 |
|
| FriendFeed is the easiest way to share online. Learn more » |
Hayes Haugen › Comments
U.S. Army may soon equip troops with smartphones (Mark Milian/CNN) - http://www.techmeme.com/110717...
Would hope that whatever platform they choose it would run an OS compiled and flashed by the military, not the provider.
- Hayes Haugen
Viddler Architecture - 7 Million Embeds a Day and 1500 Req/Sec Peak - http://highscalability.com/blog...
"Current goal it to get everything moved over, the entire system to be autobuilt, and in version control, make sure ops guys are hired and to have a schedule." Probably a good idea
- Hayes Haugen
Teen Decomposes Plastic Bag in Three Months | Wired Science | Wired.com - http://www.wired.com/wiredsc...
Sorin Lerinti, Don Faulkner, Jeanette Bosman and 111 other people liked this
"Plastic takes thousands of years to decompose — but 16-year-old science fair contestant Daniel Burd made it happen in just three months. The Waterloo, Ontario high school junior figured that something must make plastic degrade, even if it does take millennia, and that something was probably bacteria. The Record reports that Burd mixed landfill dirt with yeast and tap water, then added ground plastic and let it stew. The plastic indeed decomposed more quickly than it would in nature; after experimenting with different temperatures and configurations, Burd isolated the microbial munchers. One came from the bacterial genus Pseudomonas, and the other from the genus Sphingomonas. Burd says this should be easy on an industrial scale: all that’s needed is a fermenter, a growth medium and plastic, and the bacteria themselves provide most of the energy by producing heat as they eat. The only waste is water and a bit of carbon dioxide."
- April Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
So why is carbon sequestration a good idea when it's all complicated and expensive, but bad when it involves burying plastic bags in landfills?
- Paul Buchheit
I think it's better to sequester carbon as dirt than as bags.
- Gabe
But if it's already in plastic bag form, why not leave it that way instead of turning it into CO2?
- Paul Buchheit
Paul: that's exactly what I've been thinking. Particularly since the City of Seattle no longer allows residents to sequester food based carbon in landfills and instead requires us to burn it into compost.
- Hayes Haugen
Dirt is useful because you can grow stuff in it. Most waste products are not so useful.
- Gabe
Yes, but the choice isn't between dirt and plastic -- it's between plastic and CO2.
- Paul Buchheit
I have to agree with Paul on this one: atmospheric CO2 is much more of a pressing concern at the moment than landfill space. Though I do admire the kid's scientific spirit.
- Louis Simoneau
Concur with Louis and Paul. Here's an interesting Penn & Teller bit about landfills: http://www.youtube.com/watch... (from their Bullshit episode on Recycling myths).
- Stephen Mack
It doesn't say what the process actually produces. They mention the feed material (plastic) and the waste material (water, CO2), but not the real products. I assumed it produced globs of carbon. Am I wrong?
- Gabe
Why would you assume that Gabe?
- Paul Buchheit
the carbon in the CO2, perhaps?
- Jack Jones
Has nobody considered this for an artificial ecosystem? Compost your scraps for fertile soil, and compost your bags for the CO2 for the plants growing in it. Sure you'll need an airlock on your greenhouse (and an oxy mask whenever you enter it) but you'll have the best damned tomatoes on your street.
- Chris Charabaruk
You don't want to leave it in plastic form as it screws up the ocean large! Check this out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... I hope they can use this to make something that would eat the plastic in the ocean rather than the sea life dying from it.
- Luke Kilpatrick
Since it said that the waste products were CO2 and water, I assumed there were also non-waste products. The good thing about landfills is that they can later be mined for all the great things that were too cheap to recycle.
- Gabe
Yeah, I think landfills have an unjustly bad reputation. When properly managed, they are a great way to deal with garbage that our technology can't yet efficiently recycle. (we're saving for the future!)
- Paul Buchheit
that's great news. now i can really finish my threat to all my damn *invincible* plastic bags! (waves fist)
- ed fry
The two biggest problems with landfill are the leachate seeping into groundwater (or contaminating local soil) and methane (a greenhouse gas). Even if you can mitigate those problems, they're difficult to eliminate entirely, making the land almost useless once it's full.
- Gabe
Gabe, not to minimize the problems, but I live right next to Shoreline Ampitheather in Mountain View, which is built on landfill is proof that the landfill land is hardly useless.
- Stephen Mack
It's not just landfills, though. Take the large floating trash gyre of the Pacific, and its effects in the ecosystem. So the tiny little plastic balls in water are fake food, and animals eat them, and then die in various ways, lowering populations and making species even more fragile. Landfill may be a good way if it's contained and monitored more closely, or CO2, in various areas- such...
more...
- anna sauce
@anna at least he is coming up with a solution rather than just finding more things to complain about
- Chris Johnston
anna's right -- the problem is when the stuff ends up in the ocean. Landfills are a good way to keep the stuff out of the ocean.
- Gabe
Stop speculating and start experimenting!
- Dane Deasy
Lazy online commentators... ;)
- Dane Deasy
What's the risk in providing a specific kind of bacteria an unlimited food source?
- dthree
Old news.
- Will Higgins™
Pseudomonas is living even on tubes used in surgery. It is a major problem. It simply eats the plastic in a wet environment.
- Balint
IActionable: Free game mechanics for startups - http://iactionable.com/free-fo...
But what I really want is a system that crowd sources to tweak the parameters of success. In video game terms: if only 1% of people can jump over the wall in the 1st level, lower the height of the wall.
- Hayes Haugen
My firewood house is now finished!
Jay, qub, Anthony K. Valley © and 55 other people liked this
Where are the walls? Where will the firewood hang the plasma TV? How are they going to entertain themselves?
- April Buchheit
April wins.
- Yolanda
Zillow says this is now worth $540k.
- Stephen Mack
*dead*
- Spidra Webster
Very nice. I have been thinking about building one myself. I just got a full cord of wood delivered today. I didn't think you had a wood stove though. Where are you burning this wood?
- Robert Felty
Are you trying to skill up to compete in the next Survivor?
- imabonehead
wonderful!!! :)
- Marisa Puddu
Is the firewood upset that you made their house out of their dead relatives?
- Dave Roth
The firewood house can be used as firewood!
- Amit Patel
Wow. We just built ours. It is our driveway plus a blue tarp.
- Laura Norvig
Rob, we have a firepit. You'all can hang out around it when you visit. It's really nice.
- Paul Buchheit
Great one!
- Wulfmansworld
Did you build it for only firewood? I can't imagine your house's size. How much money do you earn? :P
- Emre Savaş
Yes, I built it. I also require my children to live there along with the firewood ;)
- Paul Buchheit
Well, it is cute enough that I can totally imagine your kids *wanting* to play in it!
- Laura Norvig
Emre: I don't know how cold it is where you live, but where I live the amount of firewood that fits in that house is only enough for recreational purposes. You could never go the whole winter on that much.
- Gabe
Nice!!
- Rachel Lea Fox
Gabe, this explanation is much better than Paul's comment :) by the way I'm living in Istanbul.
- Emre Savaş
Is this a 20% project? :)
- Jemm
Size-wise, that is not a very big wood pile. Our wood pile in Indiana was probably 10 times that. Clare's grandpa in upstate New York usually has about 10 cords around. He goes through about 3 cords each year. (1 cord ~ 4 cubic meters)
- Robert Felty
Rob: Here's my father-in-law's wood holder. It has a tarp "house" built around it with PVC pipe that's not pictured: http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- Gabe
Order some rounds delivered to your house. Get a splitting maul. Splitting wood is good therapy and excellent exercise. Firewood is a happy by-product
- Hayes Haugen
Rob, the PVC tarp house is nice because my Dad can take it down during the summer. As he only needs to keep the wood dry in the winter when we make fires.
- Maggie
A wooden house holding wood that's headed for destruction by combustion. It's a plant version of Animal Farm.
- Sue - Friendfeed is best
Finally! A Bay Area house I can afford!
- Spidra Webster
So here is a question: What makes the Founding Fathers (US) the greatest moral compass and definers of democracy anyway.
Rodfather, vicster, alexandra and 2 other people liked this
They beat the British.
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
They were the first, here, to set it up. I'd imagine that's worth something.
- Jonathan Hardesty
THIS!
- <3Heather<3
They aren't. They gave us a Republic, not a democracy. (Taught my kids this today.)
- Trish Haley
The defeated the British over 150 years before Ghandi. And they did it guerrilla style. Ghandi would have been nothing without the lessons learned here.
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
Democratic Republic, Josh. :)
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
They set up a system that is designed to require and withstand change. The moral and democracy parts are distractions.
