Am J Clin Pathol. 2009 Dec; 132(6): 824-8 Schreiber WE, Giustini DM In the past few years, the term Web 2.0 has become a descriptor for the increased functionality of Web sites, including those with medical content. Most physicians do not know what Web 2.0 means or how it can impact their work lives. This review provides some background on the evolution of Web 2.0 and describes how its features are being incorporated into medical Web sites. Some potential applications of Web 2.0 in pathology and laboratory medicine are discussed, as are the issues that must be considered when adopting this new technology.
Thank you to everyone who helped and encouraged on this and offered future support! Among many things, one thing I'm a bit embarrassed about is the lack of details in the "broader impacts" and open science parts of the proposal. Definitely it needs more planning and better writing, and the panelists are going to point that out. Hopefully you all understand that it's a product of spending all my time trying to make the research parts as good as I could.
- Steve Koch
Thanks everyone! I sort of dropped off the map after submitting the proposal. One of my most successful attempts at actually vacating during a vacation.
- Steve Koch
Bummer! Just found out tonight that the proposal was not funded. I have done one read-through of the reviews. First of all, I am once again amazed at the time and effort the reviewers put into reviewing my proposal. There were 6 reviewers in total and they all had a page or more of feedback. And they all pretty much agreed on the main points: (a) interesting proposal that is worth...
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- Steve Koch
Thank you Jean-Claude, Andy, Cameron, and Drew for the Open Science support letters! I am sure that was key to the very positive reviews for Open Science. Thank you to everyone else on friendfeeed who supports me and our other lab members. We now have 7 months to obtain the preliminary data and get a couple publications, and indeed we are now poised to do so. I am confident the lab members can do this, and by eliminating (b) and (c) above, all signs point towards this being a very strong proposal next time.
- Steve Koch
well done all 'round! next time you'll knock 'em dead.
- D0r0th34
for the CAREER third time is often the charm - good luck for next round
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Thanks, Jean-Claude and Dorothea. The CAREER "3rd time's a charm" effect is part of the reason I submitted without strong preliminary data. (But I also thought we'd be able to generate the data in time for the 2nd submission. Now, though, I'm SURE we can before July :) )
- Steve Koch
After thinking about it for a couple days now, I am still very happy that they viewed the open science so positively. I think that's a big deal.
- Steve Koch
absolutely Steve - very good feedback about OS being a positive to the funders
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Steve, this looks really really promising. If you can come up with interesting data for the next resubmit, I think you have a great chance to get funded. Congratulations!
- Bill Hooker
I checked these out before Thanksgiving -- I really liked the Motorola Droid, but didn't like the $600/year it would add to my monthly bill.
- Mickey Schafer
The crazy thing is he said Verizon had a deal where it was $200 for the phone with a $100 rebate and unlimited service was $30/mo for 2 years. Sounded like a good deal to me!
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
That is insanely good -- I wonder if I should've waited until Black Friday or Cyber Monday!
- Mickey Schafer
But...is that $30/mo in addition to the basic plan? Because that's what it was for me...the grand total coming to nearly $600/year. I see that Cameron has the Android...
- Mickey Schafer
Yay! I <3 you forever! (Could you add the straight-up small orange open-access one? I know it doesn't advertise PLoS, but you'd still get a kickback, yeah?)
- D0r0th34
How do I know these were rigorously peer-reviewed... :)
- Benjamin Tseng
Feel free to do your own post-manufacture peer-review. Then post a comment, note or rating. ;-)
- Bora Zivkovic
i picked up a little orange open access button (no PLOS printed on it) at last year's science blogging conf, i think.
- Christina Pikas
yup, it's possible to get 'em, but you have to go through one of the custom button companies. I'm lazy. I want one-click ordering. :)
- D0r0th34
the URL for this post says "rigorously pee." I giggled.
- mjc
Everything we do should be rigorous!
- Bora Zivkovic
Hmm. I've got about 40 OA buttons left:- http://www.flickr.com/photos... After a quick rummage through, I can scientifically confirm that there are 14 of the straight-up small orange open-access ones:- http://www.flickr.com/photos... D, I'll see if I can teleport these to you directly.
- Graham Steel
+1 Graham Goggles and capes ala XKCD's Doctorow cartoon would be of perhaps niche interest, I suppose.
- Mr. Gunn
Was browsing through the PLoS store last nicht (Scottish for night) and I could not work out what to buy. Looking again today, there are 18 pages to stroll through. I can however exclusively report that Mum & Dad just bought me this PLoS Hamsters hoodie http://www.zazzle.com/hoodie_... for my birthday tomorrow. Nice.
- Graham Steel
"Thank you for your Zazzle order. The following items have been queued for shipment: Hoodie (Dark) - Basic Hooded Sweatshirt, Navy Blue, Adult L"
- Graham Steel
w00t! I also bought a couple of things myself today, to give as presents.
- Bora Zivkovic
For some reason, Ive always wanted a Hamsters Love PLoS thingy. Having considered the options, and whilst I sure ain't "a Hoodie" from the UK perspective:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... I am well lookin' forward to wearing this purchasement. All of my OA garments are t-shirts. A warm winter sweatshirt (hood an option) plus that logo was 'I can haz' :-)
- Graham Steel
Can PLoS make some Hobermann spheres with toy hamster inside? :)
- Shirley Wu
from twhirl
I am still waiting for a P2P search engine... use my FOAF network to find me stuff, and use FOAF-SSL to allow my peers to use my machine as search node...
- Egon Willighagen
It's amazing to me that it's been so long since Google kicked everyone's ass in search that they've forgotten why it happened in the first place. Paid placement sucks. People don't want it. When Google appeared, they appeared during the days of crappy search "portals" like Yahoo and Altavista. Google was a clear winner precisely because they didn't play that game. I can't believe MS actually thinks they can go back to that and have any success at all.
- Mr. Gunn
Do you have any ability to get them to change the regrettable name?
- Mr. Gunn
Are these supposed to be original content or will you accept some cross posting?
