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Danaa › Comments

Sean McBride
Scorched earth created by Netanyahu's Congress speech is spreading - West of Eden - Israel News | Haaretz (Chemi Shalev) - http://www.haaretz.com/blogs...
Scorched earth created by Netanyahu's Congress speech is spreading - West of Eden - Israel News | Haaretz (Chemi Shalev)
"And now the prime minister's loyalists plan to pour even more high-octane fuel on the burning fires of U.S.-Israeli relations." - Sean McBride from Bookmarklet
"So this is their plan: to inject even more inter-party venom into hitherto bipartisan support for Israel, to pour high-octane political fuel on the already burning fires, to stain Obama loyalists as Israel-haters whose place is outside the fence, where they should remain." - Sean McBride
Smear not only as Israel-haters -- but as America-haters. (And Amalek, Jew-haters, enemies of the West, etc. -- the usual litany and rant.) - Sean McBride
The biblical/Torah subtext behind the mindset of many Zionists: anyone in the world who won't bow down before the absolute authority of the Israeli government is an enemy of God and worthy of destruction. - Sean McBride
By all means, let israel be the wedge between black and hispanic Democratic representatives and the all-for-israel, all-the-time party. Black people take very seriously the disrespect Obama aspect of Netanyahu ploy. Counter to what may appear on the surface, blacks (and to a lesser degree hispanics) have not been deaf to the increasingly outright racist tone of the shrill critiques of... more... - Danaa
Giseon Levy is right. We should thank nethanyahoo every day. The gift that keeps on giving. Do vote for him, Israel. Please. - Danaa
Sean McBride
PressTV: 'Saudi princes patrons of al-Qaeda' - http://www.presstv.ir/Detail...
PressTV: 'Saudi princes patrons of al-Qaeda'
"A former al-Qaeda operative imprisoned in the United States has told lawyers that members of the Saudi royal family provided millions of dollars to the terrorist group in the 1990s." - Sean McBride from Bookmarklet
"US officials assert that the attacks were carried out by al-Qaeda terrorists but many analysts say it was a false-flag operation and that bin Laden was just a bogeyman for the US military-industrial complex. They believe rogue elements within the US government orchestrated or at least encouraged the 9/11 attacks in order to boost the US economy and advance the Zionist agenda." - Sean McBride
"In an interview with Press TV in April last year, American scholar Dr. Kevin Barrett said that the intelligence agencies of the US, Israel and Saudi Arabia played important roles in planning and orchestrating the September 11 attacks. He added that 9/11 was not a hijacking incident but a military attack. “There was in fact no hijacking in 9/11. It was a simulated hijacking and in fact it was a military attack.”" - Sean McBride
So far Mondoweiss has shown no interest in important breaking news about Saudi Arabia. - Sean McBride
MW has also not shown any interest in news about what's going on in the Ukraine, or in Syria (the two are linked quite obviously, via the neocon front against Russia). Even more interesting is that The Intercept showed zero interest in Ukraine, which is where much of the action is at the moment. - Danaa
Apropos the Debaltsevo cauldron: seems to me that the more left leaning and/or pro-Palestinian alternative media outlets are in an informational cauldron of sorts too. They are effectively "cordoned off" behind imaginary Majino lines. That's what's happened to MW - their "sphere of interest" has been deliberately and methodically shrunk to one little pocket. As long as they stick to... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- that cordoning off you mention is often disappointing. Part of the problem may be a lack of interest in international geopolitics by the MW administrators -- and an overly ethnocentric approach to the world. Antiwar.com, Consortium News, The American Conservative, Lobelog, Global Research, Counterpunch and many other sites often do a better job of situating and explaining... more... - Sean McBride
This breaking Saudi story is huge. (And I could smell it coming it months ago -- it has been simmering in the background for quite some time.) Now even the New York Times has given it a push forward. - Sean McBride
google nick berg to find out why mondo and intercept won't touch the saudi angle with a 10 foot pole. - pepsi
I analyzed the Nick Berg story in real time while it was first unfolding -- it sure looked like a false flag op -- a forerunner of the ISIS/ISIL atrocity videos. - Sean McBride
# Google "nick berg" in combination with 1. 9/11 2. fake 3. false flag 4. hoax 5. jack blood 6. mossad 7. video - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Benjamin Netanyahu at Paris victims' funeral: Time for civilized world to uproot enemies in our midst - Israel News - Jerusalem Post - http://www.jpost.com/Israel-...
Benjamin Netanyahu at Paris victims' funeral: Time for civilized world to uproot enemies in our midst - Israel News - Jerusalem Post
BEGIN QUOTE "These aren’t just enemies of the Jews, but all of humanity," the prime minister said. "It’s about time that all of the civilized world unite and uproot these enemies from our midst.".... The prime minister praised "the spirit of the Jewish community in France," which remains "totally connected with Am Yisrael ("the nation of Israel"), Eretz Yisrael ("the land of Israel"), and Torat Yisrael ("the Torah of Israel"). END QUOTE - Sean McBride
The best thing for the French jews who agree with the connection to the "Jewish state" is to go there and join them in their abominable path to perdition. I kind of doubt that at this point most French people will mind all that much if their entire jewish community (or at least that fraction that pledges allegance to the "Jewish" state of netanyahoo, liberman and bennett) just upped and... more... - Danaa
Sean McBride
US worried by 'rising tide' of European anti-Semitism | The Times of Israel - http://www.timesofisrael.com/us-worr...
US worried by 'rising tide' of European anti-Semitism | The Times of Israel
"White House chief of staff promises Washington will wage ‘tireless’ fight against Jew hatred" - Sean McBride from Bookmarklet
"In an emotional speech to the French parliament Tuesday, Prime Minister Manuel Valls spoke out against what he called “the new anti-Semitism,” which was being spread via the Internet." - Sean McBride
The more they crack down on free speech against the abominable Israel and its supporters, the more hatred will be directed against the Jews who support it. The more conspiracy theories of all kinds will grow in the shadow. Already a very large fraction (perhaps 1/3) of the people in Europe and may be at least 20% in the US believe that zionism is a global ideology seeking to control the financial markets and manage geopolitical outlooks to benefit the abominable state. - Danaa
Just looking at the videos showing the yahoo elbowing a black head of state and a woman French parliamentarian to "get to the head of the line", one gets the idea that in israel we are dealing with a bully that knows no curbs on civilized behavior. - Danaa
Those jewish people that succumbed to pressure and let their French relatives be buried in israel will do a lot to convince the people of Europe that the Jews among them are not exactly "one of them"> Why else would they not be buried in a french cemetery? - Danaa
Sean McBride
Jeffrey Epstein's Connections (NNDB Mapper) - http://mapper.nndb.com/maps...
Jeffrey Epstein's Connections (NNDB Mapper)
It is much more efficient to present this kind of data -- mapping social relations -- with simple plain text category/instance pairs: - Sean McBride
1. c; Jeffrey Epstein address; * 2. c; Jeffrey Epstein affiliation; * 3. c; Jeffrey Epstein associate; * 4. c; Jeffrey Epstein association; * 5. c; Jeffrey Epstein category; * 6. c; Jeffrey Epstein client; * 7. c; Jeffrey Epstein company; * 8. c; Jeffrey Epstein dislike; * 9. c; Jeffrey Epstein donee; * 10. c; Jeffrey Epstein employee; * 11. c; Jeffrey Epstein employer; * 12. c; Jeffrey... more... - Sean McBride
Simple text often beats fancy graphics for communicating semantic knowledge about the world. But you need a formal and consistent knowledge representation scheme. - Sean McBride
This graphic presentation is wonderful. It makes things clear in a snap - like a bird's eye view. The Map is easily followed and I really like the presentation. beats reams of words anytime by showing up the networks in all their tentacles. the one improvement I'd do is to add a third dimension. Some of the key connections cannot be easily perceived in 2 dimensional space because there are overarching connections best illustrated on a third axis. - Danaa
I think this graph is very cool and useful -- and I hope this graphic mapping technology for social networks continues to develop -- but I find it a bit difficult to scan and grok all the relations among entities in this format -- perhaps it's just me. Simple permuted text lists in table columns I can absorb at the speed of light -- zap -- especially all the tiny details. - Sean McBride
Whatever information and knowledge tools work, use them -- all of them in combination. - Sean McBride
Another way to go at this, with compound categories: - Sean McBride
1. c; Jeffrey Epstein associate+billionaire; * 2. c; Jeffrey Epstein associate+CFR member; * 3. c; Jeffrey Epstein associate+Harvard University professor; * 4. c; Jeffrey Epstein associate+Israel lobby leader; * 5. c; Jeffrey Epstein associate+Israeli leader; * // a few examples - Sean McBride
As fine-grained as you like. - Sean McBride
I still prefer the graphics. Most people would prefer them too, I believe. Pictures sometimes speak much louder and far more clearly than mere words. - Danaa
I prefer data visualization for macro analysis; text-based tables for micro analysis -- for drilling down deep into atomic structures. Eventually methods may be developed for zooming in and out of huge and complex datasets, at whatever level, purely with data visualization and graphs. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
On using streaming notebooks to manage all your writing and notes
I am posting here an example from my notebook -- just a few hours of writing from this morning (click on "notebook sample.txt" above). The key conventions: use a single semicolon at the beginning of a line to separate notes -- add text to the semicolons if you want to provide titles or tags for notes. Begin each day by designating the current date after a semicolon divider. You are basically pouring all your thoughts, notes and compositions into a single forward-moving journal -- one text file per year. Editing any previous notes is a breeze -- just search or browse backwards. - Sean McBride
Advantages: 1. you don't need to keep switching among dozens or hundreds of files 2. you never lose anything (assuming you have backed up your notebook to multiple local and cloud locations) 3. you can instantly retrieve anything you have ever written over years or decades 4. think and type with minimum friction - Sean McBride
Also: notice how easy it is to share long-form texts and essays on Friendfeed. Just upload them with your posts. - Sean McBride
(This is mostly for Danaa -- we've discussed this before.) - Sean McBride
# what you can do with a streaming notebook (all in one file) 1. compose articles 2. compose books 3. compose comments 4. compose email messages 5. compose notes 6. compose tweets 7. create journal entries 8. create lists 9. create reminders 10. create to do lists 11. plan projects 12. save citations 13. save contact information 14. save links 15. save quotes 16. track expenses - Sean McBride
Thanks Sean. I guess I can use my own, computer provided notebook text file, since that's what you seem to have. I never used it before but it's on the desktop. This seems like a good way to write posts with the confidence they'll remain. Now I kind of dislike the appearance, the type and the streaming format, but if I could just get into a more organized frame of mine, I could at the end of every couple of days, sort those chunks among the different word files I keep on various topics. - Danaa
The one caveat I have is that I could have done the same using a single word file, and I used to a while back. The problem, I fear, remains as always my chaotic self. I stopped doing the organization I needed to do and then things got too voluminous. - Danaa
Danaa -- what's nice about this method is that you don't need any special software -- just a competent text editor or word processor. If you want to sift through and sort your notes spanning years or decades, use a search/grep program like Examine32 or dtSearch. I've been using this method for years, and love it -- and I've tried everything else out there. - Sean McBride
I just noticed that my conciousness has the same trouble with 'text' as it does with FF. Something about the type setting totally does not appeal to me. Yes, I do have a sense of order residing somewhere in the midst of chaos, and unfortunately that sense is perfectionist. How can tendency to chaos and preference for perfection exist in a single mind? - Danaa
The key to pulling together all your material scattered across long periods of time is to use the search programs I mentioned above -- combined with your own personal tagging scheme. - Sean McBride
Consider yourself lucky and gifted -- internal contradictions tend to be energizing -- to keep your mind moving -- ever in quest of harmony. - Sean McBride
Since I happen to have a perfectly good Word program I see no reason to not use it. I expect some version of word or equivalent will remain around forever. Howevr your tip on those search programs is welcome. Seeing how I 'lost" a comment which was entered into the wrong file, I can see why that would be handy. I'll try them later, see if they work for me. - Danaa
There is always another option: use Evernote or Google Keep. But I find that they interrupt my flow of thought -- all those zillions of discrete notes -- too clunky. - Sean McBride
Quest for harmony - I'll try and conjure up that sense in my next filing for the IRS. I am sure they are getting tired of all the extra notes I send in with my return, which almost always include a list of fine excuses for being a bit on the late side. In fact the 'quest for harmony" will be my next excuse. It's a good one. - Danaa
Did you use Evernote? I have not installed it yet. Is that as prone to NSA snoop-and-poop as Dropbox or the cloud9s)? - Danaa
I do in fact use Evernote for a very limited range of notes -- those that I want to access both through my laptop and smartphone. And for what it does, it is truly a great program. Regarding protecting my privacy from NSA and similar organizations -- I gave up on that years ago -- it's not possible -- they are too good. - Sean McBride
Regarding personal tags -- an example. If, for instance, you compose a Mondoweiss comment to, say, Citizen, add the words "mondoweiss citizen" after the semicolon divider that starts the note. Then search on "; mondoweiss citizen" to instantly retrieve any comments you have ever directed to Citizen. Create whatever tagging scheme suits you. - Sean McBride
Why I like text editors better than word processors -- they are clean and minimal. When I am thinking and writing, I don't want to be bothered by a dizzying array of formatting options -- keep it close to the bone -- focused on ideas and information. I find Microsoft Word to be too cluttered. (But Word is good for creating pretty and polished documents for formal publication.) - Sean McBride
Word can be used like a text however. You don't need to activate any of the formatting options, though I can understand that their mere presence at the top of the document can be a bother to some. One click deactivates the menu though, making the whole thing look very much like a text file. Sometimes I use bolds and fontss to highlight a sentence or a word. Which kind of works for me.... more... - Danaa
Here's an advantage of Notebook - the properties are not saved, so there's no danger of disclosing unwanted authorship for example if one wishes to send annonymously. Word always save the properties. One has to manually remove them if so desired and who can remember to do that ? by contrast, an empty slate seems to be the default mode in Text (except Rtf). - Danaa
Danaa -- true -- you can use Word in text mode. But there is a cult of the text editor, of which I am a member. You might want to take a look at Notepad++, Textpad or Sublime Text sometime. They are brilliant and highly refined tools. - Sean McBride
Regarding note separators: I use a semicolon at the beginning of a line because it is so easy to type. But use whatever separator works for you -- that is aesthetically pleasing, perhaps. - Sean McBride
Oh, the embarrassing stories I could tell you about that hidden data in Word -- business deals blown, you name it. Text files (in text editors) are perfectly transparent. - Sean McBride
There is a much larger dimension to this streaming notebook convention that I haven't mentioned -- using semantic markup. For instance, at the most basic level you can start one-line notes with simple tags: "book;" for a book citation / "article;" for an article citation / "contact;" for contact data / "expense;" for an expense / "do;" for a to do item / "video;" for a video citation --... more... - Sean McBride
And one can even abbreviate those tags to further streamline your typing: a; / b; / and so on. - Sean McBride
Another aspect of this: you may think that a year's worth of writing and notes stored in a single text file might become too enormous to handle. For instance, I just noticed that my "notes 2014.txt" file is over 5GB. But the truth is that PCs and text editors have become so powerful that you can spin a 5GB file around on the tip of your little finger (or on the head of a pin) -- navigate it with speed and ease. - Sean McBride
I just noticed that files uploaded with Friendfeed posts are provided with a clickable link -- for instance [notebook sample.txt http://m.friendfeed-media.com/671763d...] -- which is pretty cool. They can be pointed to and opened with any browser from anywhere on the Internet. - Sean McBride
Streaming notebooks are perfect for brainstorming and stream-of-consciousness writing. - Sean McBride
Another take on this: - Sean McBride
# what one can compose or store in streaming notebooks 1. articles 2. blog posts 3. book chapters 4. books 5. citations 6. contact information 7. email messages 8. essays 9. expenses 10. facts 11. Internet comments 12. journal entries 13. lists 14. notes 15. passwords 16. personal data 17. programming code 18. project plans 19. quotes 20. reminders 21. search expressions 22. shopping lists 23. statistics 24. to do lists 25. tweets 26. web links - Sean McBride
Everything I have posted on the Internet has been composed in my streaming notebook -- I can quickly scan back in time over years to see what was on mind, what was going on in my life and what discussions I was involved in on any particular day. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
What Mondoweiss means to me
A brilliant blog, created by an individual -- Phil Weiss -- that has been gradually degraded by the presence of mediocre hangers-on. - Sean McBride
The problems with the blog began when it acquired the ambition to morph into an activist political organization with a party line. Since then, the quality of commentary and discussion on Mondoweiss has continued to decline. Creative thinking and party lines mix like oil and water. - Sean McBride
Recommendation: Phil should follow the example of Andrew Sullivan, Juan Cole, Richard Silverstein, Gilad Atzmon and other standalone bloggers -- keep Mondoweiss oriented around his own idiosyncratic thought processes, however they evolve. Don't try to shoehorn Mondoweiss into any cut-and-dried political movement -- that will just drag him down. - Sean McBride
Dis you post this comment? - Danaa
I wouldn't dare to try to post this comment on Mondoweiss. :) Seriously. But it may get back to him. - Sean McBride
There is no way you can have an open or semi-open discussion board without the "mediocres". Most people call those they disagree with mediocre or worse. MW is far better than most in this respect. Though I agree, the comment section is not what it was once. That's just the way it is and the way it has been for every forum out there I have ever seen. Nothing remains what it was, even... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- I read that recent comment of yours when you posted it and thought it was right on the money -- I agree 100%. - Sean McBride
To reframe the critique of MW: when I first noticed Phil (well before the founding of Mondoweiss), I was impressed -- he struck me as a strong and original mind, and daring, to say the least -- and someone who couldn't be easily pigeonholed by the usual political categories. During recent years, the Mondoweiss crew seems to be increasingly dominated by doctrinaire leftists -- nowhere in... more... - Sean McBride
I generally make it a practice not to accuse anyone of being a dullard to his or her face :) -- but the thought occurs to me occasionally. I apologize for being such a bad person. - Sean McBride
Danaa wrote: "That being said, I happened to glance at the comments that accompanied the article. All I can say, is wow - those were the days. Blankfort was still around, Gilad popped in, Witty provided witless commentary (as always,not quite to the point), Robert Werdine with his voluminous meanderings nonetheless gave cause for merriment and some curveball throwing (including the... more... - Sean McBride
See all of her comments here: [Mondoweiss; Danaa http://mondoweiss.net/profile...] - Sean McBride
Your most recent comment -- about the neocons -- http://mondoweiss.net/2014... -- was super-smart and subtle -- no flattery -- the truth: "In particular, the neocon forces have regathered and gone further afield in their playbook, especially when it comes to Russia bear baiting. It sure seems like someones want a confrontation real bad, even though none of it makes any sense." - Sean McBride
Danaa wrote: "Well, you know my theory: as just about all the realist and sober headed analysts got cleaned out of the state department, and as the access of these realists to the presidency got more and more restricted, what was left is a vacuum of competency into which neocons stepped in, or more like charged straight through the front door. I wouldn't consider the Neocons to be... more... - Sean McBride
One reason for the neocons to keep inciting violence all over the world -- to help take the attention and heat off Israel regarding dealing with the Palestinian issue. One distraction after another -- keep them coming -- keep the American diplomatic establishment preoccupied with other issues. - Sean McBride
Well, Keith always inspires me. One doesn't have to agree on every little thing to be inspired. Quite the contrary. Sometimes it's those little points where you feel, on a gut level, that something is a bit off - those often provide the best occasion for some deeper thought. Just trying to figure out what it is one can't quite agree with can force looking in new directions. I happen to... more... - Danaa
Another person who is subjected to the strawman device is Gilad Atzmon. some decided they know what he was on about and proceeded to attack him based on those ascriptions. When they didn't find a comment they could jump on in his book, they'd find something that he may or may not have said in a talk, take it out of context then proceed to demolish the rest of his contentions. This is... more... - Danaa
BTW, Sean, if you look through the comments on that Arendt article you'll note that Keith and Gilad had a rather civilized exchange. Keith didn't like Chapter 9 and gave his reasons, while Gilad defended it without getting too brittle. That was interesting. I was impressed that people kept their cool and were still able to proceed to make their points. It was useful for others. - Danaa
Danaa -- yes to all your points. And the intellectual vitality at MW before the heavy hand of doctrinaire political correctness started squeezing the life out of the comments section was impressive and invigorating -- that was in great part the lure of the site -- conversation on a level you couldn't find anywhere else. - Sean McBride
Regarding PAZs and LZs (progressive anti-Zionists and liberal Zionists) -- both groups claim to be vigorous critics of Likud Zionism and both groups have been obstructing effective actions to challenge same -- and their efforts appear to be mostly about circling the wagons around primal tribal interests and anxieties. This syndrome requires in-depth psychological analysis above all... more... - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Israel's entire political strategy is now based on stirring up hatred, conflict, violence and war between Christians and Muslims, between the West and the Muslim world.