- Hayes Haugen
Well said, Hayes.
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
Because it's new and shiny (relatively).
- Rodfather
Off to go look up the effects of enforced minimum wages. After thinking about it, getting rid of minimum wage seems like a brilliant way to increase employment, though there need to be safe guards in place so employers can't reduce the wage they are giving the employee without notification.
Andy Bakun, Mark Horne, Bindu Reddy and 10 other people liked this
Look at the countries that have no enforced minimum wage and then look at the ones that do. I'd rather live in one of the countries that does.
- iTad
Jimminy. 1 guy earning $10 is awesome. 3 guys earning a total of $10 isn't.
- Johnny
Tad, I'm just thinking about Supply & Demand equilibria, the unemployed are demanding jobs when their is no supply, and business still need employees but can't afford it. And yes I'm off to look up facts on that, because it doesn't make sense why the open system, wouldn't be more effective.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Johnny, that's called greed.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
No Jimminy, that's called business
- Johnny
Johnny, yeah but what I'm saying is it's up to the employee if he wants to work at the business, even if he will be paid less, and I'm not saying the business can't impose it's own internal minimum wage system.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
You really think McDonalds would continue to pay a teenage kid $5 an hour if they could pay him $4?
- Johnny
No, but he has the right to walk, if he doesn't agree to the price, obviously the wages they pay for various positions would reach an equilibrium of what people are willing to be paid for their position.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Without a minimum wage, there would be more $2/hour jobs than you could shake a stick at. We'd create a huge underclass in the US.
- iTad
The issue is Jimminy, the people who get hurt by this are the people who can't afford to be picky about where they work
- Johnny
And what happens when you factor in kids with no bills who live with their parents and are only working for extra money?
- Rah-PM 2012
Jimminy when it's a choice between starving to death or living in horrible poverty, most people chose poverty.
- iTad
Johnny, I'm one of those people, and I've tried to get jobs at fast food places, I can't because they don't have room to hire anyone else.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Before long you end up with families that have to put their children to work, etc etc.
- iTad
It's easier to understand why this wouldn't work when you have actually had to work for minimum wage. When you don't actually make enough to pay for anything except getting back to work every day.
- Rah-PM 2012
So they have no more room and they can pay their staff less? WIN!
- Johnny
We have the standard of living that we do in this country (and in the West in general) because of the horrible, evil socialists that set up minimum wages, days off, 2 day weekend, 40 hour workweek, etc.
- iTad
Rasheen, I got by fine on a part time minimum wage job. So don't tell me that.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Exactly Rah!
- iTad
What do you pay in rent Jimminy?
- Johnny
Jimminy have you been on minimum wage with a couple of kids to support? How about 4 or 5 kids?
- iTad
Christ, i had to live on minimum wage in my late teens/early 20s. NOT FUN. #LivingInCar
- Joe The Sausage
Define "got by." Did you have rent? A Vehicle? Live on Ramen noodles?
- Rah-PM 2012
Right now nothing because I have no income, and no job and can't find one.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
I'm guessing you have a backup system then... some folks don't have one.
- iTad
So where do you live?
- Johnny
@Jimminy: you live in the UK, right?
- Joe The Sausage
Some jobs are not worth $10 an hour. Some jobs cannot not support a family. That doesn't mean no one wants those jobs, or that those jobs should not exist.
- Alex Scrivener
Min wage is currently 7.25 here in Atlanta, GA, US and that's only because it went up twice last year. That's still not enough to afford to do anything except live in your car, on the street, or with your parents.
- Rah-PM 2012
Rahsheen, yes I rented a place from my aunt for $200 a month, had another $150 in bills, $100 for food, I know how to get by cheap from college, and had an old junker that my parents gave me with insurance at $500 a year. I managed to pay off $2000 in college loans, and have close to $1500 in the bank before my accident. I did this in 16 months on minimum wage, of 6.55 and 7.50.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Here is a starting point, Jimminy: "The minimum wage is a law saying that employers must discriminate against workers with low skills." http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2009...
- Alex Scrivener
And here: http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2009...
- Alex Scrivener
And right now yes, i'm living with my parents because I'm broke, I lost my job right after I was involved in my accident which cost me most of my savings. I'm literally down to <$50 and I'm fucking pissed because I can't even get a call back.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Hell, just search the whole site, he writes about it enough - http://www.google.com/search...
- Alex Scrivener
So would you have worked at that place for $5/hr?
- Johnny
I think in theory... what Jimminy is suggesting is supposed to work. But just simply delving into the first layer of this idea crops up so many issues and past experience tells us that this wouldn't work.
- Holden Page
Commend you for managing your money that well, but that's just not a normal situation for the average person. I know from personal experience that a company paying min wage will use and discard employees like toilet paper. That's why they're only paying the minimum required by law. If you took that away, G-d knows who would be flipping your burgers because nobody can actually live on minimum wage as it stands now.
- Rah-PM 2012
Johnny, yes I would have, I bumped shoulders with Fortune 500 CEO's weekly, and had me poeple teach me various business techniques. Also I was driving around brand new vehicles so it didn't hurt.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Holden, I think I agree with you both that it should work, but it doesn't. There are other variables that need to be taken into account. Like greed and desperation.
- Rah-PM 2012
When minimum wage goes up to $x, jobs which are worth $x-1 are no longer worth hiring for. Not every job is worth paying a living wage. Doesn't mean that no one wants it.
- Alex Scrivener
Alex, which jobs are not worth paying a living wage?
- Ayşe E.
Maccas employs 1.5 million people. Let's say 2/3 of those are teenagers. 1,000,000 x $5/hr (for 8 hours a day) = $40,000,000 day... 1,000,000 x $4/hr (for 8 hours a day) = $32,000,000... Do you expect Maccas to spend an extra $8 million dollars a day on teenagers because they're nice? I'm sorry Jimminy but by the sounds of your experience, you are the exception rather than the rule.
- Johnny
@Ayşe E, Lemonade Stand Operator.
- Alex Scrivener
I agree there are some that wouldn't work for $4 an hour... but there are some that would... and the race down begins
- Johnny
Rahsheen, thanks, and I agree there is greed and desperation. Sure I don't have a lot of things, but I'm happy, I had a desktop and books to read(which was one of my few indulgences).
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Alex, are you being serious?
- Ayşe E.
It's actually been documented that raising the minimum wage incrementally doesn't reduce the number of jobs. That's a misconception. With no minimum wage you get slave labor and sweatshops, because employers collude. Read your history of the American labor movement - the Pullman porter strike, the Triangle shirtwaist factory fire, the lives of Eugene Debs - and not from right-wing...
more...
- Auntie Buttinsky Botts
Yes, I am being serious. Should Lemonade Stands be illegal?
- Alex Scrivener
Illegal? I don't follow.
- Ayşe E.
Do you know why people were so pissed off about immigration, Mexicans were willing to come here and work under the table, for jobs we wouldn't do at the appropriate rate to be paid, so we could have decently priced produce? Yet we get pissed about this, because some would use our taxed services, I'm pretty sure, they were actually saving us money.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
I would rather pay more than illegals using my taxed services. Just sayin'
- Holden Page
Should we outlaw Amazon mechanical turk?
- Hayes Haugen
If a Lemonade Stand [edit: Inc.] only makes $5 an hour gross, should it be illegal to operate one, since it makes less than minimum wage in revenue?
- Alex Scrivener
We're talking about a corporate minimum wage model. Does Lemonade Stand Operator fall w/in this model?
- Ayşe E.
I think the real reason there's a minimum wage is because if wages keep falling, at some point a lot of people start realizing it's not worth busting your ass for peanuts when you could just start robbing people instead.
- Victor Ganata
Why does anyone make more than minimum wage now?
- Alex Scrivener
Jimminy, a lot of those jobs exist because farmers are unwilling to pay good money AND consumers aren't willing to pay what the produce is worth. I work in the agricultural industry and understand the cost pressure. Do you know who the biggest influencer of the cost of produce is? Big Retail chains... the same ones paying minimum wage to their staff.
- Johnny
That's why call centers moved out of the country. Nice work minimum wage!
- Hayes Haugen
If farmers are unwilling to pay good money AND consumers aren't willing to pay what the produce is worth, it isn't worth much. Worth is how much you are willing to pay.
- Alex Scrivener
Victor, you are not far from the truth. I know very intelligent people who have been in some very tight spots and crime was definitely on the table as an option to make ends meet.
- Rah-PM 2012
Hayes, they moved out cause they could pay someone else cheaper. That's not the minimum wage's fault, it's the businesses
- Johnny
Is no job better than a low-paying one?
