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Dare Obasanjo › Likes
This looks like a job for...
Roberto Arancibia, winckel, Josh Haley and 97 other people liked this
Whoa, it's the back of my head! It really looks like I'm working hard.
- Wayne
Super FriendFeed?
- Outsanity
hahah cute! I can hear the Superman music now LOL
- Susan Beebe
SuperFriendfeed Guy! (Currently shedding his mild-mannered not-so-secret identity, Dan Hsiao.) Our beloved superhero maintains the same level of transparency as the entity he represents.
- April Buchheit
from iPhone
Brilliant...
- Zee.
(To the tune of Sesame Street's 'Captain Vegetable') Out of his not-so secret workstation somewhere in Facebook comes your newest super hero! --- It is I, SuperFriendfeed Guy/ Post your comments in my homefeed/ Sharing cool posts for all my friends is good for me/ And they're good for you, so post some too/ If you can't see, just sub to me/ See videos and pictures that you'll like/ Three cheers for me, SuperFriendfeed Guy/ Like! Like! Like!
- April Buchheit
My inspiration: http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- April Buchheit
FFMan
- Mehmet Fatih YILDIZ
+1 Outsanity
- ashish
Way better than that so-called hero on Smallville.
- Rebecca Sun
CIO
- Renchin(Reina)
:))
- 'Like' robot (frɐnc)
sendfeed....? XD
- marx
Technorati Changed Their Business and Few Noticed - http://jeffnolan.com/wp...
Jose Maria Pelaez, Ahad Bokhari, Daniel Rowley and 9 other people liked this
"It’s fair game to criticize a company for executing their core business poorly but it’s unfair to criticize them for changing what their core business is all about when the evidence is overwhelming that the old one would have driven them out of existence."
- John E. Bredehoft
John: Is that assumption or do you have facts to back that statement up? Just curious if you have information.
- Owen Greaves
Lesson One - Know Your Market - http://jamiequint.posterous.com/lesson-...
Space Cowboy, acelya akpinar, Mac Sharp and 16 other people liked this
"Before starting Snaptalent we completely failed to evaluate what was going on in our market. We thought there was a problem that could be made better with technology and decided to tackle it without talking to *any* potential customers about if what we were doing was even useful or necessary. We did not have a deep understanding of what recruiters did on a day to day basis, none of us had ever recruited or even really talked to anyone who had. We decided to attack a market because it appeared to be inefficient, without gaining internal understanding of what was actually happening in the market and possible reasons for that inefficiency. We didn't understand what recruiters based their decisions on when making vendor purchasing decisions, we didn't even know who the decision makers and budget holders were within the organizations we were targeting. We were completely blind from a market perspective. This problem was not only limited to the recruiting side of the market. We also had...
more...
- Paul Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
...this reads like it could have come from The Onion.
- .LAG liked that
No matter how obvious, a useful reminder.
- Nenad Nikolic
Wow @daveman692 joins Facebook. When I was at Google today employees there say Facebook is recruiting heavily. Congrats Dave!
Jesse Stay, Hugh Isaacs II, Steven Walling and 4 other people liked this
Now I don't want to hear anyone else tell me Facebook isn't trying to be open. :-)
- Jesse Stay
Jesse - Why do you say that? You comment sounds pretty 'inside baseball'
- Jason Miller
Facebook isn't trying to be open, Jesse :)
- directeur
Did you guys see the title of @daveman692's position? He is also one of the main organizers of OpenID, OAuth, a significant contributor to open source, and a huge proponent of "just making things open". I think this hire says a lot.
- Jesse Stay
Jason, I've been studying and following Facebook since they launched their platform - I've written 2 books on Facebook. It is "inside baseball" for me. Facebook is where the majority of my background lies.
- Jesse Stay
@daveman692 is Facebook's "Open Programs Manager"
- Jesse Stay
Facebook 3.0 May Be The Most Useful App On The iPhone Yet - http://www.techcrunch.com/2009...
Endorphine, BraGiu, Andrew Dobrow and 41 other people liked this
It's pretty slick on the BlackBerry as well.
- Ken Bauer
I'm waiting for the FaceBook app for the Android phone. I thought I heard it was in the works.
- Chris Jackson
This thing makes me think how much mobile app dev of soc net tools will drive (and, actually for someb is already driving) smartphone sales. It's obvious, but this makes it so clear. Thnx
- Alberto D'Ottavi
from fftogo
Yes, but when will we *get it*?
- Brett Kelly
This is why I hate the app store so much. Cool app, massive delay in getting it to market. Why do I have to download this crap through Apple? Why can't I download through FB directly? Frankly, all developers of "free" apps should release through Cydia, so those of us with jailbroken phones don't have to put up with Apple's BS.
- Otto
I hope Spotify release their app on Cydia if Apple rejects it. What a great reason for millions of people to jailbreak their phones. :)
- Jamie Cansdale
Those admins from hell kicked me off of facebook. http://apps.facebook.com/causes...
- James Michael Mike DuPont
Looking forward to this, three weeks until available?
- Joe Dawson
Taking ages isn't it! I've been refreshing the app store a couple of times a day hoping for it to arrive. Dont even use Facebook that much, just wanna play with the update :)
- Simon Wicks
The current app is just dreadful.
- Derrick
A funny story about how http://friendfeed.com/marccan... was right about iLike:
Susan Beebe, Martynas, Iván Abrego and 10 other people liked this
At an iLike party that Marc Canter (founder of Macromedia) and I and lots of others attended I thought Marc was a jerk because he stood up at the party and told the founders to "get away from dependence on Facebook." But that's one of the reasons I've come to like Marc. He'll tell you the truth, even if it costs him a lot personally and even if it isn't socially brilliant to do.
- Robert Scoble
Now it's clear that Marc was absolutely right about iLike. That they had lots of Facebook users, but never built a good business. It's a bummer, because I remember the early days of iLike when the CEO was sitting on the floor putting together an airconditioner. I remember when they got millions of users in the first week of Facebook's app platform and assumed that they would go all the way.
- Robert Scoble
Sounds kinda like me. I like him.
- phil baumann
phil: I like him too. It's too bad that Silicon Valley won't have him telling the truth like that. That said, he can always blog at us from his new place in Ohio!
- Robert Scoble
His point of view on the 2007 incident: http://blog.broadbandmechanics.com/2009...
- Robert Scoble
We need more peeps like that - it's what drives things forward.
- phil baumann
Seems Marc has the sensibilities of a restaurant critic rather than a PR guy. Good for users not so good for VC's.
- Jim Posner
...I've always enjoyed Marc's candor and larger-than-life passion about what he does. He can see the future. And he still owes me a lunch at Kokkari! ;)
- .LAG liked that
marc was my favorite on the GGang
- Chris Heath
I just followed Marc. A call-it-like-you-see-it attitude is one of the things I like about Robert Scoble too.
- Bruce Lewis
Chris: if there's one guy I want to have a meal with, it's Marc. Partly because he takes me to the most awesome places and partly because he's an interesting dude is visionary about where the industry is going, even if he can't always get there himself.
- Robert Scoble
Scoble ...very true: Marc knows the best places to eat. his presence and wherever the place is, it will always be an experience.
- .LAG liked that
"I even remember what it was like before Robert Scoble got here!"
Tyson Key, Nicholas James, Penguin It's Cold Outside and 110 other people liked this
i do actually recall what it was like before he got here
- MG Siegler
lol lol
- Chris Saad
I recall what it was like when he declined to be here. :)
- Louis Gray
Who is Robert Scoble? Is he Alex's brother or something?
- Jim Norris
What was it like?
- Christian Collins
quieter
- MG Siegler
a moment of win?
- Trish Haley
I try to beat Scoble onto networks I think might blow up so I can experience that quiet. :P
- Shawn Farner
I remember FriendFeed when Mona was Scoble!
- Zulema ◕ ◡ ◕
from iPhone
++Zulema
- Bruce Lewis
Hell, I even remember what it was like before I got here.
- Kelly Norton
who?
- Ivan Kirigin
I remember what it was like before Ivan Kirigin actively participated here. Good to see you commenting. :-)
- Bruce Lewis
I remember too!! Haha!!! :D
- Susan Beebe
from iPhone
Hehe MG.
- jcunwired
It was, in fact, even nicer back then. Back when Paul was Leo LaPorte
- j1m
Mona was Scoble??? Really trying to imagine that...
- George Hall (Australia)
I thought it was Guy Kawasaki that started the downfall of Friendfeed? :)
- Ray Cromwell
I am always going to have a place for FF. Just like I will have for gmail. Paul you might have something to do with this.
- Akshay Dodeja
beta invites, it seems so distant...
- Dobromir Hadzhiev
I remember when FriendFeed was available only through VT100 terminals.
- Jemm
I even remember what it was like before Alex Scoble got here. But I never knew a time without Louis Gray. And, before Paul? Well, there was Twitter. I remember that time well. :-)
- Robert Scoble
I miss having a friendfeed embed on my blog. I could use a good social media hub that isn't effected so much by good ole business decisions. What are my options?
- Mark Essel
Mark: rrrriiiiiggggghhhhttttt. Write your own, I guess is the option.
- Robert Scoble
Mona was a much more attractive Scoble. "Queen of FriendFeed" as I recall.
- DGentry
Robert, Who own's the internet? Who owns the web? How do we get that same group to own social media information so that I can rely on it rain or shine. As an aside, I looked into facebook this morning and nearly puked in my own mouth due to crappy apps, and low quality information. I sorta don't see facebook as my social information hangout, ever. (maybe lite will change that... and the relationship structure)
- Mark Essel
Mark: @god owns those. ;-)
- Robert Scoble
I have this site bookmarked as ScobleFeed
- Travis Smith
Who?
- Will Higgins™
"Don't worry. We still have Plurk." :D
- Christopher A Carr
I too was here long before Scoble but thankfully I've gotten to know him much better after his arrival. Death to Scoble...Long live Scoble.
- Mark Krynsky
There was a "before Robert Scoble got here"?
- Morton Fox
BRS (Before Robert Scoble) will be a new measurement of time.
- Jemm
I think BS (Before Scoble) would be better. ;) Just kidding Robert
- Keith - @tsudo
I'm pretty sure Scoble was here when I got here, but I followed Louise Gray here and Scoble was quiet back then. His Twitter followers weren't following him en masse to FF like they apparently do now.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I don't remember but I love that quote anyway. That needs to show up in my feed again.
- Martha
Oh now we're starting to insult Robert now? Shame. :(
- Molly, New Ears :P
People, geez. He's quoting that hilarious video with Hitler talking about FB and FF.
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
Molly... how is it insulting him.. he is in this thread joking along with it... not sure he feels insulted, maybe he would say so if he was..
- Rob Sellen :o)
Molly: if you think this is insulting you should read some of the people over on Twitter.
- Robert Scoble
I remember FriendFeed on a 28.8k modem. I'm totally being serious. This whole real-time thing would have sucked. Oh, and yes, I remember FriendFeed before Robert. ;-)
- Zach Flauaus
I've been trying to see if I can actually tolerate "that cesspool of superpokes and mafia wars" of late...it's rough going. ;-)
- Christopher A Carr
RT @arrington: @Scobleizer or in other words, what happened today is facebook hired 11 engineers. [Amen!]
Alex Schleber, Oğuz Serdar, Yant and 5 other people liked this
Exactly. We been had. Any other update would have been in the user/dev conversation. But since we had done our job as testers, we were no longer in the conversation.
- Melanie Reed
+1 Melanie. The social community built FriendFeed, but will we be getting a check from Zuckerberg? Nope, we just got handed a wooden nickel.
- jcunwired
Great geek T-shirt as seen on @jensmccabe - http://ourdoings.com/roberts...
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Rajesh Sharma, Ken & Kiyomi, Anand Sharma and 17 other people liked this
I love fun geek shirts. This one was made as a sponsored shirt by Plantir Technologies.
- Robert Scoble
Haha that's great
- Mo Kargas
GIrls always look at me funny when I turn my head around these txt-files. I like to read, what can I say? :)
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
Now that's great!
- Keith - @tsudo
I just unsubscribed to "Louis Gray" because I got sick of looking at his twins.
Ton Zijp, Darren Heydon, Kol Tregaskes and 9 other people liked this
That's nice.
- Beau Liening
To each his own, I guess. I like seeing peoples' kids, especially when they're parents are creative about how they get posted.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Thanks for sharing!
- Louis Gray
Ding Ding Ding! You just won the "Sad Fuck of the Day" award! Congratulations!
- Bec Rowe @d0tski
I suggest you post more Louis
- Nick Halstead
Here, let me shed a tear for you.......Nope...couldn't....sorry.
- Beau Liening
Some people just don't like seeing kids. No big deal. Some people would consider it unnecessary to post such feelings to explain an action none of us are concerned with anyway. Fabricated big deal. The choice of words tells me that this is an attempt at fabricating a big deal. It flopped. Negative cred.
- Jack (a.k.a. Jeber)
I categorize these kinds of posts with the "I'm deleting my FF account because of..." posts. Bait to get a crapload of comments and likes.
- Beau Liening
Why is Louis Gray in quotes? Is that not his real name? Or is that code for something? Inappropriate use of quotes is totally "FTW"!
- pea
There is the Hide function...
- JA Castillo
@Pea +++++ Hahahaha so "Louis Gray" needs to tell us his real name.
- Shevonne
Cute little mobsters... may grow up and pay you a "visit." See what I did there with the quotes?
- Richard pancakhaus Walker
cracking knuckles - it's time for da MOB!
- BEX
Good for you. Why do you need to tell us exactly?
- Kamath (नमः)
I like "using" quotes for no "real" reason.
- B. Hatin
Or just remove him. I'm sure Louis doesn't stay up late at night weeping because someone removed him without posting all over why.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
LOL
- Paul Papadimitriou
Well I'll be damned! I haven't looked at Friendfeed since I made the initial post. And I didn't post it to start some kind of bait to get comments. I couldn't care less. I was just being honest. Louis is probably a nice guy and I wish he had two feeds (or does he?): one for tech posts and one for family posts. I'd subscribe to the first and pass on the second. "Children should neither be seen or heard from - ever again." - W. C. Fields
- Tokyo Dan
I'm more interested in subscribing to real people than edited personnas.
- Scott of Two Countries
Scott of Two Countries, Who's edited and who's real?
- Tokyo Dan
I think Scott is saying that by removing the twins and putting them in a second feed, that would be edited.
- Louis Gray
That's right. If you want a tech feed, there are plenty of places for it, but IMO FriendFeed is not about narrow feeds, but multi-faceted people.
- Scott of Two Countries
OK. My initial post was cold. I sincerely apologize to you Louis. But I was really irritated. I subscribe to your posts for tech. And to tell the truth, I tire very easily of seeing constant family pictures of even my close friends. Sorry if that makes me an asshole. But if I feel like that then there must be others who feel the same way. Or am I really that unique? Anyway, two feeds...
more...
- Tokyo Dan
This all boils down to the way communication is done on social networks. Today, the burden of sorting through feeds is almost exclusively done by the receiver. While most people talked about how Facebook did open its status updates to "everyone", I was more interested in the application of selective outbound communication: one status update could be directed to one list only. This is a...
more...
- Paul Papadimitriou
Good idea Paul.
- Tokyo Dan
I really like bing.com/travel. It's bad that they ripped off Kayak UI, but for once the MS product has the best user experience of all
Morton Fox, Dare Obasanjo, Derek Collison and 5 other people liked this
I am curious to see how long MS will live on by ripping from others.
- Alpay Erturkmen
Curious to know from where did they rip off the Kayak UI
- Ashish Tiwari
Ashish, I mean they ripped off kayak.com.
- niniane
On their ticket deals, what do the green arrow icons mean? What's the difference between the up arrow and the 1:30... oh, never mind. SF to Rome, $512.
- τorƍue
That arrow just helped me a lot in buying a ticket to New York. I waited a few days and saved $150. Thanks Bing!
- Roshan Vyas
Mini-Microsoft is right. Microsoft has turned a corner and tomorrow morning I'll show you another example of how. - http://minimsft.blogspot.com/2009...
Jesper Lind, Bernie Goldbach, Tyson Key and 33 other people liked this
Tease
- Geoff Schultz
Geoff: yes. I hate embargoes. It ends at 6 a.m. Pacific Time. :-)
- Robert Scoble
Geoff: but, when I left Microsoft four years ago, it was a company that didn't get the Web at all. Today? Bing. Silverlight. Azure. And other things we can discuss in the morning are showing that they've turned a corner away from strategy taxes and toward embracing the web again. Will this continue? Microsoft still has a lot of work to do. IE sucks, so does its mobile phones, but I find I'm excited about Microsoft again and that's a big change over the past four years.
- Robert Scoble
And the echo chamber feeds itself once again. Sounds like it should be interesting
- Chris
Chris: yes, I doubt my words will be found on USA Today. By the way, if it's such a nice echo chamber, why are you here to deride it? An echo chamber should be clean of that. ;-)
- Robert Scoble
sonic imperfections. Polish up the echo-chamber a bit more and me and chris won't be heard :)
- martin english
I heard its Alto Cumulus Office which is a name i made up on the fly. I agree with you though Robert MS is really putting some great stuff out there. Win 7 is great, Bing surprises, and I'm going to go a step further and throw in that XBOX Live proves they really do "get it" about the internet.
- Geoff Schultz
I keep coming back to the words someone once told me before I worked at Microsoft "never count Microsoft out." I am afraid I have done that a few times in the past four years and now it's clear Microsoft is coming back in.
