for me it's easier. I like twitter more casue it's on twitter that I first experienced microblogging. You don't just have to "not suck" if you want me to move, you have to give me something totally different. Like.. Friendfeed? :) - Simone
I don't see that as trolling. Identi.ca was supposed to be "the competitor" for Twitter. The site itself is messy, subscriptions are weird, the tracking ability is lacking. I never cared for Pownce at all and Plurk looks like something a kid painted in kindergarten. - Candace Holly
I like it because you get the excitement of never knowing when it's gonna work - Blackopsmanners
i sorta agree, twitter usage seems to be resilient to fail-whale's mystic powers. loyal loyal base.. - Ruben Llibre
Twitter has the right user experience but the wrong internal architecture. The other sites don't even have the former and from what I've seen they don't have the latter either. Identi.ca seems to be amateur city as does Pownce. Plurk was too ugly to try out and no one I know uses Jaiku. - Dare Obasanjo
Jaiku is a pain to join, but the conversation features are nice. - Ontario Emperor via fftogo
Maybe it is just me, but I don't look at identi.ca to compete with Twitter. Rather it is more about what might be possible from an open source perspective when you're able to make multiple microblogging sites work together. I'm not looking for a "Twitter killer" from it, rather some real technology innovation for distributed microblogging. - David Recordon
plurk is only "ugly".. so why not use just the mobile version. - thecolor
I too enjoy the vertical layout over the horizontal, but prefer the threads in plurk and "stability" over twitters "just tweet". - thecolor
plurk is more of a game as well as a communicative social network. Twitter, feels more like a "statement made" only type of SN. - thecolor
@David Recordon +1. In fact, you truly are a visionary. +2. - Andy C
Isn't it also because FriendFeed lacks whatever it is that Twitter gets right? - blackmailismylife
I agree with David. I think its going to be more about supporting the people that are contributing to the development of a new way of doing Tweet like micro-blogging. - Chacha via twhirl
@blackmailismylife: FriendFeed isn't constrained to 140 chars. Twitter/Jaiku/Pownce/Identi.ca are. What some would see as a feature, others see as a restriction. Sometimes, you need to be constrained to 140 chars. Less is more. - Andy C
Much as I find Scoble the arse-hole of the A-Lister Blogger body, he has a point. Twitter is for all its flaws, the best out there. - Adam Wilcox
I think this is simply the SSL certificate data. - Claudio Cicali
Most SSL sites (such as Gmail) don't show this. This is the first I've seen it, in fact. What is it called and how much does it cost? - Paul Buchheit
You need to buy an Extended Validation SSL cert (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E...). Looks like VeriSign sells them for $1,500 per year and Thawte for $900. They aren't cheap. - David Recordon
btw Paul - while i've got you here & you're not flooded with comments...is there no way to link to a particular post here on ff? - Zee from WeDoCreative
that's not regular SSL that's SSL-EV ... SSL with Enchanced Validation ... it's more expensive then a single SSL cert .. read this link for more info http://is.gd/LIs - JohnBfromMemphis via twhirl
Zee, click on "More" then "Link to this entry" - Paul Buchheit
David - thanks for the info. I have always wondered about the green bar in FF3 but never bothered to find out if it was a different type of SSL certificate. - Atul Arora
Paul, thanks a million - and there was me thinking it something you overlooked... :) - Zee from WeDoCreative
@paul, you may read this http://tinyurl.com/4qttny first, to know what's the different between "green button" and "blue button" (green: paypal etc. blue: gmail etc). u definitly need to pay much for the "green button" - kukoo
@David @Paul sorry for the double post just saw the question and knew the answer .. should've scrolled around first ... sorry - JohnBfromMemphis via twhirl
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E.... EV certs are just another scam from VeriSign, as far as I can tell. They're sold as an anti-phishing tool, but mostly they seem like a non-solution driven mostly by the need for CAs to extract more revenue from large customers. - ⓞnor
No, EV certs are just another scam from VeriSign because their regular certs are useless for determining that somebody is who they say they are. In other words, you'll pay hundreds of dollars for a cert for friendfeed.com, but they're pretty likely to give somebody else a cert for fiendfeed.com. The only way to combat this is to pay for an EV cert because their regular verification is almost a no-op. - Gabe Schaffer
@nor - Interestingly Google/Amazon dont use EV in the couple of examples I tried but eBay/Paypal do. - Atul Arora
It appears that GoDaddy has them for $400/year if you buy a 2 year cert. - Paul Buchheit
Well, a regular cert more or less says you're talking to the DNS owners of the domain listed in your address bar. Which is a service that ought to be worth about 5 cents. This one says... that you're talking with the organization that is generally known by that name? What *does* stop me from getting a business license for Fiend Feed, Inc. and so on? At some level it seems to be chasing "authenticity" which really means "will pay a bunch of money and/or fill out a bunch of annoying paperwork". - ⓞnor