- Alex Scrivener
Alex, cost of production sir.
- Johnny
Only 3 percent of jobs are minimum wage jobs according to the BLS
- DJ Stevie Steve
Furthermore, a lot of people on the anti-minimum-wage side of things would have you believe that only teens take minimum-wage jobs. It should be apparent from this recession that when the professional and manufacturing jobs go away, the three avenues left are entrepreneurship, long distance/online work and entrepreneurship and minimum-wage retail jobs. Go into your local Walmart and see...
more...
- Auntie Buttinsky Botts
"Is no job better than a low-paying one?" No, and that's what they're counting on
- Johnny
If you make it illegal to pay what the job is worth, the job goes away.
- Alex Scrivener
Look, I don't give a fuck what I get paid to be honest, I figured it out a while back I need $40 post-tax to live a decent life. I can work 12 hours a day doing it so that comes out at about $4/hr.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
That would be illegal, Jimminy. Sorry.
- Alex Scrivener
I know it would be illegal, and that's what pisses me off. I'm willing to work for that wage.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
But you can't, for your own good
- Alex Scrivener
You are definitely atypical, Sir.
- Rah-PM 2012
in the extreme.
- Joe The Sausage
Johnny: the business would not have made that choice if not constrained by a minimum wage rule.
- Hayes Haugen
Rahsheen, I understand money well enough, along with knowing I don't need anything but the necessities. Food, Water, Shelter, Clothing, Internet, and Transportation.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
+1 Internet as a necessity
- Alex Scrivener
Well, you can take a job at $4/hr, it would just have to be under the table. And you'd be fighting with undocumented migrants for those jobs.
- Victor Ganata
It is in this day and age.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Jimminy, would you work 16 hours for $3?
- Johnny
I don't see how $4/hr pays for Internet unless you're just using the library or free wifi...assuming you have a laptop.
- Rah-PM 2012
Johnny, no I wouldn't.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Sorry, that's my terms. No employment for you.
- Johnny
Throw Johnny in jail!
- Alex Scrivener
Rahsheen, I was doing it before that was part of that $150, $30 for 756 DSL, it's not that fast, but it's comfortable.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
LOL
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
So many variables here. DSL is location-dependent.
- Rah-PM 2012
What I'm thinking of is more of a contracted employee, now please I've got to research this rather than argue.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
It should be illegal to live where you can't get DSL
- Alex Scrivener
No, seriously, cause I have someone here who will work for $3 hour. Then my competitor will catch on and drop his wages. You sure you don't want 16 hours for $3 Jimminy?
- Johnny
How about if the gov rolls out "free broadband for everyone", then could we get rid of the min wage?
- Christian Burns
Johnny, why does anyone make more than the minimum wage?
- Alex Scrivener
I would work however many hours I needed in order to feed and house my family. I think it would be best if society would not prevent me from doing so. However society seems to think it's better if I don't in some cases and instead they just feed and house my family for me.
- Hayes Haugen
A few years ago, Burger King in the UK were employing people on zero hour contracts. They were paid minimum wage, but were told to take unpaid breaks when not required, but not allowed to go home or off the premises.
- Ian May
Becasue not every workplace employees at the minimum wage. They need to retain staff. Maccas doesn't. They need meatbags who won't steal from them.
- Johnny
Who said that your employer is going to let you work as many hours as you want? I worked for min wage and, if business was slow, your ass got sent home. Obviously depends on your industry, but I haven't seen any min wage jobs of that nature since I was in US History class.
- Rah-PM 2012
Also, the idea of contracted employees are laughable Jimminy. Do you expect a 16 year old kid to walk into the office and negotiate a contract with a seasoned manager? Start your research at Work Choices in Australia and go from there.
- Johnny
Did anyone read Makers by Cory Doctororw? The Dr Seuese style shantytown, the venders?
- Christian Burns
Ian++, common practice here in the United States of America.
- Rah-PM 2012
Jimminy, in addition to Johnny's suggestion, I'd follow MaryB's advice and read up on the U.S. Labor Movement.
- Ayşe E.
You cannot productively hire someone for more then they produce in the position. If you raise the min, you eliminate the unproductive.
- Alex Scrivener
The point is not that minimum wage is enough: the point is that having NO job and no more welfare is definitely not enough.
- Hayes Haugen
Hayes, nailed it. A little income is better than an income of $0
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
$1 a day?
- Johnny
over $0? Yes.
- Alex Scrivener
Between Ayes and JW, you other 3 are full of it...LOL
- Rah-PM 2012
So should an employer be allowed to pay me $1 a day for working at WalMart stocking shelves?
- Johnny
Yes, it's not livable but yes, if it is something simple.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
So how much is stocking shelves for 8 hours worth?
- Johnny
Should you not be allowed to take $1 to do something at WalMart?
- Alex Scrivener
Johnny, they should be allowed, but you should know that it isn't worth it on your end.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
$1 a day gets you nothing unless you're a starving child in Africa somewhere and got sponsored by an American family.
- Rah-PM 2012
Then don't take the job
- Hayes Haugen
Johnny, I'm trying to say, what you get paid is dependent on what you want, if the pay isn't enough just don't take it.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
But you all just said >$0 is better than no job
- Johnny
If I have no other option... what do I do?
- Johnny
Take the job.
- Alex Scrivener
Johnny, there are some cases where $1 would be worth it, work experience is also very valuable.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Take something over nothing. Or require that others fully take care of you. I'd rather give welfare to a family that does not make enough than a family that makes nothing.
- Hayes Haugen
Oh, so I should be GREATFUl that WalMart is paying me $1 a day to stack shelves cause I get the experience, right oh.
- Johnny
Or, you could learn how to flip burgers, or wrap tacos....or fold t-shirts!!!
- Rah-PM 2012
So you have to factor in what you expect to learn in the position along with wages, but the unemployed in the US are losing future wages merely because they are unemployed. And at 25% unemployement for males 16-24, it pisses me off even more.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Suck it up Jimminy. Volunteer or work for free and get work experience
- Johnny
Johnny, and Rah, you learn nothing doing those, so the value is $0
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
While working for free for experience, how are we paying for food and rent?
- Ayşe E.
Are you in the US, Jimminy? Cuz I have seen 0 min wage jobs that provide any type of useful on-the-job experience...which is why they're minimum wage.
- Rah-PM 2012
Ayse, is that a question for me?
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Donesn't matter... you can feast on the glorious work experience you are getting
- Johnny
You can live off the fat of the land!
- Rah-PM 2012
Jimminy, yeah, Johnny and Rah are right. Volunteer and Internships open doors!
- Melanie Reed
Society provides welfare to those who do not have enough.
- Hayes Haugen
Bullshit, Hayes. I lost my job and was taking care of 2 kids and a wife. Welfare told me to Suck It.
- Rah-PM 2012
Rah, um, mine actually taught me how to interact with people, and (accounting)book work. Also it loosened me up with driving, because I was afraid to drive before that position.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Who pays for the welfare?
- Johnny
Sure, Jimminy, if you'd like to answer it. I'm at a loss.
- Ayşe E.
Also: all those folks working for free for experience, if they can't buy goods and services, how is this good for the economy?
- Ayşe E.
Rahsheen: I'm talking ideally. You did not get unemployment benefits?
- Hayes Haugen
So, Jimminy, back to my question. Would you work for $3/hr for 16 hours if I gave you heaps of experience?
- Johnny
Johnny, Rahsheen, I think you are focusing on what the businesses should be allowed to do. Turn it around. If someone wants to do a job for $5 an hour, why should it be illegal for him to take it?
- Alex Scrivener
Because then everyone else gets paid $5 an hour. And then we all start living off sweet delicious 'Experience'
- Johnny
Alex, it's not. If someONE wants to pay him $5/hr, that's their prerogative.
- Rah-PM 2012
So he should not have a job to protect your wage?
- Alex Scrivener
Really? You make a distinction between being hired by a firm and an individual? What about hired by a family?
- Alex Scrivener
Hayes, No. Getting unemployment is actually not as easy as it seems. Jobs that pay low also don't like paying unemployment and will fight it tooth and nail. I was able to find something else before I had to go through all that.
- Rah-PM 2012
Alex, doesn't the law? As far as I'm aware, an individual paying someone to do a job doesn't fall under min wage laws. Correct me if I'm wrong.
- Rah-PM 2012
Ayse, obviously you need a position that pays money. So you shouldn't worry so much about experience if you really need monetary supplements. The need for money is greater than the need for experience.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
If it is formal employment, it does
- Alex Scrivener
How about a negative income tax? You work for $5 an hour and you get 20% back.