- Robert Scoble
i can't believe i'm saying this... having been(and still am) a microsloth (there i go again :) basher for more than 12 years... but if they have turned a corner... not just in terms of technology, but in terms of attitude and innovation, i wish they do bring about great things... competition for google in a way that advances technology and innovation can only be a good thing... its getting too lopsided in the market again...
- simran
Geoff: yes, XBOX Live was a great example for the past few years, but easily written off because it was from a weird group that wasn't even on the main campus. But now other things seem to be happening back on the main campus. I wonder if Bill Gates leaving had anything to do with this?
- Robert Scoble
I think if Microsoft decides to get IE to go standards compliant (big change) that would be the true icing on top for them to be turning the corner. I think Google is the new Microsoft in terms of attitude because they seem to capture everyones mind into thinking there not evil whatsoever. I'm going to like tomorrow alot.
- Rahul Krishnakumar
Windows 7 will be free.
- Shaun McDonnell
Rofl that would be a funny announcement. Thats the sort of thing you save for a Friday, right after stock market closes to prevent a run on the "bank", Shaun.
- Geoff Schultz
All this excitement because Office in the cloud?
- gui ambros
Microsoft Office 2010 http://www.office2010themovie.com/
- Johni Fisher
Until SB steps down,,,, thought i do like it when GK and SB fight with each other.http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- James Hunter
Wait Robert, you're using Silverlight as an example of *embracing* the web?
- Michael R. Bernstein
Silverlight 'rebooted' the Web and pushed every Web 2.0 developer away from Flash.
- Shaun McDonnell
Morning should be interesting, as reading between the lines of your posts here, it's not Office in the cloud. PDC, and minimsft have talked about that in detail. So, therefore it must be something else. Cool. :)
- Nick Wade
Shaun: There is no way Microsoft could do that. Scoble: The echo chamber is completely anti-mainstream and the problem there is that every new amazing thing loses perspective, such as some who are crazy about Friendfeed. Anyway, on topic, you've got me enticed to see what this is S.
- Chris
Don't know if you've covered this before, Robert, but it might be interesting to blog about how you prepare for that embargo release time, besides dropping lots of juicy hints to whet our appetite. What sort of things do you have lined up, ready to go once the gun sounds?
- Ron Schott
I have a funny feeling this announcement's not going to be as big a deal as I would like it to be. MS have a gift for taking something good (like windows 7) and screwing it (like charging waaay too much for windows 7). I will be happy to be proven wrong - lets see :)
- Jim Connolly
So, Will you tell us your secret today? At 6 a.m.?
- Bernaldo Barrena
The Borg is back in town. And there's a lot of road kill out there who thought Microsoft would never pass them...
- Bob Morris (polizeros)
from iPhone
Oh, is this the Microsoft+Apple merger? I didn't realise it was tomorrow.
- Ian Tindale
Ian LOL
- Bernaldo Barrena
It's probably the Yahicrosoft! thing coming to fruition, Ian... I wouldn't worry about it, until people start making an exodus from Flickr and del.icio.us again .;)
- Tyson Key
Why isn't there a good iPhone application conference/expo yet? I want to do one, there's too much cool stuff happening here.
metalerik, Anand Sharma, David Potts and 27 other people liked this
With 40,000 apps it's amazing to me that there isn't a good expo yet. MacWorld should have rebranded itself to "iPhone World" and gone for this. This is a HUGE opportunity being left around for a conference planner to take advantage of.
- Robert Scoble
I'll be there!
- Colin
Colin: we should do one as a community. Maybe this would be a good thing for Building43 to do.
- Robert Scoble
why ff don't make ff app for iPhone such as facebook?
- ѕнαнιη
Robert - I'd love your opinion on www.SynapticWeb.org - its the basis and framework for our thinking that produced Echo - would love to do a conf on it
- Chris Saad
I bet FF apps are coming for mobile, but I don't get why Safari isn't a great way to use FriendFeed. Maybe if you could answer that you'd get a developer interested.
- Robert Scoble
You're right that there's a massive opportunity there, a big problem with iPhone developers is that we aren't allowed/don't have excellent places to communicate with each other, this would be cool!
- Colin
The cross section of applications may be too broad.. who is the target?
- Pogmohoin
That's because 30,000 of those are just fart apps and flashlights. I think WWDC and Macworld do a fine job of highlighting the iPhone apps
- BryanSchuetz
from iPhone
Have one! Im there!
- Jeremy Lane
Bryan: no way. WWDC is NDAd for most things and Macworld is totally lame.
- Robert Scoble
I'd love an expo where I could meet tons of the best iPhone developers and see the coolest new apps face-to-face. Discovering new apps is too hard and there's too much innovation. I bet someone does an expo soon anyway. But this would be something fun, me thinks.
- Robert Scoble
Well go out there and use your magical scoble power to make it happen!
- Jeremy Lane
Why not? I think it's a fine idea. We should have it in Denver.
- John Fiala
from iPod
How can I help??? I wanna! :)
- Sheryl
John: I'm thinking of pulling an Arrington and doing it during MacWorld. :-)
- Robert Scoble
maybe you just build a virtual Expo site to rival the App Store..Interact with the developers..leave comments..developers pay for the space.. you are right.. 50 thousand apps and visibility to the top 100!
- Pogmohoin
Pogmohoin: no, I don't want to compete with Apple. I want to do a physical event where you can walk booth-to-booth and meet lots of great developers and see their cool apps.
- Robert Scoble
I here ya.. But we are not all USA savvy.. Internationalise fella's
- Pogmohoin
Pogmohoin: yes, well, we have to start somewhere and since MacWorld is in SF, I say we should do it at the same time. That way developers will already be in town.
- Robert Scoble
+1 more for physical event.
- Colin
+2
- Jeremy Lane
Cuz the iFart booth would be the size of a football field and no one wants to be next to them.
- Geoff Schultz
So the Audience is developers meeting developers? I am not knocking just really trying to nut out the advantages..btw < we are developers..
- Pogmohoin
Robert, is http://www.360idev.com/ the kind of thing you had in mind?
- Rachel Luxemburg
I'm Using BuddyFeed it's not perfect but it seems the best for now. the Biggest problem whit this app is u can't like Feeds in the main page this is the worst thing about this app :(
- ѕнαнιη
WWDC was in June. That would be a better target for iPhone Devs is you wanted to gather some. Less so, with Mac World. There are a number of events that attract developers. There's really no shortage. The other problem you mention is an interesting one in it's own right.
- Debi Jones
http://mobilebeat2009.com/ isn't good enough? It's not specific for the iPhone tho -
- barl0w
It's a good idea. Not every developer can make it into WWDC. Need more outlets for developers to get notice.
- Bess Ho
Wow, very surprised no one has started one of these up yet!
- Arnold Aranez
wow - was just talking to someone about starting a london iphone developer meetup - anyone interested (other than Robert ;-) ) - ping me on ff or twitter @robocallaghan
- Robert O'Callaghan
barl0w: nope, I want something JUST for seeing cool iPhone apps. Not discussing strategy, or any of that. Sort of like a "Demo" for iPhone apps.
- Robert Scoble
I'm currently using something developed by Boopsie for our conference in Chicago. We have about 23k attendees over the course of six days. American Library Association. It works pretty decently but is primarily a schedule tool.
- Kenley Neufeld
Find 10000 FART applications, available from 0.00 to $.$$.
- Nitin Nanivadekar
add Microsoft to your Web 2010 cloud.
- Nitin Nanivadekar
Unconference format, and if I get an invite I'll write a killer augmented reality app especially for the con. I'll dub it wifi hotspot. It'll identify the overcrowded hot spots neabye and use a decentralized navigation algorithm to lead you to uncontested juicy bandwidth. I say this with no prior app experience.
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
Mark: I don't want a conference. I want an expo. Where you walk around and see tons of great apps and meet the developers. These guys are rock stars. I want to meet them all in one hall. Maybe get the best ones to give a demo in front of an audience, like at Demo.
- Robert Scoble
Jarred my app thinking, is there a mobile app that allows bandwidth sharing between nodes (other phones with the app) poor man's wifi extended, using tcp/ip distributed packet sending (if you get cut off the app has to know) I gotta write up a blog post on this idea.
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
Interesting idea. And I like the comment from Nitin I truly embrace the iPhone and the Applications market but... "Find 10000 F.A.R.T applications, available from 0.00 to $.$$" says something.
- Patrick Boegel
I like this idea. I run an iPhone (apps focused) site and spend lots of time looking at and reviewing good/bad/mediocre/great apps - and still feel as if there are lots that pass me by.
- Patrick Jordan
Why limit the expo to iPhone developers?
- Debi Jones
A link to a post I promised about peer 2 peer mobile phone network speedup. http://friendfeed.com/iphone...
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
I love friendfeed. but it seem that less and less people are answering here so I wonder if it will last...
Susan Beebe, Violet Mae Lim, Ben Hanten and 30 other people liked this
Answering?
- Kevin J Hatton
sorry, commenting.
- Orli Yakuel
Answering is good too. I just wanted to remind you that we are still out here, at least I am.
- Kevin J Hatton
maybe it's me that should be here more..
- Orli Yakuel
As subscribers increase, I would assume the # of comments would be further diluted. Also note it's after midnight on a Saturday. Weekends tend to be slow.
- Louis Gray
Well you should be able to be on here when you want to, not feel duty bound. You have a life away from FF as I do.
- Kevin J Hatton
I don't know Louis, it's been like that for a long time now.. (talking about my account for example)
- Orli Yakuel
כן יש בזה משהו, אבל עדיין נחמד לשוטט פה
- Dudu Bekel
Since I started to be more active on friendfeed and uses it for microblogging instead of tumblr and other services, I've got a lot more responses, comments and likes. I think we need to be active to get responses back.
- Svartling
I'm still trying work out how to integrate it in my day without it being a huge distraction
- Stephen Baugh
More data is coming in now - more subscribers importing more information - so the percentage of posts that inspire a response will naturally drop, but I wouldn't say that there are fewer people commenting from my own experience. If it appears that there's less conversation going on then you may simply need to tweak who you're subscribed to and/or filter what you're seeing.
- Mark H
I think its kind of lame myself. to much Winer and Scoble and mostly its an agrogator and people aren't actually here to respond to comments. Also some people just cannot spell ;-)
- Vonn Carbon
It is much tougher for newcomers like me to get on board.
- Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Why is that? Mahendra
- Kevin J Hatton
A couple of ideas that may be worth trying. Whenever I'm looking for a conversation, I try to jump in on other people's posts and forget about my own. It's not as much fun as it is to get a bunch of likes around something you posted, but it's pretty easy to interact that way if you're not afraid to take the first step. I've also found that of all the platforms I've used, FriendFeed is...
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- Davis Freeberg
Vonn, it appears to be a lot of Scoble, but primarily because of the reason he discusses recently in #3 here: http://scobleizer.com/2009.... And it may seem like a lot, but think of what happens in a year when FF is more ubiquitous like Twitter/Facebook! Generally a richer experience here.
- Chris Aldrich
Kevin: As a newcomer to Friendfeed, what I see are two distinct types of users: the 'Influencers' with thousands of subscribers getting dozens of comments and the 'Others' who hardly seem to attract any comments. Getting involved in the first group doesn't pay dividends soon, while the latter doesn't help much. I guess I'm acting a bit impatient.
- Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Kevin: The real biggest obstacle is most folks you've networked with on blogs/twitter/etc. are reluctant to get active on Friendfeed - they have accounts with their feeds coming in, but they're not actively using them. So Friendfeed's lack of popularity is becoming its biggest obstacle for newcomers - a cyclical effect.
- Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Kevin I luve to write for ya!
- Amir
Mahendra: Just join operation twitter kidnap. Go to your closest friends, tell them that Twitter is neat, but lost its edge when Oprah joined and that they should come join you on a more robust social platform. With a couple of emails you could get them to join in on the fun.
- Davis Freeberg
Mahendra. That is an interesting observation that you make but I guess like many things it is what you make it and what you prefer to use the service for.
- Kevin J Hatton
Really? Amir? Would you write what? I am curious.
- Kevin J Hatton
I never looked at Friendfeed as being a dating site.
- Bernie Goldbach
I agree with Svartling - my experience is similar: "the more you give the more you get" at least here, on FriendFeed :)
- Hanna Wiszniewska
I think one of the problems FriendFeed currently has is that discussions don't scale easily; the flat view of comments just gets too overwhelming to easily participate in, if you're not Scoble.
- Tristan Seligmann
Here's a thought: If lots of people uses Friendfeed as there microblogging platform other than their own blog, then maybe Friendfeed should consider giving them the ability to move to a personal domain name, like most of the blogging platform does, with some customizable options.
- Orli Yakuel
I was thinking on the same lines too..maybe we need to add people who answer back.
- Rohit
I think as most of us have people over there (Twitter) and people over here (FF) and we all tend to shift from platform to platform, client to client, sometimes the flow of conversation gets lost unless you're monitoring all the ways someone can respond. I tend to respond to people @twitter from FF and don't always tick the box for an "at" reply to be generated just for them. I also tend to run over 140 so it forces Twitter users to click on the link to read the rest here. I know that a lot don't bother.
- Aron Michalski
I clicked through from @aronski post while in Tweetdeck, but normally don't. I don't like being chained to the browser and have yet to "get" FF. Too much noise? I dunno.
- Rich Palmer
I've noticed it too. Lots of time spent, little interaction. I wonder if friendfeed should start modifying its algorithms for which posts get bumped to include eights for what you want out of the service. If you're looking for interaction, weight the entries from people who actually use the service for commenting not just broadcast.
- DGentry
I've noticed it too. I try to post as much as possible but I am getting zero interaction. That's why I am trying to comment more now - to see if it kick-starts things a bit.
- Mark O'Neill
Davis Thanks for the tip. Kevin: I concur. I've now decided to approach it in a different way: I'm going to make new friends on Friendfeed and stop bothering about existing ones who don't switch!
- Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Mark: Ditto!
- Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Well, overall it looks like you people still care about friendfeed (based on your comments)
- Orli Yakuel
yeah. Well look at all the responses your initial comment provoked. :-)
- Mark O'Neill
There is so much noise it is hard to differentiate between those who simply want aggregation and those who are looking for interaction. Unless you post natively. :)
- Eric Logan
Looks like you have a lot of answers :)
- Randy Allen Bishop
Is it just my feed/my own view? It seems that FriendFeed is practically dead on a Sunday, and I don't mean that as a gripe/troll/flame either.
- Tyson Key
Weekends and early mornings are usually less active
- LPH™ and his dog P™
It depends where you live. It's not morning here :)
- Svartling
Not morning here either. :)
- Brome
I agree with Hanna and Svartling: "the more you give the more you get" and why worry about friends on twitter. You have many wonderful new people to find here. :)
- Myrna
Orli and Rohit: If you 'hang around' and get involved and ask interesting questions, you will continue to have a good conversation. Why does everyone keep referring to Robert Scoble as the only one who does it? If you want to 'do it' just do it! And Orli, it looks as though this thread is making the grade so just wash, squeeze, dry and repeat.
- Myrna
Aron, you reminded me. You can never have a conversation like this on twitter. And I find when I have more than 140 I need to come to FF so I came and stayed.
- Myrna
Mark, posting alone will never do it. You've got the right idea now about taking part in others threads.
- Myrna
Orli: I strongly believe we're going there, with Friendfeed enabling dotcom domain registering (same as tumblr and Posterous). BTW, can you get so many comments from Twitter and still follow? I doubt that ;)
- Nir Ben Yona
Nir, that will create further fraction and not help boost the activity level.
- Amit Morson
Amit, maybe. Wondering if anyone can give some traffic numbers, comparing between Friendfeed and Posterous.
- Nir Ben Yona
Mahendra I've actually noticed the same trend on most social sites it's difficult to break into and unless you contribute quality you will soon feel as if you are screaming into a void. I'm also trying to build a new network of friends on friendfeed but just have to be more regular and participate more often :)
- Bhowmik Shah
from Nambu
By the way I also think that we need threaded comments or something similar the current method isn't scalable
- Bhowmik Shah
from Nambu
Bhowmik, patience and you will soon be smiling! :))
- Myrna
And FriendFeed loves you too, Orli! ;)
- Tyson Key
Bhowmik: yep! That's why I decided to break away from the cyclical effect I described, and look to discovering new Friends here instead!
- Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Mahendra :)
- Myrna
I guess I'll have to post about this all converstation. and @Nir, you're right of course, I can't do that on Twitter.
- Orli Yakuel
Orli, where will you post..LOL?
- Myrna
In my blog (duh) ;)
- Orli Yakuel
Oh on FF? You can start another discussion and refer back to this discussion and then you'll have 2 long threads..that's good for a beginning. Robert Scoble will soon join lol. Robert is a friend but like to tease.
- Myrna
Orli: or you can just embed this thread in your blog :)
- Nir Ben Yona
this is what I'll probably do Nir
- Orli Yakuel
How dare you bait me so!
- Mike Nayyar
What shall I comment on my dear?
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Myrna ... now i'm all excited :)
- Bhowmik Shah
Like Louis says weekends are slow, also, when America is asleep during the week it's quiet too. For me the mornings in the UK are very slow but about 3/4pm BST everything starts to get going. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
It's also down to being active on FF, like a few have said above. It's certainly the scenario of what you put in is what you get out for FF.
- Kol Tregaskes
For me I saw a big drop after the new UI beta came out then again when the new UI when full but it's grown back up to what it was before and possibly surpassed it.
- Kol Tregaskes
A few suggestions; when you post to your blog either import the RSS feed to your FF page and sync the comments (there is a FF Comments plugin if you use WordPress for example), post interesting entries, post entries with images (which gets more attention than entries without) and if you feel an entry deserves more attention or you would like an answer try bumping it with a comment or re-sharing it to relevant groups.
