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Dorai › Likes
"Three Reasons You Need to Be on FriendFeed *Now*" - http://bhc3.wordpress.com/2009...
Rob Fahrni, zʍıɔ, rowlikeagirl and 76 other people liked this
Actually, I'm getting tired of Friendfeed. Most discussion is vapid, banal and inconsequential. IOW, a waste of time.
- Dawn
I love the idea of a "Personal Content Database". I always thought of FriendFeed as an aggregation site, but it sounds better as a personal content database.
- Matthew Lang
Me too Matthew. I use it that way to some degree.
- Steve Rubel
from email
Is there a way to get a friend feed onto a personal web site?
- Peter Fletcher
Thanks for posting this Steve. And Dawn, are you deliberately ironic? Regardless, this post is for those who may not have the time to engage actively here, but will still benefit from being part of the service.
- Hutch Carpenter
@Peter - try this: http://friendfeed.com/embed
- Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Thanks Brian.
- Peter Fletcher
Nice work but a lil late on this BNO
- sofarsoShawn
Peter, you can also embed an individual thread on your site by copying the code from the "Share" link
- Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF
Oh, Dawn, that's rich cause I blocked you for bringing vapid, banal, and inconsequential stuff to friendfeed a while back. All you have to do is look at all the items from the Google I/O conference to see just how wrong you are: http://is.gd/HaUQ
- Robert Scoble
"Personal Content Database" is quite apt (especially if we could have our service icons back) - When working in twitter and waiting for twitter's page to refresh a new post, it is quicker to jump to FriendFeed, because the post is there instantly.
- Chris Loft
@rahsheen thanks for the tip.
- Peter Fletcher
BS, Robert. You blocked me because I'm not one of your sycophants but actually challenge your assumptions, motivations and actions. Like when I said you were neglecting your blog, you retaliated against me, but just two weeks later, Arrington said the same thing and you took that seriously. But I'm just a female, right Robert?...somebody you keep calling stupid, even though I'm sure my...
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- Dawn
Amen to that!
- Calvin Ayre
Dawn, I think I love you.
- cecily
Dawn: you don't even have a clue about why I blocked you. It's cause you were arguing religion and politics and had no clue who Ralph Reed was and then you followed it up with the lamest posts on global warming I've seen that it made me wonder why I was arguing with someone so clueless (and I forget there were a few other things you were arguing about). So much for that high grade point average. By the way, I don't remember Mike Arrington ever talking about that stuff.
- Robert Scoble
BTW: I unblocked her for some reason, I still don't know why. Oh, yeah, my brother stuck up for her and so far I've seen just the lamest additions to the community, like this one here. If friendfeed's discussion is vapid, banal, and inconsequential IT IS OUR FAULT. So, Dawn, this one is on you. Good riddens, I say.
- Robert Scoble
Ahh, community.
- τorƍue
#4 Bacon
- sofarsoShawn
Yeah, right, Robert. I'm so lame that Louis Gray announced both on his blog and on FF that I'm a great person to follow. And you're comment about Ralph Reed just once again shows your bigotry against Christians, lumping us all in one basket - that far right fundamentalist basket that you once belonged to and now despise. I never did belong to it. I'm Catholic, not "born again." I've had...
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- Dawn
Btw, two people have DM'd me that Scoble is best ignored. I can't do that. Being the target of repeated and consistent defamation by Robert Scoble isn't the same as Joe Blow FFer calling you an idiot. Robert's words carry a lot of weight in the tech world. I've asked Robert privately and politely to back off and as you can see, he's refused to do that. I not only have the right to defend myself, but I have a duty to my present and future investors and to my future employees.
- Dawn
FriendFeed's usefullness to me would increase 100% if I could automatically filter out every post with "friendfeed" in the title. That way I could get rid of the constant yapping about how great it is, and actually use it usefully.
- Ian Betteridge
Bump for the good times.
- Mark Krynsky
This is a post from last may! The situation has totally changed since then
- DC Crowley
"even though I'm sure my IQ is higher than yours. Were you valedictorian of your high school? Or graduate magna cum laude? Did you get a graduate degree with honors" wow that means even i don't qualify :(
- ffcode
I agree, I think we should try to save Friendfeed.
- Hunt
from iPhone
Forrester on open source in the Enterprise http://radar.oreilly.com/2009... More on this topic at #oscon: http://en.oreilly.com/oscon20...
achean, Dorai and Michael R. Bernstein liked this
open source, Web 2.0 gain appeal to CEOs as budgets shrink -
http://www.computerworld.com/action...
Dorai liked this
Brad Williamson to Brad's feed, Media News and Analysis, Twitter, RWW: The Future of Tech, TheNextWeb Forum, Social Media
TWITTER Founders: "If you pay attention to it (TWITTER) too much, you can run yourself off the rails," Stone said. He added, "Pretty soon, everybody's going to hate us." - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009...
Mike Coulter, Ufuk Kılıç, 拓 | wavesand and 9 other people liked this
HA! That's music to my ears ;-)
- Brad Williamson
from Bookmarklet
NOTE: If you like this article, make sure to join the "Media News And Analysis" group... http://friendfeed.com/media-n...
- Brad Williamson
What do they mean by "pretty soon"? I thought Twitter had already jumped a shark or five.
- Bill Sodeman
Why is it so difficult for someone to make a great phone convergence type device WITH AN EFFING KEYBOARD? ARE YOU DESIGNERS COMPLETELY MENTAL? It takes you 30 seconds to design a slide out keyboard on to your phoneish device and you are done. "But it has a touchscreen keyboard" you say? SO WHAT. GIVE ME THE OPTION FOR BOTH! Is that so hard to do?
Charlie Anzman, Elaine Helm, Mathew™ one of a kind and 36 other people liked this
Unless you don't want wads of cash...in which case, go screw a tree. So let's recap...Great phonish = On AT&T or Verizon, is less than $250 with contract, has great browser, apps AND AN EFFING KEYBOARD!
- Alex Scoble
They are out there. Choices are good.
- Rodfather
My prediction is that the next iteration of the iPhone software / HW is going to encourage third party IO devices. Just a guess, but a bluetooth or ipod connected keyboard would be very popular, and there seems to be rumblings in that direction.
- mikepk
Keyboards are the new floppy disk. (Discuss)
- Louis Gray
I'd submit that they are not...Good phoneish devices with keyboards exist, but not great ones, yet...and the Palm Pre? I wouldn't buy one on Sprint even if you threatened to drag me through two miles of broken shards of glass and salt unless I bought one.
- Alex Scoble
There are loads of devices with good physical keyboards, so its not that hard to include, its just cheaper for manufacturers to leave it out in favor of touch keys. I'm a physical kind of guy, and iPhone type keyboards just don't cut it with me.
- jcunwired
I think Alex wants a Sidekick
- Rodfather
Or an assistant :)
- Owen Greaves
Or a G1.
- Christopher A Carr
No technical reason why the USB interface and/or bluetooth of the iphone couldn't be used for input devices. I think they've controlled it so far to 'cement' the experience but they're going to encourage the third party hw add-on market much like they have with the ipod.
- mikepk
Does the Sidekick have cool apps? Does it have a real browser with funktastic multitouch? No...ergo it's merely a decent phone and not great. I want great. I'd like the iPhone if it had an EFFING keyboard!
- Alex Scoble
hehe Louis, afraid you'll have to change that to "Here's why:" and get us started :)
- jcunwired
No compromise on the 'basic' model, and then a hw keyboard add-on helps them further penetrate the business market.
- mikepk
the OG sidekick had a GREAT keyboard.
- Richard Lawler
Alex -- Android Market -- get a G1. Root it for multi-touch.
- Christopher A Carr
I wouldn't buy a T-Mobile device if you threatened to drag me through 10 miles of red ants, tobasco sauce and Jose Cuervo!
- Alex Scoble
The Nokia N97 is coming. The Nokia 'N900' sounds interesting. It may be a phone. There's a bunch of HTC phones with sliding keyboards.
- Rodfather
You still want a physical keyboard? What world do you live in?..
- Andy Connell
T-Mobile's customer service is far better than AT&T. T-Mobile didn't make the device.
- Christopher A Carr
So let's recap...Great phonish = On AT&T or Verizon, is less than $250 with contract, has great browser, apps AND AN EFFING KEYBOARD!
