Don't think I have smelled this much fear and anxiety amongst people I interact with on a daily basis for a long while. An awful lot of them now have negative equity, fancy cars they cannot afford and credit debt they cannot pay.
We took care of most of the credit debt a year or two ago, and we don't have fancy cars, but since we bought our house just a little more than a year ago, we have negative equity. It's still scary and frustrating.
- Lindsay
Even if you don't have neg equity, if your neighborhood becomes a foreclosure ghost village, who wants to live there?
- Barbara K. Iverson
from twhirl
Sorry but that's life. If they'd lived within their means, it wouldn't be so bad.
- Morton Fox
Morton, agreed what surprises me that they don't
- Sally Church
Morton, as far as negative equity, in our case it wasn't about not living within our means... we didn't over extend ourselves on the house... it's just that since we bought it it's worth about $80K less than we paid for it. That hurts no matter how you slice it... it wasn't any irresponsibility on our part. How could we have known? And with the way things are going to be reformed we probably couldn't have bought a house a few months from now if we'd waited (because we needed Fannie Mae for downpayment).
- Lindsay
everything you own; everything you owe; it weighs you down. sometimes, if you're not careful, it can pull you under.
- MikeAmundsen
Lindsay: If you can afford the mortgage payments and otherwise didn't overspend, I don't see the problem. What I've heard about some of the extreme cases is they took out home equity loans when home values were high and when that stopped working, they ran up their credit cards to continue living the high life.
- Morton Fox
Tough lesson to learn. Me? No credit card debt. Two cars, neither fancy. One is a 93 Tercel. My past: I was unemployed for 11 months. I've had to take a job I wasn't thrilled with. I didn't see a full-price movie for more than 8 years at one point. I had a three electrical device rule at one time. I save and wait for home prices to become reasonable. I still feel incredibly lucky. That's how I roll.
- AJ Kohn
@Morton: I've heard of folks getting a home equity loan to pay the mortgage!
- AJ Kohn
I think Lindsay's situation points out the fact we should not make quick judgments on those in similar situations. Not everyone is someone who went out and bought a house they could not afford, ran up credit card debts etc.
- R. Ferguson
Morton, we can afford the mortgage payments as long as both of us stay employed. But it hurts that we went from potentially having equity in our home in about 5 years (if it didn't go up in value) to potentially having equity in our home in 10 years or more (if it keeps going down in value). We were looking at our home as an investment that would help us financially in a few years... now it's a noose that we have to balance ourselves very carefully to avoid hanging from.
- Lindsay
lindsay, we're in a similar situation. my husband keeps saying, 'see we shouldn't moved'. but 4 people living in a 575 sf apt. was not working.
- Captain Bubbles
@Anika - we've had that discussion too ("we shouldn't have moved"). We'd considered moving to Seattle to get better jobs earlier this year but we couldn't because we're stuck with this house now. It's totally got us pinned down. And if something happens to our current jobs now we are going to be in a very bad place. We waited almost 11 years to get into a home... It took that long to get in a good enough financial position to make it possible. It's just sad that now it's such a liability.
- Lindsay
Lindsay...yes, same situation for us too. Still, I know that if we had continued on there, our marriage wouldn't have survived. I was close to murderizing everyone!
- Captain Bubbles
Lindsay, really sorry to hear that. You're right, it isn't always something you can control. Hopefully the economy will pick up again soon.
- Sally Church
@Jason - sometimes that's a tall order... Like I said, we've finally gotten out from under our credit card debt now but what first got us into debt? When we moved in together we got into an apartment and needed some basics (a TV, stereo, computer, some modest pieces of furniture, etc) and then we had a new baby. Making a bit more than minimum wage and so it all went on credit. Our apartment was robbed... We had to replace that stuff and still had the debt from the original stuff. Started off wrong foot.
- Lindsay
I'll bet there are a lot of people in that position. Especially if you have kids... they are expensive (and you should know!). And when you're living paycheck to pay check, banks do everything they can to screw you over so you end up with NSF fees... you can't get overdraft protection unless you don't really NEED it. And used to be you couldn't get free checking unless you could have afforded to pay for it either. It's tough to be poor.