You can track the execution of this strategy on a daily basis in leading pro-Israel media outlets -- there is nothing subtle about it. - Sean McBride
This strategy has been in play since at least 1954: [Wikipedia; Lavon Affair http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...]: "The Lavon Affair refers to a failed Israeli covert operation, code named Operation Susannah, conducted in Egypt in the Summer of 1954. As part of the false flag operation, a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israeli military intelligence to plant bombs inside Egyptian, American and British-owned civilian targets, cinemas, libraries and American educational centers." - Sean McBride
Early on, Zionist leaders realized that the only way Israel could survive was by using Western military and economic power to crush all its adversaries in the Mideast. And they have largely succeeded in executing that strategic plan. - Sean McBride
The endgame here, obviously, is World War III (or World War IV in the parlance of neoconservatives) -- an apocalyptic explosion that will involve the use of nuclear weapons and other WMDs against major population centers. - Sean McBride
What is driving this campaign: Torah-based Zionism. The Old Testament God shall have his way. - Sean McBride
One of the key casualties of this political juggernaut -- traditional Americanism, including the core values of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights. Repairing the damage at this point may be impossible. - Sean McBride
I very much agree with this comment, Sean. Since I read sometimes the hebrew emanations from israel I can raise you one or two. Their social media posts, articles by columnists, TV commentation and everyday chit chat is packed full of dengration of the muslims and endless wishing for confrontation with the West. For some reason, most israelis believe that driving this wedge between... more... - Danaa
Yes, this is definitely happening. What is amusing is that they sometimes go off message -- and start banging away on the United States and Europe ("the West") with as much ferocity as they direct at Islam and Muslims. They often seem to be spiraling out of control, thrashing at everyone (including "liberal Jews"). They may go completely off the rails before getting World War III/IV off the ground -- but maybe not. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Well, I finally moved the needle on discussion about the Judaism/Zionism issue on Mondoweiss.
It took a few months but I knew that eventually this controversy would get sorted out in a reasonable way. - Sean McBride
See this discussion -- the topic has opened up considerably: "Israel should pay 1.4 million Palestinians to leave Gaza, Moshe Feiglin says" http://mondoweiss.net/2014... - Sean McBride
Why do you care about saving Judaism? You need to connect with the *real world of life and death*, the Palestine plight and the Zionizing of the USA government. The last thing you need to do is encourage Jews to think about themselves and study their Judaism navel any more than they already do---that self absorption and narcissism is their problem to begin with. - American
The main objective here is to find ways to modify the influence of the Israeli government on the American government -- and to reduce the hold of Old Testament cultism on the minds of American Jews and Christian fundamentalists. We need to reconnect and realign American culture with the attitudes and value system of its Enlightenment founders. - Sean McBride
Are you a chess player? - Sean McBride
If you want to rid the US of Isr/Jewish/Zionist influence you go after the US politicians and the media . The Jews and Judaism haven't changed in 2000 years and they are not going to. And no one has time to wait for them to if they were capable of change. - American
I/P isnt a chess game. Maybe you need to be plunked down in a Palestine refugee camp or stuck in Gaza the next time the Jews and the Judaism you want to save drop a 1000 tons of bombs on men, women and children. This is not an intellectual pursuit or game for hobbyist . - American
*All* political conflicts are exercises in combinatorial game theory. If you can't play, you can't win. - Sean McBride
# some chess concepts you should take the trouble to master 1. absolute pin 2. advantage 3. attraction 4. bind 5. blockade 6. blunder 7. breakthrough 8. brilliancy 9. building a bridge 10. calculate 11. check 12. checkmate 13. clearance 14. combination 15. connected passed pawns 16. connected rooks 17. consolidation 18. control of the center 19. counterplay 20. cover 21. cramped 22.... more... - Sean McBride
"Going after" US politicians and the media will get you nowhere -- you need an effective strategic plan -- one that is superior to that of your opponent. - Sean McBride
The Israel lobby has been running circles around its opponents for decades now by playing smart. - Sean McBride
For the definitions of the chess terms above, see [Wikipedia; Glossary of chess http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...] - Sean McBride
At the highest levels of play, you maneuver your opponent into a position in which it defeats itself. That takes strategic planning and skill -- not blunt forward attacks based on the emotion of the moment. - Sean McBride
How to play stupid: [Wikipedia; Sonny Corleone http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...] and [Youtube; Sonny is Killed - The Godfather (4/9) Movie CLIP (1972) HD https://www.youtube.com/watch...] - Sean McBride
Keep deluding yourself that this is all some chess game of great strategy instead of the simple corruption that it is. Corruption is not 'maneuvered" out, it is attacked and thrown out. Live long enough and you will learn that if history hasnt woken you to that fact yet. - American
Put another way: if Tom Brady focused on hurling verbal abuse at Peyton Manning, would the New England Patriots beat the Denver Broncos? Winning in politics is not about yelling at your opponents -- it's about executing a strategic plan with skill. You need a brilliant plan and the skills with which to execute it. Planning and execution is the name of the game. And effective strategic plans usually rely on multilayered misdirection. - Sean McBride
I doubt that the National Defense University would endorse your approach to political conflict. [Wikipedia; National Defense University http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...] - Sean McBride
A conviction of moral superiority over your opponent is not sufficient to win political conflicts. - Sean McBride
The National Defense Univ?...LOL You do understand dont you that 'war plans' and strategies are 'plans' based on the use of brute 'force'. - American
And the use of brute force always occurs within a complex strategic context -- within a set of carefully prepared political plans which rely heavily on scientific propaganda and psychological warfare. Military force is a branch of politics -- not vice versa. You keep putting the cart before the horse. - Sean McBride
You are advocating the Sonny Corleone approach to politics -- as opposed to the Michael Corleone approach. Thrashing as opposed to thinking and planning. - Sean McBride
You dont really know what's involved in what I am advocating. That's your intelligence failure. You 'assume' you know. Big mistake. - American
You have been quite clear about what you are advocating -- I am capable of reading plain English. - Sean McBride
So, Sean, do you plan, single-handedly to defeat the powerful genocidal regime in Israel by using chess maneouvers and logical debates to convince "people" (who exactly?) that zionism was always embedded in Judaism? you do realize, I hope, that at least among jewish persons, the response would be 'dah"? just because Mooser puts up road blocks in your path doesn't mean there two and... more... - Danaa
As for the non-Jews, you may convince a couple of not very knowledgeable ones that indeed judaism has in it the seeds of its own destruction. And then what - eradicate it? what is your end plan? - Danaa
I think that in general, looking too hard for logic in history and/or international affairs is a bit of a dead-end street. Just as zionism is buried within the finest wrappings of "jewish values", so is illogic and bare-knuckled quest for power buried in the finest affairs of humans, including the ones who consider themselves seriously "enlightened". - Danaa
I can see why American despairs. I do too often. Though I tend to use the despair more as a mourning ritual than a tool of advocacy. For the latter, BDS, in its full-throated version, is the one and only tool remaining to us. Then again, I have done my share of talking to israelis so I know that all the best talking points in the world do not suffice to save a single gazan life, if... more... - Danaa
Or, may be your debate adversaries would be people like Annie? if she came to agree with you today, would she do any more advocacy for palestinians than she is already doing? How about Mooser? would he go charging into the woods trying to bad himself an anti-zionist or two, using his tefilin as a rope? i think the image is kind of funny though. - Danaa
OTOH, I sure don't mind you diseecting zionism/Judaism to your heart's content. I like rhetorics and am sure you'll come up with lots of facts and sources to bolster your arguments. I know I am not exactly the intended audience but because of some fondness for argumentation I'll probably remain seated when all others left the auditorium. - Danaa
These attacks by pepsi on Danaa remind one of a uniformed male Nazi viciously beating an unarmed Jewish woman with the butt of his rifle. Appalling and disgusting. And deleted. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- I apologize: as you may imagine, I can't track this group 24x7. - Sean McBride
By the way, as I mentioned before, it's easy to save full copies of FF posts with all comments to one's local or cloud drive -- and I saved a copy of this one before the deletions. If you want to see it, send me a direct message. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- you may have missed a major turn in the road here -- quite a few Mondoweiss commenters are in fact strongly interested in discussing the role of religion (Judaism, in particular) in driving and rationalizing Israeli and Zionist beliefs and policies. It's the elephant in the room that many people can't wait to address head-on. Effectively countering this religious dogma and... more... - Sean McBride
Citizen's remarks on this subject have been insightful: http://mondoweiss.net/profile... (search the page for "sean") - Sean McBride
Thanks Sean, I know you can't be everywhere at the same time. Still, some fun was had - I am practicing increasing my typing speed without adding too many typos. - Danaa
To be stalked is to be popular, right? unless...... - Danaa
The biggest problem I see with this re-examination of the religious tenets of Judaism, is that religious jews themselves, long ago, made it a cul-de-sac. They cannot be reached, and I don't mean just the ultra-orthodox but even most of the sort-of-believing observants. people like peter beinart that liberal jews love to admire. It would be great if you could make a dent in the belief... more... - Danaa
So, what about the secular humanist Jews? there you'll find quite a few who will agree that Judaism itself birthed and helped promote the toxic version of zionism we see running rampant. But to them that's just grist for the mill - reaffirming their secularness. Problem is that the jewish progressives built another shiboleth, known as "Jewish values". I call them the Tikun-olam crowd.... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- pepsi is indeed stalking you -- in a flagrant way. What he is doing has been noticed. - Sean McBride
So, assuming you know all that, i'll conclude that your target of people to convince (who are not yet) are non-jewish people who may hold zionist views. Now, if that's the case, you can see the problem Mooser had all along. If that's the target, and realizing what naivite resides in those parts, the only way you can cast doubts upon zionism is to show its deep connection to Judaism.... more... - Danaa
Do you think pepsi could be a secret fan? (yes, i know. Always the self-flattering positivist). other possibilities are more disturbing whether he is a agent or not. Sometimes, I wonder how many personas are buried in a single handle. Wondering is good exercise. - Danaa
The group has gone private again -- stalker pepsi simply won't leave Danaa alone. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- the discussion about the role of Torah/Old Testament memes in forming the attitudes of contemporary Zionists may well have a significant impact on non-Jewish Western political, policy and opinion leaders. And I think they are smart enough and decent enough to make careful discriminations on these matters that won't lead them down the road towards classical hardcore... more... - Sean McBride
Danaa -- what may happen is that non-Jewish political elites in the West may begin to hold the Jewish religious establishment (and Judaism) accountable for the behavior of Israel -- which doesn't seem unreasonable, given the facts on the table. The prospect of this development may motivate Jewish religious leaders in the Diaspora to try to influence Israel in a positive direction -- and with sincere energy and force -- not just empty feel-good words. - Sean McBride
Gawd Sean, you are such a wannabe babe in the strategy sphere. First, the only reason you 'moved the needle' is because you did a blow job for Judaism by praising it--that's the only reason Mooser even responded to you without his usual slurs. - American
I actually like several aspects of Judaism -- we could all learn a great deal from it -- it emphasizes family values, personal responsibility, hard work, achievement, love of learning, charity, philanthropy, etc. Many Jews succeed in the world because these values are their bedrock. - Sean McBride
Second, the Jews should take the advice of wasp like MRW and myself----""MRW December 25, 2014, 8:28 pm Does anyone understand the tedium these circumlocutions are having on non-Jews? They’re not doing themselves any favors. Why should non-Jews stand up for this lack of self-reflection, this inability to be smart or intelligent?'' The more the Jews talk and whine and chew their Jewish cud like cow in a pasture and obsess about themselves and their religion the more disgusted non Jews become. - American
MRW is right -- too much ethnocentrism expressed by any ethnic group in American life will lead to a backlash. - Sean McBride
'' we could all learn a great deal from it -- it emphasizes family values, personal responsibility, hard work, achievement, love of learning, charity, philanthropy, etc. Many Jews succeed in the world because these values are their bedrock. - Sean McBride).....Ugh, thats actually nauseating. Do you have little Jewish figures and shrines to Jews in your house too? LOL.... - American
American -- what is the difference between the bigotry you express towards Jews and the bigotry that Berthe expressed towards blacks? There is no difference. For some reason you find it necessary to demonize all Jews, just as Berthe found it necessary to demonize all blacks -- you simply can't acknowledge that some Jews -- many Jews -- might have positive traits. Your views on Jews are perfectly consonant with Pamela Geller's views on Muslims. - Sean McBride
'' MRW is right -- too much ethnocentrism expressed by any ethnic group in American life will lead to a backlash.'' - Sean McBride)....And you think your Jew worship is any less ethnocentric? Why dont you switch to worshiping Buddhist-ness and Buddhism ....I think we 're all over dosed with of your Jewish/Judaism obsession. And you've never explained why you are so obsessed with Jews and Judaism. Why are you? - American
Don't start your nazi hunting shit with me again little boy or I will go back on MW and verbally eviscerate your pretentious ass. You are the lying screwball on here buddy and you have a Jewish obsession mental problem. MRW says you are a Jewish supremist pretending to be a irish American, I think he is right. We are done. - American
When I point out the positive features of the Jewish tradition, I am pushing back against the ignorant and revolting antisemitism of some crazies in the anti-Zionist camp who are using controversies about Israel to try to finish the work of Adolf Hitler and to ignite a new and bigger Holocaust -- and these people are easy to spot. Generally I feel more sympathy with my own cultural tradition (European Christian) than any other tradition -- but I am not chauvinistic about it. - Sean McBride
MRW is making a fool of himself if he is claiming that I am not Irish American (and Anglo American, French American, Dutch American, Roman Catholic and Episcopalian). I've noticed that he seems to be highly susceptible to wild conspiracy theorizing. The most extreme antisemites are unable to tolerate the slightest praise for any Jew without losing their minds. - Sean McBride
American -- you didn't answer the question -- what is the difference between your views on Jews, Berthe's views on blacks and Pamela Geller's views on Muslims? There is no difference. You have no reply. If you would like, I could collect your most colorful quotes on Jews from GFTG and post them on Mondoweiss -- what do you think? - Sean McBride
Sean, I will not go off the handle here but I must point out to you that the values you list as jewish are pretty much Christian values (protestant tradition primarily). With one exception - you cite "love of learning". That however, was largely meant the Torah learning, not general learning (even though secular scholarly jews of course promote love of general learning, as does every... more... - Danaa
I am not inclined to blow-outs but can understand American's annoyance. This thread is hardly the place to extohl "Jewish values", certainly not by one who seeks a close look at the deep connection between the religion Iand its values) and the messianic/ethnocentric streak represented by zionism. You just can't mix things up like this without raising doubts as to your motivation. You,... more... - Danaa
American, don't leave me all alone now...just me and Sean - that might get a bit lonely - I like a little crowd now and then. - Danaa
Danaa -- I didn't say those values I mentioned are exclusively Jewish values -- I said I have noticed them among nearly all the Jewish families I have known or encountered -- especially the emphasis on education (the more the better) and delayed gratification (hard work). And I mention this only in response to some of the vicious comments made about all Jews by extreme antisemites like... more... - Sean McBride
Keep in mind that most of the Jewish families I have known have sent their kids to Harvard, MIT, Yale, Princeton, etc. Nearly all of them were progressives in some of the most progressive communities in the United States -- probably not typical of most Jewish families scattered around the world. Perhaps Chu had many unpleasant encounters with Orthodox Jews in Brooklyn -- I don't know. - Sean McBride
It just occurred to me that those values you mentioned - education and delayed gratification - are really quinessential Asian values. Ascribing them somehow to jews is silly, as the enormous success of Asians in America would attest to. Not only that but the "hard work" aspect is not all that typical any longer of successful jewish families. I know many who were seduced by the promise... more... - Danaa
Also I can't help but notice that there is one value entirely missing from your list of "Jewish" values - humility. Not in the play book. Not in the US and not in israel. So how much arrogance and exclusivity are people to put up with (the "bad" values) in order to to soak those magnificnet rays of the "good" values? - Danaa
Yes -- Asian culture also strenously promotes education and delayed gratification as core values -- as I said, these are not exclusively Jewish values. As to how well Jews are doing these days regarding respecting these values, one could look at the latest statistics for the number of graduates from leading universities, law schools, medical schools, business schools, etc. - Sean McBride
Everytime you choose to illustrate and list the great jewish values, Sean, you lose one or more people. Not sure why you didn't seem to get the message that just about everyone who ever visited this feed has next to zero interest in basking in the benevolence of said attributes. not one. not ever. Myself included. Which brings up the question - you always try to get people to come to... more... - Danaa
I call things the way I see them -- people can take it or leave it. The only reason I encouraged people to use this feed was to pursue discussions that have been been banned (or severely impeded) on Mondoweiss. I also encouraged them to start their own feeds and groups -- to take the initiative and break out of the box defined by top-down blog-style discussion forums. But many folks are still living in a 1990s model of Internet communications. - Sean McBride
Every time you choose to illustrate and list the great jewish qualities, Sean, you lose one or more people. Not sure why you didn't seem to get the message that just about everyone who ever visited this feed has next to zero interest in basking in the benevolence of said attributes. not one. not ever. Myself included. Which brings up the question - you always try to get people to come... more... - Danaa
American has stormed off before -- and he is always welcome back. We both have our individual views on these matters and we don't hesitate to express them. - Sean McBride
But on this feed you can also see the downside of too much real-time back and forth. Nothing seems to survive the onslaught of temper. At the end, temper wins. may be the delayed posting of comments provided by moderated blogs is a opportunity for a cool-off period. WE humans who care about world events tend to be a quick-tempered and fast on the draw crowd. I think it's part of the DNA... more... - Danaa
I don't see that as a problem -- I am focused here on the even-tempered flow of posting high-quality items on Mideast politics. If you find the lead items of news value, good -- if not, by all means turn to other, better sources. - Sean McBride
But sean, you already know all too well what makes American (and others) storm off - it's the tacit accusation/insinuations from you that they are somehow anti-semitic. that people should become riled up by accusations is simple enough to understand. The question is, why do you keep doing it? you already know the outcome and can surely expect it. If people storming off doesn't bother you, fine, it's your choice. But it bothers me, and perhaps others who are reading. - Danaa
On a positive note, my 8 finger typing skills have greatly improved, thanks to FF. I should send them a thank you note for the training. - Danaa
To repeat this important point: when I see clear cases of antisemitic language, I call them out -- and I will always do so. And the reason I do this is because I think they degrade the ability to pursue a useful critique of key issues regarding the I/P conflict. By all means feel free to disagree -- or even to hang out in GFTG. It's a free Internet. Build whatever discussion communities most appeal to your tastes. - Sean McBride
I like the chat capabilities of FF -- my mind tends to move quickly (as do my typing fingers), and an hour from now I will be on to other topics. Catch it while its hot. - Sean McBride
Regarding type A personalities (in reference to arrogance, etc.) -- I tend to have a high tolerance for them -- many of the most interesting people I have known have been completely impossible. But they were still worthwhile -- as long as there was some creative activity going on in their heads. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Have pro-Israel hackers been attacking MWFF?
Ok -- I've had reports from three separate MWFF subscribers describing problems with logging into Friendfeed -- and that is highly unusual and difficult to explain. Two possibilities among several: 1. a pro-Israel activist (or group) has managed to hack into FF and is able to maliciously manipulate user accounts (including changing passwords). 2. a pro-Israel insider at Facebook with high-level access to Friendfeed is messing with some user accounts. - Sean McBride
Generally, paranoid and conspiratorial explanations for technical problems are the last possibilities I consider. But when I take these three reports together in combination they are difficult to account for. Someone may be trying to damage and kill the group by disrupting the access of new FF users to it. But that's just a suspicion for now. - Sean McBride
Is the WilliamJones account still up and running? His posts seem to have disappeared over the last few hours. - Sean McBride
If you are having trouble logging in to Friendfeed, here is a backup group on which to communicate: [Google Groups: Mondoweiss on Friendfeed https://groups.google.com/forum...] You might want to post a few test messages on that group. - Sean McBride
This is funny. I tried logging out of WilliamJones to test the password. Sure enough, it said I have the wrong password. So I asked it to send me a Password Reset. But THIS time it sent me a password reset for W.Jones INSTEAD of for WilliamJones. So now apparently after a year, W.Jones is back online. - W.Jones
Well, that is good news in a sense -- but I am still wondering what the hell is going on here. What better way to disrupt and wreck a group than hacking into and messing with the passwords of its members? Only members of MWFF have reported this problem with logons on Friendfeed -- three of them. That is three too many. - Sean McBride
If you use Google Groups at all (or Yahoo Groups), you will realize that Friendfeed provides a much superior interface for group communications and discussions. - Sean McBride
Basically, the main problem is that I have been unable for a long time to get FF to remember my passwords for any FF account. - W.Jones
Could it be that my account name is really wjones1? - W.Jones
Your user name for the account at https://friendfeed.com/wjones1 is W.Jones -- I am looking at the page right now. - Sean McBride
There is also an account at https://friendfeed.com/wjones with the user name William Jones. - Sean McBride
Not mine though. - W.Jones
Weird Stuff. It looks like my WilliamJones posts disappeared now after logging into W.Jones, and since I shared the same email account, there is no way for me to log in as WilliamJones. - W.Jones
What was the URL for your WilliamJones account? - Sean McBride
I have been using FF since 2007 and have never had a problem logging in. It has never forgotten my password. - Sean McBride
I dont remember the URL, but it could have included "William Jones", and I used a picture of a male ram. You can check your direct messages for my message to you. I never deleted my account or that direct message. While still logged into the WilliamJones account I saw your message saying that my messages on WlliamJones had disappeared. - W.Jones
1. the exact characters in the URL matter a great deal 2. the direct message from "WilliamJones" has disappeared - Sean McBride
I very vaguely remember it as williamjones11 , which doesn't exist now. - W.Jones
The exact URL for that account should be available in your browser history -- take a look. Also, all of Taxi's FF account URLs are probably still present in her browser history. - Sean McBride
Sean, are you including taxi in the three users you are referring to? I assume not, since what happened to her accounts seemed like a unique case. Still, something smells fishy to me. My account BTW is so far behaving normally, but then I don't subscribe to many things. Your theories Sean may have some grounds. - Danaa
To be on the safe side, I started archiving at least my own comments (since, as I told you, I was not, and still am not in the habit of saving them, or using the notebook method. I should, but I don't due to pure laziness). - Danaa
Danaa -- I am wondering now if Taxi's login problems fit the same description as the problems reported by WJones and one other person who just sent me a private message on the issue -- now my antennae are vibrating. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- try that streaming notebook method I mentioned -- it requires less work for automatically archiving your own writing than any other method I can think of. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
What Will Israel Become? - NYTimes.com (Roger Cohen) - http://www.nytimes.com/2014...
