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Björn Brembs › Likes
Publishing:: Evolution, Disruption & the Future - Session 1. Edinburgh - 12th June 2013 - http://vimeo.com/68441564
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Björn Brembs liked this
In context http://www.edinpubconf.net/index...
- Graham Steel
In my inbox: I am delighted to confirm that your request for funds to support the scaling and further development to sustainability of ImpactStory, a nonprofit open altmetrics platform that helps scholars evaluate, sort, consume, and reward web-native products has been approved by the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation.
Chris M, Matt Hodgkinson, Seb Schmoller and 34 other people liked this
!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :) :)
- Heather Piwowar
$500k over two years
- Heather Piwowar
as in Half A Million Dollars.
- Heather Piwowar
:) :) :) :) Jason Priem and I? We're pretty excited about this.
- Heather Piwowar
WAHOOOOOOOOOO!
- jambina
Yay!!!
- Mary B: #TeamMonique
w00t w00t!
- RepoRat
Wow!
- Jenica
Yipee! awesome!
- Christina Pikas
YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- Hedgehog
as Christopher Walken playing The Continental would say: wow wowwie wow wow!!!
- LibrarianOnTheLoose
from BuddyFeed
congrats - that's such great news!!!
- Sarah
Congrats. PS: I opened my account again and started up the "create collection" process for my Google Scholar file. It's still running half an hour later. I'll let it run for the next three hours at least...I look forward to seeing the results.
- Walt Crawford
Wowowow, good job!
- Meg V. Meg
Hi Walt. Yeah, sorry, it shouldn't take that long... 3 mins at most. The good news is that we're moving out of time-consuming fundraising mode and into development mode (with $$ to hire contractors to help!).... we should get to fixing bugs like this soon. Sorry you are running into a bug now, and I hope you'll be up for giving it another go when we've given it a rev!
- Heather Piwowar
Snoopy dance!
- John Dupuis
Heather: Then I guess, since it's now been more than an hour, I should cancel it and try again some other time?
- Walt Crawford
Walt, yup, cancel for now. can you email me your Google Scholar file so I can debug? team@impactstory.org Thanks!
- Heather Piwowar
Heather: Done. (I don't know that I actually canceled it, but I shut down that tab.)
- Walt Crawford
YAY! That is so exciting, and congratulations!
- Laura Krier
Having your good news liked by oodles of people you like, admire, respect, haven't met yet, and/or have known for years? Happiness*2. Thanks, everybody.
- Heather Piwowar
also, not just good for you, Heather - but good for the rest of us who care (and/or want someone else to care) about tracking altmetrics. :-)
- $tephanie•Gardening
D'oh. Got so caught up in playing with text mining in r that I forgot the original question
Cameron Neylon, Björn Brembs, Kirsten and 3 other people liked this
Do Altmetrics Work? Twitter and Ten Other Social Web Services http://www.plosone.org/article...
Björn Brembs and OMG 404 Joe liked this
Today is my last day as a postdoc! The 3 years zoomed past: great great run. Next up: full time direct employee of @ImpactStory :)
Björn Brembs, Kubke, Egon Willighagen and 17 other people liked this
I want to write a blog post all about it. Alas swamped on time and emotion dimensions at the moment (family estate stuff, grant applications, new code release...). Struggle just to tread water just now. so we'll see.
- Heather Piwowar
so access to the literature will be come an even bigger thing :( ?
- Christina Pikas
I'm really lucky: I'm going to be able to keep affiliations to UNC ("affiliate") and UBC ("honourary research associate"), so I can still access subscriptions and have a local community. I fear my own ramp in OA ranting the day that I don't have uni affiliations, I will admit! :)
- Heather Piwowar
Happy last day!
- Hedgehog
The bravery of librarians - http://cameronneylon.net/blog...
Björn Brembs, Kubke, Betsy #TeamMonique and 5 other people liked this
Two things caught my attentions over the past few days. The first was the text of a Graduation Address from Dorothea Salo to the graduating students of the Library and Information Sciences Program at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. The second was a keynote from Chris Bourg, whose blog is entitled “Feral Librarian”, gave at The Acquisitions Institute. Both focus on how the value of libraries and the value of those who defend the needs of all to access information are impossible to completely measure. Both offer a prescription of action and ...
- Cameron Neylon
My small effort at pissing people off for the day: http://scienceblogs.com/confess...
