34 secs flat for my latest tweet. Thanks Paul and team for this!
- Jorge Escobar
wow, that makes actually want to use Twitter. I may just go tweet something.
- Mike Nencetti
It should be even faster than that Jorge, but our systems are getting near their limit. I hope to have it down to 1 sec sometime next month.
- Paul Buchheit
Yay! That's fantastic! I was getting really bored of manually refreshing it every time I tweeted. Especially from my phone. :)
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
Does this mean that Scoble can get smarter on FriendFeed again?
- Crutis
You are still working on Frienfeed (: how nice !
- Murat Can Demir
^ That's probably the best part of this announcement, TBH. Good point
- LANjackal
from IM
whoa, it took less than a minute. i accdently tested it but it's great :) thnx
- asli subasi
awesome, keep it up guys, i knew you would not let us down
- Iggy Mwangi
Great news, love the efforts still put in to FF.I use Google Reader to share into FF (PubSubHubBub) then FF to Twitter (now Real-Time). The URL shortener is great (ff.im), and so FF is central to my social lifestream. I don't care what Scoble says, FF is technically better and feature-rich.
- Keith Rowland
P.S. Conversations are still better here than on GReader, and you just can't have one on Twitter.
- Keith Rowland
You didn't break the FF Facebook app while you were at it, did you? It hasn't worked since.
- Tim Tyler
Oh, awesome!!! 12 seconds :) I can finally go back to Twitter (...okay no I can't I've turned into a Friendfeed junkie..) but prior it took hours upon hours for me to see a feed. Dumb I am, I never suspected a problem LMAO.
- H0llywoodWh0re
Paul ?? Twitter updates facebook status and then facebook creates a new feed here on friendfeed. So we have same entries both from twitter and facebook on friendfeed. Could you guys please work on how we can avoid duplicate entries? Thank you. ( If there's already a way to avoid this, pls let me know)
- Murat Can Demir
Cool, thanks, Paul! :-) RT Twitter updates have been missed. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
And just as I say that, I see my tweets are not coming into FF in real-time. :-(
- Kol Tregaskes
Kol. I just tweeted and it was here before I could get out of Tweetie and launch Safari... It's working :)
- Johnny Worthington
from iPhone
Try it in real life. It's a nifty demo but it's still much easier to read the label or upc code and search on that. Going from question to answer it has about a 10% hit rate.
- Hayes Haugen
Hayes, have you seen this video? http://www.youtube.com/watch... Taking old vacation pictures and finding out what the buildings are. The good stuff starts about 4:30 minutes in. :)
- Matt Cutts
So he taking pictures of his computer using his phone, finding out what the object is, then going back to the computer and typing it in? Something seems terribly inefficient about that ;)
- Amit Patel
Amit: my point is that by the time I start the app, take the picture and get a false hit it's faster to just recognize the object myself and search on it (with my phone).
- Hayes Haugen
Matt: like I said it does cool stuff sometimes but as a general purpose tool for identifying the things I run across it has not done well. I'm not claiming anything other than how it's worked for me. Suggest people use the product instead of watching promo videos! And I'm not crapping on the concept - looking forward to its evolution.
- Hayes Haugen
From most recent search history: miss: $20 bill, Norwegian flag, a Sitar, a MacBook, an iPhone, a Leatherman tool, the box for the Leatherman, a Canon Ti, a photo of Venice with a tower. Hit: box of Pepperidge Farm Entertaining Quartet crackers because it recognized "Entertaining Quartet" in huge letters - just like I did. What I really need it to do is recognize things I don't recognize. So I'm off to do some tests....
- Hayes Haugen
The file upload procedure is just plain broke -- is anybody at FriendFeed even interested? About 9 out 10 attempts end up with an endless "processing" cycle.
I had this issue with an mp3 I tried uploading today as well. Couldn't they just play from another source without actually having it on their servers? If the link points to a valid file on the internet, it should still be able to play fine.
- Itachi
I think they decided to not respond to this group. See profile: "If you're experiencing a bug or issue, please see our <a href="http://friendfeed.com/about...">Contact page</a> to get in touch with us directly."
- NaHi
from f2p
Aye, same thing with spam. More time/effort is being dedicated elsewhere..understandable.
- Itachi
We're investigating. Are you experiencing this with all file types?
- Paul Buchheit
That's really interesting because I've not experienced this trouble at all. I only upload image files though.
- pea
Images generally work for me. An mp3 file took several attempts though.
- Todd Hoff
Apparently you can only upload 3 mp3 files per day (I am guessing per 24 hour period) -- at least that is what the message I got seems to imply. It gives you this message at the end of the upload process -- and you have to wait until the quota is replenished ( though you have no way of knowing when that would be unless you remember when all the upload attempts happened).
- Brian Sullivan
I had some issues uploading .mp3s a while ago (finally just sent them to Posterous and had done with it) - Paul, is there a file size limit? The ones I had were encoded at like 320kpbs, so they were about 9 or 10mb. The smaller ones I did (4-5mb) seemed to have a greater success rate, but I couldn't really test because of the upload limit that counted the failed ones against me.
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
From what I can tell, the upload problems are caused by S3 errors (we store the files using Amazon S3). I've put in a little more logging and more retries. If you still have trouble uploading files, post the filename and I'll investigate.
- Paul Buchheit
What is really happening during that "processing" cycle? The "upload" part appears to work -- at least the progress bar and time taken is in line with the size of the file. For me it is the "processing" part that has failed.
- Brian Sullivan
The "upload" part is uploading to the FriendFeed servers. The "processing" part is the FriendFeed server uploading to Amazon S3, which is where there are sometimes problems.
- Paul Buchheit
Ah, thanks for clearing that up, Paul.
- Micah Wittman
This is still occurring. Not uploading to Amazon apparently.
- Eric Logan
Agreed Louis. I am still getting new subscriptions on FF ( though not as many as before). FF stays open until the fat lady sings.
- Roberto Bonini
You made very good points, Louis - both why FF has not been surpassed as a solution and why you stating these points is important. Real time has slowed for me in FF so I can actually catch the content and I'm still getting new subscribers. The value I derive from FF is undiminished.
- WorldofHiglet
Finding Louis? Is that the sequel to Finding Nemo?
- WorldofHiglet
I so crashed with that not entered big reply, making a post with two OS in virtualization for a screenshot... I'll get back atcha for the usual Disqus thoughtful exercise, I'm not the daily blogger, but I have lots of those ranged comments... my point was with the "even if it's assumed I'm looking denial straight in the face." being an excellent turning for that movie. Finding Louis...
more...
- ElijahBailey-Zu of FF <0,
Oh, good. For a moment there I thought we were in trouble.
- Santa CW™
You're absolutely right. Which is why I'm sticking around, too.
- Dennis Jernberg
You hit the nail on the head.. that's why I'm staying onboard!!
- Chris Myles
You won't be .... I will ... (and Windows 7 was my idea ..... :)
- Charlie Anzman
If Friendfeed went under, it would have to be immediately reinvented. I'm still not getting why so many people don't yet get Friendfeed.
- Sean McBride
This seems really straightfwd - the 20% time won't be enough to implement new features etc. I think it is just a matter of time until someone builds on top of the FF API with new/addtl features and launches a site (hmmm, "FriendDig"? "DigFeed"?). The functionality is too compelling to waste away
- Dave Hodson
Everybody talks about filtering the real-time stream of information online but the Activity Streams community is the place where those conversations go on between leading engineers at the world's biggest and smallest social networks, with the goal of replacing the "walled garden" model of social networking with an open, interoperable communication marketplace. If Activity Streams succeeds, you will be able to subscribe to and filter the activities of your friends across multiple different networks, without having to sign-up for or even ever have heard of those other networks. This is almost the equivelent of AT&T phones being able to make calls to Verizon phones. Of rail-transport companies being able to ship goods across the country over different railroad networks - because the rails for the trains to run on are the same size. It's different though, because of the granular filtering by type of activity. Applications built on top of Activity Streams will allow the equivilent of a...
more...
- Marshall Kirkpatrick
Can't wait. And no redundancies, please.
- Laura Norvig
Will be interesting to see how much granularity over permissions the content creators will have. Will I have to just choose "yes" or "no" that anyone who is connected to me anywhere will be allowed to see my stuff? How could greater control work - seems complicated.
- Laura Norvig
Here's a fractal I use that may be useful as a template for Activity Streams... 1) interest-generating opener 2) background on current threats/tension to resolve 3) opportunity or vision of a better state 4) strategy w/steps to get there 5) issues to solve before accepting strategy 6) next steps by stakeholders
- Mark Frazier
This is awesome Marshall. I'm wondering whether we broaden the concept beyond messaging to decentralize the social graph itself, so app developers can leverage existing relationships without having to build on top of a facebook or a twitter...(or perhaps that is implied here?)
