 |
|
| FriendFeed is the easiest way to share online. Learn more » |
CmtyChat
A chat about the business of online communities. Founded by Sonny Gill and Bryan Person.
Just an FYI, given the Thanksgiving holiday, we'll be taking this Friday off for CmtyChat and starting back up on Friday Dec. 4th. Enjoy the holidays and if you don't celebrate, enjoy the rest of the week! :)
Q3: November 20, 2009 - A great blog post by Jim Lynch a few days ago discussed the issues of Community Managers telecommuting. Do you work remotely for a company? Does it work for you? How would you go about persuading a company to allow you to work remotely especially, for a new post?
Here's a link to the post for you to read after cmtychat ;) http://www.extremetech.com/article...
- Sue
Telecommuting is not an option for me but I often end up working from home after hours LOL
- Arié Moyal
There are some great CM's like @TanMcG but she is in Canada and says there are not so many CM roles opening up for her there. Remote work would be great for peeps like that.
- Sue
I am allowed to telecommute randomly. It isn't a set schedule, my boss likes us to be here - he feels we have more synergy (over used term but accurate) when we are all here and chatting back and forth.
- Lee Anne Orange
Amen @Sue. I really appreciated that post. Jim sounds very qualified and to hear that he is having this struggle too gave me some hope that things may open up re: the role of CM not needing to be tied to a desk/office.
- Tanya McGinnity
Same here Lee Anne :)
- Arié Moyal
I'm in Canada too - Some jobs are opening up here
- Arié Moyal
What do you all think about the current job market for CM's? Are we seeing more roles or less?
- Sue
I think that when you're looking at small start-up companies (like mine) or larger companies that haven't entirely bought in to SM yet, where being in person *feels* important, whether for "critical mass", or to help win people over to the cause. I think there are some really great folks who can do it remotely though, but I'm not sure where I'd begin in trying to convince a new employer on the subject.
- Marie Connelly
I defonitely think we're seeing more and even the roles of bloggers/journalists are requiring more and more CM savvy
- Arié Moyal
@Marie. Yes it would be a touch sell. Many CM's comment that its hard getting upper management to take on board community members concerns. Perhaps if one worked remotely it makes it difficult to overcome that.
- Sue
I think the reduced infrastructure costs might appeal to some companies
- Arié Moyal
Quieter day today. In that vein I have posted question 4.
- Sue
Glad you mentioned Jim's post. I do much of my work remotely but that often presents another problem--no clear end to the work since with community, you can never be done. So I am working on trying to strike a balance and managing inputs to work as effectively as I can. But that's another story!
- Megan Keane
Q4: November 20, 2009 - Bryan and Sonny are looking at the possibility of changing the time/day of cmtychat so more CM's can participate. What suggestions do you have for day/time? Do you also have suggestions for topics for future cmtychats?
I'd like to do something about the role of voice/telephony in community possibly in conjunction with the VoIP Users Conference Call - I would prefer something during the day but maybe not at lunch time or on a Friday
- Arié Moyal
I agree - lunchtime is tough. I prefer mid-morning for chats. Fridays are hard too cuz many people go out of town or leave early on a friday.
- Lee Anne Orange
This is my first cmtychat, so I'm not sure I can really comment on the timing. Does anyone else feel like work always seems to hit Friday around noon? Would there be a way to message all the subscribers here with a poll or something? That could help find a time that works for a majority of subscribers.
- Marie Connelly
To get an idea of location, can you provide the time zones you are in? I'm on the East coast.
- Sue
I'm east coast as well.
- Lee Anne Orange
@ Marie That's a good idea. Maybe a thread started that people can contribute to over the course of the next week. Whereabouts are you Marie
- Sue
East Coast here
- Arié Moyal
@ Sue, I'm East Coast too.
- Marie Connelly
We can do a twtpoll and you can all tweet your CM contacts ;)
- Arié Moyal
Is anybody interested in turnin previous chats into blog posts or a wiki?
- Arié Moyal
Ok I have to run Wont be around next week - Surgery Thursday
- Arié Moyal
It would help me b/c I would love to participate more, but even having it about an hour later would help.
- Megan Keane
Hi Megan. Whereabouts are you?
- Sue
Hi Sue, I'm in San Francisco, so Pacific Time. I believe you know my colleague, Susan Tenby.
- Megan Keane
Thanks, Sue & the whole group - I'm hooked! Have a great weekend!
- Marie Connelly
Glad you enjoyed Marie.
- Sue
Thanks Sue and everyone - great chat!
- Lee Anne Orange
WARM-UP/INTRO: November 20, 2009 - Hi Everyone. Hope this Friday finds you well. Let's use this string to say hi and introduce ourselves. Here's a little icebreaker to warm us up - What is your pet peeve in traffic?
Hi Sue! my pet peeve in traffic (and we have 2nd worst traffic in the USA) is people who drive in the shoulder lane to pass everyone and then cut over in front of the rest of us who have been sitting there.
- Lee Anne Orange
Hi all. My pet peeve is people not using their indicators to signal their turns. Perhaps they are hoping that I will use my magic 8 ball to foretell where and when they are going to tun.
- Sue
Hi all, my pet peeve is those folks who leave like 10 miles between their car and the car in front of them. Close the gap!
- Megan
Hi everyone. I'm Tanya and I'm fortunate enough to live in Montreal, where we have an amazing metro system that takes me anywhere I want to go. Pet peeve on the metro- folks who don't let those who need to be seated sit down.
- Tanya McGinnity
Hi everyone! This is my first time in the CmtyChat-nice to "meet" all of you. Like Tanya, I take the metro most everywhere, though I would not say that Boston's subway system is anywhere close to "amazing". One big metro pet peeve for me is folks who listen to their music so loud I can hear it over the music playing through my own headphones.
- Marie Connelly
Hi Lee Anne, Hi Megan, Hi Tanya. Hi Marie, it's nice to meet you. Welcome to cmtychat
- Sue
1st question is up.
- Sue
Hi Arie Moyal here from Montreal I'm a CM for babyTEL, mainly for the Social Media Voice Services division My pet peeve in traffic is cars :P I don;t drive hehe
- Arié Moyal
Can you guys reach out right now to other CMs and see if they'll join us here?
- Arié Moyal
I'd like for someone to go through all these chats and possibly write blog posts or start a wiki/nowledge base
- Arié Moyal
@Arie. That really is a great idea. Everyone shares such great information.
- Sue
Wish I had the time to do it :S
- Arié Moyal
Q2: November 20, 2009: Another subject touched on often is the Social Media Manager/Community Manager debate. Are they one and the same role, or different? In what way?
The reason I ask this question is that I see both roles advertised and its getting more and more difficult to distinguish the two from the job requirements. Yet there is a distinctive difference between managing a static community, such as a forum, and a floating one for a brand such as multiple brand communities on facebook, twitter, blogs etc
- Sue
They're not the same - They should be IMO but not everyone "gets" that social media is about community conversation engagment and support A lot of them just use it to blast
- Arié Moyal
They are often lumped together and in some ways, you are bringing people together thru social media, buidling relationships just as you would in a community. Social Media in my opinion shouldnt be just a sounding board for your marketing. So i like them lumped together.
- Megan
I just changed my role as the coach of a coaching company They called me an SM coach I call myself a CM coach
- Arié Moyal
@Arie. So SM is more a tool to facilitate conversation and build community?
- Sue
I think it speaks to the culture/understanding of the company what they choose however there is an issue with people thining CM means managing a company's charity activities (btw see my request in the intro)
- Arié Moyal
@ Sue Exactly right
- Arié Moyal
I think it depends on some of the specifics. There are times that they might be different. But with, say, "outbound community management" (that great blog post circulating today)...that's often a natural part of CM, but it has a lot of overlap with SM too.
