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Andrew C (✔) › Comments

Andrew C (✔)
@ShaunKing: Eyewitness Accounts of Michael Brown Shooting -
"4 different eyewitness accounts from 4 different angles (left, right, above, ground level) all tell the EXACT SAME STORY. Period. What is also SO KEY is that all 4 of these eyewitnesses, including Dorian Johnson who was right there, had the same story from THAT DAY on. [...] For anybody to hear the three videos I just shared and still choose to think they are, in essence lying or colluding together is racist." - Andrew C (✔)
"In essence, to think that Crenshaw, Mitchell, and Johnson colluded, concocted a story, then risked it all to share it, is insane. For reference, please read "Psychopathic Racial Personality" by Dr. Bobby Wright. In it, he explains that racism is a form of psychopathy. The idea, the gall, to think that 3 strangers, in essence just because they are black, immediately colluded & made up... more... - Andrew C (✔)
"I would not say ANY OF THIS if the accounts of Crenshaw, Mitchell, and Johnson, were very similar to what we hear from Darren Wilson. But the accounts are WILDLY different from the very start to the very, very, very UGLY end with Wilson unloading on Mike Brown's face/body. It was treated as a red-herring of sorts when Mike Brown did not come back with back full of bullet holes. This is... more... - Andrew C (✔)
"Crenshaw, Mitchell, and Johnson all say that Mike was hit FROM BEHIND, not in his back, and autopsy confirms a graze wound in his arm. Crenshaw, Mitchell, and Johnson ALL confirm that Mike Brown's body twitched when grazed, turned around, then surrendered to Wilson. Mitchell, an incredibly composed unbiased eyewitness not even from there said Brown not only didn't "bumrush" Wilson, but... more... - Andrew C (✔)
Mississippi man shot after cross burning in yard -
Mississippi man shot after cross burning in yard
"A Mississippi sheriff says a man was beaten and shot two weeks after calling authorities to report a cross burning in his yard, and investigators are trying to determine whether the attack was prompted by people being upset that the man was visited by his mixed-race grandchildren." - Eric from Bookmarklet
""They called him some severe names and then they told him to leave and they chased him off his porch around his house and beat him with brass knuckles and then shot him with his own gun," Julie Wilson told the TV station." - John (bird whisperer)
How are you going to kick a man out of his own house and shoot him with his own gun? That's jacked up. - DB, Lil LB's Dad
Awful. - Andrew C (✔) from Android
Andrew C (✔)
Ferguson Cops Busted? New Video Seems To Show Brown Paying For Cigarillos (Video) | Crooks and Liars -
"While it is difficult to be 100% certain, the video appears to show Brown purchasing some cigars, but lacking the money for the amount he wished to buy. Brown seems to purchase some cigarillos, pay for them, attempt to buy more, then replace the ones he could not afford. [...] In any case, neither the employee nor the store owner called law enforcement–something that would surely happen if Brown committed a "strong-arm robbery." At this point, the police portrayal of the video and strategic release have had the desired effect. Right-wingers have labeled Brown a "thug."" - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
Andrew C (✔)
How big is Governor Goodhair gonna smile in his mug shot?
Turns out PR firms have advice for this kind of thing! - Andrew C (✔)
He must have practiced pretty hard to hit the fine line between looking glibly happy and looking defeated: - Andrew C (✔)
Definitely a hint of 'smug' as well. - Jennifer Dittrich
Andrew C (✔)
Police cameras are important, but they’re useless without policies to ensure they’re used properly - The Washington Post -
"So in addition to making these videos public record, accessible through public records requests, we also need to ensure that police agencies implement rules requiring officers to actually use the cameras, enforce those rules by disciplining officers when they don’t and ensure that the officers, the agencies that employ them, and prosecutors all take care to preserve footage, even if the footage reflects poorly on officers." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
"One policy that would go a long way toward achieving those three objectives is what defense attorney Scott Greenfield calls the missing video presumption. Currently, the courts generally treat important video that goes missing as a harmless mistake. They assume no ill will on the part of police. If you discover that the police were or should have been recording an encounter that would... more... - Andrew C (✔)
"Under the missing video presumption, if under the policy agency’s police there should have been video and there isn’t, then the courts will assume that the video corroborates the party opposing the police, be it a criminal defendant or the plaintiff in a civil rights lawsuit. The state could still get over the presumption by presenting other evidence, such as witnesses, medical... more... - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
In Honduras, U.S. deportees seek to journey north again - LA Times -
"At least five, perhaps as many as 10, of the 42 children slain here since February had been recently deported from the U.S., Hernandez said." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
Andrew C (✔)
Cop Pens Touching Op-Ed: Do Everything I Say and I Won't Kill You -
Cop Pens Touching Op-Ed: Do Everything I Say and I Won't Kill You
"There is an implication here that informs the entirety of Dutta's argument, which is that cops never are the aggressors in situations, and instead only operate from a place of reaction. A really bad time to make this argument would be right this very second, when every night America gets to watch Missouri policemen shoot endless canisters of tear gas at peaceful crowds of protestors and journalists." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
"It also would have been a bad time to make this argument two weeks ago, after America watched Eric Garner get strangled to death by a NYPD officer for selling untaxed cigarettes off the street, which is in no way harmful to the safety of police or the public." - Andrew C (✔)
"Dutta's language here—"in most cases it's less ambiguous"—gives him as much wiggle room as he needs—#NotAllCops!—but he seems to fail to acknowledge that the incidents that fall outside of "most cases" are more than enough to engender the suspicion of police that he is so quick to dismiss as childish." - Andrew C (✔)
""If you don't want to get shot just do what I tell you" is a purely insane thing to say. That is not how human interaction is supposed to work, regardless of whether an "authority figure" is involved or not. [...] Dutta's solution is to do whatever a cop says in the moment—up to and including an arrest that may or may not be lawful or warranted—because you can just go ahead and sue cops later." - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
Jesse Williams On Ferguson, Mike Brown and White Privilege | News One -
"“I know plenty of white kids that steal stuff from convenience stores,” Williams continued in response to allegations that Brown stole cigars moments before his murder by law enforcement. “There is this idea that every time a black person does something they automatically become a thug worthy of their own death.”" - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
"When Velez-Mitchell introduced William’s class privilege into the conversation, asking how he could still feel so “disenfranchised” with all of his success, he responded: “I don’t think of just me, I think of a collective group of people. While privilege is very well, whether it’s a class issue that obviously exists–I’m glad you bring that up. This idea of having to explain why it’s racial, while we’re standing in our own blood is silly. It’s racial because it doesn’t happen to White people.”" - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
RT @ShaunKing: 6. If Mike had no gun residue on his hands, this means the officer fired the gun and Mike thought he was about to die right then and there.
