“Now that the twins are here, it's obvious we won't fit in the Honda Civic or Mercury Tracer. Without breaking the budget (or slashing our MPGs), what car/SUV/wagon do you recommend?”
Toyota Camry Hybrid, maybe? Not as trendy as the Prius, but uses the same drivetrain. The Prius is pretty much sold out until next year, anyway. There's a hybrid Highlander if you really must ... - Chris Baskind
The goal here is to fit four people in, including 2 car seats, plus dragging along stroller, diaper bag, and groceries on occasion. That might rule out the Camry. - Louis Gray
minivans are tangible evidence of evil. - Hao Chen
leave the kids at home, i will babysit - Allen Stern
Allen, given one already works for you, I think I'm looking for someone who wouldn't already be around the kids 8 or so hours a day. But thanks! - Louis Gray
The Camry is roomy for a midsize sedan, and gas prices at the end of a 3 to 5 year note could be pretty shocking. But if you're really hankering for big, you might want to watch the Chevy Tahoe hybrid. GM only sold about a thousand of them in May, and I'd expect discounts soon on the order of $4500 plus plum financing. - Chris Baskind
I have been in love with my Honda CR-V since the day I got it 3 1/2 yrs ago. Hondas rock the family transport thing - as they tend to rank highest in child safety year after year. They were the first with curtain side-airbags standard. Nice to drive w/ great gas mileage and fantastic handling. Converted me away from Saturns. Definitely check out the CR-V. (geez, I sound like a cult member...sorry - but I love that car.) - Lucretia Pruitt
unfortunately, size does matter when it comes to MPG, hence increasing family is inevitably means longer gas bill and more CO2 into common air - silpol
I'd recommend Pilot over CRV; the new CRV is so sporty, it goes down on utility. - Parth Awasthi
I have three children so if we have anymore we are going to have to upgrade as well! - Joe Dawson
Whatever you pic, I recommend that it be very gas efficient. I predict a rise in gas prices ;) - Dustin McLaughlin
No idea if you have them in the US but for our kids (18 mo boy/girl twins, 3 week old boy) we bought a Kia Carens. Room enough to bring along helpful relatives too! - Edd Dumbill via twhirl
Edd, the Carens is called the Rondo in the states. Thanks for the tip. - Louis Gray
The mileage isn't as good as a Civic, but the Toyota Sienna is quite nice. (assuming you're secure enough to drive a minivan :) We used to have a Subaru Forester, which was nice, but babies have a lot of accessories, so it's good to have the extra space. - Paul Buchheit
I am not sure if it is available in the USA, but we are very happy with our Honda FR-V (goes under the name EDIX in Japan), a 6 seater with a reasonably large trunk. With two car seats installed in the back there is enough space left on the third seat for an adult, so when the kids were small one of us could sit next to them on long trips. And with the folding middle front seat, grandma and grandpa can fit onboard too. The 2.2l diesel iCDT has average fuel economy but gives daddy a bit of sporty feeling ;) - Vlado Handziski
Honda have about the most fuel-efficient engines (fact). Now that they also do Diesel engines, maybe something like the Honda CR-V [perspective from a Europe person] - john conroy
Happy Toyota Highlander Hybrid owner here. Handles our two kids and their stuff very well and offers AWD (which we need in our climate / area). Not sure if there's still a tax incentive. Smart driving techniques are getting me 35 mpg. If too expensive, maybe a Ford Escape Hybrid? - Kevin C. Tofel
Yet another recommendation for the Honda CRV. It feels really big and doesn't kill you with MPGs. Minivans typically do not have good MPG, so I can't recommend any. - Rob Diana
I would go with a Ford Explorer. This is my Schwag wagon. - Mike Fruchter
Have you checked out the Honda Fit? It's surprisingly roomy for getting 30mpg (and costs $14k). - Gabe Schaffer
we got both our boys honda cr-v's due to 4wd, safety, small yet roomy, good mpg for suv, honda quality/durability - been very happy with them - mike "glemak" dunn
