first and DMU second. I put myself in that group, even considering all of flickr's faults. If I had to choose between flickr or DMU, I would choose flickr. That's point #1. Point #2 is this: people are angry with the hardcores here because your stubbornness is destroying a community that easily transcends...
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- andertho
It's not about respect Ivan. I respect you. I think you are grievously wrong, but I respect you. You have developed an emotional attachment to a bunch of meaningless, transitory threads and your attachment to this abstract, meaningless concept is damaging the concrete, very real community we established.
- andertho
and no, by your very presence here you are not agreeing with my Point #1.
- andertho
To your point number 1. My Flickr account probably is in fact more important to me than DMU was. I've probably spent alot more time over the last 5 years on my own stream than I did on DMU (although I spent a ton of time on DMU as well). Flickr can nuke either groups or accounts without warning. This means that something that I say in a forum on Flickr could in fact result in my own...
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- Thomas Hawk
Now, I wasn't aware that it was a violation of the Flickr TOS/CG to threaten to blog about someone. I've always thought of blogging more as free speech. Let's say I go to Starbucks and have a bad experience. I've always thought that I'd be within my rights to say in the Starbucks forum, hey, this sucks, you should fix it or I'm going to blog about it. Apparently though that is against...
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- Thomas Hawk
By engaging in community off site of Flickr I better protect my Flickr account. Flickr needs to change this practice of deleting accounts and groups without warning. Until they do I have no interest in tip toeing around forums on Flickr knowing that the slightest misstep on my part could in fact end up in my losing my account.
- Thomas Hawk
Ivan, you are choosing those threads over the community. I think that's an irrational, wrong decision. TH, I love you and stood by you and defend you all the time to lots of people and I hope you come back to flickr, but that what you said to the Viking was a bad, bad idea and I am surprised you did not know what would happen. I have no fear for my account whatsoever as I would not do...
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- andertho
someone was threatening people (me and others in the community) with physical violence and it was a bad thing to expose that sort of bad behavior? A while back a camera store threatened me with violence and I blogged about them and they ended up being shut down. A few years later the NYAG actually went after the whole lot of fraudsters. Andertho do you think it is acceptable to threaten people with violence.
- Thomas Hawk
Flickr only has one tool: the hammer. They need more tools. There was no need at all to delete DMU2 because of what TH did. There was no "pattern of abuse" emanating from the group itself. It was a total failure on Flickr's part to delete the group and it has had devastating consequences to OUR community.
- Pierre Honeyman
agree with Pierre completely. But it did surprise me to see people clamoring for my account to be nuked for threatening to blog about James and I'm still actually sort of surprised that this is a violation of Flickr's TOS/CG apparently. It seems when Flickr nuked a simple photo of Rebeka's because she went after a store in the UK selling her prints illegally that they came back latter...
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- Thomas Hawk
Flickr nuked our group for one single reason. A lot of dissent emanated from DMU. That was wrong and they'll do it again.
- Thomas Hawk
and see I can't even have a conversation about this incident to clarify things with them because I'm banned from the help forum. How does it make sense that I'm banned from the help forum? I'm inches away from having my account nuked on Flickr and you think I should engage in community there andertho?
- Thomas Hawk
The right thing to do was to report the Viking.
- andertho
Flickr should see a clearly interpersonal conflict like that and just back off with a "My name's Paul and this is between y'all."
- Pierre Honeyman
And as I say that, please remember that I defend you all the time to a whole bunch of people, and I am not trying to be antagonistic
- andertho
"all about my account,?" No. Partly about my account though. I personally am not interested in putting my account at risk and I'm also not crazy about investing time and energy in a community forum on Flickr only to see it nuked in 6 months. Having been through two nukings now it's not something I'd like to go through again. But I'd like to hear more about how my threatening to blog...
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- Thomas Hawk
Andertho, are you familiar with the story of the three little pigs?
- Thomas Hawk
you didn't just threaten to blog. you threatened to destroy his reputation. he was wrong. you were wrong.
- andertho
i am familiar with the three little pigs. and you are building your brick house on an island with no other pigs, no source of food, and no means to live. i'll settle for a straw house where i can eat and live knowing that as long as i follow some fairly simple rules i won't suffer any harm.
- andertho
what? no other pigs to live? there seem to be plenty of pigs here, plenty of food and lots of oxygen and breathing room actually. You put more faith in the big bad wolf's ability not to eat little pigs who follow rules than I do. Especially when the big bad wolf gets to make up the rules as he goes along.