- Kol Tregaskes
Also, joining groups of you interests and interacting with the threads gets you more attention and simply subscribing to like-minded users (who might subscribe back) can be beneficial.
- Kol Tregaskes
Google's Microsoft moment - http://dashes.com/anil...
Dare Obasanjo liked this
"They've reached the point of corporate ambition and changing corporate culture that means they're going to be perceived as if they are. Whether they're able to truly internalize that lesson, accept it, and act accordingly will determine if they're able to extend their dominance in the years to come."
- Nelson Minar
Touché.
- Hein Roehrig
"Google's recent development work on applications for mobile devices has often been delivered exclusively as applications for their own Android platform instead of as iPhone applications..." Apparently Anil takes it for granted that that is by Google's choice.
- Daniel Dulitz
Why did Google announce Chrome OS this week? Well, of course, Microsoft has a big announcement coming on Monday (I'm embargoed).
Daniel Rowley, Bill Romanos, Charanjit and 216 other people liked this
It'll be interesting to discuss both announcements too, and what they mean for each other.
- Robert Scoble
Is this that internet clipboard that Ray Ozzie demoed a few years ago? Maybe they've completed it!
- Diego Barros
I hope to see something good come out of this. Are they saying free or paid for the Chrome OS?
- Anthony Timberlake
That's my Scoble - seeing things behind the things!
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
*raises eyebrow* Interesting. I applaud more competition
- Mo Kargas
I'm intrigued!
- Daynah
Diego, no, it's one of Microsoft's primary businesses. Did you know Microsoft has 14 billion dollar businesses?
- Robert Scoble
Related to Microsoft's Gazelle browser? http://news.cnet.com/8301-13...
- Kiran Patchigolla
Windows 7 GPL 3.0 ?? Brouahahaa:-)
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
Microsoft isn't doing too bad lately.
- Eric Florenzano
cool, im thinking its a special version of windows 7 for netbooks?
- sean percival
Anthony: I'm sure it will be free.
- Robert Scoble
Robert: I'm sure they do. As I'm sure IBM does. But I don't care about IBM. :)
- Diego Barros
BingOS?
- imabonehead
imabonehead :D
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
imabonehead: no. :-) Microsoft isn't that disruptive.
- Robert Scoble
And that means Google Is doing well once again, doesn't it?
- Markingegno - Donato
from Android
The Chrome OS will be for netbooks and such for now. And is Microsoft announcing the Free One Care?
- Dylan Richardson
haha BingOS! I like it
- Diego Barros
Bingo yes :)
- Kiran Patchigolla
*chuckles at imabonehead*
- Daynah
LOL BingOS! The startup sound will be Ballmer saying "BING!" like he did at AllThingsD conference.
- Paul Salzman
Bing-OS was his name-o!
- Daynah
Bingos <--- that was his name-o
- Micah Wittman
GoogleOS is already out - "It's the browser" - the GNU/Linux/Ubuntu skin is just marketing...
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
*high fives Daynah*
- Micah Wittman
An open source OS - how much stable will it be??
- Palak Mathur
Question is Robert, if you are not allowed to say, how on earth did Google find out?
- Sandra Large
Bingo-sssss
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
Micah, we're on the same google brain wave tonight. :)
- Daynah
Palak - you troll
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
Ride the wave :D
- Micah Wittman
Sandra: it might just be coincidence. Or maybe they have great spies. Depends on your view of the world, huh?
- Robert Scoble
Microsoft is open-sourcing their code too??? Yeah, didn't think so. :)
- Josh Fraser
Josh: part of the Microsoft announcement on Monday runs on Google Chrome (and Firefox for that matter).
- Robert Scoble
Not all "open-sourcing" is created equal.
- Micah Wittman
Maybe Microsoft is making it's secret announcement this week cause they knew Google was about to announce?
- Alan W Silberberg
Robert - say no more, don't get into trouble, Duder.
- Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic
Thats real funny Josh .. Its like pulling teeth to get them to give a discount on anything.
- Dylan Richardson
Alan: maybe! It all depends on how you look at the world, doesn't it?
- Robert Scoble
Nice Cant Wait!
- James Hunter
It just seems to coincidental. Like President of Iran making big speech during MJ's funeral!
- Alan W Silberberg
Scoble the only MS announcement they could make that would blow me away is Windows 7 Early release.
- Dylan Richardson
Dylan: Microsoft has a few other impressive things up its sleeve.
- Robert Scoble
So the question is now that Google's making an OS, will Eric Schmidt resign from Apple's Board?
- Paul Salzman
It's all just ones and zeros. ;)
- Victor Panlilio
So, do we give Calacanis credit for calling a Google OS back in 2006? http://calacanis.com/2006...
- Mike Doeff
Sanat: insightful. Paul: Google makes a smart phone OS, and he hasn't resigned, so why would he now?
- Robert Scoble
Zune HD. Looks nice for the first time ever I'm thinking about it.
- Dylan Richardson
Google is talking about it's goals at this point. Isn't Intel trying a netbook OS too that boots fast? It'll be interesting to see which OS features win out here with different implementations. Is instant on to the browser the key or will some other feature shine? Fun times ahead, though really need to see things in action.
- Loren Heiny
from iPhone
Dylan: sorry, that is dead on arrival. They should have combined Zune with a cell phone.
- Robert Scoble
I got a screen photo here: http://ff.im/4WoVE, I don't have much comments yet due 2 that I am using it now, its not much of an announcement.
- polou/indigo_bow
Robert, Zune with a phone hmmm??? I hope ur rite as u said ur embargoed!
- polou/indigo_bow
Gazelle?
- carrotmadman6
MS does not have the Balls to take on the iPhone.
- Dylan Richardson
Wait for Monday. Nothing else to say.
- Frédéric Sidler
from iPhone
Robert, because they claim to excuse him from the part of the meetings related to iPhone...computer OS is arguably the biggest segment of Apple. I guess he can stick around for the hardware discussions. I know my argument is elementary, but maybe walking a line here?
- Paul Salzman
What was the last big hit new MS product?
- James Watters
But if they did that would be cool competition is always better for the consumer.
- Dylan Richardson
James: Xbox? Dynamics? Bing?
- Robert Scoble
Apple is not really what I will be looking at Android is the big boy here
- polou/indigo_bow
MS Office on the browser would also explain why GMail and Google Apps are finally out of Beta today too.
- Ron Schott
Xbox
- polou/indigo_bow
OH OH Project Natal is coming out!! lol j/k
- Dylan Richardson
Robert: Thanks, wasn't hating, just looking for organic momentum from products. Bungie was def a godsend to 360. Bing proved Seth Godin wrong which I greatly enjoyed.
- James Watters
@Robert Scoble: So I looked up Microsoft's last quater's financial report, Microsoft does indeed have a $14 billion business :)
- Long Zheng
Bing is nice I have to say. Here is how I use it .. If I want to Buy or shop a price I use Bing. If I need info its Google.
- Dylan Richardson
MS better fix the %$^#%@^ Gumblar hole first, it's apparently worse than Conficker -- http://rixstep.com/2...
- Victor Panlilio
MS also has ~6+ B in R&D, is it efficient?
- James Watters
Not new news, but it could be the launch of Silverlight 3.0? Offline mode and all the other nice bits, runs on Chrome and Firefox.
- Travis Koger
from iPhone
Oh, really? When I get something on embargo...I don't write about getting it under embargo. Come on, Robert. You're better than that. Or at least I hope you are.
- Andrew Feinberg
I agree @travis, but google make it like a news
- polou/indigo_bow
James: it doesn't matter, a company like Microsoft needs a product pipeline to remain relevant. Research lets Microsoft remain relevant and on Monday you'll see a bit of how it does that.
- Robert Scoble
OK. Google Chrome OS. Netbook makers say Linux based Netbooks have high return rates. How will people react to a Netbook that only runs a browser? Linux has remained niche.
- Dileepa Prabhakar
Andrew: sometimes you have to take a risk. This is one of those times.
- Robert Scoble
Robert: I will look forward to it. We ALL win when great software comes to the market. Almost nothing better in the world.
- James Watters
14 billion, maybe Office that runs on Silverlight, therefore in the browser properly.
- Travis Koger
from iPhone
Do you all think GoogleOS will just boot up right into the browser? Browser will be in firmware?
- Paul Salzman
BTW, Robert, will Microsoft finally dump IE and develop a Webkit based browser? (Forget Gazelle. Yet another stupid Microsoft research project that will never successfully make it mainstream.)
- Dileepa Prabhakar
Paul: no highly unlikely.
- James Watters
Dileepa: I don't know the answer to that. But the demos on Monday (I have a bunch of video coming) were shown to me in Firefox. So maybe that's our answer right there.
- Robert Scoble
James: so you think it will sit on top of Linux or something? Or just be a new flavor of Linux?
- Paul Salzman
Linux flavor of Chrome, thus far not arrived yet
- polou/indigo_bow
Paul: I'd look at Android as a precursor and say yes its going to use a google refined linux kernel, and I believe the post even says a windowing system. I'll check TC again to be sure brb.
- James Watters
Paul: I bet there will be some customization of Linux underneath Google's Chrome OS. I'm intrigued and can't wait to see what they will do with it.
- Robert Scoble
Google says the software architecture will basically be the current Chrome browser running inside “a new windowing system on top of a Linux kernel.” (quoting TC)
- James Watters
I can almost bet that its web based Microsoft Office with some nifty real-time collaboration features.
- sameer
Sameer - I agree. Explains cross-browser compatability
- Daniel Lazarides
from iPhone
"a new windowing system" leaves the door open for a greater level of abstraction away from the kernel for sure. Probably still with some access to files, devices, etc on the local hardware though which a browser alone would be a clumsy solution too.
- James Watters
If Microsoft's BIG announcements are Web based Office (already demo'ed and announced), Windows Azure RTW (nothing unexpected) or Windows 7 RTM (already announced to be announced!), there is nothing that's going to surprise people on Monday then.
- Dileepa Prabhakar
I think Wave might be integrated into the OS.
- Jayasimhan Masilamani
Dileepa: Windows7i -- the Cloud OS from MS
- Paul Salzman
Jaya: Like as a built in extension to the windowing system? Like IE and explorer?
- James Watters
@Alex Will they be able to match Open Source strategies as followed by Ubuntu,etc??
- Palak Mathur
just another rehashed disaster of windows in another marketing created packing
- Zac Bowling
Dileepa - They haven't talked much about collaboration using Office web. There was one OneNote demo that showed some realtime synchronization. I'm thinking more Wave-like realtime features.
- sameer
Zac: I'm going to believe Robert, but lets give him hell if this is marketing glossy! :)
- James Watters
Paul Salzman: Windows 7i with WGA! -- works only when accessed through IE when running on a WGA validated copy of Windows.
- Dileepa Prabhakar
Dileepa: that's it, we've called it! ;)
- Paul Salzman
Robert you managed to convert a complete google night into a complete MS night :)
- Kiran Patchigolla
James: it's been a while since I've felt compelled to do more than five videos at a Microsoft press conference. See ya on Monday.
- Robert Scoble
sameer: That will be mimicking existing Google Docs feature. Google Wave is at a completely different level and I am not sure if Microsoft is up to doing something like that.
- Dileepa Prabhakar
Till Monday it is, I'm thinking I'll even blog it.
- James Watters
Wave might act as the collaboration platform on the OS. But that leads to another question. Will the OS be tied to Google accounts for login?
- Jayasimhan Masilamani
Dileepa: Let's see, I think there's potential for implementation of realtime collaboration across the web based and desktop offerings of Office that could be of big mainstream impact. It's got to be something related to Office, Robert talks about the "$14 billion business" - The only other Microsoft business I know of that's that big is Windows.
- sameer
sameer: I said that Microsoft has 14 billion dollar businesses. Plural, not singular, but I also said it was one of Microsoft's primary businesses. That narrows it down a bit, yes.
- Robert Scoble
My guess is a MS hardware that will shake the netbook market!!
- Krishnan Subramanian
So that's a Win7 RTM announcement, combined with Web Office. If Web Office will be free to use, the combination of W7 Starter with Web Office will be a huge notebook hit.
- Kirill Petrovsky
If ChromeOS was meant to counter MS, then the logical MS announcement would be some kind of OS project, like maybe a combination of Microsoft Singularity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... ) combined with Silverlight for NetBooks or mobiles.
- Ray Cromwell
MS Web Office for sure: Scoble said it runs on Chrome and Firefox and it's a multi billion business. Actually, MS Office accounted for 18-19B $ in 2008.
- Jérôme Flipo
I fear that if the tech side of their release if good (but whatever the pricing), Google Apps isn't ready for the fight.
- Jérôme Flipo
Microsoft announces the cloud OS? I'm still not sure about a Google OS though.
- Burcu Dogan
Web Office in Silverlight, together with a mobile version that means we get Silverlight on WinMo and maybe even IPhone would be a win for me
- Ian Blackburn
I cannot wait...:-) but I DO have a clue...
- Eric Denekamp
Lots of people suggesting Office-in-browser but if that were it why would Robert be under embargo given they've already announced it and demo'd it? I'm not saying it ISN'T Office-in-browser but if it is then something doesn't add up!
- Jamie
Good point Jamie - the two primary business in MS are Office and Windows (in terms of revenue anyway), so perhaps this is more to do with a Windows OS in the cloud? How would that look?
- Ian Blackburn
Midori perhaps? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- Jamie
Initially, Google VS Live, Then Chrome Vs IE & Google Vs Bing, finally its Windows VS Chrome OS
- Michael_techie
Ummm... are they announcing an online version of MS Office like Google Docs?
- prolificdyslexic
that's why I do not subscribe to Scoble - too many comments on his articles, too much noise
- Павел Романовский
I don't see any noise in here. Interesting conversation!
- Robert Scoble
The MS guy at Portland Cloud Camp said Azure was going to be released very, very <wink, wink> soon. #cloudcampPDX
- Gary Walter (gwalter)
@gwalter You’re maybe right. The front end would be MS Gazelle, and the back end would be Azure.
- Bram Pitoyo
Microsoft is finally putting the Zune out of it's (and out) misery and killing it? :)
- Diego Barros
Office Web Apps release to public beta is well overdue - first promised for end of 2008. If this is embargoed then it must involve something new. ScottGu hinted that Silverlight 4 was already in development. SL3 is released this Friday. So maybe SL4 will be released,in beta with a beta of Office Web Apps showing some SL4 features (like more AIR like features)..
- Joe Wood
It seems like "too late" and illogical for Microsoft to come-up with another vendor-lock-in type innovation and expect positive results. Microsoft is not run by daredevils nor wimps. The announcement Robert talking about might be about a web based productivity application suite, which is standards compliant and offers a familiar interface and workflow for people, thus easily adoptable and steal competitors' (G, Y!, Zoho, 37S, Adobe?, etc.) user base.
- Berk D. Demir
The thing thats got me shitting my pants over all this is Games. I need Windows to play all the latest Direct X 10 and 11 games. Linux is hopeless in that regard.
- Mark
Audience in here is mainly composed of technically inclined, early adopters. We feel comfortable with online apps and mainly ready to ditch (or already ditched) many offline applications in favor of our new toys. OTOH, that's a huge paradigm shift for the other majority of less technically inclined and incomparably bigger masses. Microsoft still have the power to lead masses, create...
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- Berk D. Demir
Interesting discussion! I vote for MS Office online !
- Krishnamoorthy
I commented in istartedsomething on Long Zheng theories with this list. so why not here after having read all of Scoble responses?: Safe Guesses (not crazy): 1.- Office Ensemble (Office Web Apps + Office Live Update) and a Office 2010 public CTP (the most likely one) 2.-Microsoft Online Services gets full release along with a full release of Windows Azure while one of the new Data...
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- Avatar X
from FriendFoo
i crammed a lot of guesses that may not have to do with the announcement so maybe robert could say warm or hot to the whole list without having to specify. :P
- Avatar X
I vaguely recollect listening to the GIllmor Gang in June/July 2008 where Robert said he'd just visited Microsoft Research and seen "an amazing new browser". If memory serves me correctly it was said in the context of mobile devices but who knows.....this may be another contender for Monday's announcement!
- Jamie
Anything related to Midori ? http://technologizer.com/2008...
- Krishnamoorthy
Microsoft has already made their counter-move to a Google OS. It's called Windows Azure. It'll serve apps to the Google OS with ease and MS will make money in the process. Yeah, I know today the money be nowhere near what the Windows OS makes, but while the Google OS is gaining traction as a desktop OS, Azure will be gaining traction as an app hosting platform for that very same Google OS and others.
- Jeff Weber
More spam news will come in. Azure, Mirot ha ha ha
- Michael_techie
just another social network (where the IE users might hang out)
- Dobromir Hadzhiev
Another huge innovation like renaming Bing?
- Burcu Dogan
Google is initially going after netbooks via a new OpenSource OS. If Microsoft's Next Big Thing is Azure then they are betting that a locked-in cloud-based OS will trump Google's move. It's gonna be VEHLEY INTELESTING to see this play out.
- J.D. Deutschendorf
launching online enabled MS Office, free and beta
- Павел Романовский
I really hope it's not anything Silverlight related, some one is on crack if they think the end game is everything running in a plugin in a browser.
- Scott Kahler
Tease. Tease. :)
- Charlie Anzman
Robert, they'd better have more than a few "14 billion dollar" businesses. Their market cap is 200 billion for heaven's sake.
- Stephen Pickering
sorry, have to ask. did it make you cry? :)
- dannysullivan
does this mean google=novell?
- Eran Even-Kesef
Made the news onto electricpig your announcement!