- Marie Connelly
SM is a tool though - it can be misused - if you use SM wrong you're likely doing CM wrong but SM is only part of CM
- Arié Moyal
Marie: A link please?
- Arié Moyal
I think they are different but have overlapping circles of influence. Maybe that is why they get lumped indiscriminately together.
- Lee Anne Orange
Heres the link to the post Marie is referring to. Its a great read http://socialsilk.com/2009...
- Sue
Thanks for posting that earlier today, Sue
- Marie Connelly
@ Lee Ann. Yes I agree
- Sue
@Lee Anne. Definitely! I also think some of this is companies knowing that they need to get into social media, but not necessarily knowing exactly what that means or the type of people who can help them do it right.
- Marie Connelly
@Marie - completely agree.
- Lee Anne Orange
SM is a subset of CM tools if done right
- Arié Moyal
@Arie so reaching outside of your community to bring in new members via social media
- Sue
But forums as has been mentioned here dont usually fall under SM, neither do live events or e-mail
- Arié Moyal
@Sue That's part of it but it could mean giving your members other ways to communicate with you and with each other
- Arié Moyal
Q3 is up
- Sue
Q1: November 20, 2009: Here's a gentle question to start us off - We talk often about the downside of community management. What about the upside? What drew you to community management? What do you like most about it?
I like being part of the "conversation". That is the best part in my opinion.
- Lee Anne Orange
I love bringing people together. And it just happens I'm passionate about this particular community's focus on the arts so its easy for me to get involved and be enthused about what we are doing and the possibilities.
- Megan
By nature I'm a connector and a caretaker. I also love helping people and teaching so I think that when I first encountered the job description, I had an 'A ha' moment where I knew this was a role that brought together all of these aspects of my personality into a way to make a living.
- Tanya McGinnity
I think the "helping people" was a big aspect of it for me as well. We're a health community, so there's sort of a natural connection: helping people improve their health, find what they're looking for, help them help others...Not sure how I could *not* want to do that.
- Marie Connelly
@Tanya. I know that aha moment too. I've been managing a community for almost 10 years but didn't really think about it in terms of job title/description until I stumbled across a blog post about cmty managers in 2008. That's when I thought "that's what I do'
- Sue
Community management is fun You get to meet interesting people and talk your face off for a living :) I just got a facebook message one day from a friend I worked on the college paper with and now I'm a CM & a CM coach Nuts! Hehe
- Arié Moyal
When people ask what you do for a job how do you describe the CM role to them?
- Sue
I think CMs are all 3 types from the tipping point rolled into 1
- Arié Moyal
I tell them I help strengthen the community that exists around the brand/product of the company I work for and I tell them I'm on twiter and facebook all day LOL
- Arié Moyal
CMs are like hosts at parties The better the hosts supports and connects the better the party
- Arié Moyal
@Sue, it's an over simplification of course, but I usually say, "I find the folks who might be interested in our community, let them know we're out there, and make sure they have a good time when they get here".
- Marie Connelly
@Arie @Marie. I like both of those descriptions.
- Sue
Q2 is up
- Sue
One thing to remember is tha the community exists - your job is to strengthen it
- Arié Moyal
Q4: November 13, 2009 - A question for the community here. Where do YOU want to see this group evolve to? What opportunities do you feel CmtyChat has to further expand and reach out to more CMs and those wanting to just learn more about community management?
Open-forum: so don't be afraid to share your thoughts :) Really want to gauge ppl's feelings and ideas on CmtyChat after several months since starting this chat.
- Sonny Gill
That's an awesome question. Since social business is starting to catch on, I think it'd be great to talk more about the growth of the CM role internally. Also, maybe start discussing Dir. of Community roles? I dunno, I'm spouting off here...
- Teresa Basich
Good suggestions, Teresa! Spout away :) I've been getting a lot more into the social business side of social media and CMs definitely play a huge role in that shift.
- Sonny Gill
I love the way we can bounce ideas of each other.
- Sue
Definitely Sue. Does everyone enjoy the FriendFeed format still in comparison to all other chats being on Twitter? Always something I think about so worth asking everyone here.
- Sonny Gill
Is there another time cmtychat could take place, maybe to involve CM's who don't have as much freedom in their roles to participate during the day? Again just throwing a suggestion out there like Teresa.
- Sue
I think CMs are going to take on a lot of work on the internal training and education side as social business takes hold, for sure. I'd love to get some ppl here working in director positions at companies going toward social business. And yes, Sue has a great point -- maybe a different time to integrate some new faces?
- Teresa Basich
I have to say I was hesitant about it to start with, but find now I much prefer cmtychat on FF.
- Sue
That's a good question, Sue. I've thought about that a lot as well - especially as Bryan and I would much of the time have conflicting schedules on Friday afternoons (travel/work). What times would you suggest? Mid-week evenings? Obv not coinciding with other chats.
- Sonny Gill
Yeah, I really like the FF format. Threaded discussions rock.
- Teresa Basich
A lot more to think about now as we move forward with CmtyChat. Glad you guys still dig FF but timing may be something to think about adjusting.
- Sonny Gill
I think we need to tell more people about it (each one of us tell 2 CM friends) and possibly reschedule it so it doesn't conflict with my lunch! LOL
- Arié Moyal
I suppose what fits best for you and Bryan as hosts. I imagine its difficult anyway to find the perfect time of day due to the time zones, but maybe evenings would be better for some.
- Sue
I think it can be a place to learn and a place to share I think we should also maybe have a job board and possibly help develop some best practices & case studies we can share
- Arié Moyal
I hear ya Arie & Sue. Sorry for taking your lunchtime, Arie ;) But evening chats come aplenty and people seem open to it, so definitely worth thinking into more and seeing which time slot we could fit it into.
- Sonny Gill
Thanks a lot everyone! The hour flew by - but it's been great, as usual :)
- Sonny Gill
What's great about FF is that it's threaded and you can go back and read the stuff even after the chat is done (which means we have to be on our best behaviour)
- Arié Moyal
Perhaps starting a topic on a Monday that we could all participate during the week, then aspects of what comes out of that topic could be the focus for the cmtychat session.
- Sue
I like that Sue!
- Arié Moyal
Interesting idea, Sue! So starting it up here in the FF room on Monday w/ a question and then full on discussion still on Friday?
- Sonny Gill
I missed the chat but wanted to add my +1 for FF over Twitter. I don't use FF normally but for this chat it's perfect. I miss the chats a lot and love being able to come back and read them so easily in this nice neat format.
- Michelle
WRAP-UP: November 13, 2009 - It was a bit quieter this Friday but appreciate everyone who was able to spend their afternoon here and chat it up. You guys rock! :)
Thanks, Sonny! And thanks to our tiny little group today. :) Looking forward to seeing where this group goes!
- Teresa Basich
Yes thank you Sonny and thanks everyone for putting up with my shenanigans ;)
- Arié Moyal
Great questions as always. Hope everyone's Fri 13th is uneventful. (@teresa btw the way watched your vlog's the other day. It was nice to put a voice to a face. Great job by the way)
- Sue
@Arie, cmtychat would not be the same without you, or your shenanigans :)
- Sue
Thank you, Sue! That's me. :) And thanks for stopping by my blog! I really appreciate it.
- Teresa Basich
Yay! I'm part of a community! LOL
- Arié Moyal
Q3 : November 13, 2009 - Being that it's Friday the 13th, let's hear some horror stories. What are some of the biggest challenges you've faced as a CM but also, how did you overcome those obstacles? (suggestion by Tanya McGinnity)
Well currently my cmty crashed over an hour ago, and I am just awaiting the slew of complaints that will rush at me when it comes back up .... honestly I am not kidding. Can you adam and eve it.