- John Dupuis
404 error for Dorothea's link
- maʀtha
I know but that's a problem at her end I'm afraid. Looks like slis.wisc.edu is also down...
- Cameron Neylon
@John That list is...ummm....extensive...
- Cameron Neylon
Tell me about it. When I started compiling it a week or so ago I figured I'd end up with 10 or 20 items max. But the number of small programs and departments that have been cut really surprised me.
- John Dupuis
Up around 2000 page views for the post.
- John Dupuis
RT @laura_hudson: I love this story about a woman gender-flipping a cheesecake poster at her gaming job (and her boss's response!): http://t.co/yBz9uw7sDB
Matt Hodgkinson, Björn Brembs, OMG 404 Joe and 14 other people liked this
The other poster is worth the click! :)
- Curtis (a) Jackson
Awesomes
- Eric Sizemore
I liked the whole story...
- Walt Crawford
that is f'ing awesome
- Sir Shuping is just sir
"Ruby Underboob and Brosie the Riveter, together at last"
- SteVe C
new @researchremix post: My champions of Open Science http://wp.me/p4g7f-nn
Kubke, Graham Steel, Egon Willighagen and 3 other people liked this
and thanx!
- Egon Willighagen
Just went back to find my 1st blog post. Y'know who welcomed me from day 1? @sennoma @LibSkrat + @petermurrayrust :) http://researchremix.wordpress.com/2007...
Egon Willighagen, Björn Brembs, Marianne and 9 other people liked this
...and Paul Miller!
- Cameron Neylon
what you have done with that blog in six years is nothing short of astounding.
- RepoRat
Bookmarking this for lonely days. Astounding, she said. Astounding! Onward.
- Heather Piwowar
from iPhone
Oi. You kick azz. Don't let anybody tell you otherwise.
- RepoRat
Yup, i do :) but i get lonely. Anyway.... Just so cool you guys were there from day one. I'm forever grateful to Bill Hooker for finding my blog, flagging it to oanews, and issuing strong welcome :)
- Heather Piwowar
from iPhone
Six years already? Excellent :)
- Hedgehog
It Didn’t Work for Phil Ochs, It Doesn’t Work for Jeffrey Beall - http://walt.lishost.org/2013...
Kirsten, Bill Hooker, Angel R. Rivera and 7 other people liked this
Does someone have a copy of the 2013 "Predatory OA" paper of Beall? Sounds like a fun read.
- Egon Willighagen
It has taken me three years to go from being interested in Jeffrey Beall's analyses of journals (http://journalology.blogspot.co.uk/2010...) to rolling my eyes every time he comments on Open Access.
- Matt Hodgkinson
Walt, yes. If you unglue it, I'll contribute and encourage others to also, for sure. Be sure to set a minimum level that makes you happy, though.
- Heather Piwowar
Egon: Since the serials crisis is over and everybody has access to all the subscription serials they could possibly read, you must--MUST--be able to read Beall's article. Of course, I can't (not without paying $23.68, an oddly specific sum), but that's because I'm one of those nonexistent unaffiliated folks who don't matter.
- Walt Crawford
Heather: I will do that. So far, I've received 0 email and 0 comments on the post itself, but it's early yet.
- Walt Crawford
I'm just puzzled. He's a librarian right? At a university? Who presumably has to argue for a budget? Which he's just lost all leverage over for ever and for all time because "there is no problem"? Am I missing something?
- Cameron Neylon
He's at the University of Colorado Denver Auraria Library. If his ScholComm role is similar to the one at my uni, he doesn't actually have any collection development responsibilities or a budget to manage. How the UCD electronic resources and collection development librarians feel about what he's saying would be very interesting to know.
- Hedgehog
"Jeffrey is the Scholarly Initiatives Librarian at Auraria Library." http://people.auraria.edu/Jeffrey... I think his background is as a metadata/cataloger.
- OMG 404 Joe
yes, he started out as a cataloger. He previously had a holy war against Dublin Core and argued for MARC.
- Sarah
Which may make me indirectly partly responsible for him (except that I never argued *against* DC), for which I apologize. Come to think of it: I never argued *for* MARC except to say that if you're going to call it MARC, you should know what you're talking about.
- Walt Crawford
I'd give a lot to read his tenure file.
