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Dave Morin › Comments
Re: Test - http://davidrobynreiss.blogspot.com/2009...
"sweet!"
- Dave Morin
Glacier Park's ice fields may be gone by next decade - http://www.matr.net/article...
This is so tragic.
- Dave Morin
Thoughts on Tumblarity. - http://davemorin.tumblr.com/post...
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I think that's officially the longest FriendFeed post I've seen to date ;-)
- Jesse Stay
Odd that they're importing the entire thing...
- Dave Morin
whoa
- Josh Haley
wall of text crits you for 1236 damage!
- Tad
Fixed. This is a Tumblr problem with how they've popularized "reblogging" and new formats for sharing. In this case, this was a photo share, where the text body was included as a comment rather than the body, with a traditional title. An interesting problem for how FriendFeed (or anyone else) should parse those types of posts.
- Dave Morin
I'm pretty sure the Canon 50D is right for me, but I'm willing to be convinced to spring for the 5D Mark II... anyone have an opinion?
Roberto Bonini, Alex Scoble, Andy Szybalski and 2 other people liked this
I have the 50D and I love it. I have a ton left to learn about photography, and I think the 50D is fine for me for another 2-3 years. Then I'll be able to buy something like the 5D MkII for way less.
- Braden Kowitz
cool... if a designer could be happy with the 50D, then I'm sure it will be fine for me. Thanks!
- Mike Sego
For reference: I had the Rebel XTi previously. The 50D is a HUGE step up from that body. My favorite lenses: 50mm f1.4 and 17-40mm f4L.
- Braden Kowitz
can the 50d do HD video?
- Kevin Systrom
Low light/indoor no-flash shots on the 5D2 is FAR BETTER. ISO 3200 is mostly noiseless on the 5D2.
- Peng-Toh
The biggest difference is the 50D's 1.6x crop factor and higher frame rate. If you like to shoot sports, the 50D is the way to go. The 50D also has a handy pop-up flash that's great for fill in a pinch. If you like the idea of shooting video, the 5D is the best bet.
- Gabe
I have the 40D and absolutely love it. The real key is in collecting as many L series lenses as possible :)
- Dave Morin
Dave has a good point: Buy the cheaper camera and spend the extra money on better glass!
- Gabe
Nikon.
- Elias Torres
from Nambu
500D or 5D Mark II, because you want the 1080P video option. If you like shooting landscape, you should consider investing some extra dough into a fullframe camera. :)
- Terje Sorgjerd
Body depreciates much faster than glass. But you only need a few really good glass. What are you shooting? That's more important.
- Peng-Toh
OH: "I would never hire a UI person who walked into my office and sat down with a PC..." #macbigot
Antonio Altamirano and Dave Morin liked this
Agreed.
- Dave Morin
If he makes UIs for Windows you must understand...
- Sebastian Wain
@Sebastian Wain: he should run WinXP as a virtual machine :-)
- gib
Checking out a new web-based email client a friend is working on which I am not allowed to talk about yet. But, I am mad impressed.
Tanath, Jérôme Flipo, Junal Rahman and 11 other people liked this
I am playing with some secret stuff too and I hate not being able to talk about it.
- Robert Scoble
That's part of the fun of it! :)
- Dave Morin
More importantly, I'm glad SOMEONE is going after email again. Gmail was an improvement (Thanks Paul!) but is no where near where things should be. It still baffles me as to why someone hasn't added simple little things yet, like parsing for notification emails and adding favicons, or adding photos to the inbox view, or showing me live data from the web about a person alongside any email. Xoopit is doing some interesting stuff here, but it is barely the tip of the iceberg.
- Dave Morin
I'm may be out on a limb here, but based on modern social capabilities I think permission based email (are you a friend based on any number of social networks) and filtering is way overdue. Remember challenge (mailblocks - I think AOL acquired) response to prevent spam? How about a challenge system that says, "I can't delivery your email to Dave because you're not on his approved...
more...
- Dave
A number of startups tried this (including my own circa 1999/2000) but the senders get highly annoyed by challenges.
- Ray Cromwell
Yeah, not clear that challenges are the right way to do it. But, it seems like creating a better filter using the social graph as a corpus is a rock solid idea. I've talked about this a few times before with some folks, but never seen it done that well. GMail's user reported spam implementation is what makes it so great...
- Dave Morin
So is Facebook going to buy this and use it for messaging? ;-)
- Jesse Stay
Nope! Just a great developer doing interesting things.
- Dave Morin
Like we need another challenge-based social-network inside mailboxes. I long for elm-like simplicity AND ability to tag, and unobtrusively suppress display of all but [selected gist] of a message. Plus stats/ trend functions like being able to click on a respondent's name and seeing a browsable history of past exchanges; mutual most frequently used keywords (auto-extracted tags);...
more...
- ianf ⌘
Wyclef Jean Rocks the SF Barrel House - http://bub.blicio.us/wyclef-...
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Tanner Powell, simonpure, MG Siegler and 5 other people liked this
"Surely someone of Wyclef’s status could have simply played a few songs and then scurried off into a limo to enjoy the remainder of the night with his entourage - it was certainly hot enough in the venue to motivate him to keep it short. Instead, he invested his time, passion, and energy into creating a memorable experience for everyone by playing almost every song he’s ever written, moving the dancefloor as DJ, and finally mingling with guests after the show. If you didn’t know any better, you would swear this was his most important and personal show ever." (Stoked to see @wyclef on the Twitters! And, yes, his show was outrageous)
- Christopher Sacca
from Bookmarklet
Agreed with Sacca here. I've never seen such time, passion and energy from an artist dedicated to his music and his fans. What an incredible show.
- Dave Morin
Re: Brittany Bohnet - http://www.brittanybohnet.com/post...
"He wins on Facebook Lexicon too: http://bit.ly/TPmTg"
- Dave Morin
Tweetie for Mac is absolutely incredible. http://www.atebits.com/tweetie...
