It's made it less relevant for me. By the time I get to a story in Greader, it's already been shared several times over in Friendfeed. I mainly use Greader to bookmark stories for later now. - Mark Trapp
I'm neutral on this one, Steve. My Google Reader habits haven't changed since I started using FriendFeed. - Bryan Person
I haven't found enough people yet for it to replace Google Reader. Lots of tech stuff here, but not the spectrum that I subscribe to in Google Reader - Bwana McCall
It has the same relevance, because it is finely tuned to my likes and dislikes. A social network... even of peers... can never replicate that. So while FF works nicely for breaking news, it won't replace the depth of knowledge I acquire from Reader - Jamie
less. except your statement presumes that Google Reader was relevant. not. - dave mcclure
Less for some items discussed by subscirbers and more for topics I am passionate about. - Gerry Garcia
I might say just a bit, when twitter came along, that's where the news were breaking, the same is with friendfeed maybe even more, but good old reading of feeds is different and still part of the game - Dobromir Hadzhiev
The same. Google Reader is an essential element of FriendFeed. - Louis Gray
@Lee I agree re. shared items.@Dave Google Reader is second to Bloglines. - Steve Rubel
I think it really adds to GReader. I share stuff all the time now with notes and its great to see it get out there and spark some conversation. It's not quite there yet to replace GReader from a usability perspective but if it did get there I would probably switch to it. - Devlin Dunsmore
via twhirl
FF makes GReader more relevant for me. I see stories here first. I use my reader as a way to catch up on news that I may have missed. - Alex Williams
I tried to go all FriendFeed, but found I was missing too many stories...so I'm back to using both. - Chris Rossini
FF has allowed me to trim my GR feed list. For example, I dropped my various Scobleizer feeds from GR because FF does a better job of filtering them for me. - Delete Me
The uses are different. My primary use of Google Reader is to gather together the content I need to read. That doesn't necessarily equate to a need to solicit the reactions of others to that content. FriendFeed is handy if I do feel a need to gather reactions. But I cannot see myself giving up one for the other. - Jill O'Neill
More relevant and useful. Reader serves as a content delivery system will FF serves as an excellent aggregator and recommendation system. - tsudohnimh
via twhirl
FF will reduce reader usage a but it's not a real feed reader e.g. can't play podcasts - Adrian
via twhirl
Depends. For me, neither has a significant impact on the other. At least not yet. - Mike Keliher
I think they are complementary in the sense that some things just don't do well in FriendFeed. I want to be able to read all of my tech news, but the friendfeed river is time-based which makes it more difficult to keep track of. - Rob Diana
I don't think it makes it less, necessarily. After all, *someone's* got to find a story initially, right? - Sean Goller
FriendFeed and Twitter have nearly replaced GReader for me. The trusted human filter beats scanning through 100s of posts daily to get to a gem. Hopefully not all will stop using them or the great posts will eventually dry up. Based on other comments here I might cull my subscriptions and then share more. P2P-like over me just taking and taking. - Jay Gilmore
Less; until Reader becomes as social. - Stowe Boyd
For my personal workflow, Google Reader feeds my blogs as well as FriendFeed. So I vote for "more." It seems easier to track shared items on Google Reader than liked items on FriendFeed. - Ontario Emperor
via fftogo
FriendFeed is very useful, but in a very different way than Google Reader. I need both. - ron k jeffries
because of FF, I have LESS TIME for my RSS reader :-) - Thomas Ho
via fftogo
More, for depth (and because FF adds meaning to share). But FF has it for discovery of new stuff. - Eric Johnson
I almost completly stopped using RSS reader. I use FriendFeed and one custom news page on NetVibes....via feedalizr - Shahar Nechmad
I don't feel it's made it less relevant, I come across blogs here that I wasn't aware of and add them to my subscriptions there! - Joe Dawson
I want to be able to mark FF treads and ditch the ones I have viewed. Until then, I have to use my reader. - morten saxnaes
using both but finding that I'm starting to use Google Reader differently. More like a discovery device by following search-based feeds and then using FriendFeed to follow specific humans. - Marnie Webb
Google reader is simply another source of data for Friendfeed to aggregate. The environments can exist independent of each other. The wonderful thing about Friendfeed is that you can continue to use all your applications/data sources and have them automatically collected and displayed. Applications such as Flickr, Google Reader, and Youtube have become popular because they are good at doing specific tasks. An aggregator does not make those applications irrelevant. - Mark Nassal
I still use GR occasionally, but most of my information comes from FF. Digg usage way down too......via feedalizr - David Sim
I use gReader to follow blogs I can't find in FF. Also as a discovery tool, because sometimes I share stuff from there here. Sometimes directly with gRader and sometimes using the bookmarklet. I'm using it less because of FF, though (I deleted a lot of Tech blogs subscriptions the other day). - Alejandro S.