Speaking of which, the autopsy did say no gunpowder residue was found on his body (but left possibility there might be some on his clothes). But a struggle with the cop through the SUV's window would presumably have left his hands clear. - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
Different rules apply | MZS | Roger Ebert -
"I want to tell you a story about the difference between knowing and understanding." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
"All of which is a wind-up to say: having grown up in a mostly black neighborhood near Love Field airport in Dallas, and having been a diligent liberal for most of my adult life, I already knew there was such a thing as white privilege, and was properly horrified by it, but I didn't truly understand what it meant, on a deep level, until one summer night in 2006, when I was spared arrest or worse thanks to the color of my skin." - Andrew C (✔)
[after a fight where he'd had the other guy in a chokehold] "I don't know how long I was down there, but it was long enough for the owner of the deli to call the cops. A squad car pulled up sometime later. Two patrolmen got out and pulled me off the guy and tossed me on the sidewalk. Then one of them ran over and put his knee on my back, but did not cuff me—a detail that didn't register... more... - Andrew C (✔)
"By now the adrenaline fog seemed to be lifting. I was seeing things in a more clinical way. The violence I had inflicted on this man was disproportionate to the "assault," and the tone of this exchange with the cop felt conspiratorial. And then it dawned on me, Mr. Slow-on-the-Uptake, what was really happening: this officer was helping me Get My Story Straight. Understanding, at long last." - Andrew C (✔)
"I also need to mention that while this conversation was taking place, not ten feet away the other guy was face down on the pavement, handcuffed—even though when the squad car arrived, anybody who'd looked at our situation purely in terms of physical action, without the explanations I proffered afterward, would have concluded that I was the menace." - Andrew C (✔)
"I went home. The other guy didn't. That's white privilege. White privilege sent me home to my kids. White privilege is the reason I've never told this story publicly. Extenuating personal circumstances, aside, I did something that I should not have done, and I escaped the consequences of my actions by accepting a benefit that never should have been bestowed." - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
Running Shoes Used Mainly For Computer Programming | The Onion - America's Finest News Source -
Running Shoes Used Mainly For Computer Programming | The Onion - America's Finest News Source
This used to be me, but now I wear sneakers to work and switch to slippers while in the office. - Andrew C (✔)
Sneaker net wouldn't work without them. - Greg GuitarBuster
This cuts deep, man. - Brian Johns
Andrew C (✔)
From Sterling to Ballmer -- a rags to riches story for Clipper fans - Clips Nation -
"There's a story I tell about Donald Sterling. I've probably told it to you at some point. A few years back I was invited to Sterling's annual "White Party" at his Malibu beach house. (I know, the "White Party" has additional freight now.) Sterling takes his White Party very seriously. If you show up at his White Party wearing anything other than white, you either put on the white T-Shirt they hand you at the door, or you don't go in. So you're at this party with 500 or so people, all in white." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
"The Donald stayed hidden for awhile. He made his appearance at his own "White Party" about two hours after it started -- dressed all in black, like Johnny freakin' Cash." - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
Welp, Twitter's started showing me - in the main timeline - what all y'all are favoriting.
What is this Twitter you speak of? - Ken Morley
Someone else mentioned that a few weeks ago. That's so bizarre. There's many reasons for favoriting a tweet. Why show that to other people? - Anika
I mean favorites have always been public, but until now they weren't promoted into the main timeline like RTs. - Andrew C (✔)
Ugh - Amit Patel
Steven Perez
Things To Stop Being Distracted By When A Black Person Gets Murdered By Police | -
Things To Stop Being Distracted By When A Black Person Gets Murdered By Police |
"I wish I didn’t have to tell some of you that victim-blaming when a Black person is murdered by police is a huge no. That it doesn’t matter if they were on the honor roll, or smoked weed sometimes, or were going to college, or what brand of hoodie they wore, or even if they spent time in jail at some point. That the right to walk down the street without being a target for murder by the police isn’t a right one should have to prove themselves worthy of. That we should all just have that right by virtue of being human beings." - Steven Perez from Bookmarklet
"When you’re Black, you don’t always get the benefit of being seen as a human being, though. Black people are seen as ‘up to no good’ by default. The truth is that our lives, like anyone else’s, are filled with good choices as well as mistakes, achievements we’re proud of as well as missed opportunities. Successes. Failures. Just like everyone else. But what’s also true is that we, as... more... - Steven Perez
"If we were to talk about a victim’s past, we would have to talk about it in a context of oppression. But, you know what? We don’t need to talk about it at all. Because it is irrelevant to issue of their victimization. Just like bringing up a victim’s past to justify her rape is wrong, bringing up a victim’s past to justify his murder by police is also wrong. Yes, even when those people are Black." - Steven Perez
"The victim’s past isn’t the issue. The issue is yet another unarmed Black teenager murdered by police. His name was Mike Brown." - Steven Perez
Steven -- the focus in this case should be on collecting and analyzing all the available physical evidence and ascertaining the truth of what really happened. That is my opinion, at any rate. Feel free to disagree. - Sean McBride
Sean: I agree. - Steven Perez from Android
Steven -- I also understand why there is a great deal of emotion about this incident -- there has been a long-standing pattern of unacceptable police brutality against minorities (especially blacks) in American society. But at the end of the day, this particular case will be resolved on the basis of the best evidence. And one still can't rule out the possibility that Michael Brown was in the act of surrendering when Darren Wilson shot him -- a deed which would probably (and justly) send Wilson to prison. - Sean McBride
Given how previous cases similar to this one have played out in the courts (Sean Bell, Oscar Grant, Trayvon Martin, etc), I am not as optimistic as you in the fairness of the legal system, Sean. - Steven Perez
Actually, ask Sean what he thought about how the Trayvon Martin case went. - Andrew C (✔)
Sean, someone (who I'm guessing you've blocked or has blocked you) wants to know what you think about how the Trayvon Martin case went. - Stephen Mack
I didn't pay much attention to the Trayvon Martin case -- it became a media circus of the type I usually filter out. But when the story came out about George Zimmerman pointing a shotgun at his pregnant girlfriend, I became convinced that justice was probably not done in that case -- Zimmerman should have been convicted. - Sean McBride
The Michael Brown case strikes me as being much more important than the Trayvon Martin case in terms of its political and cultural impacts. And in this instance there will be much more physical evidence and eyewitness testimony available to determine what really happened. I am hoping that the full truth comes out, no matter what the truth is -- and it will be difficult to spin the facts. Bottom line: seek justice. - Sean McBride
There are many white racist cops out there -- we all know that. The question is, is Darren Wilson one of them and did white racism motivate his shooting of Michael Brown. My mind is wide open to accepting that this is true if anyone can persuasively make the case. In the meantime, I have no opinions one way or the other. The most important factual point to resolve now is whether Brown was surrendering to Wilson or running at him. - Sean McBride
No doubt this may be annoying to some people: I tend to look at human situations as intellectual problems to be broken down and solved, to be looked at objectively from every angle, with every assumption and assertion being strongly tested. Sorry -- that's my temperament. Experience teaches that if you rush to judgment, you can get burned. Get your facts in order. Stand on as strong a... more... - Sean McBride