<<futuRINÔ>> liked this
discussion about whether it could be a ff killer here https://friendfeed.com/e...
- Christian Anderson
why would it be a friendfeed killer? it is a perfect compliment.
- Dave Morin
thats the gist of the string
- Christian Anderson
Re: Brittany Bohnet - http://www.brittanybohnet.com/post...
"Yum."
- Dave Morin
I just came up with an idea that could be interesting to Twitter, friendfeed, and Facebook: invisible comments. Wonder if anyone else is thinking along these lines? http://scobleizer.com/2009...
Mike Elliott, Susan Beebe, RicardoSilva and 35 other people liked this
This is at the bottom of a post about the newspaper industry and how they keep giving the geeks all their meals for free.
- Robert Scoble
Robert - Let's do it!
- Jim Connolly
Radar.net has this.
- Dave Morin
Dave: really? I gotta look again.
- Robert Scoble
Dave: do they use it as a command line interface to talk to the search engine?
- Robert Scoble
"invisible comments" without reading the post: Isn't that the most pointless feature ever? :D
- Meryn Stol
Jim: I'm thinking of doing my own social network with a few other geeks. I have a feeling that's the only way to get what I really want.
- Robert Scoble
Count me in.
- drew olanoff
Meryn: actually it would be very powerful. You should read the post, or at least the part where I talk about invisible comments (toward the bottom).
- Robert Scoble
Robert - If you do, I will happily contribute and cover in the tech news blog!!
- Jim Connolly
Yes, Robert, just wanted to point out the strangeness of the term. :) You're talking about reader-contributed metadata. Delicious is doing that. Every link towards a page also is metadata. Yes, in general this is a VERY good thing. There could be far more support for this kind of thing in both browsers and blogging platforms like Wordpress (or plugins).
- Meryn Stol
So linking advertising to user generated tags, outside the normal commenting system
- Johnny Worthington
Meryn: the invisible comments could also be machine generated, just like EXIF data on photographs are (my camera makes those and Flickr displays that data).
- Robert Scoble
I mentioned this a bit awhile back when I was saying hashtags were a hack and unnecessary. I agree with you - each of these networks really needs an accompanying meta layer of some sort to categorize data.
- Jesse Stay
CURIOUS: Could the use of invisible data be REALLY easy for spammers to manipulate?
- Jim Connolly
Robert, are you familiar with Microformats?
- Meryn Stol
Can we set physical comments to "inaudible?"
- Craig Brownell
Regarding the free lunch being given to Craigslist, we had many meetings about this at Media General while I was there about this (I was in charge of moving their print classifieds to online formats). The Newspapers still have a in on this that even Craigslist can't attack - they have strong relationships with local stores, auto dealers, and more that they can tie to classifieds listings. It was my job there to find ways to work with this data. IMO they still haven't done enough.
- Jesse Stay
Forgot the link to my meta article: http://staynalive.com/article...
- Jesse Stay
Ahhhh... So if you made a post about, say, wanting a new bike, the comments that would come back with user reviews would prompt a script to locate a price and location for purchasing each one of those reviewed bikes. That way you can pick the best one, purchase it instantly and the 'machine' can take a cut as a revenue source?
- Johnny Worthington
For a site like FriendFeed, it would be better to just add support for tagging by readers. Adding support for RDF triplets would be a next step, but simple alphanumeric tags (like Delicious) already would go very far.
- Meryn Stol
Would posters have the option to create their own metatags of any kind, or are these a preset bunch in your idea Robert?
- Colin
On the other hand, putting everything inside plain-text fields (which the comment field could be used for) allows for any kind of metadata to be embedded. One could even add a JSON or XML string.
- Meryn Stol
Search can be made far more powerful if you know the kind of metadata stored though.
- Meryn Stol
i do like the idea of putting meta-comments that are machine readable, not for humans - although i would not put it as comments, more have a "tag" option perhaps, that people can collaboratively dump info in
- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
Colin: posters could do their own, but really that would be pretty geeky to do. I imagine developers would give us UIs to do invisible ones. Things like "set location of this tweet." Imagine if we had the ability to do that! Then I could search for "show all tweets about New York plane crash, but only show me tweets done from New York."
- Robert Scoble
Joelle: invisible comments wouldn't be displayed as comments. It's more like a command line interface to the object you are typing into.
- Robert Scoble
FWIW about a year ago Alex inferred they were talking about this at Twitter on the API team. Of course, not much has changed in a year so I don't expect to see it.
- Jesse Stay
I've been pushing this for awhile now - maybe it is time we just do it ourselves.
- Jesse Stay
I think that there are quite a few people thinking along these lines. The key is to make it interoperable across the various microblogging platforms. If it was done in a way to be compatible with all of those, and implemented in a client, it could be added to other data sources (like blogs) and be pushed out to aggregators (like FriendFeed) which could be read by the same clients. The clients would need an access/authentication protocol to allow the entry of metadata.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Honestly, we should really get Evan Prodromou in on this discussion. He has funding, and the vision to lead something like this using his already existing framework. Although he is at the super secret #swfoo so he's inaccessible ATM
- Jesse Stay
Designing the protocol for this is probably the easier part. The more difficult part is getting buy-in to a standard from the client software developers. I'm in though. I still maintain this is better developed as a client protocol rather than trying to get the microblogging platforms to support it via API. The less it depends on the platform the more widely used a single protocol could be -it could be used for all kinds of different data types from tweets to blogs and more.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob, the advantage to using Laconi.ca as a base and extending it is they already have client developers working on software.
- Jesse Stay
Jesse: cool as long as we do it here. We need the improved comment area and live chat ability that friendfeed affords.
- Robert Scoble
If you use laconica it still has the problem of being developed in a platform dependant way (the same as waiting for twitter to put it in)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Dave Winer deserves credit for pushing me to this realization, by the way, and he will be involved in anything I do.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, I'm just saying we already have a base we can build upon that's Open Source and based on open standards. We can either fork it or extend it if Evan P. supports the idea. It's a start at least. The other option is to build on top of either Buddy Press as a base, or SixApart's new software, or JaikuEngine. They're all good starts at least.