- Jean-Claude Bradley
May I also suggest that hyperbole such as "The biggest scientific network in the world with 180,000 members!" should probably be toned down so that things like this http://bit.ly/4kpy47 don't keep happening.
- Mr. Gunn
Mr. Gunn, I don't think I have any ability for that. Jean-Claude: the main purpose is to have original content but I'm sure there will be some cross-posting as well.
- Berci Mesko, MD
Definitely time for me to take a new close look at Research Gate. Should have done it months ago.
- Cameron Neylon
thanks Berci - I'll bounce some posts on you when I think they might fit
- Jean-Claude Bradley
+1 daniel. In all fairness I'll also have another look at ResearchGate, but to me, the only useful science community has been biomed experts: http://www.biomedexperts.com/ (also reviewed in NGS)
- Nils Reinton
I'd like these guys more if they didn't tout their membership numbers. It's very off-putting.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Berci - Sorry if I sounded cranky above. I'm hoping with a respected member of the community like you on board, you can help them develop the promise, get a better sense of what the community really wants, and maybe tone down the slightly over-the-top promotional stuff a little.
- Mr. Gunn
I think those who received the invitation from Google itself got 20 invites to give (there is a wave with them). People invited by a regular user that had invitations can't invite others.
- Bruno C. Vellutini
I'd actually do something with it if I had an account :P I guess I do have a thesis defense coming up in 2 months though...
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
maybe we should collect the existing science related wave plugins/robots or how do you call it, and some new ideas. and start to develop them after receiving our invites :)
- Endre Sebestyen
Just read somewhere that invites will be available at 4pm BST. Didn't check sources, though.
- Jan Aerts
100,000 invites sounds like a lot but worldwide soon thins out :(
- Anthony Underwood
@Jan if you get the invite and you happen to have some invites as well, consider me please
- george
Word on the street is that only existing wave users will get invites. The new invitees won't get any.
- Chris Miller
Chris: But they did post that about the three groups of people that'll receive invites. *sigh*
- RK
Me, too! I'll offer a drawing in return!
- Kamilah Gill
Cameron: Where did you read that? If it's true then there's hope after all :D
- RK
Various things going around on Twitter and in wave suggesting that the release will be at 9am PST which would be 4pm UK time I guess but I would give that the status of rumour rather than fact. Haven't seen any convincing info that anyone has a new invite yet.
- Cameron Neylon
from twhirl
Cameron: Yea. Saw it on Brizzly too. Anybody got an invite? Should be out now :)
- RK
FWIW - sounds like invites won't be out until this evening, so that the Sydney-based googlers will be awake to troubleshoot. http://twitter.com/twephan...
- Chris Miller
Yep - all information I have suggests tomorrow morning Sydney time. Even if we assume they are in at 6am thats still some hours away yet. I'm off to bed me-self.
- Cameron Neylon
from twhirl
I'm told that once you even get an invite it can take a couple days for the activation email to arrive. I wonder what email would be like now if they had required invites back in the day...
- Paul J. Davis
Will you keep working with/for LabSpaces when you come to UF for your post-doc?
- Mickey Schafer
Haha, well, I hand coded it all by myself for a year before it went live, and now I've been running it all by my lonesome for 3 years, so yeah, I'll probably keep up with it ;) I can't bear to let all of that time and effort sit idle, even if I only get 100k pageviews a month :(
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
glad to hear it, Brian. I've enjoyed my forays into LabSpaces -- seriously, it's been as good a read as Science News.
- Mickey Schafer
Wow. Turned my Thesis in at 4 this afternoon, google wave developer sandbox activation at 10pm. Perfect timing. Add me if you like :) brian.krueger@wavesandbox.com
"Why does a scientific society have to go to Facebook for social web technology? Why doesn't it have that technology built-in? After all, social and society don't share the same etymological ancestry for nothing (i.e., the Latin word socius meaning "companion"). I'm sure over 40,000 members are a large enough base where most current tools would work fine. For instance, imagine you could have a buddy-list of other SfN members. Then, when the program of the next meeting is available, you can choose to pre-populate your itinerary automatically with all the presentations by your buddies."
- Björn Brembs
I think the problem might be hassle of getting permission to automatically add members - and when asked probably the vast majority will ignore the request. Then even if there is a network I suspect it will be accessible only to members of that society.
- Jean-Claude Bradley
The idea is to be only accessible to members - after all they're already using the site for plenty of other things anyway. The idea is that societies should use social web technology to deliver the kind of improvements societies were founded for initially: improved communication between members with a common interest.
- Björn Brembs
maybe I'm in the minority here but for me one of the biggest advantages of social software is meeting people you didn't know existed - so I don't see the incentive in participating in a closed network
- Jean-Claude Bradley
But there's a cross-incentive for the society to CREATE a closed network: lock-in, perceived "added value" for the membership dollar. In my experience such closed networks don't fly, for exactly the reason Jean-Claude adduces, but that doesn't stop orgs from trying. Also, I've run into real snobs, who don't want to engage in what they perceive as a free-for-all but are more interested in a walled garden.
- D0r0th34
Good points! Indeed, because in principal every member of these societies could meet in meatspace, meeting new people is *not* one of the goals I had in mind. Rather, keeping track of who of the 40,000 members of SfN is doing what. I regularly miss people or their presentations at meetings, simply because I don't have the full record of people in my head at all times. If there were a way of tracking their activities automatically, this would be easier.
- Björn Brembs
Basically, my idea was to leverage social web technology to have people spend *less* time on the society's website, but getting *more* done. This may only work for large societies, where the number of people in your field attending has become too large to track by hand, but science in growing...
- Björn Brembs
Scientific societies are anti-social in general
- Alexey
from iPhone
how about having a SFN society / group on NING. Only sfn members may be added to the social network and it may be what you desire...though being a non-member (and having no hope of becoming a member) I'll always support open forums:-)
- Sandeep Gautam
Sounds to me like something to aggregate information held elsewhere, rather than something you'd build, Bjorn. Take from Facebook, TripIt, Dopplr, and maybe you'd have something.