"“Why should we cherish “objectivity”, as if ideas were innocent, as if they don’t serve one interest or another? Surely, we want to be objective if that means telling the truth as we see it, not concealing information that may be embarrassing to our point of view. But we don’t want to be objective if it means pretending that ideas don’t play a part in the social struggles of our time,... more... - Steven Perez
Steven -- I was using "objectivity" in a different sense -- collecting all the facts about situations and arranging them in their true order (to the best of our ability) -- to read reality aright. We will, of course, all use these readings according to our respective value systems and agendas when we take positions. The point is, be on solid factual ground when taking positions *on... more... - Sean McBride
And I would agree with you, were we talking about a competent police department that wasn't intent on firing tear gas and rubber bullets into peaceful protesters, to say nothing of threatening anyone with a camera. Such is not the hallmark of rationality. - Steven Perez
There is plenty to criticize in the Ferguson police department -- but apparently some of the protestors are not so peaceful. That is why the NAACP endorsed sending the National Guard into this situation. Use Google Images and Youtube to turn up all the evidence of looting, rioting and vandalism that has been going on. What do you think that businesses and store owners and employees in... more... - Sean McBride
The majority of which could have been largely averted, had the police department handled the situation in a more professional manner. How much of the destruction that has been wrought has been a result of the police deciding to escalate an already tense situation until it became necessary to bring in the National Guard? - Steven Perez
Steven -- you're right -- the Ferguson police aggravated the situation. But here is the point: what kind of people loot, vandalize and destroy their own neighborhoods to engage in political protest? For instance, Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have endured much worse treatment and suffering than Ferguson residents -- but they have never trashed their own neighborhoods as a form... more... - Sean McBride
There's your mistake, Sean: looters don't need a cause; they need an opportunity. Just ask every sports fan whose team just won a championship if the looters that smash up their downtown area are "fans". It's the same principle in this case. There's always going to be a group of opportunistic assholes that will take advantage of a situation to their benefit, especially in a nation founded by opportunistic assholes. - Steven Perez
This just in: [Ferguson protesters: The peaceful, the elders, the looters, and the ‘militants’] - Sean McBride
Riots that occur after sporting events are not pretending to be acts of noble political protest. - Sean McBride
Celebration riots in North American Sports. - Eric Logan
The Sociology of Crowds: Celebration Riots in North American Sports. - Eric Logan
Actually they are fans it seems and large groups of young white males are usually present and it's most likely to happen after long droughts by the sports teams and the culture surrounding the venue matters according to the only study I can find. - Eric Logan
Of course Steven is most certainly correct that they are not really fans in the truest sense of the word anymore than the looters are supporters of this family. - Eric Logan
Steven -- I can't think of any instances in which Palestinians have looted, vandalized and trashed their own neighborhoods in recent months; or in which Jews did so in the Nazi era; or in which American revolutionaries or the Irish did so under British occupation. From a cultural standpoint, there is something anomalous about this behavior -- it is not typical in most political situations. - Sean McBride
Eric -- who better to pay tribute to Michael Brown than looters? He himself looted a store in Ferguson minutes before his violent confrontation with Darren Wilson. - Sean McBride
Lots of people don't understand why looters "destroy their own neighborhoods" and I get it, but when people are disenfranchised and treated badly by those who are supposed to protect them, represent them, etc. it's hard to be personally invested in your neighborhood or even feel like it's "yours" at all. And while lots of folx scoff at the idea of outside agitators, the truth is they do... more... - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
The looting and vandalism are being chronicled in depth with images and videos posted on social media: 1. [Google Images; ferguson looting 2. [Youtube; ferguson looting] - Sean McBride
You're talking in circles, Sean. We're saying why people loot, and your reply is essentially "BUT BUT BUT BUT LOOTING!!" - Steven Perez
^^^^ - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
Steven -- I didn't see your response to this comment: I can't think of any instances in which Palestinians have looted, vandalized and trashed their own neighborhoods in recent months; or in which Jews did so in the Nazi era; or in which American revolutionaries or the Irish did so under British occupation. From a cultural standpoint, there is something anomalous about this behavior -- it is not typical in most political situations. - Sean McBride
Steven -- how do you think police should respond to the looting and vandalism? What is your best advice? - Sean McBride
"their own neighborhoods"... do the people of Ferguson hold stock in the stores & businesses that have been hit? In the actual neighborhoods, no one is breaking windows or setting fires to people's houses or apartments or schools..."their" stores & businesses aren't affected because "they" don't own them or profit from them. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
And you cannot compare what is happening to American citizens, who ostensibly have rights protected by the constitution, to Jews under Nazi occupation, who'd already been oppressed before the Nazis got there. They had no expectation of legal or constitutional protection and besides, nazis & anti-Semites did all the looting & burning for them. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
In the other political situations I mentioned -- for instance, in Gaza and the West Bank -- did Palestinians from one town enter another town and loot and vandalize it? Not that I know of. And the conditions of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank are much worse than in Ferguson. - Sean McBride
Well, Sean, I have a radical idea concerning how to deal with looters: stop shooting peaceful protesters, journalists and other pedestrians with tear gas, rubber bullets and sound cannons, and go arrest looters. And, if they can find the time, stop shooting unarmed black men. I know those sound pretty radical in the second decade of the 21st century, but maybe if the police really apply themselves, they can reach that goal. - Steven Perez
Anyone who tries to justify or rationalize in any way the looting and vandalism in Ferguson is going to have a tough sell with the American people -- even Michael Brown's family has strongly condemned that behavior *without equivocation*. - Sean McBride
Why are you comparing Ferguson to other places in the world? Do you think the people most affected by what's happening all have the luxury of watching, studying, and debating the politics of other countries? I'd guess the majority of people in Ferguson have been too busy working so they can pay their bills, raising their families, & trying to keep their children safe, to be worried about protest tactics elsewhere. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
folks in Ferguson being tear gassed while standing on their own property are "the American people." - t-ra supports #LOLSpidra
And this is where our brains part ways, Sean: I think you're conflating "looters" and "protesters". Which is something the police in Ferguson are doing. It's like watching the Bush Doctrine played out in suburban St. Louis: "Hey, look! Looters!" "Never mind them! We're being filmed! Get the LRAD!" - Steven Perez
Steven -- I didn't conflate looters and vandals with peaceful protestors -- I strongly support peaceful protest and even civil disobedience -- I am a big fan of Henry David Thoreau. But looting and vandalism have come to play a major role in recent events in Ferguson -- it's all over the news, in both the mainstream and alternative media. - Sean McBride