- Lindsay
I'm not concerned. I've lived my life a lot like i run my companies: keep overhead and expenses low, run it lean and focus on making money. I have faith. I've fallen into the trap of needing to have only once. Never again.
- Patricia
@Lindsay Sounds like you had some unlucky timing but are going to be able to ride it out. I wouldn't worry too much about the negative equity on your house as long as you are able to pay. It sucks but it's better than renting. When home prices start to climb again you'll be fine.
- Kevin D. White
@Kevin - yeah, I know... as long as our jobs are fine, we'll be fine too... it will just take a LOT longer to realize any benefit from the investment other than having a backyard.
- Lindsay
I never in a million years thought that we'd be relatively okay. No fancy cars, tiny little house, and while we live paycheck to paycheck, we aren't upside down on the house and the mortgage is paid.
- Cyndy
I came to this country with 2 suitcases and 4 boxes, started from scratch with most of my family and friends back in the UK. 10 years on, I still have no credit card or consumer debt, live modestly, own an old '95 Toyota truck and a manageable mortgage on one salary. Life is too short to be stressed out.
- Sally Church
I cast no stones, and the loss of equity value in my own home hurts too ... but I think part of the problem started when we began to see our homes as places of equity instead of places we lived.
- Nadine Schaeffer
@Nadine I think you would have to go very far back in time to find an era when people didn't count their home as an investment.
- Kevin D. White
@Kevin: An investment in your personal well-being and maybe your children, sure. But the whole home equity loan concept, your house as an extra cash account, is a relatively new development, and in my mind, a very bad one.
- Nadine Schaeffer
Or more to the point. You can't call 'time out' when you're President.
- AJ Kohn
press accounts say Obama suggested joint release, McCain jumped w/o him. world leaders seeing that will hardly trust McCain, eh?
- MikeAmundsen
not smart - desparate move by mccain
- Dave Hodson
Agreed (with comments) not a smart move.
- Andrew Baron
and give Obama un-challenged TV time this friday? wow!
- MikeAmundsen
The comment by Obama is exactly right - this is the time people want to hear what the person in charge in a few weeks time is going to do. By all means get involved in solving the problem in Washington, but if you've got a slot to tell the world what you are doing about it on Friday, why hide away instead?
- Richard Peat
Jeremiah I think McC put his foot in the bucket. He's author of a good deal of dereg legislation. He wants delay so he can figure out how to talk his way out of the corner, w/o having his nose grow for the reasons that plagued Pinocchio.
- shelisrael1
One of the clearer points here, why can't McCain do more than one thing at a time? How can he run the country if he can't balance something as simple as a debate with handling his position in the Senate?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
McCain's presence in the Senate will be disruptive at best, while underscoring his lack of understanding of the actual issues of this proposal, furthermore there are no breakdowns in the process, the bill is working in the respective committees and there are concessions on the part of the Administration towards the changes whihc Congress wants made. McCain will only be in the Senate to cast his first vote since April.
- Nathan Eckenrode
I would agree, Jeremiah. McCain has not demonstrated authority on economic matters, so his vote would simply be in support of...
- Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
SOme people will believe anything. "A pox on both their houses"
- Jim Stewart
I think it could also really backfire on McCain. It just makes him look like he's backing out of the debate at the last minute, and he's not willing to include the American people in an authentic discussion on how to solve the economic crisis. It also makes him look like he's hiding behind an elite curtain of world leaders who will solve the crisis for us. People want results at this point, not just spin.
- Cathryn Hrudicka
COP OUT!! he's afraid of the debate and is using the EXCUSE of the economy as a way to bail out of this debate - WEAK knees ... Obama wins!
- Susan Beebe
Obama doesn't understand what the big deal is. He thinks all you have to do is vote "Present" on the bailout and go on campaigning.
- Oldengrey (Jay)
It isn't chickening out to refuse to allow your weaker opponent to call the shots. Kerry tried the same thing in 2004 and Bush, the stronger of the two refused then.