- Hayes Haugen
Define "formal employment"
- Rah-PM 2012
Yes, he shouldn't. because that protects EVERYONE's wages from the owner turning around and saying 'Look, Jimminy is working for $5. You all do that or you are fired"... Until the next guy comes in for $4
- Johnny
W-2
- Alex Scrivener
Hong Kong as no minimum wage, FWIW.
- Kurt Starnes
As wages reduce in this ideal world--$5 to $4 to $3, all the way down to "for the experience"--will the cost of goods and services reduce as well? Cos, you know, that would be convenient.
- Ayşe E.
Alex, obviously, that doesn't fall under an individual paying someone.
- Rah-PM 2012
It does if I hire a personal assistant, or trainer
- Alex Scrivener
Ayse, and therein lies the problem. LOL.
- Rah-PM 2012
Johnny, if you put me in a position where I expected average experiential gains of $1.00/hr yes. I would take your position.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
How would you support yourself while you are in my employment?
- Johnny
Ayes, yes they should, as production costs decrease, and the demand for higher price product decreases, the cost should also decrease.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
How would he support himself if it is illegal to take your job?
- Alex Scrivener
Alex, they have to be certified and file that income on their taxes. However, I can pay my little brother to work for me and don't have to go through all those hoops. Can't remember the specific tax laws at the moment.
- Rah-PM 2012
Johnny, I would cut back, but I wouldn't remain with you at the price up to the point I was assured of the value statement of the experience could be transfered.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
I just want a system that encourages work, encourages business activity and allows people who consume more value than they produce to still live with some dignity.
- Hayes Haugen
That sounds like "under the table" to me.
- Alex Scrivener
Rah, I would like to hire you as my personal Lemonade Stand Operator Workout Coach. LOLZ.
- Ayşe E.
Jimminy, I am your sole source of income. Try again
- Johnny
Alex, there is a legal way to make that work. Like I said, can't remember the specifics ATM.
- Rah-PM 2012
Wow, a world with just you and him?
- Alex Scrivener
He is working for me 16hr a day, remember?
- Johnny
A world where you can work for just $1/hr and it's gone to the point where corporations have significantly lowered prices to accomodate...either it's Utopia or Mad Max and the Thunderdome.
- Rah-PM 2012
LOL@Ayse
- Rah-PM 2012
Johnny, you just broke the world, there is an evolutionary mechanic, this is how people move up the ranks.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
If you want to define minimum wage as the wage above which you have to file paperwork and pay taxes, fine, go for it. Sounds great. Make it $50 an hour. But if minimum wage is the cutoff for illegal activity, below which doing a job becomes a crime, it seems counter-productive.
- Alex Scrivener
And Johnny, I said I'd cut back to meet your $3/hr. Obviously I don't need electricity, internet, cable, or a phone, so you saved me a ton of money. I'm just going to be working for you, so I don't have a need for those.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Jimminy - Here's some info for your study: http://www.cato.org/pub_dis... Excerpt: "In 1946, George Stigler, a Nobel laureate, pointed out that the minimum wage negatively affects the level of employment. Stigler's view now enjoys near-total acceptance in the economic profession."
- Kurt Starnes
Alex, I'm just going by the laws that are in place.
- Rah-PM 2012
So by making wages cheaper... there is more employment? If I could pay my staff less, I would and just reap the benefits of the $$$. Why hire more staff than I need... They're only cheaper
- Johnny
Staff produce profits. Unless you pay them too much. Then you go out of business.
- Alex Scrivener
Johnny, more people = an increase in potential gains, more work means more production, more production results in more items to sell, so long as you are in a field that doesn't get saturated easily, you will see more profits based on equivalent profit yeilded per item.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Hong Kong has very high per-capita income levels, with no minimum wage.
- Kurt Starnes
And if your margins get too high, competitors will come in and undercut you,
- Alex Scrivener
2 things Jimminy. 1) I don't need more staff. 2) Me and my competitors are paying staff less, which means less disposable income which means less sales which means reducing cost of item which means less profits
- Johnny
What you say makes sense, Jimminy, but only for a specific type of market. For instance, it falls flat when applied to the restaurant industry or fast food. Too many cooks in the kitchen means some will get fired and others will have their hours cut.
- Rah-PM 2012
Rah, I just though I'd say something about your robberies, not that it's slowed down a bit. Do you think people are more likely to steal when they are suffering from sustained unemployment or low wages. I'm pretty sure it happens more likely under the first.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Rah, there are still ways for the margins for various products to be maintained.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
In a competitive market (not strict monopolies) firms will bear a cost to employ (includes overhead, not just wages) equal to the productivity of the employee. If they pay less, other firms will undercut the profit margin. If they pay more, they go broke.
- Alex Scrivener
More than likely under the first, but when you know your job (or lack of one) means your wife and children won't eat, you start to think outside of the box. I have been in both positions and I could definitely sympathize with someone who may have taken some....uh..."liberties" being stuck between a rock and a hard place.
- Rah-PM 2012
Honestly, this is a very experiential thread, even if it's an argument, we're going into various economic and business aspects, while also discussing something that could have a huge effect on the world.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Oh and I'd like to highlight Kurt, he's said somethings that are very interesting about Hong Kong, but noone else has seemed to acknowledge him.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Great job, Kurt
- Alex Scrivener
Not understanding what you mean about maintaining food. You make the food, nobody buys it. You throw it away. Kurt's comment didn't have enough information for me to comment on. I was waiting for more.
- Rah-PM 2012
Jimminy, the 40 hour work week and the minimum wage were a response to the industrial revolution. I saw Kurt's post... Poverty rate has risen from 14.8% in 1995 to 17.7% in 2005 in Hong Kong... so there's that (Source: http://www.hkcss.org.hk/cb4...)
- Johnny
Oh, and after you have someone throw the extra food out, you send them home because you can't afford to pay them for standing around.
- Rah-PM 2012
There we go! Numbers! And Links!
- Rah-PM 2012
Here is a little story about the guys who collect carts in parking lots. They now us a machine to help push the long rows of carts, rather than a second guy, because it is cheaper than paying someone. http://cafehayek.com/2009...
- Alex Scrivener
Or, they use bungee cord (Target)...depends on how cheap they want to get.
- Rah-PM 2012
Either way, unskilled labor is priced out of a job.
- Alex Scrivener
Jimminy, Alex: My pleasure. Keep up the good fight! Rahsheen - I posted a couple of excerpts, but the whole article should be read for proper context. I think a key to the debate here is that a minimum wage eliminates price competition, which ultimately hurts unskilled workers, according to a lot of data and many studies.
- Kurt Starnes
"A minimum wage increases unemployment among young and unskilled workers." Of 211 economists who responded, 90 percent agreed, or agreed with provisions, with this statement. http://econlog.econlib.org/archive...
- Alex Scrivener
What about a decrease?
- Johnny
Lowers unemployment
- Alex Scrivener
Study? Evidence?
- Johnny
Johnny, I don't think it's ever been done, because once someone has been paid a wage, they get the feeling they are entitled to recieve such a wage. Not saying everyone, but most.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Wife calling. Must go.http://xkcd.com/386/
- Alex Scrivener
Here's a list of fifty years of studies: http://www.house.gov/jec... Excerpt: "For many years it has been a matter of conventional wisdom among economists that the minimum wage causes fewer jobs to exist than would be the case without it. This is simply a matter of price theory, taught in every economics textbook, requiring no elaborate analysis to...
more...
- Kurt Starnes
Just curious. Has anyone here belonged to a union or had a parent or grandparent that belonged to a union? Good? Bad? Ugly? Why?
- Melanie Reed
BTW, congrats to all for the exceptionally civil discussion -- a somewhat rare thing on the internets. A tribute to FF, IMO.
- Kurt Starnes
Look. In my opinion, I could pay my staff less, and hire more staff, but I would be paying less FOR less. I don't pay my staff what they are worth, I get unhappy and unhealthy staff. Most of us sit her and chat like we have a god damn idea what living in true poverty is like. What it's like to work for nothing. A lot of us don't. And that's what I really love about these studies and...
more...
- Johnny
Kurt, it's more like me deciding to go walk in the snow, I understand both Rahsheen, and Johnny's POV, and if you look above, I was wondering why not having a minimum wage wouldn't work. Which I still have to research, but I have alot of views, and source material to look at.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
@Jimminy... if you can, try to get your hands on a book called "Nickel and Dimed" (http://bit.ly/8gqrTR) — it's written by a New York Times journalist who goes "undercover" by taking a string of waitressing, fast food, and cleaning jobs, just to see what life is like when one makes minimum wage. It's quite an eye-opener. People need to make a "living wage" and arguably, the minimum wage barely qualifies.