second the Honda fit suggestion - I test drove a 2008 and liked it - the 2009 due in early fall is supposed to have lots of improvements too - mike "glemak" dunn
I like the fit too; if I were in the market for a car right now it would be near the top of my list. It is definitely roomy but I don't know if it's big enough for Louis's needs. To get a lot of stuff in it you need to pull down the back seats; which wouldn't work to well when you have to transport 2 adults and 2 babies. - Benjamin Golub
What about a Prius? We have friends with small kids that love that combo! - Susan Beebe
We have Honda CRV and Chrysler Town and Country (rated high on safety and has awesome storage) CRV perfect for around town with the kiddos but our cross country trips require the T&C. - tanya
You might consider a Mercury Mariner hybrid, the Ford Escape hybrid or the Ford Taurus X - Scott Monty
Our 2005 Honda Odyssey gets 16MPG city, 23 highway (real numbers, not sticker). - Bruce Lewis
I highly recommend the Toyota Highlander...wonderful vehicle. - Chris Rossini
Check out the Saturn Vue. I believe they still use Honda engines - which means you get a great engine at a far better price than actually buying a Honda. You could move up to their larger SUV if you need a bit more room ;) - AJ Kohn
Louis - the new Toyota RAV4 will have plenty of room for the twins and their gear. They added about 12" of length a year or two ago but it still gets around 25-28 mpg. My wife loves hers. - Barry Graubart via twhirl
You don't want a car. You need a minivan. Or a station wagon. Sorry to burst the bubble, but by the time you get two carseats in a sedan, that's it. Add in the double stroller and going grocery shopping is a horrible experience. Take the stroller out, put the stroller back in. Now if you are taking a trip somewhere... it all goes to hell quickly with the stroller, the pack 'n plays...I had an Odyssey and while I didn't love it, it was a nice vehicle. The MPG isn't the best, but sanity and convenience are... - Cyndy
SUVs... forget it. They just completely suck gas. Far worse than a minivan. Oh, and for cargo room, best bets are the Odyssey and the Dodge Caravan, with the Dodge winning with the Stow 'n Go. - Cyndy
Just downsized from a Suburban to a Toyota Sienna. Love it. With the 2nd row captain's chairs, much easier to move around for little ones, etc. Pretty inexpensive also, comparatively. - Steve Woodruff
MY wife and I have a Honda CRV - we average around 27 MPG and it can handle us, a kid, a dog, and plenty of cargo space. Trip to Niagara, trips to grandma's, trips to the store are all pleasurable. - keif via twhirl
I agree with Cyndy. I have two kids and I LOVED my old Ford Windstar. That thing was the most comfortable and convenient vehicle to get the kids in and out of without killing my back! The new Ford van didn't impress me and I now have the gas guzzling Pacifica. My kids are past the stroller years or I'd be driving the Dodge Caravan. If your shopping price, check out the Kia Sedona... lots of features for less - kbourke
I'm surprised at how much I like my minivan (we've got a honda odyssey). I like that the kids can open the doors themselves without me worrying that they'll crash into the car next to us (think small school parking lots filled with large cars all close together), I like that we can bring as much stuff on vacation as we want, and I like that they can each bring home a friend for a playdate at the same time. It also lets me carpool etc when the opportunity arises. - Jane Manning
Jane, there is that, and that's why next car will be a full-size van. We can't take more than one playdate ever. But yes... there are a lot of things to think about with two toddlers, like getting them into the car in a parking lot when they are walking, etc. that you don't think about when they are infants. I'm not LOVING that I have a minivan, but I live with it. ;) - Cyndy