What Will Israel Become? - NYTimes.com (Roger Cohen)
"“There is a growing uneasiness, social, political, economic,” Amos Oz, the novelist, told me in an interview. “There is a growing sense that Israel is becoming an isolated ghetto, which is exactly what the founding fathers and mothers hoped to leave behind them forever when they created the state of Israel.” The author, widely viewed as the conscience of a liberal and anti-Messianic Israel, continued, “Unless there are two states — Israel next door to Palestine — and soon, there will be one state. If there will be one state, it will be an Arab state. The other option is an Israeli dictatorship, probably a religious nationalist dictatorship, suppressing the Palestinians and suppressing its Jewish opponents.”" - Sean McBride from Bookmarklet
"Tolerance is under attack as a wave of Israeli nationalism unfurls and settlements grow in the West Bank. This virulent, Jews-first thinking led recently to a bill known as the nationality law that would rescind Arabic’s status as an official language — and proved a catalyst to the breakup of Netanyahu’s government. It also finds expression in the abuse hurled at anyone, including the Israeli president, Reuven Rivlin, who speaks up for Arab rights. “Traitor” has become a facile cry." - Sean McBride
"Danny Danon, a former deputy defense minister who is challenging Netanyahu for the Likud leadership, told me his long-term vision for the West Bank, or Judea and Samaria as he calls it, “is to have sovereignty over the majority of the land with the minimum amount of Palestinians.” The two-state idea, Danon said, “is finished, and most Israelis understand that.”" - Sean McBride
Comment regarding Danny Danon: "If this were said by a non-Jewish minister of a non-Jewish state, most American Jews wouldn't hesitate to call this fascism; the sentiment is worthy of the French National Front or of the British National Party. But because it was said by a Jewish minister of a majority Jewish state, many American Jews can't bring themselves to identify this for what it is, i.e. a virulent form of racism as the underpinning for land theft. The more shame on them." - Sean McBride
Most of the New York Times comments would fit in seamlessly with Mondoweiss comments. - Sean McBride
'' “There is a growing sense that Israel is becoming an isolated ghetto, which is exactly what the founding fathers and mothers hoped to leave behind them forever when they created the state of Israel.”").....His statement does not even make sense. Obviously they did Not intend to leave the 'ghetto' behind. Creating a state of,by and for Jews only Was creating a Jewish ghetto. Neither... more... - American
American, the ghetto has been a complicated situation. There are indeed many places where the jews were quite content to leave in their own "enclave" and this was greatly supported, encouraged and mandated by their rabbis - so that they may remain separate. Because they were already in ghetto-like situation, it was easy for the ruling authorities at various times and places to keep them... more... - Danaa
Judaism and Zionism have always been self-ghettoizing ideologies, movements and cultures based on separating "Israel" ("the chosen people") from "the nations" (cult outsiders). A complex array of traditions and rituals was constructed to help maintain that separation. - Sean McBride
regarding your other point - the jewish leadership not really wanting to stray from the ghetto model - I think that also requires some acknowlegement of the variance between intent and reality. Those leaders (the ben Gurions etc) really did not want the old shtetl model to prevail in israel, as they set out for an "enlightened" state, at least what they considered so, a state like any... more... - Danaa
The idea I am trying to promulgate here is that it is not really possible to be "enlightened" and separate at the same time. There was, at its root, a universalist component to enlightenemnt which was never going to sit well with parochialism. There are numerous examples of the dichotomy and how it played out in different countries. The very concept of "separate bu equal" - a Jim Crow... more... - Danaa
The clear choice: reject Enlightenment culture and modern Western democratic norms. Actually, I am not surprised. So now the game will play out along inevitable lines. - Sean McBride
What is perfectly predictable: Likud Zionists will work tirelessly to inflame and normalize racism in the United States and Europe in order to justify racism in Israel. They will form alliances (many of them under table) with white nationalists in the West. - Sean McBride
'' The idea I am trying to promulgate here is that it is not really possible to be "enlightened" and separate at the same time. ..Danaa).....Of course it isnt. "Separation" from others was the goal and cornerstone of Zionism. Only in nonsensical Jewish pilpul can they pretend, redefine definitions of democracy, ect. and convolute what Israel was 'intended to be'. it is what is was from... more... - American
Sean McBride
Rethinking Taxi's Friendfeed problems
I think Taxi may have confused accounts with groups. When she deleted her Friendfeed account she also automatically deleted all the groups that were created by and associated with that account. With regard to creating new accounts: it works perfectly. I just experimentally created and deleted three new accounts without a hitch. - Sean McBride
Once again, I will be happy to help her out in getting reestablished on Friendfeed -- she just needs to contact me in email: seanmcb@gmail.com. - Sean McBride
Why am I still able to access Taximondo Feed and post on it if she deleted all her feeds and accounts? Is is because I was a subscriber ? I would have thought that would have been wiped out also, even for subscribers. - American
Because (I am guessing) https://friendfeed.com/taximon... is an independent and standalone account -- not a group created from and associated with another independent and standalone account that she deleted. (The existence of that account means that she has always been able to communicate with other FF users all along. Has she responded to your posts in that feed?) - Sean McBride
Nope no response. I think I will delete my post and comments there, no point in leaving them up. - American
Have you asked her through another channel why she isn't responding to communications in her own feed? If you have access to it, she does. - Sean McBride
What I got from her is that she can see posts on this FF but not on Taximondo. But she can't post a response. Note that the taximondo feed has just three subscribers - American is one and I'm another. The admin subscription is not there any longer which is probably why she can't post or even see comments on that feed (that because it was private, unlike this one). - Danaa
According to her communication with me, she is busy setting up a blog and for now is taking a break from the FF patform. I actually don't blame her. It was a bit of a jolt. I also lost my own comments on her feed as well as any on a thread started here by her. I am still smarting from that and wish there was a way to resurrect those. She is sending her apologies to those whose comments... more... - Danaa
If the feed is still up, and you and American can see and post to it, that means that she unsubscribed herself from her own group -- strange. I've never seen that before. - Sean McBride
It does not make sense that she deleted her 'account' and wiped out her two other feeds and herself and all her comments and left the Taximondo one intact. If she did indeed wipe herself 'totally out' of FF the Taximondo feed should have been wiped out also. Maybe Sean can explain. - American
My guess is that if you create a group with yourself as sole administrator, and then unsubscribe yourself from the group, the group just sits there under the control of no one. Existing members can still post to it. I am completely baffled by Taxi's actions. - Sean McBride
Bottom line: without knowledge of the exact URLs she was working with (for all acounts and groups), I don't really know for sure what happened or how she became so tangled up. This situation is a first. - Sean McBride
Well I deleted my post there and unsubscribed to get it off my list. - American
Sean McBride
JVP has almost certainly been heavily infiltrated by a number of Zionist agencies, including Mossad and the ADL.
In fact, they may be largely running JVP. - Sean McBride
Unit 8200 is probably intercepting all of JVP's digital communications and the digital communications of all of its members and supporters. - Sean McBride
I don't doubt for a second that there is fifth column in JVP. There are after all moles in every organization viewed as a challenge against the establishment. Occupy was heavily infiltrated and some were deliberately planted provocateurs. So were the Ferguson protesters. The fifth columnist don't have to be in the "leadership" just relatively close enough. - Danaa
Sean McBride
Comment to Annie Robbins on the American Council for Judaism (ACJ) and Jewish Voice for Peace (JVP)
Once again, Annie directed a critique at me, in her usual rambling and disorganized way, here: http://mondoweiss.net/2014... She sought out and initiated the exchange, not me -- which is how this always goes. I composed a civil and substantive reply -- which is still sitting in moderation -- which means that her post has still gone unanswered. This is no way for a moderator to run a forum. This is the way dictators and despots conduct debates -- muzzle your opponent while you deliver speeches. - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
Annie, - Sean McBride
When we begin to see organizations like the American Council for Judaism (ACJ) and Jewish Voice for Peace (JVP) start to move the political needle in a significant way -- especially to exert a significant impact on the US Congress -- then we will all stand up, take note and applaud. But the ACJ has been around since the 1950s, and during the last half century its impact on American Mideast policy has been negligible -- non-existent really. - Sean McBride
I recently turned up this fascinating article in JTA from **May 7, 1956**: - Sean McBride
"1,350 U.S. Rabbis Denounce the American Council for Judaism" | Jewish Telegraphic Agency http://www.jta.org/1956... - Sean McBride
BEGIN QUOTE - Sean McBride
Some 1,350 American rabbis of all three branches of the Jewish faith–Orthodox, Conservative and Reform-this week-end scored the American Council for Judaism in one of the sharpest denunciations of the Council voiced. The statement was released by the New York Board of Rabbis, which circularized 1,500 rabbis in all parts of the country with the document. - Sean McBride
The joint declaration hit the American Council for Judaism, asserting that it has “consistently misrepresented the Jewish people before the bar of public opinion” and “has consistently maligned and impugned the integrity of Jewish institutions, organizations and causes, and has consistently distorted the precepts of Judaism which it purports to serve. The joint declaration reprimanded the anti-Zionist organization for what it termed “slanders” against American Jews “who adhere to the ideals of Zionism.” - Sean McBride
Asserting that the Council’s “real goal is the complete disappearance of the Jewish people,” the declaration stressed that the Council represents numerically “an infinitesimal fraction” of American Jewry. “we view with contempt the Council’s attempt to dissuade Americans from helping their fellow Jews and the State of Israel through contributions to the United Jewish Appeal and the... more... - Sean McBride
END QUOTE - Sean McBride
Notice that the Jewish religious establishment -- Orthodox, Conservative and Reform -- was overwhelmingly lined up against the ACJ back in 1956 -- and even then was conflating Judaism with Zionism. Since then this situation hasn't improved -- it has only become worse. - Sean McBride
One needs to be a realist about these matters, even while holding on strongly to idealistic beliefs and objectives. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
There is no good reason not to clear this comment. I think the problem is that Annie can't figure out how to answer the points and handle the discussion. - Sean McBride
New comment: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
The ACJ (American Council for Judaism) was challenging the Jewish/Zionist establishment back in 1956: - Sean McBride
"1,350 U.S. Rabbis Denounce the American Council for Judaism" | Jewish Telegraphic Agency http://www.jta.org/1956... - Sean McBride
So why is that establishment much stronger now in 2014 than it was in 1956? - Sean McBride
One might come to the reasonable conclusion, based on solid facts, that the Jewish community as a whole is constitutionally incapable of reforming the Jewish establishment on the issues of Israel and Zionism -- that is what the long historical track record reveals. Lots of idealistic talk and promises, no effective action. The game goes on and on with no change. Fool me once, shame on... more... - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
I actually agree with you Sean, on the substance. Unlike phil, who continues to hope against hope, I actually don't believe the American jewish community - as a community - has it in them to change. Some young people push the debate forward, some other young people become activists, a few good people raise their voices and call it like it is (Stieglitz comes to mind). And yet, this... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- a big idea has been taking shape in my mind and perhaps you can critique it. It was triggered by that JTA article I cited earlier: [1,350 U.S. Rabbis Denounce the American Council for Judaism http://www.jta.org/1956...] - Sean McBride
The idea in a nutshell: there has been a stream of Jewish anti-Zionism in Jewish culture for more than a century now, but the influence of Jewish anti-Zionists never rises above a certain level of minimal influence. Phil Weiss is the latest proponent of this stream of thought -- and his impact on the Jewish establishment will probably be no greater than the Jewish anti-Zionists who preceded him. The overwhelming majority of Jews has consistently rejected and punished anti-Zionists in their midst. - Sean McBride
For instance, long before Phil Weiss there was Alfred Lilienthal: 1. [Wikipedia; Alfred Lilienthal http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...] 2. [Amazon.com; Alfred M. Lilienthal http://www.amazon.com/Alfred-...] - Sean McBride
And there is an analogy here regarding Enlightenment and universalist Jews in general, beginning with Spinoza -- they have consistently been rejected and punished by the overall Jewish community. Why should we believe that this situation is ever going to change? - Sean McBride
I think Gilad Atzmon took a good look at this overall pattern of behavior over centuries and decided to ditch the tradition altogether. - Sean McBride
If my analysis is correct, then one can predict with considerable confidence that the Jewish establishment (and the Jewish community as a whole) will find itself once again in a state of severe (even apocalyptic) conflict with "the nations" -- with non-Jewish groups -- a situation that has erupted repeatedly since the founding of Judaism. Conflict with "the nations" is the most salient... more... - Sean McBride
JVP members (including Annie Robbins) keep dangling before us the hope that Jewish anti-Zionists are going to succeed in reforming the Jewish establishment, Judaism, Israel and Zionism, but there is little reason to believe that this is actually going to happen. The truth is that Jewish anti-Zionists have continued to lose ground since the 1950s. - Sean McBride
What do you think? - Sean McBride
"" I actually don't believe the American jewish community - as a community - has it in them to change...Danaa).......Leaving out my disgust with Zionism completely and just looking at the Jewish Community objectively as an outside observer I don't think there is going to be any change either. In every instance I have seen in history when Jews were confronted with a choice of 'cleaving... more... - American
Also the truth is most Americans rarely think of Israel, its not on their radar or something they care about one way or another. So I doubt there will be great uprising there either unless Israel causes some horrific event that blows back on the US and puts Israel on their radar. - American
The way some kind of change might come about is a war between the 20%s. The 20% who want Isr out of Palestine and out of the US v. the 20% of US zionist and The I-Lobby Orgs. - American
Sean McBride
Mooser asked: what can be done to uncouple Judaism from Zionism?
One thing that can be done: encourage Jewish religious leaders in *public conversations* to begin drawing clear lines between Judaism and Zionism -- to explain to the world where they differ. But have we reached a point in which those leaders no longer believe that there any differences between Judaism and Zionism? Game over? - Sean McBride
Censoring the debate over this issue is probably not going to solve the problem. - Sean McBride
Btw, Mooser just posted a surprising batch of smart comments in which he reveals that he *does* understand -- fully -- the problematic relations between Judaism and Zionism. One wonders why he spent so much effort pretending that he didn't understand. - Sean McBride
In reply to your puzzlement - Mooser understands quite a bit. He just didn't like you personally because of your over-aggressive and condescending on-line persona in debates. I told you before like three dozen times that Mooser has the zionism/Judaism angle figured out just fine. It's just that you haven't been reading his posts to others with the attention they deserved, even as you... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- I couldn't begin to match Mooser for aggression, bullying, insults, arrogance, etc. -- that's his specialty. But for some reason you are willing to overlook that behavior. And you continue to get it backwards -- Mooser pursued me -- I didn't pursue him. When the critique of Jewish religious Zionism first emerged on MW, Mooser lost his wit and humor and went all Terminator --grim as death. The archives tell the tale. - Sean McBride
Danaa, sorry but Mooser is a asshole imo. And his witty little attacks on people have gotten old and arent amusing any more. He literally 'stalks' people he doesn't like with his' interpretations' on what they've said. So it doesnt matter what he understands, its his mouth and attitude that makes him an asshole. He's had his three strikes with me and I never respond to him and ignore... more... - American
American, understand you don't care for Mooser and neither does Sean. All I'm saying is to just avoid engaging with him, that's all. Some on-line personas rub people the wrong way and frankly, it would be surprising if they didn't as that's what happens in 'real" life too. There are lots of people i don't care to engage with. So what else is new? All I was saying is that sean and Mooser... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- I tried to avoid exchanges with Mooser, but he kept coming at me -- and he is still doing so now -- as of today -- he just called me a "right-wing mouth-breather" on MW. I never called him "stupid" -- I pointed out that he rarely posts interesting documentary material in his posts, with cites -- as do most of the best commenters on MW. I most prize *knowledge-based* commenters like Hostage, whose posts are sorely missed. - Sean McBride
Danaa, let me say again that "I dont engage with Mooser'' or even respond to him-- BUT that does not prevent his addressing and stalking my comments. So in my case the problem is in him. I scanned MW articles and 100 comments this am for any developments and noticed his comment on my comment that the Judaism is or isnt Zionism debate is best left to the Jews to settle . This was his... more... - American
American -- since Danaa hasn't been the target of obsessive stalking by Mooser, as we have been, she may not have noticed what is going on. And we are not the only targets who have been subjected to this abusive treatment -- other users have complained about it. - Sean McBride
My personal policy is to avoid all feuds with other commenters -- they are a waste of time -- that is why I stopped engaging with hophmi. The only reason I keep engaging with Annie is because time and again she has interfered in my conversations with other MW users in a highly aggressive way. I have definitely had the feeling of being stalked by her -- often by her in combination with Mooser -- they act as a tag team. - Sean McBride
American -- quickly scanning the most recent 100 comments on MW -- I see at least 15 by Mooser. Total comments posted by Mooser to date: nearly 20,000. http://mondoweiss.net/profile... A high percentage of them have insulted the intelligence of other MW commenters -- essentially dismissing them as morons. - Sean McBride
Just quit commenting. I think I've made 3 comments in 2 weeks on MW anyway. I really have nothing much to add to MW and I am not that into all the Jewish debates. I've started relying more on twitter with Max, Greenwald, Walt and others, to pick up on news blips. I noticed some important news about Hamas this am on Max's twitter, I'll post it above. - American
American -- that is a *smart* use of Twitter -- you are quickly skimming the cream of daily commentary on Israel and Mideast politics. Many of those Twitter links point to valuable long-form articles and essays -- one click and voila. The trick is to find the best feeds to follow. - Sean McBride
Regarding Mooser's style of argument -- most recently he has accused me of being a "right-wing mouth-breather," a supporter of slavery and someone who is "frightened of Jews." And Danaa thinks he's smart? :) Check out his attempts to discuss the Enlightenment tradition in this thread http://mondoweiss.net/2014... - Sean McBride
sean, danaa should be applauding you for finally getting that rat fink Mooser to engage in the key issues of the Jewish Question, when mooser asks, "what can be done to uncouple Judaism from Zionism?" - pepsi
unfortunately, danaa doesn't want to have that conversation either. She'd rather play pat-e-cake with her fellow Jews than to ask, "what can be done?" - pepsi
one minute danaa tells sean and american they should take mooser's supremacist bigotry personally, and the next she tells sean to back off, so her jewish circle-jerk party isn't threatened. Better a supremacist, bigoted, gatekeeping comments section than none at all, she insists, jewishly. - pepsi
I just scanned the 100 most recent comments on MW. It stinks. - American
Mooser has managed to anger Keith (along with quite a few other MW commenters). Check out this exchange: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
KEITH: Listen Jerk, that isn’t what I said and I resent you implying that it was. Perhaps you have more in common with Hophmi than either of you would care to admit. - Sean McBride
MOOSER: Look Keith, I can’t help my DNA! I was born with it, and so far, although it is possible (or so I have read) to get your foreskin replaced, I’m stuck with the Jewish DNA, not that I mind. And if Hophmi was ever short, and needed a DNA transfusion I would volunteer. We don’t agree on stuff, but I won’t see him wither and die for lack of Jewish DNA. http://mondoweiss.net/2014... - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
Mooser used to be a popular figure on MW -- he's gone off the rails -- attacking all and sundry -- usually by maliciously mischaracterizing their words, which he doesn't seem to take the trouble to read and understand. It's a weird and uncomfortable social situation, to say the least. - Sean McBride
With regard to the ethnocentrism angle on this, the comment speaks for itself -- mocking and jesting on the surface, dead serious at the core. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Annie Robbins finally shows her hand on censoring discussion on the relations between Judaism and Zionism
Annie Robbins: - Sean McBride
"hi sean, i’m done moderating your comments in this thread because i’m not qualified to judge where attacking a religion (or claiming it’s insignificant and completely consumed by a political construct) crosses the line into attacking the worshipers of a that religion given my repulsion for your determination to insist judaism is completely consumed by zionism, or whatever it is you... more... - Sean McBride
She is trying to moderate a topic about which she is completely ignorant -- she can't put together two coherent ideas on it. - Sean McBride
We'll see if this clears: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
oldgeezer wrote: - Sean McBride
"It’s a bit silly to see adherents of Judaism as a monolithic block, and say their religion is the problem, just as it is silly to lump Protestants and Catholics together as one." - Sean McBride
No one here has said that all adherents of Judaism comprise a monolithic block that supports Zionism. The argument is that *all* of the leading organizations of the Jewish religious establishment strongly support Zionism (apparently, now, even including the American Council of Judaism) -- and that they have combined Judaism and Zionism into a single ideological package. It's a gigantic... more... - Sean McBride
These religious organizations and leaders merit as much reasonable criticism as Christian Zionist groups. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
Not yet cleared: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
lysias, - Sean McBride
<blockquote> Two roads diverged in a wood… One descendant of ancient Judaism, Christianity, gave the Old Testament a universalist interpretation. The other major one, Rabbinic Judaism, gave it a tribal, exclusivist interpretation until the Enlightenment, when it too gave the Bible a universalist interpretation. Until Israel was founded and Zionism swamped universalizing Judaism. </blockquote> - Sean McBride
That is one of the best brief summaries I've seen of the history of Judaism yet. - Sean McBride
Judaism had a brief moment of universalism during its Enlightenment phase (which was inspired primarily by European, not Jewish thought leaders, like Voltaire, Diderot and Jefferson), and then, with the emergence of Zionism, quickly sank back into narrow ethnocentrism and tribalism -- which is where Judaism stands in the year 2014. Even the formerly anti-Zionist American Council of... more... - Sean McBride
The crisis of Zionism is really the crisis of Judaism and Jewish civilization in general. The ability of Zionists to communicate with the rest of the world is rapidly deteriorating because, in an Aspergery way, they have little respect or empathy for the concerns of outgroups -- for the human race at large -- for modern universalism. - Sean McBride