- Giraffes Up In The AIr
Dr. Schmidt HAS to resign from the Apple board... too many conflicts of interest (iPhone v Android, Chrome OS v OS X, Chrome v Safari). What could he possibly be adding that can't be obtained through someone else?
- Gerald Buckley
You are in Palo Alto? I am in Mendocino. :)
- Joe
pricing of Azure will definitily be one of the announcements; not the BIG one. Office online perhaps...
- Jeroen De Miranda
Very interesting indeed. Chrome OS sounds like a great companion to Windows on a netbook+ device, for those times when you do need instant web/email. Looking forward to your videos!
- Will Johnson
Since the event on monday is WPC I'm guessing that Steve Balmer will present MS view on future of the Enterprise and showing off some of what Ray Ozzie has been working on. Coming full circle with Azure (computing infrastructure), Mesh (powering collaboration), SilverLight (future of runtime enviroments on all platforms) and of course all of this software+services has to be powered by Windows Enterprise Servers on the back end.
- Daniel Chow
Also the new Office is the first application to launch under the above stack. Scoble, did I get anywhere close to any of the embargoed announcements? :)
- Daniel Chow
Robert - Was GLADoS based on you? ;)
- Matthew DeVries
What do you think? How long will the Apple-Google Friendship last? http://friendfeed.com/applero...
- Hans Kainz
They are going to announce the release of IE 9 - the even worse with net standards addition.
- Bobby Griffith
Windows 7 Home/Business/Ultimate Netbook Edition. Each with different capabilities and things disabled for no reason other than to confuse users and make more money.
- Scott Koon
heh - i know now what the announcement is and i am not embargoed - i should make a post :)
- Allen Stern
Go for it, Allen! Inquiring minds want to know!
- Rudy Amid
Well if you do know, you owe it to your readers to report the news,
- Mark
Mark - That's if you see tech journalists (which I don't think Robert even classifies himself as) as true hard hitting journalists (think woodward and burnstein, ed Murrow) or if you think of them in the vein of Sports writers. Sports writers, like tech writers, need to foster relationships and have their names known and have to cross closer into the friendzone to get us the day to day...
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- Matthew DeVries
Mark: sorry, I signed an embargo. That's the way these things go and I'm not willing to burn this relationship, sorry. You'll know on Monday. Matthew is exactly right. And even with Woodward and Burnstein, they played this game. You didn't know who Deep Throat was, even though that was news too.
- Robert Scoble
Not even going to go for the Deep Throat joke... I swear, I'm not going to... :p
- Bill Heslin
what announcement?
- kang
I didn't mean Robert should report it. I meant Allen Stern who commented he was not under an embargo. He knows it, he has no NDA, he should report it.
- Mark
RT Allen Stern "heh - i know now what the announcement is and i am not embargoed - i should make a post :)"
- Mark
I hope its not Gazelle. If it is I respect Robert for abiding by the embargo. It seems as though no one in tech abides by embargoes any more. If it is Gazelle, might as well discuss since it is all over the tech blogs already.
- Keith Beucler
As they keep it under the blanket till now! It should be software only thingy! speculations about xbox, zune phone etc are free to leave!
- Amir
It's not Gazelle. At least I don't think so, because I have no clue what Gazelle is. I'm off to find out.
- Robert Scoble
Ahh, nope, what I was thinking of is not Gazelle. But now that I see the rumors I wonder if Microsoft has more than one major announcement on Monday?
- Robert Scoble
My Guess: They enabled Live Mesh Web Desktop to run applications, So in future all applications are going to be hosted in Live Mesh
- Amir
maybe i want use chrome all day,,just for internet surfing
- qian
Hey Robert, on a scale of 1 to 10, with 1 being an announcement that version 8.1 of IE includes a better spell-checker, and 10 being that Windows 8 is coming out in 2010 and is free, how many out of 10 is the announcement going to be in terms of having an impact?
- Mark
btw I have had this single chrome window open for about a week, and because each tab has its own process I don't get memory leaks like with firefox.
- Mark
Does unmodded, unaddon'd firefox leak?
- Matthew DeVries
Not sure to be honest
- Mark
So there could be your difference.
- Matthew DeVries
Mark: that's hard to judge. I'd say 6.9 based on how you framed it.
- Robert Scoble
Is this something that will go over well on Wall Street?
- Michael Fidler
Well, today Microsoft announced the promotion of Steven Sinofsky to president of the Windows Division.
- imabonehead
Robert ur (face) a hit today in the news outlets: http://lifehacker.com/5310444...
- polou/indigo_bow
I hope Google comes up with a great OS. I have tried any different Linux versions on my netbook but have never found the perfect one. Looks like they have connected the right partners as well so I am very excited. 9 0ut 10 for me. This could change everything
- Asgeir
TechCrunch on Scoblelizer's drumroll: "Office In Cloud Comes Monday" http://bit.ly/18sKUe
- JimmyJet
it will be a sigh of release for people come to fear those massive, massive office purchase/downloads. still a pain for when you travel and have no access online though...
- Terry O'Fee
While Google's forays in the OS and office productivity arenas are great for consumer choice, are they playing w/ fire? Google's core revenue stream is search, which has a much lower switching cost than any of MS's multiple revenue streams: Client, Office, Server. It seems like the two are pitching for a protracted fight that could be costly to both. But in a battle of attrition, it seems to me that Google could lose $ faster than MS.
- lingb
Windows ME Ultimate?
- Michael Funk
Well, it's Monday, what is the announcement about?
- SuezanneC Baskerville
MS is making Office apps online. Ala google apps. Boring.
- Rudy Amid
Looks like Friendfeed broke 1 million unique visitors on the compete.com charts for the first time last month. Congrats Friendfeeders!
HealingBrush, Adam Lasnik, Alternating Reality Books and 80 other people liked this
I just noticed Louis Gray mentioned this in comment Saturday morning at 2 am. Did I miss the party?
- Daniel J. Pritchett
The party was held. Photos were not taken.
- Louis Gray
The revolution was not televised after all...
- Daniel J. Pritchett
Correct me if I'm wrong: isn't breaking 1M on Compete.com irrelevant? Those numbers are a loose estimate, based on less than 1% of US users ... with global reach, they MUST have hit 1M months ago (alexa says only 26% of FriendFeed users are from the USA)
- Joel Bennett
No metric is per se irrelevant. If we want to celebrate FF hitting a meaningless milestone, why not? It's not as if anyone's using this graph as justification for an argument.
- Daniel J. Pritchett
the party was held - the only participants were those on the default list :)
- Allen Stern
I just had our IT guy compare our google analytics with Compete stats and Compete was reporting about 30% of what the google stats showed.
- Laura Norvig
Any pointers to trend-tracking sites besides Compete, Alexa, Google Trends, Quantcast, StatCounter Global Stats and Trendrr?
- Sean McBride
well deserved
- Thomas Power
YAY, that is impressive - congrats FF team :)
- Susan Beebe
Congrats, FriendFeed. But how many registered users? :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Kol - all you have to do is look at the people on the default list - look at how many subs scoble has - i'd bet the total subs isn't more than a few x more.
- Allen Stern
Wow! One of the reasons is probably the better permalinks we got in the latest big update. Friendfeed indexes way better now by Google.
- Svartling
Pretty much everyone I care about exists in real life, so I'm thinking about quiting online services altogether.
Marko Saric, mjc, Ethan and 9 other people liked this
You don't care about me? *sobs*
- AJ Kohn
Seriously ?
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
This is funny, because for me online services are the bests tools I've found to communicate with "everyone I care" who "exists in real life". I don't see why you should restrain yourself from using something.
- Brome
I'm so offended
- Jesse Stay
*puppy dog eyes*
- Johnny Worthington
This is just the first step in overcoming my addiction to talking to people about stuff. One day at a time.
- Ken Sheppardson
Talking to people about stuff isn't an addiction to overcome. It's the most basic human behaviour.
- Louis Simoneau
I'm just the opposite - like to keep my peeps at cyber length.
- BEX
Seriously??
- Jannifer @wordsforliving
I have found a lot of my friends who I know and hang "in real life" now via twitter and the web.
- (jeff)isageek
Real life is highly over-rated :-)
- Paul W. Homer
The book and movie series "Twilight" has resulted in many females fantasizing about vampires. Can we please have a Twilight equivalent where the male protagonist is a Unix geek? kthxbai
i80and, Dare Obasanjo, Rachel Lea Fox and Louis Gray liked this
Exactly! We could so beat Twilight!
- Rishabh Mishra (p248)
Microsoft Releases Bing API - With No Usage Quotas - http://blog.programmableweb.com/2009...
Jérôme Flipo, Ho John Lee, Space Cowboy and 8 other people liked this
"When Microsoft launched their much-touted new search engine Bing last week it generated a lots of press and despite a somewhat muted expectations, it turned-out to be something of a hit. But lost in all the broader buzz about Bing was some news for developers: Bing has an API. We’ve now added a new Bing API Profile with technical details. " -John Musser
- DeWitt Clinton
Yay Microsoft!
- τorƍue
I've long applauded Microsoft's approach to search syndication. Their ability to aggressively innovate in syndicated search is a big part of their competitive advantage as an underdog in the market. Wish it supported OpenSearch/RSS/Atom of course (they announced it, but haven't shipped it yet afaict), but their JSON result format is sexy as is (and could well form the basis of OpenSearch over JSON).
- DeWitt Clinton
In regards to no quotas, Microsoft in their documentation says "you must ... Restrict your usage to less than 7 queries per second (QPS) per IP address."
- Philipp Lenssen
Question for you all. I have a trademark for TWiT® - first used in May 2005, trademark applied for May 2006 and registered March 2007. The trademark is in "Entertainment in the nature of visual and audio performances, and musical, variety, news and comedy shows." http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin...
Dobromir Hadzhiev, Richard Thomson, Dakota O'Neill and 186 other people liked this
Up until now there's been no conflict with Twitter itself because the brands were in different arenas. (We have, however, sent out cease and desist letters to companies using "twit" in their name and doing audio or video). But now Twitter is doing a TV show. The confusion between TWiT and Twitter is mounting. What do I do? Defend my mark? Or let my brand be swallowed by the big guy (even though we were first by several years)? I need your advice. What does the community think?
- Leo Laporte
Defend your trademark, 99% of people will totally understand, you have to do it, or you'll loose it!
- Chris Lloyd
Defend it. People that watch Twit Tv will also defend it.
- Jason Rundell
Can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. Does TWIT still stand up as an accurate brand for all the new stuff you are doing with TWIT Live? Might be time to find a new visual/brand identity.
- BryanSchuetz
At the SF MusicTech conference a lawyer called "tweets" "twits" repeatedly. Let's just say I think you should defend your mark and let TV chew up and spit out twitter.
- Richard pancakhaus Walker
I don't see how the brand of Twitter infringes on your trademark. Plus trademarks are an outdated ideal. You need to market and promote your brand and the people will come.
- Bob Blunk
Bryan: The TWiT name carries alot of weight in tech circles, it will take alot of money/time/effort to make a completely new name for something that will probably outlast twitter anyway
- Chris Lloyd
Incidentally, Twitter just got their trademark approved May 11, 2009 in the following "Telecommunication services, namely, providing online and telecommunication facilities for real-time interaction between and among users of computers, mobile and handheld computers, and wired and wireless communication devices; enabling individuals to send and receive messages via email, instant...
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- Leo Laporte
There is nothing ideal about any aspect of IP law.
- Richard pancakhaus Walker
Chris: I think Leo's name carries more weight than TWIT and (for me at least) he IS TWIT so I don't see it as quite such a big deal.
- BryanSchuetz
Of course, there's a larger long-term problem because of the way that Twitter has weakened _your_ brand. It might be less expensive (and a better use of your time) to rebrand TWiT into something that strengthens your brand and moves it away from Twitter; avoiding any future problems (and there will be future problems). You can't fight Oprah.
- Professor Messer
I guess Leo started a shit-storm here...The question goes far beyond the argument of Twitter vs. TWIT. It begs the question of how do Brands defend their government protected trademarks in a time when trademarks are failing to adequately describe what a company does. Do we need a trademark to know that Leo creates awesome podcasts and streams realtime shows via the internet? Plus, how could a trademark impart this knowledge to newcomers?
- Bob Blunk
Leo - your brand, as most evidenced by your show and content is awesome - for a small group of peeps who have had a chance to discover it and enjoy. I'd use the overlap in marques to leverage Twitter in some type of promotional / service partnership, whilst still retaining your brand and the equity you've built. Don't fight em, join em, at least tactically.
- Thom Kennon
Never give in to the big guy!
- Brian Harper
I'm with the majority, defend your trademark and your legacy.
- jcunwired
Defend it Leo. You built the brand and they need to honor that.
- Robert
I always thought calling the network the same name as a show on the network was wierd. But it's a recognized brand, and I wouldn't give in. Send some mails to all the twitvid.io's out there.
- Anton Tanderup
Is the BIG guy really that Big? Plus, with the way busines is changing one thing seems to remain the same...protectionism, let's sue someone it's easier. I'm suggesting your desicion is easy here Leo but in light of the landscape changing do you really have a chance? The other question to ponder is this, Twitter is the hot thing now but will it be 5 years from now and will it be true...
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- Owen Greaves
speaking from a british point of view a twit is someone who is a little silly or stupid. I think your podcast can stand up against the everising onslaught of twitter. Why not rise above all this discussion and say what you are This week in technology, a fantastic poscast full of wit and essential information for gadget freaks such as myself. Let the owners of twitter gabble on, in my book baby creatures twitter and you are certainly no TWIT.
- Chris Jennings
@ Professor Messer 'You can't fight Oprah' is not totally correct. You can FIGHT her, can you win? Maybe. I think, offline, Leo VS Oprah would go several rounds. Tweetfight says otherwise.
- Jason Rundell
Defend it Leo. What's the use in having a trademark if others can infringe upon it.
- TechListReport
Sorry to say, my girlfriend recently yelled at my for watching 'Twitter' when I was really watching TWiT live. Confusion does exist for people who don't fully understand what each service is.
- Wo
The good thing about trademark law is that it's well established and legally documented. The problem with trademark law is that it's well established and legally documented. You need a brand to create awareness, and you need the trademark to protect your established brand. This one is sticky because TWiT is well established but it's going to be an expensive brand to protect. Twitter's...
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- Professor Messer
@Jason Rundell, don't get me wrong, I'd love to see a cage match between Leo and Oprah (who wouldn't?). But it'll cost a lot of time and money. Sometimes it's better to be smarter than the legal system.
- Professor Messer
I'm not sure I fully understand where the perceived trademark issue is. The names are similar, but clearly different. I don't know that Twitter is making any efforts or attempts to infringe on the TWiT brand, particularly in the area specified ""Entertainment in the nature of visual and audio performances, and musical, variety, news and comedy shows." I agree and understand the brand...
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- Ken Camp
The fact is, the brand that really matters here is not TWiT, but Leo Laporte. I came to TWiT because of you, Leo, not because of the name. That being said, I'll stand behind whatever decision you make.
- Darren Landrum
Oh, and I think this is just the opportunity we need to resubscribe our iTunes and take over the top 10 lists. :)
- Professor Messer
Can I ask - did TWiT exist before Twitter? Or did Twitter exist first? And - is your name TWiT based on Twitter, at all?
- Chris Loft
Chris Loft: TWiT predates Twitter and comes from This week in tech...
- Chris Lloyd
I think it's only right to defend your trademark Leo. You were there way before Twitter and just because they have gained significantly increased attention and media coverage, doesn't mean you have to lay down and submit to Twitter. I would defend your mark vigorously if I were you. You've worked hard to build your brand.
- Marty McPadden
Chris Loft proves that there is confusion between the two.
- Anton Tanderup
Leo - TWit is an incredible brand and network of invaluable podcasts - you simply have to defend it
- Robert Davies
Fight for it. When they try to get additional financing make your move. Asserting your trademark will cause them to settle or buy you out when they go public.
- Alan Morris
I think that once you see the Twitter television show, you'll probably want to distance yourself as far away as possible.
- Professor Messer
Defend your trademark. I get more intellectual engagement from the TWiT network of shows than I do from most of my Twitter community.
- Eric Geller
Use whatever legal tools you have available to defend your brand, especially if Twitter is talking about crossing into audio/video. You have a strong product, and Twitter is creating brand confusion in the market. A hard line needs to be drawn between your product and theirs, and it's clear that they are not going to keep a respectful distance with TWiT.
- Jason Miller
You have to rise above the emotion and make a business decision. How much will it cost you to defend versus how much will you gain? Simple cost/benefit. My guess is that this fight will cause you to lose focus on your work, be a financial hardship as you go up against a company with VC backing, and all for the "possibility" that you will win and maybe get some compensation from Twitter....
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- Tom Sheppard
I thought twitvid.com was the new video netcasts Leo has been talking about, boy was I surprised!
- Daniel Rinaman
It has to be defended.Giving up and letting another company take your brand, no matter how big the company or personal feelings toward the owner, can not be an option. You built your brand and should defend it.
- David Z
Defend it Leo!
- Gunny doesn't side-hug™
You need to defend it Leo. You had the trademark first.
- imperator3733
How about a name like LeoCast... No confusion there.
- Rustic Thoughts
Agree don't let the big dog scare you..you have the law on your side
- Randy Pollock
It's YOUR mark Leo and you have worked hard to make it as well-known as it is. Defend what's yours!!
- Jim Connolly
Twitter will be virtually gone like Classmates and MySpace in a few years... Keep the name!