What I really want is "is widely and unambiguously recognized by the community as the entity associated with that name". Where "the community" is... some big trust network centered on you and people you know? - ⓞnor
this is still far from regular idi... I mean casual consumer :) they shall say how much you are INSURED on your login when you come to this site, and insurance expressed in money, with sum signed by issuer into server side SSL certificate - only then you know for how much you are protected :) names are like talk - cheap :) - silpol
I was in Mountain View today! Does it have to be tonight? Can you do next week? I will be back in town. - Daniel Brusilovsky
Damn, how about tomorrow? Want to come over for a Half Moon Bay BBQ? :-) - Robert Scoble
ooh, ooh, pick me! pick me! .... wait.... that'd be a long walk. nm :) - Chris Abbey
Do we get to keep the hardware device? :P - David Recordon
@Robert Scoble: We're thinking about heading your way tomorrow, actually. Our 4th of July plans are up the air, but it's a possibility. You have a BBQ planned? What time? - Don MacAskill
Don: call me when you're coming over tomorrow. The BBQ is gonna be going in the evening. +1-425-205-1921 - Robert Scoble
I'll see if we can make it. If we can't this weekend, we should do it again sometime soon. :) - Don MacAskill
Why is it I feel like I miss out on stuff when I live up here in S. MN? - Mike Wills
@Mike Wills - or Jacksonville, Florida... - JA Castillo
It isn't so much that I think that the FriendFeed plugin is like TrackBack from a technical perspective, but rather that the idea of bridging conversations around the web is very similar. This glimpse of FriendFeed integration might also show what a future version of TrackBack could look like. Either way, it really is about how we can all use rich APIs to bridge content, identity, and other aspects of the social web as we move from site to site. - David Recordon via FriendFeed MT Plugin
Huh? We've been making a very conscious cross-company effort *avoid* unilaterally proposing standards for the past few years. See our approach to HTML5, to OpenSocial, to Gears, to Atom Pub, Sitemaps, OAuth, OpenID, etc., where we're either taking our proposals to public forums, industry foundations, or formal standards bodies. In fact, we work with closely with Microsoft on a number of these initiatives. Are there some specific examples you can cite? I consider a big part of what I get paid to do to look into places we could do better at this, so I'm keen to hear more about your concerns. - DeWitt Clinton
@Dewitt: Don't forget KML in your list, now OGC Standard. - nadim
Google has been pulling unilateral moves with far reaching impact for years from rel=nofollow to OpenSocial. What Google has become savvy at is finding some partners/stooges to stand behind them shortly after their unilateral announcements and call it a "standard". I'm still waiting for the details on which standards body ratified OAuth and OpenSocial. - Dare Obasanjo
@Dare OAuth was actually first started by a group of individuals from Twitter and Magnolia and then Chris Messina and myself (I was at VeriSign at that point but then moved to Six Apart) got involved. From there it grew certainly with the support of Google, but not the other way around. - David Recordon
Exactly what David said re: OAuth -- OAuth is 100% a community-run initiative that we're rapidly transitioning to use over our own legacy proprietary auth formats. And OpenSocial is run entirely in the open by a very wide-ranging group of companies (Yahoo, MySpace, Hi5, Ning, Plaxo, LinkedIn, etc., etc), and the intellectual property has been entirely transfered to the OpenSocial Foundation, out of Google's control. - DeWitt Clinton
I'm not saying Google doesn't have more work to do. Of course it does, but please, let's be accurate. I'd like to hear examples of places I can focus my attention. - DeWitt Clinton
And not cool calling those companies "stooges", Dare. - DeWitt Clinton
Though for the record, I actively push back, even internally, against calling anything a "standard" until it has gone through a formal standards body, such as IETF, OASIS, ISO, etc. "De facto standard" is okay, but I prefer the term "specification" for things that haven't been formally ratified. - DeWitt Clinton
Competition is always good. However, I don't think we should be comparing identi.ca to wordpress just yet. - Mack D. Male
Wither its Open source or propetry, both business strategies need to have a Revenue strategy to be sucessefull.. You get pinched for either the s./w cost or the support charges.. same difference ! - Peter Dawson
hmmm but I'm not paying for Twitter (and I never would). Although I did pay for Typepad (it was a proven commodity, it was reliable and it had features I needed but couldn't configure on my own). I'm with Mack. - melmcbride
@Shane Six Apart is certainly still around and continuing to give great tools to bloggers every day. - David Recordon
@Shane I have been the head of Six Apart Europe and still a shareholder so I am conflicted but yes, Six Apart is thriving and growing very nicely, there is room for both on the market. - Loic Le Meur
It certainly would be an interesting development if a strong open source competitor/alternative emerged in the space. - Doug
SixApart left the self-hosted space long time ago, they are after the people that want to blog without a fuss, mainstream people. Wordpress is for folks who care about the tool they use. I used MT and Typepad, been using Wordpress for some years now, and it was the best move i made. - Mário Pires