- Steele Lawman
I think I am detecting a tendency towards high profile tilting against windmills as a consequence of "being on t'internets" which seems to lead to highly polarized positions being taken up. Profile building seems to require taking extreme, even archetypal positions.</potCallingKettleBlack>
- Cameron Neylon
Cameron, indeed. The more "extreme" your statement, the higher the impact. And because it is hard to find new scientific results that are extreme, people focus on things around science. (or make new science finding sound more extreme than they are... which is *very* common deep inside the publishing world, as we all know)
- Egon Willighagen
Executive Order -- Making Open and Machine Readable the New Default for Government Information | The White House - http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-pre...
Björn Brembs, RepoRat, Deborah Fitchett and 8 other people liked this
is it just me or does this deserve a "holy wow" or two? "Newly generated government data will be required to be made available in open, machine-readable format by default"
- Marianne
from Bookmarklet
Absolutely a holy wow. :)
- Hedgehog
Cool video about it http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog... Although, they're both listing off to one side
- Hedgehog
Such a big wow.
- Heather Piwowar
from iPhone
I'll see that holy wow and raise you a #fuckyeahbuttercup
- RepoRat
(would have done so earlier except I just had time to drop my bags in my hotel room before heading out to Zombie Burger, which is a real thing that exists JUST LIKE OPEN GOVERNMENT DATA NOW)
- RepoRat
"Elite journals: to hell in a handbasket?" not yet, says @Hadas_Shema commenting on http://tinyurl.com/cgkn2h5 - http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/informa...
Kubke and Björn Brembs liked this
"@Hadas_Shema"
- Seb Schmoller
from Bookmarklet
"Experts disagree on whether cost of publishing research will fall, as #openaccess grows, MPs hear" #BISOA
O'Dowd et al.pdf 148 KB
Seb Schmoller, John Dupuis, Björn Brembs and OMG 404 Joe liked this
Y'know, reading that--esp. Alma Swan's comments--I realized that "Kick it down the road a decade or so" is the theme song of Green OA, and I don't know whether academic/spedial libraries can survive the "EVENTUALLY subscription costs might, maybe, perhaps go down" scenario.
- Walt Crawford
Should that be speeddial libraries or special libraries? I like the former.
- OMG 404 Joe
I meant special libraries, but speeddial libraries--"Just call 1-800-ELSEVIER and your budget allocation worries are all gone!"--might work as well.
- Walt Crawford
(not to slight Wiley and such smaller charmers as Sage, Emerald and ACS...)
- Walt Crawford
Oh I do like the way I've been selectively quoted there...no mention at all of "...prices will go down."
- Cameron Neylon
There's been a disagreeable (to me) tendency in the OA-sphere to gloss over the question of loss of publisher profits. It doesn't take a PhD in economics to see the difference between the pseudo-monopoly nature of a subscription system in which journals are economic complements (if your field is Bollocks, you must subscribe to both J. Bollocks and Proc. Nat. Assoc. Bollocks) and the...
more...
- Bill Hooker
Bill: I hear what you're saying, and you know that some of us (ahem) with relatively small voices have been addressing this issue.
- Walt Crawford
The title of O'Dowd's article in the BMJ is certainly not fully reflective of what was discussed during the ~3 hour hearing which I watched the other day. If you have too much time on yer hands, here it is... http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Main...
- Graham Steel
Moreover, I don't think O'Dowd et al has much experience in this territory, if any http://www.bmj.com/about-b...
- Graham Steel
Random and won't necessarily lead to anything question: IF (and it's a big if) I was taking a self-directed tech learning course, and I had 2 out of 3 components figured, and wanted to pick, as my third, ONE programming or scripting language to attempt to become very basically competent at, which one would you recommend and why?*
Michelle Noble, Sir Shuping is just sir, Björn Brembs and 6 other people liked this
*Given that I am likely to become a librarian of some sort in a year or two; given that I am really not intending to become a systems librarian; given that my background is in circulation; given that I think digitization and circulation are allied fields; given my science training; given my not having DONE science in a decade; given my not having programmed anything except one game in the last fifteen years (though I was pretty skilled for a non-programmer before that)...**
- Marianne
** feel free to ignore the above comment and just answer based on your own skills/experience/interest - any data is better than no data :)
- Marianne
You have several good choices. R is excellent for number-crunching and data visualization of many sorts; it would help you either as a science librarian or in acq/circ if that's where you stay. Python is a general-purpose language often seen in scientific computing; it's also a Swiss army knife that can chop metadata, dice websites, and julienne repetitive tasks. Ruby and PHP are in broad use on the web, as is Javascript (though I don't rec Jscript as your first language because it's kind of grotty).