We're having our first child in January so I'm trading in my beloved Mark V GTI for the new Volkswagen Tiguan which is kind of a combination of a Golf and a Touareg. It's small enough that it gets good gas mileage (25-30 using the same sporty engine the GTI has) but big enough for car seats and other things. Of course, clearly I'm a very biased Volkswagen fan and pretty much won't buy anything not German. - Akiva Moskovitz
You want a minivan, trust me. It's designed for this and you'll be thankful for it over time. Toyota Sienna is very good. - Scott Ludwig
To piggyback on Paul Buchheit's comment: We actually went to the San Jose car show upon deciding that our Subaru Forrester wasn't enough in hauling Camilla (who was no heavier than 4lbs. soaking wet at the time) and her accessories (car seat, diaper bag and Bugaboo stroller). We decided that having to fold and unfold our stroller actually doubled the effort in the loading and unloading process. In all of the SUV's (large and compact) and most American made minivans, we found that we had to do that, but... - April Buchheit
with the Honda Odyssey and the Toyota Sienna, we could just lift our stroller and put it right into the trunk without any problems. For me, I was still recovering from my c-section, that was a major plus. Between the Odyssey and Sienna, it just came down to the stats and Paul found that Sienna had better fatalities than the Odyssey and so we went with the Sienna. - April Buchheit
Also, our friends, who had just had a baby as well, did some research on their own, but had refused to go into the minivan department, decided on the Infiniti FX (even made a special order on theirs since it wasn't out yet). When we let them test drive our brand spankin' new Toyota Sienna, they were converted, canceled their order, and bought their own Toyota Sienna, which they now refer to as their "sweet van." That was 2 years ago, and now with 2 toddlers and an au pair, they still love their sweet van. - April Buchheit
I have 2 boys myself. one is 3 and one is 1. Our vehicle of choice has been the VW Passat wagon. The 2.0 liter Turbo gets better than 32 MPG on the highway. It's pretty peppy because of the turbo and has ample space. We looked at the A4 wagon, the Odyssey and the Avalon before selecton the Passat. I also have a 2005 Ford FiveHundred which also is very big )probably bigger than the Passat) but lacks a little power for my taste. - Sean Scott
Honda Odyssey or Toyota Sienna - you'll wonder what you ever did without automatic sliding doors. It just makes sense in size and usage. - Joel
Louis, I regularly drive both the Sienna and Odyssey. The Sienna is definitely better for napping kids (quieter, gentler ride), plus it has AWD as an option. The odyssey drives nicer (feels less like a boat), gets better acceleration and better highway fuel economy if you get the version that disables cylinders at HW speed. Also, the Sienna's nav system disables input when the car is moving, a safety feature that's sometimes really annoying. - Sanjeev Singh
Something german and diesel powered... - Andy Davies
We have the Toyota Hybrid Highlander too. It's pricey but an awesome car with reasonable gas mileage. - Mike Cassidy
My obsessive husband researched the crap out of this question (we were about to buy something new the next day and I found out I was pregnant!) Subaru - if your wife has hips just forget it. Best vehicle for combo of space (Rav4 types too small for us with two kids and a dog), fuel efficiency, problems per hundred, resale value yada yada, the Honda Pilot. However, the second best and MUCH better deal was the Ford Explorer - got 2007, extended warranty, great financing rate..... - leigh himel
We have a 2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid. We got the optional third row of seating: the third row is too small for adults to comfortably fit, but when the kids are out of the bulky carseats they can go back there. We wanted to be able to haul the whole clan around (us, two kids, two grandparents). We routinely get 27 mpg in mostly city driving. I applaud the other commenter who manages 35 mpg, but we've never achieved that. - Denton Gentry