- Tony Zito
Marshall ... thanks for the initial explanation... I've been intrigued by all the references to Activity Streams and http://activitystrea.ms/ by people I know and trust - I just haven't had the time to join another mailing list. Just yesterday I was on the site trying to understand more and reading Chris Messina's almost-year-old post: http://factoryjoe.com/blog...
- Dan York
Will this "first draft" evolve into a RWW post?
- Dan York
Bu çalışmanın neden ve kim tarafından yapıldığını öğrenebileceğimiz bir link olsaymış.
- Can Eğridere "Jegraphy"
merak ne güzel şey, güzel şey merak ;) MAC'in makyözlerinden biri yapmış..Maalesef kendisini yaptığı şeyden daha değerli bulup belirtmemişler ismini.
- Tugce Cengiz
Gillmor Gang is recorded live in front of a live studio audience.
- Cliff Gerrish
Oops, missed my calendar notification for this week's episode.
- Matt Mastracci
The names have not been changed to protect the innocent...
- Aron Michalski
Gillmor Gang is recorded live in front of a real-time web audience...
- Kevin Marks
I'm happy to see a simplification of the Facebook API. That's one issue I've always had with the platform. The initial learning curve is very steep.
- Matt Mastracci
Scoble still wants to port your email address out of Facebook...
- Cliff Gerrish
I don't have enough friends in my email address book to make Scoble's screen look busy enough
- Aron Michalski
The question is should Scoble be able to send your email address to another platform, or another application.
- Cliff Gerrish
Do I have to agree to TOS with Scoble or does he have to agree with me?
- Aron Michalski
Facebook is the intermediary. Although you have a social contact with Scoble.
- Cliff Gerrish
Cliff: I did a brute force workaround. I just manually copied the email addresses I wanted into Outlook myself.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, it's the programatic access that can lead to looting of addess books.
- Cliff Gerrish
The TOS doesn't forbid me from doing that and it only took a few hours.
- Robert Scoble
Cliff: yeah, but sorry, if you are a spammer you just go to Mechanical Turk and pay someone to do it.
- Robert Scoble
Yes, I agree. But the question is should Facebook facilitate the process?
- Cliff Gerrish
Putting money in front of a spammer's problem will reduce the amount of spam dramatically (which is why spammer probably won't use mturk). Maybe Facebook should charge per-user/per-transaction fees to extract email addresses?
- Matt Mastracci
"Facebook is an identity platform." Very interesting competitive landscape -- Twitter, Google, MSFT, Comcast?
- Cliff Gerrish
"Your inside is out, and your outside is in"
- Cliff Gerrish
"Open Graph API" is a really confusing name for adding webpages to FB as feeds
- Kevin Marks
Actually I'm thinking of Comcast making Cable available through the Network for its users.
- Cliff Gerrish
And the topic of attention and identity which were of interest to a small group of us is now an issue for a very large group of users.
- Aron Michalski
Haven't checked the roadmap but I wonder if there will be more possibilities for API use with pages and not just the main FB friend stream.
- beersage
Seems like financial institutions have a better identity play, but they're hopeless with this kind of thing. Credit Cards have a jump on it. Telecoms could also have an opening.
- Cliff Gerrish
Does the open graph address pages or items in a stream?
- Cliff Gerrish
Anyone ask about the problem of Facebook owning our social graph?
- Kurt Jarchow
so FB's "Open Graph API" is the opposite of the Social Graph API that reveals existing connections.
- Kevin Marks
This aspect is interesting, in that presence on the internet for a long time could be anonymous and now the value will be from having a unified ID.
- Aron Michalski
So it Bret saying it's just marketing spin at this point? ;-)
- Ken Sheppardson
You'll see that the owners of the pipe, the bankers and the retailers all want to know who we are so they can get paid.
- Aron Michalski
can we identify the source of the metadata item and allow for filtering of what's a valid linkage?
- bear (aka Mike Taylor)
Robert, are you coming out for SideWiki for Facebook profiles?
- Cliff Gerrish
I totally agree with Robert. The Friendfeed search is incredibly powerful and useful.
- Karoli
Permalinks for stream items is a critical feature.
- Cliff Gerrish
how long has Bret been in the FB world :) - he's being asked questions about future growth and planning that he may not have even been in the meetings that cover those new items yet :)
- bear (aka Mike Taylor)
FB conversations are fractured, across different pages and places. Mobile experience can be a cul de sac of death for a conversation...
- Aron Michalski
my criticism of Facebook has nothing to do with the stream. it has to do with the mashup of everyone I've ever known in my entire life.
- Karoli
i think it's great that i see other people's comments when i comment on an item on FB
- Bastian
I'd like my stream to show me things that I initially reject, and then later come to accept.
- Cliff Gerrish
Facebook represents my "real" social network only as it existed 25 years ago.
- Ken Sheppardson
we need more depth as to what a "friend" is - need to factor in FOAF items
- bear (aka Mike Taylor)
Ken, i wish it was that way. It has pieces of every aspect and social graph I've had for my entire life.
- Karoli
I'm starting to realize and appreciate Robert as an underdamped dynamic system, oscillating wildly but eventually settling/converging on a steady signal, e.g. the comments today on Wave vs the initial reaction. And I mean that as a compliment, Robert :-)
- Ken Sheppardson
There is plenty of conversations I am glad to leave off of FB; 90% of the people from my past have no clue about any of what we are discussing and don't care.
- Aron Michalski
Ken, yea - that's a great way to describe him. I agree that he should take it as a compliment
- bear (aka Mike Taylor)
Again, it is easy to bring content into FB but why can't I subscribe to an RSS feed of a page like I can w/ a Twitter user?
- beersage
my problem: 90% of the people I have contact with in real life have me friended on FB and HATE my politics, leaving me with fluffy little bullshit updates. No conversation. Just nonsense.
- Karoli
The FB pipes need to be full duplex.
- Cliff Gerrish
I think the part of FF we'll never see in FB is the basic lack of walls in FF and the philosophy that anything and everything can flow freely into and out of the system.
- Ken Sheppardson
Ken, FF may be the outside part of FB.
- Cliff Gerrish
how is the spewing of netflix queuing any different that all of those mafia wars or farm app updates I get on FB ;)
- bear (aka Mike Taylor)
If that's the case, Cliff, I'd like to see them embrace that. I may have missed a bunch of signals, but I'm still working on the assumption that FF is feature frozen and will be subsumed into FB.
- Ken Sheppardson
I'm glad that neither FF or FB or Twitter will be the hot new toy we all talk about this time next year!
- Bastian
Bastian: Twitter is about to release more new features than it has EVER released. Are you sure we won't be talking about them in a year?
- Robert Scoble
Bastian, where would be talking about whatever we'll be talking about.
- Cliff Gerrish
By the way, Tina says 'hi' to the chat...
- Cliff Gerrish
Robert, only if Twitter survives their own creativity and popularity
- bear (aka Mike Taylor)
Robert is raring to have a discussion about Twitter lists. :)
- beersage
bear: I'm pretty sure that in a year we'll be doing Twitter. Two years, though? Maybe not. Things don't change that fast when they have such momentum.
- Robert Scoble
I'm loving this shot of the studio. Rock on.
- Karoli
Robert: Twitter maybe, but i'm even more excited about new third party tools build on Tiwtter. Even so everything i was told from the people i know at Twitter, there are cool things coming.
- Bastian
"talking a little about"... so, it's not imminent :-)
- Ken Sheppardson
Generalizing twitter to many kinds of Activity Streams is interesting, and I hope Bret picks up on that
- Kevin Marks
The thing about FF & Twitter is that they make it possible to curate a stream of a niche topic and put it into context w/ other content on a website. Lost of potential. With FB, you cant use any valuable stream there outside. Still a walled garden.
- beersage
I have to say, time listening to the Gillmor Gang is always well spent!
- Bastian
leolaporte: The Twitter-Bing deal underscores the problem with data silos. Shouldn't search be universal? They're my tweets, not theirs. - http://twitter.com/leolapo...
If they're "your tweets" why do you put them in Twitter? The 'silos' argument continues to leak oil. Search is what search vendors make it -- nothing is universal.
- Cliff Gerrish
It's a net neutrality issue. Twitter offers full access to the stream of data (our tweets) only to the highest bidder, not universally. ALL search engines (and others) should have full and equal access to this dataset.
- Leo Laporte
Totally agree with Leo, a worst case scenario is Bing gets exclusive access to both FB and Twitter. At that point everyone needs to get working on PubSubHubBub, rssCloud and/or FriendFeed2 and decentralize social networks. They are becoming a basic communication mechanism and they seem to reside under the control of 3-4 people. Imagine if email had been under the control of 2 companies for the last couple decades.
- Ed Millard
Completely agree with Leo, I wasn't sure of this but they way Leo puts it, makes clear that its net neutrality issue
- Veetrag
Right on Leo. I first heard about this stuff from Brian Hendrickson and Dave Winer, but Marc Canters been raising hell about it for a while.
- Mark Essel
Net neutrality is forced upon companies by us, the users. That's why I think this will never become any issue. We can just drop Twitter for something else like identi.ca if we start to feel locked in. There are always other solutions and other platforms waiting for us. That's is what's so great about the Internet.