- Alex Scoble
The new Sidekick sounds interesting. Huge display and has a Facebook, Twitter, and Myspace client. Good for teenagers.
- Rodfather
T-Mobile's 3G coverage is good in the Portland metro area, Alex.
- Christopher A Carr
T-Mobile's network sucks compared to AT&T...Customer Support doesn't do you a damn bit of good if you can't get service.
- Alex Scoble
Sidekick doesn't have a real mobile OS.
- Christopher A Carr
T-Mobile's coverage and speed is good in Portland. How often do you travel?
- Christopher A Carr
One, I live in Beaverton where their coverage isn't as good and Two I go to the Bay Area every 6 months where it's the same deal.
- Alex Scoble
Coverage is good way the fuck out in E. Vancouver. I would be surprised if it were bad in Beaverton.
- Christopher A Carr
Verizon never has good phones. You can always buy an unlocked slider off eBay and swap the SIM card if you're with AT&T.
- Rodfather
Here's your chance, Apple! Put a keyboard on your iPhone and I will buy one tomorrow.
- Alex Scoble
At any rate, there will soon be a lower-end handset running Android available through AT&T ... with a physical keyboard.
- Christopher A Carr
HTC Touch Pro 2 doesn't look all that bad. http://www.htc.com/www...
- Rodfather
Alex, if you haven't tried tmo coverage lately, I'd give it another shot with a 30 day trial. I have a g1 and travel around the bay area a bunch and have been very happy with my g1.
- Adam Lasnik
Its a phone. hello! how about speech recognition :D
- Moved to Facebook
from fftogo
My Versa has a detachable keyboard, but it's shite. :D
- PENGUIN: MAJOR CAPS LOCK
Skyfire was just released for WM and S60 phones too. http://blogs.zdnet.com/cell-ph...
- Rodfather
@rodfather I like my TouchPro a lot except the TouchFlo interface doesn't work for all apps. So sometimes you're stuck with the stupid WinMo interface.
- Kenton
well, you've obviously found the CAPSLOCK on whatever keyboard device you're using.
- Jim Hearts FF
Jim-Dude, seriously? I rock the Shift key like a real pro does...only amateurs use the Caps Lock!
- Alex Scoble
I doubt I'll ever go back to WM unless they revamp the interface. I'll be going with the Pre or stick with the iPhone.
- Rodfather
I'm with you, Alex. I touch type on my Palm 755p. I'm happy to drop my "requirement" for a physical keyboard on my next device as soon as somebody offers a device with an alternative text entry mechanism that's just as fast.
- Ken Sheppardson
Alex, you are one seriously old school mofo.
- Jim Hearts FF
Its not old school, its just practical. I don't know about other devices, but every time I go into best buy I pick up an iphone and try to type on it, effin drives me crazy. I want to feel a key under my finger and see the correct letter appear on the screen. I don't want predictive text, auto correct, or anything else that wants to think for me.
- jcunwired
I think Alex just wants a Blackberry with good browser
- Rodfather
And apps, Rodfather!
- Alex Scoble
The Pre will be coming to AT&T in 6 months, I'm guessing.
- jcunwired
Why doesn't Blackberry get a decent Webkit mobile browser a la Android, iPhone, WebOS?
- Christopher A Carr
Keyboards on phones? That's so vintage. ;P
- Anika
Because RIM's entire software development ecosystem is a big, steaming pile of poo with flies buzzing around it.
- Paul Reynolds
Well, then Alex' best hope is an Android device on AT&T with a keyboard.
- Christopher A Carr
There's always this: http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2009...
- Christopher A Carr
Alex, have you spent a solid amount of time with the iPhone keyboard? It's more than usable in landscape mode... which should be an available mode in all apps with OS 3.0. I had a Sidekick and Blackberry before the iPhone.
- Paul Reynolds
I've given up on iPhone/ Touch ever getting a physical keyboard, and so am waiting for another, preferably bigger Cocoa Touch device with a frigging poundable keyboard, whether integral or external, but it simply HAS TO BE THERE.
- ianf ⌘
Scoble (the other one) had a review of a phone that had a screen keyboard you used with a pen, but you could slide it along the letters rather than selecting each letter, and it would figure out the word. You didn't have to be accurate. Wish I had saved the name of the phone. Anyone remember this one? That was amazing.
- Justin Long
yeah you'll just have to wait for palm pre to come to AT&T
- Nick August
I'm a builder and I really need one of the phone manufacturers to get off their arse and give me a handset with a dedicated pull-out spirit level. Those iphone spirit level apps are useless! Oh sure, they work fine.. but how hard can it be to put a proper wooden one in there, with a little ethanol bubble - ethanol is cheap ferchrissake! WHY CAN'T THEY JUSY PULL THEIR FINGERS OUT!
- Andy Connell
You mock me, Andy, but there are a lot more people like me that want an iPhone with a keyboard than there are who want one without...actually there are a lot more people who want an iPhone with a stylus than anything else.
- Alex Scoble
After pen and pencil, the physical QWERTY keyboard has been the principal means for mechanical text entry for 100 years or so. If you want to remove it from your device, fine... just offer something better. We're not asking for something to be added, we're really asking that something not be removed until the alternatives are mature.
- Ken Sheppardson
Sorry, didn't mean to mock. I think the alternatives are mature, that's all. Given the form factor I think we have to get up to speed with them. I'm sure no-one here needs reminding that the qwerty keyboard was an attempt to slow typing to deal with technology that hadn't caught up with human dexterity. Are we now saying that our dexterity can't keep up with the technology?..
- Andy Connell
It's not an issue of "dexterity" for me, it's the lack of tactile feedback that I'm (1) on the right letter/symbol and (2) have pressed the correct letter/symbol, without having to look at the keyboard.
- Ken Sheppardson
dexterity would cure that..
- Andy Connell
Thin is in. Slide out keyboard = fat phone.
- Kevin Pedraja
What's next? Touchscreen boobies? Sorry, but just like I like the feel of actual skin, I like the feel of actual keys.
- Alex Scoble
no internet porn, then?
- Andy Connell
"dexterity - n. Skill and grace in physical movement, especially in the use of the hands; adroitness." ... I'm perfectly cabpably of moving my fingers. Knowing where to put them is the problem.
- Ken Sheppardson
I use a G1 on Tmobile and travel around the country with no problems with 3G service. Right now we have the slideout keyboard but when cupcake comes, we'll have the virtual as well. And as was suggested you can add the multitouch. Besides, the Android market is doing pretty well.
- Lynne d Johnson
Verizon Samsung uch-740 (aka Alias). awesome.
- Jeremy Toeman
This is why I will go from the Sprint Mogul (HTC 6800) to the Touch Pro 2. I love the keyboard!!!
- David Cook
Ken, I really don't understand.. yes, adroitness = skillful use of the hands.. that's all that's required with a touchscreen keyboard. Ask my 12 yr old niece.. If you don't know where to put them, you're de facto maladroit..
- Andy Connell
The Nokia N97 is looking like the business. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Touch-screen keyboards are like multi-button mice. Discuss. (Ever tried using a touch-screen while not looking at it?)
- Mr. Gunn
Good point. Kids these days can type super fast without even looking at the number pad.
- Rodfather
Buy Nokia and they give you the business too, Kol. Most of their good phones are uber expensive.
- Alex Scoble
I repeat - 12yr olds have no problem with touch screens. If you do, maybe you're not the.., y'know, future..
- Andy Connell
12 year olds also have smaller fingers and are 12 year olds...They aren't buying iPhones in droves either. I have money. A 12 year old doesn't. Who do you think is the bigger demographic for phoneish designers to design for, Andy? Guys like me or a 12 year old?
- Alex Scoble
Who will be the bigger demographic in 5 years? Did phone companies stop planning for the future while I wasn't looking?
- Andy Connell
My demographic will still be larger in 5 years, Andy. And you are talking about phone companies, right?
- Alex Scoble
Do you really think 12yr olds aren't in possession of iphones? They might not be buying them, but their parents certainly are, because that's what they're asking for.. you're right, I meant 'phone making' companies as opposed to phone companies..
- Andy Connell
Heh, well parents buying iPhones for the 12 year olds is another subject altogether. No, I do not believe that the vast majority of iPhone users are 12 year olds. 12 year olds are probably less than .5% of the iPhone market.