- RepoRat
Here's a simliar question (in a different field) on Ask MetaFilter: http://ask.metafilter.com/237517...
- Steele Lawman
Heh, RR. I am grinning at you because that was exactly the short list I was hoping people would help me pick from (though I welcome other suggestions too) - do you prefer one of those over the others, or think I would? Steve, thank you.
- Marianne
Well, I'm an ancient unreconstructed Pythonista, so I'm a leetle biased. I still like Python, and it's still my get-shit-done tool of choice. If you can *possibly* pull off both Python and R, I think that would be ideal.
- RepoRat
R R R R R R R R R R R R R R R R R R or Python
- Meg V. Meg
<threadjack>I think I may have mentioned on FF somewhere that here at YorkU the required CS course that my son is taking as a physics 1st year teaches Fortran. Yes, Fortran. The good news is that his cohort is actually the last one to learn Fortran. Starting this summer, the course is switching to Matlab, which makes a lot more sense for physics in this day and age, though I'm sure many would also argue for Python. </threadjack>
- John Dupuis
My understanding is that once one feels competent in one language, it's easier to learn the next one. So is there any benefit in starting with R or with Python (or something else) because it's a better "gateway" language?
- Steele Lawman
Python is relatively close to very structured English, which could be an argument to starting with it. I'm struggling through it right now via a HeadFirst "Learn to Program" book which uses Python and A Byte of Python (free book)
- Hedgehog
Python or Javascript
- copystar
I learned Python first, and I found that a lot of its nitpickiness helped me with XML especially.
- Lily
Answering Ethel's question: Python has a long-standing reputation as a good gateway language because of its relatively uncluttered syntax, clean design, and broad application domain. R is a domain-specific language, which means that moving on from it to other languages will involve a somewhat greater learning curve... but the jobs it DOES do, it will usually do better and/or more simply than Python. (Though I hear NumPy is pretty awesome. I've never worked with it.)
- RepoRat
(thank you SO much, everyone. I would like this thread myself if I could.)
- Marianne
Oh, and see also http://rpy.sourceforge.net/ :)
- RepoRat
you can limp along in R without actually knowing how to program by following recipes from books and by using various gui packages and/or r-studio.... i'm so old i learned pascal in college but that gets me exactly no where. I'd like to learn Python and I'd like to force myself to do more regex searching... but this isn't about me :)
- Christina Pikas
Thanks for your comments on this, everyone. I'mma be taking the self-directed tech course (with tech folks for classmates!) in the fall. Very excited about it.
- Marianne
tell me more about this course and how it works?
- RepoRat
RR, the syllabus from last fall is here: http://my.ischool.syr.edu/Uploads... . Obviously it tends to be focused more toward other branches of the iSchool, but our program director made a point of publicizing it to us as an allowable elective. Like most self-directed electives, there's a...
more...
- Marianne
thanks!
- RepoRat
Gripping >> Sweden's most linked to text: Jonas Hassen Khemiri's Open Letter to (Justice Minister) Beatrice Ask. - http://asymptotejournal.com/article...
Björn Brembs liked this
#OpenAccess - Breaking the Monopoly of Large Academic Publishers. Ann McKechin MP (member of the HoC BIS Committee) reports. - http://centrallobby.politicshome.com/latestn...
OMG 404 Joe and Björn Brembs liked this
Launch of the PLOS Text Mining Collection http://caseybergman.wordpress.com/2013...
Björn Brembs, RepoRat and John Dupuis liked this
YAYS. My latest post went live today. UKSG - Connecting The Knowledge Community http://figshare.com/blog...
Björn Brembs, Kubke and OMG 404 Joe liked this
For those that are interested, my interview with campus radio about Open Access is here: http://chrynews.wordpress.com/2013...
Björn Brembs, Graham Steel and OMG 404 Joe liked this
It's longish at 20+ minutes. Apparently they got good feedback on the interview, so that's nice.
- John Dupuis
Listening....
- Graham Steel
Yay - a good shout out about the OLH https://www.openlibhums.org/
- Graham Steel
Good job. 100% agreed with what you said and didn't find it "too heavy" in any way.
- Graham Steel
Thanks. Maggie was fun to work with. She interviewed me a few months ago about Aaron Swartz and as she mentions this was kind of a sequel to that.