- .LAG liked that
.LAG, if you like Nickel & Dimed have you read Scratch Beginnings(http://www.scratchbeginnings.com/), a grad student changed all of his documentation(no skills), and started with $25 in Charleston, SC, he lived this way for just under a year, ended up with a furnished apartment, a vehicle and >$2500 in the bank. Nickel and Dimed was where he came up with the idea to attempt this.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
...interesting. I will check it out. Glad you're aware of "Nickel and Dimed." Good, thought-provoking thread too.
- .LAG liked that
.LAG, also I've lived happily on Minimum wage, but it's definitely not something I could have done with a kid, or expecting to purchase everything you want. One must find happiness with what they have, know what they need, and indulge in wants when they can be afforded, no matter how infrequently.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Johnny, that's why I said you can self impose a minimum wage you are willing to offer your employees as a business man. I just don't think it should be a national mandated event.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
...we live in such a materialistic culture. i think a lot of people definite happiness by the things they can get. i don't doubt one could live—by themselves—on minimum wage, but a frugal life that would be, no doubt.
- .LAG liked that
Johnny, also I have seen real poverty, my birth father, his wife, and my half siblings, have lived in a very below livable situation for years, but they choose not to help themselves. he chooses to stay home and watch the kids, and she chose to quit her job, when they really needed the money. Then the economy collapsed and she couldn't find a job, so my grandfather and aunt have paid their bills for years just for the childrens sake, and it's disgusting to me.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Johhny -- I understand your point. I think you get what you pay for re wages and employees. Happy, well paid employees are going to show up to work and likely do a better job than those getting paid very little. What many studies show is that a minimum wage actually increases unemployment and, therefore, poverty levels. I don't have an answer and I certainly don't like anyone having to...
more...
- Kurt Starnes
Johnny, I also understand worrying about contempt from your employees, I'm sure I've brought the topic up somewhere before, but if you're hiring based on what they chose for compensation, they have no reason to be unhappy or resentful of you, it was their choice.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
There is a direct correlation between minimum wage and poverty levels, or is it just an assumption that poverty is higher with a min wage in place? Cuz the later doesn't make any sense given how much it costs to live.
- Rah-PM 2012
Rah, unemployment increases with a higher minimum wage, along with inflation in production costs that ultimately get passed to consumers. This increases costs, making it harder for those on minimum wage to afford the basics. It is an inflationary cycle that forces the poverty line higher, while also increasing unemployment making it even harder to live without welfare, which then taxes...
more...
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
See: http://www.heritage.org/Researc... (Study references at the bottom of the page) Excerpt: "The facts, however, show otherwise. Many economists have examined the evidence and come to the surprising conclusion that the minimum wage does not reduce poverty. Ohio University economists Richard Vedder and Lowell Gallaway examined the effect that increases in the minimum...
more...
- Kurt Starnes
The author of the above article makes three points re minimum wage and poverty levels: "First, the only workers who benefit from a higher minimum wage are those who actually earn that higher wage. Raising the minimum wage reduces many workers' job opportunities and working hours. Second, few minimum-wage earners actually come from poor households. Third, the majority of poor Americans do not work at all, for any wage, so raising the minimum wage does not help them."
- Kurt Starnes
So we're totally cool with sweatshops that pay about $4 a DAY, then?
- Victor Ganata
Victor, not if they are using children, and not if they employee didn't agree to work for that, but one must also figure cost of living into that. Sweatshops in the US at $4/DAY wouldn't work. In certain markets I'm sure $4 would be capable of supplying the necessities to live upon.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
I mean, I really think this discussion is assuming that everyone is going to obey the law. There are plenty of subminimum wage jobs out there that don't give you W-2s, and there are lot of criminal activities that earn quite a bit more than minimum wage which don't require much skill to perform, which legitimate work needs to compete with. I actually think there is a point where if...
more...
- Victor Ganata
Why do you think Communist revolutions happened in a lot developing countries? (Well, besides the whole "drive out the imperialists" thing.)
- Victor Ganata
Victor, that's why I think the system itself should be allowed to reach equilibria, the price you are willing to work at vs the price the employer is willing to pay to employ you at.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
The problem is that the transitions between steady states aren't smooth in economics. Catastrophes seem to be more the rule than the exception. And as I think you pointed out, people don't take as kindly to downtrends as to uptrends.
- Victor Ganata
Also the determinants of equilibrium wages are difficult to pin down. Discrimination is acknowledged by most economists as a determining factor. Education may only be part of a "signaling effect" meaning that increasing education attainment will not necessarily raise the level of overall wages. Ex: you would have a waiter with a Phd.
- Melanie Reed
The system designed by economists has you and I on a stable trajectory of entry level job in our 20's and then a rise up the corporate ladder till we pan out in our 50's and then sink into a stable retirement. ;) unfortunately, it never really worked that way in regard to the constant contraction and expansion of the marketplace layered with catastrophes, high rate of divorce, etc. Now...
more...
- Melanie Reed
Victor, and Melanie, I agree with you, the system is broken, but somethings are just about impossible to repair at this point, and others would take several decades(and even those might not pan out in the long run). I don't even think it's possible to reverse minimum wage at this point, unless you discriminate against the young, phasing it out for the people who never had the benefit of...
more...
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Just wanted to add a few European countries that don't have national minimum wage: Germany, Finland, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and Italy (not a complete list, I'm sure). I'm not saying they're paradises, but I think they have some viable alternatives to national minimum wage.
- Eivind
@Johnny: About your Hong Kong numbers: I just want to point out that the entire leap in poverty rate seems to have happened just when the Asian financial crisis occurred (and Hong Kong became part of China) (in '97).
- Eivind
Eivind, those countries you listed have fairly robust social welfare safety nets in place, no? At least robust compared to the U.S.
- Victor Ganata
from iPod
There are day-laborer "pick-up" sites in every city of any reasonable size. Construction contractors, moving contractors, landscape contractors, etc. all know where to find a supply of people who will work for whatever they're offered. An acquaintance of mine did this and lost his toe when a lawn mower rolled back on him. His "employers" were generous and paid him for the full day when they dropped him off at the ER and took off.
- Mark J
*bump*
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
Jiminy, your argument is a standard theoretical economic argument. It has a serious problem: it treats laborers as continuous when in fact they are discrete. Furthermore, it is contradicted by the actual data, as shown by Card and Krueger. See the summary here http://www.uvm.edu/~vlrs... or the book here http://www.amazon.com/gp...
- Ruchira S. Datta
Ruchira, I came to the conclusion I was wrong for the most part. One thing that the data from that summary is that it only analyzes the effect during a period of economic expansion, and not contraction. Which makes it much more feasible to allow the increases, without harming the total number of employee's.
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
So if minimum wage laws are good, then why not just jack it up to $100/hour. That would make us all better off and wealthy right? If not, then why does anyone think it works at a lower rate?
- Mark Horne
@Mark - wow, your strawman argument has totally convinced me!
- Andrew C (✓)
Um, I'm asking how it works, not claiming anyone thinks it would work to make $100/ houre increase mandatory. So there is no strawman argument present. I'm asking how a minimum wage law can be called helpful. In the case of $100 an hour we all know that it would cause unemployment or maybe price inflation. So how would $8/hour not do the same on a smaller scale. Are we helping people,...
more...
- Mark Horne
Mark, the problem with the theoretical argument is that the fact that workers are discrete, not continuous means the demand curve of labor is not a sloping straight line, but a staircase. A small increase in the minimum wage moves along one of the treads of the staircase, increasing the wage without decreasing the number of people employed. A large increase to $100 an hour would move way past this point and would decrease the number of people employed.
- Ruchira S. Datta
Mark, the reason why "anyone thinks it works at a lower rate" is that they looked at the data and it does. I came up with my explanation for why the theoretical argument doesn't work after the empirical data was in. That's how science progresses.
- Ruchira S. Datta
Jimminy, thanks for being open to learning from data. Another thing that happens during economic expansion is generally inflation. Firms may short-sightedly try to keep the paper profits from increased prices of goods, increasing earnings per share, rather than filtering them down to the rank-and-file workers. But eventually the workers can't afford to consume more goods, triggering...
more...
- Ruchira S. Datta
Bump for current relevancy
- Jimminy, CoG of FF
The New Yardstick: If You’re Not Apple, You Lose - http://theappleblog.com/2010...