I prefer GReader to FF. It's less cluttered than FF. With FF I check in to see the things I missed in my feeds. - Snay Trivedi
I primarily use GReader - it's easier to locate information. I just come over to FF to see what "friends" are doing. - Kim
I agree with Snay and Kim. Comparing the 2 is like apples and oranges unless you simplify the scenario to include only breaking tech news. My scope spans far beyond that and I can't get the health, auto, environment, local, mountain bike and personal blog articles in FF that I subscribe to in GReader. I don't consider it a replacement but another way of getting information. - Jon West
thanks to everyone that is now following tweetsmart.com you are all followed back and can begin posting to the main feed at your convenience. thanks louis for breaking out launch :) - Morgan
I am working on a blog post to follow up PR secrets too. Great post. Loic is the best at this stuff in the business. UPDATE: it's now up: http://scobleizer.com/2008/05/... - Robert Scoble
Robert, can't wait for your post. Can I pitch you a marketing product as a target? - Loic Le Meur
I've found that you are correct about Bloggers, I see that they don't need to try to reach out to bloggers. If the product or service is the best out there you don't need to try sell it. They will review it without your help....via feedalizr - Paul
Loic: the new PR is two things: 1. It's "Professional Relationships." You are by far the best in the business at that. 2. It's creating experiences that create story frameworks. The best example I've seen recently is Michael Adams inviting us up to Yosemite (Ansel Adams' son). He had no news, nothing to announce, but by having a magical experience to share he got on front page of New York Times. - Robert Scoble
I agree PR should not in itself become a barrier that someone must get help to climb over. With all the great tools that exist today it is possible to form direct relationships which will facilitate ones PR efforts. This is not to say knowing the best ways is not important but that one need not be an expert or for that matter pay one to effectively promote ones efforts, product or company. - Joel Ordesky
Gadiel Rivera, I am always sincere. Robert, thanks for the compliments, dear "PR Target" :) - Loic Le Meur
Love #5 and agree. If you do something incredible, why force it? Your time will come and you'll get the attention and respect you deserve. - Shawn Farner
Awesome post Loic! I really like # 2....CEO should evangelize their own products like you do so well. Heck, if they can't get passionate about it, why should I ?! - Susan Beebe
Speaking of which, Loic, I have another bottle of awesome wine here. Why don't you come over and show me some more cool stuff about Seesmic while we drink it together? :-) - Robert Scoble
I like Scoble's comment here too about Adams & NY Times PR traction... amazing case study there for sure. PR is changing. No longer does it matter who you know but more importantly ... WHAT you do with those relationships! Do you leverage them or just pass off your PR duties to a "professional"? sounds like consumers are seeing thru the fake old school PR strategies and want the real deal (authentic, grunge, not plastic fake)! - Susan Beebe
Robert, deal. I will bring one too, want dinner tonight? For lunch it is a bit late I am having dessert, we could join you with Geraldine would be super cool - Loic Le Meur
Hmm, already have plans today/tonight (gonna go hang out with http://www.tangodiva.com ) so give me a call and we'll figure out a good night to get everyone together. +1-425-205-1921 - Robert Scoble
Since starting work at a very, very "old media" trade press outlet I get pitched all the time by PR people. What's interesting is the questions that I ask back are ones that they're unprepared to answer when they think they're pitching MSM. I often get asked "are you a blogger or something" and I have to explain that I started as one (and still am), and if I don't find it interesting, than my audience (who is paying exorbitant amounts to read our stuff) has nothing to learn from me parroting their crap. - Andrew Feinberg
Also, AMEN BROTHA to Robert's comment on Professional Relationships. Especially in DC, peer-to-peer is the best way to get your message across. It's how I've managed to put together an experience that should create a great story framework that you all should hear about very soon. Trust is built one-on-one, and if you have no relationship, all you are is a mouthpiece. PR people should "lurk" on the scene and spend 2-3 months at bars, meetups, etc before even trying to make a pitch for anyone, to anyone. - Andrew Feinberg