Quite a few progressives seem to be in denial about what is going on -- including progressive Jewish anti-Zionists. They really don't differ that much from liberal Zionists in their insistence on clinging on to sentimental beliefs that don't match up with reality. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
Ah, it turns out that Annie deleted this comment outright -- she can't hold up her end of the debate, per usual -- so she relies on censorship to try to muddle through: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
Annie, - Sean McBride
I pointed out to jon s that the racist, bigoted, violent, ethnocentric, nationalist and genocidal passages in the Torah/Old Testament greatly outnumber the vague, feel-good universalist passages, and that many contemporary religious AND secular Zionists use those hate-filled passages (certainly hate-filled by the standards of contemporary civilization) to rationalize and justify Israeli and Zionist policies. - Sean McBride
When you read texts, you need to study them *whole*, with all the parts in context and in proportion. I've read the Old Testament carefully from beginning to end at least five times, in combination with a great deal of critical analysis. I urge everyone here to read it all the way through at least *once* to understand why that work acquired such a bad reputation among Enlightenment and universalist thinkers -- they were appalled by it. - Sean McBride
Many people who haven't actually read the Old Testament, but who have only heard bits and snatches of it from popular culture, are shocked and horrified when they do. - Sean McBride
Christianity arose as a universalist and progressive revolt against the narrow tribalism and nationalism of the Judaism of that era. Compare the flavor and tone of the Old Testament and New Testament regarding tribalism and universalism. Reform Judaism, which was an Enlightenment product, emerged from a similar perspective on ancient Judaism -- like Christianity, it was created in the... more... - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
And Annie Robbins is now also deleting my replies to Mooser -- giving him an open field to engage in attacks without rebuttal: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
Mooser, - Sean McBride
I told you clearly that I don't think there are any available solutions to the problem of Zionism in a historical era in which Zionism and Judaism have merged into a single ethno-religious nationalist ideology and captured the minds and emotions of Jewish establishment leaders lock, stock and barrel, with little effective resistance or opposition from the Jewish community at large. - Sean McBride
All one can do is try to make reasonable predictions. What I foresee is an increasing collapse of relations between the Zionist world and the rest of the world -- there is nothing I can do about it. What do you propose? What do you foresee? - Sean McBride
As I mentioned before, I would expect a fair number of Jews to disaffiliate from the Zionist organizations (nearly *all* Jewish organizations) which are creating so much social and political friction with "the nations." Many of them just want to get along like the rest of us in modern Western democratic nations which care about universalist values. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
So much for the vigorous and informed "war of ideas" on Mondoweiss -- it's a rigged game. - Sean McBride
I just noticed that Annie has deleted yet another comment that had already been cleared: - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
jon s, - Sean McBride
Don't the passages commanding ethnic cleansing or genocide outnumber the universalist passages to a considerable degree? - Sean McBride
For instance: - Sean McBride
Deuteronomy, chapter 7: <blockquote> When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you many nations—the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites, seven nations larger and stronger than you— and when the Lord your God has delivered them over to you and you have defeated them, then you must destroy... more... - Sean McBride
Surely you must see the parallels here with the attitudes of quite a few Israeli settlers and religious Zionists? - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
It's fascinating that Bill Maher on mainstream TV (HBO) discusses (and roasts) the violent themes in the Bible on a regular basis -- but that conversation is too hot to handle for Mondoweiss. - Sean McBride
Been decades since I read the Old Testament and New Testament (in school theology classes) but my impression was God in Old Testament was a violent and punishing God whereas in the New Testament God was forgiving and merciful. The Old was jewish scriptures, the New was Jesus. The Old Testament was Jews as tribe and against the nations - and God in OT very vengeful and violent against enemies---- sounds lot like zionism. - American
I had to laugh at the guy who said the Exodus could be seen as a 'universal' theme of Judaism. Liberation and all that. LOL. - American
American -- of course, what you say is precisely true -- but even these simple concepts, which anyone with even a passing familiarity with the history of Judaism and Christianity understands, are going right over the head of Annie Robbins. If Phil Weiss and Adam Horowitz back up Annie's charge that discussing these issues is "antisemitic," I think it will be time to write off Mondoweiss as a lost cause. Perhaps Jerry Slater had it right about Robbins all along -- the basic complaint: not very bright. - Sean McBride
What did Slater say about her? - American
Slater had problems with the generally mediocre, sloppy and uninformed quality of her thinking and writing, as I recall. One wonders why Phil Weiss and Adam Horowitz permit her to represent Mondoweiss so prominently. Her posts are a mess -- and usually angry and overwrought. - Sean McBride
Everything you really need to know about Zionism can be found in Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy and Joshua -- it's all there -- the basic ultra-nationalist myths, memes and themes -- fleshed out by the other books in the Old Testament. I strongly doubt that Robbins has read a single book in the lot. - Sean McBride
A moderator should not let their 'personal opinions' and 'personalities' dictate what they moderate. - American
Robbins has corrupted and degraded the comments section. She is using it as her soapbox, exercising control and censorship to prop up her personal (and often uninformed) opinions. But the buck stops with Phil Weiss -- he has permitted this situation to go on and fester for quite a few months now. - Sean McBride
In the golden age of MW, no one got in the way of vigorous debates expressing a wide range of views -- moderators were careful not to interfere with the natural flow of conversation of commenters. They didn't try to impose their point of view on the comments section as a whole. She is rather a despot and tyrant by temperament -- she revels in wielding what little power MW affords her. - Sean McBride
I wrote this last Saturday in a private message: "Annie has gradually come to believe that Mondoweiss is her personal blog -- and she has become increasingly bossy, opinionated and erratic in her management of the comments section." - Sean McBride
I am totally not joining you Sean in this tirade against Annie. frankly, if not for her, there would probably be no comment section at all at MW. If you want to rail against Annie, you will lose me. vendettas by anyone against anything are not my cup of tea. We lost over time many comment sections. haaretz's Talkback was one of the best ever and it's gone. The Guardian CiF was excellent and it's now severly curtailed. If MW will go by the way of HuffPo et al, that's something we have all expected. - Danaa
No one, as in NO ONE awes any of us a platform fro carrying out our favorite discourses/debates etc. IF MW does not wish you to carry on, especially in light of the OBVIOUS disinclination of the site to be a vehicle for any one particular debate, then you may just have to accept this and move on. - Danaa
On this feed, you can exercise whatever editorial control you wish. You can block people, you can engage with them on any topic, or not. It6's your feed and your choice. But on MW you are one commenter out of many., and if they don't want to go on and on in one particular direction that's important to you, then that's their choice. You can complain to the editors, and you can complain... more... - Danaa
I will repeat again - without Annie there's no comment section, period. She does the lion share of moderating for virtually no compensation. They'll never find another one like her willing to work countless hours on a thankless task for nearly nothing. That's the reality. It seems to me, sean, that you would rather destroy what's left of the comment section than to have your special... more... - Danaa
One more thing - I took note of your second comment above, the one you said was deleted. At some future time of my choosing I will make a similar comment, just as I have in the past. I bet you it'll clear. I told you it's personal - it's you personally they don't want to engage with on this topic. may be the way you approach it is a bit pointed and ascerbic. may be you telegraph too... more... - Danaa
Several times you described Mooser here as "not very bright" also. It could be he took note of that and decided engaging with you is for the birds. Now you called Annie all but "stupid", even dusting off good old Slater to back your denigration (why, if Slater said it he must be right, eh? after all, we all admired Slater, didn't we?). Now I'm beginning to wonder about things. Lots of things. But one thing i won't wonder about is why Annie prefers to give you a pass. - Danaa
I can't help but wonder now - was it your purpose to derail the MW comment section altogether just because it did not live up to your expectations? if it'll be no more, will you feel vindicated? is that what you were after all along? - Danaa
I have settled the argument for everyone ----->American December 17, 2014, 12:45 am '' Judaism is Zionism- Zionism is Judaism Yes it is– No its not. Anyone can find 1000s of articles by Jews and Rabbis claiming it is and claiming it isn’t. And all of them on both sides quoting this and that from the Old Testament to prove it. So its crystal clear that Judaism is Zionism for some of them... more... - American
Cause that's the truth.lol - American
<<We lost over time many comment sections. haaretz's Talkback was one of the best ever and it's gone. The Guardian CiF was excellent and it's now severly curtailed. If MW will go by the way of HuffPo et al, that's something we have all expected.>> ~Danaa. ....... ;....... It's nice that MW restored the comment period's length.. Too bad they had the unwieldy redesign though. - WJones
Danaa -- the Mondoweiss comments section could easily survive the departure of Annie Robbins -- there are any number of people out there who are better educated than Annie, more literate, have more analytical minds and better editorial judgment, and who would be eager to lend a hand. Annie more than anyone else is responsible for the steep decline of the quality of MW comments -- she is... more... - Sean McBride
One begins to wonder: are there any significant differences between many Likud Zionists, liberal Zionists and progressive anti-Zionists? Many progressive anti-Zionists are no more able to deal honestly and objectively with the ideological roots of Zionism than Elliott Abrams, Michael Ledeen or Benjamin Netanyahu. It's all about emotionally circling the tribal wagon in all circumstances. - Sean McBride
To the main questions I addressed to Phil Weiss and Allan Brownfeld in the "Yes, Virginia" post, still no answers, no serious thinking of any kind. It's no wonder that progressive anti-Zionists have not made the slightest impact on affecting the power of the Israel lobby -- they are afraid to address the question of what sustains that power. In their gatekeeping function on this issue they are as much enablers of Zionism and the Israeli government as liberal Zionists (and even Likud Zionists). - Sean McBride
Danaa -- your instinctive inclination repeatedly has been to side with Mooser and Annie Robbins in their efforts to censor informed discussion about the role of Judaism and the Jewish religious establishment in empowering Zionism. It's difficult to reconcile this behavior with your many critiques of Judaism and support for Gilad Atzmon. I am still trying to understand the strange self-contradictions here. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- Annie has severely damaged the comments section by flooding it with her opinions (most of them written in mangled and confused prose), while at the same time moderating the section with a heavy hand to manipulate and rig discussions and debates in her favor. Really -- the situation is ridiculous. Phil sets high standards for MW in his lead articles. Annie has muddled and muddied the MW brand. I am surprised you can't see it. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- Phil in his lead articles has often shown a strong curiosity and open-mindedness about discussing the Judaism/Zionism issue in a bold and frank way. Instead of encouraging Annie Robbins and Mooser in their worst tendencies you should instead be encouraging Phil Weiss in his best tendencies. After all, it's his blog -- not Annie's or Mooser's. This is a conversation he has the... more... - Sean McBride
Annie is making a bit of progress: "anyway, i am rambling. i’m in the odd position of protecting judaism or islam or whatever. i’ve asked someone else to step in and make these decisions on this thread. it’s over my head." http://mondoweiss.net/2014... The operative words: "it's over my head." - Sean McBride
Sean, your personal vendetta is kind of getting a bit stale. It's all about you being "smarter" than others and has absolutely nothing to do with whatever issue you are into. If you were arguing about the fact that night follows day and insisting the people debate the issue with you, it would be the same. You came across as obssessive with an ax to grind. Given your over-aggressive tactics, I am not sure I would want you to be the one carrying on the argument. - Danaa
I honestly think the issue of Judaism vs zionism matters to you a hill of beans. Only being right matters to you. I hope you enjoy the thin airs of your eternal scintillating brilliance. keep calling everyone stupid and see how far that gets you on the popularity scale. I now see you are, in fact, much like pepsi in argumentation style - keep beating the same theme to death long after everyone else left to find greener pastures. perhaps the two of you are not so different after all. - Danaa
Danaa -- you've got this backwards -- Annie and Mooser have consistently been the aggressors in these exchanges -- and you have consistently defended them. Regarding the range of my interests concerning Mideast politics -- look at this feed -- it covers a wide variety of angles on the subject, not just the religious angle. In fact, I think the cyber angle is much more interesting than the religious angle -- but few people at MW are equipped to discuss it. - Sean McBride
The only side I am siding with is civility and knowing when you are hurting rather than helping your side of the argument. As I said before - IT IS NOT THE TOPIC BUT YOU PERSONALLY that people don't wish to debate or carry on with because your style is too obssessive compulsive. Just like our debates about Twitter - you never heard or acknowledged a thing I said about the pointlessness... more... - Danaa
There is no Judaism vs. Zionism issue now -- they are one and the same thing, according to the leading authorities on Judaism. Anyone involved in debates about Israel is now involved in controversies about Zionism and Judaism simultaneously whether they know it or not or like it or not. - Sean McBride
There you are again, describing people at MW as "not equipped" with this that or the other. most of us believe that if you think MW is not "up to your lofty standards" then perhaps another venue is what the doctor ordered. You should find people who share your standards to debate with. If they are not at MW I'm sure they are somewhere. May be you could start your own blog and call it... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- regarding Twitter and Big Data: I addressed your remarks in a substantive way and you never replied to my points. Sophisticated Internet users know how to mine Twitter and other social media to automatically extract high-quality editorial content with minimum effort. It's a powerful tool for those who know how to use it. It greatly reduces noise and increases signal -- it... more... - Sean McBride
I confess -- I like bright minds and bright people. That is what drew me to Glenn Greenwald's and Philip Weiss's blogs, and their early communities of commenters -- lots of fascinating and useful conversations there. I suspect you were drawn to those blogs for the same reasons. What has been disappointing is to see the gradual decline in the quality of conversation on MW. But this may be the fate of all great discussion forums -- they eventually lose steam and burn out. - Sean McBride
It's the simple truth: if the MW folks were "well-equipped" regarding cutting-edge information technologies, they wouldn't have permitted an outside company to degrade the quality of the Mondoweiss site. And generally I've noticed that Phil and Adam haven't taken much interest in the details of the Greenwald/Snowden revelations about the technologies being currently wielded by NSA,... more... - Sean McBride
That is why I posted this article today -- "National Cybersecurity Center of Excellence improving security in US, Israel" https://friendfeed.com/mondowe... -- which one of my data mining tools pushed to the top of the queue for me. - Sean McBride
What I like about Glenn Greenwald, among other things -- he's not a gearhead by nature, but he has worked hard to wrap his mind around important technical issues that are foundational for contemporary politics. Good for him -- that lad has grit. That is why his collaboration with Edward Snowden produced powerful revelations that shook the world. He dug in and learned about the technology. (One can imagine how much it hurt his head to master the personal cryptographic system that Snowden taught him. :)) - Sean McBride
Well I'll be damned....Mooser is still stalking and making unsolicited comments on my 'one' comment regarding letting Jews settle the Zionism -Judaism divide/question. And he's getting uglier and uglier. He even has to slam Presbyterians ------------->Mooser.December 17, 2014, 2:17 pm....''....And oh yeah, I forgot to mention, all kinds of different Protestants, so many I certainly... more... - American
I noticed -- rolled my eyes. - Sean McBride
There is a quality of out-of-control dementia in many of these posts -- the endless stream of drivel -- and of course the over-the-top narcissism -- the voices in his head are always clattering away -- the tone is usually mean and cutting. Psychological issues. Tics. - Sean McBride
In every case of my 3 run ins with Mooser his attack on me on the basis of my 'gentile' opinions and implying I am anti Semitic or stereotyping Jews.As I said before it is impossible for people like that to understand that people can regard Jews as differing 'individuals' and still recognize that they often act as a 'collective' force. I see nothing contradictory in holding those two... more... - American
The vibe he puts out when he goes into Terminator mode is that he has sniffed out Amalek. - Sean McBride
Sean "Sophisticated Internet users know how to mine Twitter and other social media to automatically extract high-quality editorial content with minimum effort. It's a powerful tool for those who know how to use it.". You say I don't get "it", and I'm telling you the "it" does not interest me. I have you to mine the news for me, and if it weren't you it'd be someone else. I am not a paid... more... - Danaa
OK, interlude over. Gotta go back to what's pressing..... - Danaa
Well I am just going to say one more thing about Mooser then i am done with him. The first run in I ever had with him was on a thread where people were discussing something about Jews, how they were kept down in ancient days, and someone said something about Jews being in the financial world, on WS, etc... I made the comment that more Jews going into banking, WS and etc instead of... more... - American
American, everything you said about the reasons Jewish people were in the money trade is true. That is exactly How I learnt about the history of the Jews. Also no one in Europe would object to your statements at all. the problem with Mooser was on two levels; (1) he figured out you were not jewish so therefore saying "Jewish" and "money" in the same sentence was verbotten, and (2) he is... more... - Danaa
Sorry for the history "lesson" - I didn't mean to lecture, but I am sharing my experience as a one who came to this country as a foreigner and was astounded to find out how little people knew about history of, say, Europe. And that included some of the most learned jews I met. That includes Phil himself. Only in history departments you find knowledgeable people. So Mooser, to bring the... more... - Danaa
Anyways, i take all this into account when I talk to people like Annie or mooser or keith or even Slater. I see no point (though once i may have) of denouncing people as ignoramuses, having become cognizant of just how ignorant I am about things I learnt nothing about. that being said, it's true that I get treated better than you or Sean. Benefit of the doubt, tribal "status" and all... more... - Danaa
My own suggestion is: get a blog going that's run by a mix of jewish and not jewish editors. Not easy but all it takes is two, one on each side who are open minded and have the kind of non-ascerbic personality on-line that would attract others. Phil, whatever people think about him, simply brought an attractive personality to the I/P debates - who wouldn't want to have dinner with him? who wouldn't be willing to even pay for dinner. So there - this is what it's all about. personality first, debates later. - Danaa
Danaa -- I hear you loud and clear on your views on social media mining, and I respect them. We all process information in our unique and idiosyncratic ways -- and thank God for that. I like social media mining precisely because I value my time -- it permits me to scoop up the most valuable new information for me personally in the least amount of time and with the least amount of... more... - Sean McBride
Danaa -- I also appreciate you being so forthright and forceful in expressing your opinions about the Annie/Mooser situation -- why beat around the bush about your views? :) Neither of us is shy about expressing our opinions and I like that -- it cuts through the bullshit nice and quick -- and eventually things get sorted out one way or the other. I wouldn't waste time in discussions... more... - Sean McBride
Wrt to the tug of war with Annie, my held-up posts were cleared -- I assume either by Phil or Adam -- which is what I expected would happen. - Sean McBride
Danaa, no I dont mind the imput. But it mystifies me that so many Jews on MW who are so into the Jewish subject seem to have no real historical knowledge at all about actual Jewish history. Next to my fiction addiction, I am a history fan, not expert, but read a lot about different eras and countries that come up on my radar screen--so when I got involved on MW, where the theme is very... more... - American
Tragedy is that the opportunity for a Jewish Renaissance in the US has ended in capitulation to tribalism. This tribalism also ties it to the "diasporic". The term "diaspora" of course is a Zionist one; it predates Herzl. The immense wealth and influence has not served the core ideals of equity and fairness but a neurotic worldview that bristles against and blames the outsider in the... more... - peacefly
peacefly -- great comment -- overloaded with content ("overloaded" is a compliment) -- you packed many powerful ideas into that single paragraph. The key challenge facing Jewish civilization in the 21st century: solving the problem you described. I'm an optimist -- I think it can be solved in a positive way to the satisfaction and benefit of everyone. - Sean McBride
Jewish messianism is a powerful force that can evolve in both negative and positive directions. Let's figure out how to nudge forward the positive impulses -- the universalist strains in the culture rather than the tribalist and xenophobic strains -- but without abandoning the culture as a whole. But doing that will require ruthless honesty in trying to figure out what elements in the culture have often gone wrong. This is not a project for the timid. - Sean McBride
I cant find anything positive about Jewish messianism. And I havent been able to find any universal strains in the culture either. Every time I ask for some examples of the universalism all I get is quotes from Jewish writings. What I want is real world 'examples' of how they have 'practiced' universal principles. - American
Jews have often been in the forefront in the battle for social justice, human rights, civil rights and civil liberties. But Zionism has created enormous confusion about which values Jewish civilization really stands for. - Sean McBride
What is most problematic in Jewish civilization: mystical ethnic collectivism. That meme is at the core of both ancient Judaism and contemporary Zionism. - Sean McBride
'' Jews have often been in the forefront in the battle for social justice, human rights, civil rights and civil liberties'..sean)......Still, give me some examples in history, countries, movements other than some Jews involvement in Civil Rights. I am looking for specific examples. In all my research i cant find any movements by Jews in human social issues prior to their involvement in... more... - American
Cant find any Jewish movement against SA Apartheid either---->Search Results History of the Jews in South Africa - Wikipedia, the free ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_South_Africa Wikipedia The early patterns of Jewish South African history are almost identical with ..... The majority of South African Jews were unsupportive of the anti-apartheid cause. ‎History - ‎Today... more... - American
That's because there was no such movement. Vast majority of these movements were supported in the U.S. out of self-interest or safe emotional ways to exercise responses to Holocaust - hence no outrage against own tribe in Occupied Palestine - and not overarching universalism. That's why its quoted, first they came for the [fill in the blanks]. Jews in SA had no fear as "whites", many of... more... - peacefly
MPFF
Yes, Virginia, there is a liberal Zionist - http://mondoweiss.net/2014...