Louis - Really depends on how long you intend on keeping the car. The older they get, the more 'stuff' you're gonna find yourself driving around with. Safety and mileage ratings have been going up on almost everything. Found the Jeep Liberty GREAT for space but horrid on gas and just traded it for a Nissan Sentra (with the continuously variable transmission). GREAT car, reasonable, super mileage. - Charlie Anzman
How about some kind of used Volvo wagon. 2002 or newer, good shape, taken care of. nice safe family car. - Julian Baldwin
We just got a Kia Sedona (mini-van) and love it... it's probably the best of the 2nd tier (surprisingly) behind Sienna and Odyssey, plus it's way cheaper. - Jason Dettbarn
You will soon have some new friends - other parents of same age children. Plan for 7 in a car, not 4 :-). Toyota Sienna is the only choice IMHO. - Keith Teare
"According to Bloomberg, there is currently tanker capacity of at least 30-million barrels parked off the Iranian coast. That is about five months worth of the proposed Saudi boost to crude supplies." - Atul Arora via Bookmarklet
I saw a comment about this a few weeks back suggesting some people don't like the price and so aren't willing to buy - Andy Davies
acheslow - but depends how you define active. I have a lot of items but dont' add too many anymore. In fact, I tend to use FF bookmarklet instead of delicious these days. - Alan Cheslow
grah - i've been saving more and more locally. yet i still frequently visit the network/popular pages for link consumption. simple and only a little noise to deal with. - Graham Garland
wow. thank you all. i will be adding you all to my "network" on del.icio.us. Please continue to post interesting content to del.icio.us. My imaginary friend del.icio.us will appreciate it :) - Brian Daniel Eisenberg
I',m andymurd on del.icio.us too - bit late to this party, sorry, I've been experimenting with the social aspects of del.icio.us but found it works well when people actually know you quite well. - Andy Murdoch
Thank you ALL. I will try to find some time for my experiment and report back on results. Expect a blog post at a minimum. Thanks again! Great stuff! - Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Interestingly,my del.icio.us use has gone WAY up since I started with friendfeed. - Mr. Gunn
Wish I could get petrol at that price! - Andy Davies
Andy: How's petrol in England? I heard $11 (5.5 GBP) in Turkey before my 2-week camping trip. These prices were in California on the way to Yosemite. Buck Meadows $4.99. Tuolumne Grove $4.84. Kings Canyon was $0.30-0.50 cheaper than Yosemite. California prices always have an unbelievable variation. San Francisco was $4.45-4.70+ when I left 2 days ago. - Mitchell Tsai
Due to the girl's smaller size, under 2 KG, she'll be in the NICU, but the boy is already with mom, getting acquainted. Kristine is in recovery from the C-section, but I expect will do well. On with a new stage! - Louis Gray
Yeaaaaahhhhhh!!!! Funny, Milan spent the first three days of his life in that same NICU. They are really great there, so your daughter is in good hands. Names? - Robert Scoble
Lisa: you should open a day care for FriendFeed'ers. Heheh. - Robert Scoble
YAHOO! (the word not the company). Big congrats to Louis & wife. Now the fun REALLY begins. Thanks so much for sharing the experience on Friendfeed. - Brian Daniel Eisenberg
That's awesome. Congrats to you and your wife! - John McCrea
Congratulations! We look forward to chatting with them online as soon as you can prop them in front of the computer. ;-) - Chris Baskind
Hmmm.... day care for friendfeeders = new biz model. I gotta got get some VC @now :) - Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Congrats Louis! And hat's off to Kristine for the long labor followed by the c-section! Glad to hear things are good with the li'l ones. They'll be home before you know it. Fantastic! - Hutch Carpenter
I promise photos soon. Names too. I'm tired and so is Kristine. Thanks for being part of a very real community here on FriendFeed and indulging me. - Louis Gray
Lisa: our house is child proofed just for you. Or is it for the kids? I don't know, but either way, we're ready for the influx of FriendFeeding babies! :-) - Robert Scoble