Why am I comparing Ferguson to other places in the world and previous eras of American history? Because many of us have noticed that legitimate political protest movements almost never rely on the looting and vandalism of their own property to make a political point. And that is why the serious protestors in Ferguson want to rid the looters and vandals from their midst as soon as possible. - Sean McBride
And you're insinuating that the protest movement in Ferguson does rely on looting? - Steven Perez
Might want to check the title of this post again, Sean. - Steven Perez
I insinuated no such thing: I explicitly stated, for instance, that the Brown family has condemned the looters and vandals *without equivocation* -- with no rationalizations presented to explain their behavior. I have also strongly and repeatedly condemned the heavy-handed behavior of the police. - Sean McBride
I am not in support of violence or looting. But I think it's important that people stop thinking that "they" are destroying "their" property. That isn't what's happening. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
I rewrote the sentence above to make my point more clear: Many of us have noticed that legitimate political protest movements around the world and in American history have almost never been accompanied by the looting and vandalism of the protestors' own property to make a political point. - Sean McBride
Sean, you cannot compare blacks in America to any other oppressed people in world history. Unless you have some personal or family experience of 400 years of slavery, apartheid, and continuing genocide in African-American communities, you may have little understanding of how people feel. I'm not justifying looting, but perhaps as I suggested to Hostage on a MW thread that he and Chomsky... more... - weareone
Steven -- how would you characterize Michael Brown's behavior at the convenience store? What does his body language convey to you? - Sean McBride
And saying "many of us have noticed..." doesn't really mean anything. I'd bet the vast majority of Americans don't see themselves in what is happening elsewhere, or put much thought into what it's like. Until it happens to them. And when it does, they're probably more likely to react in the moment than to go study protest movements in other countries. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
WHO GIVES A FUCK WHAT MIKE BROWN DID OR HOW HE ACTED. Whatever he may or may not have been doing, he SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN MURDERED FOR IT. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
Seriously, it's like you didn't read, or don't care about, the OP article. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
My question was, how would you characterize Michael Brown's behavior in the convenience store? -- a simple question. No reasonable person believes that he deserved to be murdered for committing a strong-arm robbery. The facts about what occurred in his violent confrontation with Darren Wilson still haven't been sorted out -- the picture is still murky. - Sean McBride
weareone: "I'm not justifying looting." Well then we agree -- it is not justifiable -- and it is incredibly self-destructive, as many African-American leaders have emphasized in their public comments in recent days. - Sean McBride
And no one on this thread has suggested otherwise. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
How would I characterize Michael Brown in the convenience store? Two words: paying customer: - Steven Perez
Given that the Ferguson PD likes to play fast and loose with the facts (just the Al Jazeera camera crew how they felt about receiving "assistance" from the cops in the form of getting tear gassed - and then being told by the chief that no journalists had been gassed), you'll understand, Sean, why I think that the local fuzz is somewhat economical with the truth. - Steven Perez
You're focusing on the wrong thing. As someone else has stated, often provocateurs are brought into the community to shift the focus, the narrative. Even if this was not the case, focus on the injustice. - weareone
Steven -- didn't Dorian Johnson already acknowledge that they robbed the store? Correct me if I am wrong. Why did Brown bully, intimidate and shove the cashier? Most people have characterized his body language as thuggish. - Sean McBride
And those people would probably see ANY black or brown person's body language as "thuggish" - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
You're illustrating the point that the OP article is making, illustrating it beautifully. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
weareone: my Irish ancestors experienced a great deal of oppression in Ireland and the United States for many years -- but it is not a subject that I dwell on at all -- I tend to be forward-looking -- most Americans are. With regard to the comparative oppression of peoples worldwide historically speaking, African-Americans certainly rank high on the list. But as you well know, hundreds... more... - Sean McBride
Starmama: how, then, would you characterize the body language in these images? - Sean McBride
I voted for Barack Obama twice for president precisely because he was the *least* thuggish of the available candidates. - Sean McBride
That brings up an even more troubling question, Sean: why didn't the police pick up Johnson, if for nothing else, then at least for questioning? Why was Chris Hayes the first person to interview an alleged robbery suspect? - Steven Perez
I see a big guy pushing a smaller guy out of his way. Maybe Mike was being mean. Maybe he was mad at something the other guy said. I also see another goddamned distraction in the form of dissecting a murder victim's behavior to shift accountability from the police officer to Mike Brown. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
The alleged robbery, btw, wasn't even an issue. Store never called police about it. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
Steven -- you are asking questions that still need to be answered -- and I can't wait for the answers. But is it a fact that Dorian Johnson himself acknowledged that he and Brown committed a strong-arm robbery in the convenience store? Johnson's own lawyer confirmed this on NPR yesterday -- and NPR -- hardly a right-wing media outlet -- was intensely curious about the problematic issues that have been raised in the last few days in this group. - Sean McBride
Which group? - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte
Starmama -- the main issue in this controversy is whether Brown was surrendering or charging Wilson when he was shot, and whether he assaulted Wilson before the shooting. Do you think you know what happened? I don't know. What we know so far is that the eyewitness claims that Brown was shot in the back were false. With regard to Dorian Johnson's credibility: even NPR questioned it yesterday. - Sean McBride
US Politics. - Sean McBride
Sean - Even NPR? Why is that so surprising? - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte
Do you think there is anything improper in NPR wondering about Dorian Johnson's credibility? Johnson's lawyer, the former mayor of St. Louis, took no offense to Robert Siegel's sharp and skeptical line of questioning. - Sean McBride
Sean, I'm not referring to past historical events, I'm talking about ongoing genocide and apartheid in the black community. Apartheid is now taking a different form, much more subtle and insidious than in Palestine or South Africa. The form is incarceration of the black community. Some stats are here: but just one example- 5 times... more... - weareone
weareone -- I have been aware of these statistics for a long time -- this is a huge social problem that needs to be addressed. I agree. With regard to the Ferguson situation what mainly interests me is uncovering the truth about really happened in the violent confrontation between Brown and Wilson and pursuing justice on the basis of that truth. Some people are assuming that they know what really happened before a full investigation has been completed -- I am not one of them. - Sean McBride
NPR, Sean? Link, please. - Steven Perez from Android
Everyone would like justice and truth, but the truth is that we have a very unjust system at the moment-police, courts, media, elected officials. I think this is the frustration that many are expressing."The Shortest Distance Between Palestine and Ferguson " - weareone
And that is why we need to pay very close attention to this investigation -- and demand that it be an honest investigation, with no suppression, manipulation or skewing of the facts. - Sean McBride