He conveniently leaves out any mention of Android or even Windows 7.
- Hayes Haugen
This is cool.
Amir, Laura Norvig, Kol Tregaskes and 27 other people liked this
I fail to understand.
- Richard A.
Looks like on the fly OCR, properly parsed into contact data. That is win.
- EricaJoy
Richard, it's one possible use of the new Google Goggles product http://www.techcrunch.com/2009.... It recognize the text on visit cards and makes it useful. That's a pretty convincing application of Google's mission IMO.
- Jérôme
I was just thinking how much I would like smartphone OCR.
- Andrew C (✓)
If you have this installed on your Android phone, for fun go to Amazon and start taking pictures of book covers. Its nuts!
- EricaJoy
Another reason to get an androphone soon, very soon ;-)
- stanjourdan
Erica, the existing Amazon Android app does book covers. And so does the standalone app SnapTell. =)
- Andrew C (✓)
Just DL'ed from Android Market. Doesn't work all the time but very cool!
- Mike Reynolds
Took a picture of a bag of potato chips and got some demon wicca sex blogs. But then took a picture of a coffee table art book that's just a figurative painting on cover and it correctly identified it as a Julian Schnabel book. Definitely entertaining but definitely labs level results.
- Hayes Haugen
Can't see it in the [Canadian] Market. Does it work with Android 1.5?
- Andrew C (✓)
Nope, 1.6 and newer. Turning into a trend.
- Hayes Haugen
Then Rogers *really* needs to get off their asses and release the 1.6 update.
- Andrew C (✓)
Ahhhh.so it's for people with crappy input devices ;-). One day will people have forgotten how to type. It's a good idea. We'll see when they make it available to all platforms.
- Richard A.
If a device hasn't been updated to 1.6 already I don't think it's likely it ever will be. Everyone has their hands full with 2.0.1.
- Hayes Haugen
Ergh, maybe I'll just root the phone then. =P
- Andrew C (✓)
There is an app called CardReader for the iPhone (3GS or better) that can scan a business card, send it to a server to OCR it, then import that info into a new contact. It works pretty good on standard looking cards, but fails when the cards have a busy background or such.
- Ken Gidley
Microsoft Kin is dead - http://www.engadget.com/2010...
At least they cancelled it shortly after launch - though it never should have shipped in the first place.
- Hayes Haugen
Perhaps it needed to launch in order to be canceled. In other words, perhaps launching helped the internal political situation move on.
- Scott Ludwig
48-hour sale on EA's iPhone games makes wasting time affordable - http://mobile.engadget.com/2010...
Wow. Biggest launch of the IOS platform is being used by one of the biggest platform publishers to....roll out strip-mall pricing.
- Hayes Haugen
NSFW: Content Is King! Rest In Peace, Content (Paul Carr/TechCrunch) - http://www.techmeme.com/100614...
"does the block of words pack in enough high-buzz keywords to rope in a hundred thousand or so Google searchers? And can it be spread out over enough pages to provide half a dozen ad impressions for each of those users? If so, great: now they just need the users to click on one of those ads and GTFO, which probably explains why so much online content peters out within 30 seconds of the headline."
- Hayes Haugen
Did someone make an iPhone app that scans your call log and does a reverse-lookup on unknown numbers yet? Because that would be awesome.
shannonmorley, Louis Dershowitz, Chatsohbet and 4 other people liked this
I think I've heard of an Android app that does something similar using white pages data. Dunno about iPhone though.
- Matt Cutts
from iPhone
Indeed it would.
- Roberto Bonini
I seriously doubt apple would let a third party app data mine the phone app. To many privacy issues
- Charles Dick
Matt: Android has a few apps like that. I use "caller lookup" which tells me the caller name and city of incoming calls, and also whether it is a telemarketer. The one extra feature I would really like it to have is to automatically block the call or send it to voicemail if it is identified as a telemarketer.
- Simon
Android, Windows Mobile, Blackberry and Symbian all allow API access to the call log.
- Hayes Haugen
Truecaller does something similar to that.
- Otto
How a Silly Phone for Teens Reveals Microsoft's Plan for Us All (John Herrman/Gizmodo) - http://www.techmeme.com/100605...
" Yet the one unequivocally great feature is a web service called Studio. The concept is simple: Each Kin phone automatically and transparently uploads virtually everything created with the phone to Microsoft's servers, from photos and videos to text messages and social media updates...Why doesn't every phone work like this? " That's what our software has done for years (dashwire.com).
- Hayes Haugen
Is there any programmer who would like to develop Friendfeed Windows Mobile 6.x application?
HasanCivelek liked this
If it was 1 year ago I would say yes.
- Hayes Haugen
Now why not? :)
- Sencer Bugrahan
As much as I enjoy FriendFeed and coding in .net there's only so much time to do stuff.
- Hayes Haugen
Even if they do make it, WM Smartphone devices without touch screen would be alienated as second class citizen anyway.
- Natsuki Seika
Be Careful With Content Providers - http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2010...
Wherein Google specifically calls out that nearly 2 years into Android there is no blessed access to SMS outside of sending them. There is also no blessed access to calendar.
- Hayes Haugen
Auto Facial Attractiveness Enhancement Engine - http://www.cs.tau.ac.il/~tommer...
Carrie Thomson, natasha william, Suresh S and 127 other people liked this
This is amazing. I think we should automatically apply it to all profile photos ;)
- Paul Buchheit
Facial discrimination?
- Jason
Impressive.
- j1m
Can I get one for the body as well as the face?
- Dion Almaer
Very interesting. Hope they post the download link soon so that we can all play with it.
- Brady Brim-DeForest
It seems as if the main problem with most people in the examples shown is their forehead is too short or too narrow. Wonder if there's a subtle clue that big brains are beautiful there! :)
- Lindsay
@Jason - that's an interesting concept. Would you be more likely to trust the girl on the left or right? Would you be more likely to talk to either one of them at a party (or more intimidated by either one?).
- Lindsay
Right one looks more dumb...
- philsmirnov
Notice that for all the women they soften the jaw, while squaring it for men. Everyone also gets a slightly thinner face and upturned almost smiling lips.
- FFing Enigma
@SB yeah and the forehead adjustment... almost like there is a triangle with the forehead at the point and they flip it so the chin is the bottom of the triangle... weird.
- Lindsay
They are different women! Blame Paul! : )
- Erhan Erdoğan
impressive
- accexine
Lindsay: whenever sketching generic faces, the face starts as an inverted triangle and the eyes appear a third of the way down from the top of the forehead; lips and nose appear below and above (respectively) a line 1/3 up from the chin. Looks like these pictures are rearranged to meet that particular school of drawing.
- FFing Enigma
That is interesting yet odd. Seems that the faces are slendered with the software.
- Jim Goldstein
from twhirl
I wonder what would come out of applying their algorithms to face of black or asian person? Different countries have different concepts of beauty.
- arty
This technology should be made available in eye glasses, just imagine how much better your work day can be!
- Claude Betancourt
Paul - Think you should definitely add the option. "Click here to be beautiful without the expense of plastic surgery! .... and you may even get more 'Likey's" :)"
- Charlie Anzman
Some of the stuff coming out of Siggraph this year is really freaky. How about combining this with the automatic video editing stuff? ;)
- Joe Beda
without a doubt amazing. It's incredible how subtle the changes are yet massive difference.
- Zee.
Huh, that's pretty crazy. Creepy, but cool. :)
- felix
I haven't read the paper, but I wonder if it adapts to different notions of "attractive" (that changes from culture to culture ...)
- Rui Pires
+1 @Claude I was thinking the same thing! Incorporate this software in wearable monitor glasses, and the whole world would be beautiful! I'll bet we can look for these on the shelves in the U.S. just before November. Social media and reality enhancement software have put Winston Smith out of a job.
- ɐ ɯıʞ sıɹɥɔ
do i sense another manga-style meme starting?
- anna sauce
So, if it turns me into Gilbert Godfried... what does that mean?
- Ⓒⓗⓡⓘⓢ Ⓟⓘⓡⓘⓛⓛⓞ
You know, if these guys had gotten together with the realtime video+photo enhancement folks and approached the Beijing Olympic Comittee then that singing girl in the opening ceremonies might not have had to been replaced with a body double. (Yeah, I just brought three of this week's biggest memes together. I'll be here all week.)