Louis: if you think you're tired now, just wait a couple of weeks!!! Enjoy your sleep when you can get it. We'll be here when the kids wake you up again. ;-) - Robert Scoble
Congratulations Louis and family! All this twittering / FF'ing on the excitement of babies being born is reminding me of my own sons' births inspiring my proto-social-web baby pool project (admittedly it's Web 1.5 - not all shiny/ajaxy but hey, it debuted in 2004 which is like a lifetime ago in web-years). Anyway, thus ends my shameless plug: http://bebepool.com/ - Micah Wittman
Congrats, Louis. I was (and am) a twin, 2lbs, 6oz though. 4mos premature. - Andrew Feinberg
Louis - you are one of the anchors here on Friendfeed! It's been an honor sharing this experience with you, and your family. Wishing you, Kristine, and the twins the sweetest of dreams. Sleep well. You deserve it! - Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Wholehearted congrats. Our first was in the NICU after being born premature and those folks do wonders. Dylan is now a tall, healthy, 48-inch-tall five year old towering above the rest... - Chris Reed
Luis fantastic duded. Congratulations to you and your wife!! - Alexander van Elsas
Congratulations Louis & Kristine, & welcome to your son & daughter! You're tired now? Wait 19 years...I have twin daughters that age; I can barely type ;-) ! Twins are special, all enjoy your new life together. - David Peacock via twhirl
Congratulations to you and Kristine on your new arrivals, really proud for you both! - Joe Dawson
Well done - the hard work starts now! Our youngest was in NICU for three weeks (he was 4 10 and had to be delivered seven weeks early as my wife had a life threatening condition), but the great thing about NICU baby's (well in the UK anyway) is that they get trained to sleep!!! - Andy Davies
Mazal Tov to the new parents! Congrats!!! - Mike Fruchter
Congrats Louis and glad to hear mother and twins are fine and enjoy your rest you'll need it! Only 12 weeks before our new one arrives and I'll be going through the same thing :) - Russ G
Congratulations Louis. Brilliant news! - Chris Nixon
Congrats! Hope everything goes really well! - Matt Cutts
there are so many comments here i can't possibly read them all, but that's awesome louis, congrats to you and your wife. do the babies have names yet? - MG Siegler
Congratulations! All our best wishes to mum, babies and your good self! - John Samuelson
Congratulations! As a life-long end user of parenting, I know that you will require the best of luck. And here's a towel, just in case. The towel will be with you... always. - Cyvros/fyc
I think I teared up there a little bit. Congratulations Louis! I know how exhausted you guys are and hope you're getting some much deserved rest right now. You're all in my thoughts this weekend. - Carla Thompson
~~~B~A~B~I~E~S~~~A~R~E~~H~E~R~E~~!!~~Y~E~A~H!!!!! Congratulations Louis & Kristine!!! So happy for you guys and your family!! (Sorry I feel asleep after 1AM EST... long week) - Susan Beebe
Congratulations Grey family. "Hello, babies. Welcome to Earth. It's hot in the summer and cold in the winter. It's round and wet and crowded. At the outside, babies, you've got about a hundred years here. There's only one rule that I know of, babies—God damn it, you've got to be kind." - Clare Dibble
I have to pry Lindsay off of FF every single night. "C'mon sweetie! It's 11:30 and you have to get up at 6!!" "Just a couple more minutes!!" :D - Tad Donaghe
Maybe a little, though not FriendFeed specifically (Twitter & Google Reader being other time sinks that all get lumped together). I've considered telling her about it but am 99% sure of her reaction already. - Andy Tinkham via twhirl
My wife left me in December. I have more time now for FF. - Russellreno
Spouse calls laptop my square-headed girlfriend... - Madsimian
My other half just recently joined Friendfeed account. She is now hooked, not as bad as me though. - Mike Fruchter
Noah: Sure you can quit! ha, ha! .. you just don't *want* to!! :*) - Susan Beebe
Awesome! Can't wait to meet your two new kids and hope everything goes as well as possible. - Robert Scoble