- John Dupuis
danah boyd, "why I’m quitting Mendeley (and why my employer has nothing to do with it)," apophenia - http://www.zephoria.org/thought...
Björn Brembs, OMG 404 Joe, Marianne and 6 other people liked this
Pull quote: “I cannot say the same thing for Elsevier. As most academics and many knowledge activists know, Elsevier has engaged in some pretty evil maneuvers. Elsevier published fake journals until it got caught. Its parent company was involved in the arms trade until it got caught. Elsevier played an unrepentant and significant role in advancing SOPA/PIPA/RWA and continues to lobby on issues that undermine scholarship. Elsevier currently actively screws over academic libraries and scholars through its bundling practices. There is no sign that the future of Elsevier is pro-researchers. There is zero indicator that Mendeley’s acquisition is anything other an attempt to placate the academics who are refusing to do free labor for Elsevier (editorial boards, reviewers, academics). There’s no attempt at penance, no apology, not even a promise of a future direction. Just an acquisition of a beloved company as though that makes up for all of the ways in which Elsevier has in the past _and continues to_ screw over scholars.”
- Stephen le Francoeur
And Elsevier apologists pile into the comments.
- DJF
I loved her response to the first one, which boiled down to "no, REALLY, fuck Elsevier sideways."
- RepoRat
omg... so, to summarize, microsoft is less evil than elsevier so it's ok that i work here. (i made sure to avoid all capital letters in this sentence)
- Blake
Microsoft is probably less evil than it once was, but I still don't really trust it. As with many large organizations, their research arm probably is really independent, and I have no problem trust MSR more than I do the rest of the organization (cf, Bell Labs vs the rest of Bell/AT&T)
- DJF
I don't trust OCLC as far as I could throw it. I trust OCLC Research pretty much implicitly. So yeah.
- RepoRat
There's also the fact that, as danah points out, Elsevier is actively trying to restrict, control, and shut down open scholarly communication and research. Microsoft, no matter how evil, doesn't care about that. So it's easy to be 100% "Microsoft evil", and still be opposed to what Elsevier is doing.
- DJF
I'm also not super-thrilled at the "discredit danah b/c of her employer" tactic. Smells of ad hominem. Sorry, Mr. Gunn.
- RepoRat
yah know... i don't see that as ad hominem. I actually made that point, too. Elsevier has some really talented UX designers and what not on staff and people who aren't individually evil, but that doesn't make the company as a whole any less evil. just because she cares about kids doesn't make microsoft any less evil. (i use microsoft products, too)
- Christina Pikas
Agree w RepoRat. Her employer has nothing to do with this. She could work for Springer or T&F and still legitimately think that Mendeley being bought by Elsevier is bad for the industry.
- Heather Piwowar
Disagree. Her employer is entirely relevant. Microsoft is another giant gatekeeper IP-troll asshole corporation and anyone who works there can be expected to have been indoctrinated into that mindset, even if only slightly and subconsciously. So, for such a person to see another similar company as despicable says a lot about that second company.
- Bill Hooker
This is all a sideshow. Whether db is a hypocrite (and I personally don't think she is) has NOTHING to do with whether the Mendely acquisition is good for Mendely users (and I personally think it is BAD for users). So congratulations on the misdirection and ad hominem, William Gunn, because it is apparently working.
- Steele Lawman
Re Mendeley/Elsevier one area I don't see being discussed in twitter stream etc, is that this buys Elsevier proprietary Intelligence. What Mendeley reveals in their Open API is only a tiny amount of their total data. It isn't click stream or highlighting or fine grained demographics etc. This means that Mendeley gives Elsevier a competitive...
Kubke, Kaan Öztürk, Garret McMahon and 12 other people liked this
advantage on what scholars do and how they do it. People are talking about whether Mendeley will treat all publishers equally like Scopus does... there is a difference. Scopus is built on citations, which anyone could in theory get with enough money. With Mendeley, Elsevier gets workflow information, and no other publishers get that. It is a smart move for them, but a blow to people who think that propping up Elsevier is not best for the industry.
- Heather Piwowar
yes. please write that blog post.
- RepoRat
Will try but no time today. Someone else free free to beat me to it, no need for attribution.