- Alex Scoble
If that's Apple's target demo, I wish them the best of luck, because they'll need it.
- Alex Scoble
Nah, they'll be just fine..
- Andy Connell
Yeah, because that's not their strategy.
- Alex Scoble
*cough* fanboy *cough*
- jcunwired
This starts to become a silly argument. You don't believe that the vast majority of iPhone users are 12 year olds? Neither do I. Nor, more to the point, did I say or imply that. If we can go back, I'm saying that your need for a physical keyboard is outdated, and will become increasingly so in a future of young people adept at the new technologies. Louis Gray, in his masterfully sly way. was implying the same thing with much more aplomb and tact a couple of hours ago. I could learn a lot from that guy..
- Andy Connell
Andy, you painted yourself in to this corner, time to get your feet dirty and do a little repainting.
- Alex Scoble
Huh?
- Andy Connell
As for Louis? Witty though he may be, he's still wrong if he thinks that keyboards are no longer necessary or desired accoutrement on phones.
- Alex Scoble
The problem is Andy, you're just wrong. Liking a physical keyboard for knowing where your fingers are isn't a young/old thing. You'll need a different argument.
- Richard Lawler
No, I really won't.
- Andy Connell
From Applematters "But I can say, without a doubt that the most important thing for me in the next iteration of the iPhone will be a physical keyboard." http://www.applematters.com/article...
- jcunwired
From CNET reviews Does the iPhone need a real keyboard? "Two people to my right, two people in front of me, and three people in back of me were all tapping out IMs or e-mails on their iPhones. What struck me was how awkward most of these people looked, tapping away with a single finger, laboring to type sentences just a few lines long." http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-18...
- jcunwired
From neowin.net - Study: iPhone keypad less efficient than physical QWERTY keypads "A recent usability study found that average cell phone users are far more efficient using physical QWERTY keypads to type messages than they are when using the virtual keypad included with Apple Inc.'s new iPhone." http://www.neowin.net/forum...
- jcunwired
From Slashgear - AT&T Matrix Pro Contest - Physical QWERTY Keyboard VS Virtual QWERTY Keyboard Arguement "Since a virtual keyboard is trying to emulate a physical keyboard is will never be able to match the "feeling" perfectly." http://www.slashgear.com/forums...
- jcunwired
From Zdnet - The anatomy of an iPhone user (and why they want new form factors) "Reading email is the top function in the iPhone, but users are focused on reading email not composing them. In fact, a third of iPhone users carry a second phone “either for basic voice calling, or other functions like composing e-mail.” http://blogs.zdnet.com/BTL...
- jcunwired
Andy, you need an argument. Period. :)
- jcunwired
The main problem with his stance is there is no evidence that people prefer a keypad with no physical demarcation between the keys - because those people don't exist. As it is, all touch screen devices are a tradeoff, one that's worth it to some and not others, but to pretend like a physical keypad doesn't have benefits any person can enjoy is just silly.
- Richard Lawler
You know, if they made a iPhone with a second screen that could slide out.... so same as a fold-out phone but with a screen instead of the physical keyboard... I'd want one because it would be "Good enough" and I might even like what can be done with a rearangable keyboard. But even crap like Windows CE/Windows Mobile got much better with a keyboard.
- Wirehead
They could easily but it's more than likely another Jobs directive. No buttons. Disagree at your peril.
- Adi
No buttons. No keyboard. No floppies. No problem.
- Louis Gray
Late to the party, but, HTC Touch Pro. Touchscreen, slideout keyboard...
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
Bluetooth accessories are a major focus of the iPhone 3.0 release.
- Jason Wehmhoener
The thing is, I can, in fact, type on an iPhone keyboard. I've tried it. It sucks. I'm about 5x faster and more accurate on a real keyboard, and I can use my Treo 755p with one hand no problem. It certainly could be that I'm just too clumsy to use an iPhone. I'm probably not cool enough either. Oh well.
- Ken Sheppardson
I feel your pain. I don't want to give up my 755p either or the plan. I think that is why I keep finding new reasons why I should keep it.
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Wow I haven't heard anyone use maladroit in a long time. And de facto as well. Thanks Andy, you've made my day.
- Gilbert Harding
Alex, I get new phones with new contracts so pay very little above the monthly payments. I just have to be patient some times. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
I know that after getting a phone with a touch screen, I hate using it for anything. The 9 button with perdictive text was faster for me than a touch screen, even a good one, ever was. Primarily my device exp are the n800 and Voyager.
- Aaron Kurtz
from f2p
I'm with you, Alex. That's why I got a G1. If you're willing to buy one without a contract, you can use the provider of your choice.
- Rishabh Mishra (p248)
It's pretty funny, your next post is about the possibility of hyper-inflation and whether or not it had the potential to completely crash our economy and you seem much less passionate about that. You are a very angry consumer. Unless you actually design a product it is rarely going to meet every single one of your specifications, there's always something you would have done differently.
- James Poling
I'm passionate, because it's stupid that they keep designing these things without keyboards, despite the droves of people who are asking for phones with good keyboards.
- Alex Scoble
The problem is the iPhone already sells more units than any other smartphone out there (yes I know the Curve is #1 but many of those were buy 1 get 1 deals from Verizon) and Apple is always firm on their price points. Why would they eat into their profit by adding a physical keyboard when obviously it's not scaring too many customers away? While a physical keyboard on the iPhone might...
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- James Poling
We can be sure of one thing, iPhone will never get an integrated physical keyboard. But as soon as 3.0 is released, there will be separate, third-party BT keyboards for it, and, especially, for any potential future larger form-factor Cocoa Touch device (aka "iTablet") they may release. Onscreen keyboard is pretty good for Twitter-class messages, sucks for anything longer than that...
- ianf ⌘
I may be late to the party ... but Nokia E71? I have one. It has a qwerty keyboard. And a nice, stable, wonderful operating system. In fact, I think it is the best phone that Nokia has ever built. And I'm a Nokia brand-loyal individual from the 1990s.
- Miss Elle
What percentage of your posted items get action (comments/likes) on friendfeed? Just trying to get a sense for the average amount.
τorƍue, Dorai, Mel Buckpitt and 12 other people liked this
For me it's a low percentage... as this is illustrating :)
- Frankie Warren
it sometimes takes a little bit of time to get people's feedback. what i would recommend is commenting and involving yourself with other people's posts and they'll eventually get to yours.
- Cee Bee
That's what I figure... I'm trying to figure out if it's primarily content or the number of followers you have. I assume it's a combination of both. Also I'm starting to think that my twitter stream is just clutter since I get almost no engagement as FF is hardly the intended audience ever. Thanks for the feedback.
- Frankie Warren
Extremely low. Cee Bee, define "eventually" :(
- jcunwired
It varies. Google Reader shares and Last.fm get the least. Pictures are almost guaranteed, as are most blog posts. It is a combo of follower counts, reputation, content and headlines or photo quality.
- Louis Gray
Depends on the time of day and who's online at the moment.
- Rodfather
About 2/3 have likes/comments, but I post almost exclusively from the bookmarklet or Flickr/Smugmug images. Of stuff with an image, it's probably 80%+
- Ken Sheppardson
I've seen few likes and comments on my own posts at friendfeed.
- Dustin Sallings
I get more conversations when I actually say something myself instead of just posting a link or quoting an article.
- Amit Patel
What Cee Bee said. You might find conversations where stuff you posted would help the discussion. More on this technique here: http://friendfeed.com/brlewis...
- Bruce Lewis
from fftogo
Bruce: thanks for the link. I always debate removing my twitter stream due to the low engagement. I know that people should be able to just filter through it, but I think it has a negative effect when people click through to my friendfeed profile and see a bunch on @replies etc... here is a search of my twitter stream vs my twitter stream with one like so you can see what I mean:...
more...
- Frankie Warren
75-80% I'd say...perhaps higher.
- Alex Scoble
I find that posting to appropriate groups increases interaction, but in general my experience is that my own posts dont get that much 'action'
- Matyjas
I'd say about 50% get at least a like and 30% get comments, and that's fine. :)
- Steve C
Probably 15-20%. But I have very sporadic activity here so I get a higher percentage when I'm actively engaging the community.
- Aaron Hood
Frankie, consider creating a semi-public group, "Frankie Warren's Tweets" and moving twitter to it from your main feed.