- Jesse Stay
I agree Dave should be involved - FTR I pushed it before he did though ;-)
- Jesse Stay
Jesse: agreed, definitely will go with an open source choice.
- Robert Scoble
@Robert Couldn't the %%0 invisible="" be abused for search gaming?
- Neal Jansons
Neal, I think some sort of trust ranking would be useful to get around that - users could be rated by their peers and those with higher peer rankings would appear higher in the search. I think that would get around that, and still accomplish what Robert's trying to do - feature the people that use the service above others.
- Jesse Stay
So I guess we're stealing from Plurk in that manner ;-)
- Jesse Stay
Neal: yes, but why couldn't the owner of the node (in this case, me) see all invisible comments and delete those that aren't good?
- Robert Scoble
@Robert: Not a scalable solution.
- Neal Jansons
Robert, true, but you'd soon need an Akismet-like engine then.
- Meryn Stol
Neal: wrong. That is EXACTLY the system that exists here for visible comments. Meryn: wrong.
- Robert Scoble
Taking the reputation of the "commenter" into account is better I think... A kind of pagerank-like solution. Comments by people with low rank wouldn't count for much, might even be ignored by default.
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: you don't need to do anything more than what friendfeed has already done. I should do a blog post on why.
- Robert Scoble
Why not explain it here first, then I can should at it. :)
- Meryn Stol
Meh, I don't like being blinded by PR's success as a model. I think there are inherent problems to self-reinforcing ranking models.
- Neal Jansons
I need more than 288 characters to explain why decentralized moderation is the most brilliant thing friendfeed has done to date.
- Robert Scoble
Neal, you know anything better then?
- Meryn Stol
decentralized moderation is the same as with blogs... And wordpress doesn't have Akismet for nothing.
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: blogs and Akismet are not decentralized moderation and participation on blogs doesn't have a built in reputation system as they do here.
- Robert Scoble
Blogs ARE decentralized moderation. Every blog owner moderates his own blog's comments.
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: not nearly as decentralized as here.
- Robert Scoble
No, honestly, I have been thinking about the problem since it came up in conversation with @technosailor at wordcamp last year. It's a logical problem, not a code problem.
- Neal Jansons
Robert, what's the difference then?
- Meryn Stol
Neal: I'm writing a blog about why it's different. Meryn, be back in 15 minutes. GIve me a chance to explain why friendfeed is FAR different than blog moderation.
- Robert Scoble
ok :)
- Meryn Stol
how do you know they are not already being used??
- Max Rosenthal
Robert: I think I get what you are saying. The invisible tags would be caught and moderated similar to any other commenting, but should be machine-read for other purposes.
- Neal Jansons
Neal: right.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, you left me hanging on something you brought up. “Now, why does the New York Times make it easier to find the front page of the paper the day they reported the Titanic sank? Hint: they have this figured out in a way that Twitter and others just don’t.” How do they do it? What’s up with SkyGrid? You left that one hanging, too.
- Michael Fidler
Michael: well, the New York Times cares about archives, for one, and adds metadata to everything so that important stuff can be found again when someone needs to find it. As for SkyGrid, see ya at 4 p.m. Pacific Time today for a live press conference about it.
- Robert Scoble
Max: I'm sure there are a few invisible things that we don't know about. I just want a public API put on them! :-)
- Robert Scoble
@Robert I don't think an API would be that hard to do, it's really just meta-tagging+microformats with a tag-like front end, or am I completely misunderstanding you?
- Neal Jansons
Robert, seen this recent piece on RWW? http://www.readwriteweb.com/archive...
- Meryn Stol
Neal: you are putting engineering talk on it, but I think that's pretty close. I tend to not like the engineering talk nor do I like structured data that much. I like commenting. And invisible comments with a somewhat structured API would be very cool.
- Robert Scoble
Meryn: that post on RWW is very close to what I'm talking about here. Those guys are so smart.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, what's your gripe with "structured data"? Saying (for example) "price=1000USD" in a comment is structured data as well, just expressed in plain text. Maybe your gripe is with the clumsy interfaces? All kinds of dropdown boxes and multiple text fields can indeed be a pain.
- Meryn Stol
Robert: So what would you like it to be implemented as? A plugin for a blog? It seems like what would end up happening is that the invisible comments would end up injected from the front end into the page when the page next rendered, basically like commenting on comments.
- Neal Jansons
Meryn: some things, yes, need to be structured, like that. I was thinking more of metatags. I think they are massively stupid in such a world. Here's a metatag: foobar. Now I can search for this item just by using "foobar" in the search here. But there are some places where more structured stuff is better. I just try to resist structure as much as possible because it tends to make things harder to use and less flexible.
- Robert Scoble
%%0 comment="this would be an invisible comment if my system were implemented"
- Robert Scoble
Neal: the moment I hit post on that it would turn a different color and whatever API was there would be enacted.
- Robert Scoble
Neal: this would be implemented by friendfeed (or my own social network) itself. So the comment box would become a little code run window, too.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, yes, too much structure hurts usability, and often doesn't add much value. The idea of less structure was also the basis for tags on Delicious. Plain alphanumeric tags have proved to be extremely powerful. Hierarchies or controlled vocabularies seem unnecessary.
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: exactly.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, how about an additional input box for those "invisible comments"? Saves you typing the "%%0 comment=".,, Or a checkbox to make a comment invisible.
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: again, that would be the UI developer's job to decide. Here on friendfeed? No, not appropriate. Too complex. On TweetDeck or Twhirl? Maybe.
- Robert Scoble
I like one box that does lots of things. Like Google Chrome.
- Robert Scoble
@Robert Hmm...I see what you are saying. And then a search engine could pull using the tag variations. The search side would be a lot like Backtype.