- Internet's Tad
Comments about Obama "not understanding what the big deal is..." and supposedly being the "weaker opponent" sound completely ridiculous, since Obama has been addressing the real issues all along. I guess we're living in parallel universes. I think the U.S. has never resolved the Civil War or the divisions in Christian sects that led to the founding of this country in the first place. Can we ever resolve these divisions?
- Cathryn Hrudicka
Cathryn, I think the "weaker opponent" remark is actually referring to McCain.
- Chieze Okoye
Cath: what do race and religion have to do with this thread? Why frame all issues in terms of identity politics? Aren't you guilty of exactly what you are railing against?
- Oldengrey (Jay)
from fftogo
er jay, when did cath bring up race? she said civil *war* not civil *rights.* reading into things perhaps?
- tiffany
Tiff:Er.. what do you think Cathryn meant when she said resolve the civil war? Secession? And Christian sects? Wineries? What exactly are you trying to parse?Er.. And what does it have to do with the economic crisis and postponing the debate?
- Oldengrey (Jay)
from fftogo
Totally disagree, i think it will be viewed as what it is a .. a delaying tactic, pure and simple politics, why else would they issue campaign talking points around it?
- Steve Mann
from twhirl
Because both sides issue talking points about everything. And now both McCain and Obama are flying back to DC anyway. We'll get more talking points from both about that.
- Oldengrey (Jay)
McCain is losing, is afraid to debate, and there's no way he'll asked that he's now just like Bush.
- Mike Reynolds
McCain is afraid to debate, he's afraid of the press, hides his VP and will never escape that he's now just like Bush.
- Mike Reynolds
Mike: I think you have crystallized the Democratic campaign perfectly. But you forgot ... LIES!
- Oldengrey (Jay)
I'd rather talk about science, education, immigration policy, technology policy, and innovation than all the stuff that's flowed through FriendFeed lately.
- Robert Scoble
thanks for bringing this up. how about both? politics and science - here's a thread to Obama's answers to the 14 science questions - http://bit.ly/2orSkj - i would link to McCain but he hasn't answered the questions yet.
- ~C4Chaos
I'm listening to this video again and realizing just how much I like talking to smart people. This woman (Judy Estrin) is on the board of directors of Walt Disney Co and FedEx. I wish SHE were up for VP!
- Robert Scoble
So why don't you talk about those things, Robert? You have a voice, you can certainly start conversations that you are interested in having.
- Alex Scoble
Alex: watch the video. I talked about those things with Judy for 40 minutes yesterday and am sharing that talk with all of you.
- Robert Scoble
yeah, thanks for posting the vid and elevating the discussion. i do enjoy listening to smart people. that's why i ride with FORA.tv - http://fora.tv/myfora/c4chaos :)
- ~C4Chaos
One way to drive innovation out of your country is to suppress research funding in certain areas in an effort to appease religious groups. The research will continue.... elsewhere.
- stretta
from twhirl
What is intriguing to me is how FriendFeed and other social networks will or won't impact this election,
- Lorraine Ball
Robert, if I could give you a 5 star rating on Friendfeed, I would. Great work!
- Mike Lewis
@Brian, exactly. that's why as cool as the Chevy Volt is, i can't shake the feeling that it's a product of hypocrisy -- 12 years later and they can only show a hybrid car with half the mileage of EV1 which is pure electric? please. for more context see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- ~C4Chaos
Brian: our corporations reward people who look at this quarter and next. That's where that kind of thinking came from. Alex is the smarter of my two brothers. But he's also a bit more argumentative. Ben is a charmer. He's done very well in business because he understands how to get people to like him.
- Robert Scoble
Robert I like your expertise in this area of innovation. You have a keen talent for it and an good eye. Your article sparked thoughts for me as well. I'm a connection seer. I see connections sometimes where some don't and this challenges me to explain them. And when I read your article I thought of Mozart. His symphonies are perfectly balanced: if you take anything away or add to it, they are diminished. This is how I see the human race and one of the reasons I see the challenge to innovation is...
- Melanie Reed
Actually, IQ wise, Ben is the smartest of all of us from what mom told me. He does say some really odd things in political discussions though.