I wasn't invited to foo this year but towel+Werewolf, and plan ahead what sessions you want to lead/contribute to. Share stuff. - Don MacAskill
Allen, it's a super-l33t invite-only geek fest. Sort of like BarCamp. Only not as open. - Cyndy
well thats a pile of crap - im totally full of foo! - Allen Stern
I had to Google that to make sure it didn't have anything to do with the Foo Fighters... unless they're hackers too. - Larry Kless via twhirl
you might put some thought into a session or ignite talk that you want to share. and maybe a tasty alcoholic beverage for late night sipping. - mike harrington via twhirl
I think Robert achieved his goal though, to generate a lot of buzz on a certain topic by posting a ridiculous article title. It's almost trolling at a higher level, getting blog authors hot and bothered instead of the peanut gallery. - J. Phil
I think Scoble may be attempting to will his thoughts to be true because it suits him. :) - Jim Kukral via twhirl
I think Scoble has a point though in terms of looking at very early data around how conversations are evolving. Certainly not mainstream but Facebook too is seeing the value in allowing conversations that might have previously occurred elsewhere. - David Recordon
I said it elsewhere, Robert's point is arguing quantity over quality - Julian Baldwin
Cyndy - excellent lol. Julian - Why did the phrase "Social Media Wal-Mart" just pop into my head? - J. Phil
Nice post Duncan, I also agree that conversation is evolving. People are gravitating more to FriendFeed and other services rather than just commenting on blogs. It's so much easier here in FF to join a discussion and track the progress. With the ability to link it back to your blog helps connect the conversations. I think Scoble is a little premature in putting a fork in this one. - Larry Kless
@j. phil there's an excellent post topic for you.."Are you social media's wal-mart?" - Julian Baldwin
I'm waiting for it to support Jabber before I'll start to use it. I don't need yet another walled off chat network especially since not enough of my friends use it to make it worthwhile. - David Recordon
I havent but my non tech friends are all using it - to the detriment of IM clients - riaz
Like others have said, once there's (non-beta) support for it in Adium, XMPP, or whatever that means I can use it in my normal IM, I'm all for it. - Cote'
what isn’t to like? I get the feeling you don’t want communication… if so… go watch television. - Noah David Simon
Noah David Simon, I don't know what you mean. I haven't owned a television in 10+ years, but I hear that many people IM while they watch TV! - Marshall Kirkpatrick
I used FB chat to talk to people I hadn't talked to in years. Then I stopped when it occurred to me that I didn't really care. - Dan Kaplan
where you just watching TV now Marshall, because I think I was pretty clear. I'm on facebook and friendfeed to communicate... not a vanity feed - Noah David Simon
I rarely use the chat, I use the chat popup just to see who is online! - Joe Dawson
I've never used it. Don't even know how to find it. - David Parmet via twhirl
I normally agree with you but this time I'm lost. FriendFeed could build Beacon like functionality but so could many others just as well. - David Recordon
David, yes, like 6A, and other life stream aggregators. It's quite simple, a news feed with hooks to third party commerce. The key here will be opt-in. Back to you, your thoughts? - Jeremiah Owyang
With Amazon activity showing up if you choose to add it, there's an element of that in FriendFeed. Opt in is pretty important, as you said. Doesn't seem too far to travel to get there, mostly just adding more services? - Todd McKinney
Agreed, opt-in is the big piece that will make something like Beacon work. Hard part is it feels like a land grab style scenario much like all of the "share this" buttons you see under blog posts, news articles, videos, etc. This is where I think Facebook was in a very strong position when they tried to launch Beacon though now it would be harder for someone else to do that same sort of thing especially if they don't have a ton of users since brands will be afraid of another fallout. - David Recordon
I'm thinking more and more about what the future of email might look like. Maybe this is where Beacon like sharing would happen. Amazon sends you your order confirmation email and your email software asks if you want to share some aspect of it. - David Recordon
Todd, this is where I think opt-in is still missing a bit. You don't want to automatically share everything you purchase from Amazon, but at least get the chance to choose not to share something before it gets blasted out to your friends. - David Recordon
I just bought a Braun Oral B Toothbrush? - Andrew Smith
i'm still not understanding why friendfeed is in this position, particularly given hide/block and not being inherently mobile. friendfeed seems much more of a river with many-to-many relationships. i think the opportunity for monetization comes from the one-on-one relationships that twitter/brightkite provide. opt-in relationships on geo-aware services are the big opportunity for beacon type recommendation services - rob zand
Give Beacon a rest... or is that bait for new blog post? - Mark Forman
Beacon was supposed to deliver ad revenues to FB. I think FF is different. - shelisrael1