Also, six bullets is a little over-the-top a punishment for alleged petty theft, especially when the officer who pulled the trigger had no idea that an alleged robbery had taken place when he shot Brown in the street. - Steven Perez from Android
Steven -- I heard the Siegel interview of Johnson's lawyer on my car radio yesterday afternoon. I'll look for a link -- but you may be able to beat me to it. - Sean McBride
Steven -- the robbery had little to do with the shooting -- other than possibly making Brown and Johnson paranoid about being stopped by Wilson within minutes of the crime. The open question that needs to be resolved is whether or not Brown assaulted Wilson, grabbed for his gun, and later turned and charged at him. That claim is out there, but we don't know whether it is true or not.... more... - Sean McBride
Sean, no. I just asked why you were apparently surprised. As for the officer being a "maniac" I haven't seen any credible claims of that nature. What is known is that Ferguson police are nortorious for harassment of black people. Which may just put them in line with Missouri law enforcement in general. - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte from Android
If you believe that all these people murdered by police were reaching for the cops' guns, you're wrong. Whenever I hear that, I automatically process it as a lie. You'd have to be incredibly stupid, or fully confident in your white privilege, to try to take away a cop's gun. Most people, and black people especially, know that that will lead to them being dead. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
Paranoid people generally don't mouth off to police, Sean. If Brown and Johnson had actually just pulled a robbery, why didn't they hightail it out of the street the minute they saw the cop? - Steven Perez from Android
We're going in circles, Sean. How are you going to insure an" honest investigation, with no suppression, manipulation or skewing of the facts" ? Did you ever see the movie, "The Great Debaters?" It addresses some of these issues--what is the appropriate response to unjust laws or laws that are not applied with equality or corrupt officials who protect the status quo? - weareone
Steven -- once again, you are asking questions that need to be answered -- one could make any number of speculations about every aspect of the case as we know it so far. Let's get all the facts out. - Sean McBride
I can't even believe the claim that Brown was charging the officer. Maybe he was mouthing off. But I'm telling you, unless they're on drugs (not weed), the likelihood of someone thinking they can get away with charging toward an armed cop is probably close to nil. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
weareone -- aggressive investigative journalists and social media are going to be all over this case, looking into every minute detail. It will be nearly impossible to engineer a cover-up, in my opinion. The US Justice Department seems to be partly or fully in charge of the investigation -- one doubts that Barack Obama and Eric Holder would participate in a cover-up to unfairly exonerate Wilson. - Sean McBride
Starmama -- I agree -- it sounds completely crazy for Brown to have charged Wilson while Wilson was pointing a gun at him -- no sane person would do that. It is definitely not a claim that I am inclined to believe based on common sense. - Sean McBride
And trust and believe, most of us with black children have already had the conversation with them about how they may be treated by the police, and how to conduct themselves in any contact they may have with them. I'm sure that's something you cannot wrap your mind around. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
Starmama -- I have black friends -- I know about that conversation. - Sean McBride
And by all accounts, Mike Brown was neither stupid nor insane. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
At the same time, Wilson would have had to be crazy to shoot Brown *six times* (at least) while he was surrendering, with his hands in the air, and with any number of potential eyewitnesses in the immediate vicinity. At least one of the two parties in this confrontation was definitely not in his right mind. - Sean McBride
But I still doubt you could fully comprehend what it's like to never have complete confidence in your child's safety being guaranteed by the police. Or knowing that your child will be judged, and treated, based on how he looks, regardless of how he behaves. As well as I like to believe I have prepared him, I still lose sleep over the dangers he faces that a white teenager never even needs to consider. - Starmama from FFHound(roid)!
Sean, a little free advice? Never lead with "I have black friends." I don't doubt your sincerity but it falls flat. You shouldn't have to be in proximity to black people to have empathy for them. That seems to be a large part of the problem. We largely don't get the benefit of the doubt. It's like the conservative politician who doesn't support gay rights until he discovers that his son is gay. - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte
MoTO -- I was just stating a fact -- I have had conversations about these conversations with black friends -- and heard disturbing stories from them on these issues. This topic isn't abstract for me. - Sean McBride
Sean, I don't doubt your sincerity either based on our discussions on other threads, but good advice from MoTO. Sean--- <<It will be nearly impossible to engineer a cover-up, in my opinion>> I hope you're right. - weareone
Again, I don't doubt that it is. Just consider what I said. - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte
"The open question that needs to be resolved is whether or not Brown [...] later turned and charged at him. " As Shaun King tweeted, according to eyewitness accounts, Brown ran 35 feet from the cop car before stopping and turning. The _fact_ is that he died 35 feet from the cop car. So this question seems pretty resolved to me. - Andrew C (✔)
I stand reprimanded for divulging that I've had conversations with black friends about black political and social issues. I will take care to keep that secret in the future. :) By the way, I didn't lead with that information -- I mentioned it off-handedly in the course of this conversation about "the conversation." - Sean McBride
Andrew -- that's a compelling argument -- maybe this case will revolve around those all-important 35 feet. (But -- was Wilson standing by the car when he fired the shots? Or had he pursued Brown to a position away from the car?) - Sean McBride
"was Wilson standing by the car when he fired the shots? Or had he pursued Brown to a position away from the car?" -- Neither matters at all when considering whether or not Brown charged. He made it 0 feet back towards Wilson. But if you are curious, there are multiple eyewitness reports that do in fact answer this second question you've just raised. - Andrew C (✔)
In terms of successfully prosecuting a case against Wilson, all of these niggling details will matter greatly. - Sean McBride
Andrew: what do you make of this? -- [Conversation recorded by bystander just moments after Michael Brown shooting casts doubt on claims the teen surrendered to Officer Darren Wilson] If there is a trial, this will become part of it. - Sean McBride
I guess if you're gonna believe what you're gonna believe, I can't stop you. - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew -- I didn't express any "beliefs" about the content of the Daily Mail article -- I was wondering what you make of it -- is it credible? - Sean McBride
Sean, I saw that video the other day. I'm not convinced that the people in that video were 'witnesses'. It sounds more like hearsay to me. They also mention 4 shots fired, a break, then 4 more shots. One person (is that in this video) says the last shots were fired closer and after Michael Brown was down in the street. - Greg GuitarBuster
Would it be fair to say that the conversations that were recorded here within moments of the shooting were spontaneous and uncoached? That is a factor I would take into consideration. - Sean McBride
Yep, definitely spontaneous and uncoached. - Greg GuitarBuster
Right -- but not necessarily true or a first-person account, as you point out. Still.... - Sean McBride
Sean, take it as you please. I could take your last comment to me as patronizing. But I'm taking the high road :) - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte
Victor Ganata
Trying to figure out what the message "Out with ducks" was supposed to be before being autocorrected.
