One candidate got a C in macroeconomics. “That’s troubling to me,” Ms. Mayer says. “Good students are good at all things. - http://fredwilson.vc/post...
That quote bothers me. I got C's in certain subjects due to lack of interest in them and A's in some subjects because of super easy profs. Neither of those two outliers determines how "good" I am at one thing or another.
- EricaJoy
I thought this article was a bit bizarre, actually. I understand the format of a profile piece, but why are women engineers and business leaders not evaluated by the same milestones that their counter parts are? Why talk at such length about her lifestyle choices? Why oversimplify key aspects of her success, like her design choices, and write so little about her product development strategy, product's objectives and whether or not her management approach has lead the company in the right direction?
- Megan
It is interesting how different perceptions of Marissa Mayer are among Google employees and among outsiders.
- Kevin
Good students are good at all things? If that's the case, why do we have a major system in US universities? Why are physics students not always good at literature, or philosophy students not always good at chemistry? Jack hole...
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
If I was hiring for a technical job and someone got a C in micro, I might think twice. But macro may as well be philosophy.
- LogEx
I always thought the grades and test scores obsession at Google was kind of dumb. Unfortunately, in the absence of good metrics, people latch on to poor ones (see Alexa stats for example).
- Paul Buchheit
Why does anybody at Google care about grades and test scores?
- Gabe
I can see why grades would be important. You can establish that someone is brilliant with tests and interviews, but you can't establish whether or not someone is diligent. Grades will tell you a lot about whether or not the very smart person in front of you is willing to use their abilities on a consistent basis.
- Andrew
I think if you put a lot of time an energy into getting perfect grades, you come to believe that it must be important. I think it's a sign of lack of creativity :).
- Paul Buchheit
Chris, as someone who got more than one C during my college career, I definitely agree that your grades don't show what you can do in your professional career. :)
- Andrew
Paul: I got C's and D's in high school but got a 1490 on the SAT, third highest in my class. Our counselor was mad at me for not doing better in class. Looking back at it I just hated learning out of a book.
- Robert Scoble
This is just plain wrong in so many ways. A focus solely on academic achievement completely ignores the other aptitudes and forms of intelligence (e.g., E.Q) needed to succeed in life. In my business we say: the A students make good law professors, the B students make good judges, and the C students make the most practical lawyers.
- V Mary Abraham
Paul's probably right here. But in all fairness, the article doesn't really say what position they were considering. It might be relevant for a more business-related position where a technical interview isn't useful.
- Gabe
Lindsey, it is a useful quote. But, based on the completely unscientific sample of my life, I've got to say that my grades were ok and I did have the benefit of some interesting experiences, but the things that have really proven useful in my professional life are the capabilities that weren't really trained or measured in school.
- V Mary Abraham
While I completely agree with the statements about overemphasizing academic achievement, especially several years after school, let's not use this as an excuse for children not to work hard in school. It's bad enough kids think education is not important anymore (especially in this country)
- Deepak Singh
I would assume Ms. Mayer is using personal criteria based on her own success to evaluate others. While not perfect, it is what she understands.
- Floyd Davenport
Did not finish High School, went to collage as a mature student at 23, did not finish college (one English credit short). My yearly income is higher then anyone I know (less my accountant and lawyer). School and grades is not everything. I did learn a lot and will always tell people to stay in school as long as posable. When I look at people that want to work for me I look at the resume, job references, and there ability to engage and communicate with me.
- walterh
Google doesn't seem to understand that what someone did between the ages of 18-22 doesn't always equate to what they will accomplish later in life.
- Tom Wentworth
Interesting point, Deepak, although as we've discussed before, I believe, school does not equal education. A lot of people smarter than I have gotten worse grades than I simply because they weren't willing to do the busy work. When it comes to something they are interested in, though, they run laps around me and I can't keep up. In a stimulating environment, which Google is supposed to create, I imagine these types would be extremely productive.
- Chris Lasher
Chris, you hit the nail on the head though. It's not the grades. It is the hard work. Which is why I'd take you over them :)
- Deepak Singh
Oh, no, I'm sure my C in Epidemiology means I'm not the least bit qualified to be advising anyone on what PDA phone to purchase.
- MiniMage, sheeple of FF
That makes no sense personally to me ... especially when you consider entrepreneurial folks. Very much like your post
- Mrinal Desai
It seems likely to me that grades from an elite US/ European/ Indian university are an excellent proxy for productivity in an environment like google. Good grades tend to be the result of intelligence and the ability to internalize an institutional value system. Google does end up accessing different sorts of intellects when they hire developers of successful open source projects or other well established engineering track records.
- Zaki Manian
It is a rather telling comment: more about Ms. Mayer and her pedestrian viewpoint than the truth about Grades. Many of the brainiest and innovative thinkers in history were autodidacts. So much for chalkboard races and test deadlines. At least we are getting to the point were the American educational system has some idea of metrics for experiential learning with learning matrix and ePortifolios. But I'm not holding my breath waiting for an Erasmus methodology renaissance. :)
- Melanie Reed
It's troubling to me that Google screwed up JotSpot and Dodgeball. Good companies are good at all things.
- Bill Seitz
I'm troubled that YoYo Ma doesn't play the piano better.
- Bill Seitz
Sounds like baloney has a new first name.
- Bill Seitz
This really bugged me when I read it to. David Letterman got straight Cs in college. Einstein was a mess in school. Some of history's brightest minds were terrible students. What an incredibly moronic way to hire and promote people. Explains exactly why Google isn't very attractive as an employer to me.
- Kevin Goldsmith
from twhirl
I don't know anything about Google, but I imagine it really depends on what field you're going into. My grades continued to matter for a ridiculous amount of time. It's taken for granted that you'd been getting As and Bs and high test scores all your life, and everyone you're competing with is getting As and Bs, too. A C would require some explaining. From K-12, I can understand boredom, but in college, why would you take a class that you weren't interested in so that you ended up not doing well?
- Victor Ganata
Of course, I can see the angle that people who have always striven to get high grades tend to overvalue the importance of grades. But there's not much you can do when they're exclusively the people who interview you, except choose another field.
- Victor Ganata
And in a field where everyone did well in school, it becomes all too clear that grades and test scores don't necessarily measure intelligence. They're more a measure of your willingness to jump through hoops to reach a distant goal.
- Victor Ganata
@Victor In college the classes you weren't interested in were called Required and/or "core" classes.
- EricaJoy
@Erica I guess I was lucky. The college I went to for undergrad gave us huge leeway in what courses we could take to fulfill those requirements and I guess I never realized that other colleges aren't as flexible.
- Victor Ganata
@Bill very witty. very pretty. :) Thanks for the chuckle!
- Melanie Reed
@Victor I'm intrigued. What university, if I may ask, did you go to? I want to start my life over and go there!:)
- Melanie Reed
@Melanie I went to Berkeley. I think all the University of California schools are similarly flexible, though.
- Victor Ganata
I'm troubled by her comment too. In my view, if you get all As, then you aren't pushing yourself hard enough. There is a time to take the safe road, but I think taking the safe road is at odds with getting a good education. Sometimes taking a C is necessary so you can really devote yourself to something you are kicking-ass in.
- Erik S