- Rutger Blom
Sounds like a nationalize Twitter argument to me. All search engines may spider the public pages. Why should they also have access to Twitter's internals?
- Cliff Gerrish
And since they're "your tweets" why don't you publish them or make them available to search engines yourself. Wouldn't that be the most 'distributed' solution?
- Cliff Gerrish
Um, isn't net neutrality about access to the net? It doesn't guarantee access to data; I, for one, don't want my bank records, for example, to be freely accessible to any search engine. Or anyone else for that matter.
- Mistletoe Glen
In addition, it looks like Google will also have a deal with Twitter. The Bing deal is non-exclusive. The introduction of the term 'net neutrality' is completely orthogonal.
- Cliff Gerrish
I can see his point I mean yeah they are his/our words. But aren't we giving up ownership of those words in exchange for using their service? Yeah I bitch about things like, reliability issues with services like twitter all the time but its free. And in using it I have [been] exposed to ideas and opinions I otherwise might not have been.
- J. Abdul-Qahhar
J. Abdul-Qahar: true enough, I was thinking about this today: the value proposition of web sites that connect people. Somehow they draw us in, and instigate us to share, and interact in ways we might normally not have. I have met so many wonderful folks online, and gotten so much incredible information, all for the price of my attention and time. My only wish is that I get to keep my social connections somehow, external to the networks which draw us all in.
- Mark Essel
Look, friendfeed is awesome. Will it remain that way without development, certainly not over the long run. They could open the source base, and allow open source development to keep it rich, and I think ads would pay for server costs. Just let it go and live or die on its own.
- Mark Essel
The basic FF Tornado server is already open source. It has demos with basic functionality, Google login authentication very simple blog, chat and facebook client. Unfortunately I don't think they've open sourced the actual FF server so it would be quite a bit of development work to get Tornado back to the same level of functionality as the current FF server. Hard to say if you could pull it off and get the existing FF user base to migrate in tact and then grow it again.
- Ed Millard
For me its like this. Since I'm not paying ANY money for using a service, when the owners/developers hatch what seems like a well laid plan (or even a hair brained scheme) intended to provide the funds necessary to keep the service going; what can I say? Except of course, good luck. As for open source ff, as hard as they have worked on it, I cant see asking, or expecting them to "hand it over to the community" just because we like it.
- J. Abdul-Qahhar
We're likely to migrate anyway. Most of us already use many social tools, and information searching/aggregating resources. But unfortunately, without dedicated support I can't see friendfeed keeping up with alternatives, even alternatives as limited as the other social streams I use (facebook, Twitter).
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
To be honest I don't really want tweets to be in search. It's bad enough that engines are filled with crappy blogs* and price comparison sites. I want my search to be authoritative. Seems lille this will creat a)noise b)tweet 'seo' and c) tweet seo 'experts'. *unless your a spammer this is unlikely to refer to you
- Phill Price
from iPhone
Phill: sorry, there are SOME Tweets that will help search. I'm seeing those come through all the time. http://twitter.com/favorit... has more than six thousand tweets -- all of which should be on search.
- Robert Scoble
Glen: "net neutrality" and "universal access", I'm sure you know, are the government's buzzwords they're using to ram their toe into the door. Next comes the rest of the foot, then the calf, and when they're finished they've opened the door wide so that THEY have access to all of the data as well. It's for the children, ya know.
- Craig Eddy
I want realtime search. Are Bing and Google going to provide this? Otherwise there are other tools that do a better job. Like TweetDeck.
- Rutger Blom
Rutger: my tweet showed up on Bing nearly instantly yesterday. So that's pretty real time to me. Bing and Google have access to the FULL firehose feed. Real time is here baby! Now, is it useful? That's another question.
- Robert Scoble
"Last month, Xeni blogged about the photoshop disaster that is this Ralph Lauren advertisement, in which a model's proportions appear to have been altered to give her an impossibly skinny body ("Dude, her head's bigger than her pelvis"). Naturally, Xeni reproduced the ad in question. This is classic fair use: a reproduction "for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting," etc. However, Ralph Lauren's marketing arm and its law firm don't see it that way. According to them, this is an "infringing image," and they thoughtfully took the time to send a DMCA takedown notice to our awesome ISP, Canada's Priority Colo. One of the things that makes Priority Colo so awesome is that they don't automatically act on DMCA takedowns. Instead, they pass them on to us and we talk about whether they pass the giggle-test. This one doesn't. So, instead of responding to their legal threat by suppressing our criticism of their marketing images, we're gonna mock them. Hence this post."
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
I wonder how the models feel when they see a botch job as bad as that? They should be able to sue RL for making them look so bad. Of course, maybe she wants to look malnourished and alien-headed.
- Kenton
Thar's just a disgusting picture in so many ways.
- beersage
Yes, the picture itself is problematic -- setting up that sort of a body image as in any way positive in our culture is fraught with it's own ethical complications. It also sucks that Ralph Lauren would seek to squash legitimate criticism of their ads by using the DMCA. I hope they understand that trying to stomp out free speech usually is only like pouring gasoline on the original fire and it's message or criticism.
- Thomas Hawk
FriendFeed update. Paul Buchheit wrote me and said he's been very sick the past few days. That might explain why he hasn't engaged the way we want. He also offered to do an interview with me to discuss the future of FriendFeed and what they are doing at Facebook soon. We're working that out, hopefully soon (but might not be until November sometime)
Bruce: FriendFeed=Facebook. So, I'm interested in what he's doing and I'm a big fan of Facebook's. Twitter needs some competition. The Fail Whale is getting to me.
- Robert Scoble
I know it's a stretch but can we gather specific questions for Paul to answer?
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
When other sites like twitter come out with new features, you want to be at the front of the excited crowd. FriendFeed will make you into that curmudgeon who's always saying, "So what? They did that two years ago at FriendFeed."
- Bruce Lewis
Cjay: I've been working on this interview since before Facebook bought FriendFeed. :-)
- Robert Scoble
manielse: well, the interview isn't on 100% yet and now that I've talked about it in public who knows what will happen? But if it does happen of course we'll get you involved.
- Robert Scoble
Cjay: I might be a rusty wheel, but remember two things: 1. I put many many thousands of hours into FriendFeed before the sale, bringing my audience over here at great risk to my personal brand. Lots of "experts" like Mike Arrington told me I was wrong to do that. 2. I'm still here.
- Robert Scoble
But yes I would agree that allowing and or resting your personal branding on a service thats based on a cloud application with it's roots depending on a social network model is very risky.
- Cjay
Cjay: actually it's not. It just looks risky.
- Robert Scoble
To those giving Scoble crap for being on FF, aren't you tired of that? You all have been doing that for at least a year. Enough. For us on FF, we'd love to see an interview, thanks.
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
Chicken soup - but stay away from those soul books ;) Hope you're up to speed soon, Paul.
- Micah Wittman
Looking at the time-scale, doesn't that actually answer the question? You don;t wait THAT long to deliver good news or to debunk a false rumour that killings your platform (well, Zucks platform).
- Jim Connolly
Paul - sorry to hear that! (it's 2:30 am here, I can empathize with your sleep problem)
- Susan Beebe
from BuddyFeed
Eric, sorry if it sounded like I was giving him crap. That wasn't my intention. I think Scobleizer has a serious career decision to make: http://ourdoings.com/ourdoin...
- Bruce Lewis
The problem i see is that social network cloud applications seem to live in peoples heads rent free.
- Cjay
First, FriendFeed is _not_ going away. (in fact, we're working on switching it to new servers) Second, I know everyone wants to know what the team is working on, but we don't pre-announce things, so for now all I can say is that there's good stuff on the way. Re: http://friendfeed.com/jworthi...
Paul, working on friendfeed.com stuff or facebook.com?
- Kol Tregaskes
I like the first sentence. The rest is just gravy.
- Derek Coward
I'm totally happy if we just reside on decent servers, and get occasional IT help... We'll keep the rest of the ship running :)
- Christopher Galtenberg
Paul - is that why it's been slower lately vs.pre-fb ?
- Allen Stern
Paul please repeat it in re-phrased form: Friendfeed is NOT going to repeat destiny of Jaiku? Y/N
- A.T.
Can't wait... **Fingers tapping desk impatiently**
- AJ Batac
But what does "going away" mean, Paul? And what does "team" mean? And when you say "pre-announce", are you talking about the Palm Pre?
- Ken Sheppardson
Allen, the slowness is due to growth (more users and more data), but I put in a few fixes yesterday that should speed things up a bit.
- Paul Buchheit
Paul, sometimes when I open up threads I get the Opps... error. Is that related? It has been happening more and more these last few days.
- Kol Tregaskes
Still better than twitter and facebook. Thanks for the update!
- Mike Nencetti
Paul, thanks for the incredible work with FriendFeed. Please, keep it alive! and most importantly keep it FriendFeed!