The usual translation doesn't really make any sense either. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
I might write a message like that. - John (bird whisperer)
Hah! - Victor Ganata from iPhone
"Pout with ducks" : take a duckface selfie. - Andrew C (✔)
Far left browser tab: FF, Victor talking about ducks ("Out with ducks"). Far right browser tab: A Way With Words, talking about ducks ("Lord love a duck"). What's with all the ducks on my browser? - Betsy
Out of fucks (to give)? - Micah from FFHound(roid)!
Andrew C (✔)
I'm so bright I gotta wear shades.
Wouldn't you have that effect on other people? - John (bird whisperer)
LOL - Marie
Cartoon suns frequently wear sunglasses: - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
... is the real name of a San Francisco real estate brokerage. - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
Andrew C (✔)
Ferguson elected abusive policewoman to city council -
"One of the six current members of the Ferguson, MO, city council (and its only woman) is Kim Tihen. That's the same Kim Tihen implicated in the story from four years ago about four police officers beating up and jailing the wrong Henry Davis, then charging him with property damage for bleeding on their uniforms. See the text of his appeal here, which includes naming Tihen as the female officer who cuffed him in the cell right before he was kicked in the head." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
Of course, they did. In Texas, we keep sending our jerks to Austin. - Steven Perez
Andrew C (✔)
So Darren Wilson has a clean record? -
"The Ferguson police have indicated that there were no disciplinary reports in Darren Wilson's file. What Chief Jackson didn't tell anyone at any of the press conferences was that, until he took over in 2010, use of force complaints were not kept in an officer's personnel file." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
"But while the police department is trying very hard to portray Darren Wilson as a good cop, we should keep in mind the history of a department that had officers commit perjury to claim that another innocent victim bled on their uniforms. Police Officer John Beaird, Police Officer Christopher Pillarick, and Police Officer Michael White were all named in the Daily Beast article as signing the complaint and then denying the facts in their depositions." - Andrew C (✔)
"And don't forget that the policewoman, Kim Tihen, who straddled Mr. Davis and cuffed him before her fellow officers beat him badly enough to cause a concussion, is now a member of the City Council of Ferguson, as reported here by a member of Daily Kos." - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
Only a few weeks until we can all use our pumpkin spice jokes that weren't good enough last year.
Dammit, @desusnice did his pumpkin spice jokes a couple of hours ahead of mine. Serves me right for sitting on it over the weekend. - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
RT @billmon1: Mike Brown: Facts & Dog Whistles: h/t @miniver @ShaunKing
"It is being reported by friends & family of Darren Wilson that Mike Brown ran 35 feet away, turned around & ran full speed at the officer. Beyond this sounding preposterous for 82 different reasons, the FACTS show that Mike Brown's body was found 35 feet from the SUV. The FACTS suggest that Mike Brown ran 35 feet, then TURNED AROUND (as 4 eyewitnesses say) and was shot/killed in that very spot. Facts. Are you tracking with me? Beyond zero eyewitnesses saying that he ran full speed at the fully armed officer, facts show he didn't." - Andrew C (✔)
"Fact. The Ferguson police department DID NOT interview several key witnesses BEFORE the DOJ ever even heard this case existed. A choice. People continue to say, "let's wait for the facts" but plenty of facts exist. In fact, a lot of facts exist. What 4 different witnesses saw is not opinion, but fact. W/O talking to each other or knowing each other, they all reported the same thing." - Andrew C (✔)
"And again, I accept that eye witnesses are unreliable, but it was a clear day on a clear street with no traffic. Furthermore... The FACTS of the physical evidence match completely with the eyewitnesses that Brown ran, was hit, turned around, surrendered, then executed I just want us to be clear that we aren't fact-less right now. Yes, we need more facts, but the ones that exist are revealing." - Andrew C (✔)
"In other words, by releasing the video of Mike Brown stealing cigars, the police chief said, "White people. It's OK. You don't have to care"" - Andrew C (✔)
"Let me tell you about the dog whistle of thuggification of black victims of police violence. It's used to justify homicide. When Jordan Davis was gunned down by Michael Dunn for having his music too loud, people wanted to know WHAT MUSIC he was listening too. When Trayvon Martin was killed by George Zimmerman, toxicology reports were thuggified to show he smoked weed = he must have... more... - Andrew C (✔)
Victor Ganata
I dig how "turnt" vs "turned" is modeled after "burnt" vs "burned". I wonder if this could be a productive morphemic distinction in other words?