- Thomas Hawk
what if Flickr decides you're "that pig" Andertho? I think the rules on Flickr are far from simple.
- Thomas Hawk
they will decide that based on my photostream, not what i say in a group. short of making threats, i am unaware of any person ever being deleted by flickr for what they said in a thread in a group. i think you are exaggerating th.
- andertho
Was Shepherd Johnson's account deleted for something in his photostream? His *totally* inoffensive (and politically significant I'd add) photostream was deleted because he linked widely available images of detainee abuse on images in the Official Whitehouse Photostream. The images he posted were not from his photostream, they were from someone else's, he just linked them there. Clearly...
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- Thomas Hawk
Look, the answer is simple. Flickr needs to reform. At a minimum they need to guarantee paid Pro accounts a warning and an opportunity to take corrective action before nuking them for behavior on the site. *Especially* given how vague flickr's rules are. I know that flickr is a business not a country, but I like to think of it as being more than just a business. You study the law...
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- Thomas Hawk
Was Pierre's photostream deleted because of content in his photostream or was it deleted for behavior (private correspondence actually) that had nothing to do with his photostream?
- Thomas Hawk
I think you know how much I've enjoyed forums on Flickr Andertho. You and I both spent hundreds if not thousands of hours in them. I miss groups on Flickr. It's unfortunate that Flickr won't reform and offer a sane and reasonable approach to content deletion.
- Thomas Hawk
i know this -- no one has been deleted because of something they said in a group thread, unless they threatened someone. so i don't think your fear of dmu causing you to get deleted is founded in fact. your other examples are not the same thing, and suggest not that you should boycott dmu but that you should boycott flickr altogether. i recommend archiving all your work and delting your account if those are your fears.
- andertho
on a side note, how are you guys going to solve the problem of therrr, a total douche, to be an admin?
- Mo Tabesh
Mo, they have already stated that they won't solve it, and that the rest of the admins don't care and want people to shut up about it. Basically.
- Stephanie Keating
mo, she hasn't caused any trouble as an admin
- andertho
Andertho, you and I both don't know if anyone's been deleted for what they said in a group specifically or not. Do you have evidence from flickr that they've never deleted an account for something someone said in a group?
- Thomas Hawk
the fact of the matter is that I can't communicate with them and even ask these sorts of questions and the rest of flickr doesn't care enough to push the issues in the help forum.
- Thomas Hawk
I feel it safer not to engage in forums on Flickr, I'm surprised you seem to think I'm just making that up.
- Thomas Hawk
there is no evidence -- none whatsoever -- that any flickr member has ever had their account deleted for something said in a group thread that was not a threat. that is why i say you are making it up.
- andertho
Andertho, the way that accounts and people and groups get nuked on flickr are not held to any specific code or laws or rules. I suspect it has happened before, but certainly even if it hasn't it doesn't mean that it can't. A lot of people were calling for my account to be deleted in the help forum just a few weeks ago.
- Thomas Hawk
The only problem with approving them is that a lot of people don't care and many don't approve. I have testimonials I've written a year ago still pending because the person doesn't know to go to the testimonial approval page. Seems to me that flickr needs an organizer for photos you are in so that you can choose the 12 that you want to appear on your profile page. This would fix that problem.
- Thomas Hawk
See you are giving testimonials to the wrong people, who don't appreciate them. I on the other hand would love a testimonial. *hint, hint* ;)
- Adam Harrison
Shades of Kafka's The Trial. You: "I posted it there, but I've been informed that suggestions belong here. ", Lu: "+1, but really still belongs on Feedback in the Help Forum." This is why I stay away from there...
- Ryan MacLean
"I prefer the way it is now, nix the tag if you don't like the photo, report abuse if it's malicious." ...why on earth is requiring "report abuse" more agreeable than simply allowing the user to choose, before it shows up on their profile, which photos they would like to be tagged in? I honestly don't understand that... it's more work for everyone involved, and there's far more opportunity for unfortunate judgments.
- Stephanie Keating
Report abuse is actually very painful anyway.
- Ryan MacLean
The other day someone people tagged me as the hamburgler from McDonalds. I just deleted it.
- Thomas Hawk
Really, I more figured you for Mayor McCheese...
- Adam Harrison
Yeah, that's the one. Doesn't quite have the same impact as it had on a big TV, but you can get the idea.