- Ciro
as long as FF doesn't go dark or fall to pieces due to lack of maintenance, i think most ppl would be appeased.
- Joe Silence is not Santa
Does this mean that the sky is not falling and we should stop running around screaming GODZILLA! and pointing in the direction of FB?
- Moved to Facebook
from fftogo
Thanks for the update! Would like to know if there will be actual development done on FriendFeed in the future (other than bug fixes/minor updates) but I understand if you can't really talk about that too much.
- Brandon Titus
Paul: so still no answer from you as to if your 'good stuff' is being developed for FB or FF? The silence suggests it's FaceBook you're working on, or at least transferring FF into an 'add on' for Facebook?
- Jim Connolly
Kol, fb platform and openness, primarily.
- Paul Buchheit
i made a post here - http://www.centernetworks.com/friendf... - one interesting note - maybe FB keeps FF running nice and smooth to keep the early adopters happy as it's a great way to get new features out to them via this channel... just a thought.
- Allen Stern
Wow. I've had to eat my words before but these are the best-tasting ones yet!
- Akiva Moskovitz
from BuddyFeed
Akiva, just add salt. You know which kind :)
- Micah Wittman
These are the best words I could have expected by Paul. There is obviously a cultural difference between the two platforms and audience and I'm assuming both the former FF team and the FB team recognize that and are sensitive to the community. Thank you Paul and I hope you are feeling better....
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Allen, you're in good company on that thought - there were musings on that concept right after the buyout.
- Micah Wittman
Damn, 20+ likes within a matter of 2 minutes.
- Itachi
I feel a few "I told you so's" coming though... :-)
- Jesse Stay
Thanks Paul. Glad you're working on maintaining/improving performance. I've definitely seen issues here. Looking forward towards your influence and changes over at the blue giant.
- Mark Krynsky
Paul - thank you for letting us know, and I do hope you feel better!
- Jennifer Dittrich
The big question though is will FriendFeed continue to add new features? There's a difference between that and it going away. (and hence my argument w/ Scoble the other day)
- Jesse Stay
Paul: Seriously weird that you're there reading this, and totally ignoring each relevant, yes no question. No one's asking you to pre announce anything - just genuinely concerned (and increasingly so) that they do NOT include developing for FF.
- Jim Connolly
Jesse: Paul answers that question - BOOM - rumour mill dies and we finally get something positive to say. Ya know what - we won;t get an answer though. He's reading this, he knows the answer, but he won't.
- Jim Connolly
Jesse: For now, FF has more features than any other platform for this type of niche. There's some catching up to do before I'm worried about new features.
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
AWESOME!! Thanks for helping to quell some concerns Paul. Looking forward to what comes next, but hope that FF never dissappears also.
- Travis Koger
from iPhone
Shouldn't we be asking the facebook guys, and let Paul keep working? Or is he wearing many hats (friendfeed head honcho and facebook openess builder)?
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
Paul: I'm right, right? There's something stopping you from saying that you are no longer adding new features to what 'we' know as Friendfeed?
- Jim Connolly
Not for nothing, but I took my friendfeed embed off my tiny blog for a few weeks after the facebook buy out. There was just this empty spot on my eyesore of a website, so I put the embed back. We care because we like the connections we've made here and don't want to lose them. It's personal for us to.
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
Paul: Amazing how quickly you guys have adopted the Facebook attitude to silence. Pity.
- Jim Connolly
Paul: blink twice if you will add new features to FF. I won't tell anyone, honest.
- Edward Zwart
FWIW he did just upgrade servers. My e-mail notifications are almost real-time. Sounds to me like they're still improving the service.
- Jesse Stay
Jim: Don't blame Paul on that, it's not fair. He's only allowed to say so much at this point but I'm very satisfied on what he said.
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Jesse: The questions not if they keep the servers running - we want to know if this is a dead platform.
- Jim Connolly
Jim: in Paul's defense Facebook's PR is more controlling than FriendFeed's was. I'm sure he's having to consider the effects his words will have on other people inside Facebook. But, I'm VERY HAPPY that Paul is here giving us hints as to what's coming. I wish it had happened six weeks ago so we wouldn't have lost so many people, but maybe that would happen anyway.
- Robert Scoble
Jim, there may be a few new things, but as I said, the team is mainly working on fb platform and openness, so it's unlikely that there will be any big new features of ff (except maybe one that I've been thinking about for a while...).
- Paul Buchheit
Did the Walrus think about Feed Splicing? :-)
- Robert Scoble
Paul: Finally - THAT'S what we were wondering.
- Jim Connolly
Cool Dude: Need it to have a classier forum than the parent; Parent is still good but the options here make it just a bit nicer.
- ThatDBD
Paul: Pity. At least we now know not to expect any developments or improvements. Thanks for answering the question. Whilst it confirmed my fears, it's good to know what's happening.
- Jim Connolly
I have no problem with FB integration (notice my drool above). Hoping for good friend conversion tools to bring subscribers over as friends or fans on Facebook from FriendFeed. (Connect.registerUsers FTW!)
- Jesse Stay
As a result - Jim has left the platform.
- Jim Connolly
Jim: this is a change from last week, by the way. My sources were telling me that we weren't going to get any new features and now Paul is refuting that and saying we might get one new feature here.
- Robert Scoble
I'm still drooling - anyone have a towel?
- Jesse Stay
Jesse: I'll buy you a virtual one over on Ning.
- Robert Scoble
personally, i would be happy just to have FF not fall apart and die. given the post-acquisition situation, anything beyond that is gravy!
- Joe Silence is not Santa
Robert, I heard Ning is dead - care to send me one on Facebook? ;-)
- Jesse Stay
Robert, think of it as 20% time. If there's a feature I want, I'll just add it :)
- Paul Buchheit
Thank you for the clarification, Paul, and hope you are feeling better.
- WorldofHiglet
a communication channel that will be around and getting improved no matter what happens, our blogs :D I'll be commenting on yours Jim. 20%, that's a helluva light better than 0%, that's actually much more than I expected. Could we crowd source funding to buy you more %?
- Mark Essel
Even if there no new features in Friendfeed, I am happy with Friendfeed just staying on.
- ashish
how many users are there on friendfeed is there any chance we could buy it out (and get a full time dev staff back)? This platform rules, the dev team is incredible (albeit on facebook stuff now).
- Mark Essel
Paul, if you wanted me to bake you some cookies, all you had to do was ask, GEEZ.
- Derrick
Question: how many facebook bucks do we have to buy in total to get Paul and team working on friendfeed more of the time (100% ;)
- Mark Essel
Twitter doesn't accept cupcakes any more (just check Foursquare when at their offices). How about FriendFeed? :-)
- Jesse Stay
Mark, I'm okay with better Facebook integration. There's a lot of power in that (hence my drooling).
- Jesse Stay
I've got mixed feelings Jesse. I have friends on facebook. Then I have people that get excited by the same stuff that I do on friendfeed
- Mark Essel
Mark, I'm really hoping it ends up the best of both worlds - that would be really cool
- Jesse Stay
im going back to efnet - i got a bus for 7pm - anyone want on? :-P
- Allen Stern
I don't think you can mix the two sites at all. This has been repeated over and over. FriendFeed's technology might be portable, the concept, no.
- Jorge Escobar
Is it too late to do something about it. If it's a question of funds, can't we raise some? I mean this is the best communication platform I've come across yet. Facebook could be, if they just handed over the reigns to Paul, but its unlikely that sort of shift could happen.
- Mark Essel
Is the user perceived need of a full time devoted dev staff a fallacy?
- Mark Essel
I think you could make the case that some sites and services can in fact be "done" at some point, and simply require resources to keep them up and running.
- Ken Sheppardson
Ken: That's a potential advantage of turnkey application-level hosting such as App Engine: the resources to keep them up and running are almost entirely outsourced. ~All costs are variable costs, monetization improves over time, variable costs decline over time, so services that are "done" can literally just coast.
- Daniel Dulitz
They could open up something like friendfeed. Distributed social networks, with many servers would make search more challenging (search like status could help). The Internet keeps on chugging, it's a distributed information network that's been alive for many years. Our social networks should live, as does the underlying Internet.
- Mark Essel
Nice Daniel, I've been having fun playing around there (frankensearch.appspot.com). I'm using it to get to learn a little more about scala and lift now.
- Mark Essel
might be a full-time job times 2 or 3 for any fresh devs - safe to say Paul's got a bit of a head-start which changes that equation significantly! .... Also maybe almost as important is simply keeping spammers in check - that makes the difference between a ghost town vs the happy place here we want to keep coming back to enjoy ...
- Dan Freeman
Istanbuldan buyuk bir eferimi hakketti bu cocuklar, bizim icin calisiyorlar
- MobilAdam
from fftogo
Yes, this helps a lot. Thank you, Paul. We were beginning to fight amongst ourselves over these things.