Allan Brownfeld explains that Liberal Zionism has never existed, because Zionism was always based on an illiberal idea, denying the Palestinian presence and removing indigenous people from the land
What liberal Zionists do to others in the name of ethnic nationalism can be done to them -- and no doubt will be done. - Sean McBride
"Run don’t walk to read this article in the Washington Report for Middle East Affairs: “Lamenting the Decline of ‘Liberal Zionism’ Is Futile—Since It Never Really Existed.” In which Allan Brownfeld of the American Council for Judaism explains that the crisis liberal Zionists are experiencing today over anti-democratic trends in Israel is actually the collapse of their own illusions: these liberal Zionists should have recognized long ago that the ideology they embraced was illiberal at its core." - Sean McBride
"Those who believe that Israel is now in the process of abandoning its founding philosophy of “liberal Zionism” are engaged in a futile enterprise, for that “liberal” Zionism never existed—it is simply a convenient myth. They have not confronted a contrary thesis—one supported by history—that Zionism was flawed from the beginning, not only by ignoring the existing indigenous Palestinian population, but by rejecting the dominant spiritual history and essence of Judaism." - Sean McBride
c; Moshe Sharett quote; "We have come to conquer a country from a people inhabiting it…the land must be ours alone." - Sean McBride
"Those who look at Israel’s current policies, such as continued construction and settlement of the occupied territories, are wrong to blame the country’s right wing. Labor and Likud Israeli governments alike have advanced the occupation. Both right- and left-wing Israelis, apparently, are comfortable with the status quo. Those who lament what they think is the decline—or end—of “liberal... more... - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
Allan Brownfeld wrote: <blockquote> 1. ... by rejecting the dominant spiritual history and essence of Judaism ... 2. ... turned its back on the Jewish universal spiritual tradition ... </blockquote> - Sean McBride
Could Allan Brownfeld, or anyone here, provide the names of some key Jewish religious authors and works, outside of Enlightenment non-nationalist Reform Judaism (which has turned out to be a small historical blip in the big scheme of things), that give voice to "the Jewish universal spiritual tradition" and "the dominant spiritual history and essence of Judaism"? Some key quotes? The Torah is an intensely tribalist and nationalist ideological document -- one fully consistent with contemporary Zionism. - Sean McBride
Any good quotes? - Sean McBride
How does Brownfeld's interpretation of Judaism jibe with that of Israel Shahak or Yehoshafat Harkabi? - Sean McBride
Where is the "universalism," for instance, in Maimonides? - Sean McBride
There are deeply grounded cultural and ideological reasons for why the Jewish religious establishment has embraced Zionism with such enthusiasm -- and why it continues to double down on Zionism decade after decade, crisis after crisis. Until that complex of ideas is fully investigated, untangled and understood, it is going to be difficult to change a critical mass of Jewish minds about the rightness and righteousness of Zionism. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
Once again, Phil himself has introduced the subject of Judaism on Mondoweiss -- and is promoting the familiar theme that Zionism is an anomalous and illegitimate deviation from Judaism. I don't think that is an argument that can withstand a fair intellectual challenge based on reading aright the foundational documents of Judaism for the past few millennia. - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
One can untangle and bring clarity to this subject by assembling two collections of quotes: - Sean McBride
1. universalist quotes by leading Jewish religious thinkers - Sean McBride
2. anti-universalist, ethnocentric, nationalist, racist, tribalist and xenophobic quotes by leading Jewish religious thinkers - Sean McBride
Which stream of thinking has exerted the greatest influence on Judaism as a whole over the last few millennia -- and especially during the last half century? - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
I would be interested in pursuing this discussion with Phil Weiss and Allan Brownfeld -- not Mooser or Annie Robbins. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- once again check out Mooser's behavior on Mondoweiss -- he is initiating discussion with me -- I am not initiating discussion with him. And his comment to me is entirely without substance. Clearly any criticism of Judaism gets under his skin -- but he is unable to explain precisely why. - Sean McBride
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
Another question for Allan Brownfeld: - Sean McBride
Within Judaism, the Ultra-Orthodox, Satmar and Neturei Karta represent the main (and perhaps) only anti-Zionist streams. In what way are they universalists? - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
Interesting -- Mondoweiss deleted my first comment above -- which struck me as being perfectly reasonable and civil. Why? But it approved the second comment. Mondoweiss appears to be highly conflicted and inconsistent about this subject. - Sean McBride
TIf Mooser is initiating something you don't need to respond. Do you respond to every commenter on this or any other subject? why do you care so much what Mooser says? do you take on Hophmi all the time? or every comment Annie makes? I must say that your comments come across to me as needling. however much you read on the subject you are not a religious jew so it is not your faith or... more... - Danaa
just be glad I am not putting up this comment on MW. that would really bring "them" (whoever they are) out of the wood works. - Danaa
Danaa -- what is important to me are the destructive effects that this ideology is having on my country -- the United States. Asking reasonable questions about the ideology in question is not "needling" -- it's an attempt to get at the bottom of what is driving this ideology and political movement. Phil posted an article citing Allan Brownfeld which, once again, addressed the... more... - Sean McBride
Danaa -- you seem to be arguing that one has to be a religious Jew to ask questions about Judaism and religious Zionism. By that reasoning, it would be improper for Jews to raise questions about Christianity, Islam or any other non-Jewish religion. And in any case, the focus of the discussion here is about *politics* -- not religion -- about the ways in which religious believers are... more... - Sean McBride
Whatever you would like Brownfeld to do he is not going to do it and there's no way you can force it. just because you want someone to come out and debate you or explain their position, they will only if they want to. My suggestion would be to find him on his own blog or whatever perch he is on and have him take it up there - if he wants to. The emphasis here is on "want". - Danaa
what i don't understand is why you insist they (whoever0 debate an issue with YOU. For whatever reason they don't want to have that discussion specifically with you. The more you insist, the less likely they are to take up your question. May be you could get someone else to raise it? or perhaps accept that everyone basically agrees there's a problem in the Judaism/zionism department and somehow those who care about judaism (which is not you and is certainly not me) need to resolve it for themselves. - Danaa
Sure what jews do affects others. But you want to argue something that that they don't want to argue WITH YOU about. I keep telling you they ain't gonna pick up the glove as much as you want to duel it out. If I were you I would take it personally, and make decisions accordingly. Perhaps there is a legal instrument you could use to force them to come out and debate/discuss/explain whatever. - Danaa
Now look what you did Sean - you brought out pepsi! now we can all have fun together, can't we? - Danaa
Well, the logjam seems to have broken -- the debate is proceeding on MW. :) - Sean McBride
I looked at the comments. I've said this before----I rarely see any Jews who actually have a true and factual understanding of Jewish history and I think it is because they rely on Jewish writers who write 'only' about Jews. Therefore they get only a Jewish interpretation' of world history, events, the Jews place in it and etc.. They should read some 'straight' world history books by... more... - American
What is most frustrating in trying to discuss the tribe, Jews, zionism or anything related with them is they do not understand how a person (or critics) can hold two views at the same time. There is nothing contradictory about treating or regarding Jews as 'individuals' and at the same time recognizing that Jews often act as a tribe or 'collective'. - American
I can easily agree with what you say American regarding views of history. In Israel in particular we got strictly a jewish viewpoint of history's larger events. For example, we really studied only history of places and countries where jews were at one point or another, and only those periods when they actually lived in the land. examples are Poland and Russia. We got very little Russian... more... - Danaa
ChasMark -- interesting essay on Machiavelli. You should post it on GFTG or your personal feed. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Mooser and Annie Robbins on Mondoweiss are still trying to obstruct and censor discussion about the ideological linkages between Judaism and Zionism.
And Annie Robbins is continuing to try to protect Mooser from being challenged about his views on Judaism and Zionism -- whenever this topic comes up, she interjects herself between Mooser and me -- really strange behavior. Mooser hides trembling behind her skirts -- he loses his tongue. - Sean McBride
On the subject of religious Zionism, both Jewish and Christian, Mooser and Annie seem to know absolutely nothing -- no cites, no background reading, no facts, no insights. Their agenda seems to be to protect Judaism from any responsibility for Zionism -- which is an absurd position. The Jewish religious establishment is by far the most important component of the Israel lobby. - Sean McBride
"Fofani"? I don't think this is appropriate, Sean and will not get you many fans. It just looks like you are irritated that Mooser won't engage with you. It's his choice, you know, to not debate this or another issue. Just like hostage. Debate only makes sense if there's another side that actually want to debate. You may want to find another angle to get your point across is my recommendation. - Danaa
Danaa -- you may have missed many of the exchanges. Annie Robbins has repeatedly inserted herself in the discussions about Judaism and Zionism in a way that was clearly intended to obstruct and disrupt that line of conversation and investigation on Mondoweiss. And she has repeatedly failed to draw clear distinctions between her role as a Mondoweiss moderator, Mondoweiss spokesperson and... more... - Sean McBride
Annie Fofani is her Twitter handle, by the way. https://twitter.com/anniefo... Nothing derogatory was intended in the use of her self-chosen Twitter name. (Did Danaa think I was taking a cheap shot at her? :) -- not my style.) - Sean McBride
I thought this was a reference to the Name Game: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... (Annie, Annie, Fofannie) But since her name is Annie, not Ana, her name actually would make the Name Game (which uses the ending "-ana") into a tongue twister. - WJones
My main problem with Annie -- she consistently misrepresents and garbles my views and directs her ire at straw men -- after awhile, one loses patience in trying to sort out the mental mess. You can only have a useful discussion when the participants quickly get each other's points -- and respond intelligently to what you are actually saying. Mooser is even worse in this department -- he... more... - Sean McBride
If annie and Mooser's debate style is not to the level you want then just stop debating them. isn't that the obvious solution? my only question is why do you insist on continuing something that you are not happy with? may be you should find some other people to engage with on this topic, possibly not on MW. - Danaa
I am not saying anything here about the pros or cons of this particular debate, because the point of your point is that they (annie, Mooser et al) don't seem to want to engage with you on the topic. At least not sincerely. If you keep bringing up the topic trying to draw out Mooser, it'll just look like you are trying to score debate points. - Danaa
Danaa -- you've got this completely backwards -- when I tried to debate this subject with other people, Mooser and Annie repeatedly interjected themselves into the discussions with the clear intent to disrupt and obstruct -- they were the aggressors. I know what I am talking about -- I was in the middle of every exchange :) -- (all of it archived, by the way). - Sean McBride
Sean, the topic is probably worth discussing for the sake of other readers, but not to expect Annie and Mooser to engage in a constructive way. I don't know that Mooser is really able to make a detailed engagement on the topic, pro or contra. Annie probably is, but she straightjackets herself on the topic, since I asked why are so there so many PEPs who are conservative on the issue,... more... - WJones
I don't know what the deal is with annie and Mooser but I don't engage with either of them any more since the debate/argument Mooser started with me that annie butted into and was very snide and insulting. I made some comment on a thread in response to something saying I had always regarded Jews as religion because that's how I was raised, that Jews were Jews because they were members... more... - American
American -- that's the well-established pattern by now with Annie and Mooser -- they work as a tag team -- with Annie often interceding (butting in) to try to protect "little brother" Mooser -- who has trouble standing up on his own two feet in a serious debate. Often neither one makes a lick of sense -- often they are snide and insulting. They have dragged down the level of the comments section. The basic agenda -- constrain the critique of Zionism to what they consider to be safe limits. - Sean McBride
Well I just ignore them now--I don't really comment that much on MW any more anyway. My only interest in ever looking into the tribe or Jewishness/Jewish history'Judaism to begin with was simply because of the political problem of Jewish Zionism to try and see*why* there is always a Jewish problem century after century. I think I now have a good grip on the 'why of it'----and imo if... more... - American
Avigail's essay was really great. I think more people should have paid attention (judging from the comments - I expected a lot more. If the thread isn't closed down yet I may interject). The key here is the psychology of brain washing from infancy (that's how it's done in Israel). She is saying what I have been for a while now (and she is definitely the professional psychologist; I am... more... - Danaa
'' The key here is the psychology of brain washing from infancy (that's how it's done in Israel). She is saying what I have been for a while now (and she is definitely the professional psychologist; I am just a good observer) that israelis are a cult, a really virulent one. And one with enough tentacles to draw in their supposed bretherns among the jews of the world. Who then go on to... more... - American
MOOSER: "[“I see ancient Judaism as holding an inner Messianic prophecy of universalism.” ~W.Jones"] Yes, but you have always been one of the world’s premier chumps, so you would think a meshuggana thing like that. Go ahead, be a schmendrick, I can’t stop you." http://mondoweiss.net/2014... - WJones
I think he is being sarcastic. - WJones
Let me ask you again, WJones. why do you insist on carrying on a conversation with someone who simply doesn't seem to want to talk to you? Mooser does not want to discuss anything to do with ancient Judaism and/or whatever "prophesies' one imagines were contained in the OT (which, as you know I consider Rantings, not "prophesies") with anyone, be they jewish or not. It's not his shtick,... more... - Danaa
Another thing - most people who are jewish, however observant they may or may not be, are nopt very interested in talking about ancient judaism, and especially not with those who say they are Christians. That task is perhaps best left to historians and/or theologians with a historical bent. I realize Christians (cf. mostly protestants) do like to talk about early Christianity which gets... more... - Danaa
On this again eh? I honestly don't see the point unless you are trying to prove that Judaism provided the seeds for Zionism. I think there are some beliefs in Judaism that 'could have' ..mainly how it evolved for some into a ethnic or 'peoplehood tribe' . But seriously, how do you think you're going to change whatever is in the minds of those you keep trying to discuss this with? The side that pursues this and the side that avoids it both have their minds made up already so its a lose- lose. - American
American saying it more simply than I did, more to the point, too. - Danaa
Mooser, working in tandem with Annie Robbins, was aggressive and abusive in trying to shut down discussion about the relations between Judaism and Zionism on Mondoweiss as a whole. He started that mess. And now many people are wondering where he is really coming from on these issues. If the subject makes him defensive, nervous and shrill, he should steer clear of it -- and he should... more... - Sean McBride
What this controversy revealed about Mooser is that underneath the comic exterior lurks a true fanatic when it comes to Judaism -- very angry and xenophobic in a classical Old Testament way. - Sean McBride
The anti-Zionist and non-Zionist factions in contemporary Judaism are on the far fringe and are completely powerless -- the Jewish religious establishment overwhelmingly supports Zionism and frames it as an organic extension (or even core component) of Judaism. Regarding the topic in general: it comes up all the time on Mondoweiss, spontaneously, among many commenters and MW writers,... more... - Sean McBride
Judaism is the ideological glue that holds together the ethnic cult of Zionism. - Sean McBride
Drat! I lost my comment and have a cruddy head cold and am going to bed---but will just say again ....quit beating your head against the wall. Mooser and annie don't want it, aren't going to engage. I don't know why you try/care anyway cause nothing anyone outside of Judaism says about Judaism being Zionism or visa versa one way or another is going to change anything. - American
I have no interest in discussing the topic with Mooser and Annie -- but I do with other people on MW who are interested in the topic and who are much more knowledgeable about it than they are. You should advise them to butt out and stick to issues they know something about -- with Mooser, that would be doing Henny Youngman routines, circa the 1950s in the Catskills and Borscht Belt. - Sean McBride
I doubt my telling them to butt out would have any affect. lol BUT.... if you want to pursue the subject with other commenters then be smart and don't step in the cow pie---by addressing Mooser on it, don't respond to him or annie regardless of what they say if they do butt in, ignore it----only respond to the others you say have an interest. - American
yet again, I must second American. Don't engage with those who don't want to engage with you. Addressing others is fine, why not. You know, the easiest thingto do on MW, as I found is to ignore people. Which is why I'm always amazed that people were so tempted to respond to someone like hophmi or the other pro-Israel posters. I did so only once in a blue moon and only when i felt like... more... - Danaa
Danaa and American -- again, you are missing the point: Mooser and Annie Robbins were trying to prevent *other* MW users from engaging in discussion on this topic with *one another*. They have sought to censor and shut down the topic of Judaism and Zionism altogether by means of personal attacks and even vicious verbal abuse (from Mooser). I had numerous lengthy and useful conversations... more... - Sean McBride
But this is a non-issue now -- the MW comments section has lost its vitality -- most of the heavyweight commenters and commenting have disappeared. - Sean McBride
What is going on here is that some MW personalities are trying to cling to the belief that Zionism is a peculiar deviation from the Jewish tradition which "hijacked" Judaism. But this is not the case -- the roots of Zionism lie firmly in Judaism -- that is why the Jewish religious establishment has embraced it passionately and without reservation. What was a deviation was Reform Judaism... more... - Sean McBride
Quite a few minds on MW were capable of discussing these issues in an interesting way based on a mastery of scholarship -- but they are now gone. And this is a conversation that has gone right over the heads of Mooser and Annie. - Sean McBride
DANAA, You ask: <<"Let me ask you again, WJones. why do you insist on carrying on a conversation with someone who simply doesn't seem to want to talk to you? Mooser does not want to discuss anything to do with ancient Judaism... My suggestion is - find someone else to converse with.">> I don't have a special interest in talking with Mooser. I make general comments on MW about things I... more... - WJones
WJones -- indeed -- the issue is about Mooser and Annie fouling up and degrading the MW comments section in general with classical troll methods -- not about any desire to engage in discussions with them. - Sean McBride
''indeed -- the issue is about Mooser and Annie fouling up and degrading the MW comments section in general...Sean).....Yeah but there is nothing you can do about it. The best days of the MW comment section are gone, not likely to return. Except for a few times when articles like the one about Ferguson and cops appears and gets people arguing their side and debating its mostly just repetitive yada yada. - American
American -- as you know, I've pretty much written off the MW comments section. There are still some good posts there, however -- for instance, I just quickly scanned the 100 Most Recent Comments and noticed some interesting posts by JLewisDickerson. The valuable commenters go well beyond opinionating -- they load up their comments with important documentary material from high-quality... more... - Sean McBride
WJones also made some excellent posts just recently. - Sean McBride
I wanted to interject into the comments to defend Sean for getting into a worthwhile topic. - WJones
Once again, Mooser is up to his old tricks: http://mondoweiss.net/2014... Always in attack mode on the subject of Judaism. - Sean McBride
Sean, who cares what mode Mooser is in? seems it's only you that takes it to heart. - Danaa
Once again, he is cluttering up the comments section with nastiness and empty remarks while trying to disrupt a useful discussion about an all-important issue. It's beginning to sound like you are defending or excusing his behavior. I would like see an intelligent discussion on Mondoweiss concerning Allan Brownfeld's views on the relations between Judaism and Zionism. Perhaps it can still happen -- we'll see. - Sean McBride
American
http://electronicintifada.net/content... How school privatization hawks Teach For America promote Israel
If you want a subject for MW take on this one. It has a Jewish angle. Plus US education is now circling the toilet between bad teachers that cant be fired because they belong to a union and Zionist who want turn the US in a Jewish state for Israel and yet others who want to bust up Teacher Unions and don't care how they do it. Its a F'ing mess. - American
'' Teach For America (TFA) is best known for dispatching hundreds of idealistic college graduates to work in inner cities across the United States each year, but it also sends selected members on free, religious-themed tours of Israel. - American
' Called The Reality Israel Experience, the TFA-sponsored trips bring idealistic young American teachers into contact with Israeli politicians and military personnel while “introducing [TFA] corps members to Israel’s education and social justice systems.” - American
'' According to testimonies featured on Reality Israel’s official website, participants are at times led by a “military tour guide,” visit with Israeli military educators at an army base “near Jerusalem” (in the occupied West Bank?), and enjoy “ATV off-roading all over the Golan Heights,” an Israeli-occupied region of Syria. - American
' The Reality Israel Experience is largely a project of Lynn Schusterman, the wealthy widow of the oil and gas tycoon Charles Schusterman. Since taking control of her husband’s fortune, she has established a reputation as one of America’s most aggressive backers of pro-Israel campus advocacy, funding campus-oriented ventures like Birthright Israel and The David Project. - American
'' As publicly-funded, privately-operated charter schools expand their reach and their wealthy advocates gain increasing influence over public education, boundaries between religion and state have blurred. This has opened avenues for ideologues like Schusterman to advance their political and religious agenda among a population of needy and impressionable children. With an eye on... more... - American
'' Unlike certified teachers, TFA members must only complete a five-week summer training program before they enter the classroom. They work for lower salaries than certified teachers and must accept weaker health and pension benefits, a prime arrangement for libertarian-minded governors and mayors seeking to hollow out the public sector. - American
'' In Chicago, where Mayor Rahm Emanuel has shuttered nearly fifty public schools, mostly in predominately African-American neighborhoods, approximately 850 teachers and staffers have lost their jobs. The man-made disaster has been a boon to TFA, which is pouring into Chicago with hundreds of non-union replacement teachers. “The added influx of TFA corps in the city means they now compete head-to-head for jobs with traditional teachers,” noted journalist Emily Brosious. - American
'' “TFA basically now is a replacement worker organization,” Branden Rippey, a Newark, New Jersey-based public high school teacher and leader of his city’s New Education Workers caucus, told me. “They are a scab-running company; they lay off tenured teachers and bring in scab workers. The [TFA] kids are so young, they haven’t had experience, they haven’t had conflict with their bosses, they don’t understand what’s happening and don’t know what they’re being used for.” - American
'' A year before Schusterman began supporting education privatization, Michael Steinhardt, the hedge fund manager who commits millions each year to Birthright Israel, and who has declared, “There were no Palestinian people,” initiated an effort to establish a network of Hebrew-language charter schools that promoted Israel on the public dime. - American
'' Reporters Nathan Guttman and Naomi Zeveloff of the Forward reported that the Israeli flag stands beside the American flag in classrooms of the Hebrew Language Academy (45 percent of the school’s students are non-white). Despite criticism from the New York Civil Rights Coalition, which accused the charters of skirting the constitutional separation of religion and state to “transmit cultural values and identity,” the publicly-funded network has expanded across the country. - American
'' According to a 2011 segment on Public Radio International’s program The World, this is how children at the Hebrew Language Academy in Brooklyn begin each school day: [Teacher is heard saying] “Hands at your side like a soldier…” [Students begin to sing.] PRI reporter: It’s not just any song … it’s the Hatikvah, the Israeli national anthem. - American
'' As the billionaire-backed, bipartisan movement for education privatization sets its sights on inner cities across America, pro-Israel ideologues like Schusterman are riding the momentum. And it seems that little can stop them from imposing their agenda, not even the US constitution. written by Max Blumentha - American
Endless propaganda, indoctrination and mind control -- it never stops; it just keeps accelerating. File under the Zionization of America. - Sean McBride