Sorry for the third consecutive comment, but another analogous industry is Lobbying. Like startup PR and journalism, you need to build a community (grassroots/readership) as well as manage professional relationships (with members, staff, sources). But, the Golden Rule of K Street (you might be surprised by this) is the best lobbyists are by far the ones that NEVER lie. Once you give someone bad information, your credibility will be zero going forward and you might was well find a new job. - Andrew Feinberg
I have your number Robert, in my "VIP PR key people to pitch" folder. Or I will do kite surfing, I should try your camera! - Loic Le Meur
Spot on. We're definitely seeing eye to eye on this. I'm not a big fan of PR people either. Cuddling egos of startups' founders get them contracts, but I know very few CEOs praising their PR firms 4-6 months into working with them. - David Marcus
The camera is yours! Just gotta figure out how to meet up to give it to you. - Robert Scoble
let me see if there is wind Robert, otherwise it is not going to happen, but thanks! - Loic Le Meur
sorta curious what Brian Solis' reaction to all this will be? ouch! - Susan Beebe
I cannot agree more. And this goes for all the "secrets" categories and top tens. Blogging, get rich and every other snakeoil formula. You want people to visit a website? Screw SEO, create something worth a damn and people will come. That's how the internet supposedly works. - Mel McB
Thank you for the comments everyone. I think those who know me, have read my work on my blogs, or read the TechCrunch post completely, know I'd never suggest marketing at targets. And just for the record, the original post was entitled, "PR Tips for Startups." While they may seem like common sense or PR 101, truth is that the points I’ve shared are what most company founders and executives usually overlook.
And while leading CEO’s, such as Loic Le Meur and Jason Calacanis, are setting the bar for a new genre of entrepreneurial participation, we need to remember that they are among a small, and hopefully growing, group of communications and community-savvy evangelists. They, as of right now, are among the edglings. This post is intended to help expedite the evolution.
Just to clarify any confusion:
Don’t market at audiences.
Do not “pitch” people.
Be genuine and remember that at the end of the day, you’re engaging with real people, not stats or marketing demographics.More on Loic's comments in just a bit - Brian Solis
1. Loic, I think you took a few things out of context, and yes, knowing Brian he would never think of anyone as a "target" 2. Saying that all you have to be is great is complete bullshit. There are plenty of great tools, products and services out there, too many, if you want yours to succeed and be competitive you need to let people know you're out there. And 3. as Brian mentioned, this stuff may seem obvious to you, but there are plenty of people out there who have no clue what to do. They need our help. - Jackie Peters
Solis knows one secret- How to spin a story to PR for FutureWorks - Jason Kintzler
People sure seem a bit harsh about Brian sharing secrets as he wants to articulate them. Sure, a great company with a great product should not have to delve into PR strategies ... and a great athlete should win based on ability, not because of a coach; a great novel should reach No. 1 without the manipulations of an editor or publicist; and the best presidential candidate should win the election on the merits of his or her position, without need of a central guiding hand for the campaign. Sure. It'd be nice - Walter Neary
strong and has the better product, but MS eats their lunch in this industry in the long tail. Same could be said about the iPod. There are better MP3 players on the market with more features at cheaper prices, but the PR and marketing genious of Jobs basically created a product that people couldn't live without, even if it wasn't the best one available in its category. - Devlin Dunsmore
via twhirl
Wow Twhirl totally messed that up!! Please for the love of god fix it so that it doesn't delete my message when updating feeds!! The missing part talks about Apple having a better product than Microsoft and while they are coming on strong MS still dominates that market. - Devlin Dunsmore
via twhirl
Forgive a novice's intrusion but this really has had my classmates in Centennial College's corporate communications and public relations program buzzing so it seemed time to chime in. What was really striking was that it was a gentleman's disagreement which wasn't really a disagreement at heart. Despite diverging on certain points, Mr. Le Meur and Mr. Solis agreed that it is about relationships- speaking with and not at people - and how you conduct them. And it was all done so civilly to boot. - Abby Martin
Loic, thank you for bringing much needed attention to the subject of helping startups succeed in PR.