- Sue
What about one I'm facing? my JobAngels clean-up and re-engagement project?
- Teresa Basich
Sue - that does not sound fun! Sorry to hear that - has it happened before? If so, any extreme reactions? How did you help calm the situation?
- Sonny Gill
T - definitely. What obstacles do you have? JobAngels has a pretty large community but with that are huge opportunities to become better.
- Sonny Gill
Biggest challenge by far is re-engaging users. The community's core is really on LinkedIn and right now there's so little management that it's heavily spammed. I have to clean up as much as I can and set some boundaries while getting a very needy community to engage in a positive way. Also, figuring out how to draw people into the conversation who aren't unemployed or who can and want to help job seekers.
- Teresa Basich
We had a spate about 18 months ago when it was quite bad for about a month. The only way I got through it was to be as transparent as possible. To let members know what is going on, what is being done to fix it and to apologize. Saying sorry, really does make a difference.
- Sue
@Sue, can you say a little more about what happened? Was it a mix-up on the inside of your company? Or a misunderstanding of some sort? Often that info is proprietary, so I understand if you can't say more about it.
- Teresa Basich
T - that's definitely a challenge but I've seen job seekers and those wanting to help the unemployed, typically stir up some great conversations about the job market and specific situations. I think it'll be a welcomed change for the cmty to see that they want to be heard and can engage now, outside of just getting job leads.
- Sonny Gill
Sue - sorry is definitely one of the most underused words, especially in a business setting. Ppl sometimes equate sorry to failing. But I see it as a second coming, where you can grow from and get better. Whether with communities or otherwise, it's no different.
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny -- Definitely. I think the key will be inspiring people to start talking, not just blasting. Getting rid of the spam and filtering, etc. Right now most members see JobAngels as a place to find leads, not necessarily talk about their job search and use the forum as support. Not sure this work is as much challenging as much as just downright hard work.
- Teresa Basich
A bit of both :)
- Sonny Gill
No, I think they were doing some maintenance and the site didn't come back up again. Trouble is from time to time they forget to tell myself, and the CM's on the other sites, and then we haven't' got a clue what to tell people. As cmty's are the core of the companies business its not the right way to go about things imho. Hence my search for alternative employment ;)
- Sue
@Sue, that's definitely a tough situation. Communication is key, especially to managers who are doing customer/community facing like you.
- Teresa Basich
@Teresa, I think that is a challenge. Trying to differentiate between someone who is genuinely helping and another who is only trying to push their company/product etc
- Sue
Q4 is up, and it's direct at YOU :)
- Sonny Gill
@Sue, I think that's one of the biggest challenges for any community, and especially prevalent on LinkedIn. I'm still utterly impressed by Beth Harte's mgmt of the MarketingProfs community on LinkedIn and I think I'm going to need to pick her brain. :)
- Teresa Basich
Sorry my browser crashed - does that count as a community crash? LOL
- Arié Moyal
Yes Arie, we're offended! ;)
- Sonny Gill
@Teresa, Yep she's great. She sent out some great guidelines for group usage a few weeks ago. I think she set a firm but fair, and friendly tone, all at the same time. No mean feat that's for sure.
- Sue
Teresa I love JobAngels I DM you guys stuff all the time
- Arié Moyal
I know I've shared it a few times but Rachel Happe's Power and peril of Online COmmunities presentation is awesome!
- Arié Moyal
@Sonny Sorry. (There I can admit that I've failed) Will you forgive me? ;)
- Arié Moyal
Arie - of course! ;)
- Sonny Gill
Have a link to Rachel's presentation?
- Sonny Gill
SOnny: www.slideshare.net/rhappe/the-power-and-peril-of-online-communities
- Arié Moyal
PREVIEW/INTRO: November 13, 2009 - Hi and welcome everybody to the Friday the 13th edition of CmtyChat :) Feel free to introduce yourselves and post any thoughts/questions you would like addressed!
Hey everyone. Tanya here. I'd love to hear some horror stories on this Friday the 13th. How have you dealt with some of the challenges of Community Management?
- Tanya McGinnity
Hey Tanya - nice to see ya again! I'll be sure to incorporate your question within today's chat :)
- Sonny Gill
Arié here, communtiy manager for babyTEL's Social VoIP division in Montreal Is anyone noticing new trends in CM we should know about?
- Arié Moyal
Hey Arié! Glad you could make it. Interesting question - perhaps we can build on that here in this discussion post and hear from other folks?
- Sonny Gill
Let's kick things off!
- Sonny Gill
Hey Joe! Curious to see how that pans out Which app are you using?
- Arié Moyal
Hey Joe - hope the browser version on the iPhone is working ok for you!
- Sonny Gill
Q2: November 13, 2009 - With some businesses slowly shifting their internal culture and how they run their biz towards the way of this social web (re: P2P social business: http://thebrandbuilder.wordpress.com/2009...), how will CMs have to adjust to these shifts? Where will their skills/roles evolve to with this change in how businesses function?
And here I thought we *were* the change!
- Arié Moyal
Ooo, me, me! Kidding ;) I think one of the biggest changes will be internal community management. I feel like there will be a bigger push to expand the community inside the walls of business. Connecting more people, creating more bridges.
- Teresa Basich
Ha - we are but there's an even bigger change happening that we and social media heads alike, will play a huge role in.
- Sonny Gill
@T - most definitely. Connecting not just more people, but the entire org. in what the business is trying to accomplish. For everyone to understand goals, have resources at hand, open doors and open-communication on what's happening within the biz.
- Sonny Gill
The Canadian government has an internal social network aimed at making things run more efficiently Of course its closed :)
- Arié Moyal
I guess for me the answer is does out job really change or does our public change
- Arié Moyal
(Ok that was a question not an answer...)
- Arié Moyal
I don't think we will have to adjust to these shifts. As Arie said, we are already there. I think CM's do this already. The rest are just playing catch-up ;)
- Sue
Arie - good question and I agree w/Sue that we're already doing this - so In essence, our role may not change all that much. But in most cases, we'll be dealing with our internal community more than we ever have in the past.
- Sonny Gill
@Sue Neener neener neener! ;)
- Arié Moyal
Q3 is up!
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny The internal shift needs to happen - Outside people just want more ways to connect with their brands
- Arié Moyal
As we all know online communities have been around for many, many years and as CM's we ace at P2P. I suppose as sonny mentioned it's how we fit in the internal structure that may change as p2p becomes more prominent.
- Sue
Right Sue. We need to be vocal and be sure we're helping lead the charge. To us, it's a no-brainer, but the organization will be looking for that leadership still to help in this shift.
- Sonny Gill
Q1: November 13, 2009 - Living in a social economy where a company's every move is seen/heard, there are org's that have communities who don't necessarily believe in them. How can these co's/CMs bridge this trust gap? What steps do they need to take and where do they start?
Way to hit hard nice and quick, Sonny! Can you give an example of what you're talking about? I mean, I get what you're saying, I just can't think of one! Trust is based in strong relationships that deliver on promises, that are consistently beneficial to both parties involved in the relationship. I think companies and CMs have to start there -- addressing concerns and figuring out what exactly makes community members distrust them or not fully believe in them.
- Teresa Basich
Oops - maybe a little too hard :) You're right, addressing concerns and seeing where these problems are stemming from is very important. I think it begins with the company itself understanding where their business is and if leaders across the board, internally, are conveying that message properly. Everybody really needs to be on the same page.
- Sonny Gill
Obviously we have to make every community member read Trust Agents and give us their feedback LOL Kidding But I think it's important to find your enthusists and really talk to them
- Arié Moyal
Have to know yourself before knowing how you can help others -- absolutely true.