American -- great post, on an important topic, with careful formatting -- easy to read and grasp. - Sean McBride
named entity extraction: - Sean McBride
1. Adam Simon 2. AIPAC 3. Birthright Israel 4. Charles Schusterman 5. David Brooks 6. Eli Broad 7. Goldman Sachs 8. Hebrew Charter School Center 9. Hebrew Language Academy 10. Israel 11. Jennie Starr 12. Kavod Elementary Charter School 13. Lynn Schusterman 14. Michael Steinhardt 15. Rahm Emanuel 16. Sarah Berman 17. Schusterman Foundation 18. TFA (Teach for America) 19. The David Project 20. The Reality Israel Experience - Sean McBride
On the Judaism/Zionism issue: "In 2011, Starr highlighted the new academy as a kind of pro-Israel activism mill, writing, “A passionate, Israel-oriented, Hebrew speaking community will almost certainly support Israel and stay connected to Judaism.”" - Sean McBride
The message that is being relentlessly hammered home by the Jewish establishment: Judaism, Jews, Jewishness=Zionism and Israel. - Sean McBride
Max Blumenthal was the author of this article, btw. More background: [Is this TFA and Reality Israel stuff Anti-Semitic? I’m torn. http://atthechalkface.com/2013...] - Sean McBride
American, thank you thank you for bringing up this topic and the reference. The situation in Education "reform" is one of my areas of interest. I am reading this now. As you say - it's a veritable mess all around - a race to the bottom. And all because of neoliberalism's model of "privatization" "testing" and "monetary reward/punishment". - Danaa
I hope you don't mind if I comment, but American didn't post this at GFTG, and I'd like to comment. It's worse than you think, American. There is a program that sends public school teachers to view the Holocaust Museum in D.C. for training. I don't know the numbers, but the lady I know who went was still teaching about soap and lampshades several years ago after attending. FWIW,... more... - Todd
Todd, I certainly don't mind you interjecting here. I agree on one thing - the "leftist" agenda in education has succeeded in bringing further down the average level of education kids get in this country for everyone. The effort to "narrow the gap" in achievement cannot succeed as long as the education achievement correlates 1:1 with parental education level, which by extension means,... more... - Danaa
Interestingly, the one area i found where people from "left' and "right" can agree on things is the need for basics in education. In this one area, most of the people on "my" side were actually from the opposing party. Fancy that! there's more to be said on this issue but time is a pressing. Still, lets thank American again for pointing out yet another weird angle in the so-called... more... - Danaa
Todd, I meant to also post this at GFTG ---because I knew you in particular would be interested in this---but got call away on a emergency errand and just got back home. - American
Yep, I agree the leftist have made education about touchy feely stuff and free to be me,me,me instead of learning. I think I am one of the older ones here and I can remember when it was the parents job to 'prepare' their kids for school, to teach them the correct behavior- -iow let them know they go to 'learn' and they have to discipline themselves about learning. I see parents these... more... - American
The TFA may have been set with good intentions originally but as we see in this as with everything else---various special interest have their hand in it...the zios, the union busters, the unions. This country is so screwed up. - American
Sean, no its not anti semitic. Politics, political ideologies and certainly not promoting loyalty to a foreign country should be in public education at all in any way, shape or form. All that stuff needs to be banned, kicked out. Education should be *neutral* period. I don't like teaching the holocaust as a stand alone subject in schools either. Particularly to impressionable young children and it shouldnt even be part of American history, it should be a subject in World History courses. - American
I didn't think the article was remotely antisemitic, and I agree with both you and Max on these issues. I posted the link to that article because the comments are incredibly revealing of a certain mindset with which we are all familiar by now. Internet comments are a gold mine for revealing the real and unvarnished attitudes and beliefs of a wide variety of cultural, political and... more... - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
Friendfeed tip: lists
1. go to your personal feed - Sean McBride
2. in the right column, under "Friends," click on "Browse/edit friends" - Sean McBride
3. click on "New friend list" in the upper right corner under "Friends" - Sean McBride
4. fill in the name for the new list under "Friend list name" - Sean McBride
5. click on "Create" - Sean McBride
6. click on "choose the friends" - Sean McBride
7. click on the friends (including groups, feeds, etc.) that you want to add to the list - Sean McBride
8. the name of the list will now appear in the right column under "Friends" in your personal feed - Sean McBride
9. click on the list name to see the latest updates by members of the list - Sean McBride
You can create any number of lists. You could create, for instance, a list to track all new posts by Mondoweiss members on Friendfeed. - Sean McBride
Lists offer a different way than groups to create new social networks on the fly, without any centralized control. - Sean McBride
Added note: when you are positioned on the feed of any user -- say, American https://friendfeed.com/america... -- you can edit the lists to which that user belongs (it can be several lists). On the left of the top bar for "Lists" click on "(edit)". - Sean McBride
Some geeks are able to figure out these features within a few minutes of first using Friendfeed, but I realize that many people are not. (And thank God most people aren't geeks.) - Sean McBride
Use lists to keep track of new posts on specialized combinations of feeds. - Sean McBride
Imagine if all Mondoweiss writers, managers and commenters set up their own personal feeds on Friendfeed -- the speed, quality and intensity of communications and exchanges would increase dramatically. - Sean McBride
I can easily imagine the information overload. I can only hope this will never happen. I have hard enough time just reading a few posts a day and a couple of comments here and there. I already ran out of time to comment myself. At least not on the level I like to comment. I imagine many are in the same boat. That is we, who are not professional writers/commenters. No time. That's the... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- the beautiful thing about lists is that you have fine-tune control over the amount of information you want to receive from them -- simply populate them in the way and at the level that works best for you. And it's easy to edit and revise them as you go along. And if that weren't enough, you can filter lists through search expressions. I've never run into a problem with... more... - Sean McBride
Danaa -- another Friendfeed tip -- you can use "Saved searches" to easily keep up with new posts and comments on any particular topic or term (or any complex combination of topics or terms). After performing a search, click on "Save search" in the upper left corner of the page. From then on, that search will appear under "Saved searches" in the bottom block of the right column on your... more... - Sean McBride
[erhaps the time for lists like this will come for me some day. Like when i need to do some serious research. Just not yet. I'm mired in other technical searches at the moment .... - Danaa
Danaa
Friendfeed as malleable platform?
Sean earlier today: "Friendfeed breaks down the artificial barriers among *all* publications and websites on the Internet -- it is infinitely flexible, reconfigurable and extensible. Mix and match however you like." - Danaa
However, an incident with Taxi's new feed calls into question the reliability of this platform. According to Taxi (as conveyed to me), she had three acccounts on FF, two of which were "dormant", ie, nearly empty, hardly used. In the interest of house cleaning, she tried to delete one of the old, unused ones, which resulted in all three being deleted. No notice ever came up, saying... more... - Danaa
I see a very serious problem here assuming this account is true. I cannot try and reproduce/test the conditions described (ie, opening another account, and trying to then delete it) without risking that my normal account will vaporize as well. I am not sure how this can be tested otherwise. neither can I assume that Taxi would deliberately tell a story that is not true. If I assume that... more... - Danaa
Her description of what allegedly happened doesn't make sense to me -- I've had considerable experience with Friendfeed, and followed many conversations among Friendfeed wizards about Friendfeed software issues -- and these scenarios have never come up. FF is a highly stable social media platform -- written by some of the most skilled programmers on the planet. If this had ever been an issue, other users would have reported it and it would have been immediately fixed. - Sean McBride
Sean, that's the problem I see here. Only three options: either Taxi is not telling the truth and has, in fact, deliberately disabled all her accounts; or she is telling the story as it happened, in which case FF comes across as either problematic or not reliable. And three: her computer was somehow hacked. Yes, it's possible she pressed an option unwittingly and what happened was a... more... - Danaa
the possibility of "hacking" is especially problematic. It raises doubts more serious than mere "platform issues" or "software bugs". I am very disturbed by that possibility even if the likelihood is in the single digit percentage points or below. - Danaa
Danaa -- the FF community -- in its entirety -- is a far more reliable source on matters like this than Taxi -- whose tech skills are questionable. Possibly Taxi's PC has been hacked -- but that would have nothing to do with Friendfeed. FF has been solid as a rock for seven years now. - Sean McBride
According to taxi, she has contacted the friendfeed "team" but has not heard back from them. Do they exists? is there any help available whatsoever on-line to people who use this platform? could facebook be deliberately trying to hobble it? is Taxi a facebook "plant"? is Sean one of the "original" Friendfeed developers? am I asking too many questions? are we all being a bit naive about... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- FF has been in a state of stasis since Facebook purchased it a few years ago -- so there is no active team to contact. It is so finely tuned that it has been running perfectly, with no adjustments or tweaks required. Taxi is describing a situation that no other FF user has encountered for seven years -- she may be a bit confused -- or perhaps her personal machine has been hacked. - Sean McBride
Sean, taxi never claimed to have some kind of exceptional technical skills. Neither do the 100's of Millions who use facebook. Whatever the case may be, just like things that transpired with facebook over the years and got either addressed or modified, the scenario described by Taxi needs to be addressed. perhaps by the friednfeed team. Can what she described happen or not (say by... more... - Danaa
I wasn't a FF developer, but I was a very early user (from the first week it was released) and was in regular contact with the developers, who are extremely good. Again, from the FF standpoint, Taxi is describing a non-issue. The problem is at her end. - Sean McBride
Sean, if what you say is true and the problem is entirely at taxi's end, that will leave the two possibilities - her computer being "hacked" as in "taken over" at least momentarily, or she is lying. I see a huge problem either way. - Danaa
Taxi has a problem, but it has nothing to do with FF. I don't have enough information to know what precisely the problem is at her end. - Sean McBride
To me, this account is like putting in blinking yellow lights - proceed with caution. And that is what I plan to do. I will not extend my use of FF beyond what I'm doing now which is just a group messaging and commenting service. I will not put anything on my own Feed or try and "branch out to form another group. - Danaa
Danaa...ditto. we have to take people for what they claim unless evidence/contridictions become too much to deny. I don't have any reason to think Taxi would lie about what or how it happened. - American
But, sean you seem very willing to believe she lies. I understand you guys had an altercation and that her "colorful" language is not to your liking. However, as one who had no altercation with either of you, and one who is not readily emotionalized in general, I am not so quick to label people, either as liars, or as 'not so smart", or as "brilliant" or as "flaky". - Danaa
Danaa -- check out my personal feed -- with thousands of posts and comments over years -- not a single glitch or problem -- NOT ONE -- and other experienced FF users will provide the same reports. Listen to people who know what they are talking about -- not Taxi. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- I didn't accuse her of lying -- you introduced that word, not me -- I simply have no idea of what is going on at her end. Consult the full history of the FF Feedback group -- https://friendfeed.com/friendf... -- there are no other user reports that match up with hers. - Sean McBride
OK Sean, but I am waiting to hear from someone who encountered the same scenario as taxi (ie, having multiple accounts and trying to delete only one or two. leaving others intact). That's what i want to hear about - this particular scenario - can one accidentally (say, by being technically "unkilled") delete one's main account when trying to delete a dormant account? has that happened... more... - Danaa
It could be that taxi had more than one account with an identical handle - so FF wouldn't know how to distinguish between them and deletes them all in a flash. It could be she didn't put in enough distinguishing characteristics and FF got confused. - Danaa
All other scenarios are more disturbing to me. Hence my interest. I would like to have the possibility outlined above as either ruled out or in. - Danaa
I am worried though why she hasn't created a new account on FF to communicate with us--- unless FF limits accounts from the same isp. If so she would have to get a new isp. Other thing I thought of (regarding her *route* of communication with you Danaa)----is perhaps she didn't say more or announce her intentions because she has been hacked or has a monitoring bug and is having to do... more... - American
There have been no reports that I know of (and I have read every post and comment on Friendfeed Feedback since its founding) that describe a situation in which deleting one account by a user deletes all other accounts by a user under other user names. FF doesn't get confused about these matters -- some users might, however. - Sean McBride
Hacking happens all the time on the Internet -- that is the scenario I would most worry about and focus on. FF is as bug-free as any social media platform can be. - Sean McBride
FF accounts are not IP-based -- they are user account-based. You can sign into your FF account from any IP. - Sean McBride
But is there any limit on the accounts you can have on a single isp? And if I accidentally deleted myself from FF membership could I recreate a membership with the same name or not? - American
There is no limit on FF accounts by a single user from a single IP that I know of. Recreating an account with the same user name as that from a previously deleted account -- not sure -- but I suspect that may not be possible. You would probably need to choose a new user name. - Sean McBride
To test this out, I just created three new FF accounts with various user names from my standard IP number -- no problems. Easy as pie. - Sean McBride
I'm watching the New England Patriots/Miami Dolphins game while typing -- great game! :) Brady to Gronkowski -- TOUCHDOWN!!! - Sean McBride
I think Taxi may want to keep her 'brand" which is the Taxi name--that may be part of the problem. - American
That may be water under the bridge. Never delete your own account on FF if you have any intention of preserving your brand. It takes a great deal of effort to delete an account -- virtually impossible to do by accident. - Sean McBride
Brady to Edelman -- TOUCHDOWN!!! - Sean McBride
41 to 13. - Sean McBride
Trying to fix Taxi's problem: we need to know: 1. the exact URL for the account she originally deleted 2. the exact URLs for the other accounts that were deleted with that first deletion. - Sean McBride
With that information, perhaps we can figure out what is going on. This stuff isn't rocket science but it does require precise facts. - Sean McBride
Right. She could be thinking that "Taximondo" is a separate "account" from Taxi, when in fact Taximondo is just one of Taxi's feeds. Then she goes to delete her Taximondo feed, but since she imagines that it's an account, she goes and deletes her whole account. If she was Logged In as Taxi at the moment she chose to go to the Delete Account Page, then by choosing to delete it, she... more... - WJones
That's an interesting conjecture, WJones. Plausible. I imagine I could have made a similar error. Say, if I had multiple feeds and wanted to delete one or two. But that leads to one of the very problems i tried to highlight: if FF does not have a pop-up menu with question/statement such as " deleting your account will result in ALL accounts and feeds deleted. Do you want to proceed?" then yes, the technically non-savvy can easily mistake, "feed" for "account" and bingo - there goes down the whole lot. - Danaa
WJones -- good thinking -- quite plausible. If Taxi will give us the URL she deleted first, we can clear this up pronto. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- if you check out the Delete Account page -- http://friendfeed.com/account... -- you will see that it provides highly conspicuous advisories and warnings about committing this operation -- **This operation cannot be undone; all of your data will be permanently deleted** -- the language couldn't be more clear. It even provides a box to fill in: "Type the word "delete" (to... more... - Sean McBride
Danaa proposed having text saying " deleting your account will result in ALL accounts and feeds deleted. Do you want to proceed?" However, the correct text would not say ALL "accounts and". The fact is, deleting her account should only delete Taxi and the feeds in her account (eg. Taxi mondo). BUT in reality, she could have confused her Taximondo feed with her account. She could have... more... - WJones
Has Taxi made any progress in opening a new account on Friendfeed and in describing with precision the steps that led to her original problem? I'm willing to lend a hand, but I still need to understand exactly what is going on -- especially the specific account and URL that was first deleted. - Sean McBride
My best guess is that this was the URL: https://friendfeed.com/taxee (note: "taxee", not "taxi") - Sean McBride
She might consider using taxi1, taxione, etc. -- any unused URL name with taxi as the base. - Sean McBride
WJones, your theory makes sense. That's what might have happened - an understandable confusion between feed" and "account". Now at least I know what never to try to do. I am interested in this issue because I lost some good posts of my own and that's something I really don't like to have happened. - Danaa
Still no update on Taxi's travails? We can help her, but we need the specific facts on how she came to delete her account. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
The Samson Option and Narcissistic Rage
I was just reading Joe Nesbo's detective novel Nemesis and came across this interesting passage: - Sean McBride
BEGIN QUOTE - Sean McBride
'On the subject of ancient gods, I assume you have heard of Narkissos, the Greek god who became so enamoured of his own reflection that he couldn't tear himself away? Freud introduced the concept of a narcissist to psychology, a person with an exaggerated sense of uniqueness, obsessed by the dream of boundless success. For the narcissist the need for revenge against those who have... more... - Sean McBride
'Death to whom?' Harry asked. - Sean McBride
'To all.' - Sean McBride
'That's insane,' Beate burst out.   'In fact, that's what I'm saying,' Aune said drily - Sean McBride
END QUOTE - Sean McBride
[Narcissistic rage and narcissistic injury http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...] - Sean McBride
"Narcissistic rage is a reaction to narcissistic injury, which is a perceived threat to a narcissist's self-esteem or self-worth. Narcissistic injury (or narcissistic scar) is a phrase used by Sigmund Freud in the 1920s; narcissistic wound and narcissistic blow are further, almost interchangeable terms. The term narcissistic rage was coined by Heinz Kohut in 1972." - Sean McBride
"Narcissistic rage occurs on a continuum from instances of aloofness, and expression of mild irritation or annoyance, to serious outbursts, including violent attacks. Narcissistic rage reactions are not limited to personality disorders and may be also seen in catatonic, paranoid delusion and depressive episodes. It has also been suggested that narcissists have two layers of rage. The... more... - Sean McBride
Concept to contemplate: group narcissistic rage. - Sean McBride
# a few concepts to contemplate in combination: [group *] 1. aggression 2. archetypes 3. behavioral patterns 4. competition 5. cooperation 6. cultism 7. customs 8. egotism 9. interests 10. legends 11. lobbies 12. memes 13. messianism 14. myths 15. narcissism 16. narcissistic rage 17. neuroses 18. objectives 19. organized crime 20. paranoia 21. personality traits 22. propaganda themes 23. psychological traits 24. self-hypnosis 25. self-worship 26. will to power - Sean McBride
Btw, any Jo Nesbo fans out there? I discovered him recently -- good stuff. - Sean McBride
I've read all Nesbo's novels. I don't even bother reading US fiction any more---its also has been so dumbed down by Jewish publishing putting out 99% fiction by Jewish writers of no talent and its all below mediocre. Great writers of worthwhile fiction that often incoporate some political event with astounding character development come mostly from Norway and Europe now. Another sector... more... - American
For high-quality detective, mystery and suspense fiction by American authors, Barry Eisler, David Baldacci, Lee Child and Randy Wayne White stand out. American literary fiction has been in steep decline for decades now. - Sean McBride
I now plan to read all of Nesbo's novels. - Sean McBride
I have read all of Lee Child books also....I like his fast moving narrative style. He doesn't do 'extraneous filler' crap that doesn't move the plot. - American
I'm also a big Lee Child fan -- the Jack Reacher character is truly memorable. (Now that I think of it, Lee Child is British by origin.) - Sean McBride
Some time ago I looked at a book called Tuesdays with Morrie with themes of reflection/compassion highlighted in the reviews. Well the author, I discovered, was not writing a universal story but a Zionist tribal one. Here's his sense of understanding: http://mitchalbom.com/d.... If a writer of a different ethnicity wrote such a column... more... - peacefly
c; Israeli op+novelist - Sean McBride
One reason I now avoid most US fiction writers is that I started noticing in too many books by jewish writers --like Johnathan Kellerman for instance who I use to read were peppered with too much jewishness--as in too much mentioning and praising of jewish qualities and etc---and then the last book of his I read was entirely based on a Jewish Israeli operating in the Us and how 'moral'... more... - American
One could bring some clarity to this issue with a bit of social science: sort ethnic groups by number of ethnocentric novels on the New York Times fiction bestsellers list for the past half century. The hard numbers would tell the tale. - Sean McBride
Also: sort ethnic groups by number of *ethnic nationalist* novels on the New York Times fiction bestsellers list for the past half century - Sean McBride
And: the quality of the ethnocentrism matters a great deal -- is it gentle and understated, part of the natural background? -- or is it belligerent, xenophobic, propagandistic or triumphalist? - Sean McBride
Jo Nesbo's novels are *mildly* ethnocentric (Norwegian to be exact) -- but that is because he is a Norwegian author living in Norway. There is not the slightest hint in his writings of a chauvinistic or confrontational attitude about Norwegian ethnic identity. - Sean McBride
Daniel Silva is a good example of an American novelist whose pro-Israel and pro-Jewish propaganda is crude and over the top. He is a militant ethnic nationalist. Joel C. Rosenberg is another example. - Sean McBride
In Nesbo's fiction parts of it are often critical of Norway or elements of Norway's politics....cant remember the title of the one I am specifically thinking of, but it centered around some politics concerning WWII. - American
I don't read Silva any more either. And I read of lot of fiction because it is my way of 'powering down', so to speak, and mentally relaxing before I go to sleep at night. I have almost run out of worthwhile Us authors to read except for a very few. - American
Truman Capote railed that “the Jewish mafia has systematically frozen” gentiles “out of the literary scene.” In a 1968 essay, “On Not Being a Jew,” Edward Hoagland complained that he was “being told in print and occasionally in person that I and my heritage lacked vitality . . . because I could field no ancestor who had hawked copper pots in a Polish shtetl.” Katherine Anne Porter,... more... - American
The Uber Jews naturally try to label all these authors as anti semites for stating what was obviously "obvious' to the most famous non Jewish writers when Jews moved into US publishing houses. Many complained that any Jewish characters in their books that were even slightly non flattering to Jews needed tobe changed or edited out. - American
As far as these authors being anti semites instead of just resentful of the 'discrimination' against them by the Jewish publishers.....I am reminded of this------>'' If you go into a bar and get your ass whipped, maybe the people in the bar were wrong; but if you go into 10 bars in one night and get beat down in every single one of them, chances are that it isn't them, it's you''. Not everyone who criticizes the Jewish clique can be wrong. - American
There was a nice article last year in Salon about why American authors do not and haven't gotten literature Nobel price for lo so many years. It specifically mentioned Philip Roth, who last year, like this year, and every year before went sulking when Noobels were announced. The article did a masterful job of saying everything and noting many reasons without once touching on the obvious... more... - Danaa
Also, thanks for the tips, guys - did not know about Joe nesbo (so little time for anything but noon-fiction. I am all the poorer for it too). - Danaa
Danaa -- [Google; site:salon.com nobel prize philip roth http://www.google.com/#q=site...] >> [Alexander Nazaryan: Why American novelists don’t deserve the Nobel Prize http://www.salon.com/2011...] - Sean McBride
I made an attempt to read Bellow and Roth but couldn't get all the way thru them.. Bellow's disdain for non Jewish society was glaring right off the bat and Roth?,,,ugh,ugh,ugh...too dark, too ethnic, too self navel glazing. Call me simple but I like fiction with some 'redemption' in the tale. - American
I read that Scarlet Johanson was going to direct a movie based on one of Capote's novels..gawd, can you imagine what that will turn out to be? Does that smack of Jews in Hollywood rewarding her for her Israel defense or not. Cant remember which Capote novel, will have to go look it up. - American
Thanks sean. You saved me the work - that was the salon article. the comments on it were interesting too. Everyone skirting the glaring problem and looking everywhere else but directly. - Danaa
Sean McBride
Still don't think that cyberwarfare is a big deal? Check out the developing Sony situation. In truth, cyberwarfare is going to be the biggest deal of all.