Here's my response to comments across the web:
http://bub.blicio.us/?p=957
And, also, here's the unedited version of the original post. I think you'll see that we're practically on the same page (more importantly, it's very helpful for startups who need to learn about all of this in general):
http://www.briansolis.com/2008...... - Brian Solis
Just hitting F5 over and over is working pretty good for me! - Tad - the Meme Maker
I'm finding that I need the thread of twitter in one place, and all of Friend Feed in another. So it's Twhirl and Feedalizer for me. ...via feedalizr - Andrew Nez
Ok Alert Thingy Makes more sense on FF then twhirl. Alert Thingy it is. I stopped using it cuz I thought it was stupid. - Tim Moore
via Alert Thingy
yeah I'm done with Alert Thingy ... i'm really liking Feedalizr .. so far that is...via feedalizr - JohnBfromMemphis
- the only thing I like about it over Twhirl is the video recording and posting, which isn't that great as is. - Jesse Stay
via twhirl
Lol I like the replies to this from Alert Thingy and Twhirl. - Eric Florenzano
Installed it and love it, just one thing - is it possible to use a filter to not show someone?...via feedalizr - Simon Gelfand
Very nice look - but no keyboard shortcuts? FAIL...via feedalizr - Boris Gordon
Good looking UI. Problem for me is I do like TWhirl's separate screens for Twitter and FriendFeed - and the fact that I can resize the windows. - ChangeForge | Ken Stewart
via twhirl
Thanks for the tip off Scoble. This seems like a nice alternative to trial :)...via feedalizr - CannonGod
Sticking with Twhirl..hate the colors but I think it makes the smartest use of screen real estate. And @Loic mentioned upcoming XMPP support...thats got me excited. - /(bb|[^b]{2})/ (Kamath)
via twhirl
I've used Alet Thingy and don't like it at all. this morning I am trying feedalizr and am liking it alot...via feedalizr - David Jacobs
Good - nice scroll format, filters. Ick - no resize, no options. Fail - can't select text in comments (couldn't grab cool URL). Uninstalled clean and easy. - Nancy Babyak
Everyone must have younger eyes than me because the font size is just too small and the kerning is atrocious. What's that about? I appreciate the fact the comment text is blue rather than nearly unreadable gray as it is in AlertThingy for most themes but if the font size is too small and can't be adjusted, it's a wash. I can't adjust the window horizontally. Huh. So far there are no friendfeed desktop apps that give me a better user experience than the web site itself. - Rick Powell
better use of screen space, liked the UI overall. good job feedalizr...via feedalizr - Siddharth Mitra
Stickign with Twhirl. I LIKE having FF in a seperate stream most of the time. - Soulhuntre
via twhirl
It's strange that it won't let me expand the app window horizontally, only vertically. Not liking that....via feedalizr - Bob
Can't comment because wife has taken possession of lappie and i'm in digital limbo. At least i have fftogo on my N95! - Adrian Scicluna
via fftogo
I like this little program, Just installed it. I think this is very useful to keep me updated on what's going on in FF!!...via feedalizr - Paul
Upon installing Alert Thingy, this was the first thing I read. I promply downloaded feedalizer, and no longer use Alert Thingy. that was fast!...via feedalizr - rambn
Afraid that this doesn't work behind corp proxies/firewalls at this point. The developer indicated that they are working on this and should have a revision in a few days. - Greg
i disagree - the multitude of data inputs, the ability to comment, the ability to go beyond 140 characters and not to mention the up time make it far more useful than twitter - Morgan
via twhirl
yeah... but the noise can be so overwhelming. I'm not a huge fan of automated posting to anything (other than when I *subscribe* to feeds)... It's the conversation that I enjoy in twitter that seemed to get lost (for me) on FF. I still think these threaded conversations w/o the automated posting is the best thing they have going. - Dustin
It's one thing that twitter has been missing. Which is the function of separating group talk away from the bulk timeline. ... there could have been another way to do it, "grouptweets" or something like that. But having it in sync on twhirl should make it a much easier way to take a RE.net conversation off twitter and have it right their in tandem. - Brad Coy