- Neal Jansons
Open up Google Chrome. Type: 2+2= and hit return.
- Robert Scoble
Google Chrome is what I call "a magic box." The comment box here could be "a magic box" too.
- Robert Scoble
Robert. Yes i see your point. I too like as much as intelligence as possible.
- Meryn Stol
Neal: something like that. We will soon have real time search. We need to be able to talk to the search engine in real time too.
- Robert Scoble
Well what about natural language parsing then? For simple sentences, that's quite possible nowadays.
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: yeah. Have you seen Google Calendar? Add a new item there sometime. You just type something like "appointment with dad on december 25, 2009 10 am to noon." It figures it out. It's magic.
- Robert Scoble
I love magic.
- Robert Scoble
It takes a lot of engineering-talk to make all that magic happen :p So you want them to be completely free-form? That wasn't how it seemed in your post, and cutting out the data into an ontology specific for each site would be useful.
- Neal Jansons
Robert, yes, I think we're on the same page now. :) There's still a problem with actually hiding something though... You really need special syntax for that. But then I think I'd choose for - say - a back-tic "`" (or two) in front of a comment. But being able to do it through keyboard only is indeed nice. You could also say that "ctrl-enter" posts something as hidden, while "enter" makes a regular post.
- Meryn Stol
Neal: no, not completely free form. Some things need to be structured, other things need to be magic. :-)
- Robert Scoble
Meryn is right, it needs some sort of syntactic or executable switch that injects the text to the API, something similar to how http://socialmedian.com uses @ mentions in their comments.
- Neal Jansons
I posted on your blog but it seems like the discussion is really happening here... what you describe is basically implemented in flickr's machine tags: http://www.flickr.com/groups...
- Janek Mann
Janek: yeah, I saw that on the blog too, thanks! Very very similar, yes.
- Robert Scoble
So basically, flickr stole this lunch from the newspapers also. ;)
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: yeah, but Flickr hasn't implemented it in a way that makes discussing movies, restaurants, items, etc possible to monetize.
- Robert Scoble
Here's my post about decentralized comments: http://scobleizer.com/2009...
- Robert Scoble
Neal had posted a comment regarding how to implement this - "as a plugin for a blog?" -This is exactly what I'm driving at -The primary portion of the data would be implemented client side, and transported via any popular social networking platform, including via blog plugin. For ease of use a service would act as the search clearinghouse for the invisible data - this service (or services) would be easily monetized by having "the valuable" data. But the clients need not depend on the clearinghouse service
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
They could access the data directly as it was stored in its "natural" 140character state, and access it via the normal search routines for the originating platform (twitter, identi.ca, FF, FB etc) The clearinghouses would become viable businesses, by providing authentication for makers of invisible comments, and/or sleuthing out the valuable comments via search.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
No, the Internet should be public and accountable and not littered with invisible metatags that others can manipulate.
- Prokofy Neva
Re: Data Visualization is the next frontier in online awesomeness - http://blog.hellohenrik.com/...
Amund Tveit, TedBailey and Sarah Perez liked this
"Agreed man!"
- Dave Morin
Re: New Ways to Connect, Share and Be Open with Facebook - http://davemorin.com/blog...
Thomas Power liked this
"No, this is great feedback! Thank you!"
- Dave Morin
Generation Open - http://factoryjoe.com/blog...
Nicholas James, M. Serdar Kuzuloglu, Ricardo Vidal and 62 other people liked this
Everything I'm going to do from now on in life is to push generation open further.
- Robert Scoble
That has been my goal since entering software development - it's the essence of my keynote this Saturday.
- Jesse Stay
For those who don't know who Chris is, he was the lead dev on Flock, if I remember right, and is one of my favorite geeks for understanding what the bleeding edge is thinking about and working on. This is a good thesis on what is going on in our culture.
- Robert Scoble
Open is good. Secrets cause fear, anxiety, lies, and foster a sense of irresponsibility. Hence what we're seeing now on a global scale in the economy.
- Ⓐ ☠ slayerboy ☠ Ⓐ
Robert, Chris is one of my favorite Geeks as well. He's up there with David Recordon, Joseph Smarr, Don MacAskill, the FF Team, Kevin Rose, and others. I need to do a post of all the "Leader/Coder" Geeks that influence me some time.
- Jesse Stay
Thanks guys! Robert — just to clarify, suggesting that I was lead dev gives me too much/inaccurate credit. I talk like a dev sometimes, but I'm actually a designer. I prefer to think of myself of a hybrid developer/designer translator though, but YMMV. ;)
- Chris Messina
This is the best post I've read all week. I've been thinking a lot lately about how our politics (and society) is really the result of the same old ideologies that have been being beat to death since the 1960's. The election of Obama - in some ways - indicates the general rejection of those ideological debates (thank God). Chris - your post totally resonates with what I've been thinking. Thanks for putting it out there.
- Brian Roy
Connect. Share. Be Open. Onward to the future my friend. It has been awesome working on a more open and social world with you over the last 5 years.
- Dave Morin
Great article.
- Glenn Batuyong
Awesome post. Internally, we view "Social Media" as the open sourcing of people/ideas. Great stuff, Chris!
- Alan Edgett
Great post. But note on Chris Messina's website it appears there are a lot of 404 dead links. May want to fix this.
- Bill Romanos
Just bumping this up for those who have missed this article the first time around
- Bora Zivkovic
Hey, I was "six years old fifty years ago" and I consider myself a charter member of Generation Open. It's indeed a mindset change AND it's irrelevant to one's age.
- Nick in Manila
Yes, some of us have been yearning for this for a long time.
- Rebecca
I have a room with links related to open government in Canada at http://friendfeed.com/rooms...
- Richard Akerman
Interesting read, also the comments that follow. Each generation follows the 'footprints in the snow', from past generations. It's an ongoing process.