- Kamilah Gill
I bet a good contextual advertising box off to the side could generate 35-50million dollars in 6 months with a user base of 1 million people. The assumption is that the average user spends 100-200 bucks on the site making purchases they'd normally make anyway and the affiliate percentage goes to the social host.
- Mark Essel
Friendfeed's health needn't be measured by the team's willingness to add new features. Shovels haven't changed in hundreds of years, but nobody is running around saying shovels are dying. A shovel is a great tool --a simple one, at that. If anything, I'd take away features on FF, but that's just me. Thanks for jumping in, Paul.
- Chris Baskind
Chris: the problem is that a shovel doesn't get more utility the more people that use it. FriendFeed does.
- Robert Scoble
I think the problem is that some people feel extra messianic some days (which is perfectly okay), and then refuse to see/believe/accept when others don't feel the same way AND point it out. The refusing part is not really okay, I guess.
- Michael Bravo
Thanks for these reassuring words Paul. Have been working hard to get more Flickr users over here after the recent rash of censorship there. Friendfeed's TOS and lack of censorship is a breath of fresh air compared to Flickr.
- Thomas Hawk
I wouldn't say lack of censorship, but community moderated filters. ;)
- Santa CW™
I think you're unnecessarily complicating the discussion by adding new vocabulary, Robert. Now you're talking scale, not features. A product needn't expand its feature set to remain useful. Feature creep is the devil, anyway. ;-)
- Chris Baskind
You can’t predict what the future of technology will bring; so trying is a fool’s game. You can only adapt to the new realities as best you can. Paul's word is that it is still worth the time to invest in FF the tool. The tool may stay in this form but that's still a better design for me than Twitter. If FF is a shovel, Twitter is a spoon feature-wise. Audience volume-wise, it is the reverse.
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Ok here's an example of what the social media + contextual ads could like like (sorry can't embed iframe twitter they go full screen so I showed it with friendfeed). But the idea is clear: http://victusmedia.com/social-... This works by sending your tweet stream to zemanta, and then does some backend stuff (which we're working on improving) to get relevant ads from amazon
- Mark Essel
I've been rough on you guys in some comments around, but I'm VERY encouraged to see that you guys see a future for FF. Thanks for shining some light, Paul.
- Scott of Two Countries
A respectable amount of information. Thank you.
- Matthew DeVries
Chris: Pownce had more "features" than Twitter did, yet it died. So did other aggregators like Jaiku. It's not "features" that matter in social software. Well, at least not completely. It's a combination of features with crowds that matter. If the crowds leave FriendFeed has a lot less utility to everyone than if they flow in. Look at this item here. Why is it interesting? Because there's people here talking about it.
- Robert Scoble
take your time PB Bear take your time
- Thomas Power
This is definitely more of the answer we were looking for. Thanks, Paul.
- Alex Scoble
All I can say is "thank you" for letting us know what's going on. I'm glad to hear FF will be around for the foreseeable future. :-) LONG LIVE FRIENDFEED!
- Jason Huebel
I can't find any wave that is even remotely comparable with friendfeed's conversation, if you found one will you invite me? (muzzle at googlewave)
- Emme Ci
Great news, I await the new functions eagerly
- Mo Kargas
YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is the best thing I've seen ALL day!! woo hoo!! Thanks Paul :) {{{ HUG }}}
- Susan Beebe
Just a few words of assurance go a long way, Paul. Thank you for finally giving us something more solid to stand on. It's been frustrating for a lot of us waiting for the other shoe to drop and this news makes it much easier to keep investing time in FriendFeed. Please don't be shy about reaffirming that it's not going away on a regular basis because it's always good to hear.
- Fa La La La Lindsay
I will say it for the least time! Friendfeed kicks ass :). The rest who is saying friendfeed is dying. please SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!
- alfred westerveld
Tnx Paul, people just want to see that are not "alone"
- CantorJF
from FreshFeed
"As a result - Jim has left the platform. - Jim Connolly" - Was this guy ever on the platform?! A quick glance at his most recent posts [first page] show pretty much 100% of posts made from other platforms. Cut him and his blood runs blue. Twitter blue :)
- 1x29
IF you glance over the Right Wing guys publications-there is some serious Terrorism encouragement from those sociopaths. This looked like a real strong example of what they are encouraging their followers to do??? Been saying we need to pay attention they are respectable foes to intelligence and their agenda is to win at all costs. Dudes they are great foes, need to,got to, have to pay attention to what they are doing. Peace love your neighbors dudes.
- ThatDBD
@ThatDBD I think you're responding to the wrong thread...
- Fa La La La Lindsay
It's fascinating that so many people seem worried about new features. Until recently Twitter added almost no features at all and yet it continued to grow in popularity. FriendFeed's recent slump is all about perception, not tech.
- Eoghann Irving
these conversations take too much time for narcisists with tight schedules (stars). Publicity skyrocketed Twitter to the limelight. Friendfeeds champions are tech geeks, and folks that love chatting and sharing. There aren't many of us though. Give us time, or let us own the platform with a public ipo /buyin from facebook. Free friendfeed!
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
Looks like it's official then: FriendFeed lives! On new servers, even! (At least for now...)
- Dennis Jernberg
This is great news! Thanks, Paul, for the update, and if you get a hankering for a feature, great! I'm fine with the tech being your personal sandbox in exchange for keeping the service alive. Robert, I hope this means we'll see more of you and your family - and hear from the ones who have mastered the art of rolling over. Johnny, thanks for having the courage to ask the hard questions (and Louis for helping you frame the issues.) wow - life feels good again!
- MaryB, BrandingBroadOfFF
from iPhone
This is brilliant news from Paul! Now can we put this FriendFeed is dying business to rest please? It's a self fullfilling prophecy because by saying FF is dying, folks begin leaving, causing a downward spiral which would then cause it to come true!
- technogran
Wan't it to stay? Then begin spreading the word! Get others to use it! At the moment its not mainstream so encourage ordinary users to use FF! The more popular it becomes the less likely it is to fold.
- technogran
technogran: sorry, today you see what's going on. Bing? Displays your Facebook and Twitter tweets. Google? Twitter. Where's FriendFeed in this equation? Now do you get why FriendFeed is destined to be a tiny niche player and why the real action is on Facebook?
- Robert Scoble
Robert, if FF gives me what I'm looking for, why do I care where "the real action" is? If FF serves its niche well, what's the downside?
- Scott of Two Countries
Robert, do you mean that Google doesn't index Friendfeed posts? Friendfeed is the first site that comes up if you search for my name.
- Victor Ganata
Excellent point Victor - but FF only imports a small % of twitter's posts. Ergo Google is still not getting Twitter.
- Roberto Bonini
@Scobleizer - this item is not interesting because of the conversation. it's interesting because of who it's from, and what he said. The fact that there's a conversation around it and that conversation is easy to find and read is a bonus (a feature) that sets this service head and shoulders above others (IMHO). There's really not much interesting in the comments here, if you ask me. You could get rid of all the comments that aren't Paul's and the value of the entry doesn't diminish that much.
- Chris Heath
That isn't to say that conversations around items aren't ever useful or valuable (or interesting as robert says)... but in this case i would say it's who it's from and what he said.
- Chris Heath
Chris: you nailed, in a single paragraph, why Twitter is winning. You now can choose who shows up on your screen and under what context. Well, I can because I have list support. Everyone else will get that next month. Victor: Roberto is right. I barely see ANY of the good stuff I see on Twitter come over here. Well, it comes here because of my favorites feed, but that isn't in nearly as useful a form as it is over at http://www.twitter.com/scoblei...
- Robert Scoble
Robert, you keep saying that's the reason Twitter's winning - I can do that in Facebook and FriendFeed as well.
- Jesse Stay
Well, the problem is that Google doesn't seem to index tweets as well as it indexes Friendfeed posts. And Google has never been able go inside Facebook's walled garden. Hopefully that will change.
- Victor Ganata
(and I have been able to for the last year or so)
- Jesse Stay
Victor, that changed today - see ReadWriteWeb's post. Facebook is opening up public status messages to search engines now.
- Jesse Stay
Why is Twitter/Facebook/FriendFeed a zero sum game? I use both Twitter and FriendFeed a lot - they have different strengths - and they feed into each other. Facebook I use less, but that's a personal issue because I simply like it less. Why does there have to be a winner? And +1 Scott, if I'm in the niche market that FF is serving and I'm happy with it, why should I care if "the real action" is on Facebook? If that's the case, I'll take FF's "fake action," thank you very much.
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
Paul: Thank you for letting us know status as much as you are able. The fact that you took time to write anything says a lot. So thank you for that. And thank you for FriendFeed in general. It truly does rock. Have a great day.
- Morgan Haley
Why don't you just give us all Facebook accounts for the one's that don't have them and be done with it. But the Turbocharged FF/FB accounts!!
- Gene Williams
@Gene, sorry, you'll have to wait for a FB invite like everyone else!
- Andrew C
@Andrew Oh that sucks, I'm still waiting for my Facebook invite. Do you have one to spare?