i really like the hide feature to filter out some of the stuff. for example pete flint always posts a ton of redfin listings via RSS and instead of getting barraged with 20 of those all at once i simply hide that service from him - no more noise problem :) - Morgan
redfin?? I'm not finding filters anywhere. - Brad Coy
@Brad Coy: The "Hide" option has lots of filters options - Dustin
::shrug:: still not finding "Hide" were's @respres with a screencast tutorial when you need him? - Brad Coy
@bradcoy "Hide" right next to "comment" link - Morgan
To the right of "Comment" and left of "Move" you should have the "hide" option on just about every feed. - Dustin
@dustin of course now that i hid the feed i can't find it to figure out if i was smoking crack or talking out of my butt - tough to track down and 'unhide' hidden feeds - i'll find it. - Morgan
dustin i think i meant trulia listings and the link to one or two of the houses was a redfin listing. i can't find it to confirm but that's the sensible thing. the listing feed from trulia has the URL to the actual listing page ... - Morgan
Bizzaro. one more and I'll let it go... do you see that on your personal page as well? - Brad Coy
Twitter is great when things are slow, but when I am working I have to turn it off. Noise to Quality ratio can overwhelm me at times. I have twirl only ping when I have a reply or DM. How about you? - Tom Royce
@tom i have twhirl run on a separate monitor off of my main work screen keeps it in the background - Morgan
via twhirl
Tom - I leave Twhirl on throughout the day (and am now testing Alert Thingy) but like you have audible notificiations only for @ and DM's - frequently when I'm idle I'll have Alert Thingy, IM, Twhirl and email in the foreground. - Jim Duncan
via Alert Thingy
having twhirl on for me is the equivalent of working in a busy office with the potential distractions. If I need to focus, it's OFF. When I check emails (3 times a day) all message indicators are on. twitter using is at it's highest in the eve. when i browse. (I don't watch much TV) - Brad Coy
@Brad Coy: I'm with you. I often twirl off during the day just to make sure I get stuff done! - Dustin
Great Idea! disqus did well integrating Seesmic, why not FF? - Brad Nix
I wish Disqus would give the comments back to WP - Shey
Yes I hope DISQUS will integrate friendfeed too. A perfect combination. - Svartling
Right, the problem is which FF conversation(s) do you sync with? I've noticed that the really deep discussions develop in response to shared links to blog posts, and generally not in response to the author's direct blog post that shows up in their FF feed. - Aviv
Thanks Morgan. The feedback we received was very positive. Heck, we've even seen a few bloodhounds posting on twitter since. We had a little joke going were playing around with the HomeGain monkeys as puppets during the breaks ala Loren Feldman. - Brad Coy
I rarely post to Twitter, but when I do, it's typically from my iPhone. If I'm at a computer with a browser, it will always be FF. Then again, I'm someone who still doesn't "get" Twitter that much and have a difficult time following conversations. That's likely my own fault, though. - Vince DeGeorge
@J What s next one? ChatRoom twitter , forum ff, and....... FASTFOODR i think ; ) - Erhan Erdogan
Twitter is a god. FF will be, once all its minions arrive. There's not enough of my peeps on here to make this fun yet, but the potential is there. - Chad Norman
The main thing that I like about Twitter is the 140 character limit which forces people to provide a succinct and somewhat precise message which make for interesting and unusual information. I just started using Friend Feed and like it because it aggregates information. Twitter is just plain fun and Friend Feed is a way of organizing all of that fun and then some for info whores like @scobleizer and myself. - James
I've been saying friend feed is to twitter as ESPN is to Baseball. - Sean Reiser
via Alert Thingy
I use Twitter for broad discussion and new viewpoints. FriendFeed tends to be more intimate, but with people "like me" - Mike Reynolds
yeah I like that analogy too -- conversations between multiple ppl much easier to come by on FF than Twitter. - Shey