- Heather Piwowar
the way things have worked before, a given aggregator only had access to individual user behavior related to their own publications, and not even always (library proxy servers protect people to some extent). Now Elsevier knows what every Mendeley user is reading and saving; they may even know some of where Mendeley users *get* what they read and save. if that doesn't seem worrisome to people, they weren't paying attention to the Attributor thing.
- RepoRat
link to Attributor thing?
- Heather Piwowar
http://scientopia.org/blogs... and http://scientopia.org/blogs... I think Elsevier would LOVE to peg Mendeley users who aren't clearly downloading via library or toll-gate access mechanisms.
- RepoRat
Even if they are, the shared groups (which I'll admit to having been one to encourage for cross campus collab) means all the researchers then have access.
- Hedgehog
But doesn't this mean they're going to start getting sued like whoa? I mean, it was my understanding that Mendeley's provision of (some of?) this data to the publishers was one of the only reasons they weren't already getting sued like whoa.
- Meg V. Meg
Bjoern Brembs says http://bjoern.brembs.net/comment...
- Graham Steel
Meg, I hadn't heard that. Got linky? Because that's a reeeeeeally interesting angle.
- RepoRat
Hard to stop thinking about Mendeley-as-elsevier-loyalty-card for data collection. I'm not thinking about it wrt subscription enforcement, but rather as intelligence for future Elsevier product innovations. Future product innovations that help Elsevier as priority #1 and scholarship and open scholarship with the same priority Elsevier has previously shown.
- Heather Piwowar
Is Meg referring to something like what Jason Hoyt mentioned this moring? http://enjoythedisruption.com/post...
- Hedgehog
And now VictorH says http://paidcontent.org/2013...
- Graham Steel
Heather, regarding the insight available through the API and user activity. Imagine Elsevier was out of the picture, what would you say if Mendeley used it to do the same for itself. Develop and innovate on features that it had exclusive insight to, toward its own advancement?
- Ricardo Vidal
I'd be ok with that. I've been assuming that's what you've been doing till now.
- Heather Piwowar
So, following that logic, because you see Elsevier as evil, you consider that they'll certainly use the same tools to their advantage. Which is therefore bad.
- Ricardo Vidal
Suber chimes in - https://plus.google.com/u...
- Graham Steel
I don't consider Elsevier evil. I consider them interested entirely in their own bottom line and very demonstrably willing to make decisions that are not in the best interest of science to defend and promote it. I don't want to help them do that with papers, my review hours, or my click data.
- Heather Piwowar
as somebody said recently in a different context, if you're using their products when you have a choice, then you are funding their work. Unfortunately, academic libraries don't have much choice when it comes to subscribing to the journals, but we do have a choice of citation management platforms
- DJF
from Android
So we've talked about the enforcement angle and they understand this would be a really dumb thing to try to do. They want us more as a application platform since the whole Sciverse Apps thing didn't go all that well.
- Mr. Gunn
Thanks for the feedback Heather. I see your point and can only hope that we can keep doing our good work and proving Mendeley a valuable tool and resource for researchers.
- Ricardo Vidal
We've so far been successful with the approach that Open Access papers are read more, but if all the OA advocates leave Mendeley, then it's going to be hard to keep making that case. Having a strong OA community *within* Mendeley is really important and I hope people will stick around to show them that.
- Mr. Gunn
soooo... instead we should implicitly say "Elsevier sucks except when they own something we like?" That's a stance I personally am kinda uncomfortable with. Like PSuber, tho, have never been a Mendeley user, so easy for me to say -- I'll just chug right along with Zotero the way I've been doing.
- RepoRat
yes, but having good quality data accepted by even the most conservative groups showing the OA advantage certainly helps, and that's what Mendeley can provide
- Mr. Gunn
well, there will be less data on OA papers, less people doing interesting OA-related things with the data, etc. That's why I think people should stay. Just picking up your toys and going home is the easy way out.
- Mr. Gunn
Sure, if we were children, and if this were a game. However, "if you're using their products when you have a choice, then you are funding their work"
- Meg V. Meg
And if I trusted Elsevier with the kind of data I would put into Mendeley. Here's the thing: I DON'T. That's not entirely Elsevier's fault (MIT and JSTOR and Attributor and Facebook own some of the blame, among others)... but I don't think Elsevier has exactly covered itself with glory, either, and it's *crystal* clear which financial side of the bread is buttered. Do I trust Elsevier to resist temptation for the sake of ethics? THEY HIRED ERIC DEZENHALL FFS. No. I don't.