- Rick Harvey
Leo: As others have said, you can initiate legal action, but I doubt you'd win. TWiT is based upon an acronym (This Week in Tech). Twitter is not an acronym, it's a word unto itself. Twitter doesn't use the term "twit" by itself; the word is always used fully (though some people snidely call Twitter users "twits"). Until you launched a microblogging area on your site, TWiT and Twitter...
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- Dwight Silverman
yes defend your trademark
- Alfonso alatorre
Add to all this another twist. While TWiT is trademarked, twit is a common language word which can't be trademarked. That adds a dash of ambiguity to the whole issue.
- Ken Camp
Twit came before Twitter I think you should defend it. it is dumb anyways Twit and Twitter is not even the same word, it would be like CocaCola suing Coconut because of COC
- URLREVIEWS
Twitter is going to be a realty show based on stalking celebrities. It wont last more than one season.
- Rustic Thoughts
I say let it roll. Your a 'big guy' in your own field, but Twitter is bigger. Play off of them. You could be bigger. Look at all the petty stuff that Microsoft did..and where did it get them? Bad Press.
- Gene
To keep your trademark you must defend it if it's being violated.
- CT Raider
I think Twitter has the brand and you don't right now. Maybe Twitter should buy it from you or you should collaborate with twitter to monetize and add your TWiT to twitter
- Amit 'zyaada' Mittal
I certainly think you should defend your trademark, isn't that why you registered?
- dcale1965
I checked Twitter's own site and it looks like Twitter launched March 1, 2006. TWiT was around well before then. Being in tech, I find it hard to believe they hadn't heard of him. It was a big podcast even then. I knew of TWiT well before Twitter. This may seem like a dumb issue to some, but a lot of people I recommended the podcast to now ask me if "it's a Twitter thing."
- JeffreyVC
Ev told me that when they were considering names for Twitter they knew about TWiT and decided it didn't matter. In their defense, they had no idea what or how big Twitter was to become. We talked about trademark early on and both agreed there was no conflict _as long as we were in different spaces_. And therein lies the rub.
- Leo Laporte
Apple Computer and Apple records recently went through this -- what was the outcome there?
- Brian Sullivan
I thought it wasn't clear infringement when Twitter came out but now that there is Twit video the infringement is very clear. I would defend.
- Robert Scoble
Lawyers are expensive. Legal fights are draining. You could spend the rest of your professional life fighting this battle. I don't know what's been going on in the back channel, and you probably shouldn't say publicly, but if you haven't tried approaching the Twitter board members privately, you might want to. Lay out the facts carefully, and if you're open to a settlement, say roughly...
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- Dave Winer
Legally, if you do not actively defend your trademark in every infringement then you will have difficulty *EVER* defending it. This isn't an anti-Twitter thing, just a simple business practice, Leo.
- Kevin Donahue
"Clear Infringement". How exactly? It's a lose/lose for Twitter if they choose to encroach or even litigate.
- Adi
Yeah but Leo added video later. And now Twitter is adding video. The real issue is that there is no clear separation between a radio/video network and a social microblogging site these days. And our trademarking system is so ridiculous that these kinds of conflicts go completely unnoticed all the time.
- JeffreyVC
I'd say it's time to either re-brand TWiT or defend it. Deferring the decision and just living with the confusion and ambiguity is no longer an option.
- Ken Sheppardson
Defend your trademark
- Lars Clausen
Defend your brand Leo.The World Wide Fund for Nature took on the WWF and made them change their name to WWE. If they can do it, so can you.
- Bryan Lee
The big problem with defending it... beyond the unfortunate fact that it's a drain on resources that could be better spent elsewhere... is it's not clear how you'd win. They're not going to change their name. They'll forever be Twitter. Is it sufficient to somehow "ban" them from ever doing anything in video? Enforcing that in perpetuity's would only raise your blood pressure.
- Ken Sheppardson
I would take the emotion out of the equation -- find out what it would cost to defend and determine what it is worth to have exclusive/non-exclusive use (maybe some subjectivity here) and make the decision using that information.
- Brian Sullivan
I say defend it but only so much as to bring more media attention to your brand... once you have the media's attention you can use that to change the brand identity if you so choose. Your followers myself included will stay fans no matter what you call your brand, but I think you have an opportunity to expand and use twitter as a means of gaining media attention!
- Nathan McClain
If you don't do this you wont have a leg to stand on in the future when you need to really protect it. I can piss all over your trademark if you do not defend it.
- David Lloyd
Leo: in a trademark fight what is the ROI? I am sure it will be very expensive and not sure you will get much in return but if you forced Twitter to change its name I am sure they would quickly settle with you.
- Robert Scoble
I still think Twitter will be as irrelevant as MySpace in 2 years, but it's your brand to protect.
- Mike Lewis
Ideal Outcome: A $$$ settlement sufficient to comfortably fund the rebranding of TWiT.
- Ken Sheppardson
Robert makes a very good point. This could get messy and expensive, although it seems like those guys are VERY hard to work/interact with.
- Brian Daniel Eisenberg
while bryan lee makes a good point, their battles took a long time to resolve. but, don't let this deter you. i would suggest you defend it. if anything, i see you have a strong case and whatever happens can be in your favour. it's possible twitter can concede in infringing in your trademark and may be even consider licensing through the course of the battle. but be very, very patient for any outcome to happen.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Dave: wrong. Leo is who got me on Twitter. His marks were more popular and predated Twitter's.
- Robert Scoble
Leo got me into twitter too!
- Jim Connolly
I think Leo has a good chance at wining his case since he did register the copyright first. Twitter is still not a money making business. They are living off of VC money. They will probably not have the funds to mount a case since their money will be tied up with keeping twitter afloat. Am I right?
- Bryan Lee
Leo also got me on Twitter shortly after they went public.
- Mike Bracco
regarding AMF, Inc. v. Sleekcraft Boats, 599 F.2d 341 (9th Cir. 1979) the battle was very different. one of the things found was that the company had an 'infinity' of other brands to choose. it's a very different situation in detail, although it looks comparable at face value.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Or just have them become a premium sponsor. There used to be so much twitter talk before, I think they really should be owing you some gratitude for the traffic.
- Adi
As part of any settlement, you should demand Ev and Biz concede that individual Twitter entries are "Tweets", as embarrassed as they seem to be by that. They're net "twits" or "twitters"... they're "tweets".
- Ken Sheppardson
i'm sure something can be negotiated with twitter. a lawsuit in this case would show you're just defending your trademark because they are encroaching in your territory. you're not taking them on what they are known to do, their core competency. rather, it's stepping into your own grounds.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
not doing anything on purpose may weaken your trademark. many court cases also end up not going through the entire ordeal.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Yep, I agree the day has come where it's either fight or flight. And I don't mean that quite the way it sounds. :-/
- Ken Sheppardson
Defend!!!!
- Mark Williamson
from BuddyFeed
I don't think you have much choice. Either you defend it or you lose it.
- Pascal Sijen
dave johnson: true, there's always a degree of uncertainty; but that doesn't mean giving up in defending one's investment in a trademark. it can be argued pragmatically and it's to the point where leo must defend his territory upon which twitter is encroaching. aye.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
I'm not sure you can win, are we aren't even sure what they're going to call it yet. If it ends up being Twitter.TV you have no chance to beat them.
- DarknessFalls
There is even a shortening service called: http://twitpwr.com/ - The brand must be defended.
- David Z
Leo: You must defend it or lose it. They need to know you also have the muscle behind you. I have the attorney that did all the trademark work for Terminator 1-4, Rambo, old timer who knows every angle. I have him on retainer and would love to join your cause. I can arrange a chat with him at no cost, then you can decide to move ahead, or if the cost seems to steep, I would be interested in partnering with you on the trademark. Fight on Leo! Let me know if you want to chat Thx Chad
- Chad Harris
Reading this I'm also thinking, if you move forward as some here suggest, be ready to go after Twitpic.com and every other Twit* variation to aggressively defend everywhere or lose steam on all fronts. Is that a good identity move? This is not a simple question to consider when everything is taken into account.
- Ken Camp
I'm of the opinion that twitter's initial success back in 2006 and 2007 was in part due to piggybacking on the brand name recognition that Leo had built over the years prior.
- Chris Heath
I think defending it is what you must do, but perhaps take a different look at it all together and suggest some kind of mutual PR blitz leading into a partnership or new brand identity for TWiT. Just don't call it SyFy!
- Aaron T. Harvey
The question here is would a "Reasonable person" confuse the two? I would like to think I am a reasonable person (even though I can't spell) and I would not be confused in the least. I love the Twit network and watch several hours a week, but I don't see the issue.
- Rob
I agree that since Leo has been a twitter evangelist all these years, they should be able to strike an accord somehow. Maybe even partnering up on the whole Twitter TV Show since Leo has the video presence online.
- Bryan Lee
You have to defend now, or 5 years from now you'll have a weaker case against the twitty podcast network.
- Robert Hafer
Rob, the question isn't whether or not you or I would confuse the two, but do the people who watch Oprah and maybe catch Leo on The Tech Guy confuse them...and they do.
- Aaron T. Harvey
Aaron...Do you really think they would. Am I that out of touch with the "Normal People"? If that is the case then I guess I would have to conseed that to be an issue. But I am still not quite convenced.
- Rob
Funny - I would enjoy the extra publicity - You have a loyal set of listeners - and none of us are confused. If people end up on your site -cause they are looking for twitter, maybe they will take a listen. People who are looking for podcasts on technology though i doubt will find twitter in a search.
- Laurence Gold
Rob, I've seen it happen, even with people "in the know". People think that TWiT is somehow connected with Twitter because of the name. It's a mistake that, while not happening with everyone--and maybe not even the majority--can end up costing Leo and co. money.
- Aaron T. Harvey
Protect what you worked hard to build
- Shawn Hickman
Had Apple been named "TWiT," you can be assured there would be no talk of a TwitterTV...
- Christopher A Carr
Of course you should perfect TWIT for media and tech. You have the prior art, use. It's an obvious move for Twitter to exploit their 'brand' into media. You must pursue Leo. You have been a crusader for fair-use, but there are times (like this example) where fairness requires accountability.
- michael sean wright
The commenter who noted that if you do not enforce your rights they may be weakened is generally correct. I suggest seeking an agreement that is mutually beneficial and recognizes your rights in the TWiT(R) trademark.
- erik pelton
The problem with defending your trademark is the public backlash it can generate. Think O'Reilly and Web 2.0 or Apple and Profit Pod. But in this case, if you are indeed convinced that there is some infringement of TWiT by Twitter, I think you'd be doing us all a favor if you could somehow head off their plans for a celebrity-stalking TV show.
- Dave
The problem is not really twitter, or a twitter video show, but all the people who says they just sent a twit. Also all the small companies with twit in their name, who are in the video/audio area. Twit radio, twitvid.io etc etc. I see no problem in protecting the brand. However it ends out you'll get a lot of publicity.
- Anton Tanderup
Leo, this could be an opportunity for you to come out ahead. Yes it's an awkward situation and yes you could fight this on legal grounds, but there's no win for you there. Here's a way for you to win. Today your brand is a split brand--split between "Leo LaPorte" and "TWIT." You can win by focusing more on building the Leo LaPorte part of the brand. "Leo LaPorte" doesn't equal TWIT, yr...
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- Michael Metz
man you gotta defend your name and trademark,whats next a twitter podcast network?
- cliff whitefoot
I think Ken Sheppardson sums it up nicely. I don't think you even need to retain a lawyer to start with the cease and desist letters, then see if they are amenable to a settlement, partnership or other remedy. It doesn't have to, and hopefully won't ever, come to a legal battle. However, it's clear enough that unless Leo hands them his mark and re-brands on his own dime, he must defend...
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- Richard pancakhaus Walker
Its funny... in a way you helped make twitter the juggernaut it is today.... all the free advertisement that you have given them over the years....LOL.. Maybe they should return the favor
- Nathan McClain
Hasn't Leo said he wants to add a second host to the network? Wouldn't it also confuse viewers if they were watching the Leo Laporte Network and the show was hosted by someone not named Leo?
- Norm Corriveau
Leo, some other people have made good points, if you're going after Twitter your also going to have to go after the other sites with Twit in the name: Twitpic, Twitpwr and Twiteverything or your case will be thrown out.
- DarknessFalls
DarknessFalls: he'd only have to do that if they all launched TV shows too.
- Martin Bryant
darknessfalls, you're not getting the scope. it's about leo's twit trademark on video and what twitter plans to do that's associated with it.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
If you haven't done so already, explore the Apple case, both the legal and business issues that Apple Corps encountered. And if you DON'T defend your trademark, what's Plan B? Remember that Twitter (or its future owners) may someday sue YOU.
- John E. Bredehoft
from fftogo
Leo, take your mark and make them all change names. Is this Ustream show even official Twitter? it looks pretty lame, like they just used the word, visual branding like twitter.com. http://www.ustream.tv/channel...
- rob friedman
Don't sue unless you can find a business case and a lawyer to take the case on contingency with enough potential gain that it all wouldn't have been a big waste of time for a couple hundred dollars. But I am not a lawyer (IANAL). In fact, the grown up thing for twitter to do would be to link to you with an explanation that they aren't you and visa versa.
- Eric Standlee
Defend yourself, Leo.
- Devin Baines
Defend your trademark. Why else would you have filed it in the first place?
- phil baumann
The best solution would be for Leo to produce the official Twitter show as part of the TWiT network.
- Martin Bryant
The brand is big because of Leo yes, but having the TWiT brand is important. There are shows on the network in which Leo is not in.
- Anton Tanderup
Whats the question? TWiT is yours Leo, you need to protect it, the TWiT Army is not only at your back but with 60% of new Twitter accounts not coming back, all you have to do is hold out and wait on it to fold anyways.
- Bush Williams
Anton, the band is TWiT - twit.tv? - TWiT netcast network... that is the brand...
- Chris Heath
It is totally unfair, but I want to see all of your focus and money going towards content, not legal actions. You will be endlessly sending out C&Ds or worse as long as Twitter is popular. That said, I do think you should squeeze some money out of Ev in order to cede the brand.
- invariant - farewell FF
Twitter offers more value to me than TWiT ever could. Sorry Leo, but this just seems like sour grapes.
- Shannon
Leo: You should do a This Week in Law on this btw.
- Anton Tanderup
Shannon - how much value you get from either brand is not what is at question here.
- Chris Heath
I'm not sure if this was already mentioned in the nearly 150 comments here, but Leo's link doesn't work. Here's a better link that I hope stays active: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin...
- Eric Geller
+1 to chris' comment.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
You have a "defend or lose" obligation under trademark law. The TWiT brand has significant value, both from a revenue perspective and and the potential cost of re-branding al your sites, moving twit.tv etc., if you lose it. Protect the mark that secures your brand. Oh yeah, on that whole "big guy" theme: Because of your stable business model vs Twitter's Twitter's evolving one, an...
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- David Lounsbury
Shannon, the post asks for advice on how to be the best caretaker of a network and its trademark - your assignment of personal value should guide your own choices, but is irrelevant to the question at hand. How can it be sour grapes if failing to act now _could_ result in losing the standing of a trademark/brand which preceded those of other players who _may_ be crossing the line to the point of infringement.
- Micah Wittman
TWiT offers more value to me than Twitter ever could. Sorry Shannon, but this just seems like sour grapes.
- invariant - farewell FF
What a conundrum. I can't speak much to any legal considerations. But, on an emotional level, I would imagine that not defending and potentially losing the name must feel like smiling politely as an immigration official pins you with a random Anglicized name because your real, "ethnic" name is confusing to the masses in the new world, and making a fuss is to gamble the welfare of your...
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- Micah Wittman
@Ken Camp: Isn't twitter also a common english word which can't be trademarked? EDIT: Or Windows, for that matter?
- invariant - farewell FF
invariant -- you mean like Apple?
- Brian Sullivan
word, err, I mean Microsoft Word
- Micah Wittman
I think your best brand is "Leo Leporte". TWiT is just where Leos at.
- Matthew Snape
So I think we've established that common English words can be trademarked. So what's the criteria? Has to be a noun?
- invariant - farewell FF
of related note, i realise that twitter is indirectly facilitating twit offshoots upon registration. this is how: registering anything with 'twitter' in the username is *banned*. so, for a user already having their heart set on using twitter as part of their 'brand' might think of using 'twit' instead. this opens up a new can of worms figuring out who is using the twit name and doing video. like how they are doing now with 'twiter', they can stop it at registration to avoid further confusion.
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
I say defend it. If they are doing a TV show, they're definitely stepping on your toes. Nevermind that I can't imagine their show would be any good, but that's a different story... :)
- Jan Ole Peek
What about TwiTips? If that isn't entertainment then what is? But seriously I own several trademarks myself and I know if you don't take action then you could lose the Tmark. You have a conundrum because Twitter is so popular. So I would recommend seeking a compromise so that you won't lose your mark and appear like the bad guy with the public. Perhaps a clearer definition of the terms...
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- BLOGBloke
Other than I think he needs to see a surgeon to fix that lean to the left he has,... I love the guy and have been listening to him for about 15...16...dang probabaly close to 18 years about tech news I love the guy. And to top it off! He knows what he is talking about!! Leo makes am radio worth a listen on the weekends!
- John Apostoli
TWiT is a network providing audio and video broadcast covering issues related to the tech field. Twitter is a social network used to connect people using the basic SMS tools. While people *may* confuse the issue by referring to Twitter messages as "twits, there is no evidence that Twitter has used or endorsed the term. Unless & until Twitter (as a company) starts using the term "Twit"...