- D0r0th34
I don't think I've made myself clear at all. Maybe an example will help: Every year, I try to remember every name of every person I know who may possibly attend the SfN meeting. I spend several hours populating my online itinerary (with their presentations as well as by keyword), only to always forget some individuals. Now, if I had a buddy list on the SfN website (where I go regularly...
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- Björn Brembs
That's a great idea Bjorn. Especially at a meeting like that which is so enormous! It'd be nice (and really easy to program) an automatic itinerary generator.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
IMHO, what defines a "social network" is not who's in the network, but what you want to do with the network. I think what you're describing are still social activities (tracking other people's movements and activities) and I think they're not unique to scientists. Therefore, I think SfN is right to go after a generic network like FB. This is the part that I think the "FB for scientists"...
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- Andrew Su
As part of the selected few to try out the RSC's new 'social networking' site (which doesn't have the same good ideas to be fair that Bjorn has suggested (at least not yet)), my (and my peers) view is that it is just _another_ site that needs to be logged into, checked, etc. The reason we all suggested FB was that 1. all of us were already using it and 2. we had already initiated...
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- Anna Croft
Anna and Andrew, those are great points and make a lot of sense! I know too well how little I want to have to track yet another site. In this case, one would have to find a way to get the functionality implemented on FB, I wouldn't mind that at all - as long as I have the functionality. It would also still have the added benefit of scientists using FB for science.
- Björn Brembs
On the other hand, every single attendee of SfN (30,000 every year) *has* to use the SfN website just to see the program (or get accommodation!) and without your own itinerary, you're basically totally screwed. In other words, disregarding the website is not an option, tens of thousands of people are using it already anyway, most of them also more than just once a year. The society's...
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- Björn Brembs
Bjorn, I think you're right, if SfN (or ISMB) made a FB app to track the program, speakers, and attendees, I think that would be pretty fricken cool. And, I think, more productive than trying to reimplement a social networking site from scratch.
- Andrew Su
The Great Google Wave invite thread. Anyone who wants an invite post your Gmail address here and anyone who has invites available please use to invite the people on this list. There are also a bunch of requests in the Invites group here: http://friendfeed.com/invites
I have a few but holding them for a few people who have already asked me. I'm at kolint [at] googlewave [dot] com btw. A pain I know but if you can, could you update your comment when you have an account or just delete your comment. Ta! :-) EDIT: Try this site for invites: http://googlewaveinvites.com/
- Kol Tregaskes
Are people on this list getting invites or at least been told they have an invite on the way? You might have to be patient, it could take a long time for one to come through.
- Kol Tregaskes
Adam, yep agree. Maybe because I did that (month ago though) helped me get mine through from Vijay so quickly!
- Kol Tregaskes
@Kol, the invitation process seems to be based on nominations. For example, everytime someone nominates/invites you, you get bumped up the queue for an account until you're at the top and you get sent an invite by the team
- Ysabel Legaspi
Ysabel, ah I see, So lots of people must have nominated me. Darn, so a few users I have nominated could be waiting a looooong time. :-(
- Kol Tregaskes
if that voting system is right I'm very annoyed. I asked for an invite months ago, now all the numpties are all over it I'm not going to get a look in. It's like I've been sat at the front of a shop queue and everyone's just walking right past me into the shop. I am British but I detest both queuing and waiting, so this is pretty tough going
- Toby Graham
Like most other people, yesterday I wasn't aware of that I «needed» a Google Wave invitation this badly...but now I am!!! quackofdawn at gmail dot com
- Quackofdawn
Please I want a invite :( jesi.nieves at gmail
- Jesi
from iPod
neternity@gmail.com and i promise to send a wave of 100,901 twitter followers to your doorstep each of whom will have averaged 1 tweet in their existence - this might not get me an invite but surely it will get some notice - must have that something special - my google wave invite special sauce ingredient is twitter juice PS Not to be construed as an offer, not valid in any of the 53 US states, do not try this at home, caution: contents are hot.
- Ross Button
Anyone have already a wave invite?. I'm a developers anxious to take a look at wave. jmiguel.rodriguez at gmail.com . Thank you very much in advanced!
- jmiguel rodriguez
trentono gmail com...thanks in advance, mysterious stranger...
- Trent Olson
lol at this point i gotta think that by the time an invite makes it this far down the list i may already be at the top of the official invite list but doesn't hurt to try right? marco [dot] nunez @ gmail - thanks!
- Marco(aureliusmaximus)
I'm also trying. As Marco said, it doesn't hurt :) iamclem at gmail. thanks!
- Clément Simon
Hello, I would love to have a google wave invite too. ilteris@gmail.com thanks!
- ilteris
Oops! You said gmail address: marybaumcreative (at) gmail. Although I run marybaum@marybaum.com through gmail servers too.
- MaryB, BrandingBroadOfFF
from email
louisrbourque@gmail.com - an invite would be greatly appreciated, and I'll pass it on! Thanks
- Louis Bourque
from iPod
can you send me invite for google wave to i.igors (at) gmail (dot) com
- Igor Krstev
If any kind soul has an invite to spare, it would be gratefully received and shared on once GOOG get around to inviting me in. :-) The key piece of information belatedly being andy.bold@gmail.com kthxbai
- Andy Bold
Looking for one myself at alexscrivener (at) gmail (dot) com
- Alex Scrivener
I'd love an invite. I was sort of expecting to get one from Google, as I have been in all of their other betas, but to no avail :( carlton.prest@gmail.com
- Carlton Prest
Plesae send an invite! jwatson820@gmail.com
- Jonna Watson
damn, the pretty please guy will get one for sure, that steve guy @hotmail.com is likely last on the list - but we all will get one if that scobilizer guy notices that we are all here and asking and so cul cuz we are all on friendfeed - maybe if we twitter too it might help - hello google !!!!