I tend to use whatever is "closest", most times I do post to pownce, and some things just are better as a twit. FF does help bring everything together, I wish more of my contact used it. - Grant Bierman
FF is a mosaic painting that Twitter is a (big) part of. - Michael Dragone
@M.D. I think you are a mosaic painting too, what an aristocratic background you have : ) Nice comment ; ) - Erhan Erdogan
Similar dichotomies have existed before (in Microsoft Exchange, for example, you have email messages vs. threaded conversations in Public Folders), but there's usually some overlap... the interesting thing for me is that Twitter seems to be an acquired taste: at first you're all, "Huh? This is stupid" and then (maybe) you take a real liking to it. Whereas I "got" the idea of FriendFeed right away, I could see the utility, but I haven't taken a real liking to it at all. Twitter is CB Radio. - Karim
I just get overwhelmed with "stuff" on Friendfeed. Half of the content are twitter messages and the rest is stuff that people link to through twitter. The only real reason I have for FF is to read content from friends on other networks, i.e. I Digg, but a friend may Reddit...I still want to read his stuff sometimes...p.s. it does seem easier to have a more indepth conversation here...and I'm seeing lots of comments from people that I don't follow otherwise...so maybe I'll have to take a second look. - Thomas Lopez Jr
I'm pretty new to twitter and ff so its interesting to see how ppl who have been on them for a while use the services. - Nelson de Witt
age on Twitter or wherever and it shows up on FF, ready for commentary. - Soulhuntre
via twhirl
Apples and Oranges. FF has the broader net. Twitter is the river. I check Twitter more often. FF of course has the visuals. FF needs friend tagging like Pownce has. Actually, Twitter needs friend tagging too. - Jonathan Leavitt
Grr. Try #2 - I dont post to FF as a "first level" channel. I use twitter or whatever and then FF aggregates it for comment. - Soulhuntre
via twhirl
Twitter is also *SIMPLE.* Twitter = iPhone, FriendFeed = Windows Mobile. Twitter is from Mars and FriendFeed is from Venus. Twitter is a hot dog and FriendFeed is escalopes de veau a l'estragon avec endives gratineed with cheese. - Karim
Ya know, I'm just jumping into the FF field, but it looks to me like you've nailed it. The most frustrating thing about Twitter for me is that it's like a chat room where you can't always see all the posts (if I'm not following the other half of a conversation); the FF layout solves some of that, as I don't need to be subscribed to everyone to see their comments. - Tim Glinatsis
friendfeed is the new irc...with a splash of rss - steveo
LOL Hutch, I stand corrected. A well-thought-out analysis you have there. It would be fascinating to compare male/female usage ratios of Twitter vs. FriendFeed. Are structured, threaded, hierarchical conversations from Mars, and free-form chats from Venus? Interesting question... - Karim
@Karim - thanks! There are differences between the two services, and I think the organization around content in FriendFeed creates some real differences with Twitter. Twitter is organized around the person you're talking to. - Hutch Carpenter
Interesting view of Twitter and Friendfeed. But how do you handle messages that you want to get via SMS? - Ryo
I share on Google Reader, update on Twitter, post on Blogger... FriendFeed catches it all as a nice archive (that I use to create a weekly/monthly newsletter for clients). I don't have the big community following so the commenting feature is not such a benefit. If/when I do get more conversations going, then I can see FriendFeed becoming more important. Twitter is more of an echo chamber when it comes to conversation. - Joining Dots
After watching this Post I will be using FriendFeed much more effectively and therefore Twitter less. - Brad Nix
I'm doing that already without being prompted, here provide's a very addictive source of information flow and discussion! - Joe Dawson
Does no one view Twitter as a lifestreaming microblogging service anymore? I realize that as a practical matter, it is chatty, but that doesn't need to define it. I do agree, tho, FF is more like a forum, without all the BS, which I like. - rambn
if it weren't for twitterfeed.com and the AIM option I'd never post to Twitter - Jon Gosier
twitter is like IRC - FF more like blog/wiki/forums - interesting video clip! - Jeroen De Miranda