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- David J. Garcia
I've said this privately, but I guess I will say it publicly.Defend your mark. It is your livelihood. There WILL be confusion if it gets to TV, where people are not tech savvy and have no idea who you are
- Francine Hardaway
Yes, it may be expensive, and yes, these fights are draining, Dave, but until the laws are changed (an entirely different question), Leo could lose part of his livelihood through the confusion, especially since he has advertisers who would probably want him to defend. Everything in the universe doesn't happen in Silicon Valley:-)
- Francine Hardaway
David - until now that has been the case, but Twitter is planning on doing a TV show (which would definitely be infringement), which is why this debate is happening.
- imperator3733
I would certainly want you to defend it but i don't think its gonna be possible for two reasons. First Twitter is a bigger, more powerful and certainly more loved brand with more money. and you were first to infringe the unofficial agreement by hosting Twit Army. in that perspective you might not be able to defend it legally.besides the audience you've built ain't gonna be affected by what twitter does.So consult a legal advisor & take best course of action. Best of Luck
- Abhishek
I think if you approach it in good faith--initially without lawyers--you have a very good chance to work something out. Ev seems to be a very reasonable guy. Perhaps it's best to draft a strategy with counsel before any discussions though. What's really in your favor(perhaps legally, perhaps not) is that Twitter can't deny how your support and promotion for it was incendiary to the...
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- Gregg Scott
http://www.googlefight.net/... - ouch
- Nate
What's the point of a googlefight here Nate?
- Chris Heath
Sorry but the Google fight site is loaded with pop-ups that even show through popup blocker.
- Usman Bashir
Usman, I didn't get any popups (using chrome on winxp) but still it's a hideous site
- Chris Heath
Twitter has a lot of investment, but I'm not sure all of that is liquid money. You may be even in the money spent defending your Trademark. I say go for it. Do it now though if you do.
- Jesse Stay
Leo must Defend!
- Jim Mahon
If it was me, I'd defend it. While Twitter is still worth something! Talk to a lawyer first and see if you have a valid case.
- John Frazer
You must defend.
- Will Bostwick
I can't believe how long this thread has gotten!
- Bryan Lee
Seems like you are getting a lot of FREE promotion as a result of twitter. My bigger concern would be not having the twit.com URL to go with your brand name. That's a big issue!
- Craig Shipp
@Craig, twit.com was registered in 1997, and it's parked.
- rob friedman
Twit is your trademark for the company you have built up. It seems rather unfair that they would brand their idea so similar. I would defend it and all the hard work you have done.
- Matthew Davis
Defend it Leo. Things may get ugly, but sometimes they just gotta.
- David Chartier
from BuddyFeed
Fight for you trademark! Especially since they knew of your prior use and now they are doing a TV show which they should know is stepping on your trademark.
- russellcoleman
Defend, owning Twitter may not be useful for you yourself, but you could make a profit off of it if you were to sell it. Go for it Leo!
- Zachary TG
What Kyle said!!
- jcunwired
Leo, FriendFeed community, let's get practical here - Twitter has more resources and probably a decent case defending against what you could file. It would be a blow to your image, to TWiT's image, and be bad press overall. You have a far greater chance of losing credibility than gaining trademark protection. You need to look into other strategies.
- Ben Parr
There is no such thing as bad Press
- Jesse Stay
from email
I would thin kthat the thing to do is to gently but firmly convince them that they are infringing on your brand, that litigation would be damaging to both of you, losing community goodwill over the fight, and that it would be simpler, faster, and cheaper for both entities if they were to pay for your rebranding effort. Be prepared to present them with the estimated costs of litigation,...
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- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Defend your Trademark. It's the responsible thing to do as a buisness.
- Donald Forth
Defend your trademark
- Russ Jackson
what Kyle & guruvan said. Does anyone else think we need threaded comments for conversations like this right here?
- Richard pancakhaus Walker
I'd defend the TWiT trademark.
- Jonathan Bloom
I'm not as thunk as you drink I am
- David Lloyd
Also there is this guy who has a "beef" with twitter http://twitter.co.uk/
- rob friedman
@rob friedman - That guy says Twitter doesn't require you to validate your email address. Wow, that's ripe for abuse!
- invariant - farewell FF
Defend.
- Tony Meyer
Talk to a lawyer.
- Zian Choy
More than a hundred comments, the community is twitting even on friendfeed. A legal action would be very difficult. You should first define your objective in doing so. Do you really want to protect your brand or settle for a lucrative compensation? Even if you get some sort of legal protection limiting Twitter to use or endorse the word "twit" to some extent, people will still be...
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- Cem ARGUN
Cem: I'm afraid I don't understand that first sentence of yours. Can you explain?
- Christopher A Carr
It's only infringement if trademark string parser is case insensitive TWiT® != Twit®
- KyleHase
Prior art (and obligatory MP reference) http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Jay Cuthrell
Maybe a dead issue? At least as far as the potential fight w/ Twitter, Inc. Mashable says Twitter responds no official Twitter TV show http://mashable.com/2009...
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
And now for something completely different... watch the meetup room if interested in seeing Spamalot in SF as a group...
- Richard pancakhaus Walker
I would say defend it. Of course, I'm just a Twit.tv fan and not a lawyer.
- Joey Gibson
'all this nonsense'?? wtf is that supposed to mean?
- Chris Heath
Just leave it alone until they manage to make some real money off it, then litigate. That's how it's done you know.
- Will Higgins™
Leo, I am a long time fan and constant listener to all of you work. You are a more than fair and wholly honorable man. You have had TWIT long before I ever heard of a twitter. Go with your heart Leo. I am behind you. I understand you would impede progress of any positive kind. But a cease and desist letter. Seems harsh. I think you have a winner. Let them buy the TM. Power to the people. Go Leo, you deserve it. You do only good. You are one of a kind! RodneO
- RODNEY OLIVER
PC Easy: I don't think Leo's making a big stink. The idea that twitter would get into the tv/video business would be a big thing since they have a verbal agreement with Leo not to get into that business. This may be all for nothing, since the mashable article guruvan linked above states that twitter will not be doing a show. Leo was doing the best first step (imho) in asking the community for guidance in the event that the original reporting was correct (which it does not appear to be now). So moot point
- Chris Heath
I think if I was you Leo I would try to license rights to them and get some mula out of it. Remember "Leo Laporte" goes a lot farther than TWIT does and most importantly ever will.
- Eric VM
there's a current backlash on twitter trending topics right now w/ hashtag #notwittertv. the examiner has an unfavorable article here: http://www.examiner.com/x-264-C... even alyssa milano is against it: http://twitter.com/Alyssa_...
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Its going to suck and bomb... guaranteed.
- Rustic Thoughts
Maybe just sell it to them Leo for a gazillion dollars and retire. Keep the leaches out of it..meaning the lawyers. What the heck, Leo you are great at trend setting, you practically put twitter on the map. They owe you something.for all the pub you have given them since their inception.
- John Apostoli
Defend. There's really no reasonable alternative.
- Jason Clarke
You gotta defend it Leo. What's the point of trademarking in the first place.
- Joel Lovato
You have to defend what is legally yours.
- Michael Hansel
Twitter Responds: There is No Official Twitter TV Show- Mashable (May 25th, 2009 | by Pete Cashmore) -- http://mashable.com/2009... -- There is no official Twitter TV show—although if there were it would be fun to cast! In dealing with networks and production companies we sometimes have simple agreements. Regarding the Reveille and Brillstein project reported today,...
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- Chris Loft
Leo, suggest you go "open source co-branding" on this. Monetize your "twit" brand through creative brand licensing with emerging entertainment and multimedia microblogging companies that want to ride the "twitter" bandwagon. I can see creative corporate and individual co-brands like, TwitSounds, TwitFilms, TwitMedia, TwitCats, TwitBitch, TwitMechanic, etc...
- Mike Schmidt
If I hear the word "monetize" one more time, my eardrums will begin bleeding. That is all.
- wyclif
I don't want to over simplify this but if Twitter do branch into video and even streaming TV, surely the content would have to be substantially different to what TWiT already provides, otherwise they are at risk of spoiling their brand identity. Stay strong and true to the Tech news content and let Twitter, well do what ever they may do. Personally, I think it would be a mistake for them to go down this road. Time may be better spent further improving the existing service.
- Kevin J Hatton
the mashable news is taken directly from the twitter blog: http://blog.twitter.com
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Maybe it's a good time to Re-Brand. Twit has unfortunate connotations in some areas of the English speaking world. On this side of the pond a twit is an idiot. Until I became aware of Leo I gave TWiT a very wide berth. Branded simply as This Week in Tech it would have got my positive attention a whole lot sooner. Time to move onward and upward.
- Gilbert Harding
This was copied and pasted but sums it up so well : Of course, there's a larger long-term problem because of the way that Twitter has weakened _your_ brand. It might be less expensive (and a better use of your time) to rebrand TWiT into something that strengthens your brand and moves it away from Twitter; avoiding any future problems (and there will be future problems). You can't fight Oprah. - Professor Messer
- Fragtastic
A very worthy point - "I think that once you see the Twitter television show, you'll probably want to distance yourself as far away as possible. - Professor Messer"
- Fragtastic
I'll admit to being a little slow on the uptake to both TWiT and twitter and it took me some time to figure out that they were different things. I was listening to TWiT before I found twitter, and at first I wondered if I was mixing the names up in my head. I think there is real potential for confusion between the two names. Good luck in whatever you decide to do, Leo.
- Rick Reynolds
You could ride the wave of popularity Twitter is experiencing by allowing that confusion to blossom. Perhaps more people could start listening and watching your netcasts *because* of that confusion?
- David Hepworth
You need to defend your brand, however since you know the guys at Twitter maybe you can come to some sort of agreement that is the best interest of both TWiT and Twitter.
- Jim Lavin
I say defend the brand. I fully believe Leo and TWiT will outlive Twitter. It would be a shame to surrender the brand only to see it disappear in 1-2 years.
- Martin Johnson
I think you should definitely defend it. Whatever it will be called, Twitter-TV will make a big splash and Twit, being less mainstream than Oprah, won't even make a dent. And if they want your trademark, they should pay for it.
- Vincent van Wylick
I say defend it, if you don't the that opens the door to other infringements.
- Hunter
since you clearly took your name from This Week in Baseball, which deputed in 1977, should MLB defend their trademark with you?
- glenn simmons
Defend it! definitely, the trademark is rightfully yours and you need to hold on to it...I like twitter, but I like TWiT even more...
- Raymond
Glenn, you are wrong. There are many registered trademarks that contain "this week in"
- russellcoleman
See what you have started Leo? Twitter TV is not a patch on what you do. Now if it was professionally done, with great audio then maybe,
- Kevin J Hatton
Dealing with a similar issue (though not as big as dealing with Twitter). I say throw out a warning shot to protect your brand. Worst case they ignore you and you have to spend gobs of money to defend it. Best case they make you a $$ offer.
- Brian Niles
from Nambu
russellcoleman, exactly so why is Leo crying about twitter
- glenn simmons
Glenn, because "Twit" is Leo's trademark in the area of entertainment in the nature of visual and audio performances, and musical, variety, news and comedy shows.
- russellcoleman
Defend it!
- Kiran Patchigolla
Sorry Leo, does that mean I can't call people Twitts? Does it mean no one in a television or audio show can use the word twitt? I mean Twitter...TWIT...they have 3 more letters and their brand is based on communication not entertainment. Give up the ghost against Twitter by now dude. IF they were doing what you were doing MAYBE but what you are saying is noone can use the letters T W I or T .... don't become the next Monster.
- Sidney
Defend. No retreat. No surrender.
- Barry Biddlecomb
from twhirl
Sidney, it means they can't use twit as part of their brand if they go into the areas Leo's trademark covers. We are talking about branding here.
- russellcoleman
Again, Twitter is a communication company looking to capitalize on providing television content the ability to have immediate interactive component...Nothing that TWIT does...so no infringement. Leo has always had the axe to grind with Twitter...if he was going to do something he should have done it immediately...
- Sidney
My understanding is that Twitter is going to have a TV show and that may infringe. My point above was to the suggestion that no one could say the word twit.
- russellcoleman
@Christopher Carr, I meant that twitting has become a generic expression going far beyond Twitter. Here on friendfeed we are twitting, an these lines are in fact twits... :)
- Cem ARGUN
As an anecdote, until now I thought TWiT was something twitter related, and I basically ignored it for that reason. I have learned over time that I'm often not a good representative of anything, but there was certainly brand confusion in my case.
- Robin Barooah
Robin: You're not alone. I thought TWiT was Twitter-related too :(
- Tech Introvert
At first, yep, I thought Twit spawned Twitter. But in a few nanoseconds, I knew otherwise. But in the mind of 'ordinary' (horrible term, sorry) user coming at Twit from Twitter surely they'll get the idea. But Twitter is SO pervasive, I'm glad that you've decided to take advice. I know nothing, but I feel you should protect your brand. Don't change your name. Change the game. On another tack, you checked out http://audioboo.fm ?
- John C Wesley Barker
"Again, Twitter is a communication company looking to capitalize on providing television content the ability to have immediate interactive component." - Sidney That is exactly what Leo's doing
- Anton Tanderup
news of twitter tv just hit the local abc news. they mentioned there's already direct opposition by celebrities ashton & demi who (according to their tweets) will quit twitter if this reality show sees the light of day (paraphrasing). this could mean -as they say & putting it lightly- 'my enemy's enemy is my friend?' odd yet amusing opposition from the hollywood. however, no mentions of twit and leo. :-\
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Twitter can look to capitalize on providing television content the ability to have immediate interactive component all they want. But I don't think they should do it in a way that can cause any confusion between them and Leo's network.
- russellcoleman
Sorry the only confusion people have had is what Leo has brought to the table himself. He should have stepped up long ago if he felt Twitter was going to create confusion and admittably it has and TWIT and Twitter don't even cross streams. I know for one if Leo wastes his money on litigation I for will be disappointed and believe it will harm the TWIT brand.
- Sidney
i know this thread is too long to read for many. re-quoting what leo said here for those who keep saying he should have stepped up long ago: "Ev told me that when they were considering names for Twitter they knew about TWiT and decided it didn't matter. In their defense, they had no idea what or how big Twitter was to become. We talked about trademark early on and both agreed there was no conflict _as long as we were in different spaces_. And therein lies the rub. - Leo Laporte"
- sɹǝɥʇɐǝɟʞɔɐןq
Very tough choice. I think these comments provide you with a fairly good sample of public opinion from people in tech, but it would be interesting to get input from the rest of the world on Twitter who have never heard of TWiT. It certainly won't cost much to send in a warning shot so they take notice and to demonstrate defense of your TM, but I would follow that up with a request to...
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- Phil Ashman
Give it up Leo ... You may win the battle ,, but you wont win the War IMHO ,, Unless you have deeper pockets than Twitter ... is your time/money worth fighting over it ? Only *you* can answer that!
- johnpiercy
This twitter thing is just a flash in the pan, you can wait them out ;-)
- Wolfman-K
If he fights and loses, at least he defended it, which is required to keep it. If Leo does nothing, he could lose it.
- Bwana ☠
How do people feel about Monster Cable suing companies that use the word Monster in their name? I feel the same here...except that Twitter just happens to have the same four LETTERS as Twit, as the beginning. They arent using Twit as a standalone word. C'mon.
- Andru Edwards
The only justification I can see in Leo going after Twitter is so that he can at least show he is defending his TM so he doesn't lose it as Bwana said...otherwise I think it is a losing game that will be a waste of resources that TWIT could utilize in other productive pursuits.
- Sidney
The Monster Cable example doesn't really work. They were suing companies that were in different spaces. Now with Twitter doing a TV show, that is in the same space as TWIT and Leo has the trademark for it.
- Mike Child
Everyone should read this: http://blog.twitter.com/2009... It has been linked a few times in this discussion up above, but bears linking again based on recent comments - From what I can tell, it doesn't look like twitter will have a tv show - so this whole point is moot - leo may have to defend his trademark against these 'other' shows if they use the word twit in their name, but i don't think they will
- Chris Heath
Leo -This is a battle that will be HELL. Yet, it is critical you fight it. I had a couple situations very much like it in telecommunications late '80s early '90s. I should have fought. Give them a run for their money. It will cost you $$ and resources. But, with Twitter's new direction - man - you're a journalist at heart... You already know - you've got to fight for your right!
- Arleen Boyd
Man this is a tough position to be in. Honestly, I can't see TWiT or Twitter changing brands/names. However, Leo, you were first and you have the trademark to back it up. I say defend it!
- Doug Jones
Biz responds to the Twitter TV show on the blog: http://blog.twitter.com/2009...
- Doug Jones
not reading the thread befire i comment... but seems to me that TWITTER does not equal TWIT. what else is their to know?
- sull
Leo, I think the law is very clear, if you don't defend your trademark you may lose it.
- David Angel
from twhirl
Leo a firestorm is brewing over twitter tv http://www.nydailynews.com/tech_gu...
- dday
Make them pay you a million in cold hard cash for the TWIT name and change your name to TWIG - This Week In Goodness :-)
- Richard Bitting
When you see such services as "TwitThat" (http://twitthat.com/), with that spelling of "tweet", there is an incredible amount of confusion waiting to happen !
- arnaudt
arnaudt, good point. and again... TWiT does NOT = twitter - so leo has no case. twitter themselves dont use 'twit' in any way. they barely if at all use 'tweet' in any way. they began as 'twtr' in like 2006. twitter is NOT an abbreviation for anything as TWiT is. twitter is not solely behind producing an entertainment property.. they are granting rights to others to do so and in some...
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- sull
sull, TWIT does NOT have to = twitter for Leo to have a case. People just have to be confused enough to adversely impact, or even potentially impact, Leo's business.