- RepoRat
So I'm glad that Mr. Gunn and Ricardo Vidal think Elsevier will do right by all this, and I think *they* believe that; I don't believe they're trying to blow smoke up FF's collective arse. I just... don't believe that will remain the case. Temptation much too great. Elsevier won't fsck up tomorrow, or the day after... but they'll fsck up. Guarandamnteed.
- RepoRat
Elsevier is a big big place. I wish I could quote to you from the email I just got from some people within Elsevier promising their support in helping us make a business case for openness - saying they're our allies, but acknowledging that a huge organization like this isn't all going to be aligned internally.
- Mr. Gunn
I got some great email about a global text mining plan too. Many people there really believed it. There was a time and a place and a scheduled tweetup. Plug got pulled.
- Heather Piwowar
from iPhone
no organization is immune from having plans canceled
- Mr. Gunn
I agree. Though it wasn't a passive "plans were cancelled". Someone at Else cancelled the plans because they were too liberal/edgy/threatening even though had all sign offs till the day before. I just share that story to say we all know great email doesn't always work out.
- Heather Piwowar
from iPhone
Fair enough. Just pointed it out to show some nuance beyond the "everyone at Elsevier is evil and eats puppies" narrative extant. I have a feeling the task is even bigger than I realize, but that can't stop me from trying, and that really shouldn't stop you from supporting me, either.
- Mr. Gunn
I'll try really hard not to take the quote "everyone at Elsevier is evil and eats puppies" out of context when I cite it in my next paper. :-)
- OMG 404 Joe
I haven't seen that narrative on this thread. I'm trying hard to figure out a good way to support you that is consistent with what I believe, because I want to support you William Gunn :)
- Heather Piwowar
from iPhone
I support you, man. I just think they're gonna fuck you over, and it makes me sad. I do not want them to do that.
- RepoRat
I do recognize the possibility, but I have to give it a shot.
- Mr. Gunn
Salon commented here: Elsevier: All your data belongs to us http://www.salon.com/2013... via @Salon
- WarLord
"some people within Elsevier promising their support in helping us make a business case for openness" Yes, and I'm sure all the hundreds of trillions of bacteria living in/on Hannibal Lecter and all his trillions non-neuronal cells were all nice and friendly - if only it wasn't for the measly 70-90b of neurons in his skull... Quite likely, the large majority of people working at...
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- Björn Brembs
I honor your efforts, Mr. Gunn. They remind me no little of my own vis-a-vis the libraries I've worked in.
- RepoRat
This post captures Heather's sentiment, I think: http://www.salon.com/2013...
- Björn Brembs
Maybe I will try my hand at a timeline of blog posts kinda like what John D does.
- OMG 404 Joe
Mendeley may want to look at the fate of BioMedNet, sold to Elsevier by the Current Science Group in 1998 and shelved in 2004: http://newsbreaks.infotoday.com/nbreade...; http://www.sarahgreene.net/past-pr...
- Matt Hodgkinson
Wow, I haven't been back here in ages. Been trying to sort out my own thoughts on this...and I don't think I have a clear answer. I have a Mendeley account, I use it for a bunch of things including feeding the bibliography on my blog, and I haven't deleted it yet. Matt's point is the one that troubles me, Elsevier do have a history of running things into the ground. On the other hand it...
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- Cameron Neylon
...but there is another side to this which is that I know some of those cancelled projects of which Heather speaks and they had lots of those good people in them. So I worry about the inverse problem. What will happen to those people who have been on the inside working for change (and being shafted from time to time) now that there is a new shiny Open thing, both as the beacon everyone...
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- Cameron Neylon
Like Cameron, I haven't made my mind up yet. Personally, I don't intend to delete my Mendeley account at present.
- Graham Steel
"It was the destruction of BioMedNet that meant Vitek could hire a bunch of people to create BMC." So I should be grateful to Elsevier for my career :)
- Matt Hodgkinson
I also remember when Elsevier bought the Beilstein database, and they have since greatly marked up access to that data. 1998 and 2007 were key years of that. http://www.elsevier.com/about... This is kinda similar.
- OMG 404 Joe
fwiw, i posted on it here: http://scientopia.org/blogs... I'm pretty pragmatic when it comes to this sort of thing. It's not my primary reference manager (RefWorks is, sigh), but I intend to keep my account.