- Jeremy Brooks
the sense of being unaware. I think that's how Bruce Gilden likes to get people. When they are off daydreaming in their own world and unaware of their surroundings. An interesting bit of the human condition.
- Thomas Hawk
No wonder you don't have a job. Perhaps we should help you pick a style... The John Waters porn stache? The Tom Seleck? The Paul Sr. handle bars? The fu-manchu? The Dr. Fate twirled 'stache? Now that we have fresh pictures of you, we should edit some 'staches on it to find the right one for pimping you out.
- Adam Harrison
I just had: spaghetti squash (microwaved cuz it's faster) with fresh broccoli, red peppers, and onions, and a nice pasta sauce with oregano, basil, and some grated cheese. It's the first time I've cooked a spaghetti squash, and it was pretty good. Easy to cook in the microwave, and fun to peel the strands from the squash. Yum.
- Stephanie Keating
Last night i had tempura prawns, snapper sashimi, and grilled mackerel and stewed pork with beans... washed down with copious amounts of warm sake....
- JediPein
garden salad, bread, garden vegetable cheese, yogurt with diced cucumber, chamomile tea.
- Mo Tabesh
I ate that last night, yes. Was fantastic. You need to visit, Liber! This was at one of the restaurants that will be awfully busy come Olympics time. Best to get there prior to the fact. The chef is of some renown.
- Ryan MacLean
Oh. My. God. Ryan, I'm freaking jealous. Ahi tuna is one of my absolute most favourite foods... but only if it has *just* touched the grill before it's taken back off again. By "seared", I only ever mean "give me a couple of grill lines." ;) And duck confit... so good... mmm...scallops... ahhh... where was this??
- Stephanie Keating
Pein's dinner comes in a close second... that sounds delicious. Snapper is one of my favourite kinds of sashimi.
- Stephanie Keating
Don't know, it's my sister's turn to cook.
- Adam Harrison
The Observatory on Grouse mountain. Wined and dined the better half, she deserves it for putting up with me.
- Ryan MacLean
I usually have the red - it seems to be the most available here.
- Stephanie Keating
Tonight's meal: ad hoc sweet n' sour shrimp stirfry with fresh broccoli & onions, some frozen veggies, and white quinoa.
- Stephanie Keating
Man that sounds awesome! I'm being fed some "halthy" veggie pasta salad with olive oil and balsamic vinegar. Totally spoiled.
- Ryan MacLean
garden salad, yogurt with mint and diced cucumber, tea.
- Mo Tabesh
Tonight I had homemade grilled pizza with an assortment of toppings including: peperoni, grilled chicken, green/red peppers, banana peppers, jalepeno peppers, red onions, mushrooms, sun dried tomatoes, fresh basil, mozzarella cheese & provolone cheese. It was delicious.
- Chris Martino
i am at an island resort working with UW photographers... the buffet was less than impressive, so I stuck with the highlight... roast beef with black pepper gravy, yorkshire pudding and roast spuds. Man, I was starving after 3 dives yesterday and a workshop. I had 4 servings. Fucking pig. Lunch today, 2 hours ago, I stuffed my face with fried chicken and bread rolls. Another 2 dives today and a seminar.... woo hoo...
- JediPein
I've been playing around with Flickr's new people tags for the past hour or so. I like them *a lot*. The only thing is it's that much more metadata to lose when they nuke your account without warning.
I've decided I want to have fun with the people tags. I want to find as many pictures of Gary Coleman that I can, and people tag them as me.
- Adam Harrison
That sounds like a good strategy for you Adam. You do actually look like him a little bit.
- Thomas Hawk
BTW, is someone people tags an image with your name, it shows up on your recent activity, but it breaks muting, so you can't get it out of your recent activity. Freakin' annoying.
- Adam Harrison
Ah that stinks. I liked the mute feature! I don't need to know who won what sparkly gif award. So I'm gonna hafta deal with people tagging the hawk til doomsday huh?
- Ryan MacLean
i think this feature is lame - lame like mo on crytstal meth trapped in john travolta's bubble-bot bubble. thats what i think
- Cu12-13V(As,Sb,Sn,Ge)3S16
Thomas, looking at the option it does allow you to enter an email address in the text field, however I guess this would depend on the email address that the user has linked to their account... which also begs the question, does it respect the 'don't display my email address' privacy, I assume it would.
- travispuk
it seems like you can add an email address to send them an email, I'm not sure it will query their database though to simply find a match if they are already on Flickr but you just can't find them. That would seem better to me.
- Thomas Hawk