- Bruce Lewis
from fftogo
Bruce: interesting solution... Everyone else: thanks for offering your percents. Ill check your friendfeed activity out in more detail :)
- Frankie Warren
Most of my stuff natively posted gives likes and comments, a lot of the images, but still only a few from the GReader, Twitter and Digg stuff.
- Kol Tregaskes
It all depends on participation and don't listen to Alex. Never, ever listen to Alex.
- Jim Hearts FF
I think 5 % of my postings is getting comments. At the most. As soon as I'm placing something in a room, the percentage of likes & comments goes up.
- Ton Zijp
Tis low for me, but I'm not here for the popularity, I'm here just to crash the party.
- Tsali, The Native of FF
1 in a gazillion
- Jamie Vidamour
less than 1 in 100
- Mel Buckpitt
On the low side, though I find the more I participate, the higher it gets. I use FriendFeed primarily these days for the content, discussions and great platform.
- Kevin Whalen
from email
probably less than 2%. I retweet a lot.
- Dorai
less than 1/10th of 1%
- Chris Heath
Want to understand the #virt-sponger middleware re. generating #rdf #linkeddata "on the fly" from non RDF sources? See: http://virtuoso.openlinksw.com/Whitepa...
Dorai liked this
Exploring a Model for Peer-to-Peer Learning « The DeepDebate.Org ... - http://deepdebate.wordpress.com/2009...
Dorai liked this
Sometimes you just want to find what is new. Sometimes you want to find what is popular. Sometimes you want to find what is new and popular. Sometimes you are just happy to find anything (obscure search). You always want to find something "relevant", but without semantic search that's hard. Different search engine approaches?
Dorai liked this
In a search engine course in Berkeley they talk about different searches. Some times you search for information that is there. Some times you are not sure whether the information you are searching is there at all. I always thought that relevance is relative. I may not the most popular link to show up on top some times (especially when I am looking for new companies/products or outliers).
- Dorai
RT @ZuDfunck: Twitter Crowns Bit.ly As The King of Short Links; Here's What It Means http://ow.ly/5sCS Something very important is afoot.
Dorai liked this
Senate Opening Up? Offers Up Vote Data In XML Format - http://techdirt.com/article...
Dorai liked this
"There's been a big push lately to get the gov't to be a lot more open with its data, and both the new federal government CTO and CIO have spoken up about the importance of opening up more data. While it may take some time, we are starting to see things happen -- and happen quickly in some cases. Apparently, the Senate agreed (despite some reservations) to make the data from Senate votes available in an open XML format, and just a few days later that data is available. This is absolutely a good thing, but the real test will be seeing what people do with this and other open government data sources. It's nice to report on the government doing something right every once in a while...."
- Neal Jansons
from Bookmarklet
RDFj: Not only serialise RDF as JSON, but create 'semantic' JSON objects: http://code.google.com/p... (Closely related to RDFa.)
Dorai liked this
I'm really happy with the increase in activity since releasing http://beta.friendfeed.com/ on Monday. The conversations have always been my favorite part of FriendFeed, and the new ui makes them even better.
HealingBrush, Q'Darius Melton, Jeunelle Foster and 219 other people liked this
This sounds like such a "press-approved" statement Paul ;)
- Ana
Ana's comment was not "press-approved", however.
- Paul Buchheit
damn.
- MG Siegler
had the opposite initial impact than I imagined, perhaps the speed is what facilitates a lot more interaction to engage follow-up
- Lou Paglia
I agree, Paul. I've found myself engaging in conversations more since the Beta release.
- Alejandro
I was honestly skeptical. The first day of the beta was really crazy from my side as a mere user. It must have been a blur of coffee & Red Bull for the FF gang. But after 4 days I love it. I have probably interacted with FF more in the last week than in the last three months combined. Congratulations on one hell of a launch. I wish you all many sleep filled nights.
- Kevin D. White
Paul, there is option in old FF to import Twitter contacts & lots other options in 'Find & Invite', i dont see them in New FF. Have you removed them?
- Roshan Ramachandran
Roshan: we will be adding them to the beta.
- Benjamin Golub
Curious.. is this graph conversations per active user or total number of conversations?
- Bindu Reddy
FWIW, I have commented and liked more things in the last couple of days than before.. it was really distracting the 1st day but since than my feed has slowed down considerably
- Bindu Reddy
FF如此，我很欣慰~
- 阿石
虽然新版很多功能很不错，但是新版的版面看起来没旧版的舒服
- dokie
Hoping for more buzz so it keeps comin'! Great to see so many familiar names posting again
- Charlie Anzman
The new Friendfeed is pretty good. Congrats!
- fbrunel
The new FF is cool. Filters are my favorite!
- netvista
not actually, users just are testing this new interface before they are tired of it. keep watching. Would you like to release it again half of month later?
- Aether
WOW look at that graph!! That is some serious FF lovin' traffic - wooo hoooo!!!! Congrats! The beta is a hit!!! I love it, keep up the great work guys!!! :)
- Susan Beebe
I disagree... friendfeed has been so quiet lately i almost feel like.. http://beta.friendfeed.com/zee... just to get some attention!!
- Rob Sellen :o)
This app rules. And moves.
- ElijahBailey-Zu of FF <0,
Maybe what we see are the discussions of new Beta Friendfeed? :)
- Alex Kapranoff
@kkapp Sure, this is just a buzz about FriendFeed Beta
- Roman Zolotarev
The key here is the "rising" slope of the *Replies* graph after the BETA launch. While the overall offset could be due to many reasons like old users logging back in to try the beta, launch hype, Scoble etc, the flat slope of the "likes" chart and the rising slope of the "replies" chart tells me we will continue to see increased *engagement* even when the excitement has worn off.
- vijay
ｃｏｏｌ
- carmenlu
Congratulations!
- Jeff P. Henderson
Is that the hockey stick Arrington was going on about in the Gillmor Gang discussion?
- Paul Jacobson
The Beta rocks and personally I noticed I am using FF a lot more since Monday
- Mathieu Ayel
superb implementation Paul can we please have stats for most LIKED content and people easy to find without having to leave the site?
- Thomas Power
Thomas, I'd say those stats are fine off site and on FFholic. We have Best of so that's fine for me.
- Kol Tregaskes
Initially I *hated* the redesign ... but it's grown on me quickly and I find myself being a little bit more *involved* than usual. ;)
- Brandon
I'm using FF more at the moment ... but not from beta. I'm using it more because Nambu of the iPhone supports it.
- Mr K
did you exclude all of the threads relating to the beta launch from your stats?
- Alex Gawley
@agawley good question :)
- Kemal Hadimli
I think a lot of the increase is actually about the new beta interface
- Waldemar Schott
As someone else suggested, can you redo the graph and remove the discussions about the beta for friendfeed
- LPH™ and his dog P™
good improvement.
- pastas9
Could this also be interpreted to mean the new interface makes us talk more to get the same point across, i.e. behave more like we're in a chat room, exchanging "hello's" and "bye's"? The giant Gillmor Gang thread on Monday was the first time on Friendfeed I felt like saying "bye" before "leaving" the room!
- Philipp Lenssen
not for me philipp, for someone w/ limited time to check in on ff i find i'm missing conversations more w/ the beta so not engaging as much - not ff's fault more an issue of my personal use case though...
- mike "glemak" dunn
mike, doesn't "best of day" still work the same? That's how I'm catching this conversation.
- Bruce Lewis
sure bruce that gives a good view of most popular or active conversations but the beauty of expanding lists is you can organize based on themes so the list proper give you recent and active and then when expanded you can drill down through individuals who may be less active - those are the conversations I feel I'm missing
- mike "glemak" dunn
FF needs some way to communicate 'comments' other than color, because the grey (?) color denoting second tier comments is too hard to read. Don't fight your colorblind users. The mere position of second-tier comments is enough to indicate that they are comments without blending them into the background by making the font color low-contrast with the white background. Put three American guys in a room and there is a 23% chance that one of them is going to not be able to read FF because of poor font color.
- A Mitchell
yes, definite improvements - keep up the GREAT work!!!
- Walter Yu
Paul: Do you have that same chart with a line for the number of entries created?