- Teresa Basich
I think that holds true outside of CM and even outside of business hehe
- Arié Moyal
@Arie - good idea ;) That's a great idea as well - even going as far as bringing those loyalists in and gaining valuable feedback from them as well. Where THEY see our shortcomings and where they see us shining.
- Sonny Gill
@Arie, thanks for the book recommendation. I am looking forward to reading Trust Agents.
- Lou Ordorica
And you're right - it holds true in all aspects of business and life. Internal cultures and leadership has been a growing topic as of late and something many companies are slowly addressing.
- Sonny Gill
I think that if someone does not believe in the org then they look elsewhere for another org/community they do believe in.
- Sue
Do you guys have any examples of companies who you personally have lost trust in but also see an opportunity to change that?
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny Dell is a good example. They went from burying their head in the sand (remember Dell Hell?) to fully embracing social media, and even innovating (Dell Ideastorm, Dell Pulse).
- Lou Ordorica
My prob is with orgs that use Twitter as a way of broadcasting (to get their message out) but they aren't monitoring conversations or engaging. So stuff goes wrong and they just carry on regardless. Why in that case have they got a Twitter account?
- Sue
@Lou - good, popular example. You're right - they opened up, started listening more, taking action. They tapped into several communities through different strategies across the social web.
- Sonny Gill
I'm with Sue -- Not just Twitter, either. Many companies broadcast and ignore problem. Maybe not even blatant ignoring, just misunderstanding of platforms and philosophy behind online engagement.
- Teresa Basich
Starbucks - they're gone gone gone for a lot of people - They've gone ubercorporate and lost their way
- Arié Moyal
@Sue - that's a problem we've seen from the get go, but shows even more now that businesses really don't know who they're targeting, what goals they have, heck even which people to employ as these CMs/SM 'strategists'.
- Sonny Gill
@Sue I got told I need to be pushing stuff out and that I "listen" I think listening is the MOST valuable part of an org's "social media strategy"
- Arié Moyal
@Arie - I've heard that as well. Honestly haven't kept up on what they've been doing, but their culture has become a lot more rigid from the bits I've read.
- Sonny Gill
So, is this an issue of building trust internally before being able to bridge any sort of trust gap w/your external community?
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny two words: Instant coffee
- Arié Moyal
@Sonny, I think so. Building trust AND being on the same page re: co. philosophy, core of business efforts, and forward moves.
- Teresa Basich
@Lou Not only has Dell done well from a CM perspective, they've been able to show ROI from it
- Arié Moyal
As companies evolve in their use of social media, I think we will see more focused and purpose-specific outreach. For example, setting up a private community for top customers, giving them access to the firm's expert resources, and using the community instead of focus groups to glean insight and market intelligence.
- Lou Ordorica
Private communities for top consumers have been around for a long time - Communispace does that almost exclusively I think
- Arié Moyal
@Arie, you took the words out of my mouth re: Communispace and closed communities.
- Teresa Basich
@Teresa I'm sorry, do you want them back? I didn't meant to take without asking How very un CM of me ;)
- Arié Moyal
@Lou - good insight there and I totally agree. Those focused communities have been and will become even more important as businesses continue to evolve. It's more about a value-proposition (gah - buzzword) for their community vs. constantly pushing and pushing stuff out there.
- Sonny Gill
@Arie, LOL, no, they're just fine with you. Probably happier and better used, actually. :)
- Teresa Basich
Q2 is up!
- Sonny Gill
I think community is about that exactly - community - it's not about the hard sell
- Arié Moyal
The hard sell for CMs is to get the understanding/buy-in of the entire organization :)
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny The irony there is most are hired to be CMs which would imply buy-in to the untrained eye LOL
- Arié Moyal
@Arie - very true and very ironic. We're sometimes in an unfortunate position where many companies don't understand what they exactly need, but CMs looking to get a food in the door and cont. their career path, jump in these roles with the proper mindset, but doesn't mean the co. has the same.
- Sonny Gill
Q4/WRAP-UP: November 6, 2009 - Share your best community resources (not necessarily jobs/job boards - re: competition ;) that can be valuable to people who are on the hunt. (Only if you feel comfortable doing so)
I'll start with http://www.secretsofthejobhunt.com/ - great podcasts and posts that are helpful to any career field you're looking to get into.
- Sonny Gill
LOL my best resource is Sue :-)
- lizGreaux
Good point - she is pretty damn awesome!
- Sonny Gill
that she is :-D
- lizGreaux
Yay Sue!
- Tanya McGinnity
I'm kind of with Liz in that a lot of my resources are people I've connected with.
- Teresa Basich
Oh I am blushing now .... thank you.
- Sue
I figured it'd be a slightly tough question also for ppl wanting to share their resources, outside of Sue ;)
- Sonny Gill
Daniel interviews people about how they got their current job on howigotmyjob.com. Video podcasts
- Joe Kikta
I read and re-read Sally Hogsheads 'Radical Careering' whenever I'm feeling down. http://www.radicalcareering.com/
- Tanya McGinnity
I would have to say Sonny and Brian and them creating cmtychat. Plus Connie Bensen.
- Sue
BUT! Okay, I haven't gotten started yet on the JobAngels volunteer community management gig, but when I do...I think it's going to be an awesome resource for job seekers.
- Teresa Basich
Joe - that's awesome. Thanks for that.
- Sonny Gill
Teresa - that's going to be awesome, for us, as well as for you! JobAngels rocks.
- Sonny Gill
I agree with Sue, too, that this chat is an invaluable resource for sharing and connecting.
- Teresa Basich
Totally agree... These chats invigorate me!
- Tanya McGinnity
I'm a member of the Community Roundtable--a peer-to-peer network of Community practitioners. It does cost to join but we have great discussions. It's run by Rachel Happe and Jim Storer. http://community-roundtable.com/
- Rachel Makool
Thanks so much you guys - Bryan and I wanted to start this for the community and bring some sort of value to you all. Glad it's been a resource in your own respective careers!
- Sonny Gill
As twee as it sounds Twitter. I really have connected with so many great people on there. Who are so giving of their time and resources
- Sue
@Rachel, I love Community Roundtable. I'm not a member but I've heard such great things and really like Jim and Rachel. Glad to hear it's such a good resource for you!
- Teresa Basich
One thing I'll also mention is a core group of colleagues/friends that are somewhat like mentors that you can always reach out to.
- Sonny Gill
I've a close group that's been so helpful in my search, in supporting me, in shooting me leads, connecting me w/folks. Just really great to have them in my corner.
- Sonny Gill
Absolutely, Sonny. Those people lift you up and keep you afloat. They're priceless.
- Teresa Basich
On that note guys and gals - it was a really great chat today! I must jet a couple minutes early to jump on a call, but really appreciate everyone's input today. Many of us are in the same boat and am glad to see that, in some form or another, we're all willing to help each other out during tough times. Cheers!
- Sonny Gill
Thanks, Sonny! Great chat. And thank you to everyone who participated, too -- it was great bouncing thoughts and ideas around in here. :)
- Teresa Basich
Yes, thanks to everybody here for a great chat! @Sonny Thanks for hosting today!
- Joe Kikta
Thanks @Sonny!
- Rachel Makool
Great conversations. I love cmtychat, but it goes so quick. Great questions today.
- Sue
Great chat today as always, thanks again!
- lizGreaux
Q3: November 6, 2009 - Wise words always tell us to network before we need our community. What if you're late to the game, how can you connect with likeminded individuals while gaining value in your search - without the ME mentality?
Wooo! This is what happened to me, late to the networking game. Put out feelers for conversations and ideas you're interested in pursuing and join in. Especially in the online space, people are generally really inviting if you talk kindly with them, ask questions and share your experiences.