- Christina Pikas
I also intend to keep my account, so that I can keep on putting stuff into the OA Irony Award group. A good bit of it from Elsevier.
- OMG 404 Joe
(Slightly offtopic: here in this conversation we see what we lost when FF took a nosedive. This thread is better than all the scattered tweets and news links put together. I'm thinking it's time to re-invest in FF, since the sky hasn't actually fallen (I was a Chicken Little myself)...)
- Bill Hooker
Good call. I'm in.
- Graham Steel
Something slightly ironic about returning because its back to a smaller group of people though...
- Cameron Neylon
"Hate" to say it - but other than monitoring Refs Wanted Room, FF is a dead donkey for me and has been for quite a while. Other than Libranians, it's a ghost town to what it was in the past.Twitter & Google+ for moi.
- Graham Steel
Have to admit I saw a link to Heather's post and thought "oh yes, Friendfeed, I remember when I went there..."But it is still here and functioning clearly which is interesting in itself. There must be some measure of maintenance and upkeep going on behind the scenes.
- Cameron Neylon
y'all should come back. Nothing else is as good.
- Heather Piwowar
Yeah, it's still pretty awesome and unlike anything out there.
- Ricardo Vidal
It remains the best. Reminds me of my empeg :-) http://www.empeg.com/
- Björn Brembs
Cameron, it's good to read your thoughts here. It's a good point also about BMC, which is itself now a part of Springer. I hope FF is still here 4 years from now when open access is the default and everyone realizes this ;-)
- Mr. Gunn
I've just blogged about Elsevier's emerging workflows here. http://www.darkrepository.net/blog... Scopus a big winner IMO.
- Garret McMahon
Re: Elsevier acquired Mendeley. It's not as bad as I thought. - http://timotheepoisot.fr/2013...
Björn Brembs liked this
"One thing that Mendeley did good was the PR BS. I can give you thousands of examples of unethical practices they did during the years (with proof). And now they do this even more PR BS "sorry to see you go"."
- pn
I'm a proud "RSC eScience hero" - http://chem-bla-ics.blogspot.com/2013...
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Rajarshi Guha, Marie, OMG 404 Joe and 3 other people liked this
Thanks for the likes!
- Egon Willighagen
My thoughts on Mendeley/Elsevier & why I left to start PeerJ http://enjoythedisruption.com/post...
Björn Brembs, OMG 404 Joe and Heather Piwowar liked this
Very interesting post by Jason Hoyt following the announcement overnight that Mendeley have been aquired by Elsevier.
- Graham Steel
Fun! My paper with @tjvision is @thePeerJ preprint #1 :) https://peerj.com/preprints/1/
Kubke, Björn Brembs, Graham Steel and 5 other people liked this
I will admit to stalking the @thePeerJ site a little till the preprint "Submit" button appeared. To each their own fun :)
- Heather Piwowar
One is most amused by your comment, Heather. "Well done for being number one" !!!!
- Graham Steel
Walking the talk: CC BY - http://walt.lishost.org/2013...
Bill Hooker, Björn Brembs, RepoRat and $tephanie•Gardening liked this
In case you're not one who reads my blog, here's the gist: As of March 25, 2013, I’m walking the walk: Original content is now covered at least implicitly by a Creative Commons “BY” license: It may be freely used as long as credit is given. Period. I’ll have the actual license and icon as soon as I figure out how to add it. (And I'm thinking about it for C&I, despite the almost total lack of revenue...)
- Walt Crawford
And it's (CC BY) now there on individual posts. Not quite sure how to get it on the overall blog, but this is a good start.
- Walt Crawford
Our book is released - http://orgmonkey.net/?p=1676
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Pete #TeamMonique, Björn Brembs, OMG 404 Joe and 10 other people liked this
Text mining hits the pages of Nature News again, and quotes me from my blog #bloggingTotallyWorthIt http://www.nature.com/news...
Matt Hodgkinson, Björn Brembs, OMG 404 Joe and 3 other people liked this
Doesn't *link* to the blog, mind you. Maybe that hyperlinking thing will catch on one of these days?
- Heather Piwowar
nah, hyperlinks are just a fad.
- RepoRat
Hypercolor's where the money's at.
- Meg V. Meg
I have a HyperCard stack about that very topic.
- Catherine Pellegrino
I guess I could add the link here, in case anyone finds this and wonders: http://researchremix.wordpress.com/2013...
- Heather Piwowar
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