- Alex Scoble
threatened. The human race is like that Mozart symphony; you can't diminish it, remove notes as with people, without innovation being lost. There is our potential thinking ability as an organism that has now been compromised when we do that. Could this be a factor in why the problems go unsolved longer than they need to or resolution missed entirely?
- Melanie Reed
Alex: you might check that out. I remember Mom saying you were smartest.
- Robert Scoble
@Alex and @Robert Well, I don't know you all but from what you've said here on this board and you ALL seem pretty darn smart in your own unique ways!! Very glad of you, each one. :)
- Melanie Reed
If I'm the smartest we are all doomed...DOOMED I say!
- Alex Scoble
liked it so much it was worth its own blog entry, now if he could help me with the education bit, that would be great. It is not a matter of politics, it is a matter of systemic change, education, business and politics to help out here.
- Dan Morrill AKA Techwag
People would rather have cheap, throw away products with short-lifecycles than spend money on something homegrown, invented, prototyped and manufactured in the U.S. If either party were to attempt to legislate tax benefits to businesses to transition to that they would face a funding drought. The tax system, Visa system, trade and tariff systems are corrupt. While on the surface they are helping business, dig deeper and you will see a master/servant relationship between business and legislators.
- Greer Trice
Go back to Scoble's interview with Chandrakant Patel at HP Labs. See what he said about innovation, sustainability and life beyond the next tweet. http://scobleizer.com/2008...
- Greer Trice
Revise our ridiculous patent laws and ENFORCE copyright statue of limitations. See Disney. More federal funding of 'Innovation Centers' (previously called Universities). Tax incentives to corporations that release products that innovate standards and offer royalty free utility to start-ups.
- Ryan
Science, technology and innovation? Ya mon, me too!
- Sally Church
Oh, Robert... you and your reverse psychology.... ;)
- Lindsay
This already IS a topic that's widely discussed. There are entire blogs and lobby groups devoted to this political topic. I'm all about not talking about the sex lives of 17 year olds as a substitute for political discourse, but to make *this* your "real issue that no one's talking about" is just ignorant. Both presidential candidates have talked about innovation policy. Repeating the book's marketing that it's an under-attended topic is akin to blindly reprinting press releases.
- Mark "Rizzn" Hopkins
I think the threat of a Russian attack on our networks is a far more important issue than intellectual property rights ATM. >.>
- pitlord
from twhirl
http://changethis.com/49... - 14 ways to get breakthrough ideas: "There's a lot of talk these days--especially in business circles--about the importance of innovation. All CEOs worth their low salt lunch want it. And they want it, of course, now. Innovation, they reason, is the competitive edge."
- Justin Long
total likebait. but it is the way i end up finding people to follow on here.
- Jason Goldberg
let me put it differently, i seldom use the "find people to follow" functionality, so the way i discover people is by interacting with them.
- Jason Goldberg
I only hit like to expose this to everyone else. Jason and SocialMedian rock and I've been on record saying that since April.
- Louis Gray
well, and i just found a bunch of new people to follow from this post ... cool!
- Jason Goldberg
No ego problem... I am doing technologiy watch here... So no need to follow me...
- Boubacar Balde
from twhirl
If someone *likes* something I submit, it's a great indication that I might want to follow them. If they leave a sharp comment, even better.
- Jason Goldberg
people interaction is part of the core of FF
- Olivier
Must not click like... must not click like... damn.
- Eric P
+1 Oliver. The interaction on FF is what I love the most. More in depth and on topic interacton than is available on fail whale central.
- DO ANYBODY NO MONIQUE
unintended consequences: i really WAS NOT looking for people to *like* this particular story. Rather, i was pointing out that liking or commenting on something i post is certainly the best way to get my attention to follow you
- Jason Goldberg
Sorry Jason, but the more entertaining interpretation of why you posted this message is the one that will live on. You'll have no more luck getting the facts out than Gore did for the "I invented the Internet" lie. Reality just isn't funny enough.