I do remember someone posted "kernt" (vs "kerned") - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Internt. - Andrew C (✔) from Android
We already have "learnt." - John (bird whisperer)
Do you think the two forms of "burn" or "learn" are being used in a slightly different sense? Something like, "I learned that..." vs. "he is a learnt/learned (?) man"? - Maitani
I don't think burned/burnt or learned/learnt are really different, but turned/turnt definitely is. - Victor Ganata
Don't forget to throw smelt/smelled in there, too; smelt can have an entirely different meaning, but it is also proper to use it as the past tense of smell. - COMPLICATED MR. NOODLE
'Turnt' is distinctively Southern/AAVE, no? Grew up hearing stuff like, "Don't get turnrt over no boy/girl.", "She turnt her nose up like she was somebody." - Anika from Android
Differences such as these could be used to express semantic distinctions. Another possibility is that a sort of final-obstruent-devoicing is being developed. Btw., in the German language, there is no difference in pronunciation whether you write d or t as final consonant. You always pronounce it as "t". This is why, when I read Anika's comment, my first thought was: how can she hear the difference? - Maitani
Most likely the differences lead to nothing at all. - Maitani
Yeah, I was definitely introduced to "turnt" from AAVE. That's why I'm fascinated because "turnt" seems to have a different connotation than "turned" does whereas you don't really get that with burnt/burned or learnt/learned or even smelt/smelled (assuming you mean "smelt" as the past tense and past participle of "smell" and not the separate verb "smelt") - Victor Ganata
What do you think that "different connotation" of "turnt" vs. "turned" may be? I know it is often difficult to describe. Or could you come up with another example, in addition to those Anika quoted? - Maitani
It's inflection of voice, audience and intent. Like, I never use 'turnt' around most non-black people, because they really won't get it if I said, oh say, "That bitch was turnt up that night." That sentence means 3 very different things depending on context. It's simple code-switching. The length of the 'urn' part can also imply if something made the speaker mad or it was funny a... more... - Anika
Yeah, I've only really started encountering the word 'turnt' recently (and mainly in written form on social media) so I can't really give a good description, but my metaimpression is that 'turned' can be used for the same sort of senses that 'turnt' is used for, but it doesn't really work the other way around. Like, "turned up" and "turnt up" can mean the same thing in a metaphoric... more... - Victor Ganata
Thank you, Anika and Victor. What I understood is that "turnt" is a somehow "marked" usage, emotionally, metaphorically or idiomatically, in a sense that has diverged from the basic meaning of the word, whereas "turned" is the unmarked, literal, unemotional, simply factual usage. - Maitani
Precisely. - Anika
Andrew C (✔)
John Textor Demands Apology From VFX Soldier | VFX Soldier -
former DD CEO's email shows his mentality: employee compensation is more like charity from the owner to the employees rather than money paid for work performed. - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
Textor: "after I was later surprised to learn that you were one of my employees, I realized that your Policy was to hide in the cubicle that I paid for, hope no one would notice and keep taking money from me for as long as you could while you stood strong in protest…anonymously of course. A fine employee you were indeed." - Andrew C (✔)
Textor: "Seriously Daniel, I am looking for that thank you…and my wife and kids would like an apology. If not, maybe just return the money I paid you while you sold your loyalty for the celebrity of an anonymous blog." - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
RT @mallelis: one of the best dismissals of "proportional representation" in diversity discussions I've seen yet, from @leonicka
"Census numbers and statics on demographics are not objective representations of a population. Behind the numbers is a whole history that answers the question “how did this happen?” You cannot say the US and Canada are white majority countries without acknowledging that the US and Canada are white settler colonialists nations. I’m sorry. Are we not supposed to talk about that?" - Andrew C (✔)
"You cannot point to the small percentage of people from x ethnic background as justification for their exclusion without acknowledging that the departments of immigration (and national security) of the US and Canada tightly regulate the movement of peoples across their borders based in large part on the labour needs of the state. Were we not supposed to talk about that either?" - Andrew C (✔)
"This reality is a bit harder to swallow: There are more white people in the US and Canada because the US and Canada were established using the systematic genocide of Native peoples, the theft of Native lands, and the labour of enslaved peoples in the past and immigrant peoples currently who were and are never meant to stay or survive. And now you’re uncomfortable. Good. When you accept... more... - Andrew C (✔)
Great points. - Stephen Mack
Does Facebook think users are dumb? “Satire” tag added to Onion articles [Updated] | Ars Technica -
Does Facebook think users are dumb? “Satire” tag added to Onion articles [Updated] | Ars Technica
"Facebook is already an unbearable enough place as of late, at least in my case. Awful national and international news stories continue to appear in my personal feed alongside friends' amateur political commentary and personal quibbles, and that mix makes the occasional ray of satirical, hilarious sunshine from off-kilter sites like The Onion welcome. Sadly, Facebook has begun trying to ruin even these fun articles by appending their titles with a "satire" tag." - Jessie from Bookmarklet
But... many users ARE dumb. - Andrew C (✔)
Andrew C (✔)
"Sometimes, the goal of eating is not to nourish the body or even delight the senses; sometimes the goal of eating is to fill your torsal cavity with so much /foreign matter/ that you are no longer capable of producing even the simplest of thoughts. This is called stress eating, and it is good for relieving stress." - Andrew C (✔) from Bookmarklet
When you say "The world is watching #Ferguson", if world = Twitter then feuds between Demi and 4SoS fans or pickup lines are trending higher
Well, given that 'trending' isn't an actual measure of what's being actively tweeted, but a complex algorithm ( that seems to be more related to your location, who you follow, what they're tweeting, and how quickly that changes. - Jennifer Dittrich
I would agree with the article except my feed is filled with Ferguson news, by both local and overseas people, and my Trends are set to worldwide with no personalisation. - Johnny
I've got my stuff set the same way, and haven't seen two out of those three in the last several hours. (Heck, I don't even know what one of them is.) Let's just say I wouldn't be surprised that, since Twitter sells the right to be trending, that they shape it in other ways whether we want them to or not. The third party tools seem to be better at measuring true traffic trends. - Jennifer Dittrich
I can't help wondering sometimes if it's a case of a #HashTag Blinkers. I know I've spent a lot of time in the #AusPol hashtag and sometimes my brain tricks me into thinking "Well, if it's so active on this, why isn't it trending". I wonder if SOME of the world is watching Ferguson but that vast majority isn't but it's hard to tell when you've got the blinkers on. (Not saying this to diminish Twitter's power, I just wonder sometimes if there are air pockets inside a larger bubble) - Johnny
I think there's some of that, but I also think they've got an invested stake in showing just the right things when they're trending. I'm interested to see what the metrics say for the whole last week or so in retrospect. - Jennifer Dittrich
Just turned on the Tailored section and it showed up at the top. Hmmmmm. The non-tailored Worldwide trend has no Ferguson but my tailored does. My bubble theory continues - Johnny
And now my 'non-tailored' Worldwide has two different Ferguson tags. I guess the 'non' is a bit of a mislabeling, right? Because if you're not seeing that, then there's obviously a difference between what they're showing us. - Jennifer Dittrich
The Ferguson / National Guard trends just showed up but there hasn't been a Ferguson related subject for the past 9 hours (been doing company Twitter stuff all day at work). - Johnny
But, for reals, the Demi Lavato vs 4SoS fued was crazy before. I had it up on my Mac and the Ferguson running on my PC and the feud was going faster. - Johnny
Looking at a couple of the hashtag tracker sites ( is easier on the eyes,) it looks like Ferguson should have been the fourth most popular tag between 9-11pm PST (behind the 5sos and demi lovato and pickup lines ones.) So, they were definitely trending higher.. but it looks like Ferguson should have been pretty up there, but unlike the others it abruptly spiked, rather than... more... - Jennifer Dittrich
They're trying to mind control us with pop stars! Josie and the Pussycats movie has come true! (I may be a bit punchy after not much sleep!) - Jennifer Dittrich
your trending results may vary with geography? seems likely. - Big Joe Silence
For me, Ferguson is now the top trending topic. 1.1m tweets. It was at 648k yesterday, I think. Awkward pickup lines are at 22k tweets, so not sure why they'd be trending above Ferguson. - Andrew C (✔)
My top trending topics on Twitter: #Ferguson (1.1M), #MikeBrown (171.5k), The National Guard (13.8k) - Victor Ganata
Digging deeper, #SummerSlam has 474.6k. I wonder how they order this? - Victor Ganata
Seeing a random sampling of tweets which I'll paraphrase as, 'all this is brining out my inner libertarian'. Um, dudes, rest assured there are a few other political ideologies that ALSO, you know, define police playing the totalitarian card a fucking horror show.