- Chris Gardner
Chris, i think it does for him to have a 'good' case. You cannot prevent Twitter from letting media entities use twitter as part or their 'shows', even if twitter as some levell of partnership. In the end, it will cost Leo money to lose a trademark case. Proving, for example, that an MTV show tentatively named 'what you're watching' that uses twitter and facebook etc as fundemental components for audience interaction has any negative effect to the TWiT podcast.
- sull
sull, there just needs to be a likelihood of confusion. The Court there announced eight specific elements to measure likelihood of confusion: Strength of the mark - Proximity of the goods - Similarity of the marks - Evidence of actual confusion - Marketing channels used - Type of goods and the degree of care likely to be exercised by the purchaser - Defendant's intent in selecting the mark - Likelihood of expansion of the product lines
- Chris Gardner
Oh, and TWiT is not just a podcast. It is a live streaming net video network. There are on and off talks to take to cable also.
- Chris Gardner
Chris, thanks for pointing those elements of liklihood. Still, i think that even for the case to have a leg to stand on, twitter would need to have a 'show' specifically named in a way that may cause confusion. That has not happened. Trying to prevent the word 'twitter' from being used at all in marketing and branding via "visual and audio performances" because of the TWiT trademark seems a stretch and will prob result in negative publicity for Leo. Anyway, maybe we'll see. Interesting.
- sull
sull, agreed interesting. Also, this will probably not go anywhere near the courts. Ev Williams and Leo know each other and get along (not many in the industry that Leo does not get along with). They will work things out.
- Chris Gardner
For those who are unaware, people have to take action to protect their brands otherwise they lose their trademark. My suggestions and observations: 1. Look for win-win 2. It all seems moot anyway http://blog.twitter.com/2009... tho this is a fascinating thread 3. If twitter did ever go ahead with this it would be a fairly simple compromise for them to...
more...
- Isha (Marysia)
You need to defend it. I don't know that you'll stop twitter from launching their show but you have to fight it to keep your trademark valid. You for sure need to go after twitvid.com and twitvideo.com!
- The Griff
Defend the trademark. It could make the difference on winning a future trademark case with another company.
- David Ebaugh
Defend it. It was your long before Twitter was even around. Like someone else said what is the point of calling your network that if as soon as a bigger fish comes along you cave. Don't give in to the man Leo!
- Mr. Thomas
Leo. I am not a lawyer and don't play one on the Internet. It sounds like you have no real case against Twitter, but the producers of the rumored tv show are a different story. Even then, it depends on what they are doing with the subject matter. Is it *about* Twitter, or simply about people who use Twitter? Will they ever use the term, "twit" in the show? It certainly couldn't hurt to...
more...
- Jake Overton
While this is getting a lot of buzz now, it didn't even occur to me till it was posted. I think both have built their brands, both have similar sounding names but are different. Isn't TWiT an acronym? I would be more concerned with TWiB (This week in Baseball) going after Leo if he goes on TV as his show title is clearly a play on theirs, and not Leo being concerned about Twitter... ;) Either way Leo, you got some free publicity for your program/site out of this.
- mike wood
Let's not forget that use of anything in an editorial context is considered fair use.
- Ryan Brodkin
I also feel that you have an opportunity for even more publicity if you can work the TWiT shows into the TV show, joining them rather than fighting them. You will get publicity either way, but there seems to be a high road and a low road (or perception thereof). Good luck and keep up the great shows.
- Jake Overton
Leo fight them.
- johnny
we neec to fight for TWIT
- Richard Thomson
So far I don't think there is a conflict with Twitter, unless there is a Twitter TV show. Although you should fight sites like http://twitvid.io . Plus if you win, you could have an awesome domain for video downloads when you want to offer them.
- Mister IQ
Apparently there's a popular twitter client app in Japan called "Twit" http://wakoopa.com/softwar... It's the first "twit" result on Google Japan and Yahoo Japan.
- KyleHase
Thomas Frazier, father of 14 children, jailed for owing more than half-million in child support - Flint News - The Latest News, Blogs, Photos & Videos – MLive.com - http://www.mlive.com/news...
mjc, Matt Griffith, ◄ani625Ξ and 6 other people liked this
"Fourteen children by 13 different women in Genesee County and more than $530,000 in unpaid child support...Before leaving the Flint area in 2002, Frazier amassed court cases for 14 children born since 1989 and has not paid any money on any of his Genesee County child support cases in at least the past six years, according to court records. Frazier, 42, portrays himself as the victim. The victim of a system that he says saddled him with debt for children he claims aren't all his and the victim of a poor upbringing that he said caused him to seek affection from older women.."
- bob
from Bookmarklet
++Mohomed 8) $500K in child support? FAIL! I'm wondering how he felt learning he was caught haha.
- ElijahBailey-Zu of FF <0,
By the way, in a system where abortion can have many faces, could someone be that 'victim' because the women in question refused aborting, if it was for example by mistake? Would the guy be forced to pay for it in the U.S.? (I suppose it's depending on the state, but still wondering)
- ElijahBailey-Zu of FF <0,
That seems ridiculous! Who could be expected to come up with that much money?
- Gabe
i keep hearing about flint in a bad context. i want a feel good story out of flint, michigan
- Rob Schonberger
Rob: I don't think there are any.
- Gabe
@Zu, I think the answer is, in general, men have no say in abortion, and no choice/right of refusal in fatherhood. It's a gender disparity, in the sense that if your 18 year old teenage daughter gets pregnant, she can choose to have an abortion, and continue on with her life, go to college, etc. If your 18 year old son is involved, your only recourse is to hopefully convince his girlfriend to abort. Legally, he's on the hook.
- Ray Cromwell
@zu and @ray, i don't think the decision to terminate a pregnancy is taken lightly. having the right to choose does not make it an easy choice for either parent. at the very least the legal system should be holding both parents financially responsible for a pregnancy, since both were involved in its conception.
- Jessie
@jessie, I'm not saying anything about the decision itself, only who has the right to make the decision. A male has no rights in this regard, as I've heard many a parent call into radio shows asking about what legal recourse they have for an 18 year old on the hook for child support, and the answer is none, other than make nice with the girl's parents. Basically, teenage boys don't get the right to choose not to be on the hook for the rest of their life because of a dumb mistake or malfunction.
- Ray Cromwell
I guess I'll let me personal views here and say that I think people should delay starting families, and that it's stupid for essentially kids to choose to keep pregnancies. It's a burden on the parents, on society, and curtails educational and career development for the young parents. My kids are 3 and 1.5 (boy/girl) so I've got a ways to go, but I'll worry for both of them when they are sexually active. just noting that my daughter will have a choice if something accidental or stupid happens, my son won't.
- Ray Cromwell
@ray, i agree with you that people should delay starting families and that young people who choose to keep a pregnancy face a difficult road with few support resources. however, i think that if pregnant females cannot chose to be "unpregnant" (not in the sense of a terminated pregnancy, more in the sense that they could roll back the clock as if the pregnancy had never happened, which isn't possible), then i don't see why that option should be extended to biological fathers.
- Jessie
That seems like a strange condition that sort of feeds into anti-abortionist notions of parenthood happening at conception. Females have a number of options, from Plan-B to Ru486, to abortion and, adoption. To say that 1 microsecond after fertilization, it's too late for the male because you can't time travel...well, it doesn't seem that there's a rational response. Especially when you equate the "penalty" of early termination vs raising a child at young age.
- Ray Cromwell
I'd add, does society really benefit if an 18 year old is forced to abandon education for child support, vs just having the state pay for child care (like in Sweden)? Imagine if your son has an accident, and the girl's parents are nutty religious types who convince her Jesus wants her to have a child, and your son can no longer accept his scholarship to MIT or Harvard. You are powerless, your son is powerless, and all of it is based on the idea that biology trumps everything.
- Ray Cromwell
@ray, you're right that it's difficult to get into a discussion of parental responsibility without addressing whether life begins at conception, an issue which should not affect the fact that both individuals are still responsible for the female's pregnant state. it's true that a female has a number of options but their accessibility depends on the state she lives in, and psychologically none of those are easy choices to make.
- Jessie
you are correct that it is difficult to raise a child at a young age, even with support resources available, and that it is an unfortunate consequence for a son to lose a scholarship due to his child support obligations. however, it is also an unfortunate consequence for a female to forgo her career/education in order to raise the child that a Harvard-bound son impregnated her with.
- Jessie
i agree with you that teens and young adults may not be ready for pregnancy, and i would hope that they use whatever family planning methods are available and acceptable to them to prevent pregnancy until they are ready for it. but if pregnancy occurs, both parties should remain responsible for it, as by 18 years of age most youth are aware that pregnancy is one consequence of sexual intercourse.
- Jessie
It's not clear how many of those children are even his. From the story it seems that paternity testing hasn't been done, so he may just be a convenient target.
- Gabe
Feelgood story out of Flint:: http://www.mlive.com/flintjo...
- Robert Felty
"Url shorteners are bad" does not imply "Every site in the world should run a url shortener to avoid single point of failure."
Paul Buchheit, John μller, John S. Britsios and 7 other people liked this
I wonder how many people know about the free 25 GB of cloud storage at skydrive.live.com. It's handy.
Derryl Beukes, Torsten Eckert, Shey, Jamaican of FF and 92 other people liked this
I did not know of this.
- John E. Bredehoft
I think I heard about this and never looked into it. Gotta look into it!
- Justin Korn
not me - thanks!
- Marco(aureliusmaximus)
Being a Windows Live Butterfly i am aware of this service.
- Jamie Ellis
I did not know of this. Very cool!
- Dee S.
I didn't know it was that much. However, I keep wondering which cloud service is going to get yanked at some point. Who do I trust?
- MiniMage TKDteacher of FF
Do now thx!
- sofarsoShawn
I do now, Thx!
- jamar78
Does it work on OSX and Ubuntu?
- Bruce Lewis
@Bruce: it's just a web service, so I'm thinking yeah
- Sarah Perez
yeah. I like it.
- pastas9
Yack.. Windows!
- Dan van Moll
Love SkyDrive. Works great!
- Jordan Hofker
I love Skydrive, use it all the time, it's a great service. I was just thinking about how MS has a number of really good online services but they do horribly at advertising them.
- Aram Zucker-Scharff
from twhirl
Is there a way to use it as a network drive? That would be pimp...
- Hao Chen
Thanks for sharing, Sarah! I don't think many people know about this.
- MiaD
Hao, I've been searching for a desktop uploader ever since this came out. :/ Tough to do it one by one using a web 0.1 uploader :/ (I blogged about it when it was still 5GB http://www.allanjosephbatac.com/blog...)
- AJ Batac
I like the Flickr uploader
- AJ Batac
That's a way old thing.
- Anurag Bansal
from Nambu
There's multiple flickr uploaders now; what really matters is the bandwith upload rate which as I can recall is pretty fast, at least as fast as box.net. As web app skydrive is amazing for storage and it's easy interface
- sofarsoShawn
I got it
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
wonder what kind of strings attached by MS ;)
- A.T.
@solarsoshawn I'm on Windows (obv) so I use the Flickr uploader built into Windows Live Photo Gallery (plus I added the Facebook uploader & YouTube uploader, too)
- Sarah Perez
...cont'd: Facebook uploader: http://www.codeplex.com/liveupl... & Youtube one: http://www.codeplex.com/liveupl...
- Sarah Perez
@AJ Batac: If you're a Windows user, try Live Photo Gallery - built in uploader to SkyDrive (Photos) & Flickr: http://download.live.com
- Sarah Perez
@sarah nice, more than I expected at that!
- sofarsoShawn
Nice. Is there a way for it to integrate with Windows Explorer? I'm currently using Dropbox which offers that very handy feature which I can't do without.
- Mark Krynsky
Mark: Gladinet does that, but MSFT would rather you not use that. For photo uploads, Live Photo Gallery is best way though.
- Sarah Perez
That's great Sarah. Can you upload files other than photos though? @Mark, yeah I would have hoped for a similar solution.
- AJ Batac
Doh! My office content filter knew about it before I did.
- Daniel J. Pritchett
@AJ Skydrive uploads have to be done via the web browser (officially)
- Sarah Perez
Gladinet link: http://www.gladinet.com/ (don't tell anyone I gave you that!)
- Sarah Perez
It might be awesome if it weren't a web interface and one file at a time. Its sooo painful to use. Mobile Me has the right idea, OS integration, let you access the data like a normal local resource.
- Jody
surprised
- Marcos Vicente
Having upload errors.
- Walinmichi
I wish I could access SkyDrive through Windows Explorer. :(
- Chris, Taskerrific Guy
I do. I haven't really started to use it yet though.
- David Cook - 2010!!!
Nice offering. But it takes a PhD in Algorithms & Combinatorics to design a user password that passes muster on Live.com
- Ryan Miller
Heheheh "loser" :-))
Leandro Ardissone ⍨, Chris Zlatis, John Ruth and 137 other people liked this
LMAO!
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Would a FriendFeed 'room' be analogous to a Facebook 'group'?
- Ladybug Heather
New design looks like frienfeed also. They're losers but less than %1 FB users know friendfeed, so who cares.
- İbrahim Uzun [ j ]
mail2fb.com is empty !! : ))
- Erhan
that is funny!!
- Susan Beebe
where the hell is "ability to search like Friendfeed"? in 2010? damn!!! :P
- Goktug Gedik
"like" on Facebook doesn't bump the entry to the top. Not quite the same thing. However, you do get notifications on FB items that you "like".
- Morton Fox
soooo true
- Dobromir Hadzhiev
great! "HO" rulez!
- Sinan Ata
It smells competitive (!) like Internet Explorer and Firefox. BTW I'm still using my operating systems default web browser.
- A. Kıvanç Tanrıkulu
Oh this is good. *tips hat*
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
Paul liked this at Facebook http://friendfeed.com/e...
- Erhan
tesekkür ederim
- stefan m. seydel/sms ;-)
Now someone should do what they copied from Twitter.
- Corvida
You can hide now... I think search is the big one they're lacking.
- Frankie Warren
Where's the ability to not get hit with a slew of stupid, annoying invites / requests as soon as you login???
- Patrick Jordan
most of my friends are using facebook only, these two sites should merge closer
- classic
stefan: Do you like Turkish? I'm suggesting you a friend of mine, /directeur. ; )
- Erhan
Ha! and here I am! 14 seconds after you called my name :)
- directeur
directeur: Did you write a greasemonkey script for your personal buzz? :-)
- Erhan
:D No, not yet, should I? :) It was the first entry I saw and I read my name in it. Also, I have a very fun and smart idea for my next project (will tell you more on you know where :) ) Oh btw, how was Baku?
- directeur
directeur: Baku was great, we should visit there again. They have awesome meals, songs, people... I wrote a post in Turkish about Azerbaijan at webrazzi.com. Try to read. :-))
- Erhan
I will try! Thanks! :) Oh, tell me btw, you didn't forgot to bring a nice gift to you know who? I hope you didn't forgot!! ;-)
- directeur
todo facabook MUAhuauUhauUauauUUauUAhU
- Jordi Rivero
directeur: I'll answer all of your questions at FB chat. :-))
- Erhan
- The ability to undo actions like FriendFeed
- LouCypher
Me, Amazon, Scoble - http://www.scripting.com/stories...
Daniel Rowley, Thomas Power, Vishy and 23 other people liked this
I was about to say Amazon needs it's own "friending" ability, but then I saw that they already do. Who knew?
- Daniel Sims
Very astute point, as usual, Mr. Winer. Tangent: and how good are some comments on Amazon? that good: http://bit.ly/bcfTb
- jacek
Dave, you're describing an evolved, enlightened Beacon here. Amazon had that Grapevine offering, but looks like that's been scrapped. BTW - I've previously thought this would be something FriendFeed could do as well: http://bhc3.wordpress.com/2008...
- Hutch Carpenter
Friendfeed users like Tweets, here's proof: - https://friendfeed.com/account...
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HealingBrush, Kol Tregaskes, Marcus Beagley and 70 other people liked this
These are images from my friendfeed stats page that show that most of the people I'm following on friendfeed only interact with Tweets. Note how my usage is different. I like a lot more friendfeed items than a typical user. (My useage is the one that shows a bigger friendfeed slice).
- Robert Scoble
from Bookmarklet
I'm following 5,977 people and most of the heaviest participants on friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
maybe because twitter is the most active service out there (i mean in terms of frequency of update)
- Ouriel Ohayon
how many of your users are in your rooms?
- Cem Dalgic
ouriel: oh, absolutely, but since I'm more active than most people and I'm clicking like on more things I find this difference interesting to study and understand.
- Robert Scoble
That is not surprising. Most of the friend feed users are coming from twitter.
- Naimul
cem: I'm not sure and I'm not sure you can look at that anyway. I'm following 206 rooms too, but the people I'm following I hand followed and not in rooms.
- Robert Scoble
Sharing at twitter means you're sharing with twitter + FF but sharing at FF will not give these much leverage for your message
- Sarath
Sharing Friendfeed means you're sharing with FF + Twitter. If you have it set up
- Tyler (Chacha)
I think the Tweet Icon is more appealing than the FF one
- Tyler (Chacha)
I think a lot of people still use friendfeed as source of content rather than a truly conversational medium like twitter. I know your experience is quite the opposite but I think there is a more pronounced or skewed "short tale" on friendfeed where fewer people are actually paying attention to the same degree as they are on twitter.
- Marcel LeBrun
I find myself using Twitter and FF for different purposes: Twitter for making connections and sharing links, FF for discussion.
- Walter Jessen
That is why FF needs to make it easy for me to import my twitter friends into one twitter list, then I can create groups from there. FF already has the framework to be the ultimate Twitter client (groups, discussions, etc), it would blow Tweetdeck out of the water and I could access it anywhere. I would use FF a lot more if it did this.