- Bruce Lewis
from fftogo
You see Bruce, that's why I need to be able to add a *like* to your comment :)
- Jason Goldberg
Alright, I "liked" a bunch of things. =)
- Jauder Ho
No. I think Friendfeed has a lot to offer for non-geeks. Just not in it's current early stages (swamped with tech).
- Mo Kargas
You mean that normal people have no clue how to process information or work efficiently and be happy with offerings of the like of facebook while geeks do not enjoy as much normal everyday stuff normal people enjoy? Absolutly.
- Nicole Simon
Facebook is online presence for [mostly] non-online people. FriendFeed is for those who are able to appreciate the steady flow of information online, mostly geeks. Grasping the concept takes too much time for a non-geek ;-) I agree.
- Lech
What if you have both? Am I a geekier version of everyone else?
- Shannon
agree until i can only see the people i've added to my friend list and not friends of friends information then i doubt anyone else will care.
- Jonathan Jesse
What if you use the FF application from within Facebook?
- Mike Boudreaux
from fftogo
Isn't Facebook trying to *be* Friendfeed these days with the new look? I agree here, though, my non-web-wired friends and family are on FB, but not FF :(
- Michael Pick
from twhirl
in the same way as computers _used to be_ for geeks, agree
- Dani Radu
Facebook is for women. Most men will just keep in touch with friends on an ad-hoc basis -- and we're happy enough with that. And what's with all this Relationship Barometer crap, or whatever its called? That's just kooky imo. Like I'm going to advertise the fact that 'Its Complicated'. Rubbish.
- john conroy
I check Facebook regularly and last I checked I wasn't a woman!
- Joe Dawson
Somewhat agree. Facebook has indeed become mainstream, while FriendFeed is currently populated by early-adopters (which many read as "geeks").
- Nick Mutton
FriendFeed is an aggregator and conversation spot for the open Web (which is under attack). Google can get to everything here. It can't get to everything in Facebook. Another way to recast it? FriendFeed is for everyone who wants to be public. Facebook is for everyone who wants to support a walled garden. There's more than geeks here, by the way. Do you want proof? Do some searches. Here's one for quilting: http://beta.friendfeed.com/search...
- Robert Scoble
I'll pay that one Robert, there's more geeks here for now. Do you think it will ever expand out to non-geeks?
- Mo Kargas
for now yes. Was facebook for geeks when they only had 100k users?
- Ouriel Ohayon
At least I can share a link from FriendFeed with everyone. Can you do that with Facebook?
- Orli Yakuel
WOW, I never knew I was a Geek....good to know.
- Scot Duke
Agree-I find more sophisticated users here, myspace seems so highschoolish for me always has.
- orionstarr
as for the being public issue: people in FB really share everything, and indeed this happens mostly because they're 'non-online' 'low-tech' or whatever you may call them. people in FF still think are in a protected fence since it's geekier and not mainstream yet. the question is: how much do we care about google when we feel we are in a group of friends (or birds of the same feather anyway)?
- Elvira
facebook is for college students, myspace is for entertainment, linkedIn is for business, friendfeed is an experiment
- paisley
from twhirl
Myspace is a dive bar - more fun if you're there for the music or have tattoos and are kind of slutty. Facebook is the posh bar everyone wants to get into - it used to be invite only but now they killed the cover and are letting everyone in. Friendfeed is the LAN party in someone's basement........
- George Smith
I'm really a non-geek. I'm more comfortable with the user interface on Facebook. But, of course, I just used the term "user interface" on FriendFeed -- so maybe I need to rethink my possible geeky-tude.
- Cheryl Rice
I was hoping FF rooms would provide a good way to have conversations focused on non-tech topics, but so far they don't seem to be taking off much.
- Costa Walcott
I'm using Friendfeed in Facebbok so I'm everyone else's geek!
- Mike Lewis
There is so little parallel functionality, I wonder why there is the pervasive insistence to group these two together. So, disagree.
- jcunwired
I disagree, cause of the fact that there's no FunWalls, SuperWalls doesn't mean it can't go mainstream in the near future.
- Tibor Holoda
I use facebook, twitter and friendfeed and linkedin too - what does that make me? A friend to be followed, requested, added to your network maybe...