A mad rush is underway by governments around the world to identify and provide large salaries to the world's most skilled hackers. Have a shady background? No problem. Perhaps the shadier the better. What matters is the skill set. Hacking in the future will be able to make or break the world's most powerful nations, corporations and institutions. - Sean McBride
Advanced weapons systems are powerful. What is even more powerful is acquiring covert control of advanced weapons systems by hacking. That's leverage. - Sean McBride
Want to bring down any leader in the world? Hack into their personal data. There are a zillion opportunistic approaches to exploit. - Sean McBride
Brave new world indeed. - Sean McBride
Richard Clarke's books on this subject are good reads. - Eric Logan from FFHound!
# The Drudge Report this morning 1. PAPER: SONY SUSPENDS FILMING 2. REPORT: SONY Unable to Process Payments... 3. Delays premiere of hacker movie... 4. Disturbing NEW WARNING Flashed on Staffers' Computers... - Sean McBride
Richard Clarke has been on top of this for quite some time -- brilliant guy. - Sean McBride
Hackers should start going after 'the money' if they want to make a real difference. Hack and send the elites and Zios money caches out into space where it cant be retrieved. Loot their hedge funds and WS accounts. Do it to all of them. - American
But here's the catch: the plutocrats are scooping up all the smartest hackers they can get their hands on with irresistible financial lures and incentives. - Sean McBride
yes Sean - they buy whom they can. But they can't buy everyone, can they? they didn't buy Snowden (though they certainly tried with cushy job and all), and the y couldn't buy David Applebaum and so far, Assange is resisting their offers too (or he wouldn't have to continue and be holed up at the embassy). A few good ones is all we need to cause havoc. - Danaa
The question is, in terms of the long game, which hacker faction will be able to dominate all the other hacker factions. - Sean McBride
Russian and Chinese have potential, but probably US&Britain, since our systems are English based, Microsoft/Apple based ones. - WJones
I would expect the Chinese to excel at hacking -- certainly they have the brainpower to excel. I would also expect Israelis to excel -- being a bit Aspergery is an asset in this field -- almost a prerequisite. I'll wager that Unit 8200 is damned good. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
# Israeli op+*
1. AIPAC head 2. billionaire 3. Bloomberg News writer 4. CFR member 5. Iran War ringleader 6. Iraq War ringleader 7. Israeli citizen 8. JINSA member 9. liberal Zionist 10. neoconservative 11. NPR pundit 12. PNAC member 13. torture ringleader 14. Washington Post writer 15. WINEP member - Sean McBride
A very few examples. How many blanks can you fill in? (I can think of a few thousand categories of interest.) - Sean McBride
{c; *category1+*category2; *instance} That is a compound boolean category with two categories. One can create statements with any number of compound boolean categories for fine-grained analysis. - Sean McBride
# there are many other ops in the world: * 1. British 2. Chinese 3. German 4. Google 5. Japanese 6. Lockheed Martin 7. Masonic 8. Muslim 9. NATO 10. North Korean 11. NSA 12. Pakistani 13. Roman Catholic 14. Russian 15. Saudi - Sean McBride
Project: extract all the category/instance pairs from all Mondoweiss articles and comments. Store them in a single plain text list. (The single file would include tens of thousands of statements/lines.) - Sean McBride
# one can create an ontology of subops for ops, for instance: 1. c; Israeli op subop; ADL op 2. c; Israeli op subop; Christian Zionist op 3. c; Israeli op subop; JINSA op 4. c; Israeli op subop; Mossad op 5. c; Israeli op subop; Unit 8200 op - Sean McBride
One thing is for certain: if you get overfocused on Israel, you will cease to understand what is really going on in the world. There are many other powerful players, many of them working very quietly in the background. They keep a low profile. - Sean McBride
The chief objective of semantic markup? -- to create a computable model of all the entities, relations, structures and processes in the world -- to see them whole and to understand their minute interactions. - Sean McBride
Those who keep a "low profile" - are they what David icke calls the "lizard people"? or is it simpler - the grouping of plutocrats who are currently managing the Empire and its minions? - Danaa
may be it's the protocols come to life? - Danaa
The key principles of the Protocols have been understood by sharp operators for many centuries -- several millennia even. Call them Illuminati; call them whatever you will. They tend to control history because they can run mental circles around most of the human race. - Sean McBride
No doubt in my mind the Zios are firm believers in and followers of the Protocols. But the Protocols tactics for domination aren't unique to them alone. Its really a basic step guide for any groups out to gain power and assert dominance. - American
Many sharp operators understand the Protocols inside and out without ever reading it -- they understand these matters instinctively and intuitively. And most of them are probably not Jewish. - Sean McBride
American -- keep your mind open to the possibility that non-Zios are playing Zios to the hilt -- permitting them -- *encouraging* them -- to think that they are in control. It would be a huge mistake to underestimate the mental power and cunning of all the non-Jewish players I mentioned above. - Sean McBride
The semantic mark-up won't help against the "lizard people" (who may or may not be lizards), eh? - Danaa
Well I have tried to figure out who or which non Zios might be running and profiting from the Zio mafia partnership but cant come up with any. I know a lot of 'piggybacking' goes on among group and individual special interest movers and shakers as in---you help us with our/my agenda for the Ukraine or whatever and you will get xxx out of it. But I don't see any "Non Jewish group" that... more... - American
Whichever player has the most powerful information tools usually wins -- especially in the knowledge-based era in which we now live. - Sean McBride
Well, I have mentioned the military-industrial-intelligence complex to you several times -- do you have any idea of how powerful it is? Among many other things, it controls NSA, which is capable of spying on the entire world in great depth and detail. - Sean McBride
I don't think there is any one "Group" that has a 'World Plan' (except the Isr Zios for Israel). I think its more like the Wild Wild West--where you have various rouge groups or individuals out there gun slinging for their interest or ideology. Thats why its all FUBAR. - American
# Some of the following organizations and institutions, working together, have done a good job of running the show for quite some time: 1. Bilderberg Group 2. Cambridge (University) 3. CFR 4. CIA 5. DIA 6. GCHQ 7. Goldman Sachs 8. Harvard 9. IMF 10. MI6 11. MIT 12. NATO 13. NSA 14. Oxford 15. Vatican 16. World Bank - Sean McBride
And they definitely have "world plans." - Sean McBride
The military-industrial complex is one of Keith, the anti US imperialism, ranters favorite examples. He claims we give Isr aid because the US weapons industry wantsto sell to Isr. Except it doesn't even hold up either. I think I referred you to Chas Freeman's article on this. The US weapons makers sales to Isr are a drop in the bucket and doesnt even come within spitting distance of... more... - American
As far as the US weapons and intelligence complexes actually being responsible for getting the US gov to start wars and conflicts so they can sell more weapons and build bigger spy kingdoms---I don't know, that seems so far beyond evil its hard to contemplate. - American
I can't imagine anything easier to contemplate -- it's human nature at work. Human groups tend to pursue their interests with maximum force. - Sean McBride
It's not about selling arms to Israel -- it's about profiting from the Global War on Terror and the Clash of Civilizations to the tune of trillions of dollars. It's the biggest of big businesses. Israel is a tool in exploiting a magnificent business opportunity. Look at how many expensive weapons we sell to Saudi Arabia to help protect it from Israel. - Sean McBride
I think many someones would have blown the whistle on that much much faster if that were the case. It would have been easier for the politicians to do that then it has been for those who have blown the whistle on Isr lobby knowing they would be called anti semites. - American
So you are saying the US gov, lobbied by the War-Weapons Industry, keeps Isr in the ME and lets it rampage on everyone as a way creating chaos and of getting countries like Saudi to buy US weapons. - American
What whistle would one blow precisely? The machinations here are quite subtle. The MIIC works hand in glove with the Israel lobby under the pretext of doing the right thing -- of aiding a small beleaguered democratic outpost in the Middle East while fighting evil "antisemitic" forces around the world. It's a superb cover -- and the income is staggering. - Sean McBride
That is exactly what I am saying -- seems obvious to me. Meanwhile US national security bureaucracies are rapidly expanding their budgets and empires. What's not to like from their standpoint? It's a sweet deal. - Sean McBride
Well let me tell you this---a long time ago I read about the first meeting between JINSA and the CEO of a major weapons company---it was expressed as this----'since we cant beat you we will cooperate with you''. I wish to hell I could find that again..I think it may have been an investigation by Mother Jones or The Nation. - American
Where I disagree with Keith and Noam Chomsky is that I think the Jewish lobby is at least an equal player in this game. It is doing all the heavy lifting in propagandizing Zionism to the American public through a rich network of policy centers and media outlets. - Sean McBride
Well I think the Jewish Lobby 'started' the game and having the 'juice' in congress the arms groups went along or at least didnt protest. - American
But here's the thing: you never know when, down the line, the MIIC might pull the plug on Israel and Zionism. Its self-interest changes with changing conditions in the world. - Sean McBride
MIIC=military-industrial-intelligence complex - Sean McBride
But powerful forces in the West encouraged and enabled Zionism from the very beginning -- think back to that Winston Churchill essay I brought to your attention. Divide and conquer tactics applied to the Jewish world. The objective was to defang Jewish movements on the left. - Sean McBride
Think: what benefits, say, have Dick Cheney, Keith Alexander and Michael Hayden derived from the Zionist-instigated Global War on Terror? - Sean McBride
'' think back to that Winston Churchill essay I brought to your attention. Divide and conquer tactics applied to the Jewish world. The objective was to defang Jewish movements on the left...sean) .....The problem with that theory is there weren't any Jewish movements on the left. There were only two Jewish movements going on in the Churchill era--->Jewish Bolshevism in Russia and the... more... - American
I really get glazed over eyes at the way people get all into talking about socialism, marxism, capitalism, etc.etc.. Because it doesn't make a damn bit of difference to the leaders of these movements---except in which they think will have the most support----Because I dont care what kind of system is set up there will still be the *People At The Top* (Elites of the movement) of any... more... - American
American -- Churchill and other Western leaders believed that Jews were the dominating force behind Marxism and communism in Russia and the early Soviet Union, and Jews were in fact the dominating force behind a wide variety of hard left (and soft left) movements in the United States and Europe from the 1930s through the present day. There is a large collection of scholarly literature... more... - Sean McBride
American -- you're right -- all political systems end up under the control of elites -- that seems to be how human societies operate. (One can analyze human societies in the same way that one analyzes ant or bee societies -- certain behavioral patterns predominate.) - Sean McBride
American
Fwd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... old, same old,repeating history, Russia, Germany, US (via http://friendfeed.com/mwff3)
Taxi...this link is showing 'file not found'.....try fiddling with it some more or it may be you have to contact FF adm. Meanwhile only by clicking my American 'profile' page can I see anything from you cause all our direct message are gone and all your old comments everywhere on sean and pepsi feeds are gone too. So however you got this to me keep using it till you get a good feed link going that we can pass on. - American
American - it's the same for me. I can't see anything from taxi, period and all discussions/direct messages with her are gone as well. - Danaa
Might she have deleted her own account? - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
# what doesn't work in online communications
1. personal attacks 2. verbal abuse 3. feuding 4. flailing 5. hysteria 6. shouting 7. shrieking 8. thrashing - Sean McBride
Smart people instantly and automatically filter all that out -- they don't have time. - Sean McBride
What brought that about, again? is this directed at someone in particular or is it an admonishment a la Moses' tablets issued to the wider human race? - Danaa
Actually, I'd say that personal attacks and flailing work very well, seeing the immense popularity of the latest SONY hack? it's a treasure trove of behind the scenes gossip and everyone who is anyone in show business has commented on it, flailing all the way to kingdom come. - Danaa
Also, hysteria has worked for the pro-Israel crowd rather well (Holocauset! gevalt! anti-semitism!) all these years. may be a bit blanted by now, but the tool still works great against any public figure and any politico who runs for office. So yes, smearing works, shrieking works and personal attacks work - at least for the party with the werwithal. - Danaa
I am just observing Internet behavior in general -- and noticing what kinds of communications I pay attention to and which kinds of communications I don't. - Sean McBride
In terms of pushing the masses this way and that, shrieky and rabid propaganda often does in fact work -- take Fox News as an example, which relentlessly pushes fear, paranoia, rage and hate buttons. - Sean McBride
I am talking about communications that work best in influencing elite opinion -- not mass opinion. - Sean McBride
I doubt the real 'elite' actually read any of our communications. they are too busy being full of themselves issuing their own or denigrating others'. The ones that I consider "real elites" are hardly the ones at the top of the line - it's more of a community of "exiled", like Chris hedges, Snowden, Greenwald, Stieglitz etc. just to mention a very very short list. My special elites are... more... - Danaa
I should add that what especially doesn't work in *online discussion forums* is out-of-control and self-indulgent speech -- especially verbal abuse -- it is capable of bringing any forum to a grinding halt. Personal attacks rapidly escalate into infantile feuds. - Sean McBride
I'll wager that quite a few influential minds read Mondoweiss (the main articles) -- if the writing wasn't crisp, calm and fact-based, which it is usually, they wouldn't bother. They visit Mondoweiss with the expectation of acquiring new important facts about Israeli politics that are delivered with a minimum of noise. - Sean McBride
Regarding MW, I am sort of dropping it as far as commenting goes, although I will still check the articles there. Not that I dont appreciate the way it has exposed Israel and I/P, but the intelligence level in the comment section has gone down down down. So many good commenters left since all the banning, and I'm not referring to just the banned ones. All it is now is the same people... more... - American
I agree -- the golden age of the Mondoweiss comment section is over -- it was quite impressive while it lasted. - Sean McBride
FF works better for my use, even to make comments on MW articles, doesn't take as much of my time, don't have to wonder if its going thru and it has a edit function...and a delete so if what you said comes out all wrong you can get rid of it...lol - American
American -- you GET FF :) -- I'm impressed -- yup to all that. Fleetness, flexibility and personal control is the name of the game. - Sean McBride
You can have a real conversation here -- even in real time -- without too much interference. - Sean McBride
I rarely feel motivated to visit the Mondoweiss comment section these days -- I am not seeing much in the way of new information and ideas. And often just scanning the headlines of new Mondoweiss articles in the news feed in this group tells me all I need to know. - Sean McBride
The elite (authority) don't listen to the people unless they do scream. Only ways to get the attention of an elite these days is a briefcase full of money or a gun to their head. - American
The briefcase full of money approach is highly reliable -- and relatively risk-free compared to other methods. - Sean McBride
Sean McBride
On the entanglement of Judaism with Zionism (Part 2)
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
Annie, - Sean McBride
Religious Zionism -- Zionism completely entangled with and powered by Judaism -- has become the biggest story in Israeli politics over the last few years -- religious Zionists are acquiring increasing control over the Israeli government and Israeli military and security services -- they are driving mainstream Israeli politics to the extreme right in the name of Judaism. - Sean McBride
These trends are discussed all the time in Israeli and Jewish media. The best Jewish and non-Jewish minds who are knowledgeable about Israeli politics are sounding the alarm about the issue with increasing urgency. - Sean McBride
These remarks by Shabtai Shavit, a former head of Mossad, are typical: - Sean McBride
<blockquote> I am concerned that for the first time, I am seeing haughtiness and arrogance, together with more than a bit of the messianic thinking that rushes to turn the conflict into a holy war. If this has been, so far, a local political conflict that two small nations have been waging over a small and defined piece of territory, major forces in the religious Zionist movement are... more... - Sean McBride
"I am concerned because I see history repeating itself. The nation of Israel is galloping blindly in a time tunnel to the age of Bar Kochba and his war on the Roman Empire. The result of that conflict was several centuries of national existence in the Land of Israel followed by 2,000 years of exile...." - Sean McBride
"The religious Zionist movement ... believes the Jews are “God’s chosen.” This movement, which sanctifies territory beyond any other value, is prepared to sacrifice everything, even at the price of failure and danger to the Third Commonwealth." </blockquote> - Sean McBride
The views of Jewish establishment religious leaders on Zionism -- in Israel and the Diaspora -- are having a much greater impact on these developments than your views and those of Mooser. They are in a much more powerful position to define Judaism to the world than you are. - Sean McBride
It would be helpful if you and Mooser focused on pushing back against these dangerous trends in Israeli and Zionist politics -- and that will require acknowledging that there are major problems in the thinking of the Jewish religious establishment about Judaism and its relations with Zionism. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
Sean, why do you expect a different response from the editors and some commenters at MW? Haven't you been saying the same thing for several years to the same people? I came across a MW archive from 2012-- long before I began (and ended) commenting. There were a only a few commenters who acknowledged the truths that you're expressing: you, of course, Thomson Rutherford, American, Jeffrey... more... - weareone
Indeed -- "in denial" -- to a degee that is ridiculous. When you examine the back and forth on this subject on Mondoweiss (to the degree that it has been permitted), you will notice that the replies by Mooser and Annie in particular have been completely irrational, insulting, ungrounded in facts of any kind, etc. It is important for them to maintain the illusion and falsehood that... more... - Sean McBride
So be it. They're entitled to their opinion. Perhaps it's time to move on. - weareone
Phil Weiss himself has approved numerous articles on Mondoweiss that have developed this theme -- it's clear that he doesn't share the views of Mooser and Annie. I think it's important to keep up pressure on this front. - Sean McBride
Well, I'm not as clear on the editors motivations as you seem to be, given the banning of Jeffrey Blankfort, but regardless--I wish you luck, you'll need it. :) - weareone
My impression is that Phil Weiss has come under a great deal of pressure to censor certain topics concerning Israel and Zionism -- and that he has occasionally bent to the pressure. But he knows the score. - Sean McBride
Regarding the need for luck -- Annie has repeatedly held up or failed to pass through perfectly civil and carefully documented posts (like these recent ones) which challenge her and Mooser's views about the relations between Judaism and Zionism -- that's a convenient way to try to control a debate. :) - Sean McBride
Yes, but it's their site---they can do as they please, which is one of the reasons they've lost, imo, some very valuable commenters like Blankfort and Thomson Rutherford. - weareone
True enough -- publications and forums are free to moderate their sites any way they choose. But I think a few personalities have succeeded in driving away many of Mondoweiss's most intelligent and knowledgeable readers and commenters. Most of us noticed quite some time ago that Mooser contributes absolutely nothing in the way of useful information about Mideast politics -- he simply uses the site to express his shallow narcissism -- it's all about his fragile and needy ego. - Sean McBride
In any case, on the Internet it is easy to route around any obstacles with a bit of initiative. - Sean McBride
But yet the editors and some commenters continually praise his commentary. What does that tell you? - weareone
It tells me a great deal about those particular people. :) They are in the business of damage control -- they are trying to create a firewall to protect the creators and lead promoters of Zionism from the destructive consequences of Zionism. This is a project that requires grotesque and twisty intellectual acrobatics of the type that Mooser regularly serves up. - Sean McBride
Give it up. You aren't going to convince those like Mooser that there was/is anything in Judaism that gave rise to either religious (chosen people) or secular (nation of people) Zionism. The proof of the concept of/ belief in Zionism ( a 'nation' of people) within Judaism can be found during the Enlightenment period in the Rabbi's arguments with the nations on what the 'citizenship' the... more... - American
Yes. - weareone
Sean, I was responding "yes" to you, but I also agree with American. - weareone
American -- you've been right about this issue all along -- as I have acknowledged before. What makes Mooser's and Annie's behavior exceptionally weird is that leading representatives of Judaism proclaim the unity of Judaism and Zionism on a daily basis in leading Israeli and Jewish media. When this material is brought to their attention, they try to pretend that they didn't see it. We are far out of the realm of the rational here -- in crazy territory. - Sean McBride