- Ken Sheppardson
I've noticed the increase in comments to recent posts, but I still get little or no response to comments I make to content that is even just a few days old. Are there email notifications when a thread becomes re-active or is it now all about bumping threads back to the top of the content owners stream?
- karl dotter
A new design for FriendFeed at http://beta.friendfeed.com/ - http://blog.friendfeed.com/2009...
Sharon McPherson, cshirk, Anthony K. Valley © and 325 other people liked this
Great job!
- Robert Scoble
Nice job friendfeed!
- Kevin Mohr
Awesome work!
- Aaron Draczynski
Indeed, very good job. Gives me some ideas on Nambu integration.
- Gersham Meharg
realtime by default now eh? nice
- Karl Rosaen
I hate it. I love it! I haven't even scrolled down to the bottom yet. Hold on.......ok, it's good. :-)
- Jeff Eddings
Cheers Bret & team - it's feeling pretty good so far (which includes initial gut reaction)
- Christopher Galtenberg
Nice job. I can at the very least say it is a big improvement aesthetically. I haven't finished checking everything out yet, but so far so good.
- Rolf Schewe
why there is no Re-share function?
- Tony
I miss the ability to have a Firefox sidebar setup that just had my list of items scrolling past and nothing else along the side like this view: http://friendfeed.com/realtim...
- Justin Yost
Reshare will be back. Just an artifact of beta-testing, didn't make it in for this morning
- Bret Taylor
Definitely not looking for attention here, but I just don't like it.
- Nick
This real time integrated updates is pretty kick butt. Especially for comments.
- Gersham Meharg
don't like the grey background
- Moses
Any new comment can not move up this item?
- Tony
Our settings vary to prevent things shuffling around excessively. We bubble up when someone you are subscribed to comments.
- Bret Taylor
I like the updating comments, but when it shifts what I'm reading out of the frame it's a little distracting. Overall, great work!
- Derek Coatney
also wish i can add links/pics/embed in the "comments"...for example, i'd like to include an image of my email from http://www.emailcover.com, but it only shows up as a link
- brainno722 (Peter)
thanks, it looks awesome!
- Dani Martínez
Congratulations guys on a job well done!
- Thomas Hawk
Love it, but needs a floating Pause button.
- Barak B
+1 Barak
- Kenton
Barak, very good idea
- Kol Tregaskes
The filter is great! But any filter can not output to friends.
- Tony
+1 Barak
- Tony
what filter?
- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
adding a filter sucks, things like has comments from should ajax populate :(
- Stuart Evans
from twhirl
you can create filters when you click "filter"
- Tony
The anticipation was high, but so was delivery! Great job FF team.
- Micah Wittman
Awesome!
- Iván Abrego
Like it! Facebook import (notes & link, not status) seems broken though...
- Alex Lomas
A keyboard shortcut for Pause, maybe?
- Micah Wittman
Thanks, Alex, we will look into it,
- Bret Taylor
Can you open an existing conversation in a new window?
- Barak B
1st look is good, like the real time...didn't make it to the bottom the first few minutes. Also the comment box drops down as I am commenting now...message got off screen ;)
- Sanne Buurma
please add keyboard shortcut for play/pause feed
- Ouriel Ohayon
Please, remove the gray background. Any color, but not gray.
- bnoise
Agree with Andy, dislike the fugly grey
- Sally Church
Barak: click on the timestamp to open a conversation in a new window.
- Kevin Mohr
Barack B : you can click the time and select open in new window.
- Simon Wicks
Just bring back the filters to the main feed. Other than that, it looks awesome :D
- Gerardo Curiel
Agreed, the grey isn't that great.
- Gersham Meharg
refresh the page would move up the item which have newest comment?
- Tony
sad grey: why don't you let everyone choose the colour of the background?
- Davide Leonelli
looks awful for me - http://www.flickr.com/photos... - do not like the gray or the wasted space
- Nick
Grey or not, rather think about what the beta has to offer in functionality
- Sanne Buurma
Please, bring back service icons near each post — it's very hard to scan information flow without them. Also hope you'll do something with new subscription module — it's unuseful while managing a lot of imaginary friends.
- Juras Vetrau
Nice. Good job guys.
- Peter Kruit
The colouring needs looking at for sure. Unless, of course, you are going to redesign the logo? ;-)
- Kol Tregaskes
dislike the grey, sorry
- Manuela
Agree on colouring - but hey its a beta. Thanks Bret.
- Roberto Bonini
But Bret, picking a nice background colour is basically free (although I guess you should really be testing 41 variations :-))
- Alex Gawley
perhaps highlighting your own comments in the flood of comments (easier to scan/find)?
- brainno722 (Peter)
agree, gray background is bothersome.
- AJ Kohn
Wait, is the frequent shifting up and down of items I'm reading (i.e. the items in view) really supposed to work out well? I suppose you guys tried it for a while and you just got used to it?
- j1m
Peter, yep but thankfully the Cleaner FriendFeed GM script still works in Chrome and FFox, which does this for you.
- Kol Tregaskes
Don't like: broke my Blocks list, Block not available from Hover Menu
- Will Higgins™
Why Will Higgins have a superscript of "TM"? how typed in?
- Tony
it keeps the bad low-contrast grey on white text for comments that deters me from reading it. You made the main text bigger, now make the comment text black.
- Kevin Marks
Fantastic job guys !
- David Berrebi
can't see source of posts and comments
- Moses
Will: block will be back, just missing today, but it is not something we are removing (just something we didn't get in for this morning)
- Bret Taylor
I think you guys should really embrace the idea of hashtags. Let us add them to other people's posts, having various services auto-tag imported items, let us search on them using filters. Tagging is one great way for us to get a handle on the volume of information here.
- Kevin Kuphal
What's with the orange and the green on the side? Its a bit ugly if you ask me. Also, is there a way to change this, as well as make the beta permanent? (I like living on the cutting edge).
- darnell
I too like the orange and green. It's the blue I'm not sure about. :-)
- Daniel Dulitz
I like the FF blue
- nouhad
Yeah, but it clashes with the logo. Either Friendfeed needs to change their logo, or get rid of the colors. Or (even better) allow users to change the colors. :-)
- darnell
Looks horrible to me, I think we should have a customizable interface more like iGoogle, I like the idea though, just more customization, like sidebar customization, friend lists, realtime widget, chat widget, all movable and arrangeable, there sure is enough space etc...
- Kyle Weller
I'm with Kyle and Darnell - I like being able to customize my GMail colours, and having that feature on FF would be cool
- nouhad
Sorry, I don't like it. Real-time makes me nauseous still and the design is terrible.
- Lindsey is Fierce!
Yes, bring back service icons, somewhere. Also, the bigger font in entries doesn't look good.
- bnoise
Ignoring 71 previous comments... I really like the new design! One request: allow the pause button to follow my cursor as a scroll down the page!
- Chris Messina
+1 Chris Messina. That would be an awesome feature.
- Beau Liening
Add a floating "COMMENT" feature at the bottom of each thread, so I don't have to scroll up to click "comment"... this is a weird experience in new beta UI
- Susan Beebe
@Ari: This is why I really think tagging is what they need to focus on. If we could each add #ffbeta or something to our own posts as well as others, you get the trending and other features that twitter already has. Combine this with filters and you really get some killer information management features.
- Kevin Kuphal
I really like having one UI instead of different modes (normal, realtime, miniwindow), but to support the old "mini window" experience, perhaps allow the right hand side bar with filters and subscriptions to be collapsible?
- Karl Rosaen
@Karl: API is key here. Twitter isn't massively popular because their website rocks. Twitter is massively popular because there's a massive layer of applications built on top of it. Build that for FF and you have the same potential growth
- Kevin Kuphal
I wish it could use more of the screen real estate of my monitor, given my normal window size, it has large amounts of unused space on either size of the content due to the fixed layout. Maybe a multi-column mode?
- Ray Cromwell
Nice job! but, where are my rooms??
- Krishnamoorthy
@Krishnamoorthy rooms I believe have changed to feeds beta.friendfeed.com/[room_name]
- Lou Paglia
the new design works better for me. I am sure there will be glitches, but so far so good.
- Sharon Hurley Hall
Is there a way to change my prefs over to to the beta so I don't have to keep entering beta.friendfeed...?
- Ryan Stanley
UI suggestion: there's a link to expand all comments, there should be one to collapse them as wel.