- Julie Watt
disagree: if "geek" stands for complicated and difficult to use, facebook wins over ff
- FedericaB.
FriendFeed is for paople I don't know. Facebook is for my immediate real friends. I put my geeky stuff on FriendFeed/Twitter, etc...and for personal stuff with my more generic friend audience, I put appropriate content on Facebook.
- Todd
I don't consider myself a geek, but I love FF.
- ::Kristen::
geeks->multiple and extensive online presence and usages->need to aggregate->FF
- Hayk H.
youth and simple folk-> some usage of the Internet-> need to communicate-> some platform where everyone is-> Facebook
- Hayk H.
Disagree. Friendfeed is for everyone. We geeks have a strong presence here, but there are non-geek communities as well. I suppose if you don't know any non-geeks on friendfeed, you won't see many at all. The problem lies in the fact that many non-geeks THINK that friendfeed is for geeks. If more non-geeks came over, those communities would grow. Now, do I win a prize for saying "geeks" the most times in a comment?
- Slippy "WildBeard" Lane
Disagree. Friendfeed is for real-time topical conversation and more. Facebook is to connect, introduce, sneaky e-mail .... (and not play Scrabble)
- Charlie Anzman
i would categorize friendfeed as thought and opinion exchange, while facebook is for networking purposes..
- Stefan Lafloer
Nope, this geek still isn't into Friendfeed. Facebook gets used (finally) with connecting with my RL friends, as well as social media ones, and reconnecting with folks from high school, college and previous places I've worked. Facebook = social exchanges and Friendfeed = idea exchanges and media sharing. But I still rarely use Friendfeed as I find the interface too cumbersome. Back to Twitter.....
- Rob Usdin
"6. Stealth Kiwi - If you’re not big on self control, let Stealth Kiwi do it for you. It blocks all “recreational” websites, but allows you to take a 10 minute break every hour. (GreaseMonkey)" --Hey, Alan? Is that what you were using to block FF? LOL
- Mona Nomura
I keep telling myself that I need to organize my bookmarks better on delicious. I still never get around to it.
- Rob Diana
@Rob organize your bookmarks? In what way? I just tag them as I make them and if my tagging scheme fails on lookup (usually does the job 90% of the time) then the search on Del.icio.us works fine...
- Lindsay
My diigo bookmarks are a hot mess LOL Sorry to the people who've added me =|
- Mona Nomura
look at FF once a day for only 10 minutes...
- Pokai
but I don't WANT to be productive when I'm online. I'm online because I'm trying NOT to be productive.
- Nine
But Nine, what if your work IS online... :|
- Mona Nomura
It is online, actually... but I still prefer wasting time.
- Nine
As far as organizing the most used icons on Windows, forget the desktop, I really like Rocketdock. Gives you that Mac dockbar feel. And it's free too.
- TDavid
If I still used a Windows Machine TDavid, I will totally use Rocketdock :) Thank you for your input.
- Mona Nomura
I don't see the point of icons now that I use a Desktop Launcher. My desktop is blank.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
rocketdock just changed my whole game up...thanks TDavid!
- joshuabacker
See? THIS is why I LOVE FriendFeed :)
- Mona Nomura
Lindsay, I try to be organized, which means I use tags similarly to folders. The problem is that I also tend to be lazy and use existing tags that I already have. So my tags become useless. Sometimes I like to browse through my bookmarks to see if there is something I want to re-read as well.
- Rob Diana
"At Maker Faire earlier this year, Robert Bruce Thompson gave a talk (video unfortunately truncated at both ends) that highlighted how attitudes towards chemistry have changed since he was a kid, starting with a tour of the powerful chemistry sets available in 1964 (courtesy of the Sears Catalog), and tracing the dumbing down and rising fear of liability that doomed them, until, as Kevin Kelly noted in a recent review of Robert's book, we reached "the so-called chemistry sets today which boldly (and insanely) advertise they contain 'No Chemicals!'" Why are we failing at math and science? Because it isn't fun any more. When you put safety on the highest altar, what do you give up? When fear of lawsuits -- not to mention fear of technology -- drives product design, marketing, and public policy, you eliminate science at its roots, in the natural experimentation of kids who want to know how the world works."