And it is all dudes. - Micah
Yeah, but some people will never put the "liberal" badge on. - Andrew C (✔) from Android
remind them that "it ain't about you." - MoTO: Tufted Coqeutte
There are a lot of flavors of libertarianism, but I always thought one of the main things libertarians tended to agree the government was good for was public security, and you had to get into anarchism for the rejection of even that. - Mark Trapp
Andrew C (✔)
In less serous news, I got a haircut today. Normally I cut my own hair, since it's just a buzz cut, but it's a real hassle in this sublet. The hairdresser shaved my hairline straight; I always leave it natural. I don't like this look at all.
And it's kinda weird how a couple little buzzes here and there to straighten it out make it look so different. - Andrew C (✔)
Victor Ganata
I mean, if we really have no faith in any of our institutions and it's all just partisan hackery, then America is definitely very dead.
You're right about that too. We need to stop the total support along party lines neither side has all the answers. I am proud to be a Republican, but I don't support all of the party line positions. I am also proud to be an American, but I recognize the pitfalls of blind patriotism. - Eric Logan from FFHound!
It seems likely that that ship has sailed when the vast majority of people assume all of government is utterly corrupt and the mechanisms and institutions of democracy and justice are non-functional and not worth saving. We're just riding out the death throes, really. - Victor Ganata
Seems pretty obvious in retrospect that constantly proclaiming the government can't do anything right is a self-fulfilling prophecy. - Victor Ganata
This isn't a both-sides-do-it argument, either. There's a definite asymmetry to the fall of the American empire. When historians look back, I suspect it will be readily apparent that one party actively destroyed people's faith in the institutions of government while the other party failed to counteract this and clung to the delusion of being able to keep neoliberal policy sustainable, indirectly destroying people's faith in the institutions of government. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
This conversation started over Rick Perry who we both agree is an idiot. The fact that the Democrats in Travis Co. support the prosecutor after all that has transpired speaks volumes. Alan Dershowitz even thinks it's idiocy. This is what he had to say about it. "This is another example of the criminalization of party differences," said Dershowitz, a prominent scholar on United States... more... - Eric Logan
You have any proof that the special prosecutor previously hired by GHWB as assistant U.S. attorney and recommended by Kay Bailey Hutchinson and John Cornyn for U.S. atty of the Western District of Texas has decided to pursue this case based solely on politicization? - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Special prosecutor in Perry case known as thorough, dogged attorney - Houston Chronicle - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Whether you really did stop watching Fox News or not, you sure are echoing their talking points. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
It's just what all you guys like to say. I don't watch hardly anything on TV I read. - Eric Logan
That Fox news dog whistle I used. according to you I never heard of this guy when I tried to elucidate it. I have also never seen him on Fox news have you ? - Eric Logan
Well, it could be coincidence. It happens. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Seriously, insinuating that a special prosecutor is in it out of pure political motivation is a pretty serious allegation. It's clearly meant to erode confidence in the justice system. And it works. Lots of liberals and conservatives have little-to-no faith in the criminal justice system. Just something to think about as the country enters the last stages of collapse. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Guy who repeats everything AGW blogs say (usually without citing his blog sources) is a parrot? Gasp. - Andrew C (✔)
I'm willing to entertain the unlikely possibility that he came up with his ideas all by himself and it's just pure coincidence that they resemble Fox News talking points because I'm silly like that. And to be fair, as far as AGW is concerned, he usually does post links to denialist sites. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Unlikely possibility. I found the Axelrod Tweet on the Dailly Kos complaining about how he was helping the right wing propaganda machine which is a laugher in and of itself. Especially in light of the fact that this post is about partisanship, I found the Dershowitz quote here. ==> - Eric Logan from FFHound!
Seriously? You were going to use the word "fact" with a link to Newsmax? - Victor Ganata from iPhone
You asked me where it came from after speculating it was from Fox News. Fact means he said it. Did he not say it ? Dershowitz writes for Newsmax BTW. At the same time that the Daily Kos is trying to pull Axelrod back in line. It's too funny. Pretty soon we will have denialist Politicians whenever they don't tow the party line ? - Eric Logan
It's not about "toeing the line". It's about guys like Dershowitz and Axelrod speculating out of their ass when you know they haven't seen the evidence or heard the testimony. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Speculating out of their ass. Are you projecting again ? LOL - Eric Logan
What, you think Dershowitz or Axelrod have actually seen the evidence or read the testimony? - Victor Ganata from iPhone
No I think you're projecting. What does it matter what they think he was indicted he should resign and they should keep Lehmberg. LOL - Eric Logan
The law says Perry can stay governor even if he's convicted (although presumably the legislature will remove him). I think I'm OK with waiting for the criminal justice system to do its thing here. I think the people who want to delegitimize the process are the ones with politically motivated agenda. - Victor Ganata from iPhone
That's not what the Democrats are calling for and once again I agree with you. I also think he should be removed if he is convicted. I think Lehmberg remaining in office is so egregious that I was actively looking for bi partisan support for Perry on this one issue. Thankfully I found some. Have a nice night. - Eric Logan from FFHound!
Perry is within his rights to stay in office as much as Lehmberg is ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ - Victor Ganata from iPhone
Drunk driving in Texas is almost a rite of passage So Lehmberg is NOT equivalent.. plus of course at least 2 other (Republican) County Attorneys convicted for same were NOT called out by Perry - WarLord
Let me spell it out: if the indictment is nothing but a politically motivated sideshow then this requires one to believe McCrum and/or Richardson and/or the grand jury are either grossly incompetent or on the take from Democrats, suggesting that Texas doesn't really have a functioning justice system and it's just the Wild, Wild West with rival factions (figuratively) shooting at each... more... - Victor Ganata from iPhone
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