- Ryan Stanley
UI suggestion: after expanding comments you scroll all the way to the bottom reading the thread, then you have scroll all the way back up to click the Comment link. Why not have it at the bottom of the thread too.
- Ryan Stanley
Feature suggestion: FF needs a built-in way of referring to people publicly, just like Twitter's @. Perhaps use the same convention. But there needs to be a way people to address each other in public threads, so a user can make sure to be informed when people are talking or referring to them.
- Ryan Stanley
going to read through faq - roadmap of what made beta & what's going away would be nice - big concern for me is the lose of ability to expand lists to see individual participants - i find that one of ff's strongest features - that and block but i see from earlier in this thread that its will make it in later in beta (whew)...
- mike "glemak" dunn
Um, Twitter much?
- Christiana
A Pause button that follows you on page scroll could be more distracting than it's worth. But how about something like it appears upon a white space mousedown/mouseup event.
- Micah Wittman
You guys should use this userstyle: http://beta.friendfeed.com/ajbatac...
- Kyle Weller
Curious about how the new design will affect the iPhone version of the site...?
- Chris Messina
welcome qwerty. :o)
- Rob Sellen :o)
Hmm, I tried to read this thread, but I never got to the bottom, because the unexpected shifts of the text just became too much after a while. Fundamentally, if the page keeps shifting up and down unexpectedly, it's hard to see how anyone's ever going to read it -- hence the many requests for a floating pause button, which would help. You could also imagine pause on hover. Being able to read down the page without having the text disappear seems to me like the #1 use case of ff.
- j1m
I like it.
- Willem (@wim66) ☠
Of course, it's not really like you want Pause -- the real-time updates are great when they're below wherever the eyes are :-)
- j1m
I love the new UI! I'm a big fan. It feels a lot cleaner and more organized. The real-timeness doesn't bother me. It seems pretty clever about when and when not to refresh. Great job, guys!!! : )
- Jess Lee
Bret - Great job! There are certainly things to clean up before this interface goes to the main page. Rooms should REALLY be on the subscribed list on the right hand column. I would LOVE to be able to put Blank Lines in comments. I don't care if they count for a whole lines worth of characters (as opposed to a more common one character for the cr/lf) Blank lines make comments more legible and clear than just a runtogether paragraph.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I don't like how the interface STILL loses my place if I subscribe to someone while posting a comment (or even reading it!) I should be able to subscribe to YOU while I read YOU and not lose my page place. The Page should need to be refreshed to reset everyone because of the new subscription.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I don't know about the queued items, I like the real time feed, having selectable speeds instead of "over-caffination required mode" would be good. Most discussions this is irrelevant, but the discussion on tis new beta this morning (i.e. on scoble's feed) showed how insane that can be.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
The real-time-only feed in the beta is causing Safari 4b on my MacBook use up a lot of CPU cycles, hence depleting the battery faster. I'm sure FF3 will too. Please consider an "ECO Mode" similar to the current standard mode, which only refreshes once every few minutes, for those running their machines on battery power. Without such an eco-mode, and with the rapid-fire pace of live updates, I fear that I won't be using FFeed much at all. Certainly not leaving that tab open for hours on end like I used to.
- Siddharth Deb
I don't know if I've done something, or you guys did, but when I look here, I only have a few services setup in the account, when I go to the old interface I have a LOT more -I'm not certain that everything is feeding through? (i.e. I have Digg and Disqus set up, I see the correct list of icons on the old interface, but on the beta "settings" popup, No Dice. Even if this is irrelevant to the actual data flow, please fix this to make me sleep well at night. ;)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
One more thing - Could we have a character counter in the comments? It would be REALLY nice, if my account is setup to post this comment to my twitter account, and it's going to post the link to this discussion, please Add the number of characters in the link (plus a space) to the total character count. That way I won't be truncating the comment and/or the URL when it gets to twitter.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Another thing: I used to be able to click the "More" next to a single discussion, and "Link to this discussion" Where is that? If this is an outmoded way of thinking please let me know. Otherwise, um...can we have that feature back?
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob: the timestamp ("9 hours ago") is the permalink
- Benjamin Golub
Benjamin: You rock! Thanks!
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
do you need a techno dunce to help the average joe make sense of this?? haha...i love it...
- Lauren Shanahan
Very twitter like. But better due to nice conversational.
- xiawinter
I actually kinda like the grey... though it does look like it's an opportunity to let companies brand the background in some way.
- Frankie Warren
For cc to Twitter functionality, can the number of characters be a count-down instead of a count-up?
- Winston Teo
I'd like to second the notion that there should be a way to address an individual within a thread...the agreed upon "Rob:" works great, but maybe could be clickable so that there's no confusion as to which Rob or which Scoble you're talking to ;) (i.e. maybe a CTRL-Click or something on the person's name after their comment to start a new comment with their name at the beginning? )
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
The grey background looks kinda dullish, and it looks like someone ran out of ideas for colours..
- Winston Teo
IMO avatars occupy way too much real estate now, I liked the smaller ones better.
- ǝuǝƃnǝ
thsi is nothing on the new design, but after being on here all night with no attention to a down twitter, I am reminded of this: It would be nice if I could set the post to twitter for comments and likes a) permanent b) off or C) on a per comment/like basis -twitter users say this "yeah, when ppl I follow flood me with FF spam ... I usually unfollow ... even block if it irritates me enough." And I would like to be able to be easily selective of what gets put through, and it would get more GOOD attn for FF
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
please, for the love of god, move the "comment" link to the BOTTOM of the list of comments. seriously, am I the only one who can't believe this hasn't been fixed for so long?
- Dossy Shiobara
I like it
- Cristian
Great stuff! :-) FriendFeed does it better than Facebook. Please go real-time all the way for subscription requests and confirmatoions too.
- Nenad Nikolic
from twhirl
++ Nenad Nikolic
- Darren Heydon
I dont like nofollows on friendfeed and links are moved to urls very bad :(
- Turkey banned Bloggum :(
I like quick stats on user feed on top right of screen.
- Turkey banned Bloggum :(
Love the new friendfeed!
- Chris Martin
from Nambu
It's not bad, but I prefer the smoothness of the old one to the lines and edges in this new one.
- scott willeke
I love the new letter-counting post widget in the beta though.
- scott willeke
at first glance, find it much more readable than the old one. Pity there still isn't "my items that were liked or commented by others"
- Stephanie Booth
from twhirl
Bret: all the videos are now up at http://scobleizer.blip.tv -- thanks for inviting me and for all you do.
- Robert Scoble
I like this beta
- Goofy2
Stephanie: comments:1 likes:1 from:sbooth
- Justin Long
stephanie & justin - that is in the catch all http://beta.friendfeed.com/filter... - i went and liked/commented on something from each of you that had no other activity - you should both see that bubble up in /discussions...
- mike "glemak" dunn
LOVE THE NEW BETA ! the new filter is so powerful, more powerful if you could add "language parameter"!!
- foxmachia {山石}
still waiting for direct-to-room links on the right column, is it planned? (with lastupdated timestamps if possible)
- Kemal Hadimli
Nice.
- Thomas Chai
xkcd - A Webcomic - Security Question - http://xkcd.com/#
Brent - Long Live Rock, John Ruth, JR Ignacio and 99 other people liked this
I'll answer this one: Angeles Forest. PR be damned. There, I said it.
- Mark Davidson
ROFL!
- Kaan Ertürk
I love XKCD
- Dennis R.
Me too. So ultra clever. Sunday night highlight ;) And don't forget to read the alt text ;)
- Mona Nomura
from IM
If I had a nickel for everytime this happened...
- Mike Nayyar
How many nickels would you have, Mike?
- Rishabh Mishra (p248)
Who says they're "buried"?
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Like that old saying goes: Imposition is the mother of arrests. Or something like that.
- Mitch
ROFL!
- Jorge Escobar
The bodies were buried by SkyNET ina little place caqlled Area 51
- Fred Grott
RT @physorg_space: Scientists offer new theory for largest known mass extinction http://www.physorg.com/news157...
Dorai liked this
How changing the technology of collaboration can change the nature of collaboration - http://michaelnielsen.org/blog...