You reach a point with this kind of lunacy where you lose patience -- it has to be treated with withering contempt. - Sean McBride
All that happens when you pursue that is you get put on their hamster wheel. The hamster wheel being Jews are both a religion and a people. If you argue as I have that Jews were not a 'distinct ethnic people' but a religious group--and that Jewish CULTURE and their belief in their ETHNIC STATUS grew out of Judaism the 'religious' Moosers types will deny any Jewish CULTURE (the Zionist... more... - American
"But I think a few personalities have succeeded in driving away many of Mondoweiss's most intelligent and knowledgeable readers and commenters."-Sean. --You seem to be protecting the editors from the consequences of their actions. It wasn't a commenter that banned Blankfort or banned certain topics which drove away commenters who might otherwise provide some balance to the site and expose some truths. That decision was made by the editors. - weareone
Phil wants to, or does, or did believe that Jews have a superior 'culture' to others---regardless of where it came from,whether it be religious or ethnic. - American
"Phil ,et al don't want is any discussion like that to lead to any *examination of the Jewish culture*." If I may borrow your saying, American--- nail on head. :) - weareone
Sean, might you consider a name change for your feed? Does Mondoweiss align with your mission, vision and values? - weareone
A name change is something to think about -- this group started as a mere convenience, a location to track new Mondoweiss articles via its RSS feed. Then it expanded a bit to accommodate commenters and comments that were blocked or banned on Mondoweiss for questionable reasons (starting with the Blankfort expulsion). Increasingly it has included stories and information that Mondoweiss hasn't covered. - Sean McBride
American -- I can't find anything to disagree with you about today :) -- sometimes you hit the nail hard on the head in a way that it needs to be hit -- with might and force. Running into too much bullshit tends to provoke that kind of expression. - Sean McBride
Well, thanks very much Sean and American (as well as a few others whom I'm sure I've left out, though not intentionally) -you've tried to expose truths on these issues for several years. - weareone
weareone -- you have also provided some valuable commentary and insights on these topics -- and you are definitely one of Mondoweiss's sharpest readers and observers. - Sean McBride
Thanks. :) - weareone
I agree with wearone here about the pointlessness of taking on Mondoweiss in an area they clearly are not willing to engage in. As I often noted, I believe it's not so much about the topic (cf. Zionism being inherent to Judaism, which is really a tautology). it's about non-Jewish people interjecting into the discussion. They simply can't allow that because of the paranoia in jewish... more... - Danaa
The reason this line of debate is pointless on MW is because the site is ultimately run to penetrate and influence Jewish people. Not so much the establishment but the ones thinking of peeling off it. Surely, no one needs to convince the palestinians of what's going on so they are in and welcome. neither are they (Palestinians) taken seriously as potential commentators on matters... more... - Danaa
Danaa, I appreciate your comment. One question--when American says that the rabbis argued for Jews to be a separate nation, I understand that may refer to many rabbis, but what about the rabbis of sects like Neturei Karta who have always said that Jews were forbidden from having a separate nation according to the Torah? Is that community very large? - weareone
weareone -- my impression (after studying the subject in some depth) is that the influence of the ultra-Orthodox anti-Zionist community in the larger mainstream Jewish community in the United States, Europe and Israel is so negligible as to be nonexistent. They have been effectively marginalized by the Jewish establishment -- they have no chance whatever of gaining political traction. - Sean McBride
Thanks Sean--I think it's interesting that even though they've been marginalized by the Jewish establishment and even if their numbers are small, they seem to be very well known and respected by anti-zionists internationally. Perhaps that recognition will begin to occur in the US, as well, as the numerous veils covering the truths of Zionism and the Jewish establishment's involvement in it are being removed. - weareone
A major problem the ultra-Orthodox are facing in promoting their views -- they are poorly integrated into the most influential institutions that dominate American and European elite and mass opinion -- they possess little political leverage. - Sean McBride
wearone, first, neturei karta is a tiny sect among the ultra-orthodox, though admittedly they get a lion share of public attention. They are and were not the only ultra-orthodox sect that were decidedly not ready for a zionist state, but the majority of the ultra's have long ago crossed the line to the Rubicon. - Danaa
Your other question - about the rabbis: yes, throughout the middle ages the teaching was that jews are a separate people (they did not use the word "nation" and certainly not in the sense it is used today in English). The admonition for Jews to stay "a people apart" was absolutely crucial to preventing assimilation. It should not come as a surprise that even post-enlightenement many... more... - Danaa
It may also interest you to know, wearone (and I did not study the issue in any depth. I just have first hand knowledge) that in israel itself, the neturei-karta sect are held in rather low esteem. They are considered as a kind of a joke - waiting for the messiah to show up on a white donkey and all. I think they became heroes to anti-zionists which kind of gave the movement new life.... more... - Danaa
"These remarks by Shabtai Shavit, a former head of Mossad, are typical" Nothing new about these remarks. It isn't religious Zionism, it is Zionism -- yes, the tribal culture development from a religion is to blame -- as a whole that calls for holy war. Zionist thinkers from the beginning have called for holy war even though they don't use the language like ISIS. They have been doing it... more... - peacefly
Judaism was the original religion. Zionism is the old religion founded on paranoia, tribe, and so accommodates atheists and believers alike. From Chomsky to Golstein. Now secularists like the former Mossad head are getting worried because the new wave of Zionism, which is getting overwhelming input from the religious whose religious upbringing has come in a Zionist bubble, is not... more... - peacefly
Thanks for the comments Danaa. As you mentioned, I'm aware that in Israel, anti-Zionist orthodox Jews are marginalized, even persecuted. - weareone
Sean McBride
Another comment to Mooser on Judaism and Zionism
BEGIN COMMENT - Sean McBride
You haven't managed to produce a single useful cite, fact or insight about the increasing entanglement of Judaism with Zionism in the official statements of the Jewish establishment or about the alarming rise of the power of religious Zionists in Israeli society and the Israeli government -- issues that are frankly discussed all the time in leading Jewish and Israeli media. No response... more... - Sean McBride
Perhaps you are worried that Judaism will be blamed by the world for the beliefs and policies of Zionism and the Israeli government -- actually, that would make sense -- you should be extremely worried. At this point, if Zionism goes down, it will take down Judaism with it. Mainstream establishment Judaism has gone all in on betting everything on Zionism -- it wasn't hijacked by Zionism... more... - Sean McBride
You can believe whatever you like about Judaism and Zionism -- your views are having not the slightest impact on the Israeli government, the Israel lobby, the Jewish establishment or the Christian Zionists who exert so much influence in the US Congress. - Sean McBride
By the way, I can recall a time when the Mondoweiss comments section was brimming over with knowledgeable posts that included a wealth of high-quality documentation, quotes and links -- reading the debates here was an education. What happened? Much of that valuable discussion stream seems to have evaporated. - Sean McBride
END COMMENT - Sean McBride
I think many former valuable commenters came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth the effort to make thoughtful and well-documented posts to Mondoweiss -- the culture there no longer encourages that activity. What is left is a Mooser culture -- emotional and ungrounded opinionating rules. The Mondoweiss golden age was nice while it lasted. But I still look forward to Phil Weiss's articles -- they are as solid as ever -- and always fact-based. - Sean McBride
Regarding Annie: an old school political leftie, more a gutsy political activist (I respect that) than a deep thinker, with little interest in or mastery of history, literature, scholarship or the social sciences. Her writing and thinking have grown increasingly sloppy, disorganized and emotional in recent years. It's impossible to pursue a logical discussion with her -- she's all over... more... - Sean McBride
Sean, whatever my opinions are I wish you didn't feel it necessary to stoop to criticize and condescend to people like Annie, or even Mooser. You may not like their take or disinterest in the topic you want to discuss but that's their prerogative. You keep scratching at a festering wound, but at MW they don't want a big brouhaha about judaism/zionism. It's their choice. I think you should accept that and move on. There's plenty of issues to take on and if they don't want that to be their issue, so be it. - Danaa
Basically, Sean, they don't want to engage with you on that topic. Not because the topic is boring or irrelevant but because they don't want to debate it with you. That's all. I can see it annoys you, but there are options. You can post topics like this here and see if you can get interested people to talk about it. Chances are not too many will come over because the interest may not be there, except among jews and a few others who are not. - Danaa
I disagree -- they have actively tried to censor that topic on Mondoweiss -- that is the clear overall pattern. They don't want *anyone* discussing the connections between Judaism and Zionism -- that is an ideological red line for them. I have interacted with both of them more than you have (including with Annie, behind the scenes, in email) -- believe me, I get where they are coming... more... - Sean McBride
Danaa -- this group exists in part to discuss some of the issues that Mondoweiss has tried to censor. Anything that goes on anywhere in the world regarding Mideast politics (including on Mondoweiss) is fair game here. If your posts won't clear on Mondoweiss, and you think they are important, post them here. - Sean McBride
I respect the privacy of others regarding email communications always -- those matters will remain private. - Sean McBride
Danaa -- another aspect of this controversy: I think Phil Weiss is in fact intensely interested in discussing the problematic relations between Judaism and Zionism -- otherwise he wouldn't have published numerous articles on the topic (think of Joel Kovel, for instance). I don't think Mooser and Annie Robbins come close to representing his views on the subject -- and it's his blog, not... more... - Sean McBride
How much interest has Mondoweiss shown in the relations between Judaism and Zionism? Check it out for yourself: [Google; site:mondoweiss.net judaism http://www.google.com/#q=site...] How much=a great deal. Perhaps you are correct, however: the prospect of non-Jews delving into these issues may make even Phil Weiss and Adam Horowitz nervous. But I doubt that they... more... - Sean McBride
Sean, you didn't get my point. I said it's you they didn't want to debate the topic with YOU. or American. Or anyone else they perceive as not Jewish. Not Mooser, not Annie and not Phil - none wanted to have this conversation because non-jews speak up on it, and that's where it ends. Annie is a gate-keeper in this regard, not being jewish herself. In her case, she simply has a... more... - Danaa
Danaa -- I got your point from the first time you made it and I understand what has been going on -- the social and cultural dynamics at work. I chose to press ahead with an objective in mind -- mission accomplished. Meta discussion about this situation in play. - Sean McBride
The "situation" -- the many incidents in which "anti-Zionists" have tried to exert authoritarian control and censorship over the critique of Zionism. It's an issue to focus on with force -- it's going to blow up - the sooner the better. - Sean McBride
I made a comment on one of your new discussions with Mooser and Annie, Sean. However, I am worried that I won't see replies to my comment come up in my profile, which i use to see if there are replies. With their new system, you cannot make replies to a message that is already pretty far down a discussion tree and can only reply to messages that are higher up the "trunk". So I had to... more... - WJones
WJones -- I will look for your post. The Mondoweiss comment system is now so messed up in so many ways that it is almost unusable -- very user-hostile. - Sean McBride
It hasn't been approved yet, but it's just one sentence asking Mooser what he meant about something he said to you. The problem is more of a general one that I want to know how people respond to me there, when their replies could not be put in a reply box under my own comments because of their "reply-tree" system. - WJones
Sean McBride
An interesting person -- someone to be understood. Figure out his social network and its place in the big scheme of things. - Sean McBride
Which politicians on the contemporary scene in the United States, Europe, Iran and the Arab world do you support? - Sean McBride
I am not defending or expressing support for Ashton Carter or Ram Ben Barak, by the way. But I would like to acquire some basic understanding about them -- starting with the most important facts about them. - Sean McBride
I didn't express support for Ashton Carter. I am curious to get a handle on his social and political network and career track record in order to be able to predict what policies he is likely to promote. A key question: is he likely to support the two-state solution in an aggressive way (like John Kerry and Barack Obama) or line up more with Likud Zionists and neoconservatives? Where does he stand on Iran? I don't know yet. I was inviting people here to help flesh out his bio and expand our knowledgebase. - Sean McBride
The "Two Minutes Hate" approach to politics: [Two Minutes Hate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...] "Two Minutes Hate, from George Orwell's novel Nineteen Eighty-Four, is a daily period in which Party members of the society of Oceania must watch a film depicting the Party's enemies (notably Emmanuel Goldstein and his followers) and express their hatred for them." I'm not into it. - Sean McBride
"Orwell did not invent the idea behind the term "two minutes hate"; it was already in use in the First World War. At that time, British writers satirised the German campaign of hatred against the English, and imagined a Prussian family sitting around the kitchen table having its "morning hate"." - Sean McBride
Another analogy: ritualistic collective spitting at Christians, women and other groups in Jerusalem. - Sean McBride
Human nature at its most debased. - Sean McBride
Ok -- this is disturbing: "Carter has been adamant in his insistence that the United States consider the use of force in its efforts to prevent the proliferation of programs that could provide the capability to produce nuclear weapons programs." - Sean McBride
But there is some complexity here: "The most significant action taken by the United States to counter WMD since September 11 has been the invasion of Iraq. Although at the time intelligence suggesting a recrudescence of Saddam Hussein's WMD programs appeared to justify the war, it now seems that the intelligence was incorrect. Meanwhile, North Korea has quadrupled its stock of... more... - Sean McBride
Carter's neocon connections: "In 2008, Carter was one of several future Obama appointees who served on a Michael Makovsky-ledteam that approved a controversial report on Iran published by the Bipartisan Policy Center (BPC). A lead drafter of the report—titled "Meeting the Challenge: U.S. Policy Toward Iranian Nuclear Development"—was American Enterprise Institute fellow Michael Rubin, an outspoken proponent of militarist U.S. policies in the Middle East." - Sean McBride
"Other participants included Henry Sokolski; WINEP scholar and Obama adviser Dennis Ross; Stephen Rademaker, the husband of AEI's Danielle Pletkawho worked under John Bolton in the State Department; and Kenneth Weinstein, CEO of the Hudson Institute." - Sean McBride
HOWEVER: "On the other hand, Carter has expressed skepticism about the value of a direct military strike, either by Israel or the United States, on Iran's nuclear installations. In his contribution to a 2009 Center for a New American Security report titled Iran: Assessing U.S. Strategic Options, Carter wrote that a direct U.S. attack on Iran's Natanz faculty would likely have little long-term impact on the country's alleged bomb program." - Sean McBride
HOWEVER: "With respect to an Israeli strike, he emphasized the negative impact such a strike would have on U.S. interests: "The benefit to Israel of such a strike—delaying Iran's acquisition of a bomb—could be estimated in much the same way as the benefit of a U.S. strike. The cost to Israel is harder to estimate. Unlike the United States, Israel is not involved in any multilateral... more... - Sean McBride
My take so far: Ashton Carter is a traditional American foreign policy realist who is playing head games with the neocons. I strongly doubt that he is a Zionist in any meaningful sense of the term. But I need to dig into this more. I agree with him that North Korean nuclear weapons represent a major threat to the United States -- I've been arguing that for a decade. - Sean McBride
Bottom line: Obama is counting on Ashton Carter to support current American policy with regard to Iran -- continue with negotiations, avoid war. - Sean McBride
Taxi -- again: which American, European, Iranian and Arab politicians do you support? Which of them are not "scumbags" and "snakes" in your opinion? - Sean McBride
Seems like a legimate question to me: what precisely is your political agenda? Which politicians and political parties do you support? I do recall you saying that you support Hezbollah and Hamas. Is that it? If you don't like this group, that fine -- move to another one or start your own. - Sean McBride
Taxi -- if you want to try to pursue a useful discussion about Ashton Carter, go ahead. - Sean McBride
Carter is not a realist. Carter is an 'hawk ideologue on nuclear weapons'. He advocates bombing Iran if Iran doesnt cave to US requirements. I don't believe you are understanding the little ditty your quoted from him on the difference between the Us and Israel bombing Iran---WHAT he is really saying is there little difference---that the US will be blamed anyway if Israel bombs... more... - American
American -- then you seem to be concluding that Barack Obama intends to go to war against Iran -- why else would he appoint Carter as SecDef if your interpretation is right? My gut instinct is that the Obama administration doesn't want to get involved in a shooting war with Iran. - Sean McBride
Obama has staked his political career and reputation on not getting sucked into another Iraq War -- or worse. Are you predicting that he will attack Iran during the last year or two of his presidency? - Sean McBride
Iranian PressTV, which is often prone to alarmism, so far seems calm regarding the likely appointment: [Obama will nominate Ashton Carter to lead Pentagon http://www.presstv.ir/detail...] - Sean McBride
The main issue: will Obama appoint Carter as part of a plan to go to war against Iran. I don't know yet. I doubt that's the plan, but who knows. We'll see soon enough. - Sean McBride
Obama imo is a incompetent leader. He takes stands and then lets himself be over ruled by his "advisors'----he is what he was--a 'community organizer,' listening to his community----and his community is his advisors---all of whom have agendas of either Isr-First or liberal wars intervention. He is man who has no confidence in his own judgement and in the judgements he does have any... more... - American
Obama withstood massive pressure to bomb Syria -- remember that critical weekend when he reversed course? That took some backbone. But the intensity of pressure coming from the Israel lobby to attack Iran may be impossible to oppose. So perhaps that is what a Carter appointment would be all about. Stay tuned for further developments. - Sean McBride
'' American -- then you seem to be concluding that Barack Obama intends to go to war against Iran -- why else would he appoint Carter as SecDef if your interpretation is right? ..Sean).....Wrong as usual. Where did I 'conclude' that Obama picked carter for war with Iran? I was pointing out what Carter was about---I made no conclusions about why Obama picked him. What I mainly conclude... more... - American
OK -- you are making sense. - Sean McBride
'' Obama withstood massive pressure to bomb Syria -- remember that critical weekend when he reversed course? .. - Sean McBride)...Something wrong with your brain or memory--Obama did not reverse course--the senate reversed course due to what they claimed was overwhelming public pressure coming down on them against bombing Syria by the public . Obama kept sending Kerry and sending Kerry... more... - American
There are many interpretations of that incident -- the reversal of the plan to bomb Syria: [Google; obama syria chemical weapons red line]. For instance; [How the Obama Administration Reversed Course on Syria Strikes http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...] - Sean McBride
I do conclude that booting Hagel without already having a guaranteed replacement is another example Obama being --led by the nose by Nuland and his advisors. ,,,,,,the removal of Hagel before there was a replacement is very very very strange. - American
I think there is much to Taxi's analysis. I do believe the Russians put their foot down on Syria, with those missile detections as a shot across the bow. I recall well how many ships Russian moved into the eastern meditarranean. Ithey were on complete parity with NATO vessels and the dangers for anyone who cared to look were clear - an escalation that will get out of hand. Fact is... more... - Danaa
But here comes the new gambit from the exasperated neocon corner that got Crimea taken away -from them right under their eyes - it's called ISIS I believe. Someone, with saudi and Tiurkish help had financed, armed and pointed them in the direction of Iraq. They absolutely did not come out of nowhere. Whether they are manageable, is another question. One doubts it, seeing their hodge... more... - Danaa
I too agree with Taxi that Russia had much to do with it. And i also agree something desperate is up with the oilies undercutting gas prices---I think that is aimed at Russia and therefore Iran. Open the gates and flood the market and no one will worry as much about war disruptions in the ME. The oily royal potentates seem to be pulling out all the stops in going for Sunni dominance.... more... - American
Sean McBride
JewishVoiceForPeace: Omar Barghouti, in @NYTimes, refutes paper's claim that Israel is a democracy http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014... http://ow.ly/i/7N9bz https://twitter.com/jvplive...
Good for Omar. - Danaa
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