- Henry Burger
"The people within Facebook not only believe in what they’re doing but are on the leading edge of Generation Open. It’s not merely an age thing; it’s a mindset thing. It’s about having all your references come from the land of the internet rather than TV and becoming accustomed to — and taking for granted — bilateral communications in place of unidirectional broadcast forms. Where...
more...
- Bora Zivkovic
@Bora Facebook and open in the same sentence? Hah.
- Richard Akerman
two different definitions of 'open' I'm afraid.
- Bora Zivkovic
I tried to leave this comment on the site, but I think I got tangled in some OpenID - TypePad loop - anyway when he says "More relevant is that the boomers fought the Nazis." I think he means "the boomers' *parents* fought..."
- Richard Akerman
Yup, I noticed that typo myself.
- Bora Zivkovic
My offline newspaper subscription lapsed some time ago; I've hardly watched more than a few hours of television in the past five years. The Internet is definitely my primary source of reference. Maybe it's in part because I've been talking back all these years but without an access channel.
- Rebecca
Seriously. Not enough time in the day.
Dave, I seriously agree. I make more time by sleeping less. But I get this little feeling that I'm stealing it from my future.
- Kevin Elliott
Agree! :)
- Dave Morin
Re: Gary Vaynerchuk - Be It Twittering or Blogging, It’s All About Marketing - Question - NYTimes.com - http://garyvaynerchuk.com/post...
"Go Garyvee! Awesome!"
- Dave Morin
Incredible meeting with one of my favorite entreprenuers about the future of email. Now on to the future of travel with friends from Dopplr.
Atul Arora, Roberto Bonini and Susan Beebe liked this
Who?
- Paul Buchheit
I second that... Who is that?
- Susan Beebe
Paul, he's going to come to the next Activity Streams meetup. Mentioned our conversation yesterday.
- Dave Morin
Tuesday afternoon and the apple store is packed. Amazing. Unfortunately the wait to see a 'genius' about my iphone is almost 3 hours, so I will be sticking with the android.
RAPatton, Kevin Whalen, April Buchheit and 11 other people liked this
Someone needs to get this message to Apple, seriously. If a store can't handle the load, build another one nearby or SOMEthing. :p
- Josh Haley
Agreed. They also need to fix the battery life problem. As of yesterday I've gone back to Blackberry for all of my primary communications as my iPhone was dying from low battery life every day by 7pm. Still keeping the iPhone with me because I'm an Apple guy at heart. But, looking forward to their next innovations in miniaturized battery awesomeness :)
- Dave Morin
Apple stores are always over crowded at the genius bar. On the upside though they have free internet there and FriendFeed looks really cool on one of this gigantic monitors that you can just hop on and use while you wait.
- Thomas Hawk
++ Josh, to Apple: handle the load please. ;p
- ElijahBailey-Zu of FF <0,
+++ Take Amazon as customer service Benchmark, where they go so far as to improve processes of other vendors selling on Amazon network - or send their own trucks to suppliers to make sure popular items are always in stock...
- Aydin Senkut
Well, Amazon doesn't offer local service counters where you can drop in and get help with your products. I suppose T-Mobile does, though I'm not sure how helpful they are.
- ⓞnor
Paul, you need to hire a tech to handle all that stuff for you. :P
- EricaJoy
What's wrong with making an appointment? I don't see the issue here
- Bwana ☠
Making an appointment means planning ahead Bwana. I happened to be on University Ave so I decided to drop in and try to get my iphone fixed. More than anything though, I was just impressed at how many people were there. Apparently nobody told them about the depression :)
- Paul Buchheit
You think it's not just unemployed folks killing time, Paul?
- Ken Sheppardson
I also saw people outside loading computers into a car. Palo Alto is still its own world for the moment.
- Paul Buchheit
Oh.
- Bwana ☠
Eh, yeah, I had about an hour's wait at my T-Mobile shop the other day, the only one selling Androids here. Can't blame a business for things they cannot really control: you can't erect another store / hire 10 more people just like that, not if it only costs money.
- Vincent van Wylick
Yeah, you need to make an appointment you know? Duh?
- sofarsoShawn
R-word.org - Change the conversation... - http://www.r-word.org/
jonathan ehrlich, Tim Young, WorldofHiglet and 4 other people liked this
I, and most of my generation, are guilty of this. We should stop.
- Christopher Sacca
from Bookmarklet
Been banging this drum for years and people get so mad when you call them out on it.
- Admiral Anika
As the brother of an autistic dude, it used to make my skin crawl to hear people call him a "retard". Not now, not then, and never in the future will it be cool. Never.
- Derrick
Or, if Kanye is successful with his G-word campaign he can do the same with the R-word. http://www.motherjones.com/music...
- Andrew Meyer
Agreed. Our generation is guilty as charged, and needs to remove this word from our everyday vernacular.
- Dave Morin
you mean retarded? oh, oops sorry.
- Chris Nguyen
Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger. http://ilike.com/artist...
Susan Beebe, Sean Oliver, Helen Sventitsky and 2 other people liked this
I love Daft Punk.
- Robert Scoble
Me too :)
- Dave Morin
Me too :)
- Jesse Stay
We need a Daft Punk party at SXSW. By the way, it was Chris Putnam, who runs video platform at Facebook, who got me into Daft Punk.
- Robert Scoble
Funny, Putnam got me into Daft Punk too :)
- Dave Morin
Dave: this is a weird world. But I like it!
- Robert Scoble
We should get Daft Punk to come to f8 this year. Think if we generated enough noise about it on the internet they'd do it? :)
- Dave Morin
Dave: maybe, but I bet they'll still want cash. :-)
- Robert Scoble
Dave, that would be *awesome*. @jowyang and I were discussing that, in fact. It fits the audience well.
- Jesse Stay
Or, you could say it's Daft Punk and really bring in Rick Astley
- Jesse Stay
Daft Punk is awesome.
- Daniel Iniguez
Ready to rock at South by Southwest? Join us on Sunday night March 15th for the Facebook friends.get Party with Red Bull! http://www.facebook.com/login...