- Ross Button
how do we know which ones are sent? I'm just doing my own thread.
- raphaeL
I've been too busy to get on FF the last few days....figures something important happening and I missed it! I knew about Google Wave but didn't know there would be a thread to post a request. In any case, better late than never, I'd love an invite at madeliene2007 at gmail.com. :)
- Bonnie Foster
I've been on Twitter all day trying to get one, I'd love it if my day can end by me finally getting an invitation :) I'll be sure to send some invites to other people in this thread! andryou@gmail.com
- andryou
re.renus@gmail.com somebody please send me a invitation... ^_^ : )
- Emad
wimmulder@gmail.com. Am really excited to try this out for a collaborative research project I'm working on. Hoping someone has an invite to spare!
- Wim Mulder
giuliocc@gmail.com . Keen to see if we can shake M$'s cage about messaging and collaboration.
- Giulio Campobassi
Would love an invite - jonathonc at gmail.com
- Jonathon
VitaArdiyana (at) gmail (dot) com, Thanks before Kol. I will delete my comment when i have my google wave account.
- Vimala Vita
Just digging into the comments now but let me begin by saying that you did an incredible job with this thread Kol, 473 (474 after I post) comments!
- Nicholas Kreidberg
Google Wave : Could anyone invite me ? : jean.charles.blondeau[at]gmail.com Thanks
- Jean-Charles
System Messages Invite Status: 17559 invite requests in the system. 7 invites confirmed as received by requester. 199 invites claimed as sent from giver.
- oliv21
How does anyone know if someone has already been invited? You could go back and edit your comment when you receive an invitation, but since that takes days, it could be ages before you know.
- marziah
I've not even had a nomination, RK. At google dot com I'm suezanne , in the event anyone wants to make a nomination. I've asked before on friendfeed. It's kind of humiliating to beg.
- SuezanneC Baskerville
i have decided that if i do indeed get an invite, i will decline, forward my gmail account to windows live and put ie back as my default browser and i will bing it
- Ross Button
@Ross: why punish yourself for something you didn't do? :)
- François Dongier
I just want some google love; just like the rest of us do; but n,o they wave at us as they have their private, invite only party; thumb to nose, fingers a waving - that's the google wave; we need a tshirt
- Ross Button
al86shaw@gmail.com :) Not expecting anything, but thanks anyway!
- Giraffes Up In The AIr
Send to me plz ,,, mxina.com {a} gmail {dot} com
- Mohammad Sharifi
Has anyone received their invite? I haven't yet.
- Rodrigo
from email
I'd love an invite to Google Wave pls. non-geeky bf got one before me! that's just not cricket.. hehe :) icetigerza (at) gmail
- Kim
Hello, if there's any invite left, you'll make me more than happy ;-) matthieu.beauval [at] gmail [dot] com, thank you !
- matthieu beauval
If there are still invites left daryl@learnscape.com.au
- Daryl Hunt on FF
Of all the people posting here the chances of me getting an invite are slim but I'm still willing to try. If someone wants to shoot an invite over to jcallahan126@gmail.com I'd REALLY appreciate it.
- John
from iPhone
Aww Did I miss the Wave of invites? Come on Kol... Hook me up! :)
- Walt Ruppar
It looks like it, although you might be able to use the hyperlink on the front of the Wave homepage to request an invitation, if it's still available.
- Tyson Key
Google Wave Anybody? I needz one plz... walt {dot} ruppar {at} gmail [dot] com
- Walt Ruppar
from iPhone
I'll give this a try: j.linkola at gmail - anyone have invites left?
- Jussi Linkola
Anyone can provide a Google Wave invite? bmtrocks@gmail.com
- Brian
Hi guys I realy Waiting impatiently, but still have no invite... can anybody sent me invite please please simplisityzehra@gmail.com thanks in advance
- Zehra
firatdemirel at gmail.com just needs an invite for Gwave. Thanks.
- Fırat DEMİREL
Does anyone have an invite to share? Can you send it to v9y.rec at gmail.com please? Thanks.
- Vinay | विनय
Can somebody send an ivitation to terror@gmail.com . Thanks in advance.
- Yiğit
Please send an invitation to me at trivedi.knz@gmail.com. I got tired waiting.
- Kandarp Trivedi
I'll be glad to invite others on this thread once I get mine. Thanks in advance.. Keep the thread alive.
- Kandarp Trivedi
rodgerdb@gmail.com ha oh man am I late to this thread =( Here's to hoping!
- Rodger Ballard
really need one, would be so grateful thacker90184@gmail.com
- brandon
I want Google Wave invite too, please sent it to: ric4p5 {at} gmail [dot] com Thanks
- jose manuel
If anyone has invites, could I have one please? tekked - gmail.com
- TechKid
allanbesselink<at>gmail<dot>com ... please!
- Allan Besselink
I'll wager that some of the folks on this list have received their invite by now, or no longer want one - I have 16 invitations at this instant. It's probably easier for me if you DM.
- SuezanneC Baskerville
fifiquimbo(at)gmail(dot)com. I would love one, thanks!
- Fifi Quimbo
I have 8 invites to Google Wave, if someone is interested, please DM with e-mail address. Ciao, Andrea
- Andrea Romoli
I had to logout and back in before I could post to my news feed.
- Richard Akerman
Don't like a new interface being shoved down mouth without warning. Tried settings but how can you switch off News Feed if you don't wan't it?
- Graham Steel
You can only switch between News Feed and Live Feed. I don't think you can turn it off.
- Richard Akerman
I just logged in and the newsfeed info was all from this time 2 days ago, lol
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Fwd: Facebook for scientists gets millions in funding - http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin... (via http://friendfeed.com/habib...) Congratulations to Cornell/Florida/Vivo on their NCRR grant: "The University of Florida, Cornell University and a handful of other schools have been awarded $12.2...