- Patrik Johansson
→ Yes, this problem is a critical annoyance. If I refresh my Twitter through my homepage, I can see tweets; but must refresh every tweet I made or series of tweets made. I cannot get Posterous to work with Friendfeed; it appears to be a delay that never gets to this site. Also having issues with Digg, Tumblr, and Youtube; in that it takes from 1 to 4 hours for input to appear. Myself, a journalist for social media I just made another post in accordance with this subject for possible "insider" information.
- H0llywoodWh0re
I do not use Posterous, but Twitter stuff shows up...slowly. Nothing that I post to Twitter that is supposed to go to Twitpic arrives though.
- JA Castillo
Twitter. Which sucks because my Friendfeed appears on my blog and I like to select what shows up and what does not from my Twitter. It randomly shows up hours later.
- beersage
My tweets have not been feeding into twitter today . . .
- Chris Loft
didn't have any trouble with Postersous over the weekend. haven't posted since. my FriendFeed posts go to twitter with no problem. I don't post FFeed from twitter.
- MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS
I'm having problems feeding my tweets. Is that because they are losing blood to Twitter? They left us all alone.. that's a shame!
- Burak "cyrus" Bayburtlu
Yes. I've noticed things are slow to come in here too. I thought it was more on Twitter's side, Twitter is under severe strain right now because lists have greatly increased engagement over there.
- Robert Scoble
Most of my problems seem to happen in the evenings. A number of services won't update. I started noticing this right after the buy out by FB. And it's been consistent ever since.
- Bluesun 2600
Takes a long time for Twitter stuff to show up for me. I don't use Posterous so I don't know. But Flickr takes much longer than Twitter for quite some time. I think Twitter is having brain farts today (I had fail whale a couple of times).
- Arlan Koizumi
Wasn't there something like this in the movie "Sweet Home Alabama" with Reese Witherspoon? My daughter rented the DVD and I watched it with her. One of the characters had an eccentric grandfather who was always blasting something into the air... I don't think it was anvils, but something similarly "thud-worthy." Hilarious!
- Mark "DerBingle" J
Me too Matthew. I use it that way to some degree.
- Steve Rubel
from email
Is there a way to get a friend feed onto a personal web site?
- Peter Fletcher
Thanks for posting this Steve. And Dawn, are you deliberately ironic? Regardless, this post is for those who may not have the time to engage actively here, but will still benefit from being part of the service.
- Hutch Carpenter
Nice work but a lil late on this BNO
- sofarsoShawn
Peter, you can also embed an individual thread on your site by copying the code from the "Share" link
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Oh, Dawn, that's rich cause I blocked you for bringing vapid, banal, and inconsequential stuff to friendfeed a while back. All you have to do is look at all the items from the Google I/O conference to see just how wrong you are: http://is.gd/HaUQ
- Robert Scoble
"Personal Content Database" is quite apt (especially if we could have our service icons back) - When working in twitter and waiting for twitter's page to refresh a new post, it is quicker to jump to FriendFeed, because the post is there instantly.
- Chris Loft
BS, Robert. You blocked me because I'm not one of your sycophants but actually challenge your assumptions, motivations and actions. Like when I said you were neglecting your blog, you retaliated against me, but just two weeks later, Arrington said the same thing and you took that seriously. But I'm just a female, right Robert?...somebody you keep calling stupid, even though I'm sure my...
more...
- Dawn
Dawn: you don't even have a clue about why I blocked you. It's cause you were arguing religion and politics and had no clue who Ralph Reed was and then you followed it up with the lamest posts on global warming I've seen that it made me wonder why I was arguing with someone so clueless (and I forget there were a few other things you were arguing about). So much for that high grade point average. By the way, I don't remember Mike Arrington ever talking about that stuff.
- Robert Scoble
BTW: I unblocked her for some reason, I still don't know why. Oh, yeah, my brother stuck up for her and so far I've seen just the lamest additions to the community, like this one here. If friendfeed's discussion is vapid, banal, and inconsequential IT IS OUR FAULT. So, Dawn, this one is on you. Good riddens, I say.
- Robert Scoble
Yeah, right, Robert. I'm so lame that Louis Gray announced both on his blog and on FF that I'm a great person to follow. And you're comment about Ralph Reed just once again shows your bigotry against Christians, lumping us all in one basket - that far right fundamentalist basket that you once belonged to and now despise. I never did belong to it. I'm Catholic, not "born again." I've had...
more...
- Dawn
Btw, two people have DM'd me that Scoble is best ignored. I can't do that. Being the target of repeated and consistent defamation by Robert Scoble isn't the same as Joe Blow FFer calling you an idiot. Robert's words carry a lot of weight in the tech world. I've asked Robert privately and politely to back off and as you can see, he's refused to do that. I not only have the right to defend myself, but I have a duty to my present and future investors and to my future employees.
- Dawn
FriendFeed's usefullness to me would increase 100% if I could automatically filter out every post with "friendfeed" in the title. That way I could get rid of the constant yapping about how great it is, and actually use it usefully.
- Ian Betteridge
This is a post from last may! The situation has totally changed since then
- DC Crowley
"even though I'm sure my IQ is higher than yours. Were you valedictorian of your high school? Or graduate magna cum laude? Did you get a graduate degree with honors" wow that means even i don't qualify :(
- ffcode
I agree, I think we should try to save Friendfeed.
- Hunt
from iPhone
There was a lot of chatter about the future of FriendFeed this weekend. The short answer is that the team is working on a couple of longer-term projects that will help bring FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world. Transformation is not the end. Consider this the chrysalis stage -- if all goes well, a beautiful butterfly will emerge :)
Noticed the "leaked" Facebook UI screenshots and the groups blog post today, and both seem FriendFeed inspired: nice to see Facebook trying to bring the stuff we like about FriendFeed to a larger audience.
- Mark Trapp
Paul, FriendFeed rocks as Gmail does ;)
- Orlando Pozo
Devil is in the details: "couple of longer-term projects that will help bring FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world" == Facebook projects with FriendFeed-like elements == no work on FriendFeed itself.
- EricaJoy
Thanks for the update, the more you communicate, the less we have to speculate.
- Peter Hoffmann
The fact that these improvements are coming to Facebook and not friendfeed will not sway those who like friendfeed but dislike Facebook.
- Alex Scoble
Thank you Paul for bringing "FriendFeed goodness to the larger world" -- THAT sounds awesome!!
- Susan Beebe
But we knew this was the deal the moment the full details of the purchase of friendfeed by Facebook became public.
- Alex Scoble
Yeah, I don't give a crap about Facebook. I want to know about FriendFeed.
- Rochelle
Is it the interface people dislike about Facebook or the people they're friends with on Facebook? I can imagine being able to import all your subscribers from FriendFeed and have them in a separate group that doesn't interact with other groups you may have on Facebook.
- Cristo
I'm glad to hear this. I prefer FriendFeed to Facebook any day of the week.
- Nathan Clayton
And the answer for me would be some of both. I have real life friends and family that I don't necessarily want to get into the same discussions with as I do with people here.
- Cristo
And there's your answer, Rochelle. friendwho? friendwhat now? Oh, you mean Facebook! (No I mean friendfeed) friendwho? (rinse, lather, repeat)
- Alex Scoble
there are some ui differences (and i tend to prefer friendfeed in those cases) but i have friended quite a few FF people in FB and the experience is remarkably similar in many ways.
- Jason Wehmhoener
Another big difference is I don't think you get the same FOAF interaction on Facebook as on FriendFeed.
- Cristo
I like the "chrysalis stage" analogy - sounds cool.... goes an looks for FF goodness butterfly!
- Susan Beebe
Good to know that FriendFeed still has some fight left; hope that translates into a viable and sustainable platform/utility for the masses (though I quite enjoy the close-knit, uber-geek community that it's become).
- Christian
I don't like the chrysalis analogy. The butterfly emerges from the chrysalis and buggers off leaving the shell. Of course, it might then also get eaten by a bird. Tweet, tweet.
- Mark H
Note that he didn't say that FriendFeed.com was going away, only that they're diverted to bringing it to a much larger audience
- Jesse Stay
The problem is Scoble (Robert) and MG both just sent half of FriendFeed away so most of those that would benefit from this announcement won't even see it.
- Jesse Stay
Jesse, I didn't get that from Paul's comment. I read that some of the friendfeed ideas will be going into FB. I like that idea, but I still prefer FF to FB because of the different conversations here that I don't have with friends and family.
- Travis Koger
from iPhone
Yeah, Paul's statement won't help friendfeed. This will just either give people more reason to go to Facebook or find another service entirely.
- Alex Scoble
What Alex and Rochelle said. This sounds like a "we're bringing FF to Facebook" announcement, and I don't give a damn about Facebook. I want to know what's happening HERE. And Cristo, both, but more the interface. I care about the friends I've made here, and I'm connected with many of them now on Facebook as well, but I prefer to interact with them here, because I like it better.
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
Travis, he didn't say that - you read that, but he didn't say that. I'm willing to bet FriendFeed.com will not go away.