- Teresa Basich
T - I didn't think you were late to the game at all. One day I just saw your name pop up and took notice as you were communicating with likeminded folks. Maybe that's why your seemingly 'late' transition didn't seem like one at all to me.
- Sonny Gill
Attend conferences, join online and offline groups, link with former colleagues.
- Rachel Makool
I think you have to be honest and tell everyone" hi, I am here because ......." and ask them to help.
- Sue
I think it's the 'give and ye shall receive' philosophy that has to happen. Sharing (as Teresa just mentioned), posting about jobs (like Sue and Connie do) and being as interested in others as you are in your own search all sound like great moves.
- Tanya McGinnity
@Rachel - joining groups is definitely important. People are joining communities on ning and the like for common causes. You won't be looked at awkwardly if you're a new face to the crowd.
- Sonny Gill
Good advice Rachel
- Sue
@Sonny, I think that's the key. You have to understand that community building and connecting with people takes time. I just wanted to learn -- coming at your networking from a position of learning also helps remove the ME factor, I think. And thanks, that's a definite compliment!
- Teresa Basich
@Tanya - definitely. The problems that some ppl are having is the issue w/immediacy. We live in a NOW world, where things happen and move fast. But of course, that's dependent on the person to realize if that now mentality is gonna work for them or is being helpful going to. They'll find out quick.
- Sonny Gill
I think it's never too late to get in the game. You need to communicate your needs, but also still be willing and ready to help others. Remember that you want to connect with people not just for the short term search but for the long haul as well.
- Joe Kikta
Agree Sonny joining groups with like minded folks, and again networking as well as letting people know what you are looking for and who/what you are
- lizGreaux
@Joe - right on. Going in expecting immediate results isn't the answer either, as I've seen that happen many times. It's sad really because I wish ppl would their communities and network WAY before needed. But you're right, it's never too late.
- Sonny Gill
We talk a lot about online. What can you do OFFLINE with communities that can help in ones search?
- Sonny Gill
I started a local group of Girl Geeks that get together monthly for a dinner and featured speaker. This has been a great way for me to get to know members of many various local communities (designers, gamers, coders, artists, moms, fashion designers and so on). The Girl Geeks have certainly been putting their feelers out for me on places where I could go or speak to their organizations about the need for a community manager.
- Tanya McGinnity
Organize more meetups. Get to know people in person. I think you're more likely to go to the mat for someone you've met in person.
- Joe Kikta
@Tanya, that is such a great idea. Creating groups around a cause or interest and bringing in speakers and holding events that draw a crowd is a great way to meet people.
- Teresa Basich
@Tanya -That's a great example of how you launched a local offline community. Meeting face to face is so important (re: going to conferences, meetups)
- Sonny Gill
@joe - Meetups are great!
- Tanya McGinnity
Conferences are hard to get to, but if you can get to them they're a great opportunity to meet likeminded people.
- Teresa Basich
Though harder - what do you do when you're looking to relocate? We can connect all day online w/ppl around the world, but a lot harder to make time/money to go face to face at your desired locale.
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny That's a good question. I'd consider relocating, but feel I'm at a disadvantage.
- Joe Kikta
Seeing as I'm trying to relocate...I depend so heavily on online interaction for it. I have set up a couple different trips around informational interviews or potential opportunities to show my commitment to leaving California.
- Teresa Basich
Y'all should move to Canada and we'll set up an empire of Community Managers. Mwwhaaah Haa Haa <evil laugh>
- Tanya McGinnity
@Joe - understandably, everyone isn't able to relocate. But yea, it is harder for us who want to move - but like Teresa said, we have to show that commitment as well. That desire.
- Sonny Gill
LOL - I like Tanya's thinking :)
- Sonny Gill
Some of the salaries offered for CM's are on the low end which makes you think twice about relocating. I got short listed for a job and when I found out how low the salary was I turned down the opportunity.
- Sue
Ha! Tanya's got the right idea.
- Teresa Basich
@Tanya :D :D
- Sue
Then again.. I'm the CM who's out of work - so let's scratch that idea!
- Tanya McGinnity
Good point, Sue. Since relocating is part of my agenda, I hope to supplement my work with some freelance writing opportunities. But, the time commitment will be tough. Fingers crossed.
- Teresa Basich
@Sue - those of us wanting to relocate, though flexible, have a lot more to think about when making such a huge move.
- Sonny Gill
There's a definite difference between wanting to relocate and being willing to relocate.
- Teresa Basich
I think that we also have to so much more to self promote ie: webinars I sat in on the Jono Bacon webinar yesterday and was very impressed, but think that each of us who have communities could certainly share our expertise in a similar way. This exposure could lead to pumping up the old resume (ie: I spoke at CMTY chat webinar XYZ)
- Tanya McGinnity
That's an excellent point Tanya
- Sue
Teresa - right on!
- Sonny Gill
It's sometimes the challenge in the industry that only the big gurus get to give their perspective and hence get all the big speaking gigs / contracts.
- Tanya McGinnity
@Tanya - right. What are you doing to help not only move your career forward, but move this industry into a positive direction.
- Sonny Gill
@Tanya, you're so right. Exposure through shared expertise. It shows your knowledge and willingness to share and gets your name out there.
- Teresa Basich
'Q'4 is up!
- Sonny Gill
Q2: November 6, 2009 - Competition. There's TONS of it out there now. How transparent and open should you be with your communities about your search, companies you're contacting, etc. - without feeling like you've tipped others in the process.
I know the 'social' world preaches us differently, but being honest - we still have to watch out for ourselves and what we do, who we confide in and trust, etc.
- Sonny Gill
This is a really good question, because it goes to the idea of whether we're colleagues or competitors.
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
Ah, tricky question. I think you have to be really careful what information you disclose about companies you're in contact with, etc., but telling people about your search...that's not a bad thing.
- Teresa Basich
I have several people who used to work for me looking for jobs. Sometimes they apply for the same job. We have very open conversations about it. I think it's good to know who you're potentially competing with.
- Rachel Makool
@Rachel - it may be good to know, but my thought is if I don't say anything, there's a chance they won't know and there will be less competition.
- Sonny Gill
I had someone in my network as for LinkedIn introduction to a hiring manager in regards to a job we both were applying for. It was awkward.
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
@Daniel - how did you respond? Did you write it?
- Sonny Gill
Agree with Teresa. Let people know what you're looking for, not who you are looking at.
- Chuck Hemann
Yeah, the specific companies you are targeting can be a sticky situation. I met someone once at a networking event that had interviewed for the same exact position I had just interviewed for and it was a little awkward. Still friendly, but awkward.
- Joe Kikta
@Sonny, I feel the same way you do. I'd rather not open up that discussion with others. It's too in-depth.
- Teresa Basich
I've personally had 2 close friends in the SM world get positions for jobs I was after as well. Tough going and how the market is, but they were more high profile and pretty much everyone knew about the openings. The feeling is all the same though.
- Sonny Gill
Sorry. Meant to type ASK. I told him I didn't think it was a good idea and why. It turned out neither of us got the job. I was hoping one of us would get it, though.
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
@sonny That's true in some cases but currently there aren't many roles so there's a good chance that one of your friends or acquaintances knows about the job and will apply. Just this week, a job popped up in the Bay Area and three of my former team members are interested.
- Rachel Makool
Chuck, you said it perfectly. No need to disclose that information to make headway in your search and networking.
- Teresa Basich
@Rachel - that's the monster that is today's job market! It's scary and why we have to sometimes be more strategic in how we communicate with our communities and what's divulged.
- Sonny Gill
I'm in a fairly small city in so most people just assume that I've applied for anything with the words community, social or marketing in it!! Not much choice in my level of transparency!
- Tanya McGinnity
Wise words Chuck
- Sue
Q3 is up!