Mike Elliott, David Recordon, Atul Arora and 2 other people liked this
Sure, sure. I've stood on those lines before and not gotten in:-)
- Francine Hardaway
Francine: Me too. I was thinking of making jello shots for everyone in line. Wanna help?
- Robert Scoble
Facebook throws the best parties - the fact it's called friends.get shows cool people will be there.
- Jesse Stay
Jesse: last year I couldn't get my friends into the Facebook party. :-)
- Robert Scoble
yeah, last year the facebook party made me boo loudly... we did make it in...eventually...hours and hours later...
- Erin @queenofspain
That's not true Scoble, I personally walked your friends in for you :)
- Dave Morin
Dave: after we were sent away earlier in the evening by the door guard. I have witnesses. :-)
- Robert Scoble
What matters is how the night ended :) We really hope to see everyone there this year! We're putting together a really fun event.
- Dave Morin
That's true. I do appreciate you getting me and a few friends in later in the evening. I wonder what you all are cooking up for tomorrow? (I'm invited to a press event in the morning).
- Robert Scoble
Are Facebook videos embeddable, or are they trapped in fb? (question inspired by http://www.facebook.com/video...)
Roman Zolotarev, René Clausen Nielsen, Hassan Ibraheem and 6 other people liked this
They are embeddable. But right now the embed code is only available to the owner of the video.
- Dave Morin
The advantage to Facebook over Youtube is I can ensure only my family can share my video with other family members, not the public. I think I'm going to add privacy settings into my Wordpress plugin for Facebook, btw.
- Jesse Stay
Is the resolution reduced like it is on Vimeo when the video is embedded?
- Michael Fidler
One thing I would still like to see that makes YouTube, Vimeo, etc. better is to be able to download the videos. Then I could truly use it as a Video storage repository.
- Jesse Stay
Funny video Paul! Are you planning on making other video players embeddable like Brightcove, etc?
- Michael Fidler
I would like an uploader that reencodes the video first so that it doesn't take forever to upload. I don't understand why Picasa or something doesn't do this.
- Paul Buchheit
that is quite an interesting video...
- bob
I could probably find the right person in the Picasa/uploader team to ask if you really want to know
- sharon perl
Paul, encoding time is the most common complaint when it comes to video. Here's the reason I mentioned Brightcove, as another player to add here. Look at there customers. There's a lot of great content to share. Scroll through the tabs, http://twurl.nl/6lqwz3
- Michael Fidler
I'm guessing it's because they don't want to include every known encoder/decoder, but even if they just supported a reading a few (mjpeg and h.264) and writing h.264, that would be very nice. (maybe h.264 compressors are expensive to license? how about whatever the gmail video chat uses?) Actually, what would be really great is to add this function to gears so that it can be shared by all sites.
- Paul Buchheit
Michael, is there a good generic way to add Brightcove? We already support all mediaRSS containing flv or mp4 video streams (see http://friendfeed.com/e... for example).
- Paul Buchheit
I get video's directly from Brightcove's RSS in my reader. This is their 50 newest video's every day http://www.brightcove.tv/rss... It's not the same as having access to all their customers feeds, but it's not bad. I wish there was a way of sharing content from any of Brightcove customers though.
- Michael Fidler
Take a look at Truveo http://www.truveo.com/ There's RSS for all of the categories. I haven't signed up yet, but hopefully it's possible to favorite a video like in Youtube. Then all we would have to do is add the favorite's feed here. That's if you can support it, of course!
- Michael Fidler
Re: The web is not about information or just data. The... - kortina's tumblog - http://blog.kortina.net/post...
"I hope you can too, guys. Keep up the awesome work. Bit.ly rocks."
- Dave Morin
Benno, Simon Wicks, Jesse Stay and 5 other people liked this
Wild. Why the hell is Dave on Twitter anyway? He works for Facebook! :-) If you are overwhelmed by someone you are doing it wrong. Get Tweetdeck. Or, better yet, use friendfeed and build lists. Put me in "noisy assholes." Geesh. I can handle a TON of noisy people coming at me, seems we all need new skills.
- Robert Scoble
I wish I could hide comments on scoble and Tad unless I commented on the thread.
- Christian Burns
I remember seeing THIS in the Apps forum, a Tweetdeck for FF: http://www.frienddeck.com/ If only it was a proper AIR app.. (EDIT: Oh, I'm an idiot. It IS a downloadable app!)
- Neurario
Hey, I was being authentic and nice about sharing my thoughts here in an open way. Scoble, I really value your voice and think you're awesome. But, the Twitter's interface on the web isn't doing the conversation justice right now. TweetDeck/FriendFeed's filtering is actually pretty decent, though I prefer consuming Twitter on the web right now for some reason.
- Dave Morin
Dave: sorry for sounding abused. I wasn't. :-)
- Robert Scoble
But, since we're talking about it, there's a hell of a lot of value in http://www.friendfeed.com/scoblei... for someone who works at Facebook and wants to keep up to date on the industry. At least I am trying to pick out really great things for you to read. The volume might need adjusting, though. It's tough cause some times I'm noisier than other times.
- Robert Scoble
Oh, and Twitter broke for me a long time ago. That's why friendfeed gets so many kudos from me. But, I see a ton of people getting a lot of value from the likes. So, I'll keep doing them, maybe adjusting the volume.
- Robert Scoble
I do get value from Scoble's likes. @Scobleizer: Would be better if you'd supply a short description along with it though ;-)
- Patrick Mackaaij
Patrick: unfortunately I can't do that. friendfeed just passes them along when I click "Like" on an item. Regarding what I mean about Twitter breaking, I mean that it's useless for having conversations. If you try people get pissed off and start abusing each other. They love just a few tweets per day from everyone. Put more into the system and they go batty. It's very predictable, even to tonight.