Here's a link to UF's coverage of the event: http://news.ufl.edu/2009... -- I'm curious, though about this: "The new program will draw information about scientists from official, verifiable sources and make it available using a type of technology called the Semantic Web. For example, information about researchers’ positions will come from their employers and a listing of...
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- Mickey Schafer
How is this different from Biomed Experts, SciLink, etc? After seeing the failure of a dozen of these sites, I'm skeptical of the premise that there's real demand for them. You can build all the semantic infrastructure you want, but if people aren't going to use it, then it's a waste.
- Chris Miller
Kind of what I was thinking, too, Chris. But the UF blurb does not address these concerns, so hard to know at this point. Maybe I'll send a message to Sarah Gonzalez tomorrow (one of the UF ref librarians who jump-started the idea) and see if she'll fill me in.
- Mickey Schafer
It really hurts to see money be wasted like this on a platform that doesn't really address the issues plaguing these types of sites that already exist. I think someone needs to be given 12 million to figure out how to get scientists to actually use the technology! (Or code tools we'd like to use ;) )
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Brian: what are the differences between this system under development and tools that might be considered ideal?
- Mike Chelen
Mickey: scientists may be more likely to get involved for those reasons if they result in an effective operation. it is exciting to hear import and export of standard formats being given a priority, yet it may be longer before anyone sees if the process is functional
- Mike Chelen
Chris: anytime someone mentions "facebook for ____ " it seems a little vague and hard to understand what might differentiate the service :D
- Mike Chelen
Reading the press release, it doesn't sound like this platform is going to be any different from biomedexperts. I'm not sure there is an "ideal" system. It's going to be hard to offer every discipline the proper tools and content that will drive users and spawn collaboration. Having worked on my own site for the last 3 years, I've heard many scientists say the last thing they want to do...
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- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
The question that has to be answered is what is the compelling reason for scientists to trust the people they encounter on "facebook for scientists". Non science social networking is low risk...
- Richard Badge
from Nambu
"The goal of the program is national networking of all scientists," said Michael Conlon, interim director of biomedical informatics for the University of Florida, in a statement. "Scientists have problems finding each other. We often find that researchers have pretty good networks with students or with scientists at institutions where they received their degree or worked before. But...
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- Attila Csordas
I have the same response to hearing this that I imagine many of you would reading a grant proposal that proposes to do an experiment that others have already done and which didn't work, and the results of which aren't cited in the new proposal. They need to address how they're going to work in the face of all these past failures. If their branding strategy is any indication, I'm not sure they're aware of the past failures.
- Mr. Gunn
Mr Gunn nailed it. Where is the strategy for succeeding where so many have failed?
- Bill Hooker
Mr Gunn +3 saving role against hype.
- Paul J. Davis
I would like to point out that the Facebook for Science line is journalists trying to market this to the public rather than the investigators trying to address this groups concerns. I think that phrasing needs to be taken with a grain of salt. That doesn't mean the other criticisms aren't legitimate. I just think it is important to evaluate the project on its own merits rather than public mass market branding of it.
- Michael Habib
One point on how it is different from some other projects. It is NIH funded. I am not aware of any other solutions with such a mandate from the NIH. Second, it is a huge amount of money.to devote to the problem. Neither of these differences directly addresses the concerns expressed, but they are both factors that give this project an edge in potentially addressing the issues.
- Michael Habib
"The University of Florida, Cornell University and a handful of other schools" any people here from those schools funded or know the people funded and can invite them? Would love to hear their angle
- Attila Csordas
I'll be doing a post doc at UF. I think I'll contact the head there and see if they need any help :)
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
I am at UF. I have met Sarah G. (one of the initiating reference libs) while doing a guest lecture in her class. But I don't know the other people. We could just forward this discussion to one of the contacts usually listed.
- Mickey Schafer
Michael Habib, I agree with your observation that "facebook for scientists" is journalist-speak. And in terms of explaining things to the UF community, it is a good analogy as my students constantly and consistently categorize social networks as either twitter or facebook.
- Mickey Schafer
I forwarded it to to Mike Conlon at UF. He said he'd take a look at this discussion and also for more information said we should read the RFA http://grants.nih.gov/grants.... The RFA says that it wants the platform to be a federated network distributed by partner institutions, which is novel in the SNfS field. It'll be interesting to see what they come up with.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Thanks, Brian (or really, should I use some southern-ism, like "Thaaank you, sweetie" which is actually what happens here, especially at places like Waffle House?).
- Mickey Schafer
I think that background just shows how little actual background research was done before proposing this RFA :P
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
I wonder if they'll talk to OWW, Epernicus, SciLink, Laboratree, and the dozen other SNfS services out there to import or otherwise leverage all the data that's already been contributed by scientists. I can see it being useful as an aggregator and motivating standardization and data exchange, but would hate to just see it reinvent the square wheel
- Shirley Wu
from twhirl
We have a few author profiles in Scopus as well :)
- Michael Habib
Congratulations to Cornell/Florida/Vivo on their NCRR grant: "The University of Florida, Cornell University and a handful of other schools have been awarded $12.2 million to build a social/collaborative network for scientists and researchers. The idea is to make it easier to find research and like-minded researchers in an effort to speed new discoveries."
- Michael Habib
Um, good for them... but whither the current science social nets?
- Richard Akerman
Very much beginning to think that the "FB for scientists" moniker is not useful going forward.
- carolh
Facebook for science isn't useful. This is the first major initiative that I know of that is backed by the NIH and a boatload of funding. There is another one of these grants being awarded, but I am not sure which team got it yet. It is a huge amount of cash to throw directly at the problem.
- Michael Habib
How many people get research grants funded for $12M for something that's been repeatedly shown not to work? What a waste! Do you think they even know what the problem is that they're throwing money at?
- Mr. Gunn
@MrGunnMy guess would be no. Especially since they're still using the (derogatory) term Facebook for scientists. Someone dropped the ball big time in reviewing the history of these types of sites. Unless they have a model that's completely different and focuses on content, content producers and tools, I don't see it going much further than the current crop of unused sites. Here's to hoping this isn't another 12 million in wasted tax dollars.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
I still think there's room for something like this to work -- it needs to be content-centric as we've learned here on FF/TLS, and I think it also needs some kind of imprimatur to get past the "oh noes 4chan and pr0n do not want" reaction that most scientists seem to have to anything online. Perhaps with the stamp of approval that comes with the Cornell name and solid funding will help. (Obadmission: I wouldn't have spent $12 mil on this either.)
- Bill Hooker
Its like any big funding initiative in these areas. it comes about three years too late. I consulted on a couple of these applications and the ones I saw people seemed to be grappling with the important issues. Remains to be seen whether it turns out anything more than bloatware. Certainly the referees seemed somewhat clueless in a few cases,
- Cameron Neylon
from twhirl
This was one of two grants to be given out for national networking as part of the stimulus package. My guess is it was an arbitrary amount of money because the government had printed a bunch and needed it spent. Whether other projects have been successful or not, begs the question whether this needed stimulating. There was already a health, if not wildly successful, startup industry in...
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- Michael Habib
I'm not devoutly religious, but I think this is a issue of free speech. My boss says that the university works hard to keep god out of all communications, but I think that's more of a business matter. He's since told the student that its wholly inappropriate and unprofessional to thank God.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
I'm not overly religious as well but I agree with your group leader here. To me, it's not so such much a matter of free speech but more a breach of professional ethics. I also disagree with political statements being made in scientific presentations. People attend scientific talks for the science, not the presenter's political or religious views. There are plenty of other channels (and contexts) more suitable for that purpose.
- Ricardo Almeida
I agree that it's a bit of a question of what is appropriate. The student should be made aware that such a statement will make the majority of his/her audience highly uncomfortable. What if s/he had said "thanks in particular to my main squeeze for that really great blowjob last night, that relaxed me for this presentation" - it would be out of place, as well, and make listeners uncomfortable. On the other hand, I'm uncomfortable with an outright ban on thanking God per se. (And I'm atheist, too, FWIW.)
- Heather
While in general I agree with Heather, It could also be cultural. In some cultures, it would be perfectly appropriate to do so and no one would even notice unless someone went on a rant
- Deepak Singh
Haha, I'm not sure the support someone receives (or at least the perceived support), is comparable with a blow job :P This is a very religious person, so her perceived support from God is extremely high. I also don't think it's preaching, but maybe others would. It's just a personal statement, and if she feels it's appropriate, then how can I have a problem with it?
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
if the talk was about Evolution, it would be a problem :-)
- Pierre Lindenbaum
I've only seen this happen at the end of dissertation defenses, where there is a little more leeway given to the acknowledgements section. It's unclear from the OP whether or not this was the case? At a "normal" talk it would be a little weird for sure.
- Jason Winget
I say inappropriate, according to both science and religion. "And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you." Matthew 6:5-6
- Chris Miller
(FWIW, I'm an atheist, but enjoy quoting the bible to make a point to religious folk)
- Chris Miller
So is it wrong to thank god when a long and boring talk comes to an end? :-)
- Eric Jain
Hah hah - I think Heather hit the nail on the head here - the student was giving a talk, not receiving an award, so thanking God is just as weird and unprofessional as thanking your Mum and Dad. I think the student has misunderstood what the acknowledgments section is for - for attributing the work done and advice given (and hopefully God himself has not been contributing directly to the science).
- Ben Blackburne
Don't ban it. I'd rather know who among my colleagues is prone to belief without evidence.
- Bill Hooker
There should no censure on what students say in presentations- better to have the discussion on what the presentation is "for" and whether inclusion of personal beliefs / opinions furthers this aim (we're scientists right?)
- Richard Badge
from Nambu
I have zero problem with thanking god at the end of the talk... I would notice the author presenting a slide with results carved in rock on a mountain and present that as his scientific results...
- Egon Willighagen
Acknowlegements in talks , thesis etc are where speakers / presenters get an opportunity to reveal aspects of their personality which their science may not convey so its not uncommon to see people thank their base jumping buddies, their cat , parents etc so I see no problem with people thanking God either.
- Hari
"TexFlame renders a single PubMed abstract into a graphical representation derived from the Systems Biology Graphical Notation (SBGN) [1,2]."
- Mr. Gunn
from Bookmarklet
"Web scientists at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute will use the World Wide Web to compile and share scientific data on an unprecedented scale." This definitely prompted a "O RLY?" when I saw the headline.
- Mr. Gunn
from Bookmarklet
With a college like MIT actively endorsing student blogs (uncensored!), I wonder if this might later encourage science blogging and open research when these students move on to become grad students, postdocs, and faculty...
- Hilary
hmm if you pay people to blog surely it will influence the content
- Jean-Claude Bradley
@Jean-Claude I disagree--so many of these 'we'll get the XXX's to blog for us!' strategies suffer because they offer no compensation and end up being perceived as pyramid schemes. Also, $10 an hour for a max of $40 a week? Come on, that's nothing...
- Mary Canady
True enough, Mary, but if you had a choice between a fully independent blog (or group of blogs) and another group whose authors were paid -- no matter how little -- to write the content, which would you trust more? Even if the money has no real effect, the perception of influence is important.
- Bill Hooker
Hasn't Warwick been doing this for a while in the UK? OK, it's not MIT...
- Peter Miller
Sounds ok to me. I think it's a great idea for opening the sciences up to internet interaction. @bill, what are the perks of writing for science blogs? There's no revenue sharing there??
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Do you mean ScienceBlogs (Seed Media), or science blogs? The former do share advertising revenue with their bloggers. As for perks, I guess everyone gets something different out of blogging... I'm not saying it's a Bad Thing to pay bloggers, just that there's both potential for, and a likely perception of, pay-for-play.
- Bill Hooker
"This year, 25 freshmen applied for four new spots, and, Mr. McOwen said, it was hard to choose. " -- only 25?
- Mickey Schafer
My thoughts are similar to Bill's. If someone is already an active blogger and they get a small revenue stream down the road that is different from a non-blogger starting to blog because they get paid. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that but I think many people would assume there was a conflict of interest.
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Something that occurs to me on reading Jean-Claude's comment -- people like "us" (FFers), who are comfortable online, are probably less likely to be bothered about the potential conflict of interest -- we have multiple sources (many of them blogs that have passed our trust filters!) and bullshit meters in good working order, so we will sniff out pay-for-play if it happens. I can easily imagine, though, that anyone who is already a bit suspicious of blogs in general would be doubly suspicous of paid blogs.
- Bill Hooker
Obviously, duplicating my comment on your post: "I'll miss you Paulo. Come back and visit soon. Your voice makes "the obviousness of the online world" a lot less obvious.
- Nils Reinton
Since I have seen lots of people asking, but nobody offering, I conclude that the new invites haven't gone out yet. Has anybody actually received a new account today yet?
- Matt Leifer
Are we forming the queue here then? If so, here I am :) Thanks! (allyson.lurena at that gmail email account)
- Allyson Lister
The BBC suggest that each account gets 5 invites (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1...), but I read on Techcrunch yesterday that each account got 8 nominations (not invites, merely suggestions...). There's obviously no definitive info out there. Anyway, if there's invites going, and this is the queue, count me in :) (sjcockell at googlemail)
- Simon Cockell
I saw some comment about release at 4pm BST but no idea where that came from or if it is accurate
- Cameron Neylon
Those Ebay buyers are going to be sorely disappointed when they find that it's not an invite but rather a nomination, which I read a Google's way of saying "we'll know if you try to let in a SEO or spam account".
- Mr. Gunn
Ok - it looks like I have eight - can other people on the sandbox confirm numbers and we can see about dividing these things up. Also can anyone who got their own invite delete the comment above?
- Cameron Neylon
I can confirm 8 invites... which are really nominations, it seems...
- Egon Willighagen
Line gets crowded ;-) pls count me in: yar.nikolaev [] gmail.com
- Yaroslav Nikolaev
I make it 17 names above - and I've seen at least three other requests (Richard Akerman, Mike Ellis, David Bradley). So not sure how to do this. My inclination is to prioritise based on people who will be able to put some direct effort into building (but not necessarily coding) things.
- Cameron Neylon
Can I just check whether Bjorn, Andy, and others with sandbox accounts have any free invites?
- Cameron Neylon
Would it be worth getting those interested in obtaining accounts to write a short abstract (say 100-200 words) about the sorts of projects they'd use their account for?
- Dan Hagon
To all those wondering what is going on here - we are trying to coordinate the invitations we have with the people who want them. Its a bit of a slow process.
- Cameron Neylon
Shouldn't Wave make that process faster? :)
- Jan Aerts
from Android
Yes, Jan. There's a wave weve set up for tracking who's got them and who still needs them. Everyone from this thread (that I know - please don't spam this thread ;-)) has been added.
- Mr. Gunn
Since I haven't heard from Google, yet, I'll place myself in this queue for Wave invites. First name, last name, gmail. Thanks for organizing the process.
- Chris Lasher
Cameron - Thanks for your efforts to match requests to invitations. Hopefully there'll be enough to go around for everyone on this thread who asked for one. Btw, because I didn't mention it above, my gmail account name is axiomsofchoice.
- Dan Hagon
Jan, Wave makes the communication faster and more efficient in some ways but it doesn't help that much for human processes - like making difficult decisions. Also as far as I am aware the invitations I haven't sent haven't actually flowed through the system yet so you're not missing anything as yet...
- Cameron Neylon
Oh, I'll add myself late to the list. rni.boh at gmail (you know the rest...).
- Bob O'Hara
Would like to add myself to the queue as well ;-)
- bala chandar
I would like to add my name to the list too - mhanwell at gmail if there are any invites still out there.
- Marcus D. Hanwell
I have now been nominated for an invite (it's "in the mail"), so I've removed my comment above. Thanks @robsyme !
- Andrew Perry
How to Think Like a Computer Scientist — How to Think Like a Computer Scientist: Learning with Python v2nd Edition documentation - http://openbookproject.net/...
A little underwhelming, but I can just imagine the uproar if they had made more substantial changes.
- Mr. Gunn
The sad thing is that design has probably been in the making since 1998. So much administrative red tape to go through in an institution like that. Just hope redesigns to subpages come quickly too. It'd be dumb if that was the only spot that gets a facelift. Although, this is what I start with every morning - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/gquery...
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
I really like that they have a "free full text" filter next to search results - not sure if this was possible before, maybe through some advanced search feature?
- Shirley Wu
from twhirl
I'm still taking in the design changes. @shirley. Agreed on the placement of the "free full text" filter where it is now. Yes, this was possible before. Sandi Porter over at Sb's in 2007 ran with a fab 4 part series about this http://scienceblogs.com/digital... Much easier now, though, so thumbs are certainly up in this regard :)
- Graham Steel
Hi, Folks -- a PLoS publishing question -- a former student of mine (doing grad work in autism - vestibular system connection) is in grad school and has her project ready for publication. She's been accepted to a small, very specific OT pub, one UF doesn't even have a sub. to and so she went and purchased one herself.
I've suggested that she consider PLoS as an alternative, and she's interested in that (potentially wider audience!), but is a bit nervous about the "commenting" function...doesn't want to get "trashed" on her first publication. What is the best way of demonstrating this function, and quelling her nerves?
- Mickey Schafer
I imagine passing a formal peer review stage should reduce the odds of her getting trashed post-publication significantly. Then again, I don't know what the OT/UF pub/sub things mean, so maybe I'm missing an important detail :)
- Wobbler
oops! OT = occupational therapy; pub = publication; sub = subscription -- she was invited by her initial journal choice to submit a brief report. This is original work for her (she had the idea, she did the initial studies as an undergrad; she was "accepted" into grad school to finish her work before she'd even applied; she's now finished the project). I said I'd help with the manuscript. The point about passing peer review is a good one! I guess I should have though of that...:-).
- Mickey Schafer
I'm confused too, a bit. But...As for worry about PLoS, you and her could have a competition to see who can find more examples of papers that have been trashed so far. I've never seen one :)
- Steve Koch
You could point out that very few papers receive comments ;-) Of those that do, I've never seen "trashing".
- Neil Saunders
Unfortunately, what Steve and Neil said ;-)
- Bora Zivkovic
I don't think she'll jeopardize her acceptance if she CommentPresses the work (or something similar). Find out first, of course, but that may be a way through.
- D0r0th34
@bora, tell them to add openID and Facebook connect. When I added anonymous commenting to my site, people actually started commenting on articles because they didn't have to register. Unless if you think the only worthwhile comments will come from those who will sign up for an account? I think it's worth a shot. As far as this post goes, I think your student should be confident in the...
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- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
@Brian - second that. Often I just can't be bothered to register on a blog site to comment, BUT if I can quickly sign in via my OpenID (as in single sign-on) it lowers the bar substantially for me. Anonymity isn't an issue to me, but registering again and again all over is a killer.
- 'Mummi' Thorisson
I did mention that relatively few comments get posted...her PI is more concerned that PLoS One doesn't have a citations ranking yet, though he did say that both PLoS Medicine and Biology are "highly regarded" -- so far, she's really interested in some kind of OA publication since she sees the value of immediate access to a wider audience. I've also recommended she explore some of the...
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- Mickey Schafer
I also agree with Brian. IMO, the only real issue about getting "bad" feedback is that you usually can't do a whole lot about it. It's not like you can just "open, edit, save, republish" your article. Still, if PLoS thinks it's good enough to publish (after revisions from the peer review feedback, optionally), it's unlikely that she'll get trashed.
- Wobbler
Right now, I'm experiencing an interesting sense of caution -- this is her professional life, not mine. My job is to help her succeed in her profession, so the question emerges what is the best model for early, pre-doctoral, pre-tenure-track-position publication? I tend to think OA is a good route b/c the potential for article-level citation counts shows a positive impact; clearly, her PI is going with the highest IF available, and that makes sense for post-docs/jobs.
- Mickey Schafer
so we need short useless google wave conversations. where are the invites? :)
- Endre Sebestyen
Well, I don't have to process an IM any further (e.g. delete). It just goes away.
- Neil Saunders
Be nice if Wave was out, then you could just have a stream going in you inbox ;)
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
The last two places I've worked had a private Jabber server that works great for short conversations and things that don't require phone/email. I assume adoption would probably be poor in most organizations though.
- Adam Kraut
A colleague alerted me to yammer, which some people use in our organisation. 86 out of about 6000, to be precise :-)
- Neil Saunders
quote "For me, this is the one thing the ridiculously over-hyped Mendeley could do that would merit the degree of media attention it is getting -- be the basis of an open citation database. It would need massive improvement to its metadata extraction algorithms, which currently suck (Google Scholar's, for all Jacsó's complaints, are much better), but it would generate something of lasting value."
- Duncan Hull
Granted this would only be for the life sciences, but I've never understood why the NIH hasn't leveraged Pubmed this way. I mean, they have an API of sorts, and you can download the entire database, so it's not like they're trying to keep things proprietary. What's really going to push things, though, is more widespread adoption of institutional repositories. They're presumably going...
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- Mr. Gunn
@Mr. Gunn PubMed and PubMedCentral may have the API's but they don't have all the citation data...
- Duncan Hull
@duncan, they do have the data. It's just not linked. All you need to do is write an algorithm to link it all. Well, except for the papers in PMC that are scanned. That's a whole other issue.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
"scientists have ceded the field of citation analysis to commercial companies" to which I quote Rage against the Machine: "we gotta take the power back!"
- Björn Brembs
when I saw your comment in facebook Bjorn, it ended with "Rage against the Machine ..." and I figured you were quoting "F*$K you I won't do what you tell me" but I guess this will do ...
- Jonathan Eisen
If only I had some RDFa (aka ontology), then I could add the linking on my homepage for Google Scholar/Yahoo! to aggregate...
- Egon Willighagen
+1 Egon - I still believe that the power of federation makes it worth getting past the usability issues. Aggregation scales much better than a centralized database.
- Mr. Gunn
"It was a throwaway statistic in an article about the heavy metal band Slayer that got Jonathan Pieslak thinking. During the Gulf war, he read, some 40% of the band's fan mail came from soldiers stationed in the Middle East. Professor Pieslak is a music theorist at the City College of New York. Over the past few years he has interviewed US soldiers about the music they listen to and – more importantly – what they listen to it for. You wouldn't expect much Chris de Burgh or Barry White to come floating over the barbed wire fences around military camps in Iraq or Afghanistan, and Pieslak's research confirms the hunch. The playlists are dominated by Slayer, Metallica, Eminem and others. What's interesting about the work is not so much which bands soldiers are drawn to, but the extraordinary terms they use to describe the power the music has over them. Some talk about tracks turning them into monsters, making them inhuman so they can do inhuman acts. The subjects of Pieslak's interviews...
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- RAPatton
from Bookmarklet
the audio in this is pretty interesting...the tracks you listen to to keep you sane..or get you in a different headspace...
- Anna Lynn M.
clearly, music has influence over mood and feelings. it can influence thought. that which influences thought and feelings and mental states can also influence action. that which can influence action can influence behavioral patterns and habits. that which can influence behavioral patterns and habits can influence history. however, music does not transform or control people without their...
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- docrivs
i can just see certain one-track-minded people reading this synopsis of this article and nodding their heads, because it seems to confirm what they already believe -- that some art and music is just bad for people, bad for society. they forget that we cannot know the light without also knowing the dark.
- docrivs
When I'm in a violent mood, I drive listening to Rage Against the Machine, NIN... etc. Very satisfying.
- Fossil Huntress