- Sonny Gill
As is the nature of the beast a large of percentage of the jobs are also on the west coast so there are less opportunities elsewhere.
- Sue
@Sue - Indeed. It's all relative to where you're at personally in life. Geographically, how flexible you are, who you're taking care and where you can go.
- Sonny Gill
Q1: November 6, 2009 - We've seen the job search evolve greatly given new technologies and networks that we have access to today. How can communities help out CMs (and the like) get back on their feet?
Daniel Johnson, Jr. liked this
I think a good place to start is for any CM to share details of jobs they see advertised with other CM's.
- Sue
In my instance I've had an incredible outpouring of people in the local tech community get in touch with me for jobs/companies that they see me fitting with.
- Tanya McGinnity
@Sue - to help spread the word of your interest, who ppl may know and connect you with?
- Sonny Gill
Sue does an incredible job in sharing and spreading the word... Kudos
- Tanya McGinnity
Create awareness. Talk to your community about other CMs you know in need.
- Teresa Basich
@Tanya - definitely. I've experienced the same in my job search and it's amazing how much people WANT to help.
- Sonny Gill
Also, reach out to people about what they're looking for. If you know someone is looking, talk specifics with them. Make connections.
- Teresa Basich
@Tanya I agree Sue is amazing. I think it is all about sharing and networking
- lizGreaux
@sonny yes. I see come across jobs in the weirdest of places and always try and forward the details along. Many of them have different titles so they are not always labeled as "Community Managers"
- Sue
I was thinking a bit about how community members are the best references for community managers in many ways.
- Tanya McGinnity
Thank you Tanya and Sue. I think we are in a tough job with little contact with other CM's. So we need to look out for each other and encourage each other.
- Sue
CM's can't be everywhere, though I'm sure they'd like to be. Have to rely on the community to make them aware of opportunities out there for them.
- Chuck Hemann
@Teresa - I'm glad you noted that, T. Many say 'yes I'll help', but only few get down to the nitty gritty and get to know the person and what they wan.t
- Sonny Gill
@Chuck, so true. There are opportunities out there but it's hard to keep tabs.
- Teresa Basich
Thinking more strategically - should these CM job seekers be open to accepting opportunities within their realm but not FT/paid? To continue their experience while searching for IT.
- Sonny Gill
Being part of a Community/Social Media network of practioners is incredibly helpful.
- Rachel Makool
Are there any job boards for our 'types'?
- Tanya McGinnity
@Sonny, Most people want to help but don't know how. To figure out how to help, you have to ask questions and narrow options down. Creates more opportunities for connection.
- Teresa Basich
re: your question Sonny...that probably depends largely on a person's professional experience. Lots of experience and folks are probably less likely to accept something like that. Lesser experienced folks, probably would.
- Chuck Hemann
Great question, Sonny. I think you have to be really careful about those opportunities -- choose wisely, because often you can find your time being driven by volunteer, unpaid opps.
- Teresa Basich
not unlike what happens with traditional PR students...many, especially now, are taking paid (and even unpaid) internships in order to keep gaining experience
- Chuck Hemann
@Tanya. I believe Connie Bensen has got a job board now, and I try and post all the jobs I see on my discussion board. If no one minds here is the link: http://ocmforum.com/forum...
- Sue
The problem is, if you've been out of work for an extended period of time, people will want to see your filling your time with various opportunities, not JUST job searching.
- Teresa Basich
I'm seeing more Community & Social Media managers positions pop up but not many Director or VP roles.
- Rachel Makool
Thank you, Sue! Great resource.
- Teresa Basich
Teresa/Chuck - I hear ya. That's a scary part of what's going on in this job market that some people are somewhat 'forced' to take these other opps just to fill their resume, build their experience, but in a smaller role.
- Sonny Gill
I'm seeing more community manager internships now too
- Sue
Thanks for that link Sue! Very good.
- Tanya McGinnity
@Sonny, that's been one of the hardest things for me, juggling projects to gain more experience while managing the search. Not an easy task.
- Teresa Basich
@Sue - yes, CM/SM internships. Do you feel these companies are afraid to hire FT, not sure what it all means, or just don't give CMs enough credit for what they do within an org?
- Sonny Gill
How does one manage an internship while still needing to find FT work? That's always been a show-stopper for me.
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
@sonny. I think they are afraid to commit to a full-time person.
- Sue
@Teresa - totally with you there. I become hesitant at times to accept numerous projects, but know it'll benefit me - even if ti does cut into me searching for a FT role.
- Sonny Gill
@Sonny @Teresa - I wouldn't necessarily see it as a "lesser" role (unless it's just flatly way below your skill level). I'd see it as an opp to continue building a skill set, but also an opp to make an impression on a future employer.
- Chuck Hemann
Moreover, why would a company or brand trust their communication to an intern?
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
@Daniel - that's definitely tough to balance the two. You've got to make time for the latter for sure, but if the internship is taking up all your time, you may have to reevaluate what you're doing.
- Sonny Gill
Not many remote jobs either, so it's hard to move lock, stock and barrel when you are not sure how committed the employer is to the CM role.
- Sue
As a Canadian, there are much fewer CM roles so being able to telework would be ideal, but isn't the reality just yet.
- Tanya McGinnity
I'm sort of kicking myself right now, because I didn't go for a part-time internship, because of the low wage and commitment required. Now that person has an in for a possible full-time gig in same organization.
- Joe Kikta
@Sue - for those needing remote positions. Can job seekers 'sway' employers or educate them on how CM roles can be well managed remotely.
- Sonny Gill
@Joe, I think that's what happens with quite a few internships -- it's like a trial run, you know? Don't kick yourself, just keep moving.
- Teresa Basich
Many of you are really speaking to a few issues I have about the way CM is viewed - many are afraid of hiring Full Time, many pay low wages, view it as a support role rather than a strategy position. How do we break this kind of perception?
- Tanya McGinnity
I'd be more likely to go for a contract position, but not an internship.
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
@Joe - That stinks but it's something we second guess sometimes being on the job search. The thing is - we sometimes ahve to get over our own egos and what we think we deserve, to instead grind it out and get to that goal of ours. Not saying you, specifically. But it's with internships, projects, etc. I've done the same.
- Sonny Gill
I think its possible yes, but extremely difficult. You would really have to sell yourself.
- Sue
Sometimes hard to think long-term strategic when the short-term view is not good.
- Joe Kikta
There are definitely more contract or temp-to-hire positions available than FT positions. Fear of financial commitment to a fairly new role.
- Teresa Basich
Hate to bring up the word, but monetization is key. Curious how many community managers work on that piece as well. Building your resume in that area might help with job search.
- Karen Gutierrez
Q2 is up folks!
- Sonny Gill
@Tanya, yes that is so true. I don't know the answer to that. I think it's a time thing. That as time goes on it the CM role will be viewed in a more prominent light.
- Sue
@Joe - I definitely hear ya re: long-term vs. short-term. It's a battle with ourselves, let alone the job market itself.
- Sonny Gill
Could it also be an accreditation issue. We don't necessarily get degrees or go to school to become a CM..
- Tanya McGinnity
@Tanya. I think that is a valid point. If you look at job descriptions the requirements each employer wants differs widely. Whilst mainstream jobs generally have a standard skill set they are looking for. CM role is still so new that its hard for employers to know what to ask for.
- Sue
WELCOME: November 6, 2009 - Welcome folks to this week's CmtyChat! Can't believe it's November already but it's a great time of year. Feel free to introduce yourself, what you do, and how we can help you.
Daniel Johnson, Jr. liked this
Hi! I'm Tanya - a newly out of work community manager here in Canada so I'm sure this session is REALLY going to help me :)
- Tanya McGinnity
Hey Tanya! We're actually using your suggestion from last week as a starting point, so thank you!