Yaroslav Nikolaev, Mahesh CR, Dorai and 8 other people liked this
There's a followup to the post, in comments, from Ilya Grigorik (who put the video together). Turns out that to at least some extent the effect may be an artifact of how the data was processed. I've added a note to the head of the post, and this shouldn't be used as an example. (Well, at least not of what I originally thought it was.)
- Michael Nielsen
Too late, Michael. I'd say the number of "likes" this article got on FriendFeed indicates it will be used as an example, no matter whether this was real or not.
- Peter Stuer
Peter - To my surprise, a lot of the "likes" came after the note above. I considered deleting the post, but adding a note explaining the problem seems like the better option.
- Michael Nielsen
Michael, the article deserves a like if only for self-corrected research. Still, I believe that "changing the technology of collaboration can change the nature of collaboration", but I never saw this assertion in a blog title before. That this case might have been a wrong example doesn't matter a lot to me. :)
- Meryn Stol
Meryn: Ah, got it. :-)
- Michael Nielsen
http://www.facebook.com/login... announced at SXSW
Nicholas James, Bryan Landers, Diana and 2 other people liked this
The entire conceptual content of your conscious mind can be dumped to a single plain text alphabetical list of semantic assertions.
Seek Ground, Julian Edward, Rui Pereira and 9 other people liked this
What if we could integrate and inference the complete content of everyone's mind in the world? What if you could upload your mind to a central database? (Just a few privacy issues there.)
- Sean McBride
how do you know we can't already do this?
- Russell Wagner
Actually, we already can do this, and it is quite simple to do. But most people don't know about it.
- Sean McBride
"I need a dump truck mama to unload my head"
- Greg GuitarBuster
Bob Dylan, From a Buick 6 :)
- Sean McBride
If you study Jonah Lehrer (Link; http://billgiltner.blip.tv/file... ) and other neuroscientists, you may agree that the idea that the mind, conscious or otherwise is simply a bunch of knowledge and rules is simply, may I say, "braindead". (This doesn't mean that i'm against modeling cognition, and improving it).
- bill giltner
Airplanes don't flap their wings and AI systems don't need to simulate organic human brains. Airplanes can outperform birds in important respects, and AI systems can outperform the human brain in important respects. But still: the more we learn about human mental processes, the better. Some of that knowledge perhaps could be used to improve AI systems.
- Sean McBride
My point is that all the FACTS to which you have conscious access to in your mind can be expressed as a single plain text alphabetical list of semantic assertions. Think about it: it's true. Start by trying make an inventory of everyone you have ever known. Category/instance binary pairs work well for this kind thing. My 10th grade English teacher=*, etc.
- Sean McBride
no it can't, sorry
- William Harryman
William Harryman -- don't be sorry. Give some examples. (Remember: we are discussing factual conceptual knowledge to which you have conscious access -- not unconscious knowledge, not sensory knowledge, not muscle memory, etc. -- not the total complex field of consciousness and memory.)
- Sean McBride
no it can't. read eckart tolle. words can't explain why words can't explain it. its a trick of the mind
- j sven
The *conceptual* content of any author can indeed be reduced to a list of semantic assertions. (Whatever emotional or mystical feelings you experience while reading a particular book is another matter.) Another way to go at this: make a list of all the proper names of objects/things/beings with which you have had direct experience (people, places, organizations, movies, etc.).
- Sean McBride
even conceptual information, as embedded in the human mind, is way more complex than binary code can reproduce - this is why AI fails every time, even in its most basic form
- William Harryman
Give an example of a concept that one can't express. If a concept can be given a name, it can be situated on a space/time grid in particular relations with other objects. Every time you use Google you are using a form of AI which vastly exceeds the capacity of any human brain regarding a few particular tasks.
- Sean McBride
AI cannot represent thought, it can only crunch numbers - if it cannot be reduced to numbers, AI can't do it - for example, freedom - if you can turn that into binary code, with all its meanings, associations, derivatives, then you have solved a problem AI people can't solve - it's a word that has more embedded, implicit values than anything Google can search for
- William Harryman
Some of the conceptual objects and markers floating around in our heads: activities, albums, apartments, articles, bands, books, bosses, buildings, cafes, cars, childhood friends, cities, classes, classmates, clubs, college friends, coworkers, doctors, enemies, events, family members, foods, friends, furniture, games, high school friends, houses, jobs, lovers, magazines, movies,...
more...
- Sean McBride
William -- you need to dig more into AI research -- it's much more about symbol processing, conceptual processing and knowledge representation than about "number crunching."
- Sean McBride
great, it can map nouns, so try adjectives, or adverbs, or any abstract word - and memories are one area it will never be able to map, too many sense perceptions involved, such as taste, scent, vision, and so - no way to map that in binary code
- William Harryman
William -- read above: I understand the problem with sense and muscle memories. Verbs, adjectives and adverbs are very easy to map to semantic systems. Everything grammatical is easily mappable to semantic and conceptual structures. Grammatical rules define precise relations among objects/nouns.
- Sean McBride
in fact, if words are truly "quantum entanglements," http://tiny.pl/bftr, then things gets a hell of lot more complex than anything a computer can do
- William Harryman
Actually, machine intelligence already exceeds human intelligence in certain domains, and will probably greatly exceed human intelligence in all cognitive domains within a few decades. The small size of the human skull significantly limits the number of our neurons, neuronal connections and memory capacity.
- Sean McBride
William -- search on "knowledge representation" on Amazon.com, and you'll get an idea of how intense has been the research and activity in non-number-crunching AI research fronts.
- Sean McBride
Won't the dump be just static (snapshot at a time?). How do you keep up with the new stuff, links and connections. The new aggregated brain would alter individual brains too.
- Dorai
It would be an inventory of everything in your head up until the current moment, yes. The snapshot may be static, but it could be operated on in dynamic ways in combination with other lists.
- Sean McBride
An interesting point is that much of this biographical/autobiographical information has already been captured in dozens of databases. Integrated, these databases would remember and know much more about you than you know about yourself. Conversion of this data to interoperable semantic assertions is probably already underway in certain circles.
- Sean McBride
Buffalo Ontology Site - http://ontology.buffalo.edu/history...
Dorai liked this
The blame starts with Aristotle for Ontology!
- Mahesh CR
Ontology Design Patterns . org (ODP) - Odp - http://ontologydesignpatterns.org/wiki...
Dorai liked this
Patterns for designing Ontologies
- Mahesh CR
Daniel Rowley, Yuval Atzmon, adam garrett and 22 other people liked this
I love Evernote. Check out the Evernote Addicts room if you want to find out what other FriendFeeders think about it: http://friendfeed.com/rooms...
- Her Lindsay-ness
I've been using Evernote. No complaints. The toolbar button makes it easy to grab things for later as I see them. Never tried Zoho.
- Mark Foundos
I use google notebook firefox plug-in. It is getting better all the time but I would really like a wiki style interface to notes.
- Dorai
I love evernote as well
- Mitchell Hislop
from twhirl
Does evernote have any formatting capabilities beyond using the keyboard for ctrl-B, ctrl-u kindof thing? I don't remember it having a formatting toolbar. Does it now?
- Kamath (नमः)
i think you mean soho notes, yes? if so, it's a great program that i first began using as a note application on my mac and still love to use. other than that i use yojimbo for personal stuff occasionally and evernote all the time for archiving articles and clippings from the net
- Cee Bee
I love Evernote. I use it email feature, so I can send formatted emails (specially copied and pasted webpages) and I get it with images and a similar format than web pages. A great tool.
- Leandro Ardissone ⍨
evernote is probably my most often used out of the three i mentioned above. it has a great search function (images and words) and is pretty good overall with the use of keywords
- Cee Bee
I use Google Notebook for somethings that I want quick access to, when in my browser, but I use Evernote for most all note taking stuff, unless it's stuff I want to share with a certain. closed, number of people, and then I use Google Docs, depending on the format of course.
- Ian May
I was a super happy Surfulater user till the big 166% price hike. I will not be upgrading. There are quite a few people that feel the same way I do: http://www.donationcoder.com/Forums...
- April Russo (app103)
Evernote - in the cloud, on the desktop and on the Iphone -- online / offline and Iphoneline....
- SnakeDoc
Evernote FTW
- Eric P
Just started looking at diigo
- William Meloney
I love Google Notebook. It might night be very social, but it works great. Has a nice little Firefox extension for clipping stuff.