- Robert Scoble
@Robert It needs no adjustment as far as I am concerned. Keep the liking the way it is. If it's good, share it with us, like you have been doing. There is no reason to let good content slip by just because a few can't handle it.
- April Russo (app103)
No Scoble, please don't adjust your quantity or quality. I didn't mean to imply that you were "noisy." I meant to imply that some of these user experiences on the web need innovation. I do actually get a lot of great news from you on FriendFeed. However, right now Facebook and Twitter are a big part of my daily flow. FriendFeed is too, but slightly less so.
- Dave Morin
I think twitter should be used for more conversations. I don't care if someone tweets 100 times on twitter. It only gets annoying when people have their twitter connected with their facebook. They are two unique platforms that shouldn't be connected in my opinion. If I tweet 20 times a day on twitter nobody says anything. But when my twitter was connected to my facebook and my facebook status was updating 20 times a day I had people call me out on it. They were annoyed
- John Snyder
@Scobleizer - all I was asking for was to have some hashtags on your ff posts so I could separate your comments from just the links / etc. you circulate. I think adding context to what you share so that it can be organized and filtered better will be an important piece of twitter and all systems going forward. If you just had #fflike and #ffcomment next to each post, that would make a big difference
- Josh Elman
Specifically I think the innovation needs to come around Comments. Right now, we have bifurcation of commenting interfaces all over the place. A lot of the time it is hard for me to follow @replies on Twitter to a "place" where the conversation is happening. Over here on FriendFeed, or on Facebook it is easy for me to find that place and catch up with conversations that are meaningful to me (like this one).
- Dave Morin
@scobleizer so Facebook picked up 'Like' from FriendFeed - is it helping anyone yet like (no pun intended) yours does through here onto Twitter?
- Mrinal Desai
joshelman: I can't do that, though. Friendfeed doesn't offer that option. John: when I try to do conversations on Twitter not only do the conversations not go anywhere useful (due to what Dave noticed) but people start complaining because as I get noiser to keep up with a rapid-fire conversation people start complaining.
- Robert Scoble
I also think there's something here around consolidation of conversation and distribution of comments. How do we work together as an industry to help make sure that all of the comments from a conversation (no matter where they were made) end up being distributed to whatever interface the user prefers to use?
- Dave Morin
Dave: that's an interesting question. Is that really something we want to happen, though? I find that sometimes I just want to talk to my facebook audience without my Twitter audience hearing about it. In fact, isn't my pulling "likes" from friendfeed into twitter sort of what you're talking about and isn't it increasing the noise load on Twitter?
- Robert Scoble
I think it's funny when people complain. They can choose not to follow people.
- John Snyder
John: what would the fun in that be? We love to complain and throw rocks at people.
- Robert Scoble
I've been thinking about this federation/distribution question a bit lately. I think the most straightforward solution is RSS/Atom feeds augmented with a references/in-reply-to element (similar to email). Comments and likes would themselves be feed entries, and could easily span domains (just as email does).
- Paul Buchheit
Yeah, that's a fair point Scoble. Perhaps we're still in a situation where "place" and the "audience" in that place still matter greatly to the context of a conversation. And, we aren't yet at a point in history on the web where the consolidation of conversation across the meta-place that is the Internet is something that is important.
- Dave Morin
Dave: it is important sometimes. It's why I'm playing around with "likes" first. Those are easier to transport across company and community boundaries. Comments are more difficult. Sometimes I'd like to join my facebook and friendfeed and twitter communities. Other times I really would not like that idea.
- Robert Scoble
Was twitter ever really intended to be a place for conversations to happen or did it slowly evolve into that. I ask because it asks you to type what you are doing. Just a thought
- John Snyder
Paul: Sound perfect, and in line with a lot of what I've seen bounced around lately.
- Ken Sheppardson
@paultoo - ff should add some options to add context when pushing likes and comments over to twitter.
- Josh Elman
Paul, we would love if you guys joined the conversation around Activity Streams. We're doing a bunch of work right now with the community to come up with good ways to think about this. Comments is something that we haven't even really begun to explore as a part of it. But, a lot of the work is based on Atom already. The element you propose is a solid way to think about it.
- Dave Morin
Also I wouldn't mind the "Comment" button being at the bottom of the thread. Kind of hard to scroll back up to the top of a thread and press comment only to be jumped back down to the bottom.
- Dave Morin
John: the question was just a suggestion to get you going, not a rule. And, anyway, my "likes" ARE my answer to what I'm doing right now. I'm liking your stuff. Conversations are an answer too "I want to talk with you about politics." Too many people put too many weird rules into Twitter. The only rule is it's 140 characters. All the other ones should keep their rule books to themselves.
- Robert Scoble
Dave: I agree with the comment button idea.
- Robert Scoble
Wrt the comments questions, I think the first place to start isn't repeating comments across channels, but creating bi-directional links between the source and comment locations. Imagine on twitter a "being discussed here" that could point to ff, facebook, etc. This is already available at the API level with the Comments Box feature that we launched at Facebook.
- Josh Elman
I love this conversation and the people participating in it. I think it shows who the leaders are. Just 2 comments - 1, Josh, the problem with hashtags is they take away from the length of conversation on Twitter - they subtract from the already short 140 char limit. 2, in regards to conversation, this conversation would be a lot easier to parse if even the comments were threaded.
- Jesse Stay
Paul, I agree - RSS is seeing like an almost better solution over something new like OMB. Whatever it is, everyone needs to agree on it, not just one person who thinks they have a cool solution to the problem (I'm not implying anyone here). Is there a standards body around this stuff?
- Jesse Stay
Robert, I just saw your most recent tweet. Those guys who stopped following everyone, what was their reasoning?
- John Snyder
@Jesse - agree that hashtags take away from the length, but it seems a worthy tradeoff to allow focusing and filtering content. The stream is so powerful, but if we can't organize the information we can't make sure to see the things that we want to see. I think just being able to turn a person on/off is too coarse.