- Sonny Gill
Sonny - I appreciate it! I was so busy applying for jobs that I forgot I suggested it!
- Tanya McGinnity
Hi Sonny, hi Tanya, hi everyone :)
- Sue
Hi Sue.
- Tanya McGinnity
Hey Sure! How are ya?
- Sonny Gill
We'll let the late ones sneak into the classroom ;) Let's kick things off with Q1
- Sonny Gill
Hi Everyone
- lizGreaux
Hi Liz
- Tanya McGinnity
Hi Liz
- Sue
Hey Liz - thanks for joining us :)
- Sonny Gill
Hi everyone!
- Teresa Basich
Hi, I'm Chuck and addicted to social media.
- Chuck Hemann
Joe here, back for some more learning. Looking for marketing gigs that ideally involve Social Media.
- Joe Kikta
I'm Daniel Johnson, Jr., and I'm a Social Media Manager on the Loose in Cincinnati, Ohio. Currently participating in National Podcaster Post Month.
- Daniel Johnson, Jr.
Hi, I'm Rachel, live in San Francisco, used to manage Community for eBay and am now consulting.
- Rachel Makool
WRAP UP: October 30, 2009 We’re coming to the end of the hour…thanks for the good tips on how small businesses can use social media. As social media goes more ‘mainstream’, more small businesses will be faced with how to devote their precious few resources to drive business, so this will be the next big problem to solve in our industry. Thank you...
Thanks Mark! great discussion and ideas today. Have a great weekend!
- lizGreaux
thanks, liz...nice meeting you!
- mark williams
Thanks Mark. Great job! Nice to meet all of you.
- Tanya McGinnity
have a fun Halloween, Tanya!
- mark williams
@Tanya Check your e-mail! Later everyone I'm late for a call!
- Arié Moyal
Thanks for hosting today Mark! Great Job!
- Joe Kikta
bye folks - thanks for allowing me a flyby! ;-)
- Jim Storer
Q3: October 30, 2009: Given a budget of say...$50K per year to invest in social media programs, (including time/salary) how would you recommend a small business invest it? (community platform, blog, viral contests, anything else?)
I'd recommend they hire someone to teach them how to get the most out of free tools and an SM savvy VA to help manage it and then I'd focus on contests but it depends on the business - I'm currently coaching a business coaching company on customer engagment and those are a few of the things we're working on
- Arié Moyal
This will definitely vary widely by your type of business and what goals you have.
- Joe Kikta
Assuming the salary part might be for a separate part-timer to work on social media programs, or for training, as Arie suggests.
- Bryan Person
Much of this is more going to involve *time,* which is, of course, money in the end. Big community platform is probably out (too $$$), but a smaller one may work. Blog probably depends on the biz having someone who can blog decently.
- Bryan Person
okay...I'll toss out some random small businesses and maybe folks will brainstorm? These are actual businesses that I know of, but are NOT clients. How about a campground. How would you spend their $50K budget?
- mark williams
I agree with @Arie
- lizGreaux
I'd recommend determining clear goals first. There is no money to waste going places where your customers or potential customers don't frequent.
- Angela
for the campground, I might actually start with discussion boards on their site. so users can connect and ask about local amenities, whether there are bugs/snakes in the area etc.
- mark williams
@Angela...let's assume that most small businesses would say their goal is to drive sales.
- mark williams
doing a flyby in between calls...
- Jim Storer
(and granted, that might not be realistic, but that's probably how they would state their goal.)how would you advise them?
- mark williams
hey Jim!
- Arié Moyal
as others have mentioned, it really varies based on type of business and goals.. but I think taking a look at a listening service and joining the conversations happening elsewhere will give you the most bang for your buck.
- Jim Storer
@ Angela Too true. Goal setting is most important. It helps determine success.
- Arié Moyal
hi arie... sorry i'm so late
- Jim Storer
We'll forgive you this time - Right guys? :0
- Arié Moyal
what about a local movie theater? How would you recommend they spend their $50K budget?
- mark williams
As a CM who is still identifying community members listening is the biggest part of my job
- Arié Moyal
let's assume that the small business owner has come to you and said "I've heard I have to be using social media to market my business. I have $50K. Tell me what to do."
- mark williams
if it is local i'd probably be out on the street more and connecting to the people who already come often
- Arié Moyal
@Arie...once you listen...are you engaging too? What form does your engagement take?
- mark williams
@ mark I engage when appropriate So far it's been more responding to tweets and being helpful if I can
- Arié Moyal
ok - movie theater owner... if i already have a web presence, i'd probably create a blog and do as Arie said... get out on the street more and connecting to the people who already come often... highlight other local businesses and figure out how to become a more robust member of the community (vs just a business)
- Jim Storer
@ Jim Yep! it's about the offline a lot more than the online for local business imho But giving memebers of your community recognition online is helpful Also it would depends on the movies they played in the theatre - I might set up a wiki or discussion forum for movie buffs
- Arié Moyal
The first thing i would say to someone who came to me with 50k burning a hole in their pocket would be "Why?"
- Arié Moyal
lol @Arie. I would assume because they want to turn that $$ into more sales.
- mark williams
Teaming up with local businesses to offer a complete "experience" is a good idea.
- Joe Kikta
@ Joe & @ Jim Indeed it's all about co-petition
- Arié Moyal
that's definitely the new trend, @Joe..."experience marketing". I think social media is an excellent tool...especially a blog....is a good way of sharing the experience with others vicariously.
- mark williams
In many cases, folks like to see quick results as well as have an opportunity to tell their story. A blog is a great low-cost way to be able to express yourself and your business in more than 140 characters plus in anchors nicely to your existing website.
- Tanya McGinnity
@ mark Sure but I'd ask them why they think spending 50k on online activities is the best
- Arié Moyal
@ mark Not everyone is a good blogger
- Arié Moyal
be sure to allow a "subscribe to this blog via email" option... best option to build a strong DB of passionate local folks. Spend some of that money to host special night (i.e. show Halloween on Halloween).
- Jim Storer
@Arie..nice! I like that word--co-petition.
- mark williams
side note: i miss the small, local movie theaters...
- Jim Storer
@Arie @Jim Participating in the local Chamber too, as a part. @Mark Agree. The wiki idea not a bad one either
- Joe Kikta
excellent suggestion on local Chamber and I like to remind folks that *email* is a social media tool too.
- mark williams
tanya - i agree a blog is a good anchor for other socmed efforts (i.e. twitter, youtube, etc)
- Jim Storer
so emailing your other Chamber members with your sales/specials or industry insights is a way of being social locally too.
- mark williams
@ Jim Great to build a DB yes but like Bryan said at SMB15 in Boston Don't use that list in the wrong way
- Arié Moyal
@Mark Not sure I agree with email as Social Media... Unless it's a two-way discussion, not Social Media
- Joe Kikta
adding social media buttons/widgets to your website is not a bad idea
- Arié Moyal
@arie - always be careful with how you use your house list... always. with blog subscribers, you can create a new post that achieves your objective (announce an upcoming event, etc.) and you're not spamming them.
- Jim Storer
Sure Joe but there are ways of inviting that discussion Especially if you write the e-mail in a way that invites them to share
- Arié Moyal
SMB15... how do you remember that? i barely remember 11/29
- Jim Storer
Haha I have a long unforgiving memory and there was a handout :P
- Arié Moyal
email = social media? i think it's a semantic discussion. email can support social, but agree it's not really what I think of when someone says socmed.
- Jim Storer
No it's not necessarily SM but it's an engagement tool
- Arié Moyal
@Joe...yes, many businesses use email as a broadcast mechanism, which is wrong imo. I answer all my emails people send to me, so I think the core concept of SoMe is that a business should act like a person.