- Nate Pilling
I like Evernote but I tend to use it only for specific things - mainly lists, ideas, pics and other things that I want to be remember for the long term. Anything that is current (like my to-do list) or that I just want to jot down real quick goes in stickies, or good ol' fashioned paper.
- Ariel Torres
You know, I realized today that I love all the ancillary features of Evernote: the tags, search, syncing, multi-platform support, ability to convert pictures to text. However, it really sucks at note-taking; basically you get a box with no way to organize anything.
- Glen Campbell, B.A.
Am I the only one who uses MS OneNote? It's pretty good.
- Dan Fitek
OneNote is probably the best application MS made. I loved using it on my Tablet PC. However, I've switched to a Mac for my primary machine, so I can't use OneNote anymore. Evernote's ubiquity and cross-platform clients are what make it better than OneNote for me.
- Cheryl Jones
Dan, I use MS OneNote all the time at work. If it was available on the mac, I wouldn't ever consider anything else.
- Kamath (नमः)
I love MS OneNote too
- Marcel Janus
I've used Google Notebook, but the software version, the clipper and the accurate search made me move to Evernote. Never tried Zoho Notes.
- Gian
I've tried both Evernote and Google Notebook, and like them both. Though the OCR built into Evernote is very cool. Makes me wish my blackberry had a camera.
- Greg Morgan
I need to do a video review of a great notes gadget.. will have to do it tonight and post into FF
- alphaxion
You know.. zoho notebook is actually the most like MS OneNote.
- Greg Morgan
I love Evernote, especially because of the windows mobile client which also uploads your notes directly to the web. One thing i love most about the mobile client is its ability to take "Snapshot notes" this allows me to take snapshots of newspaper or magazine article's directly into EverNote.
- Marco Willemse
Evernote has been wonderful... worth the $5/month premium account... however, if Journler ever came out with an iPhone app, I'd drop Evernote in a heartbeat
- Shawn Duffy
from twhirl
Another vote for Evernote.
- Herb Hernandez
Evernote for its cross-platform support and API
- Ted Louie
Evernote! :)
- PaperDoll
Oh wow. I had no idea Zoho Notes accepted images & video. Thanks for the tip on that. Now I can save everything.
- Anika
Onenote. Mostly for meeting notes and printing receipts/web pages to a Onenote document.
- Rodfather
Evernote FTW
- CW™
Evernote all the way, multiplatform, web enabled and iPhone enabled! Yay!
- Paul Wade
Try Out Microsoft Office Onenote
- nfan12
from Alert Thingy
If you're on a Mac, Shovebox is useful with a slick interface.
- Tom Landini
Evernote. I wonder what Amy chose since this post began in November.
- Russellreno
@Russell Yeah, that's kinda funny. Take a look at Amy's feed. She's never returned to this conversation or any other for that matter.
- Christopher Harley
Am I the only one who finds Mail.app's notes feature to be sufficient?
- Paul Grav
@tom landini isn't shovebox that noteapp that you could get for free at Macheist? I mostly use evernote cuz of their excellent multi-platform capabilities and webclient. I use google tasks for stickies and the like? Shovebox any good for this stuff?
- Sebastiaan van den Akker
I believe you can get a free copy of Shovebox at Macheist. It is Mac only, so not cross platform.
- Tom Landini
Big insight of the day: multiple semantic markup languages, schemes, systems and conventions can easily cohabit and communicate with one another on the net. Pick the semantic style that suits you. Automatically convert any semantic markup style to another compatible style.
Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie), Morton Fox, Tyson Key and 2 other people liked this
For instance, converting #song[Morrissey; Tomorrow] to {song; Morrissey; Tomorrow} and vice-versa is no big deal.
- Sean McBride
Is there a list of semantic markup languages, schemes and systems. I am familiar with rdf/xml, n-triples, n3. Are there others? Or there other schemas (besides rdfs and owl?)
- Dorai
Dorai -- I am urging folks to try to rebuild semantic markup from the ground up with a single-minded emphasis on *simplicity* and ease of writing and reading on the user end. If you search on "nml" in my feed you will see one approach that appeals to me.
- Sean McBride
The two song statements/assertions in the comment above are examples of simple microformats, where #song[*artist; *title] and {song; *artist; *title}.
- Sean McBride
In the future, Internet services and platforms (like Friendfeed, Twitter, Google Docs, Yahoo! Mail, etc.) will clearly state what semantic markup schemes they recognize and are able to parse, process and manage.
- Sean McBride
Thanks to you I already found nml. I agree with you. The bottom up approach is great. And we do need to bridge microformats and semantic markup.
- Dorai
Dorai -- if you feel motivated to rethink semantic markup from the ground up, please share whatever ideas come to mind. It's often useful to begin with a simple factual statement like "The capital of France is Paris." What feels like the most natural way for human beings to mark this up for machine-scraping and processing?
- Sean McBride
To answer my own question: #triple[France; capital; Paris] where #triple[*object; *property; *value] and #triple is an NML microformat.
- Sean McBride
Sean, I like the simplicity of triples, but how would you encode/build higher level abstractions. Do objects in a triple have both properties and methods? In many cases, the properties and values will also be objects, correct? They are only properties/values for a particular fact. In an OO sense, how would we encode inheritance, polymorphism, etc?
- Greg GuitarBuster
Greg: can you provide an example of a higher level abstraction that you have in mind? I am fairly certain that NML can easily handle any kind of semantic construct, no matter how complex. Simple building blocks can be combined to create anything one can imagine. Formats can be embedded within formats, to any degree or level of nesting.
- Sean McBride
what if my semantic language is coded #song[*title; *artist] (i.e., artist and title are switched from your examples)? don't we still need a single hierarchy to tell us where everything goes?
- Sean O'Hanley
Sean: in NML (which is just one semantic markup scheme among thousands of possible schemes), formats like "song" are defined with specific slot values and slot orders. By definition, within NML space, the first slot (slot1) in the song format is ARTIST, the second slot (slot2) is TITLE, and the third slot (slot3) is DATE: #song[*artist; *title; *date] Slots are separated by semicolons....
more...
- Sean McBride
thanks, Sean. makes more sense now.
- Sean O'Hanley
The property/value pairs associated with any format (article, book, dissertation, painting, song, etc.) can be expressed in any order, if the property names are explicity stated. The point of the default order/structure is to minimize the number of characters, to simplify the typing of semantic assertions and statements as much as possible. Semantic assertions should be as easy to write as brief natural language notes.
- Sean McBride
Sean, I'm thinking about storing and retrieving facts. Did Clapton play Blackie on Layla? I also have ambiguity, since Layla was recorded multiple times. How can I encode a discography without storing/retrieving multiple, redundant facts
- Greg GuitarBuster
I just noticed that semicolons can be dispensed with when explicitly stating property names: #song[title=Tomorrow artist=Morrissey]. Since no white space is permitted in property names, this statement is easily machine-parsable: "artist" is associated with "=" not "Tomorrow".
- Sean McBride
Greg: #album[Derek and the Dominoes; Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs; 1970 guitarist=Eric Clapton guitarplayed=Brownie] This statement combines default property/value slots for the format ALBUM with explicitly stated property/value slots. Does this seem sensible and intuitive? Are there other issues you have in mind?
- Sean McBride
Greg: dealing with multiple, alternative and redundant statements of the same fact: that is an issue I am thinking about. :) I am fairly certain that if the rules and conventions are articulated clearly enough, variant statements of the same fact can be reduced to a single most simple statement of that fact.
- Sean McBride
Expressing multiple recordings of Layla in NML: #song[*artist; Layla; *date label=*label] Any number of additional property/value pairs can be added to this statement: "producer=*producer" etc. Semantic statements wrapped in NML containers (or wrappers) like #song[] are infinitely extensible with explicitly stated property/value pairs.
- Sean McBride
A key question in designing ultra-simple semantic markup systems: what is the minimum information required to correctly disambiguate and identify any object from all other objects in the universe? How do we get a handle on the object?
- Sean McBride
Building a comprehensive and fine-grained timeline list of Eric Clapton's life with the NML timeline format: #timeline[Eric Clapton; *date; *event] #timeline[Eric Clapton; *date; album by; *title] #timeline[Eric Clapton; *date; song by; *title] #timeline[Eric Clapton; *date; article about; *author; *publication] etc.
- Sean McBride
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