- Kelly Johns
Didn't we establish this a looooong time ago? This was a driving factor behind the twitter reply feature IIRC
- Bwana ☠
I also remember this being an argument for even joining friendfeed. "It's all tweets anyway"
- Bwana ☠
That's not proof, that's one data point. Why in the world would you conclude that you're "typical," Robert? My graph is far more heavily weighed towards the FriendFeed side instead of the Twitter side.
- Glen, Bespectacled Elder
rather this reflects more the portion of use, not favourable inclination to it: tweets are cheep, it's harder to share content
- sofarsoShawn
Glen: I'm not talking about you. Most people on friendfeed only engage with Tweets. The 6,000 people I'm following demonstrates that.
- Robert Scoble
Glen, that's not just one data point, it's the accumulation of 6,000 data points. I'll post mine as well to show how I may differ from Robert. Here's the data I have: http://friendfeed.com/e...
- Louis Gray
That's interesting but I don't think it is a real reflection of activity ON FriendFeed, it's a reflection of what is IMPORTED into FriendFeed. Most people on FriendFeed have a Twitter account, so they're importing it... that doesn't mean that their tweets get conversation or participation in FriendFeed though, and may not really account for the majority of activity ON FriendFeed.
- Lindsay is in 20-ten
I have my prefs set up to ignore tweets unless someone else has liked or commented on them, and as a consequence I'd guess about 10% of my feed view consists of tweets, if that much. And I know a lot of other people have it set up like I do.
- Lindsay is in 20-ten
Many of us block tweets on FF (at least I do) -- so I think your stats may be an anomaly not the norm.
- Brian Sullivan
Lindsay: there's where you are wrong. This graph shows you what 6,000 of the most active participants on friendfeed are liking and commenting on (and compares it to my behavior of what I like and comment on). NOT what is imported into friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, I believe you are incorrect. That graph shows what data they are bringing into FriendFeed. It says, "Top sites are calculated by looking at where your shared stuff has come from over the past 30 days" not what you have done with it.
- Louis Gray
I agree w/ Louis&Lindsay this graph only represents quantity of imported feeds, I myself hide all twitter input and only rarely check it when I click unhide. I never have bookmarked entries b/c through dual screens I just use the ff bookmarklet
- sofarsoShawn
Louis: that is interesting. I thought it included usage too.
- Robert Scoble
Louis is right. Nevertheless, it seems that Twitter does produce a very good percentage of FFd input.
- Alexandros Georgiadis
I personally prefer FF. It is easier to import other content to FF and I just populate my Twitter stream with my ff posts
- Rob Cairns
I do the same thing as Rob, and occasionally add original content directly to my Twitter stream.
- Vinko
It would be interesting to see graphs that show what @Scobleizer thought these graphs showed.
- Bruce Lewis
from fftogo
What FriendFeed Needs to Do To Grow and Keep New Users - http://www.louisgray.com/live...
Igor Poltavskiy, Bill Strathearn, Kol Tregaskes and 94 other people liked this
Agreed! Can't wait to see what comes from friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
I'd love to have like a dashboard of options. Like to decide if 'likes' poped the thing to the top, to enable likes at all, to enable FoaF, etc
- Tyler (Chacha)
Well thought out. We have the firehose. We we need powerful filtering that's brain-dead easy to use.
- Chris Baskind
Great post. The small, medium, large option is brilliant. And agreed on finding your 'real' friends. Yet, in parallel I think the bigger issue is ... show us the money. Want FF to have legs? Out revenue model Twitter!
- AJ Kohn
I rant... because I care. :-)
- Louis Gray
Louis: me too! I have too much invested here to see facebook or twitter win! We need track.
- Robert Scoble
There's no value in disclosing a revenue model for a private company, and there's no indication that FriendFeed is hurting for money. So what's the point? I don't understand the desire to integrate FriendFeed into TweetDeck, either. It seems like asking to integrate a Microwave into a Toaster: they do different things.
- Mark Trapp
I know it might not be ... popular, but it might be effective to a) promote the Find + Invite via email to high users and b) put the Find + Invite into a multi-email format (week 1: Robert Scoble invites you to join FF. week 2: Robert Scoble reminds you to join FF. week 3: Robert Scoble demands that you join FF.) Okay that last one is a bit of a joke. But each email can also give another reason why you should join. One off invites seem so 2008.
- AJ Kohn
AJ: I find it to be much more effective to send an email saying "Robert Scoble is talking about you here..."
- Robert Scoble
@Robert: Excellent! I like that too. I just want the invites to not be one off. Why make YOU track down and find out if ... Om actually did join? Have a staged invite email stream ... 3 messages perhaps. And perhaps it even emails you with which joined and which didn't {thinking out loud here}. Make the invitation the first FriendFeed conversation.
- AJ Kohn
There are some good ideas in here. I'll note that Friendfeed has formatted the site for the iPhone with full functionality. But i can't use it on my Blackberry unless I go to IM, which overwhelms the phone (and me)
- Karoli
Sometimes it does come down to presentation and value explanation as much as this might offend the service purists. A lot of people struggle to get over that adoption hump. I think that FF should put a big sell on value and what its good for (in straight forward terms) right up front and I definitely agree that there should be a lite and starter version.
- Richard Filing
So can SocialToo stretch itself to handle FF? Not only the follow/unfollow bit, but the conversation bread crumbs help you track what was last said... just a thought for the start of an idea (obviously not the end result).
- Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
Most important (at least to me) is being able to find other FF users who I already follow on other services, like Twitter or Brightkite. I made a comment about that on the post, but it's so important that I'm mentioning it again here.
- Chris, Taskerrific Guy
We need more advanced Filtering for more advanced users...
- Tyler (Chacha)
Especially Per/List Filtering. Being able to block Twitter Results from one List while seeing them in another
- Tyler (Chacha)
Louis THANK YOU ... excellent post... LOTS of great points you bring out here! I am cleaning up my "lists" and noticing lots of users that have bailed from FF. the firehose affect must be managed better with user-centric UI tools. Discovery / management of friends is cumbersome; lists are also challenging too
- Susan Beebe
It's really hard to create functionality that is appealing to both power users and novice users. I like the idea of providing an "opt in" option for newbies so that FF does not overwhelm them on day one of their experience. I think I still would have preferred the opt out "hide" mode from the start. Once the newbies that choose "opt in" mode get comfortable with FF they should have the ability to flip the switch on the firehose to full volume. That would be the trickier part of supporting two FF user modes.
- scott anderson
FF needs tags, ways to generate a stream based on tags, ability to sort this tagged content based on importance (aka likes, amount of comments) and date, complete user profiles and clever user search (as facebook does), more options about FOAF per subscriber, more "visible" rating of content aka "best of month", better share control (sometimes i would love to share to a single person without having to have a dedicated room)...so basicly is TAGS & PROFILES & MORE FILTER/OPTIONS :)
- Chris Hofmann
Probably the FriendFeed "lite" is more important short-term than the advanced filtering features. Scoble & Gray will use FriendFeed w/o advanced filtering, but John McCain won't use FriendFeed w/o the Lite GUI.
- Ontario Emperor
from fftogo
Ontario, that's why I made FriendFeed Lite #1. I've been saying it for a long time now. Scoble and I might like the full octane brand, or PeopleBrowsr, for example, but others need something easier.
- Louis Gray
A section with random users will be cool, like random pictures on flickr.
- Waldemar Schott
I think the ability to create more personal FriendFeed profiles is more important than anything else listed here. Average users like customizing their stuff. As much as Track would placate the top users, FF needs to start attracting some of the more typical users too.
- Andrew
FF in serious trouble if it can't work out how to attract mainstream crowd - i can't see it being able to as your average jo doesn't what perpetual information spewing all over them
- Bob Sonin
Andrew, I mentioned profile data in the post, and have made it a top priority in my previous recommendations to the FF team.
- Louis Gray
The room for Newbies/beginners would be a good quick addition. Point them there will introduce them to FF/rooms/how feeds work/etc. Also, Some additional quick 3-4 minute youtube "How to" videos will help as well. It can be daunting at first, but once u stick with it you will find gold!
- Amani
FF's only hope as I see it is to somehow crack the mobile space big time but it looks like they are late too that party as well.
- Bob Sonin
A lot of people have a hard time in general with the "here's a site - you can do anything you want with it" tool which many of the (Facebook, Twitter, FriendFeed) are to varying degrees. Those in tech who are used to tinkering are more likely to find the sites useful, to others - it's just scary. Twitter can be integrated into lots of different environments (dozens of interfaces), but FF isn't so accommodating yet.
- Stuart Miniman
Some entry lever offering would be great. I encounter similar challenges when promoting FF
- Jeroen De Miranda
I joined FF to generate a lifestream of my posted bits 'n pieces on the web and recently started to look at other uses which is quite overwhelming. Robert Scoble's recent video sure helped and your suggestions also make sense. BTW, I read your post in Google Reader not FF, but thought I'd find the conversation here. And then I just noticed 39 comments on your blog. The attention keeps on spreading...
- Rob Schlüter
A lite version, might help people find their own community. Jumping into a Friend Feed stream sometimes feels like sitting at the table across from the cool kids in high school. You have something to say, but are not quite sure you are really invited.
- Lorraine Ball
Found another exciting FF feature: add a room to my blog! http://www.jeroendemiranda.com/innovat... --> I found this on the FF blog; not in the FAQ or other standard documentation. Hint for FF: I think FF would benefit from hiring a user interface/ help text expert, to consolidate and streamline all help texts and instructions.... but: I appreciate the fantastic functionality of FF!!
- Jeroen De Miranda
Seeing far too much 'noise' from an article that I like over at google Shared items, and see it my stream here. Then I see seventy other people have also shared it, and its also in the blog stream. FF - LINK THEM ALL TOGETHER PLEASE!! :)
- Jez Arnold
My advice to FF: Make 1 version (skin, UI) for Twitter users. Then make 1 version (skin, UI) for Facebook users. Then let these 2 engines virally feed users into FF. Then wait for the old timers to complain about how its ruined now that its gone mainstream. :)
- Elliott Ng
I agree with all of what you have written. I am trying to make good use of FriendFeed, but run into some of the roadblocks you have identified. I am a pretty heavy Twitter user, but FF has so much more functionality - but I just can't seem to take advantage of it all. I also want to seamlessly link Twitter and FF - but can't seem to do so without getting double-posts on Twitter.
- Curt Mercadante
I agree with the points mentioned, FF is a great tool and with a few tweaks etc they'll continue their growth :)
- Nicholas James
When we stop building walled palaces and figure out how to properly thread comments, FF will be extremely useful to the mainstream. Until then, the users must sift through comments on multiple posts of the same article, and don't even get me started on re-posts (MONA!) Just look at Louis's Disqus feed from this one post (He currently has 12 separate posts, some having additional comments not linked to this thread) and you will start to understand the problem. If this isn't fixed, Twitter and Facebook win.
- Bob Blunk
FriendFeed is for those with social media competency. Why would it seek an audience lacking that skill? It should simply be the best service available, as the audience grows naturally.
- Christopher Galtenberg
Some Thoughts on Walled Gardens and Social Operating Systems - http://www.25hoursaday.com/weblog...
Sarah Perez, Chris Hollander, B2B Specialist and 7 other people liked this
Totally agree, but over in China walled gardens are all the rage. Why? Because they still think customers are like roaches: they should be able to come into their service, but never leave. It's influenced by their knowledge that services can be cloned here within days for very little money (software developers here make $10,000 to $25,000 per year). So, they are always looking to put up walls as ways to keep customers from switching to other services. That attitude is starting to change, though, even here. It gives me hope for the future.
- Robert Scoble
We can't forget that walled gardens are ostensibly attractive places to the uninitiated. There's a lot of beauty and order there that is appealing to those who aren't yet familiar with the scenery of the great, rugged wilderness that is the open network. It seems like every time a walled garden dies somewhere, a new one springs up to take its place (proprietary OS --> cloud computing being a recent example). I think we haven't seen the last of them until open platforms become more successful.
- Dion Hinchcliffe
There are still many users that like walled gardens as well. It gives them a sense of security that their comments are available only to a known audience, protected from the scrutiny of the bigger, rough & tumble world stage.
- Erik Britt-Webb
When you haven't had walls or gardens maybe a walled garden isn't so bad?
- Todd Hoff
Poll shows big shift to McCain among white women | Reuters - http://news.yahoo.com/story...
Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah, Mitchell Tsai, Noah Carter and 12 other people liked this
I truly don't get this. So - it's gender first, issues second? I called McCain's team cynical for this pick, but might they have been right?
- Anthony Citrano
It's true. American voters don't care about issues. It's all about appearances and vanity. Amazing, eh?
- Glenn Batuyong
from twhirl
Drat
- Amber, Random Time Lord
I don't get it, either.
- Michelle Martinez
Voters care about more than just issues. GWB's stance on the issues was just what his base had hoped for and yet he hasn't necessarily pleased them in the past 8 years. Would you vote for David Duke if he wrote up a new platform that perfectly matched your ideals?
- Daniel J. Pritchett
@Daniel. True but would you rather vote for someone who straight-up takes a negative stance on the issues you care about? How certain are you then that he will flip-flop after the election to a stance that you agree with?
- Glenn Batuyong
@Jason - many of you amaze me at your inability to focus on the topic at hand. There are plenty of threads about Obama's qualifications. Here I am asking if so-called independent women really vote gender first and don't bother with issues. Can we stay on the subject?
- Anthony Citrano
I think this is people saying "oh cool, a woman running for VP and she seems to be like us"...That's going to wear off pretty quick as it's pretty easy to show that she is nothing like the average middle America woman. All they have to do is pay attention...Are you paying attention middle America? Don't get swindled out of your future for a third time in a row.
- Alex Scoble
@Alex: "All they have to do is pay attention" - so what you're saying is we're doomed?
- Eric P
Dear Deities: Please we can have debates soon?
- Archangel ωαřмaiden
Alex: she's a soccer mom. That's all many people will hear and that's all they'll care about. As Bill Clinton's advance team told me "it doesn't matter what the candidate said, it matters how they look."
- Robert Scoble
Hehe, Eric. I hope not. I have HOPE that the American people are better than that.
- Alex Scoble
It's problematic that democrats are talking about Sarah Palin. She is the VP - not the top of the ticket.
- Jason Preston
@Alex What's the difference between that and a Black person saying: "oh cool, a Black person is running for President..." -- I don't see how that argument can only fly one way.
- Shey, Jamaican of FF
Well no surprise here. She thinks the government should regulate my wife's uterus.
- Khürt Williams
from twhirl
It'd be nice if people would actually address why the whole ticket is a bucket of fail instead of lamenting about teh Vagina Vote.
- Archangel ωαřмaiden
Difference is that Barack Obama's stance on the issues actually fits with most black voters...so it's not just "Cool, a black guy is running for President." It's also, "and he believes in the same things I do." Which is completely counter to Palin, who obviously does not believe in the same things as most American women.
- Alex Scoble
-1 Sean...I addressed Shey's question...
- Alex Scoble
I agree with you, Shey. Gender and race should not be the deciding point on a candidate, period. Unfortunately most of America is too concerned with what Brittany did at the VMAs to care.
- Michelle Martinez
At the beginning of the campaign, I was a huge Hillary supporter. This white woman will be voting Obama.
- Trish R
The United States is a conservative nation. They are going to vote for the conservative ticket. It's pretty straight forward.
- John Denver
Just the thought of McCain as president scares the hell out of me. And really, if you didn't want him before, just because he now has a women VP shouldn't change your opinion of how well you think he can lead the country.
- Wizetux
@Alex So the increased number of Black voters is soley because of a closer Dem. alignment of Black issues? Humans are narcissistic, let's not discount that. Do I think hockey mom's identify with Palin and are more likely to vote for her, yes. But it goes both ways: http://www.al.com/news...
- Shey, Jamaican of FF
I disagree, John. I would say moderate, maybe, but not full out conservative.
- Michelle Martinez
I'm saying that with black voters it's deeper than the color of Obama's skin...that his worldview fits with most of theirs. This is completely counter to Palin and most women voters, which is why I think any such trend to like her will disappear as quickly as one can say "she never met an earmark she didn't like, except for the one time when everyone in the nation made a stink about a certain bridge."
- Alex Scoble
Well, let's just apply McCain's own standard to this issue: "I want someone who is ready to take over from day one." Hmm.
- Anthony Citrano
@John Denver - setting aside that the word "conservative" is being abused herein, I think most good research polling would not support your statement. When polled on issue positions, and not asked to identify by labels, a majority of Americans are fiscally conservative and socially liberal.
- Anthony Citrano
I don't trust the polls. I think their methods are outdated and they aren't getting an accurate read on people.
- Sarah
@Sarah - mostly agree with you on that. But I can't help asking - to the above polling - *who are these people*??
- Anthony Citrano
@Anthony: +1 on your fiscal conservative, socially liberal. Oh, are McCain or Palin fiscal conservatives? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?
- AJ Kohn
@Anthony I don't disagree with you and I would assert that today's "New Conservative" is just that... more liberal on social issues but just as staunch as ever fiscally. This reflects my views to a tee. It begs the question, though... how to you achieve liberal social policies while still being fiscally responsible? A bit of a paradox, no?
- John Denver
@John - I don't see it as a paradox, but it's out of the scope of this thread.
- Anthony Citrano
@John: Then why is "conservatism" veering so strongly in the opposite direction? The McCain campaign just doubled down on the culture wars and hardcore social conservatives as their strategy, and meanwhile I see more concern about debt and the deficit amongst the liberals than I do conservatives.
- Eric P
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