Shel, both FF, FB and Six Apart's activity streams are all : streams of activity + soical graphs. They are similar. Also, once we look past the coolness of this new service, we need to remember that FF is going to need to monetize, as every site does. - Jeremiah Owyang
David R. Yes, Opt in (for personal and purchasing behavior) must have an opt in.For example, a friend of mine sometimes buys personal products (hair care) from amazon that we may not want shared with Friendfeed. Whether it's email or an opt-in immediately after purchase it matters not. Come back, whats your next thought? - Jeremiah Owyang
David has a good point about granularity of sharing. The email client sharing option is an interesting idea as well. I kind of like the way del.icio.us does it with the "do not share" check box when bookmarking something. There are still shortcomings since it's just a yes or no question, but it probably makes sense to put the publishing visibility on the source feed. - Todd McKinney
Trying to keep up with you on FriendFeed as well. What is "Beacon"? - Brian Hansen
I first read bacon and thought it was a brilliant joke. ah well - marcel weiss
Even with opt in and permission granularity getting users on board with a Beacon like feature is a though sell. Adding some kind of revenue share between FF and the user when there is an transaction at a third party made based on the users recommendation/action would definitely accelerate adoption of such feature, pretty much like "a reefer a friend" in most affiliate systems. - tekspectator
I msread this as "FriendFeed could be what bacon was supposed to deliver" and I thought "No, that praise is frankly too high." - Kevin Fox
but how would you know which reply is to which original tweet? I often reply to tweets that aren't the latest ones. - possible248
I'm guessing that you can get a lot of it right based off of the timing. Then maybe do what Quotably does where you can say "that's wrong" and fix the threading. - David Recordon
Hmm, I noticed the tab wasn't available to click as well; but, are you saying that you can no longer @ someone? - Do You KNOW Clarence?
i'm saying what's the point of @ing someone if they can't see it? now we're gettig philosphical. if a twitterer ats a user but the reply screen is broken, did the @ atcually happen? - Baratunde Thurston via twhirl
when they came for the "with friends" tab and API access, I didn't say anything...because I wasn't a user of the with friends API....when they throtled the API ping limit, I didn't say anything because I wasn't a developer...but when they came for the replies tag I called out --- but no one in particular could hear me call to them! [way tasteless joke there, sorry] - Marshall Kirkpatrick
the replies api call still works so desktop clients should be able to view them, however it counts against the already reduced api rate limit. - Alan Le
It's not on the same page as twitter, but if you set up a Summize RSS Feed or just do a regular search there (leave a tab open, it updates), you'll get your @replies. - John Frost
Great episode. Any chance of an audio podcast version? I tend to have time to listen to TWIT, Net@Nite and the rest in the car, less so when I'm near my computer. - David Sim
I was thinking about you when I saw that Hillary Clinton was delivering a keynote at a high school graduation in the Bronx and wondered if it was at DeWitt Clinton High School (which was behind Bronx Science, where I went to HS). I thought it would be interesting cause her last name, like yours is Clinton, and so is the high schools. Alas it wasn't at DeWitt Clinton, it was at Pelham Academy which I had never heard of. So if your ears were burning, this is why. :-) - Dave Winer
Ha! No relation though, obviously. Hillary married into the name via Bill, and Bill himself got the name from his step-father (Bill was née William Jefferson Blythe). Either way, I'm changing my name to DeWitt Obama this time around. Someday they'll be naming schools Obama High. - DeWitt Clinton
Nice. DeWitt Obama. I'm going to change my name to Dave Obama. - Dave Winer
One million Obamas strong for Barak Obama. Like the Ramones. - DeWitt Clinton
@DeWitt: I've got one at work and it's pretty good. Best part is the adjustable seat pan—great for long-legged folks and something that you don't get with a Aeron. Articulated joints in the armrests are nice too. The only downside is that I notice heat accumulation when sitting in the Leap compared to the circulation-friendly Aeron. FWIW, I'm thinking of getting a Freedom Task chair (http://is.gd/DE8) when my Aeron of similar vintage craps out. - Jason Chen
after sitting on a Leap for about a month or two, I'd have to say it's not worth it if you're buying your own. Not nearly as comfortably adjustable as some ugly black ergo chairs we had at yahoo, and not as pretty as an aeron to excuse the cost. - l.m.orchard via twhirl
totally agree w/Scoble following a convo is much easier on FF...signed waiting for FF check just in case they feel so inclined - Ruth Ferguson
I like seeing FF being used for conversations since it is easier to follow conversations you want to and ignore the others. Then my Recently Updated page on Twitter becomes useful again. - David Recordon
Nice first show guys. Definitely covering topics that benefit from a video roundtable discussion. I look forward to future episodes. Btw...where's this room you talk about at the end of the video? - Mark Krynsky
The room is linked from the bottom of the site! - David Recordon