- Paul Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
Excellent point that I had not considered in the declining interest in math and science. You can't study science because it's "not safe", and why study math if you can't relate it to real, good hands-on science?
- Kevin L
feels like i've been reading that the usa (and england) has been failing at math and science since i was a boy
- Bill de hÓra
Bill, it's true. The American education system has been gutted. It blows my mind what qualifies for classes these days; it's certainly nothing like it was when I was a kid. Kids are taught only what is necessary for them to pass nationwide, standardized achievement tests. They're not trained for adulthood at all. Balance a bank account? Better learn that at home because you're not going to be taught that at school. It's embarrassing.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Bill: Yeah. Every year in August there is a huge hoohaa over grades and pass marks. The number of students taking ANY of the sciences comes up every year without fail. The decining number of nuclear physicists, for example graduating from UK institutions is going to make the governments nuclear program more difficult.
- Roberto Bonini
"The guy got off the phone and asked 'you're not making any drugs down here are you?" I said no!! He smiled - he winked at my parents. Then he said the most unexpected thing: he said the gang at the labs offered to give me a tour of the labs anytime I wanted."
- Clare Dibble
The same discussion happens over here in the UK on a regular basis - particularly when the exam results come out in August.
- Andy Davies
akiva, "balance a bank account" that's another matter - very little math is more important than compound interest, practically speaking ;)
- Bill de hÓra
I wouldn't blame it on incidents like this. Most of the developing countries (like Taiwan, Singapore, etc) have excellent Math & Science education, despite the fact that most students in school have zero access to chemicals, labs, or any interesting equipment whatsoever. Those countries are usually even more restrictive on random experimentation. The real reason Math & Science isn't emphasized in the US is that we glorify other paths to success (business, or reality TV shows, or being an athlete, etc.)
- Piaw Na
I don't think this article has much to do with the real failure in our schools (elementary, middle, high school) to teach kids basic math and science, and more importantly, to make it INTERESTING.
- Neha Narula
Well, here in the USSR (when it still was) things were pretty restricted, but the 'Young chemist' set still contained everything from hydrochloric acid to kalium permanganate to Prussian blue and more exotic (nowdays) substances a kid with an itch could use to blast or poison if not half a block than at least the neighbor's apartment. There weren't any accidents widely reported :)
- Cozy geta
the wedding picture. the guy on the horse statue in the water fountain. omg. hilarious.
- Christine Lu
Sorry - Tad's been busy CODING. I only photobomb any photos lindsay's trying to take... and i do that all the time until she punches me... and then a couple times more.
- Internet's Tad
Dude, so what'll happen if photobombers take a group picture? Imagine me, you, Chris P in a picture together? Wow. Terrible.
- Mona Nomura
my favourite is the one with the toilet paper in the foreground -- if you've already got a roll of tp in the frame, why not photobomb it?
- Trent Olson
With the last message you sent, I'd say you can safely ignore now. Send GMails to the trash, unread. Delete phone messages, unheard. It's better for your sanity.
- Ontario Emperor
from fftogo
Totally agree. Don't even bother replying or acknowledging the communication. Thats one of the greatest benefits of the web and electronic communication.
- Adam Helweh
Louis, you are crazybrave going public with this. The one thing Stalkers thrive on is attention. You're always better off ignoring them then recognizing them publicly.
- Duncan Riley
I vote crazy, Duncan. As mentioned before, I felt it was time to use this as an example. I did what I could to take their name out, and they're not visible enough that most will figure out who it is. It's a case of an otherwise good person who probably gets most things right taking this to an extreme.
- Louis Gray
Definitely long past time to ignore in every way/shape/form. Hopefully they start taking their meds and you don't hear from them again.
- cjmart
Should definitely been more of a hardass with him. There's a fine line between some 14 year old in a chat room and an entrepreneur these days. You should have said about 3 interactions in, "If you contact me again my lawyer will be in contact" and when they did get the lawyer to deal. No benefit in being nice guy to wackos. Really. Or send Scoble round to his house via N95/Qik.