- Jesse Stay
As much as I agree about Scoble and MG driving people away, they have also effectively flush out some comment from the FF team.
- Travis Koger
from iPhone
Travis, there are better ways of getting the FF team to comment
- Jesse Stay
I think it's the opposite, the butterfly is becoming this crawling caterpillar :)
- Jorge Escobar
Oh I don't think FF will go away, and damn will hope it doesn't either!
- Travis Koger
from iPhone
What I do see is more Facebook integrated into the FriendFeed environment - I think that's a good thing
- Jesse Stay
The critical difference between Facebook and FriendFeed is the social model. With Facebook as it is today, you need to be mutual friends to see each others content. There is a "fan page" model but it is oriented toward "publishing/celebrity" rather than information sharing. FriendFeed has an asymmetric model like Twitter, where you can easily discover someone's content without any "friend" gesture whatsoever, and you can follow without friending. This makes the converation more discoverable, and useful..
- Adina Levin
If the integration is bringing public/asymmetric to Facebook, then it will be very useful indeed. If the integration is to add FriendFeed-style service integration into the symmetric/private Facebook model, it will be much less useful - it's more of the same - I'll be able to more easily share updates from youtube or last.fm or delicious to my friend network, but be unable to discover new people and infomation.
- Adina Levin
Adina: And unless Facebook goes radically toward that model, it won't suffice for me. I could not care less about their upcoming redesigns.
- Christopher A Carr
@Jesse - I can't see any sign that they are working on FriendFeed at all. All the indications are that the FF team is now working on Facebook, and only Facebook. That's great for Facebook, and I'm sure they will do wonderful work there. But don't delude yourself that FriendFeed is going to get anything more than critical fixes, and maybe the occasional thing done in someone's spare time.
- Nick Lothian
Butterflies look totally different than caterpillars and they also fly away
- Melanie Reed
+100 Adina. The things I like best about FriendFeed (easy content/people discovery, FoaF, asymmetrical following and being followed) are completely opposite to Facebook's core model. That's why as much as people keep talking about Facebook adding FF-like features, I don't see the REAL FF core features making it over, because the mindset is different.
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
I don't see this announcement as anything new, or as reassuring. We knew from the time of the acquisition that there would be would be some movement of FF capabilities into FB. The real question is whether this means absorption of FF into FB or attracting the FB user base into FF. The comment about "bring[ing] FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world" still leaves that question open.
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
+1 everything Alex Scoble has said. Friendwhat? What's a feed? Who uses RSS anymore? We've got PubSubWTFOMGBBQ now!
- Mr. Gunn
Nick, Paul just said they're working on other projects right now. That still doesn't mean FriendFeed is going away. I'm not deluding myself at all. I'm telling everyone else they're deluding themselves by assuming it's going away. All the FriendFeed team is still using FriendFeed, and Paul just tried to give us comfort not to worry. For some reason we all don't want to believe him. It's actually kind of amusing.
- Jesse Stay
I wonder what the powers that be mean by "FriendFeedy goodness"? Is it understood what WE like about it vs. FB?
- Amy℠
Paul - Wishing you all the best as you tend your new butterfly garden :) I'll be here to enjoy them!
- Susan Beebe
Jesse: "For some reason we all don't want to believe him." <-- Don't want to believe what? He didn't really say anything.
- Christopher A Carr
This is not the news that Friendfeed fans were looking for.
- Raphael, Raphael
The issue isn't belief that they are going to do something. The question is what they are going to do, and whether that will continue the core value of FriendFeed, which is not just information aggregation but discoverability.
- Adina Levin
I know more about the "Last Days" and heaven than I know about what's going to happen to FriendFeed as we have come to know it than was given in your rather cryptic answer, Paul. :) And while that may not be a fair comparison (God actually gave details and signs), there is something definitely not forthcoming about your response. A person usually withholds details that affect another...
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- Melanie Reed
Melanie, in other words, Paul works for a technology company in Silicon Valley that doesn't disclose future features, products, and services until they are ready.
- Cristo
Hopefully this helps to quiet all of the "friendfeed is dying" talk. Because this thread proves ff is alive and well.
- Garin Kilpatrick
@Jesse - I read it differently to you. To me, Paul is saying "We are taking what we were working towards on FriendFeed, and trying to bring that goodness to a bigger audience". No one is claiming they are going to shut down FF.
- Nick Lothian
@Jesse - Want to make a bet on the number of new features added to FF before the end of the year?
- Nick Lothian
You read my mind. Having seen a few acquisitions, I am wondering if FF staff was told to put the site in bugfix mode.
- EricaJoy
from IM
Cristo, to deliver some straightforward talk is not about giving away company details. If you have a product that is original and stands on its own, you don't need to refer to it as a "butterfly". Many companies even promote something new and upcoming especially to their loyal user base. It gives a signal. A proper one. It tells your users and future users enough so that they can make an informed decision about what they want to do instead of keeping them on tenderhooks
- Melanie Reed
"the chrysalis stage in most butterflies is one in which there is little movement" (via wikipedia) So if you follow that metaphor then eventually FriendFeed will go through a metamorphosis -- that means it's not dead... really how hard can it be to get what he's saying?
- Chris Heath
Its pretty hard :) The burning question is if they are putting FF goodness in to the walled gardens that are Facebook or are they bringing FF openness to FB too. I think the people here want the open forums that are FF not the closed ones that are FB. If FB is going hybrid with both walled gardens and open forums that would be OK too. People on FF want open forums... like Twitter and FF... without the crude interface that is Twitter and without the uncertainty that is FF now.
- Ed Millard
Facebook is gonna have to rip off much of the privacy to maximize their product in the real-time web world. I am going to assume FF goodness is going to be applied to FB :) *crosses fingers*
- Susan Beebe
Just a thought... why does "longer-term projects that will help bring FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world" JUST mean facebook.com? What I get from this is that they are working on a range of things, maybe bringing the FriendFeed sauce to a range of sites, powered by the Facebook back end. Who knows what that means. A FriendFeed service powered by FacebookConnect? Also to......
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- Johnny Worthington
FB needs to leave the privacy for the walled garden and the inner circle. Their current user base likes that. They just need a second feed that is an open forum and you can talk there without it bleeding in to your inner circle feed.
- Ed Millard
Seems like the inner circle is breaking down some now, what with parents and other relatives friending teenagers. I'm guessing the information posted on the walls these days is not as private. Is there a way on FriendFeed to limit what on your wall can be seen by particular people and groups?
- Cristo
Yes, but blocking doesn't work so well since you can just use Chrome's Incognito mode to get around it.
- Alex Scoble
Translation: if you haven't switche to Facebook yet, you better do it now so you can get a good vanity URL.
- David Chartier
from iPhone
I don't know what all the fuss is about. But could we have the long answer too, please?
- Laura Norvig
Although I'm interested, FB != FF. I don't see how the two mix in a way that makes me feel otherwise. Mixing audiences is not a good thing for me (with a few exceptions) and I know others share the same thought.
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Did anyone notice that Robert Scoble didn't comment on this thread? What does this mean? Does it mean Robert Scoble won't exist soon? He must be working on a Monday afternoon, no? ;)
- Cristo
Paul, will FF be here in 1 year, 5 years?
- Robert Higgins
Robert, will you and I be alive in 5 years?
- Cristo
Cristo I am funking nobody, I would like Paul to quantify his post. Simple. Will FF be here in 1 year? Will FF be here in 5 years?
- Robert Higgins
Robert, I was trying to make the point that he might not know and can't predict what will happen over time.
- Cristo
IMO friendfeed shoud attract more general audience... Facebook and twitter are having more general users. Most of the FF users are tech bloggers or those who needs aggregation services... I dont know it's just my feeling or not . but this is my impression on FF. but it's great service.. the features are too good... but we will roam were we meet our friends... thats most of the people are into twitter and FB.
- Sarath
Sarath, is there a place you can get away from tech bloggers? :)
- Cristo
Ohhhh a perrrttty butterfly, I'm moist with anticipation.
- sofarsoShawn
Cristo: i almost made the same observation an hour or two ago when i first read through this posting and its comments. I was skimming and kept seeing alex, alex, alex... and thinking to myself... where's Robert!?!
- Chris Heath
@Sarath - I have a lot more in common with the people I've met here on FriendFeed than FB or Twitter. Twitter is too hard to search, and FB (and Twitter to a good extent) is driven by the people you know in RL (and unfortunately I don't have nearly as much in common in RL with my family, co-workers and acquaintences as I do with people scattered all over the world who I have met on FF)....
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- Fa La La La Lindsay
I think that in his cryptic statement he means, and a lot of people here agree with me, that more Facebook's going to get more FriendFeedy. Which doesn't mean that FF still isn't dead or doomed. After all, he works for Facebook now. FriendFeed=open forum, Facebook=walled garden, totally opposite master metaphors; but I don't think Zuckerberg gets it, and FF belongs to Zuckerberg now. So this is really about FB; FF's still in limbo. Still, some FF people friended me at FB, and I put them in a special list.