- mark williams
@Jim You beat me to it. Well said. Can support, but not social by nature
- Joe Kikta
@Mark I guess it is all in how you utilize it. Twitter is not really Social Media for some either
- Joe Kikta
@Joe Check me out I'm using SM See? This is my latest blogpost and this is my achievement - Look at me I'm tweeting - I need 100 more followers - ooh lloky I'm social
- Arié Moyal
Email can be a great way to showcase a community member, supplier, contest winner so that extends it from just being a mechanism to only speak about yourself. I do agree it doesn't lend itself to being very social, but it can show personality more so than what I usually see done by most businesses.
- Tanya McGinnity
yep @Joe. Without getting too deep into the semantic discussion, I consider my email address a more personal access to ME, socially. An email is a direct conversation. (or could be) But maybe my definition of 'social' is too broad.
- mark williams
anyway...I have to go be social with a few workmates in 12 minutes...aka "a meeting". nice chatting with everyone and will see you next week!
- mark williams
Q2: October 30, 2009: What about Facebook Fan Pages or Groups as a platform for small businesses? How would you recommend a small business engage on FB...or would you?
So far, it seems like for small biz it can be hard to get enough Fans to generate a significant interractions on FB. And most are using it as a broadcast tool anyway.
- Beth Brodovsky
@Beth ironic isn't it? Since FB allows one to be more personal than Twitter, imo.
- mark williams
@Beth...do you have a FB Group or Fan Page set up for your biz?
- mark williams
@Mark Yes and No. There are opportunities to share more personal content, but how many take advantage? How many just play games and take quizzes?
- Joe Kikta
good q, @Joe. Of the people I know, MOST don't take quizzes or play games.
- mark williams
Well I dont think there's any harm in putting social media buttons on your website - if you have a website
- Arié Moyal
Of the 150 or so FB friends I have, gamers and quiz takers represent maybe 20% of my friends. But that could be representative of my friends, and not FB in general. How about your friends?
- mark williams
It depends on your demographic - Some people will - the point with facebook is that a lot of the internet connected world is on there
- Arié Moyal
Although I've had interesting conversations with people on FB, I've had more on Twitter. I think it's because it's more public and searchable. Easier to target people with similar interests
- Joe Kikta
@Tanya....loved your idea about promotions (and discount codes) on Twitter...does that lend itself to FB as well, or would you expect a smaller return on FB?
- mark williams
@Joe...you bring up a good point...it seems to me that there are either Twitter people or Facebook people...but only a relatively few use both platforms equally. Do you find that to be true?
- mark williams
Joe i thik the idea with facebook is to drive website traffic to facebook so you can interact with them and they can interact with each other
- Arié Moyal
There is defintely an easier *in* on twitter - It's easier to listen there
- Arié Moyal
Let me also mention that Twitter is more Open. By that, I mean that people are more open to friending/sharing with new people.
- Joe Kikta
The ties are a lot looser on twitter than on facebook - part of that is the reciprocity requirement on FB
- Arié Moyal
@mark - I agree with the Twitter people / FB people distinction. My FB group is mainly comprised of family / non tech folks whereas Twitter is a much tech savvier crew. I'm sure I might be generalizing here but this is just my experience.
- Tanya McGinnity
@Mark I think most people have a strong preference one way or the other
- Joe Kikta
@ Mark Re: return on fb - I'd say the return on FB is probably larger since there are more people there - but it can;t hurt to run the same promo on both and use different codes
- Arié Moyal
so maybe Twitter is good for introducing yourself to new customers, and FB is better at deepening relationships with existing one?s Is that a fair suggestion for small businesses?
- mark williams
twitter can't go mainstream until it's easier to "get" I also think the openness freaks people out
- Arié Moyal
@Arie I think it depends on your product or service and your brand name. I think it's easier to attract followers on Twitter than Fans (that pay attention) on FB.
- Joe Kikta
I think location has much to do with this as well. If you are a local business, then starting with building connections with the local Twitterites is quite important as a first step. I think a FB fan page comes after you've built a local following- otherwise it's pretty much just a group of you, your mom and a handful of folks who like you or your business and care enough to support you.
- Tanya McGinnity
@Tanya...that's really good advice, imo.
- mark williams
feel free to keep this discussion going...and...just posted Q3. :-)
- mark williams
Joe it defintely depends - For some businesses I'd stay away from SM :)
- Arié Moyal
@ Tanya I think you can encourage people to become fans via your website but there is no question that the offline is just as important as the online if not more
- Arié Moyal
@Tanya Well said. @Arie I'm not saying to stay away! Be smart though :)
- Joe Kikta
Hi everybody. I just interviewed a local company for a story I'm writing for EContent magazine and they shared a great tactic they use on Facebook. They call it "Facebook Friday's." The store manager posts a new product or item they 'd like to get more sales on every Monday and people discuss it all week. they give it away on Fridays. Drives monster sales for that product.
- Angela
@ Angela Sounds interesting!
- Arié Moyal
@Angela That's really cool. I'm sure people look forward to this and tell their friends who might not know about this shop.
- Tanya McGinnity
Yes @Tanya and @Arie. I spent some time observing the process before deciding to write about it and it works big time. the customers comment ad naseum about these products.
- Angela
So it would appear that SM works well for companies with a diverse or constantly evolving product offering and those that feed hungry SMites - Any other examples?
- Arié Moyal
Now I suspect it would also depend on the business and the type of products. For instance, if the products are embarrassing or private, that company may not have much luck on FB.
- Angela
I've seen flickr used exceptionally by a local cupcake shop. When users search for photos of creative cupcakes, hers show up and they truly show off how creative she is.
- Tanya McGinnity
Love that @Tanya! Can you send me a link?
- Angela
@ Tanya did you see the QR code cupcakes @clever_cupcakes made? The QR code directs you to her website Too cool :)
- Arié Moyal
http://www.flickr.com/photos... This is just a small set of photos that had created a lot of chatter in the community - both local and international (so much that someone in Bahrain is copying her style!)
- Tanya McGinnity
RANDOM: October 30, 2009: Hello, and welcome to Community Chat! I’m Mark Williams, a senior community manager at LiveWorld and I’m filling in for Bryan Person today. Please take moment to introduce yourself, and suggest topics for future #CmtyChat discussions.
I'm still learning how to use the interface, so those deleted comments you might see are mine, btw!
- mark williams
Hi Mark! I'm Arié, the community manager for babyTEL, a VoIP company here in Montreal
- Arié Moyal
Doing OK so far, Mark!
- Bryan Person
Hi All. Sue John CM for a large expat site
- Sue
nice to meet you Arie!
- mark williams
I'm Beth and I own a small business (membership marketing) & spend significant time every day using social media, but I train, speak and consult on it so I doubt I am the norm.
- Beth Brodovsky
haha...Beth...are ANY of us in here the norm? :-)
- mark williams
Its always hard as zealots to remember where others are.
- Beth Brodovsky
I'd like to throw a few stats out from the US Small Business Administration to help frame today's discussion.
- mark williams
99% of all US businesses are considered small business=less than 500 employees
- mark williams
of those...80% are single proprietors with NO employees
- mark williams
I'm Tanya... I'm a newly unemployed Community Manager and I'd love to have a discussion at some point on how communities have helped out of work CM's get back on their feet again. I'm experiencing some great community love currently and would love to see if others have had this experience.
- Tanya McGinnity
of the remaining, 66% have fewer than 10 employees...80% have fewer than 20.
- mark williams
That doesn't surprise me.
- Beth Brodovsky
25% of these businesses have revenue of less than $100K per year. and 75% have revenue of $500K per year.
- mark williams
So, lots of solopreneurs.
- Bryan Person
yes, Bryan...or few hands, doing much work.
- mark williams
and ma