When Maryam had Milan we were actually able to use our iPhones in between contractions. (Milan was born at Stanford, just like Louis' kids are -- great wifi there). Maryam didn't want any video, so we did photos and audio. Just be prepared to put down the iPhone IMMEDIATELY when your wife needs you. Otherwise the consequences are harsh. :-) - Robert Scoble
Mazel Tov and may all go as seamlessly as possible. - Mathew A. Koeneker
Wi-Fi at Lucille Packard is great, BTW. :-) - Louis Gray
Congrats! Don't worry about us and take some time offline! - Xavier Bartholome
Louis: I told you it rocks. So, is your wife admitted already? Or did they tell her to take a walk and come back in three hours like they told Maryam? (We went to Jack in the Box, and later, even back home cause, while Maryam was having contractions, she wasn't dialated enough to give birth for nearly 12 hours after we first went to Lucille Packard (Stanford's hospital for children). - Robert Scoble
Oh, and if you know Thomas Hawk, do anything you can to get him to come by and make photos. He took the most spectacular photos of Milan (and my family) that I really treasure to this day. - Robert Scoble
Matthew- Seamless birth , hmm. Kind of counter-intuitive. Louis-all the best to you,wife and twins. - Mark Forman
I'm going to sleep hoping we hear great news when I wake up. Just remember, photos, we want photos!!! - Robert Scoble
We are admitted. Contractions are 4-5 minutes apart. We'll be here for a while. - Louis Gray
Cool. Any bets on the time? I'll bet that they are here by noon. Ahh, long night for Louis ahead! Breathe! Breathe! Breathe! :-) - Robert Scoble
I don't dare bet on a time. That's bad luck. But I'm not going anywhere, and she's not either. Duncan Scoble Gray and Cyndy Corvida Gray might debut in the morning. - Louis Gray
now you are ego pandering! Well I am off to bed. Our house is childproofed now and is awaiting the arrival. Milan is looking forward to having a couple of new friends to share toys with. Thinking good thoughts for you both. - Robert Scoble
Be interesting to see how many posts a week you're going to be able to manage now... :-) - Andy Davies
And no, those won't be their real names. :-) - Louis Gray
Best of luck throughout the night Louis. Hopefully when I wake up the two new Grays will be ready to blog. - MG Siegler
In case you guys wanted to know where you rate, we haven't told any family on either side that we're here. Didn't want to wake anybody up. Once we get close to 7 a.m. PDT, depending where we are then, maybe we'll let them know. Thanks for the notes. (Is this the first FriendFeed "live" birth?) - Louis Gray
Wooo, awesome! Congrats in advance. :) - Don MacAskill
Congrats and good luck! And they'll share a birthday with @crazybob's #2! - Cyndy
Contractions are 2-3 minutes apart now. Both of them hanging out, and both of us, hanging in... - Louis Gray
I do like the names you've chosen, though. Although you haven't managed to tack FriendFeed or Disqus in there. Maybe two middle names would work. I did that with #4 so she could be named after three family members. - Cyndy
My daughter was born in a different age (1991). I couldn't provide updates to the world on an iPhone. Heck, all I could have done (I didn't) would have been to drive home, fire up the Mac Plus and my 2400bps modem, and posted text updates to the Deep Thoughts and Grotto BBSes. - Ontario Emperor via fftogo
@Ontario My last was born in 2005, and I couldn't even update THEN... they ban all cell usage and WiFi is still a pipe dream. They are still going with the "cell phones mess with equipment" airline story. - Cyndy
And regarding names...you could work "Obama" and "McCain" in there somehow...Duncan Scoble FriendFeed Obama Gray? :) - Ontario Emperor via fftogo
first photos better be with the cn stickers :) - Allen Stern
WOOT!! Good luck to you and your wife at the hospital today Daddy Grey. - Mike Fruchter
You'er not streaming the whole event? ;-) No I agree some things are sacred. Unless you're scoble. I bet mrs scoble is happy that qik wasn't released when she gave birth... - Gez