- Dennis Jernberg
@FF-team keep on rocking :). BTW I also think it's really cool you guys open-sourced tornado.
- alfred westerveld
+1 what alfred said, and good to hear words like "longer-term" & "beautiful" coming straight from The Walrus - keep that vision strong. Hope all goes well for FF team doing some good re-inventing the Octopus Garden of FB - seems you've got your work cut out for you there! It would be so nice if any way to keep a "simple & pure" form of FriendFeed alive (maintained and developed - more open source?) for us to enjoy, but no worries .... you've simultaneously raised the bar and paved the way for the rest!
- Dan Freeman
Good luck with the development Paul! Hopefully Zuck has some positive insight.
- Garin Kilpatrick
Paul: If someone offered me a bag of money to do what you guys did, I would have done exactly the same (probably a lot faster too). However, it would be nice if you spent an hour answering some of the questions here. It might also give people like me a little more faith, in what used to be your primary project; Friendfeed. You made the best platform on the planet - why not use it to let us know what the heck's going on?
- Jim Connolly
I'm assuming that Facebook wants to keep their roadmap quiet. I respect that but leaving you community in the dark for a brand that the applications stand for community building is rather ironic.
- manielse (Mark Nielsen)
SUPER!! I don't Blame ya 1 Darn bit fer Dumpin' FacePOOP Paul!! ;PPP Wait FacePOOP is the Maggot Stage!! ;))
- Billy Warhol
If I can still have all my friends that I have here on friendfeed and share things with them the exact same way, I don't care what "www" address I have to type in to get it. I just hope i don't have to give up any of FF's awesome features! Thanks for the update Paul!
- David Cook
The problem is I don't know whether to wrote an app on your API or not because i'm not sure whether it will all be dropped in the "transformation". Imagine speding late nights and weekends coding something up only for it to be dropped suddenly. Need a decent long term picture. Looking at Cliqset.
- Steven Livingstone-Pérez
Good point Steven - and one of the reasons many of us are spending so little time developing our networks here.
- Jim Connolly
This is a truly disappointing/concerning post and I think it would have been much better to hold comment until something more tangible could be discussed. Thanks for adding to the confusion/drama Paul.
- Nicholas Kreidberg
I do care about what happens next, but this is the best news of the day nonetheless ! thanks for giving us updates at last ! and I do hope FF will awaken again ! such a great tool, but letdown since the announcement of the buyback by FB
- laetSgo
will I see this post in my "best of week" email from FF?
- Kirill Bolgarov
If Facebook is going to get fixed, please remember that it needs fixing politically, not just technically. It needs to give people the option to open their data to Google - for instance. A walled garden where the walls are fixed in place sucks.
- Tim Tyler
@Paul, or perhaps an Alien will erupt forth from its stomach? (kidding, kidding!)
- j1m
"Bill needed a job. He needed health benefits. [...] The Army would solve their health coverage problem. In years past he would have been too old, but in 2005 the age limit for enlistment was increased from 35 to 40, and a year later it was raised again to 42. The tradeoff would be his absence from home. In the end, although he risked leaving Michelle to fight cancer on her own, Bill chose the Army. He signed on for a job as a signal support systems specialist, a soldier who works with communications equipment. “Seventy percent of the reason is for the insurance,” said Bill’s mother, Marguerite Hemiller. “He told me, ‘I’ve always wanted to do something for my country and I have to help Michelle.’”"
- Steven Perez
from Bookmarklet
True that a person should not have to join the military in order to guarantee health benefits for a spouse - but it is also a testament to what the military has - which is "socialized, universal health coverage" which is not considered "insurance" (though it is managed like one). Rather, it is an *entitlement*...
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
Interested to see Viper's blog on oEmbed. I like to size my videos for a certain width and am not sure how I'd get that with that single url embed. Is this .com or .org?
- beersage
It's .org. And it adds fields to specify max width/heights in the Media options.
- Otto
You can specify a width in the options, or it'll use your theme's width. You can also do a manual generic embed and manually specify height width. I'm sure his post will cover all this.
- Mark Jaquith
from email
"PhotoSketch is an internet-based program that can take the rough, labeled sketch on the left and automagically turn it into the naff montage on the right."
- Paul Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
Wow, that is awesome. The authors list cracked me up: "Tao Chen, Ming-Ming Cheng, Ping Tan, Ariel Shamir, and Shi-Min Hu". One of these things is not like the others.
- Jim Norris
What is the definition of naff here? Here in the UK it effectively means stupid/silly/rubbish.
- Travis Koger
A friend of mine led a team on a few of the animation sequences in the movie. This is the memo he got! There were a lot more details in his though. When the MPAA told them the movie was too violent, it scrapped a good chunk of the stuff he had been working on for several months. Those last weeks they spent redoing the animation to fill the gaps were insane. I remember when he came back...
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- Admiral Anika
Fanatizm sadece futbolda yok demek ki!
- nihat solmaz
yok ems ora türk köyü değil bizimkiler aşağı atmakla bırakmaz böyle hakedenleri :))
- mrtky
İlk izlediğimde ya aşağıda su yoksa diye içimden geçirdim, nasıl bir sinirmiş anlam veremedim :))) ama çok da güldüm :)))
- Cagatay Karakoc
yalnız kahve montlu adam soteye yatmış orda, saldırı planlı bence.
- Parfe
"seni adi adam, senin ben, al ulan ulan sana gel nen gel.. hıh yarışma sen ohh" attıktan sonra "gel ya mahmut hiç şevk kalmadı gidip birer bira içelim" demiştir:)) kol kola gidişlerini görürüz son karedede:P
- İrem[taşımasu]
yalnız dikkat edersek yayınlanan kanal RTL.. aksiyon normal ;) her şekil
- ems
@mrtky, peşinden atlayıp bide suda sopalarlar bi temiz :)
- Ekin Ertaç
bisikletli sanki ilk darbede aşağıya atlayacakmış ama yeterli itmeyi alamaış o yüzden beklemiş gibi. direk kurmaca bile olabilir yani :))
- Yasin Jason
ilk izlediğimde "oha dedim adamı uçurumdan aşağı attı" :))
- antique™
bisikletli kurtulmak için aşağıya atlamaya çalışıyor ama ayağı kendi bisikletine takılıyor dikkat ederseniz bizim adamımızda madem aşağıya atlamak istiyosun ben atarım seni diyerek fırlatıyor :)
- Göksel Şirin
Nedense bu video bana kurgu gibi geliyor. Cheater'ın duvarın üst kısmına doğru meyletmesi ve aşağı atılmak için pek bir dirençsiz olduğunu gözlüyorum.
- Cem ARGUN
Instant Facilitated Karma. I like. (In this one specific example, not as an overarching philosophy of vigilantism.)
- SAM
Meanwhile, nobody is helping the rider who got shoved and is lying there while bikes drive around him.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
actually, the guy who saved the pushed-over rider's bike looks like he's gonna help him after the coast is clear.
- Joe Silence is not Santa
Aww, slacy, guess I won't see you tomorrow at the cafe, but have a great time and fly safe. Josh, thanks for this shot. So I know "Honolulu" should be pronounced "ho-no" (so that both syllables rhyme) and not "hun-o" like most mainlanders do, but every time I did that I felt pretentious.
- Stephen Mack
"the furthest point you can get away from a McDonald's in the contiguous US is in South Dakota, where you can be 107 miles away from the wonderment that is the McGriddle."
- Benjamin Golub
from Bookmarklet
This is pathetic. I have three within 5 miles of my house.
- Will Sloan
I think I have 2 within 5 miles. One is within walking distance and the other is the next city over. I'm sure there are others I've managed to ignore, since I don't eat there.
- Admiral Anika
I think McDonald's on Manhattan island are like Starbucks there - you can see the next one from the front entrance of the one you're at.
- Brian Chang
I remember once reading that McD's objective was that no American be more than 10 minutes away from an outlet.
- Piaw Na
just thinking of McD's makes me want to puke... (sorry about the implied image there)
- Harold
According to aggdata.com, there's 12,275 McD's, but only 10,995 Starbucks. The clear winner in number of shops is Subway sandwiches, with a whopping 22,944 locations. If you consider all types of businesses instead of just foodservice, FedEx wins with 52,065 locations.
- Otto
How are there that many Subways, yet we just got one within 3 miles of me earlier this year.
- Admiral Anika
"A new magnificent 800-million-pixel panorama of the entire sky has been unveiled online today. It was stitched together from 1,200 photos by astronomers at the European Southern Observatory from viewing sites in Chile."
- Benjamin Golub
from Bookmarklet
You're not going to see anything like this in the Northern Hemisphere. This is only the night sky for those south of the equator. But it is cool.
- Nina Jansen
hmmm didn't supply a link in the article! Ahh its the Daily Mail, to explain to non-UK-ites, the Daily Mail is the UK equivalent of Fox News.
- Toby Graham