- ben barren
Very disturbing behavior indeed. The Borderline Personality disorder is probably quite an accurate assessment. That just gave me the creeps, but thank you for sharing, veronicaromm
- veronicaromm
It's a valuable cautionary tale. Hopefully this individual will give you some peace now.
- Mark Dykeman
I think Louis reached breaking point .. thats why he posted. Firstly, he's post is like letting steam off on this engagement. secondly, theres a lesson for ALL of us in that post. All that glitter is not gold. On the Net every1 a dog. The real questions which ones are the nice puppy dawgs and which ones are the real vicious ones :)-
- Peter Dawson
Damn. I guess this means my guest blogging stint is over. :(
- Cyndy
He must believe every Louis Gray Fact is true.
- Shawn Farner
I guess my mother was right when she told me not to talk to strangers :-/
- LouCypher
That was very creepy behavior. I can't believe it went on so long. I couldn't have been that nice.
- Bryan Clark
Cyndy, having it be you would have been a delight. :-) (Hi, Jason)
- Louis Gray
I had a similar experience a couple of years ago -- but this is really intense. persistant and weird. I feel creeped out just seeing your post -- can't imagine how you must feel -- though writing it all down must have some positive cleansing effect
- Brian Sullivan
huh, kind of eery, since i use "I hope all is well." in most messages i send to friends i haven't spoken with lately... this reminds me of an issue a teacher of mine had in high school with a female student. He ended up printing out each and every correspondance from her, which filled a binder, whereas his responses barely needed a folder. It put an extreme amount of stress on him and...
more...
- Kyle A Koch
I route the phone through GrandCentral to remove that possibility and then send addresses to blacklists. Now Facebook? I hardly go there anymore
- Chris Miller
i hope all is well, louis, but after further consideration i've decided not to offer you the position. sorry.
- Deva Hazarika
Wow, that is totally crazy and scary. Definitely the darker side of the social web right there. YIKES. Sorry to hear about that.
- Sarah Perez
Kyle brings up the crazy student-teacher interactions and why high school teachers are sometimes staying off Facebook. When I was a head teaching assistant at UCLA, here are two tidbits. (1) Most professors marry former students (2) One student sued a school, not because the teacher was harrassing her, but because of "unfair treatment" because the teacher was dating another student.
- Mitchell Tsai
My teacher friends have had students "stalk" them. One may have lost his high school job because the student who was rejected then claimed harrassment - he won in court, but the school still fired him - Unfair! I've been on the receiving end of too much attention... and I had a male college dean sexually pressure me (Didn't realize it at first... Then threatened not to approve an official request of mine to drop a class).
- Mitchell Tsai
I made the mistake of publishing similar "logs" (experience) I had with "stalkers" and it only made things worst...
- Czar
Are you taking volunteers for a new stalker? I guess I can step up if you don't get any better offers.
- Bryan Clark
wow, split-personality disorder is creepy online...
- Morgan
@Chris yeah, the stalker is typically looking for more attention - any communications are seen as an offer for that person to continue to "reopen communications" between him/herself and Louis. Publicizing the communications may actually lead to an elevated level of harassment. What you really need to do is cut off all contact as early as possible. Don't respond to anything, because they really are looking for attention. The authoritative work on this subject is The Gift of Fear by Gavin De Becker.
- Steve Lynch
Wow, I just read about your experience--sorry. I think it serves as a good reminder for everyone to be at least slightly guarded. Inappropriate boundaries and people are certainly present in all forms of communication.
- Anna Haro
Although I agree that housing is in a slump, it's important for SOMEONE to try to help the consumer confidence. The truth is that if you are a buyer in today's market you are going to get a great deal. If you're an investor in this market, you're going to get RICH.
- Jonathan.Rivera
Only and ONLY if this is the bottom. Otherwise you have to plan on holding the property for YEARS to break even
- Dave Wirsching
from twhirl
I see where you're coming from on the retail side Dave, but I believe if you buy a property today and it cash flows, then the value doesn't matter as much as the cash throw off.
- Jonathan.Rivera