- Kevin Fox
The artist proportions were laid out by the Greeks as the perfect human, that's not being used here. This beautification engine, I think, builds on top of a previous study where some students tried to mathematically identify attractiveness. They had participants rate the attractiveness of head shots from yearbooks. What they found was there was a high correlation b/w the geometrically "average" face and high attraction. That "average" is based on the proportions of the di
- xero
stances between the individual elements of the face and their relative sizes. IIRC the software adjusts elements so they statistically/geometrically complement each other. It's not actually working toward a golden set of proportions, but a set of proportions appropriate for the individual as defined by the masses. I wouldn't think of it as "facial discrimination" so much as "deviation from ones potential".
- xero
I'm waiting for the first Facebook application that automatically enhances your profile picture like this. Every social network should run this on the avatars. Beautiful people!
- Benedikt Koehler
Can you imagine the controversy if dating sites got a hold of this?
- xero
@paul automatically apply it to all profile photos, huh? are you sure you ready for results? check my picture - try to see wonderful cossacks writing infamous letter to Turkish Sultan :)
- A. T.
I wonder if they'll turn Mickey Mouse into Mighty Mouse
- Dave Q
@Lindsay; A)Maybe/? 1=Left 2=Right 3=N/A
- Jason
this will have a lot of practical applications to create a (virtual) world of beautiful (or more acceptable facially) people.
- Apostolos Tsompanopoulos
Just a complicated high tech implementation of beer goggles.
- Hayes Haugen
Chris' comment is sooo tempting
- Charlie Anzman
This is what came up as the top Google hit for paul buchheit friendfeed.
- Spidra Webster
I just read the first comment and may I ask why we should apply it automatically to all profile pictures??? Who are we gonna kid that way?!
- ambidextrous
it's long gone.
- Joe The Sausage
It's down :(
- Burcu Dogan
cannot open this link,404 is there~
- 阿石
Programmers: in practice, where have you used a bit shift?
imabonehead, Morton Fox, Mo Kargas and 2 other people liked this
It's a hardcore way of compressing configuration data, too.
- Akiva
To multiply or divide by two.
- Ruchira S. Datta
To elaborate on the question - have you ever done this in a high-level language like php
- Robert Felty
Bit shift exists in php??!
- Ruchira S. Datta
Very, very rarely in modern languages. I can't remember the last time I needed to worry with bit twiddling.
- iTad
Rarely for me, but bitmasks and hashes absolutely
- Mo Kargas
In the rose garden. Oh, wait, you said shiFt...
- ☆ Mellyboo ☆
I took a php evaluation test today, which included several questions about bitshifting and bitwise logic. I got them right, but I was really wondering why anyone would need them.
- Robert Felty
For normal business software written in modern languages, you're probably doing something wrong if you're bothering with stuff like that. If you're writing games or doing something with advanced math, science or physics maybe you'll need it. But for PHP?? Doesn't make sense.
- iTad
Counting members of a set (particularly members of a very large set, where efficiency matters) is something that comes up pretty often in some contexts, but I agree it would be a very bad idea to do this in PHP.
- Ruchira S. Datta
PHP library writers use it when portability precludes using an C extension and so forth.
- Micah
But I can see some "dude" putting it on a PHP test to show that he's old school and "smart". If that happens fire back with questions about rotates instead of shifts.
- Hayes Haugen
Serializing integers and longs to byte arrays or hex strings. Doing unsigned comparisons in Java.
- Jim Norris
If you're wondering why you would need to do bit manipulations on a web page, I agree that's pretty rare. If you're wondering why would need to do so in a high level language, I do bit manipulations all the time in Python because I write binary protocols to talk to various devices.
- Gabe
Chrome Experiments - Home - http://www.chromeexperiments.com/
 |
Some pretty sweet stuff done in jscript. Simple fabric modeling, canvas animations, html5 video mapping.
- Hayes Haugen
Picnik's Jon Sposato on why he didn't take VC: 'We were greedy' - http://www.techflash.com/seattle...
Thanks for the link. I think wanting to get return from their investment is not the same as being greedy.
- Scott Ludwig
I don't think "greedy" was the best choice of words. They wanted to risk their money in exchange for the full upside instead of letting a VC insert itself in that equation. I was impressed that they had $1 million per month in revenue before the sale.
- Hayes Haugen
from email
Posted first pic to mobileme: screenshot of my bank info. Public by default? Check. Not possible to use ipad to delete it? Check. Unbelievable.
Gallery app does not let you hide or delete pics. Safari on iPad redirects you to mobile site that does not allow interaction with gallery. Is it possible to delete or hide a mobile me picture from the iPad?
- Hayes Haugen
MobileMe does not have the same quality as Apple's hardware devices.
- Scott Ludwig
from iPhone
It's funny to me that the universal "save" icon is still a floppy disk. What do our kids even think that means?
Ton Zijp, Roberto Bonini, Rob H. and 25 other people liked this
It means Save! Duh. :)
- Louis Gray
Hahaha! Well, symbols become their own things. How many people here can answer why the symbol of pawn shops is three spheres?
- Spidra Webster
I found a few unlabeled floppies when packing & wanted to check what was on them, but cannot find any computer with a floppy drive.
- Lo the Baker
And in MS Word the floppy disk is reversed.
- Micah
What would you suggest, Sarah? Maybe we should start a movement to change the "save" symbol from a floppy disk to a nice, fluffy cloud. :)
- Curdy G
Also, the Save button is on the endangered species list. Where's the save button in many of the iMovie, all sorts of iPhone apps and many AJAXified web apps?
- Micah
Hmm. Maybe a treasure chest? That's where I'd save my special stuff. Or a filing cabinet? I dunno. But using any technology symbol (CD-R, USB stick) is probably risky, given what happened to the floppy...
- Que Sarah Sarah
My kids think it's an SD card image.
- Anika
Spidra, is the pawn shop symbol to do with balances or something?
- Yolanda
I'll think about this the next time I dial a phone.
- Joe Beda
Look at many icons on modern devices. The YouTube icon on iPhone is perfect example. And the image of a classic phone handset.
- Hayes Haugen
I had a dream about a rotary phone last night. A nightmare, actually. SPOOKY.
- Que Sarah Sarah
I am just happy it doesn't' take up 8" of the screen.
- John D Reasor
Yolanda, it has to do with the patron saint of pawnbrokers. St. Nicholas. http://hubpages.com/hub...
- Spidra Webster
Spidra, you are full of interesting tid bits. But that is a weird story to hold up as good for pawn shops.
- Clare Dibble
I like LolCurtz' idea of a "cloud" button.
- Meryn Stol
I wrote about this in March - http://jimsmarketingblog.com/2010...
- Jim Connolly
Glad y'all got your 3g ipads. we've had our ipads for a month. So let's here what is new and different. And what existing ipad owners think 1 month later.
I still really like it but $500 is a super early adopter price.
- Hayes Haugen
Thumbs up one month after. It justifies itself. Now the category needs more legit entrants and prices need to come down.
- Scott Ludwig
The Temptation of Tiger Woods | Culture | Vanity Fair - http://www.vanityfair.com/culture...
"Their relationship settled into a routine: meet at the CVS, follow him to the house, make love. Then she would return to her hostess stand and he would resume the life of a superstar golfer."
- Hayes Haugen
from Bookmarklet
Look what happens when you substitute the word "Apple" for the word "Adobe" and "iPhone" for "Flash" in this paragraph from the top of Jobs' post [repost, Friendfeed cut it off the first time]: "Apple's products are 100% proprietary. They are only available from Apple, and Apple has sole authority as to their future enhancement, pricing, etc....
Rob H., Ladyepiphanybug, Arlan K. and 8 other people liked this
Grrrrrr, does FriendFeed have a word count limit now? This keeps getting cut off.....
- Paul Wilcox
Look what happens when you substitute the word "Apple" for the word "Adobe" and "iPhone" for "Flash" in this paragraph from the top of Jobs' post [repost, Friendfeed cut it off the first time]: "Apple's products are 100% proprietary. They are only available from Apple, and Apple has sole authority as to their future enhancement, pricing, etc. While Apple's iPhone products are widely...
more...
- Paul Wilcox
And in the next paragraph Apple admits as much. The difference is that Apple isn't insisting that other companies must incorporate Apples closed, proprietary OS into their own devices. The comparison doesn't really hold up.
- Kevin Fox
Apple does so under the facade of "user experience", so its ok. /sarcasm
- JCunwired
Kevin -- is Adobe or anybody insisting that Apple include Flash in their devices?
- Brian Sullivan
Yes.
- Kevin Fox
INYIM: Huh?
- Kevin Fox
It was a well-written piece. But you have to admit Jobs is kind of moving in on Gruber's territory here. :)
- Micah
Kevin -- what form does this insistence take? I thought that Adobe had already announced abandonment of their Flash for iXxx project?