- Josh Elman
Yes, the ActivityStreams (http://activitystrea.ms) conversation is definately the one to join if you are interested in debating how this standard should shake out. We'll be hosting the next ActivityStreams Summit at Facebook post SXSW if you are interested in joining person as well. This stuff is awesome to debate and try to figure out together as an industry. Part of the fun part is that it is particularly philosophical when it comes to trying to figure out some of this comment consolidation stuff.
- Dave Morin
The comments and likes include predictable patterns ("Liked" and "re:" along with the ff.im url). Would it help to prefix those with #, as in #Liked and #re:, or would that just be ugly and confusing?
- Paul Buchheit
Paul: I think it'd be ugly and confusing. I'd love the ability to edit the likes before they get sent to Twitter, though.
- Robert Scoble
Yeah I agree with Scoble. Not sure the best way to do it. Maybe another character? Or, perhaps prefixing with @ or Re?
- Dave Morin
I hate the fact that comments are basically considered second class citizens. All this *stuff* should really just be content objects with the appropriate in-reply-to/related-to/inspired-by/child-of attribute in it somewhere. Morphing the current FF comment system and the "Related To" hack into some sort of fully threaded UI where everything could just be expanded, collapsed, and replied-to would be a pretty huge evolutionary step.
- Ken Sheppardson
It seems like each comment should have a URL that is paired with an identity URL and an in-reply-to URL.
- Dave Morin
Every time we take some geeky symbol and attach some meaning to it we take another step away from natural language and turn all this into a programming language. How 'bout we just improve the search tools and filtering (oh, and make Twitter bring back "Track")
- Ken Sheppardson
Dave, that's exactly what I had in mind (id everything by url). Btw, I'm definitely interested in talking about Activity Streams. Josh Elman, "comments box" looks like it's just a JS widget. Is there an api somewhere as well?
- Paul Buchheit
Ken: amen. We still need much better filtering tools than what we have. friendfeed's search is mondo cool but something about it is unsatisfying. Until we get really great filtering no need to bring more stuff in here.
- Robert Scoble
Paul - comments box is built on top of APIs that can be accessed directly. All comments made in a comments box can be accessed via comments.get method or FQL: http://wiki.developers.facebook.com/index... using the same XID. Working on opening access to comments made on fb in response using the same or related xid.
- Josh Elman
Dave - to your identity and in-reply-to URL, we should add a canonical object URL that the conversation is about. This way in-reply-to can link back to the specific comment.
- Josh Elman
Ken, sometimes the best solutions are social. Norms created around symbols in simple text fields can become the most important ways to carry context online.
- Dave Morin
Josh - Is there ever really such a thing? I mean what would the canonical object URL be for this comment? Your tweet, to which Dave responded, which started the thread? I never even saw it, and we really couldn't be much more removed from it at this point. Isn't it sufficient to have the linked list we can walk back if necessary?
- Ken Sheppardson
Dave - I'm not saying we should do away with all punctuation or anything. ;-) <-- or those. I guess I'm a little gun shy have having seen Identi.ca roll out !groups and @#tags over the last month or so. I don't ever want to have to implement that stuff in any of my tools/systems.
- Ken Sheppardson
Ken - we can always walk back up the tree so on one hand passing along the originator could be seen as just an optimization. But on the other hand, passing along the originator with every piece of content/comment would ensure that each place that comment gets distributed would have the right link back
- Josh Elman
Fair enough. Though, implementing social norms after they've been established shouldn't be something to get too worried about. Great conversation everyone! Onward and upwards toward a more social web :)
- Dave Morin
I bet we'll have to end up sticking some sort of pingback URL or something in these payloads as well, so the object has an address, an in-reply to, and a way to be notified when it inspires new objects. A "reply-to" address, so to speak. Hey... aren't we just reinventing all the SMTP headers?
- Ken Sheppardson
This thread is funny. Here you are pointing out services need innovation when Facebook Connect needs the most help. At least with Twitter and FriendFeed we're able to track comments but we can't with Facebook Connect -- unless it's used in conjunction with BackType or a similar service. :)
- Mona Nomura
@Scobleizer I wasn't fully aware of the technical possibilities of 'liking' in FriendFeed when I posted the comment and now get why you don't accompany the 'like' in Twitter with a small description of where I'm going to when I click. I'm curious whether you'll see this comment though since this 'thread' is days old :-) Will it popup somewhere?
- Patrick Mackaaij
Re: FOWA MIAMI: Dave Morin of Facebook - http://www.scommerce.com/fowa-mi...
"Hey Craig! Thanks for taking these notes. I'll re-blog them over on my blog as well. Really appreciate it!"
- Dave Morin
Re: Hey Dopplr, make me pay. - http://davemorin.com/blog...
"Thanks Louis! And everyone for stopping by to have a conversation. I'm going to be posting more often here and looking forward to more awesome conversations around great ideas and technology."
- Dave Morin
Re: Hey Dopplr, make me pay. - http://davemorin.com/blog...
"I realize it is a bold statement at this point to suggest that Dopplr has everything that make it worthy of subscription. But, if they continue directionally with all of the great things they are doing I'm sure they will begin to add some of all of these great suggestions and more. If my subscription fee now helps them get there faster, I think that's awesome."
- Dave Morin
Re: Hey Dopplr, make me pay. - http://davemorin.com/blog...
"It actually isn't clear to me yet which model will reign supreme. I think Dopplr could get away with an entirely subscription model with a simple trial period. They could also go with a freemium model. I do think there is a market for subscription only, super high quality applications."
- Dave Morin
Re: Jelly Talks: Facebook Connect & OpenID - User Experience - http://davemorin.com/blog...
"Testing out Disqus. Awesome."
- Dave Morin
5 Reasons Why Facebook + OpenID is Good News http://www.readwriteweb.com/archive...
Dave Morin, David Recordon, Pico Seno and Igor Poltavskiy liked this
Thanks for the great article Marshall!
- Dave Morin
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