- Brian Sullivan
I thought Jobs was already living in Gruber's territory with his habit of responding to long emails with blunt one or two word answers.
- Kevin Fox
Brian, seriously? Adobe attacked Apple several times over the last two months for not including Flash. They only walked away from the Flash for iX project when Apple changed the license to preclude it. Clearly Steve's letter is a response to Adobe's campaign to get Flash on the iPhone.
- Kevin Fox
But my point was that being as Adobe has announced abandonment of the project -- Steve is a bit behind the times here. I am wondering about the timing for his rant.
- Brian Sullivan
Adobe's like some rat or something trapped behind a glass wall trying to get to the iPhone cheese, when all they have to do is take one step to the right and they're there: If they just turned their attention to generating HTML5 and became the default provider for HTML5 authoring tools the same way Photoshop's the standard for graphics, we'd all win.
- Ken Sheppardson
Brian, he's probably getting in front of the news cycle that starts when CS5 goes on sale (tomorrow?). There's going to be a lot written about Flash in the next few weeks and he'd like this context in place beforehand.
- Kevin Fox
All this talk of HTML5 and standards. Just have to point out that HTML5 is a "proposed standard".
- Brian Sullivan
No, HTML 5 is officially a "Draft Standard", which is one step beyond "Proposed Standard". The standards track is defined in RFC 2026.
- Otto
OK - mea culpa -- but it is not standard and may be as far as 5 years away from that status.
- Brian Sullivan
If all the browser providers have implemented the draft standard, it seems like a distinction without a difference to me.
- Ken Sheppardson
@Blu T - You can create offline websites that will run on an iPhone/iPad (probably on Android too) without a network connection via HTML5. You have to create a manifest file which lists all the resources for the site (which will be downloaded locally) and include some meta tags so that the manifest/resources are downloaded when someone visits the site from the phone but once that...
more...
- Lindsay
The Black Swan Google Voice client is a GREAT example of an HTML 5 app that lives on the iPhone itself: http://voicecentral.riverturn.com/ Very, very cool.
- Otto
Ken, HTML5 is not expected to reach candidate recommendation stage until 2012. In the interim there are a multitude of issues to work out - OS, browser, java & .NET compatibility, H.264 codec patent,etc. Not to mention the inconsistencies that exist in the draft specification itself. I think it was Forrester who predicted 5 years out before rich internet applications can be fully...
more...
- JCunwired
Ken --which browser providers have fully implemented the draft standard?
- Brian Sullivan
"Ian Hickson, editor of the HTML5 specification, expects the specification to reach the W3C Candidate Recommendation stage during 2012, and W3C Recommendation in the year 2022 or later" - I am thinking the 2022 date is some sort of typo though.
- Brian Sullivan
Aren't all those arguments valid for not allowing flash on a MacBook?
- Hayes Haugen
The difference is that Adobe actually released a Flash plug-in for Mac OS X. From what I understand, full Flash support on any major mobile platform is still vaporware.
- Victor Ganata
If anyone is interested here's a pretty good article on how to create a HTML5 offline app for iPhone: http://www.html5samples.com/2010...
- Lindsay
I think that that HTML5 will already be in widespread use (despite the draft status) by next year. I am currently working on making a web app for my company run on the iPad as I type this. Documentation on HTML5 (and especially issues on the iPad) are sparse but still enough that I've made major headway in just 2 days. The hardest part is searching for tech help in Google because anything with "ipad HTML5" turns up a bunch of commentary on Steve Jobs vs Adobe instead of usable info.
- Lindsay
U.S. Soldier on 2007 Apache Attack: What I Saw | Danger Room | Wired.com - http://www.wired.com/dangerr...
Hayes Haugen liked this
Definitely worth the read.
- Hayes Haugen
damn straight. i saw this on my friend feed daily digest. tagged on delicious pronto.
- Hareesh Nagarajan
Know how the US is no longer FriendFeed's #1 country? Check out the latest posts with 100 comments and 100 likes. Great insight into what is popular outside of the US. http://friendfeed.com/search...
Vezquex, !lker yoldas. )°(, Atakan Eser and 35 other people liked this
Fun stuff. Some English content too, but wow. :)
- Louis Gray
almost half of this is in arabic and we (Turks) use latin alphabet. Just a reminder.
- Üstün Üzüm
Cool stuff
- AJ Batac :)
I always like to see the arabic and latin posts even if i can only like or dislike the pretty pictures. :)
- SteVe C
That was totally dominated by Persian/Farsi posts. Are you saying Iran is #1 now, Louis?
- Eivind
Some turkish guys are liking this. Why are they liking it i dont understand. 1st the link is mostly persian 2.nd what is there to like at all.
- Üstün Üzüm
so frakkin' weird because these are in arabic , how could this be possible ?
- Alice Cooper
Arabic script, Alice, but the language is Farsi (in most of them, anyway).
- Eivind
anyway it's normal that i don't understand because i am Turkish and we use latin alphabet ...
- Alice Cooper
Yeah, you're probably to young to remember the days when Turkish was written in Arabic script ;)
- Eivind
yes approximately 90 years ago ..
- Alice Cooper
Now if I could just get a translate link from FF to google translate that would be awesome it would be interesting to understand what is being said rather than just liking pictures.
- Dan owns Comicsforge.com
Ufuk ; maybe ( i think ) you are right :)
- Alice Cooper
Dan Morrill, there'a an app (well, script) for that http://translatorize.com :)
- Micah
Ufuk Özgül and Ufuk Özgül, sorry I am not perfect. I made some assumptions that some of the Persian content was in Turkish. Withdrawn. :)
- Louis Gray
I think this was just a thinly veiled attempt to drive traffic to the nipple-licking post again.
- Laura Norvig
Louis, 'sorry I am not perfect' isn't a real apology (not that I think one was needed) :) And on the plus side, you learned something from this. Now you know that Turkish is written in Latin script and Farsi in Arabic :)
- Eivind
And I learned that a post about Nutella is the most popular one in English. Spreads rule!
- Brent
That's because that woman is bumping her own posts EVERY FRIGGIN' DAY, T. I can no longer 'like' her posts (and she posts some nice pictures) because that makes them unhidable :(
- Eivind
This is a great reason to love Micah's translation script. If you haven't used it yet, you should. Makes the world a much smaller place and really enhances your friendfeed experience. http://translatorize.com
- April
But, but... I use Google Chrome *quivers bottom lip*
- Brent
Don't cry...I believe the bookmarklet does work in Chrome. ;-)
- April
Ok, Brent—that's it. I'm going to go stuff the translation script into Chrome Extension (I didn't have experience with it before my code for Buzz, but now I do). START THE CLOCK, I'M MAKING THIS A PERSONAL CHALLENGE TO SEE HOW FAST I CAN PORT IT. GO. [PS. And thanks, April.]
- Micah
Ok, Brent—that's it. I'm going to go stuff the translation script into Chrome Extension (I didn't have experience with it before my code for Buzz, but now I do). START THE CLOCK, I'M MAKING THIS A PERSONAL CHALLENGE TO SEE HOW FAST I CAN PORT IT. 10:42p - GO. [PS. And thanks, April.]
- Micah
GO MICAH, GO
- Josh Haley
Chrome tells me that the page is in Persian, would I like to translate.
- Alex Scrivener
We're in the minority here, LOL
- LANjackal
:-(
- Pluto in USA
in perspective http://friendfeed.com/akiva... is still in the top ten, for the horror, :(
- chaz2b
[courtsies]
- Akiva
Most of them have pictures.
- Hayes Haugen
SEC Proposes Wall Street Transparency Via Python - http://yro.slashdot.org/story...
Micah liked this
"Under the proposed requirement, the filed source code, when downloaded and run by an investor, must provide the user with the ability to programmatically input the user's own assumptions regarding the future performance and cash flows from the pool assets, including but not limited to assumptions about future interest rates, default rates, prepayment speeds, loss-given-default rates, and any other necessary assumptions.'"
- Hayes Haugen
from Bookmarklet
Blowing up HTML5 video and mapping it into 3D space « Craftymind - http://www.craftymind.com/2010...
"Copying video into a canvas element means opening up the ability to manipulate or process video frames at runtime."
- Hayes Haugen
Monitoring sensors in the background - http://mylifewithandroid.blogspot.com/2010...
" The fact remains: if you want acceleration sensor data on the Nexus One, the screen must be on. This pretty much kills all the user-friendly applications that want to analyze sensor data in the background while the phone is idle. In the worst case, the screen must be constantly on "
- Hayes Haugen
Other ways to read this feed:
