Jim Connolly › Comments

Jim Connolly
Quick Poll: Twitter Lists - do you use them, yes or no?
I have made one. - Kenton
I made a friendfeed list, in case they pull the plug on FF. and a local people list. - Mike Nencetti
Yes, I have made (or started making) a few, and I subscribed to a few made by others. - John (bird whisperer)
Mike: I don't think there's any chance of them pulling the plug on FF. It's losing geeks, but gaining lots of Facebook users. - Jim Connolly
Yes, but only a couple of them. I'm waiting for the saturation factor to die off a bit. - Renee Hendricks
I've made a few. - Ron Bailey
Yes, they come in handy for me to see timelines in a particular subject that I wanna keep track of at that particular time. Sometimes too it depends on what mood I am in that will depend on what list I want to keep track of and other times it just depends on current events, that will end up being the resulted list of choice. In any case, lists shuffle out the noise of everything... more... - Tim Tunnicliff from email
I've made some, although I don't use them as a filter very often. - Tyson Key
Absolutely. They help me find groups of people I should probably be following and alleviate the need for me to group people myself. They also let me see how people classify me. - Rahsheen
I made a couple small ones and one big one that replicates my #ff suggestions. I followed several that are about writing but Tweetdeck doesn't support lists yet - WarLord
Use them - Rasmus Lauridsen from iPhone
Louis Gray
Analyzing Twitter Lists-Follower Ratio As An Indicator of Influence | Skeptic Geek - http://www.skepticgeek.com/microbl...
So, no correlation. And I was so happy about being listed. Oh well... - Ignace Rodriguez de R,
As I told Mahrendra, I could make my numbers look a lot better by reducing my feed by thousands of followers, and thereby increasing my ratio. - Louis Gray
My Twitter List weigh-in: http://sharisax.com/2009... - Shari Weiss
And as I replied to Louis, anyone can game Twitter, and he doesn't need to anyway. :) - Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Nice post Mahrendra. I have noticed people with >50k followers on 6/8 lists and those with 500 followers on 20 lists. When I've checked them out, all those accounts with the massive follower counts were basically using Twitter as a broadcast medium. Thanks for the post. - Jim Connolly
Thank you, Jim. The phenomenon you describe was one of the things that led me to investigate this further. :) - Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Scoble, Alex Scoble
Y'all need to stop capping on "irregardless"...It's frickin' in the dictionary, people! As is "ain't", by the way. Ya damn English snobs! :)
people are just UNresponsible :) - Sasha Kovaliov
My English teacher used to whack me around the head whenever I said 'aint' in class. Then he would remind me "there aint no such word as aint!" - Jim Connolly
If they don't stop adding these silly words soon, dictionaries are going to be ginormous. - Bruce Lewis
"How may times do I have to tell you, Kirk? One does not 'boldly go'. 100 lines for you, boy, to be on my desk in the morning" - Andrew Terry
Irregardless is in the dictionary? That's unpossible! - Lola Bean (Penguin)
Enjoy your new word born of ignorance. (You knew I would show for this one didn't you?) ;) - Josh Haley from iPhone
Like hell you can't boldly go...we sure as heck are boldly going where no one has gone before. - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
Josh, nope, excuse my gnorance - directeur
I just googled for Josh Haley and got sent to irregardless.com instead - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
ha ha ha ha - Josh Haley from iPhone
So can you give an example of where you would use the word irregardless instead of regardless? - Kenton
Wherever you can use the word "regardless" you can use the word "irregardless" - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
As in "Irregardless of what you may think, "irregardless" is a perfectly acceptable word belonging to the English language. - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
How much more redundancy can you have? - Kenton
It's in my dictionary http://dictionary.reference.com/browse... so irregardless of your opinions of the word and its usage, it will stay as a totally cromulent word in the vernacular and all who pooh pooh it shall be punished severely by being forbidden from saying the word regardless. - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
Everyone across the world, get ready for a brand new beat! - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
So Alex, yours says "Those who use it, including on occasion educated speakers..." If we hear you say it too often we might start to think less of you. - Kenton
I hate irregardless. - Derrick
Good thing that I only say it to defend its use. :) - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
Derrick, you wound me. - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
wait... it's in an internet dictionary? That ain't right. - Jim #teamFFrank
Yeah, because heaven forbid that Webster's be put on the web. ;) - Scoble, Alex Scoble
Jim, it's the Internet, not the internet!!! ;) - directeur
Your both wrong...its teh intarwebthingy! - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
I use "irregardless" when I want to appear to be less intelligent than I am. - Dave Roth
the one that gets me 'I could care less' It's COULDN'T folks. Still, I couldn't care less really. - Ian May
@Alex, irregardless of what you're intelligence is, I'm write! EDIT:fixed some errors - directeur
My mother-in-law has a habit of saying "de-thaw" as in: "We needed to de-thaw the car this morning" or "We need to de-thaw the freezer." In 14 years I've never corrected her. - Mark H
If irregardless is in the dictionary then I've completely lost respect for the dictionary. - vicster.
ROFL Mark...plug what? - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
Webster's puts a lot of stupid shit in their dictionary every year. It's why I refuse to use Webster's because they're now catering to the lowest common denominator. - Hookuh Tinypants
As long as you don't confuse "specific" and "pacific", we'll get along just fine... - Andrew Terry from iPod
Oh, add "tack" and "tact" to that list, too - Andrew Terry from iPod
You probably use an OED edition from 1970, don't you...Guess you can't use Google then. - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
@Ian: you are now my new best friend. The "I could care less" phenomenon has been my #1 pet peeve since grade school. It's embarrassing how widely-used it is now. - Hookuh Tinypants
That's right...I said it...if you can't google for something then you can't use Google! - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
Wait? Who's plugging who? - Derrick
regardless of your feelings of "irregardless", people who say "irregardless" make me crazy. - Jen (SquirrelGirl)
If that makes you crazy, I submit that perhaps you've already made the trip. ;) - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
I'll take that into consideration... - Jen (SquirrelGirl)
Ever noticed the subtitle on Webster's - it includes words in "common usage" - so Alex irregardless of your intelligence - your use of the word just makes you common! ;-p - Robyn Hawk
Calling me common is about the worst insult I've gotten in a while. ;) - Scoble, Alex Scoble from IM
Jim Connolly
3 brilliant tech sites you need to check out! - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
3 brilliant tech sites you need to check out!
"Here are a few technology related sites / blogs I highly recommend you check out." - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Jim Connolly
"Twitter List" of tech news people. Who's missing? - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
"Twitter List" of tech news people. Who's missing?
"By following that one list on Twitter, you can keep up with Twitter updates from the tech news providers, who I trust for their opinions (and entertainment value in a few cases too.)" - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Jim Connolly
@VictusFate No idea why, but I wasnt following you. Am now, also added you to my tech news twitter list. Ur tweets now appear on my blog.
:-) - Jim Connolly
Jim Connolly
Twitter.com about to get stickier! - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
Twitter.com about to get stickier!
From post: "Both Tweetdeck & Seesmic Desktop are superb apps, but they are also a lot more resource hungry, than simply using a browser to access the Twitter website. Now that users are able to get all the core functionality direct from Twitter.com, using their favourite lightweight browser – There’s less motivation for NEW Twitter users to bother installing the aforementioned Twitter apps." - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Paul Buchheit
I tend to agree with Scoble about the "forum problem", but at the same time I really like seeing comments. I'm not sure what the solution is, but I think it's less of an issue if you keep groups relatively small. re: http://scobleizer.com/2009...
I think the current FriendFeed approach is close to optimal. Do you not see it that way? - Bruce Lewis from fftogo
FF has the inherant ability for the user to take control, both of what they see and the comments they allow. If a user is judicious in their lists and/or filters they should see mostly relevent content (IF that's what they actually want to see). The ability for a poster to moderate comments on their own post gives us the ability to avoid trolls/spam and/or steer the conversation (again,... more... - FFing Enigma
Scoble and other "super users" have this problem much more than regular people because they have thousands of subscribers. This is also part of the reason that Twitter probably works better for celebrities -- it's more of a broadcast channel. - Paul Buchheit
They could have a million subscribers and it wouldn't be an issue, Paul: turn off comments on his FF posts and it would be all broadcast all the time. It's the number of people they choose to subscribe TO that is the issue. To be honest, it's like someone walking into a football stadium and then complaining that it's too loud. If one chooses to follow thosuands of people one must surely expect that the amount of 'noise' is going to increase. - FFing Enigma
One thing that was tossed around a while back was the ability to disable comments from anyone you're not subscribed to: that'd allow those with a lot of subscribers to have high-signal conversations that their subscribers can still see and gain value from. - Mark Trapp
Perhaps he'd like a 'hide user' button similar to FB? This would prevent the "brings people into YOUR life that YOU DID NOT INVITE!" effect... of course the conversation could be rather disjointed. Maybe a small 'additional comments hidden' status that would show them when desired... Of course, without the conversations, FF == twitter? - Eric Borisch
Paul, can you help me test something? :) - directeur
The features that would make FF optimal would be to let users follow each other's hides and blocks. For most users this would be a nice, small improvement. For users like scobleizer it might make a huge difference. Of course, implementation details matter. - Bruce Lewis from fftogo
The problem is that we don't keep groups relatively small. There are always those who are like me who like to connect, for one, but even normal people add tons of people to their groups. It's just natural. I remember I was first to add 1,000 people to my Twitter account and people thought I was weird. Now thousands of people do that. - Robert Scoble
One thing with Facebook is they capped it at 5,000 friends. Which kept it from being used by super-connectors but also caused it to be seen as a place where you talk with just your real life friends. Now that public pages are coming on strong, we're seeing that change. - Robert Scoble
Bruce: the FriendFeed approach is far from optimal. Many, many people told me they don't like joining a forum and like just lurking instead, which is why they chose Twitter (Tim O'Reilly is not the only one who told me this). Tim Robbins likes that on Twitter he can listen to his heros. He sees it as a learning engine. Those of us here love FriendFeed because it lets us talk. But it definitely turns off lots of people. - Robert Scoble
Paul: the solution is to let us toggle comments on and off. Give the USER CONTROL. If they just want to listen to their friends, hide all the other noise. But then give us who like commenting ability to turn that back on. - Robert Scoble
You have the ability to toggle comments on and off: Edit -> Disable Comments. - Mark Trapp
Robert, comments _are_ content. - directeur
Mark: that is on a PER ITEM BASIS though. Totally useless for what we're talking about. - Robert Scoble
directeur: yes, but they are content a LOT of people don't want to see or deal with. - Robert Scoble
Robert, but then you'll be a megaphone broadcasting "your" views. - directeur
Robert has the same comments (or the same potential) on his blog as he does on FriendFeed, so I don't think it's the comments themselves. I think it's the fact that FriendFeed makes comments almost on equal level as the original post, instead of burying them way down at the bottom of a page or requiring a click to view. Out of sight, out of mind, right? - Daniel Sims
Nothing in the API precludes someone from writing a FriendFeed client that hides all the comments so you just see a river of feed items. That's how Twhirl, AlertThingy, and all the native iPhone apps implement FriendFeed. - Mark Trapp
I have two arms. I barely use my left one. Please cut it off! - directeur
Turning comments off entirely would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If you could authorize other users to delete comments on your items, you could minimize the forum problem. - Bruce Lewis from fftogo
directeur: that's right. That's what most professional publishers want. - Robert Scoble
I really think the "comments are awesome, why would you ever want to get rid of comments" argument falls on deaf ears at this point. The solution ought to be how to turn off comments if you want to get Scoble (or the people he's saying he represents) back on the FriendFeed train, or to say they're not worth it. I do think if it weren't for the comments, there'd be at least a half dozen other things Scoble or people like him would come up with to not like FriendFeed at this point. - Mark Trapp
I like the idea of having another options to disable comments for people you're not subscribed to. That way you can allow conversation, but limit it to people you "know" if it makes you more comfortable or limits the noise. I think you should have the ability to set the option as a default for all new posts but be able to override it on a post-by-post basis: 1) public comments 2)... more... - Lindsay
Her Linday-ness: I want that but it would be hard to design. - Robert Scoble
Mark, I think you make a valid point but then the question becomes: if there are no comments, is FF still the best medium to use? If so, then the ability to turn off comments on one's entire feed should be easy enough to code and implement. I suspect, though, that all things being equal (meaning: there's no ability to comment on an item) FF would no longer be the best medium for a broadcaster. - FFing Enigma
Mark: I don't think these people will consider FriendFeed at this point. Too much momentum over on Twitter. Look at the news brands: http://twitter.com/Scoblei... you're not going to get them to switch off of Twitter at this point. Sorry. That game is over. - Robert Scoble
I think the real game is how does Facebook evolve? - Robert Scoble
The real game is an open decentralized solution. yes, I'm a dreamer. - directeur
Which leads everyone to wonder why you're trying to nitpick a feature like this, or base your argument on the lack of the feature. The real reason why you (and others like you) aren't into FriendFeed isn't because of the forum problem or the lack of a feature, it's because you think Twitter is better and that's where everyone is. That's fine: that's a great argument. The rest of it is inconsequential to that argument, and wouldn't invalidate it even if you got your way. So what's the point? - Mark Trapp
I've been talking with a lot of brands and celebrities and regular people. For public studying they like Twitter better. That has Facebook wondering what it will be in the future. - Robert Scoble
Mark: sorry, but I spent two years talking to thousands of people about FriendFeed and I'm just passing along why they didn't like it. Take that feedback or leave it. Your choice. - Robert Scoble
Mark: did you speak at dozens of conferences about FriendFeed and Twitter? Did you show hundreds of tech influentials FriendFeed and listen to their feedback? - Robert Scoble
But your feedback doesn't correlate to the real reason why you, and the people you say you represent, are saying why you won't ever use FriendFeed. You said there's nothing anyone could do to get people to use FriendFeed. - Mark Trapp
Mark: if I want to listen to ONLY tech influentials, I can on Twitter. I can't on Facebook. I can't on FriendFeed. http://twitter.com/Scoblei... - Robert Scoble
Robert, if you're going to pull the "don't you know who I am?" crap, it falls on deaf ears. Let's have a constructive conversation on what you're trying to talk about. - Mark Trapp
Sure you can: you can import feeds and lists on FriendFeed. - Mark Trapp
Mark: times change and at this point it would be hard to get anyone to take FriendFeed seriously. That said, I believe that it IS possible to move people from Facebook to Twitter or Twitter to Facebook, so THAT is the real battlefront. - Robert Scoble
any comment thread about 20+ without threading and community promotion/demotion becomes difficult to participate in (for me). Though there is a difference between discussing the radiator on a 94 Subaru and the nature of discussion forums. - Hayes Haugen
Robert: is the problem really comments or the fact that each time an item gets commented, the items pops back at the top of the list? Regarding the noise, I think that the "problem" with friendfeed is that it was much easier for people to plug in automated feeds and that as a result, there was less of an explicit action. I do not know how other people feel about this but I really miss... more... - Edwin Khodabakchian
Mark: OK, show me your public list the way I did on Twitter. You can't do that here, sorry. - Robert Scoble
Hayes: BING BING BING. - Robert Scoble
Bing goes the internet! lol - Marshall Kirkpatrick
Sure Twitter has a lot of momentum now, but how quickly the winds change. Frankly, it's a shame that FF is going to be neglected... I wish that someone with as much motivation and insight as Paul and the original team could take it over now that FB has consumed them. There is still SO MUCH potential in this platform that it is depressing to see it squandered. @Robert - I don't think it... more... - Lindsay
Robert, I don't use public lists: I believe you read my blog post about why I don't. But Hutch Carpenter does, and here's his FriendFeed public list on Innovation Management: http://friendfeed.com/innovat... - Mark Trapp
Robert, who do you call "influentials"? Do they talk "tech" all the day? Isn't it unhuman? Let's go back to spring/summer 2008, and redefine "smart" for me, please :) - directeur
Edwin: the problem is on FriendFeed it has the chat problem -- it gets noisy and gets noisy fast. - Robert Scoble
directeur: influentials are people who influence. I picked them. Shoot me. - Robert Scoble
The noise is largely proportional to the circles you're in. If you put yourself in a huge room, it will be a loud room. - Kevin Fox
Robert, do you remember the "MOAR NOISE" phrase? It was THE reason why I built NoiseRiver. Filters, I used to say when you were always saying: MORE NOISE! - directeur
Kevin: exactly. But on FriendFeed the room gets big VERY QUICKLY because as more people join they drag in their followers with them. - Robert Scoble
Facebook has the same problem. While we're chatting here, tons of tech news diversity have swooped by. - Robert Scoble
So Robert, should there be something built in to "warn" others of becoming "chatty". Something that says: "This comment is irrelevant. You may post again when you have something relevant and germane to our discussion"? So WHO makes those distinctions and judgements? - Melanie Reed
Compare this chat to http://twitter.com/Scoblei... which one brought more information to you? The chat is more fun, cause we're engaged, but it's noisy and if you don't care about it, a waste of time. - Robert Scoble
Melanie: in a chat room you can't control people that way. - Robert Scoble
Robert: True, but [big number]*[average number] is far larger than [average number]*[average number] - Kevin Fox
Hayes you are correct. Slashdot has actually had the best discussion forums for more than ten years because it has threading and community moderation. Its not a trendy social networking site though so no one notices. If you had a social network site where you post topics but with Slashdot like forums it would rock. Only down side is moderators tend to inject bias but /. has good signal after moderation kicks in - Ed Millard
Robert, I don't care about more information. I have more than enough. :) - Melanie Reed
(Where you (scoble) are the big number) - Kevin Fox
Does it really have to be one or the other Robert? - iTad from fftogo
Kevin: the problem with FriendFeed is if you and Melanie were having a conversation it would be pretty small, right? But I follow you. The second I touch your conversation it gets big. - Robert Scoble
If only someone could figure out how to make a room that gets big very quickly appeal to broadcasters... - Bruce Lewis from fftogo
This problem doesn't happen on the private Facebook because you have two-way friending there and a cap of 5,000. But on Facebook Pages? Absolutely. Noise baby noise! - Robert Scoble
Bruce: broadcasters don't like any of this because there's no way to monetize. Why do you think Arrington really hated this? - Robert Scoble
Robert, I don't care about more information. I have more than enough. :) What I would like is what Tad is implying in his comment. You know you can have "...two opposites that have learned how to blaze together" ;) And excuse me, but is wrong with a big conversation? - Melanie Reed
"The chat is more fun, cause we're engaged, but it's noisy and if you don't care about it, a waste of time. " If someone doesn't care about it on FF, they can hide it and not see it again. Problem solved. - FFing Enigma
Chatting is not intended to provide information. It is like planning -- it is the process of chatting that is what is useful not the words that are spoken/written. - Brian Sullivan
Thank you, Tina! and Brian! - Melanie Reed
Melanie: I love big conversations. That's why I loved FriendFeed. But most people aren't like me. - Robert Scoble
Tina: there are so many things going by on my screen in FriendFeed that hiding them all would take all day long. - Robert Scoble
Robert -- why is it that you think that people are like you and things should be done for your needs? - Brian Sullivan
FF is too busy!! - Big Joe Silenced
Brian: again, it's not about me. - Robert Scoble
Robert one word: APML. I used to yell it back in 2008, no one cared. You want "filters" by personal interest. - directeur
FreiendFeed sold ME on it two years ago. I've been trying to sell others on it. The feedback I'm giving is from OTHERS. - Robert Scoble
The Forum Problem is a problem? - tehKenny
directeur: APML will never work. - Robert Scoble
oh dear, don't hate the messenger. - Big Joe Silenced
Robert: who are these "others" and what are their numbers? - Melanie Reed
Paul nailed it - Twitter is a broadcast channel. Massive amounts of subscriptions are fine there - it's all about reach. But if you want discovery, if you want to engage, then FriendFeed and FoaF is where it's all. They're NOT the same. One you can subscribe/follow as many as you want, in the other, subscription abuse will cripple your ability to view and interact. - AJ Kohn
Finally, a thread on this subject that makes sense. - Akiva
Threading may or may not help... it seemed to hurt with GoogleWave... it was so hard to follow all the tangents... of course without threading a lot of the tangents just get lost anyway. I guess I have given up on trying to catch everything... If it's important and I didn't see it the first time, eventually the concept will bubble up enough times for me to notice. That's one NICE thing about following lots of people and participating in lots of convos. - Lindsay
why won't APML, or something like it, work? i missed that memo - Marshall Kirkpatrick
Robert, go say this to Last.fm or the BBC :-) Smart recommendation engines are the future - directeur
FriendFeed may make some audience/discussion leak out, but also makes audience leak in through seeing what your friends are talking about. Arrington may be mostly concerned about the leak out. Other broadcasters may be looking for the leak in. - Bruce Lewis from fftogo
Marshall, me neither! :) - directeur
Also, the meta around the content in FF (likes, comments) is what helps turns random data into information. It's annotated and qualified. - AJ Kohn
Lindsay: true - Hayes Haugen
Thank you, AJ, yes. And you can sort that out when you want to on your own time. That's the utility of it. - Melanie Reed
Perhaps one solution to the 'forum problem' is to allow posters to selectively choose who can participate in the discussion but still be viewable to the public. - Rodfather
I love the noise but I don't subscribe to thousands of user. - Ashish from iPhone
So maybe the real question is, why do some people prefer conversation over broadcasting and vice versa? Is the broadcast-mentality simply a matter of popularity (the inability to reciprocate all the connections, so just broadcast instead) or is the effort it takes to connect with people on a more meaningful basis a major turn-off? Or is it just the tools that people use and what makes it easier for them? - Lindsay
Rodfather, this will bring wars. Trust me. I'm not a commercial object. So you want to SHOUT and ask me to close my mouth? :) Moreover, close comments, other threads will be started and the noise you wanted to avoid will be even greater. The Streisand Effect, anyone? :) - directeur
For example: this discussion has 80+ comments and rolling. I don't mind that at all. I am engaged. I am also updating a web page on our web site as I do it and switching over to grade 30 some PRF's for students on the play Macbeth. I am not having any trouble with the "forum problem" or any "chattiness" I learned the "ropes" of FF when I joined and accepted that it as it was. - Melanie Reed
To me FF turns data (the river of content out there) into information (the good stuff - explained). The tool set FF provides is superior in this way - but it takes time to dial in the right set of filters to apply to the data set (which changes!) and many simply overwhelm the great filtering system they've provided. - AJ Kohn
A lot of people don't want to put in the time and effort to make the tool work for them like you, AJ and Melanie. I can empathize with that. I think it also has to serve their base inclination of either broadcasting or conversation, and the tool choice is also influenced by whether they already are part of a community on it or not. Most people won't leave their community even if it us using the less appropriate tool for their inclination. - Lindsay
directeur, then those people can make their own thread and allow everyone to comment. I'm thinking of in case there's a roundtable event where certain 'experts' in a field can have a thread to discuss a topic among themselves without worrying about others cluttering the thread. - Rodfather
AJ, indeed - the task is to build new concepts with and for filters. Filters, not to shut stuff out, but to mix it better to create a constant flow of narratives. - zeroinfluencer
AJ, is it more that FF provides the platform for the users to turn that data into information? The users are integral to FF. Now with Twitter you can program a week's worth of tweets (I have heard) but I don't wish to do that. Facebook... you could almost do that-although it does have engagement -you could certainly use it without. But FF runs on an engagement engine - Melanie Reed
Marshall: I don't trust automatic systems to guess what I'm going to be interested in next. Never seen a system yet that works. But we should debate this. - Robert Scoble
That's getting into intelligent agents and AI once full blown - Melanie Reed
Robert, we should debate it! The robot that makes all my decisions for me says it's quite likely I would enjoy doing that! ;) - Marshall Kirkpatrick
Web tech needs to look outside their dev environments for richer influences in filter design: http://www.youtube.com/watch... - zeroinfluencer
Is the problem that Robert is looking for a single service solution. I see the same 'content' on Twitter and FriendFeed but I scan Twitter for 'raw information' and go to FriendFeed to 'discuss' it with others. I watch the news at home on TV but I talk about it with my friends or work colleagues around the water cooler or coffee shop table. I am comfortable existing in several spaces - Johnny from iPhone
@Lindsay: I don't know. I'd rather educate people on the power that FF can provide with a little effort. Or, that it actually doesn't take LOTS of subscriptions. Max it at Dunbar's number (which is what I do for my home feed) and you'd be fine. - AJ Kohn
+++ Johnny Scotty would be proud of you: The right tool for the job - Melanie Reed
@David: Exactly! My home feed - I tweak it. I use people like Robert and Rob Diana and Michael Fruchter and Anthony Citrano and Thomas Hawk and numerous others to bring a mix of themes and concepts into my feed. - AJ Kohn
So are we saying that its not the tool itself...but HOW it is or is not used that maxes utility? If so I agree! - Melanie Reed
@Melanie: Yes, the users are the key. The users are the filters. http://www.blindfiveyearold.com/soylent... And the engagement provides a rich annotation and a secondary level of filtering. So yes, users and their engagement absolutely matter. - AJ Kohn
Sure, yes, how you use it maxes utility. But it also helps if it's suited to how you WANT to use it... if not it's a struggle. And people don't like to struggle, even if it's possible to make something do what you want it to... easier to use another tool if it fits your purpose better. FriendFeed fits my purpose so it's not a struggle for me... but for someone with a more broadcasting mindset than a conversational one, it's going to be tougher. - Lindsay
Vincent, most long-time FriendFeeders have spoken strongly against any sort of moderation/rating system for comments. No one wants mobs of people trying to control what other people can see like what happens on Digg. It's why every time the topic of 'Unlike' comes up, people rise up to talk it down because it creates an aura of competition and negativity. - Akiva
AJ, yes! users are the filters. - Melanie Reed
Akiva +++ - Melanie Reed
Anybody use Mailchimp here? It is tangential to the discussion. They have a cracker jack built in user educational system that monitors and makes usage suggestions. - Melanie Reed
Is lunchtime finally over yet? - Hayes Haugen
I'd love to peek in on the recommendation engine discussions. I'm in the 'they don't work camp' myself but I'm open to being convinced and perhaps technology has approached a point where it could work but ... from working in eCommerce I've seen it fail time and time again. Random factors, contextual issues etc. - AJ Kohn
@Melanie: Know of Mailchimp but don't use. The 'monitor and makes usage suggestions' sounds interesting though. - AJ Kohn
AJ, that's because the devs didn't pay attention when their instructors (ahem) were teaching it to them. ;) - Melanie Reed
Another point I'd like to make is that no one is forcing anyone to read the comments here. If people want a broadcast-only medium, it's fairly easy not to click on the 'x more comments' link. Unfortunately, Robert makes a painful observation: he played FriendFeed cheerleader for two years and the people who needed to take the bait didn't or did but then cut loose. That pretty much means... more... - Akiva
Johnny: I am comfortable with all of these too, but it's not about me. But, anyway, the business battle now is between Facebook and Twitter and it'll be interesting to see the choices that Paul's team makes and how those compare with the team NK over at Twitter is making. Then the market will choose which one is best. - Robert Scoble
Akiva: If I were at Facebook and knew that they could turn into the next MySpace I'd put every single engineering minute onto Facebook. Wouldn't you? - Robert Scoble
Like I said before, there is still SO MUCH potential here... and it's a shame to see it squandered. I think there are a lot of ways it could be taken to the next level. For sure it could be a contender to Twitter with a few enhancements, but fat chance of that now that there is no longer a dev team, and that it's "parent" is a competitor. - Lindsay
Robert, here's a good example: You want to debate intelligent recommendation agents? Allright, I know that you know Chris Saad. Chris is a very cool guy in fact! But do you know Deniz Oktar? Deniz, who is not as popular as Chris, is a SMART Turkish guy too and works on the same subject. If you limit your view to "popular" people, you'll definitely miss him. And debating such a subject without alternative ideas likes Deniz's or humbly mine, won't be perfect :) - directeur
Not sure, Robert. Is turning into the next MySpace a good thing for you or a bad thing? For me, it'd be bad. - Akiva
Akiva, go take a look at (and experience) mailchimp's monitor and make usage suggestion system. It's adaptable for a number of scenarios - Melanie Reed
I think the business battle (other than the marketing to consumers end of it) will be occupied and won by Wave. Facebook, Twitter and FriendFeed are mere toys in that world. - Brian Sullivan
Melanie, I'm not complaining about a solution that MailChimp could provide. I'm fine with FriendFeed as it is (for the most part). - Akiva
directeur: most people choose news brands to curate and find new people that will have something valuable to say. See http://twitter.com/Scoblei... for instance. That already is TOO MUCH so telling people to get more people or more things into their lives just isn't going to cut it for most people. - Robert Scoble
Allowing public panels where only the influential can talk certainly would have a useful role, Its just like panels at conferences. A lot of people would no doubt like to just follow the influential in these forums. On the down side it would make the already influential more so and it would probably lose some audience if it was done a lot because there is no democratic engagement. The people who don't spend all their time cultivating their fame and networks do say interesting things too. - Ed Millard
directeur: and, anyway. if he's in Turkey and not in San Francisco he's far less likely to influence tech in a major way. So I disagree. - Robert Scoble
(FYI - look at this conversation and tell me where else anything like this could take place.) - AJ Kohn
No, we're completely boring and worthless, Ed. We're not worth paying attention to. I mean, who wants to see a picture of our kids? ;) - Lindsay
Akiva, I meant for those who might struggle "getting" FF but would enjoy and benefit from it once they do. There's an "on ramp" to FF that rivals North Corridor Dallas coming out of an apt complex on to 50mph+ 4 lane traffic. Some of us are better at that than others, but you still see a lot of cars on the road. :) - Melanie Reed
IRC or a phpBB messageboard! - Big Joe Silenced
There has also been a lack of creative uses using the FF tool sets. Good uses of the tools inspires participation + it's easy to criticize -- harder to create. - zeroinfluencer
@Robert: Whoa, whoa. Weren't you arguing that adding 8K new people from Twitter Lists was a good thing? Is more better, or worse? - AJ Kohn
+++David - Melanie Reed
@David: Good point, no real developer platform. That's been a big boon for both Facebook and Twitter. - AJ Kohn
Robert, yet he DOES. You just aren't into that speciality :) If you think that every "tech" thing must happen in SF you really miss A LOT. - directeur
Woah, Robert, so you are saying anyone who doesn't live in SF doesn't count in a tech discussion? That's a little self centered isn't it? - Ed Millard
I understand it but I really dislike any discussions where the topic seems to be "how can we turn this thing that the people who use it like into something that people who don't use it and would only use it for selfish reasons like?" Screw them. If something's not as "techy" as Slashdot and it's more chaotic because the comments aren't threaded like Slashdot and there's no moderation... more... - Mark H
Lindsay, I want to see a picture of your kids. I only wish I had some to show back. ;) - Melanie Reed
Ed: you are NOT a careful reader. - Robert Scoble
Robert's not saying that those ideas can't happen, or that a true revelation can't come from elsewhere, but that ... the likelihood that someone outside of SF to influence tech is less. The Capital of the Internet is SF. I'd agree with that. But that doesn't mean it'll always stay that way, nor does it mean that tech from other areas can't be influential. (least that's how I read it.) - AJ Kohn
OK I just read it, you still said if you don't live in SF there is very little chance you will have any influence on tech. If you have no influence then you either have nothing to say on the subject, or even if you do have something to say it wont matter. - Ed Millard
Hrm, I think the whole thing is overblown. My personal FF landing page still has as much utility as my first day (if not more). Bleh, whatever. - Chieze Okoye
@AJ The FF API is beautiful, I don't think dev communities saw the richness that you can create with the aggregation of FF streams. A few valley PR oriented bloggers pushed 'conversation' as FF's 'killer app' - whereas, the realtime aggregation streams and republishing of content is radical and unique. - zeroinfluencer
Well I'm pretty sure all the people in Seattle, Toronto, Paris, London, Moscow,Tokyo, Shanghai, Hong Kong, Beijing, Bangalore, Boulder, etc. probably disagree - Ed Millard
@David: I'll take your word on the API and wouldn't doubt it given the FF team's chops. But fostering usage, that community - that's where things may have gotten shaky. Too few people leveraging it. It could still resolve back to an inability to really grasp what FF can do for them. - AJ Kohn
AJ, I think you're on to something. Back in the day, usability (including general user and disabled) use to be a well-known topic. Universities made it a part of the curriculum. Everything before and including e-commerce got the once over. But it occurs that the latest generation (including GLS and SM) have outpaced the community standards for usability. It's really the wild west again-... more... - Melanie Reed
Akiva: I suspect the noise problem Robert's describing from others isn't that comment threads get too long. It's that items keep popping to the top as new comments show up, when they don't want to see the new comments. I don't see any way around that except a separate client. It would take too much away from the FriendFeed experience for the default interface not to work this way. - Bruce Lewis
Mark, I didn't mean to suggest /. is the only solution to the forum problem. If you have really big forum discussions /. is time tested way to control noise and raise the signal level. On the other hand it would probably be a horrible solution for intimate and friendly discussions among friends. Someone earlier Lindsey? kind of had a good suggestion. When you make a post have a row of option buttons and let the poster set the kind of forum for that thread, broadcast, panel, open, modded, thredded, not.. - Ed Millard
Ed: I specifically said "far less likely." I didn't say there is very little chance. But, seriously, this is an argument for another thread. Lots of people think they have influence but actually don't have as much. For instance, I love to think I have influence on Facebook but I'm far less likely to influence that then Paul Buchheit is. Facts are facts. - Robert Scoble
Chieze glad you like FriendFeed. Me too. It's awesome. But that doesn't mean much to the rest of the world. - Robert Scoble
Robert, how often do you use "Add This"? It's germane :) - Melanie Reed
OK we will agree to disagree on that one and drop it. I've lived in the bay off and on, I think there are pluses and minuses to being there. - Ed Millard
Melanie: "Add This" being the "Add Photos" at top of FriendFeed? Not as much as I should. - Robert Scoble
Robert: No this service: http://www.addthis.com/ This is fast becoming the SM share button for many websites. Ours uses it. And FF is on it. Take a look at the entire list - Melanie Reed
FriendFeed's feature set will mean a lot to the rest of the world when it's fully integrated into Facebook in 2011. - Bruce Lewis
Bruce: I don't think it'll take that long. - Robert Scoble
Robert, you may be right, in which case FriendFeed is a relevant thing to look at. Maybe it isn't actually too far ahead of its time. - Bruce Lewis
Just like Lisp can make you a better programmer in other languages, FriendFeed can make you a better thinker when writing about other social networks. Popularity isn't everything, even for a blogger. - Bruce Lewis
You mean, it's not all about attention? :D - Lindsay
Who really knows why Twitter got all the traction? Does Scoble? I very much doubt it. I think there's a great effort going into finding a logical explanation for Twitter massive success and FriendFeeds more modest gains. My own best guess is that it has more to do with the madness of crowds than it does with any limitation in FriendFeed. Twitter had a decent enough foothold already by... more... - JSLeFanu from FreshFeed
Twitter got the traction because Twitter's easy. It requires very little effort to get into and it requires even less to participate. It's the same reason why YouTube comments are the cesspool of the Internet and MetaFilter's comments are not: anyone can sit around and watch videos all day and then trash talk them but you make people pay to comment and you'll weed out the chaff almost... more... - Akiva
David: I was there from early days on Twitter and studied how it grew. I know more than you might think. Remember, I was the first person to follow 1,000 people there and I was the 13,800ish user to join. - Robert Scoble
This link is the most illuminating one on FF traction at the time of the buyout. It indicates FF was just starting to regain traction after it had stalled out for a while and it suggests if maybe FF had stuck it out a while longer things might have changed. http://www.techcrunch.com/2009... - Ed Millard
Twitter got hot in the early days because of Leo Laporte and because of SXSW and because it was goofy fun way for tech influencers to talk to their friends. It just kept growing from there. Another factor in addition to simplicity (Akiva's right there) is the API. Tons of clients and tools and services are built on top of it. FriendFeed got nearly none in comparison. - Robert Scoble
The difference may be luck of the draw ( a la Gladwell) - Brian Sullivan
People had to build tons of clients, tools and services for Twitter because the default web UI is so bad. - Ed Millard
Ed: what that graph doesn't show you is what we now know. Google Wave sucked a lot of attention of geek influentials away (IE Hype) and Facebook's Connect is running away with another game. I went into FriendFeed the week they decided to sell and asked them because I knew Twitter had new features coming that would make FriendFeed less interesting. I think the FriendFeed team looked at the competition and decided to fold. - Robert Scoble
How could I have ignored the API? It's like Firefox's plug-ins: it's the only thing that makes Twitter usable for many users. Without it, they wouldn't touch it. Heck, if it weren't for Tweetie 2, I wouldn't touch it either. - Akiva
And Facebook's Connect platform is getting incorporated everywhere. I think FriendFeed was hoping to become part of the general web, like what we did over on http://building43.com and that just wasn't going to happen because Facebook's Connect platform is rocking and rolling now. In fact, I made a fundamental blunder by not going with Facebook on Building43. If I had, our traffic would have been much higher than it is now. - Robert Scoble
You can be sure that once CNN and other assorted media outlets started plugging Twitter it was game over. Once the band wagon was rolling every "personality" was going to hop on. It is a little disturbing that Miley Cyrus has now joined the "everyone should delete their Twitter accounts" camp. - Ed Millard
David Hall +1 Steven Berlin Johnson would be a good reference - the persistence of babble is incredible valuable in phatic communications. FF, through the web interface hides a lot of that. Instead, the babble was more bookmark centric and less about 'having a sandwich'. That's why you have, on the whole, better conversation threads on FF, and ending up having to duck out of the way of... more... - zeroinfluencer
Disturbing REALLY????? My word, Miley is absolutely right <sarcasm/> - Roberto Bonini
To paraphrase Louis Gray's wife, "nerds in startups are fickle". I speculate they had a lot of self doubt when they stalled out prior to that up tick, and decided to sell just about the time FF was starting to take off again. Someone waves $50 million at you during a period of self questioning that is a potent motivator, I think Zuckerberg saw that and he did nip a potential competitor in the bud. - Ed Millard
But all the above comments is about public sharing. I use FF a lot for project planning and development - it's fast - you can discuss items with good archive search, and you can post media. I wonder how many people use FF in this way, and ignore the public babble? - zeroinfluencer
Having read most of this thread (and Robert, comments are VERY valueble) the"forum problem" is NP-complete. Comments are valuable becuase seeing people reason is often just as enlightening, if not more so, than the original information. - Roberto Bonini
Ed - mind you, there's only a few ways you can get to the helm of the FB API design and product development. :) Who's to say this isn't all going according to plan? - zeroinfluencer
Roberto: me and you agree on that. In my research most people do not. They see these things as noise. But, if you make the comments toggle on and off we BOTH win! Plus, comments REALLY help search! - Robert Scoble
Ed: correction, it was $50 million. - Robert Scoble
Robert you keep talking about "your research". Is this anything more than anecdotal conversations? - Brian Sullivan
David, Well maybe Paul and Co. are doing a trojan horse on FB but what I've read about Zuckerberg he doesn't seem likely to relinquish control of anything he cares about and I am skeptical you are going to turn FB in to FF with their entrenched user base. - Ed Millard
@Scoble you're arguing from authority again. I think on a broadcast platform like Twitter that's an easier one to pull off. On Twitter it's a big "so what" if you've posted a load of BS because most people will simply miss any challenge to your "content." Post the same on FriendFeed and you get tackled and you get tackled in public. Reasonable enough grounds to explain your current stance and certainly as good as any reason I've heard you put forward yourself. - JSLeFanu
Robert, I stand corrected, and it is corrected, this editing your posts thing is one of FF's scarier features. - Ed Millard
OPEN QUESTION: Is FF gaining or losing users? I see very little here now - but I'm told user numbers are going through the roof. - Jim Connolly
Ed: tell me one thing. What's the biggest difference between FF and FB? There's already not as much difference as you'd might think. The one thing I miss over there? Real time search. - Robert Scoble
Twitter got big because it's about ego. Look at me, Me, ME! Twitter flourished because people like to talk about themselves. (FF is not, which is why it hasn't gained nearly as much traction.) It was developed as an update service. It has evolved into ... something else. As for comments, they are invaluable. - AJ Kohn
Jim: user numbers are not going through the roof here. I don't know anyone credible who has said that. The registered numbers are going up, but the active numbers are going down. - Robert Scoble
AJ: FriendFeed is just as much about ego as Twitter is. If not more so. - Robert Scoble
Ed, the goal is to design influentially for the web. Paul B does seem to give that ethos in his startup camp talks and general interviews. I would think FB would warm to that ideology. - zeroinfluencer
Very true. Robert. - Roberto Bonini
@Robert: How? Seriously, I'd like to hear your opinion. - AJ Kohn
Robert: In other words, as people like yourself, Arrington and even those little guys like myself with a couple of thousand subscribers leave - we're being replaced by less active users. Makes sense. I used to check in on and off all day. Now, 2/3 times a week, - Jim Connolly
Jim: not true. I don't see a lot of people joining in here and I'm watching it closely. Sorry. More people are leaving the back door than are coming in the front. - Robert Scoble
To me the two big ones are 1) perception that it more walled garden networks and not as open though certainly it has avenues which are more open like FF 2) its home to massive quantities of apps, games, spam from people trying to get rich that hold no interest to me, though obviously many others like them. FF is probably just overlooked by that crowd, if it were bigger it would be infected with all that crap too. FF seems to mostly just be good people from my limited time here. - Ed Millard
All User Centric Design is modeled around the ego. Good software design keeps that in mind. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... - zeroinfluencer
AJ: Twitter is, for many people, about business now. Not ego at all. News brands: http://twitter.com/#... no ego. Tech companies: http://twitter.com/Scoblei... No ego. But here? It's ALL about ego! - Robert Scoble
David is right. - Robert Scoble
On Twitter the default is to show number you follow, number of followers, number of Tweets. That's all playing on ego and popularity. Nearly everything (even lists) is geared to stimulate a innate need to acquire more of something as a way to ... validate contribution or perceived influence or authority. FF does not show this in the default mode. - AJ Kohn
Companies and brands are the most aggressive form of ego there is, and they usually are direct reflections of the ego of the company's CEO. - Ed Millard
Alright Robert. In order to reduce the signal to noise ratio, we can do one of two things, we can use "Likes" to filter the comment stream. If I Like more posts from Robert than i do from LG, Roberts comments appear but not LG's. We can use semantics to (somehow) sort the thread and show comments relevant to the original post. (simply dumping noise isin't a solution - not all noise is noise all the time. Likewise, increasing signal in an echo chamber is fruitless) - Roberto Bonini
@Robert: Oh, I think Twitter is a great business tool! It's a marketers paradise. But I'm not sure that's what most people believe it to be. People still think they're going to get some sort of social dialog there. I think it's why Twitter churn is so high. People get it thinking it'll be one thing and quickly find out it's another. - AJ Kohn
+1 AJ, there are some people that use Twitter in awesome, constructive, useful, ways like Tim O'Reilly and Jay Rosen but a lot of people its pure self promotion. As for news outlets using twitter they are going to go wherever the eyeballs are, and they will go to multiple networks not just Twitter. Those are pure broadcast, no engagement, they aren't really a ringing endorsement of why Twitter is great. - Ed Millard
I'd bet FF *would* take off (but be worse for it) if it listed how many times the content I fed got liked and commented on, and that (along with subscribers etc.) were all listed right there at the top of my home feed. And that upon signing up, I'd get suggested users based on subscriptions but also who got the most likes and comments. Yet, I don't think that's conducive to what FF really excels at. - AJ Kohn
@Robert, biggest difference between Facebook and Friendfeed - reciprocal connections. Without a doubt. The apps, the ads, other stuff, is true, but for me the central difference, and the thing that betrays a fundamental difference of worldview between the two apps is whether or not you can follow someone's content without them having to follow you back. You can only do that on Facebook... more... - Jandy
@Ed: I realized a long time ago that Twitter was a big Internet megaphone. And if you could get a lot of people to 'listen' to that megaphone well, that's powerful stuff. It's about Reach. Twitter gives your message reach. Nothing wrong with that. I just don't see it as ... transforming. - AJ Kohn
Those who study the art of propaganda consider reach to be everything, because following reach is influence, and following influence is control. TV is losing its reach in the Internet era so most of those "brands" and "personalites" are rushing to find a way to regain it, enter Twitter and FB. They are better because they are bidirectional. - Ed Millard
*Noise* :) - Ashish
@Ed: I'd be interested to see more on how reach leads to influence. It often does but ... not always. Plenty of multi-million dollar ad campaigns in the graveyard as examples. Reach + ? = influence. - AJ Kohn
Ed I think you're right. I caught that TC piece at the time too. Seems to me that the FriendFeed guys had a bit of a crisis of confidence and grabbed lunch while it was on offer. In any case I always figured FriendFeed as a place to graduate to once you'd rammed up against Twitters limitations. And, as I'm sure you know, that doesn't take long. That's how I got here. I was actually on... more... - JSLeFanu
You don't have influence until you have reach so its the prerequisite. Then it a matter of how effectively you craft the message and push the buttons in your target audience. Some people are good at that part, some aren't, some fail, some succeed. - Ed Millard
Robert, I just wonder. Isn't twitter more about consuming the information and FF more about sharing and discussing? Look at http://twitter.com/Scoblei.... What can anyone add to that or comment on that? I agree it is getting a lot noisy in here (exhibit, this post). But not all posts will be this noisy I think. - Amit
+1 Jandy, she answered Robert's challenge to me better than I did. - Ed Millard
@Ed: I'm not sure. New memes start with someone small sometimes. Say ... keyboard cat ... and someone who has reach communicates that message and it goes big. So who has the influence? The creator of keyboard cat or the person to has the reach to make it go big? I find it very interesting. - AJ Kohn
Jandy: +100. You just nailed for me why I like Twitter and FriendFeed better than Facebook. Agreed. - Robert Scoble
Robertt, maybe this post and the scads of comments prove your point, but maybe your point is limited to your own experience due to your unique position in tech. You speak, noise follows. But that does not make Friendfeed irrelevant or useless for the average or even just left or right of average user. You have a unique experience that is going to color any forum you put your time into.... more... - Martha
+++Jandy - Melanie Reed
Well put, Jandy. - Akiva
I think the forum problem is not as big in smaller more intimate groups. Recently I've been very active in the DMU group here that includes a lot of folks who've migrated here from Flickr. The relevancy is much more higher in these venues than in the main feed because it's a smaller controlled experience. I do wish though that groups were more full featured like the rest of FF though.... more... - Thomas Hawk
oh of course and photo voting pools for groups would by awesome too. ;) - Thomas Hawk
Martha: you might have a point if we were just talking about me. But we're not. So, try again. Again, I've talked with thousands of people about these things. They tell me they don't like the noise that public forums bring. I've been doing this for 25 years and this isn't the first time I've heard this pushback. Facebook, by the way, on its iPhone app, handles it perfectly: it hides all... more... - Robert Scoble
You all keep referring to this as either chat or comments when actually its a discussion. I think that the ability to discuss anything on Friend Feed or anywhere else for that matter IS where you learn the most. I'm not techy like most of you, I'm just an ordinary 'average' user, but I see twitter more as a 'newsreel' of info, shallow but instant, whereas Friend Feed is more a 'thrashing out of ideas and opnions, and is therefore all the richer for it. - Technogran
Sandra: chat/discussion/forum/comments are all pretty much the same thing. Yes, the two are different. There CAN be lots of learning here, it's just that this is a lot noiser than other online things in some ways. - Robert Scoble
Robert, about noise: when you or other tech influencers introduce FriendFeed, you show the things you're excited about, which tend to be big and noisy, right? And if you're the first person someone follows on FF, they're going to get a noisy first impression. The slower growth that doesn't come through tech influencers may have less of a back door. - Bruce Lewis
And about the 25+-year-old forum problem: Moderated Usenet was great until moderators slacked off. Decentralized moderation fixes that, at least for small discussions. Larger discussions can lead to whack-a-mole (though I notice this one hasn't), but with one of the suggestions I made earlier in this conversation the number of whackers could scale with the number of moles. - Bruce Lewis
Moderation = censorship. Censorship sucks. Give the users control to hide and block. The less censorship the better. - Thomas Hawk
@Paul - what about a view to only see the user's posts/content ie no comments of others and no likes => then it becomes twitter like - Kishore Balakrishnan
Come on, it's hardly messier than Facebook, since the default view only includes the first and last comment. Basically the gist I'm getting is that people who think they're important don't want to listen to people who they don't think are important. Such is the human race, I suppose. - Victor Ganata
+++Victor hammer meets nail. - JSLeFanu
Robert said "FB iPhone app ... hides all comments with an arrow that you can then use to expand the comments. That is so much better than this mess here that it isn't funny". Robert, I must be missing your point because FF also hides most comments until you expand them because you want to read them... Don't want to read FF comments, don't expand them, problem solved. Or are you saying FF is a "mess" because it shows first and last comment? - Ed Millard
235 comments! I really don't want to expand *that* on FF! Is this a pain-point for anyone else? - Space Cowboy
Not for me. If I'm interested enough in the topic or dialog I'll click the time stamp and open the post page to read everything. The text amount is comparable to a medium length blog post: if I have the time to read that I have the time to read this if it interests me. - FFing Enigma
The problem is for big conversations like this one you need threading and maybe moderation, but for more normal conversations that are smaller flat is better. Allowing a switch between the two adds complexity. For big conversations FF lacks the button to reply to a specific poster so the viewer can thread, at least as an option. Much of the noise level in this conversation is due to people having to manually try to fake threading. - Ed Millard
The threading vs. flat conversation is interesting to me - we've tried multiple times to put Disqus or Intense Debate on a film blog I write for, and every time we meet huge resistance to threading ESPECIALLY on long threads. People say they have a lot of difficulty finding the new comments when they aren't all at the top or bottom. - Jandy
Why can't there be a summary fly-out with timestamps based on response rate to single comments and a "last comment made" link as well as "thread count" links and lastly, "participants in this thread" link? Collapse everything else except the initial post. The initial interface looking like this one, should always be available for those who want to "sort through". You want the... more... - Melanie Reed
Jandy, you kind of have to let the user flip between threading and flat to solve the chronology problem. Slashdot has a popup menu at the top that lets you view in "Threaded, Nested, Flat, No Comments". The down side is the UI gets progressively more complex both to implement and use unless you are going to force everyone to lowest common denominator UI. - Ed Millard
But Ed, that's what I have against the traditional "threaded" approach: all the fork like structure. It does get complicated real fast. What's needed is somewhere a "summary" for those jumping in late to "catch up" but also the "single comment" link to democratize the discussion. Threads have all the indentation problems of trying to follow that way IF I am picturing what you mean by thread. - Melanie Reed
My other observation is this: everyone creates a "story" about the ideas and information they are taking in and immediately starts associating connections in their mind creating a mental picture whether they realize it or not when they are perceiving that information. Our user interfaces don't yet lend themselves to that especially where it come to dialogue and forums. We've accepted a... more... - Melanie Reed
Here's why you don't need indented/tangential threading: FF discussions tend to be small enough to fit in the "RAM" in one's mind. It curtails many threads that might ramble; the exception (like Paul's thread here) comes when the power of the topic/zeitgeist and vibe of a live chat going strong overrides that usual point of decay. Predictablly, one or several commenters here will start a new thread or escalate it to a blog post and summarize their thoughts based on what transpired on this stream. - Micah
Melanie, have you used Slashdot, they did forums earlier and better than anyone. The forum starts out flat, and then starts threading. Random community moderators start modding up the insightful posts, and burying the trolls, crap, etc. Once the moderation kicks in the "summary" is all the posts that were modded up to 5 which are shown expanded. All the lower moderated stuff is there but you have to clck to see. Slashdot would suck like YouTube comments if they hadn't solved the forum problem. - Ed Millard
It's organic, not hierarchical. As other have stated, there is as much to learn from watching the process unfold as there is to gain from end result. - Micah
Ed, no, I haven't used Slashdot but I'm willing to give it a try. I'm pretty adaptable. But when I see a problem and it becomes "the picture" for me, in this case a circle then I know its time for the leap out of the present "prison of one idea". ;) - Melanie Reed
Micah, its true threads are bad for small friendly forums. Some of this discussion is about what happens when the forums on "celebrity" social expert's threads get so big they overflow readers brains and they turn in to *noise*. One noise problem is organization, the other is some post and some posters are better than others in the mind of the celeb and the reader. - Ed Millard
Slashdot dealt with most of the forum problems ten years ago, they had to to survive the trolls. The problem is their UI needs to be complex to be flexible and keep everyone happy. Their audience is also mostly geek power user. When you get to social networks the other UI school is demanding the UI be dirt simple so the unwashed masses can cope, but dirt simple mean its inflexible and it ticks off nearly everyone, especially power users. Hard problem to solve... making everyone happy. - Ed Millard
Ed, conferences have break-out groups. The same idea should be employed. - Micah
Ed, yes, you offered a little explication for others of what happens when you lost the ability to categorize your"story" into a mental picture that is associated with previous "stories" you have stored in the brain. That end result is "noise". Some of us are better at doing that than others, that's true. But there come a point of over flow for all of us. What our UI needs to do is to amplify and assist in that "story" constructing process. - Melanie Reed
Break out groups is a nice idea, but it seems a bit cumbersome. You need to make a new post, post a link here and get some critical mass from the first forum to move. If you do it five times you would splinter the first forum and lose critical mass, especially in a "real-time" forum where people will only watch one forum at a time. Chances are most people will cling to the first forum if its interesting. - Ed Millard
Ed and Micah, what I hear both of you saying, and Robert as well, is that at some point in the "story" constructing process, the dialog from the forum needs to end in the narrative of a blog. Up till now, the blog component has been a random, unattached part of the discussion. AM I hearing that you think that in some way it should become part of the UI? So that the discussion gets... more... - Melanie Reed
Not sure I follow, blog is kind of a one voice, one direction thing, only way a forum morphs to blog is when once person splits off the forum to make a more in depth point and posts the blog link to the forum. I'm mostly just talking about the various methods for restoring order in a big forum, and improving signal to noise ratio. Most entail putting more options and more UI in and around the forum and making the UI more complex which many think is bad on a social network. - Ed Millard
Ed, as I was writing this, it occurs to me that what I'm suggesting is what I may have just figured out (finally) that Google Wave is trying to get us to do. But if so, I beleive FF could actually do it better. the "noise" problem that was created by the various forms of SM, inside and outside of the platforms, was the inability to "connect the dots". We didn't have a framework for how... more... - Melanie Reed
One of the problems that we haven't solved is the usefulness of digression and random access of connective tissue in the "story" process. That's the wild card that often comes up as "noise" - Melanie Reed
I can't speak for Robert. Some of his issue "seems" to be he only wants to see the Silicon Valley/SF movers and shakers in his feed talking about tech and social networks, and he doesn't much want anyone but that same group to be posting on forums under his auspices. Friend Feeds openness is bad for that. The same is true for all the Twitter celeberati. They don't want peons anywhere near their online presence to tarnish it. - Ed Millard
Only way I can see to maintain FF openness for those who want it, and celeb broadcast only mode for the celebs who demand it, in one social network is you have to have an option when you make a post on your feed to control the forum methodology (i.e. broadcast only peons can only look on, panel mode where only my social elite are allowed to speak & peons can watch, private where only my circle can speak and see (FB mode), or completely OPEN(FF mode). - Ed Millard
There also seems to be an issue where someone you follow, through the "like" process, can inject pictures of kittens, babies and man titteh in to your feed. Of course that is kind of the original point of social networks, seeing what your network sees. I think some just want hard core tech news and talk and twitter lists probably do allow an uber though somewhat lifeless feed like that. - Ed Millard
Ed, well, that is the territory of the heart when it comes into contact with the machine. And oddly (or maybe not so oddly) there is a post on my feed that addresses that theme: http://friendfeed.com/faithx5... ;) Digression and Random access at work. lol And I find that refreshing. I'm always excited about how some new idea may be generated because I allowed what... more... - Melanie Reed
@Melanie: I fully believe in non-linear learning. The ability to take input from diverse thematic content and synthesize something ... to apply something from one world to the other. That's where I think we're heading. I think of it a little bit like a digital version of Burroughs' Cut Up technique: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... - AJ Kohn
I can't believe I read the whole thing - Michael Slattery
Such a simple and obvious solution: provide an optional *LIST* view for Friendfeed items. Open the comments only on items that look really interesting. Am I missing something obvious? Then Friendfeed could easily emulate Twitter on all essentials (and surpass it in many other areas). - Sean McBride
Sean, I think the obvious thing you are missing is there are no FF developers any more so FF probably isn't getting anything it doesn't already have. And there are camps here that don't really like the alternatives that FB and Twitter offer which is why this is such a hot button issue. I wish there was one social network that had lists, open forums, walled gardens, and broadcast mode based on the wishes of the person running a feed so everyone could be happy in one network. - Ed Millard
Hello ,I am out here to spread this good news to the entire world on how I got my ex love back.I was going crazy when my love left me for another girl last month, But when i meet a friend that introduce me to DR aluta the great messenger to the oracle that he supervene,I narrated my problem to DR aluta about how my ex love left me,He only said to me that i have come to the right place... more... - Mccart Brenda
i never believe in spell casting, until when i was was tempted to try it. i and my husband have been having a lot of problem living together, he will always not make me happy because he have fallen in love with another lady outside our relationship, i tried my best to make sure that my husband leave this woman but the more i talk to him the more he makes me fell sad, so my marriage is... more... - Mccart Brenda
Louis Gray
Newsome.Org > Google Reader: Putting Scoble In Time Out - http://www.newsome.org/2009...
Newsome.Org > Google Reader: Putting Scoble In Time Out
Newsome.Org > Google Reader: Putting Scoble In Time Out
"I like Robert Scoble.  I really do.  But, like my 8-year old, if I don't watch him like a hawk he gets distracted and starts doing all kinds of crazy s***.  Like pooping all over Google Reader, which is really a stand-in for RSS readers in general.  I know he doesn't really mean it.  It's like the time my 8-year old announced that she was giving up Skittles.  It was a radical thought.  There was logic to it.  Shoot, it made me proud. But it wasn't real." - Louis Gray from Bookmarklet
Actually I do really mean it. Google Reader is useless to me. It takes MORE THAN A MINUTE TO START UP on my account. Totally useless. - Robert Scoble
They just pushed a new build that should help with big accounts last night. Try again. :) - Louis Gray
I just timed it. 25.7 seconds to start up my account. Totally useless. Still. - Robert Scoble
Robert & Louis: Is Robert's experience likely to be relevant to more than a tiny minority of 'normal' users? I'm guessing the reason it takes 26 seconds to start up is that there's an avalanche of data there? - Jim Connolly
Jim: right. But I remember the days when I was made fun of for having 1,000 followers on Twitter. Now a LOT of people have 1,000 followers. I only have 1,500 friends on Google Reader and it takes 26 seconds to start up now. Useless. - Robert Scoble
Jim, it takes about half that time for me. 10 to 15 seconds. Longer than, say, FriendFeed, but not interminable. I see that it can get bogged down every once in a while when I have more than 300 new items. I never see 1000+. I am only following 894 people, and hide many shared items lists, so I am not such a drain on GR as Robert is. Also, even if Robert and I disagree at times, I always like his trying new things. If he doesn't, who will? - Louis Gray
Louis - Robert: Good points. I think it shows how insanely well developed Friendfeed is. - Jim Connolly
"The greatest myth in the history of the internet is that Twitter is the place to get news." - Co-sign. - Andrew C (✔)
I like google reader, but with FriendFeed and now Facebook, I'm getting everything shared from other networks. I think the days of the RSS reader are just going away. Nothing bad on Google Reader, it's just an older way of tracking news. I used to go in every day, in the last 6 months it's spanned to once every few weeks. And I don't feel less informed. - anna sauce
I find that I get most tech stuff fine through FriendFeed, but none of my other networks are good at getting me stuff on film. The big news blogs are on Twitter and I could get them there, but a TON of the best small film blogs aren't on Twitter, so the only way to get them is via RSS. Plus I miss so much on Twitter because I can really only check these things sporadically every few... more... - Jandy
Jandy: you have a good point there. Geeks are generally two to three years ahead of the rest of the world. So, it will be interesting to see what your behavior does in two years. - Robert Scoble
Jim Connolly
Fellow linux geeks - 2 days to go!!!!! http://www.ubuntu.com/
Anyone using the beta - Much of an improvement? - Jim Connolly
Jim Connolly
Particle beams injected into The Large Hadron Collider (LHC) - http://news.bbc.co.uk/2...
Particle beams injected into The Large Hadron Collider (LHC)
From Article: "Engineers working on the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) have successfully injected beams of particles into two sections of the vast machine." - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Jim Connolly
CyberPotato » Blog Archive » Friend feast - http://www.cyberpotato.net/...
CyberPotato » Blog Archive » Friend feast
From post: When Scoble says “Friendfeed is dead,” his lament expresses an existential anguish similar to that of Nietzsche’s “God is dead.” Friendfeed was Robert’s paradise in the cloud, until the day it was sold to Facebook. Following the sale, not only did the geek presence on Friendfeed decline sharply, but it became evident that new development on the platform had come to a halt. - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Leo Laporte
I <3 FriendFeed
Rock on, Leo! - Josh Haley
Pass it on! - Jesse Stay
I thought you'd given up on FriendFeed? - Lillian Banchik from IM
I <3 FriendFeed, too. - Kevin Fox
I <3 Kevin Fox - Jesse Stay
+1000 - EricaJoy
Looking for the community to resurface and make it even better :-) - Courtney Engle
I <3 all that <3 FF - Josh Haley
come on we ALL love it - Thomas Power
I love it too. - Robert Scoble
Same here. There's something about the conversations here that I don't think we'd get anywhere else... - Thomas
It's my hourly stop, if not more some days. - Fleagle
I've had my account for a while, but only recently started using it daily. Lovin' FriendFeed! - Alex
As of October 21, 2009, there is no near competitor for Friendfeed for sharing and discussing news. End of story. - Sean McBride
And 1<3 FriendFeed from this Gran as well! (haven't a clue what 1<3 actually means but I'll join in - technogran
We do, we do! Hey Facebook, don't kill FriendFeed! - Jeff
I <3 FriendFeed 2! - Laserone
facebook sucks, friendfeed rocks ! - Adrian
Hey Leo you are the best in the tech world! Everyone else is just wannabes - orionstarr from iPhone
I like Friendfeed. I don't love it. I do love Twitter... Oops. Did I say that out loud on FF? - Lon Cohen
i like turtles - HansVanRock
I confess, I heart FriendFeed too. - JSLeFanu from FreshFeed
I want to like this AGAIN!! - Rachel Lea Fox
I'm lukewarm on Friendfeed. - Grant Brunner
I love Friend Feed Leo, I just wish it will survive. - Rob Cairns
Most of us users love FF - Sad to see what's happened past couple of months. - Jim Connolly
what does it mean? |<3 ---- ??? - Kelly J
the letter i (capitalized) then a space... then <3 (which is a sideways heart) ... so it reads: "I love (or heart) FriendFeed" - Chris Heath
meaning "I" am less than "3" *space* "FriendFeed" ofc - Mike Chelen
friendfeed = good. not friendfeed = bad. - Sue - Friendfeed is best
suezanne: +1 - Jim Connolly
Robert Scoble
FriendFeed update. Paul Buchheit wrote me and said he's been very sick the past few days. That might explain why he hasn't engaged the way we want. He also offered to do an interview with me to discuss the future of FriendFeed and what they are doing at Facebook soon. We're working that out, hopefully soon (but might not be until November sometime)
I don't know if that's a good idea for you, Robert. You might be better off making a clean break from FriendFeed. - Bruce Lewis
Thanks Robert, that's great news! Paul, hope you feel better... - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Bruce: FriendFeed=Facebook. So, I'm interested in what he's doing and I'm a big fan of Facebook's. Twitter needs some competition. The Fail Whale is getting to me. - Robert Scoble
Another reliable update. - Ashish
I know it's a stretch but can we gather specific questions for Paul to answer? - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
When other sites like twitter come out with new features, you want to be at the front of the excited crowd. FriendFeed will make you into that curmudgeon who's always saying, "So what? They did that two years ago at FriendFeed." - Bruce Lewis
Cjay: I've been working on this interview since before Facebook bought FriendFeed. :-) - Robert Scoble
manielse: well, the interview isn't on 100% yet and now that I've talked about it in public who knows what will happen? But if it does happen of course we'll get you involved. - Robert Scoble
Cjay: I might be a rusty wheel, but remember two things: 1. I put many many thousands of hours into FriendFeed before the sale, bringing my audience over here at great risk to my personal brand. Lots of "experts" like Mike Arrington told me I was wrong to do that. 2. I'm still here. - Robert Scoble
OMGAWWWWW he still has "it" - sofarsoShawn
I hope Paul gets to feeling better soon. He's a great guy. - Phil Glockner from iPhone
sofarso: I never lost it. :-) - Robert Scoble
Cjay: actually it's not. It just looks risky. - Robert Scoble
To those giving Scoble crap for being on FF, aren't you tired of that? You all have been doing that for at least a year. Enough. For us on FF, we'd love to see an interview, thanks. - Eric - Final Countdown
Paul, get well soon - Shane
Good luck for the interview, Robert and thanks for the update. Hope Paul gets better soon. - Mahendra (SkepticGeek)
Thanks everyone. I'm actually not "very sick" though, just "kind of sick" -- it's mostly messing up my sleep. - Paul Buchheit from iPhone
be well! - Laura Norvig
Chicken soup - but stay away from those soul books ;) Hope you're up to speed soon, Paul. - Micah
Looking at the time-scale, doesn't that actually answer the question? You don;t wait THAT long to deliver good news or to debunk a false rumour that killings your platform (well, Zucks platform). - Jim Connolly
Paul - sorry to hear that! (it's 2:30 am here, I can empathize with your sleep problem) - Susan Beebe from BuddyFeed
Eric, sorry if it sounded like I was giving him crap. That wasn't my intention. I think Scobleizer has a serious career decision to make: http://ourdoings.com/ourdoin... - Bruce Lewis
Hope you feel better, Paul. - Kol Tregaskes
That will be an interesting interview, thanks for posting this update. - Dan owns Comicsforge.com
Can't wait for the interview!! Thanks to you and Paul for keeping us updated!! - Rosemary Sorg
Robert, do you think Twitter is too unreliable or do you think the competition is healthy? - John Cass
Feel better soon, Paul! - Ruchira S. Datta
The walrus has eaten the oysters: http://bit.ly/nJrdl - Michael Slattery
Paul Buchheit
First, FriendFeed is _not_ going away. (in fact, we're working on switching it to new servers) Second, I know everyone wants to know what the team is working on, but we don't pre-announce things, so for now all I can say is that there's good stuff on the way. Re: http://friendfeed.com/jworthi...
I know that doesn't answer everyone's questions, but I hope it helps. - Paul Buchheit
Paul, working on friendfeed.com stuff or facebook.com? - Kol Tregaskes
I like the first sentence. The rest is just gravy. - Derek Coward
I'm totally happy if we just reside on decent servers, and get occasional IT help... We'll keep the rest of the ship running :) - Christopher Galtenberg
Paul - is that why it's been slower lately vs.pre-fb ? - Allen Stern
Paul please repeat it in re-phrased form: Friendfeed is NOT going to repeat destiny of Jaiku? Y/N - A. T.
*processing statement...* - Micah
Can't wait... **Fingers tapping desk impatiently** - AJ Batac
But what does "going away" mean, Paul? And what does "team" mean? And when you say "pre-announce", are you talking about the Palm Pre? - Ken Sheppardson
Allen, the slowness is due to growth (more users and more data), but I put in a few fixes yesterday that should speed things up a bit. - Paul Buchheit
thanks paul - Allen Stern
Paul, sometimes when I open up threads I get the Opps... error. Is that related? It has been happening more and more these last few days. - Kol Tregaskes
Still better than twitter and facebook. Thanks for the update! - Mike Nencetti
Paul, thanks for the incredible work with FriendFeed. Please, keep it alive! and most importantly keep it FriendFeed! - Ciro Villa
as long as FF doesn't go dark or fall to pieces due to lack of maintenance, i think most ppl would be appeased. - Big Joe Silenced
Does this mean that the sky is not falling and we should stop running around screaming GODZILLA! and pointing in the direction of FB? - Tony C (Unrated) from fftogo
also, thank you for making such a great service in the first place! - Big Joe Silenced
Paul: Did you see http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009... & can you understand why it got so many people talking / blogging? - Jim Connolly
I second that!! - Kol Tregaskes
Always nice to hear Paul talking about Friendfeed. - Ashish
Thanks Paul for the update. - Roberto Bonini
Thanks for the update! Would like to know if there will be actual development done on FriendFeed in the future (other than bug fixes/minor updates) but I understand if you can't really talk about that too much. - Brandon Titus
Paul: so still no answer from you as to if your 'good stuff' is being developed for FB or FF? The silence suggests it's FaceBook you're working on, or at least transferring FF into an 'add on' for Facebook? - Jim Connolly
Kol, fb platform and openness, primarily. - Paul Buchheit
David Recordon FTW - Jesse Stay
i made a post here - http://www.centernetworks.com/friendf... - one interesting note - maybe FB keeps FF running nice and smooth to keep the early adopters happy as it's a great way to get new features out to them via this channel... just a thought. - Allen Stern
Wow. I've had to eat my words before but these are the best-tasting ones yet! - Akiva from BuddyFeed
Akiva, just add salt. You know which kind :) - Micah
I'm anxiously waiting for FF->FB Platform integration (drools...) - Jesse Stay
These are the best words I could have expected by Paul. There is obviously a cultural difference between the two platforms and audience and I'm assuming both the former FF team and the FB team recognize that and are sensitive to the community. Thank you Paul and I hope you are feeling better.... - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Allen, you're in good company on that thought - there were musings on that concept right after the buyout. - Micah
When the leader speaks, everyone listens.... :-) - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
I feel a few "I told you so's" coming though... :-) - Jesse Stay
Thanks Paul. Glad you're working on maintaining/improving performance. I've definitely seen issues here. Looking forward towards your influence and changes over at the blue giant. - Mark Krynsky
Paul - thank you for letting us know, and I do hope you feel better! - Jennifer Dittrich
The big question though is will FriendFeed continue to add new features? There's a difference between that and it going away. (and hence my argument w/ Scoble the other day) - Jesse Stay
Paul: Seriously weird that you're there reading this, and totally ignoring each relevant, yes no question. No one's asking you to pre announce anything - just genuinely concerned (and increasingly so) that they do NOT include developing for FF. - Jim Connolly
Jesse +1 - Jim Connolly
Jesse: Paul answers that question - BOOM - rumour mill dies and we finally get something positive to say. Ya know what - we won;t get an answer though. He's reading this, he knows the answer, but he won't. - Jim Connolly
Jesse: For now, FF has more features than any other platform for this type of niche. There's some catching up to do before I'm worried about new features. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
AWESOME!! Thanks for helping to quell some concerns Paul. Looking forward to what comes next, but hope that FF never dissappears also. - travispuk from iPhone
Paul: I'm right, right? There's something stopping you from saying that you are no longer adding new features to what 'we' know as Friendfeed? - Jim Connolly
Paul: Amazing how quickly you guys have adopted the Facebook attitude to silence. Pity. - Jim Connolly
Paul: blink twice if you will add new features to FF. I won't tell anyone, honest. - Edward Zwart
FWIW he did just upgrade servers. My e-mail notifications are almost real-time. Sounds to me like they're still improving the service. - Jesse Stay
Jim: Don't blame Paul on that, it's not fair. He's only allowed to say so much at this point but I'm very satisfied on what he said. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Jesse: The questions not if they keep the servers running - we want to know if this is a dead platform. - Jim Connolly
Jim: in Paul's defense Facebook's PR is more controlling than FriendFeed's was. I'm sure he's having to consider the effects his words will have on other people inside Facebook. But, I'm VERY HAPPY that Paul is here giving us hints as to what's coming. I wish it had happened six weeks ago so we wouldn't have lost so many people, but maybe that would happen anyway. - Robert Scoble
Jim, there may be a few new things, but as I said, the team is mainly working on fb platform and openness, so it's unlikely that there will be any big new features of ff (except maybe one that I've been thinking about for a while...). - Paul Buchheit
Did the Walrus think about Feed Splicing? :-) - Robert Scoble
Paul: Finally - THAT'S what we were wondering. - Jim Connolly
Paul: Pity. At least we now know not to expect any developments or improvements. Thanks for answering the question. Whilst it confirmed my fears, it's good to know what's happening. - Jim Connolly
I have no problem with FB integration (notice my drool above). Hoping for good friend conversion tools to bring subscribers over as friends or fans on Facebook from FriendFeed. (Connect.registerUsers FTW!) - Jesse Stay
Jim: I'd modify "any" to "many." - Robert Scoble
As a result - Jim has left the platform. - Jim Connolly
Jim: this is a change from last week, by the way. My sources were telling me that we weren't going to get any new features and now Paul is refuting that and saying we might get one new feature here. - Robert Scoble
I'm still drooling - anyone have a towel? - Jesse Stay
Jesse: I'll buy you a virtual one over on Ning. - Robert Scoble
personally, i would be happy just to have FF not fall apart and die. given the post-acquisition situation, anything beyond that is gravy! - Big Joe Silenced
Robert, I heard Ning is dead - care to send me one on Facebook? ;-) - Jesse Stay
Robert, think of it as 20% time. If there's a feature I want, I'll just add it :) - Paul Buchheit
Thank you for the clarification, Paul, and hope you are feeling better. - WoH: Professor MOTHRA
Even if there no new features in Friendfeed, I am happy with Friendfeed just staying on. - Ashish
Paul, if you wanted me to bake you some cookies, all you had to do was ask, GEEZ. - Derrick
Twitter doesn't accept cupcakes any more (just check Foursquare when at their offices). How about FriendFeed? :-) - Jesse Stay
Mark, I'm okay with better Facebook integration. There's a lot of power in that (hence my drooling). - Jesse Stay
Mark, I'm really hoping it ends up the best of both worlds - that would be really cool - Jesse Stay
im going back to efnet - i got a bus for 7pm - anyone want on? :-P - Allen Stern
I think you could make the case that some sites and services can in fact be "done" at some point, and simply require resources to keep them up and running. - Ken Sheppardson
Thanks, Paul. - Josh Haley
Ken: That's a potential advantage of turnkey application-level hosting such as App Engine: the resources to keep them up and running are almost entirely outsourced. ~All costs are variable costs, monetization improves over time, variable costs decline over time, so services that are "done" can literally just coast. - Daniel Dulitz
might be a full-time job times 2 or 3 for any fresh devs - safe to say Paul's got a bit of a head-start which changes that equation significantly! .... Also maybe almost as important is simply keeping spammers in check - that makes the difference between a ghost town vs the happy place here we want to keep coming back to enjoy ... - Dan Freeman
Istanbuldan buyuk bir eferimi hakketti bu cocuklar, bizim icin calisiyorlar - MobilAdam from fftogo
Yes, this helps a lot. Thank you, Paul. We were beginning to fight amongst ourselves over these things. - Kamilah Reed (K. Gill)
Chris: the problem is that a shovel doesn't get more utility the more people that use it. FriendFeed does. - Robert Scoble
I think the problem is that some people feel extra messianic some days (which is perfectly okay), and then refuse to see/believe/accept when others don't feel the same way AND point it out. The refusing part is not really okay, I guess. - Michael Bravo
Thanks for these reassuring words Paul. Have been working hard to get more Flickr users over here after the recent rash of censorship there. Friendfeed's TOS and lack of censorship is a breath of fresh air compared to Flickr. - Thomas Hawk
You can’t predict what the future of technology will bring; so trying is a fool’s game. You can only adapt to the new realities as best you can. Paul's word is that it is still worth the time to invest in FF the tool. The tool may stay in this form but that's still a better design for me than Twitter. If FF is a shovel, Twitter is a spoon feature-wise. Audience volume-wise, it is the reverse. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
"Feature creep is the devil." truer words! - Big Joe Silenced
I've been rough on you guys in some comments around, but I'm VERY encouraged to see that you guys see a future for FF. Thanks for shining some light, Paul. - Kristin of Two Everything
Clarification is appreciated. - DGentry
Chris: Pownce had more "features" than Twitter did, yet it died. So did other aggregators like Jaiku. It's not "features" that matter in social software. Well, at least not completely. It's a combination of features with crowds that matter. If the crowds leave FriendFeed has a lot less utility to everyone than if they flow in. Look at this item here. Why is it interesting? Because there's people here talking about it. - Robert Scoble
take your time PB Bear take your time - Thomas Power
This is definitely more of the answer we were looking for. Thanks, Paul. - Scoble, Alex Scoble
Thank you - Johnny from iPhone
yea - happy happy.... - Chris Jackson
I can't find any wave that is even remotely comparable with friendfeed's conversation, if you found one will you invite me? (muzzle at googlewave) - ıɔ ǝɯɯǝ ˙ɹp
Great news, I await the new functions eagerly - Mo Kargas
YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is the best thing I've seen ALL day!! woo hoo!! Thanks Paul :) {{{ HUG }}} - Susan Beebe
Just a few words of assurance go a long way, Paul. Thank you for finally giving us something more solid to stand on. It's been frustrating for a lot of us waiting for the other shoe to drop and this news makes it much easier to keep investing time in FriendFeed. Please don't be shy about reaffirming that it's not going away on a regular basis because it's always good to hear. - Lindsay
I will say it for the least time! Friendfeed kicks ass :). The rest who is saying friendfeed is dying. please SHUT THE FUCK UP!!! - alfred westerveld
Good to read. - Grant Bierman
Tnx Paul, people just want to see that are not "alone" - CantorJF from FreshFeed
@ThatDBD I think you're responding to the wrong thread... - Lindsay
still curious, but understand - Kim Landwehr
It's fascinating that so many people seem worried about new features. Until recently Twitter added almost no features at all and yet it continued to grow in popularity. FriendFeed's recent slump is all about perception, not tech. - Eoghann Irving
Looks like it's official then: FriendFeed lives! On new servers, even! (At least for now...) - Dennis Jernberg
Hoorah! - Ron Bailey
Very glad to hear it!! - Rosalinda Mojarro
word! - Dylan Casey
This is great news! Thanks, Paul, for the update, and if you get a hankering for a feature, great! I'm fine with the tech being your personal sandbox in exchange for keeping the service alive. Robert, I hope this means we'll see more of you and your family - and hear from the ones who have mastered the art of rolling over. Johnny, thanks for having the courage to ask the hard questions (and Louis for helping you frame the issues.) wow - life feels good again! - Mary B: #TeamMonique from iPhone
This is brilliant news from Paul! Now can we put this FriendFeed is dying business to rest please? It's a self fullfilling prophecy because by saying FF is dying, folks begin leaving, causing a downward spiral which would then cause it to come true! - technogran
Wan't it to stay? Then begin spreading the word! Get others to use it! At the moment its not mainstream so encourage ordinary users to use FF! The more popular it becomes the less likely it is to fold. - technogran
Yes :) Paul . Thanks. we love ff :) - sunipeyk
Questions? No just enjoy it. - ★ Soner Gönül
technogran: sorry, today you see what's going on. Bing? Displays your Facebook and Twitter tweets. Google? Twitter. Where's FriendFeed in this equation? Now do you get why FriendFeed is destined to be a tiny niche player and why the real action is on Facebook? - Robert Scoble
Good news :) - Maryam Ardakani from FreshFeed
Is not FF that is going somewhere else (?). Is its user base. - Claudio Cicali
Good to know. - orionstarr from iPhone
Robert, if FF gives me what I'm looking for, why do I care where "the real action" is? If FF serves its niche well, what's the downside? - Kristin of Two Everything
Robert, do you mean that Google doesn't index Friendfeed posts? Friendfeed is the first site that comes up if you search for my name. - Victor Ganata
Excellent point Victor - but FF only imports a small % of twitter's posts. Ergo Google is still not getting Twitter. - Roberto Bonini
@Scobleizer - this item is not interesting because of the conversation. it's interesting because of who it's from, and what he said. The fact that there's a conversation around it and that conversation is easy to find and read is a bonus (a feature) that sets this service head and shoulders above others (IMHO). There's really not much interesting in the comments here, if you ask me. You could get rid of all the comments that aren't Paul's and the value of the entry doesn't diminish that much. - Chris Heath
That isn't to say that conversations around items aren't ever useful or valuable (or interesting as robert says)... but in this case i would say it's who it's from and what he said. - Chris Heath
Chris: you nailed, in a single paragraph, why Twitter is winning. You now can choose who shows up on your screen and under what context. Well, I can because I have list support. Everyone else will get that next month. Victor: Roberto is right. I barely see ANY of the good stuff I see on Twitter come over here. Well, it comes here because of my favorites feed, but that isn't in nearly as useful a form as it is over at http://www.twitter.com/scoblei... - Robert Scoble
Robert, you keep saying that's the reason Twitter's winning - I can do that in Facebook and FriendFeed as well. - Jesse Stay
Well, the problem is that Google doesn't seem to index tweets as well as it indexes Friendfeed posts. And Google has never been able go inside Facebook's walled garden. Hopefully that will change. - Victor Ganata
(and I have been able to for the last year or so) - Jesse Stay
Victor, that changed today - see ReadWriteWeb's post. Facebook is opening up public status messages to search engines now. - Jesse Stay
Why is Twitter/Facebook/FriendFeed a zero sum game? I use both Twitter and FriendFeed a lot - they have different strengths - and they feed into each other. Facebook I use less, but that's a personal issue because I simply like it less. Why does there have to be a winner? And +1 Scott, if I'm in the niche market that FF is serving and I'm happy with it, why should I care if "the real action" is on Facebook? If that's the case, I'll take FF's "fake action," thank you very much. - Jandy
Good point Jandy - sunipeyk
Paul: Thank you for letting us know status as much as you are able. The fact that you took time to write anything says a lot. So thank you for that. And thank you for FriendFeed in general. It truly does rock. Have a great day. - Morgan
Thank you. - amygeek
@Gene, sorry, you'll have to wait for a FB invite like everyone else! - Andrew C (✔)
FF team needs 20% time at FB to keep inventing the next. - Christopher Galtenberg
This is great to hear, it would be bad that a major peice of my microblogging arogration just died off. - denzuko
Bump for clarification and Happy Birthday Paul! - Charlie Anzman
Memories - Ashish
Jim Connolly
Friendfeed confirms no more features coming to Friendfeed | The Tech News Blog - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
Friendfeed’s Paul Buchheit has just confirmed to me that the next ‘big’ new feature coming to Friendfeed, will be the last. This comes a day after Buchheit issued a confusing statement about the future of the platform he co-founded. Here’s what Buchheit just told me, in full: - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Mark: Not sure how it would change things for Paul and the guys - they just sold out to Facebook and have more money than they will ever need. (and they deserve every fricking penny BTW!!!) - Jim Connolly
A sign of how quiet things are now on Friendfeed? I've had 5 (FIVE) click-throughs from friendfeed to my blog after posting this here. 3 months ago it would have been massively more. Really sad watching it die slowly like this. - Jim Connolly
Alan: Not sure - but when a post has twice as many 'likes' as clicks it means something. That same post's been read over 400 times so far - so there's some interest out there. - Jim Connolly
Mark: not true. Advertising for a million users wouldn't bring in that much on a forum-based site. Average CPM is about $3 per 1,000 page views. That wouldn't make anyone rich. The way Paul will become really rich is to help make Facebook a public company (they are well on their way). That means pouring all his skills into making Facebook a better service for its 300 million users (and growing). - Robert Scoble
Alan: And there's no longer a debate - the co-founder confirmed no new development. - Jim Connolly
Thats sad... - Roshan Ramachandran
It's also worth pointing out how much respect I now have for Paul, for being good enough to let us know the future plans - well, lack of future plans. That took balls and he deserves some credit. - Jim Connolly
Feedback please: Do I delete my account now the platform's no longer being developed? - Jim Connolly
So Jim, this is why you were pestering him so much in the thread? So that you could get a catchy headline for your blog? He said - "Jim, there may be a few new things, but as I said, the team is mainly working on fb platform and openness, so it's unlikely that there will be any big new features of ff (except maybe one that I've been thinking about for a while...). I don't see that as a... more... - Kenton
When platforms cease being invested in, as you know, they slowly grind to a halt. Is it better to invest the time I spend here on a platform that's growing - rather than shrinking? - Jim Connolly
Kenton: I don't need a catchy headline for a blog, thats only updated a couple of times a week and run as a pastime. The feedback you gave about deleting accounts screwing up comments makes sense. When the co-founder says that "it's unlikely that there will be any big new features of ff" I believe him. - Jim Connolly
I guess it depends on why you're investing your time. If it is in the community, then I don't see why you can't still contribute. If you're using it for increasing your personal brand, business, blog traffic, etc then you are probably right to invest your time on sites that see more traffic and growth. - Kenton
Kenton is right, you're title is wrong, fact. He did not say NO new features. - Keith Bennett
There's really nothing cool about all this cryptic communication Paul is giving us. All it's doing is riling us up and causing us to be unnecessarily speculative. We made this site be worth 50m, so we therefore don't deserve to be strung along like this. - Brad Williamson
Keith: Did you interpret "it's unlikely that there will be any big new features of ff" as meaning there WILL be more big new features? - Jim Connolly
"Thank you" - Seems the route is to keep the account alive, rather then mess up content for other users by deleting it. Appreciate the heads-up. - Jim Connolly
Six clicks now, fwiw. - Mary B: #TeamMonique
Gotta go. Just subscribed to everyone who's commented here - so you can DM me. Really appreciate the feedback. - Jim Connolly
Jim: No I didn't, but I also didn't post an article saying there will be NONE! Fact is, we don't know what they are up to, what they plan to do and that's what causes the speculation. You're adding fuel to the fire and I think you should change the title, that's all. Personally, I'm in the wait and see what happens camp. I'm happy with the service as is and I'm sure what emerges from the FB integration will be interesting, but until I know what that is, I'm happy to continue with what I have. - Keith Bennett
ICQ still exists...Winamp still exists...AOL still exists (but why?) - Scoble, Alex Scoble
Another FriendFeed self prophecy post. Cast doubt about its future so users begin leaving, then it will HAVE to close because of lack of users! You should be doing the opposite and encouraging folks to join...its users that keep a service afloat.. - technogran
Jim Connolly
Friendfeed’s Paul Buchheit talking in riddles over future plans - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
friendfeed has definitely lost it's shine since being bought by facebook. i've kinda lost interest in having conversations on here when you don't know what is going to happen to it. i've been focusing more on facebook because that's where i've gotten into more interactions lately. - Ⓐ ☠ slayerboy ☠ Ⓐ
Makes sense. I'm doing a lot more now on Twitter. Never thought I would ever hear myself say that here. Sad. - Jim Connolly
Thanks for the 'likes' - I would like this to get some oxygen and (who knows) maybe an answer? I LOVE this place and it sucks to see people leaving. - Jim Connolly
This means too little for the community here -- quite disappointing... Author says "no one could agree as to what his actual message was"... Clearly, Paul didn't say anything signaling that they're still working to improve FF site itself, and that it has a bright future... To me, all this confirms that FF, as a destination, won't be developed anymore. Of course, core technology may be improved, and integrated into Facebook in someways etc. -- but I think that would be a completely different game... - Onur Kabadayi
Onur: Agreed. - Jim Connolly
definitely - Ⓐ ☠ slayerboy ☠ Ⓐ from IM
Had a couple of interesting comments on the blog about this. Seems people, so far, think that Paul's decision not to give a clear answer, was political. In other words, he would have squashed the rumours, if they were not true. - Jim Connolly
this is an almost borderline trust issue for me. If he can't be truthful and come right out and say what exactly is happening, he doesn't deserve presence on his site from me or anyone else IMHO. Haven't we learned, esecially this past year, that the truth is the only thing that matters? beating around the bush and avoiding truths leads to conspiracies and rumors running rampant and is bad news for everyone involved. - Ⓐ ☠ slayerboy ☠ Ⓐ from IM
Paul Buchheit
There was a lot of chatter about the future of FriendFeed this weekend. The short answer is that the team is working on a couple of longer-term projects that will help bring FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world. Transformation is not the end. Consider this the chrysalis stage -- if all goes well, a beautiful butterfly will emerge :)
What is transforming... FriendFeed, or the idea of FriendFeed? - Christopher Galtenberg
Thanks for the update, Paul! - Anne Bouey
THANK YOU! - tehKenny
Fabulous News :) - Susan Beebe
Noticed the "leaked" Facebook UI screenshots and the groups blog post today, and both seem FriendFeed inspired: nice to see Facebook trying to bring the stuff we like about FriendFeed to a larger audience. - Mark Trapp
To Robert Scoble: I told you so ;-) - Jesse Stay
Sounds like they're adding some of FF's features to FaceBook. yay - iTad from fftogo
Mark - got link? - Susan Beebe
Thanks Paul :) - Ashish
Paul, FriendFeed rocks as Gmail does ;) - Orlando Pozo
Devil is in the details: "couple of longer-term projects that will help bring FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world" == Facebook projects with FriendFeed-like elements == no work on FriendFeed itself. - EricaJoy
Thanks for the update, the more you communicate, the less we have to speculate. - Peter Hoffmann
The fact that these improvements are coming to Facebook and not friendfeed will not sway those who like friendfeed but dislike Facebook. - Scoble, Alex Scoble
Thank you Paul for bringing "FriendFeed goodness to the larger world" -- THAT sounds awesome!! - Susan Beebe
I hope out of the chrysalis emerges an infested Kerrigan. That'd be awesome http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki... - Ivan Kirigin
Thanks Mark, much appreciated... I'll check those out - Susan Beebe
+1 Ivan :) - Benjamin Golub
But we knew this was the deal the moment the full details of the purchase of friendfeed by Facebook became public. - Scoble, Alex Scoble
Yeah, I don't give a crap about Facebook. I want to know about FriendFeed. - Rochelle
sadly, no one with any power seems to care about FF anymore. - Big Joe Silenced
And there's your answer, Rochelle. friendwho? friendwhat now? Oh, you mean Facebook! (No I mean friendfeed) friendwho? (rinse, lather, repeat) - Scoble, Alex Scoble
there are some ui differences (and i tend to prefer friendfeed in those cases) but i have friended quite a few FF people in FB and the experience is remarkably similar in many ways. - Jason Wehmhoener
Thanks for the transparency on the Friendfeed "ghost town" matter Paul. Much appreciated. - Alex Knight
Thanks Paul... bring the special sauce to Facebook: http://blogs.zdnet.com/weblife... - Andrew
I like the "chrysalis stage" analogy - sounds cool.... goes an looks for FF goodness butterfly! - Susan Beebe
Good to know that FriendFeed still has some fight left; hope that translates into a viable and sustainable platform/utility for the masses (though I quite enjoy the close-knit, uber-geek community that it's become). - Christian
I don't like the chrysalis analogy. The butterfly emerges from the chrysalis and buggers off leaving the shell. Of course, it might then also get eaten by a bird. Tweet, tweet. - Mark H
Mark LOL nice, ... haha - Susan Beebe
Note that he didn't say that FriendFeed.com was going away, only that they're diverted to bringing it to a much larger audience - Jesse Stay
The problem is Scoble (Robert) and MG both just sent half of FriendFeed away so most of those that would benefit from this announcement won't even see it. - Jesse Stay
Jesse, I didn't get that from Paul's comment. I read that some of the friendfeed ideas will be going into FB. I like that idea, but I still prefer FF to FB because of the different conversations here that I don't have with friends and family. - travispuk from iPhone
Yeah, Paul's statement won't help friendfeed. This will just either give people more reason to go to Facebook or find another service entirely. - Scoble, Alex Scoble
What Alex and Rochelle said. This sounds like a "we're bringing FF to Facebook" announcement, and I don't give a damn about Facebook. I want to know what's happening HERE. And Cristo, both, but more the interface. I care about the friends I've made here, and I'm connected with many of them now on Facebook as well, but I prefer to interact with them here, because I like it better. - Jandy
Travis, he didn't say that - you read that, but he didn't say that. I'm willing to bet FriendFeed.com will not go away. - Jesse Stay
As much as I agree about Scoble and MG driving people away, they have also effectively flush out some comment from the FF team. - travispuk from iPhone
Travis, there are better ways of getting the FF team to comment - Jesse Stay
:( I quite liked the caterpillar. - Nick Lothian
Oh I don't think FF will go away, and damn will hope it doesn't either! - travispuk from iPhone
What I do see is more Facebook integrated into the FriendFeed environment - I think that's a good thing - Jesse Stay
The critical difference between Facebook and FriendFeed is the social model. With Facebook as it is today, you need to be mutual friends to see each others content. There is a "fan page" model but it is oriented toward "publishing/celebrity" rather than information sharing. FriendFeed has an asymmetric model like Twitter, where you can easily discover someone's content without any "friend" gesture whatsoever, and you can follow without friending. This makes the converation more discoverable, and useful.. - Adina Levin
Agree Adina. - travispuk from iPhone
If the integration is bringing public/asymmetric to Facebook, then it will be very useful indeed. If the integration is to add FriendFeed-style service integration into the symmetric/private Facebook model, it will be much less useful - it's more of the same - I'll be able to more easily share updates from youtube or last.fm or delicious to my friend network, but be unable to discover new people and infomation. - Adina Levin
@Jesse - I can't see any sign that they are working on FriendFeed at all. All the indications are that the FF team is now working on Facebook, and only Facebook. That's great for Facebook, and I'm sure they will do wonderful work there. But don't delude yourself that FriendFeed is going to get anything more than critical fixes, and maybe the occasional thing done in someone's spare time. - Nick Lothian
Butterflies look totally different than caterpillars and they also fly away - Melanie Reed
Crickets chirping... is this site alive?? :) - Christopher Galtenberg
+100 Adina. The things I like best about FriendFeed (easy content/people discovery, FoaF, asymmetrical following and being followed) are completely opposite to Facebook's core model. That's why as much as people keep talking about Facebook adding FF-like features, I don't see the REAL FF core features making it over, because the mindset is different. - Jandy
I don't see this announcement as anything new, or as reassuring. We knew from the time of the acquisition that there would be would be some movement of FF capabilities into FB. The real question is whether this means absorption of FF into FB or attracting the FB user base into FF. The comment about "bring[ing] FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world" still leaves that question open. - John (bird whisperer)
+1 everything Alex Scoble has said. Friendwhat? What's a feed? Who uses RSS anymore? We've got PubSubWTFOMGBBQ now! - Mr. Gunn
Agree with Jandy on +100 Adina. - Amy℠
Also, I agree with Jandy and Adina's comments. - John (bird whisperer)
Nick, Paul just said they're working on other projects right now. That still doesn't mean FriendFeed is going away. I'm not deluding myself at all. I'm telling everyone else they're deluding themselves by assuming it's going away. All the FriendFeed team is still using FriendFeed, and Paul just tried to give us comfort not to worry. For some reason we all don't want to believe him. It's actually kind of amusing. - Jesse Stay
I wonder what the powers that be mean by "FriendFeedy goodness"? Is it understood what WE like about it vs. FB? - Amy℠
Paul - Wishing you all the best as you tend your new butterfly garden :) I'll be here to enjoy them! - Susan Beebe
This is not the news that Friendfeed fans were looking for. - Vezquex
The issue isn't belief that they are going to do something. The question is what they are going to do, and whether that will continue the core value of FriendFeed, which is not just information aggregation but discoverability. - Adina Levin
I know more about the "Last Days" and heaven than I know about what's going to happen to FriendFeed as we have come to know it than was given in your rather cryptic answer, Paul. :) And while that may not be a fair comparison (God actually gave details and signs), there is something definitely not forthcoming about your response. A person usually withholds details that affect another... more... - Melanie Reed
Hopefully this helps to quiet all of the "friendfeed is dying" talk. Because this thread proves ff is alive and well. - Garin Kilpatrick
@Jesse - I read it differently to you. To me, Paul is saying "We are taking what we were working towards on FriendFeed, and trying to bring that goodness to a bigger audience". No one is claiming they are going to shut down FF. - Nick Lothian
@Jesse - Want to make a bet on the number of new features added to FF before the end of the year? - Nick Lothian
You read my mind. Having seen a few acquisitions, I am wondering if FF staff was told to put the site in bugfix mode. - EricaJoy from IM
Cristo, to deliver some straightforward talk is not about giving away company details. If you have a product that is original and stands on its own, you don't need to refer to it as a "butterfly". Many companies even promote something new and upcoming especially to their loyal user base. It gives a signal. A proper one. It tells your users and future users enough so that they can make an informed decision about what they want to do instead of keeping them on tenderhooks - Melanie Reed
"the chrysalis stage in most butterflies is one in which there is little movement" (via wikipedia) So if you follow that metaphor then eventually FriendFeed will go through a metamorphosis -- that means it's not dead... really how hard can it be to get what he's saying? - Chris Heath
Its pretty hard :) The burning question is if they are putting FF goodness in to the walled gardens that are Facebook or are they bringing FF openness to FB too. I think the people here want the open forums that are FF not the closed ones that are FB. If FB is going hybrid with both walled gardens and open forums that would be OK too. People on FF want open forums... like Twitter and FF... without the crude interface that is Twitter and without the uncertainty that is FF now. - Ed Millard
Facebook is gonna have to rip off much of the privacy to maximize their product in the real-time web world. I am going to assume FF goodness is going to be applied to FB :) *crosses fingers* - Susan Beebe
Just a thought... why does "longer-term projects that will help bring FriendFeedy goodness to the larger world" JUST mean facebook.com? What I get from this is that they are working on a range of things, maybe bringing the FriendFeed sauce to a range of sites, powered by the Facebook back end. Who knows what that means. A FriendFeed service powered by FacebookConnect? Also to...... more... - Johnny
LMFAO. Johnny++ - Rahsheen
FB needs to leave the privacy for the walled garden and the inner circle. Their current user base likes that. They just need a second feed that is an open forum and you can talk there without it bleeding in to your inner circle feed. - Ed Millard
Yes, but blocking doesn't work so well since you can just use Chrome's Incognito mode to get around it. - Scoble, Alex Scoble
Translation: if you haven't switche to Facebook yet, you better do it now so you can get a good vanity URL. - David Chartier from iPhone
I don't know what all the fuss is about. But could we have the long answer too, please? - Laura Norvig
Although I'm interested, FB != FF. I don't see how the two mix in a way that makes me feel otherwise. Mixing audiences is not a good thing for me (with a few exceptions) and I know others share the same thought. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
Paul, will FF be here in 1 year, 5 years? - Robert Higgins
Thanks for the update Paul.. - Chris Myles
Cristo I am funking nobody, I would like Paul to quantify his post. Simple. Will FF be here in 1 year? Will FF be here in 5 years? - Robert Higgins
IMO friendfeed shoud attract more general audience... Facebook and twitter are having more general users. Most of the FF users are tech bloggers or those who needs aggregation services... I dont know it's just my feeling or not . but this is my impression on FF. but it's great service.. the features are too good... but we will roam were we meet our friends... thats most of the people are into twitter and FB. - Sarath
Ohhhh a perrrttty butterfly, I'm moist with anticipation. - sofarsoShawn
Glad to hear it, Paul. - WoH: Professor MOTHRA
Cristo: i almost made the same observation an hour or two ago when i first read through this posting and its comments. I was skimming and kept seeing alex, alex, alex... and thinking to myself... where's Robert!?! - Chris Heath
Great news. Thanks! friendfeed team. :D - Franc, a rememberer
@Sarath - I have a lot more in common with the people I've met here on FriendFeed than FB or Twitter. Twitter is too hard to search, and FB (and Twitter to a good extent) is driven by the people you know in RL (and unfortunately I don't have nearly as much in common in RL with my family, co-workers and acquaintences as I do with people scattered all over the world who I have met on FF).... more... - Lindsay
I think that in his cryptic statement he means, and a lot of people here agree with me, that more Facebook's going to get more FriendFeedy. Which doesn't mean that FF still isn't dead or doomed. After all, he works for Facebook now. FriendFeed=open forum, Facebook=walled garden, totally opposite master metaphors; but I don't think Zuckerberg gets it, and FF belongs to Zuckerberg now. So this is really about FB; FF's still in limbo. Still, some FF people friended me at FB, and I put them in a special list. - Dennis Jernberg
@FF-team keep on rocking :). BTW I also think it's really cool you guys open-sourced tornado. - alfred westerveld
+1 what alfred said, and good to hear words like "longer-term" & "beautiful" coming straight from The Walrus - keep that vision strong. Hope all goes well for FF team doing some good re-inventing the Octopus Garden of FB - seems you've got your work cut out for you there! It would be so nice if any way to keep a "simple & pure" form of FriendFeed alive (maintained and developed - more open source?) for us to enjoy, but no worries .... you've simultaneously raised the bar and paved the way for the rest! - Dan Freeman
Good luck with the development Paul! Hopefully Zuck has some positive insight. - Garin Kilpatrick
I like butterflies. - Harold Cabezas
Paul: If someone offered me a bag of money to do what you guys did, I would have done exactly the same (probably a lot faster too). However, it would be nice if you spent an hour answering some of the questions here. It might also give people like me a little more faith, in what used to be your primary project; Friendfeed. You made the best platform on the planet - why not use it to let us know what the heck's going on? - Jim Connolly
I'm assuming that Facebook wants to keep their roadmap quiet. I respect that but leaving you community in the dark for a brand that the applications stand for community building is rather ironic. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)
SUPER!! I don't Blame ya 1 Darn bit fer Dumpin' FacePOOP Paul!! ;PPP Wait FacePOOP is the Maggot Stage!! ;)) - Billy Warhol
If I can still have all my friends that I have here on friendfeed and share things with them the exact same way, I don't care what "www" address I have to type in to get it. I just hope i don't have to give up any of FF's awesome features! Thanks for the update Paul! - David Cook
The problem is I don't know whether to wrote an app on your API or not because i'm not sure whether it will all be dropped in the "transformation". Imagine speding late nights and weekends coding something up only for it to be dropped suddenly. Need a decent long term picture. Looking at Cliqset. - Steven Livingstone-Pérez
Good point Steven - and one of the reasons many of us are spending so little time developing our networks here. - Jim Connolly
ffcode: Good luck with that ;-) - Jim Connolly
So the changes are at Facebook not FriendFeed, Paul? - Kol Tregaskes
And good luck to all of your team - Özkan Altuner from iPhone
yemezler - MobilAdam
I do care about what happens next, but this is the best news of the day nonetheless ! thanks for giving us updates at last ! and I do hope FF will awaken again ! such a great tool, but letdown since the announcement of the buyback by FB - laetSgo
will I see this post in my "best of week" email from FF? - Kirill Bolgarov
If Facebook is going to get fixed, please remember that it needs fixing politically, not just technically. It needs to give people the option to open their data to Google - for instance. A walled garden where the walls are fixed in place sucks. - Tim Tyler
@Paul, or perhaps an Alien will erupt forth from its stomach? (kidding, kidding!) - j1m
bump! - Jesse Stay
Why? edit: so... 18 months later i'm still wondering what exactly this post was all about - Chris Heath
Louis Gray
The Second Life of FriendFeed? - http://scobleizer.posterous.com/the-sec...
Depressing. - Akiva
Understood, Akiva. Sometimes the big plans we all hoped for don't come to pass. It's no coincidence I'm still in Vegas writing that. It sure would have been nice to have some other hopes come true this week! - Louis Gray
True enough. I just hope that Robert's also right about these other awesome features that Twitter plans on introducing. I just can't get past the 140-character limitation as always crippling the long-term experience there. - Akiva
I think Robert's right, as usual. Friendfeed is still insanely useful for me during our shows (see the TWiT-Conversations room) and I hope I can continue to use that functionality here or somewhere, but I find myself no longer using it all the time. Twitter is back, alas. - Leo Laporte
Akiva: there are lots of ways around the 140-character limitation. I actually like it because it enables mobile phone usage. FriendFeed is very hard to use on my iPhone compared to, say, Tweetie. - Robert Scoble
Thanks Leo. - Robert Scoble
Robert, what do you think about a 140-character truncation hiding a longer post? - Akiva
Akiva: it doesn't bother me. There are already post shortening services like that that work with Twitter. - Robert Scoble
If you could just auto-add every twitterer you follow as a "ghost friend", Friendfeed becomes a superset of twitter... - Kevan Emmott
Robert, true, but those links take you outside of Twitter where there is no guarantee of the target site being mobile-friendly or even up and available. And this doesn't even get into the fact that it's impossible to have discussions there. - Akiva
And by there I mean Twitter and not a particular target site. - Akiva
I predicted Friendfeed's demise six months ago here http://dawnsplan.wordpress.com/2009... when they released the new UI. Cool, but too late. - Dawn
Btw, Arrington was right. Scoble was wrong. - Dawn
This saddens me too. I keep trying to like Twitter, but it just doesn't have the engagement Friendfeed has/had. Will stay cautiously optimistic about new features. - Martha
Kevan, you've always have been able to do that and in May or June, it was made easier to add people you follow on Twitter, Facebook or Gmail. - Anika
Wish things were different, but that's a solid write-up, Robert. +1 Akiva for all your points above. - Micah
Dawn, you may have correctly prognosticated the impending demise of FriendFeed but you did so using all the wrong reasons. - Akiva
Micah, thanks! - Akiva
No, I mean auto-create *ghost users* for people who don't have Friendfeed accounts who you follow in Twitter. You can easily add the ones that have accounts - I've already done that - and you can create ghost users, but that's a bit of a pain. - Kevan Emmott
ffcode, just because something's popular doesn't make it good. It's tough to have a real conversation about anything on Twitter because of that limit. Try having a conversation with more than one or two people at once. Each @reply eats up some of that precious space. - Akiva
'Nibble logger'. Well, that's something I'm going to be repeating constantly for the next few days. - Akiva
I can speak that from personal experience, during an acquisition it is the most important thing to keep the team acquired in place. Some acquisitions are made purely for the product or technology. Others might be arguably for the customer base. However, successful acquisitions always focus on 1) successfully keeping the core leadership and customer-touching teams in place, 2) augmenting... more... - Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
Akiva, the essential reason FF is failing is because it's always been too much like Twitter, even when it was "better" than Twitter. FF needed to differentiate themselves in a remarkable, unique way, and they failed to do that. Twitter had already won the public's imagination in this space, so the window of opportunity for FF as a real competitor was closed a long time ago. That you and Scoble and others are just now waking up to the symptoms doesn't mean I'm wrong about the cause. - Dawn
I don't think any of us are just now waking up. Most of us came to terms with it in the wake of the Facebook buy-out. And I still believe it is that that spelled FriendFeed's doom and not the change to the UI. - Akiva
Dawn: I have talked with hundreds of people about Twitter and FriendFeed and NONE came to that conclusion but it doesn't matter. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Sadly, I have to agree with everything Robert's said (which is slightly painful). I love this place, but Friendfeed's going nowhere. That is, unless something BIG happens and happens quickly. - Jim Connolly
I just have to say that I incorporated FF into my Introduction to Sociology courses, with over 120 students, and it has been quite useful, dare I say extraordinary. It is an extremely useful "aggregator" of sorts, and a fantastic organizational tool for me as instructor. I can do some pretty cool, nearly real time integration of information with my students with my iPhone, Google Reader, Twitter, my blog, etc...and FriendFeed. - Chad Gesser
It seems to me that the integration of information into FriendFeed has been incredibly overlooked and undervalued. It remains to be seen what kind of impact Wave will have in pulling people back to their laptop/desktops, but there is an interesting trend of the use of mobile devices for learning, and FF has made that possible in ways for me this semester that I have never thought. Granted my iPhone is a very important part of the capabilities. - Chad Gesser
Am happy for you guys mine is like hell - Pam Gwenzi
Ken Stewart: Another reason to do acquisitions is to just kill a competitor. Since apparently FB didn't lock in the FF engineers you have to wonder about their motivations. It will be ironic if the FF acquisition just strengthens Twitter, FB's biggest competitor, which is mostly what it seems to be doing. If I was on the FF team and FB didn't lock me in, I would take whatever they got out of the deal, leave and start a new FF, under a new name, assuming there isn't a no compete. - Ed Millard
I sure would like to read the contract for the FF/FB deal. It seems.... odd. - Ed Millard
Chad: FriendFeed might turn into the equivalent of Notepad. Useful for some things but no one ever talks about how cool Notepad is. It hasn't gotten many new features in decades, but it still is used every day by probably thousands of people, maybe even millions. If FriendFeed turns into that I'll be happy, and FriendFeed will indeed see a second life as a lightweight conversation tool. Google Wave sure shows what happens when you get a ton of features. Yuch. - Robert Scoble
I would be *very* happy if FriendFeed lasts as long as notepad. The main reason I started posting stuff on FriendFeed was to make an on-line notebook where I can search for previously found items. Along the way I surprisingly found that some people actually like looking at what I post. I miss the more active FriendFeed days, but I would be ok if the activity moves to Facebook etc...,... more... - Mitchell Tsai
+1 Chad: "integration of information into FriendFeed has been incredibly overlooked and undervalued". I continue to get high value for that reason. - Hutch Carpenter
I do think FF will get its "second life", probably soon. I still think it's the best social media aggregator by far. It's what I use to bring all my social media stuff together. I even use it as my preferred Twitter client when I'm not on the Twitter website. Still, I don't think Facebook realize what they've got here other than just another competitor to squash, Yahoo/Google-style... - Dennis Jernberg
Robert, then nobody in Silicon Valley understands mainstream dynamics. What a surprise. :) - Dawn
*raises hand* doesn't this beg the question why the hell's he been on FF all day? I can recall a time when Twitter was vile & corrupt according to Scoble, so he must've misread those chicken entrails as he's back cheaping cheaping away like Tweeting was life giving air - sofarsoShawn
Sofar: Twitter is still corrupt. But it is where the things and people I want to read are. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Jim Connolly
Balloon Boy hoax, CNN and Twitter - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
Balloon Boy hoax, CNN and Twitter
(From post) I’m hoping that this dumb-ass story isn’t the starting pistol, as the news outlets take their places for a ‘race to the bottom’. Yes, there has always been political bias in the news and yes, the news outlets have often got things wrong. However, focusing on speed rather than facts is hardly going to improve the quality and reliability of the news we watch or hear. - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Robert Scoble
Thank you to my 50,002 followers. Look through my followers here and compare to my Twitter followers and what do you notice? I see fewer spammers. Fewer bots. Fewer social media experts. Thanks for joining me on FriendFeed! It has been an awesome two years!
Down with bots, spammers, and social media gurus! Up with geeks! A big thumbs up on behalf of my fellow FriendFeed fanatics. - Dennis Jernberg
I love geeks and FriendFeed has them in droves. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
You're welcome ;-) A question though, where do you think we geeks will congregate next? I'm thinking that since Facebook now owns the Friendfeed devs, FF will eventually starve to death... hopefully not. - Roberto Teixeira
But I notice a lot of users interact on FF via Twitter not directly on FF. Also FF faces tough competition from the likes of Posterous and Tumblr which offer more functionality with similar ease of use as FF. - Roger
Roberto: Not so long ago this very FF post from scobleizer would get something about 300+ likes and 150+ comments. Sadly, FF users are surely looking elsewhere. - Arvind
FF is ok, but its not the be all and end all Robert. - Micky
Arvind: yup. Foursquare! :-) - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Friendfeed wins - Ashish
I too think that friendfeed is still a winner... people that left just filtered themselves out of my conversations. They are no longer discoverable here to me. Their loss (imho) - Chris Heath
Your welcome :). Friendfeed really really is awesome - alfred westerveld
Yes Robert and Friendfeed is massively technically superior - Makes it even sadder that the platform here's being ignored by the new owners. - Jim Connolly
2 years? Wow, nice work man! - Loc from iPhone
Robert - I love the community and friends here on FriendFeed. I am so happy I was on FF in early 2008 and got to experience it's wild and wooly growth path. Chatting with you and all these cool geeks is really fun. I've learned TONS from you guys and I truly appreciate the friendship too! :) - Susan Beebe
I agree, way less marketing gurus and spammers =) - Brodie Beta
In my experience, I've been using ff more rather than less since the fb aquisition. I don't see why I would migrate to another community ATM. To me, Friendfeed is king. :) King of social media, that is. - Franc, a rememberer
Me, I'm sticking with FF for the foreseeable future. I'm even going to do my part to promote it, at least to my (right now) 1K+ Twitter followers. - Dennis Jernberg
Friend Feed is the Future Robert and you just may be our Faithfull leader! :) - Warren Daly
Word. - Gary
Thank you, Robert. I have learned quite a bit from you-and you have created/moderated some tremendous discussions/issues. Best wishes to you and your family. - Harold Cabezas
I'm still here. I tried doing the Google Reader thing. While it's a great reader, I think it SUCKS as a social platform. I still use it, but I don't expect as much out of it as I used to. FriendFeed and posterous are what I like best for what I do. Facebook is getting a little chaotic for me. I've made lists, but I think I need to start pruning... LONG LIVE FRIENDFEED! - Kimber Scott
U do like normal folks like us, who does have a life, like having hobbies such as movies, taking pictures, making jokes and listening 2 old radio jokes on the Internet lol...and wondering why spell check doesn't work somedays - polou/indigo_bow
Has it really been 2 years? OMG that was fast. - Elliott Ng
Jim Connolly
Someone PLEASE turn off the 'live blogging' hosepipe! | The Tech News Blog - http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
Someone PLEASE turn off the 'live blogging' hosepipe! | The Tech News Blog
Once again, hundreds or maybe thousands of people, attending the SAME event at the SAME time are ‘live blogging’ the SAME content to (mostly) the SAME people. - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
Robert Scoble
Today is probably the day when I pass 50,000 followers on FriendFeed. A mind-blowing number if you consider it includes almost no spammers or celebrities.
Thank you for joining me here! - Robert Scoble from iPhone
yeah cos twitters down lol - michelle harris
A mind blowing number considering youre not a celebrity either. - Paulo Diniz
Also about 5,000 of those joined after FriendFeed sold to Facebook. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Congratulations Robert, you obviously have earned it! - Stock Market Club
Congratulations! - Helge V. Keitel
Congrats - Kashif Khan
Do you still think FriendFeed will die, Robert? Just curious. - Jeff Harbert
Only almost? Well, we probably define "celebrity" a bit uniquely around here. - Kathy Fitch from iPhone
Jeff: if I ever said that I take it back. That said the FriendFeed team is mostly working on other things now. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
WOW !!! congrats ... but I must say I have 4 real real real friends IRL .... :D - Marcel Bloingo
Nice to see you here Robert. It's been kinda quiet lately. ;-) - Rob Michael (Atmos Trio)
You've really gotta consider getting some celebrities and spammers on this account....where's your sense of adventure....lol - walidmREALTOR
Walidim: that is what Twitter is for! :-) - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Congratulations-I completely agree with ffcode, FF weighs more than Twitter in my opinion....unless you're going for mass, huge numbers...... - Harold Cabezas
I have almost 15K followers. - Dave Winer
Andy: a little slower but not much. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Look out, I'm only 49,800 behind you - Dave Hodson
Think about it - you can fill a stadium with that many people. - Mike Doeff from iPhone
Good to see you still around. This place is as fun as ever. - Bruce Lewis from fftogo
Why not have a face-off with CNN? :) - James Harnedy
Robert Scoble for Mayor of FriendFeed. - Thomas Hawk
I haven't been on friendfeed much really since the facebook announcement but it is nice to have something to fall back on when my beloved twitter is out. - Lise
You just followed me. I'm not following you yet.. Will do so if you accept my invite on Facebook that I sent to you a few years ago.. - Johnny Rice
Johnny: I deleted about 10,000 Facebook invites and accept very few new ones, sorry. - Robert Scoble from iPhone
Robert: On FriendFeed, we're all celebrities! And spammers. :) - Steve Lynch from twhirl
@ffcode - hmm, who exactly is dave "hudson"? - Dave Hodson
Congrats. Yeah, I haven't noticed much abuse on FriendFeed; but then again it's hardly used by the mainstream. - Joe Manna
Joe, what's not mainstream about 50,000 people? - Louis Gray
No problem. I just sent you another Facebook invite via Facebook Mail. Just now.. If not accepted then you're pulled from the contact list.. Do you need a Google Wave invite? I have 4 left.. tick tick tick.. ;-) - Johnny Rice
what does that mean? i mean what good are you getting from those 50K followers? how many of them don't provide content back to you? - Jonathan Jesse
Time's up... ciao - Johnny Rice
Ive hardly used friendfeed since facebook took over and (apparently) seem to want to 'run it down.' Pity. - Jim Connolly
Basically I just open FriendFeed from time to time to see what Scoble's followers are writing (I loved the "castle" discussion) - Michael Slattery
& you know, my sub counts for like 10,000 of those :o) congrats big guy! - sofarsoShawn
congratulations, got any tips for the rest of us? how long have you been on friendfeed for? twitter(at)locspoc - Loc
Do you feel any pressure Robert? Does having such a huge number of followers bring more responsibility and quality of the content stress for you? - Özkan Altuner
Spammers or not, 50k would be a sign of info overload for anyone: http://bit.ly/3KQSAz - Leif Hansen
Forgot to say: thanks for letting us join you here, Robert! - Kathy Fitch
Congrads Scoble on passing 50,000 followers! - polou/indigo_bow
Congrats for your first 50K -- on FF, even! Me, I'm still a little over 49,750 behind you... - Dennis Jernberg
Kudos to you Robert. - Roberto Bonini
Ozkan: I do feel some pressure to find good stuff and not to waste people's time because that waste is multiplied across so many. - Robert Scoble
Numbers is ossum! - david beckwith
lol - Meg VMeg
Don't be a Wally Waste Multiplier, kids. - Micah from FFHound(roid)!
Steve Gillmor
I hear that @Pistachio, @Loic will be on today's Gillmor Gang at 1pm. - Cliff Gerrish
Should be a great show! Laura @Pistachio is a great lady - and who doesn't like Loic? - Jim Connolly
looking forward to it - Kevin Marks
Hi Laura!!! - Francine Hardaway
No one there. - Paul W. Swansen
who's doing darth vader breathing? - Kevin Marks
Finally running a bit late. - Paul W. Swansen
Not me. - Robert Scoble
a bit loud all of a sudden - Rocky Barbanica
John Borthwick of BetaWorks live on the GillmorGang. - Cliff Gerrish
how many of you are joining us at the ReadWrite Real-Time Web Summit next Thurs? John Borthwick is! http://readwriteweb.com/summit hi John! :) - Marshall Kirkpatrick
a spot on her camera is distracting - Rocky Barbanica
Marshall: I will. - Robert Scoble
I am joining you there - Brian Hendrickson
Rocky: that's a mouse pointer. - Robert Scoble
I'm joining the http://readwriteweb.com/summit @marshallk - looking forward to it - Kevin Marks
the spot is there even on loic's cam - Nishant
if Twitter=AOL we should see a "web" twitter soon. - Robert Scoble
Yeah, it's not on her camera... it's on everybody's - Ken Sheppardson
We've got a cursor problem that we know about. We'll just hav to live with it for this show. - Cliff Gerrish
no - now it's on Loic- must be tricaster - Rocky Barbanica
nice mouse pointer in the middle of the screen.... whoo! - Jay
oh good! didn't know you were coming Robert, glad to hear it! - Marshall Kirkpatrick
Marshall: I'm not sure if I reserved my Twitter ticket yet. :-) - Robert Scoble
ahh thanks cliff - Rocky Barbanica
that comes from the mouse/keyboard sharing utility probably - if they are running multiple skype computers - bear (aka Mike Taylor)
seriously.... someone pick that booger! - Jay
What, you mean Kevin's birthmark? - Ken Sheppardson
and fix the wide faces LOL - dstamand
Bear, bingo - Cliff Gerrish
Isn't everyone born with a mouse cursor on their face? - Robert Scoble
Evan Prodromou on Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference today 07 Oct 2009 http://www.w3.org/2009... - Brian Hendrickson
=D - Jay
Would have been interesting to watch this discussion on wave. SO much chaos! yikes! FF is better! :-) - Nishant
There's always something going on with the technology on GG - Francine Hardaway
FF is different, not better. - Ken Sheppardson
Someone is typing on a keyboard, knock that off. - Robert Scoble
Yes. different and better for such discussions - Nishant
Suggestion: Mute when not talking. - Arnie Klaus
Love these British accents and guys who sound like they're talking in tunnels - Francine Hardaway
Just what I need. An explosion of data coming into the stream - Francine Hardaway
Sorry, Robert. I'm typing. Then again, I'm not on the call... didn't realize it was disruptive ;-) - Ken Sheppardson
I want tweetdeck or seesmic to be a full "real-time" web browser : with all real-time information in there : Twitter, Facebook... etc, but also Gmail, my RSS feeds,... etc - Julien
Ken, that doesn't mean we can't hear you. - Cliff Gerrish
Francine: I haven't seen any of that stuff on my stream yet. Probably has a big impact on search. - Robert Scoble
Cliff: So you can hear the Blue Angels overhead too then? - Ken Sheppardson
Oh yeah. - Cliff Gerrish
Other people are reporting Blue Angels too. - Robert Scoble
I just saw them off the Pacifica coast - Rocky Barbanica
#blueangels should be trending topic on Twitter any minute. It's their first practice for Fleet Week today. - Ken Sheppardson
I like the split screen can you quad screen? - Rocky Barbanica
Rocky, not yet. It's a feature request for the Tricaster. But the double box is pretty cool. - Cliff Gerrish
split screen eliminates visible cursor issue - Rocky Barbanica
... waiting for the Moment of Win - Daniel J. Pritchett
Daniel: we are too! :-) - Robert Scoble
Daniel: it usually comes after the show. - Robert Scoble
I was wrong. - Rocky Barbanica
lol @Daniel - Micah
Just *reply*, Robert. We'll follow-up and go back to look at the conversation if your reply is interesting. - Ken Sheppardson
Flag a conversation as interesting by participating. - Ken Sheppardson
@Amarquart - are you thinking something like Friendfeed's Best of Day for lists? - Daniel J. Pritchett
is there an audio archive for these new gillmor gangs? - Jamie
"Re:" - Ken Sheppardson
all I want to do is hear the show on my commute. this live shit is annoying. - Jamie
Jamie: get an iPHone. - Robert Scoble
I have an iPhone - Jamie
Jamie: Look for Bootleg Gillmor Gang on iTunes - Ken Morley
I want an RSS feed - Jamie
FriendFeed was very close to what I want, but didn't give me enough choice on controlling/separating my words out from yours. - Robert Scoble
latest bootleg gillmor gang is 9.17 - Jamie
/me casts Level 9 Lazyweb of the infinite - Daniel J. Pritchett
You can listen to Ustream live on iPhone with the Ustream app. - Robert Scoble
Still hate hashtags, although I use them - Francine Hardaway
Keep looking, I have 10.01 via iTunes. - Ken Morley
I know but the live format isnt always convenient from a timing perspective. some of us work! lol - Jamie
Francine: I use them less and less, usually only for conferences. And even then I hate them. - Robert Scoble
Oh, and people now spam by putting hashtags on irrelevant tweets - Francine Hardaway
I need a visual map on how these things work or I can't adapt easily. - Arnie Klaus
Bored dog just countersurfed in my kitchen, took the top off the crockpot and tried to take out the chicken! Thank goodness a fail! - Francine Hardaway
thanks Ken I will try again - Jamie
Can someone please move the pointer out of the middle of the screen? - Matthew Schrock
I like Brizzly's take on a wikified hashtag index right inside the client. It's got flaws but it's a good start. Would love to see an "official" hashtag wiki. Then again, Twitter doesn't feel like a wiki-friendly company. More on Brizzly at http://www.louisgray.com/live... - Daniel J. Pritchett
Laura's not odd -- just far more like everyone else - Ian McGee
Matthew, we just have to live with it for this show. - Cliff Gerrish
Just keep a 2-shot, Cliff :-) - Ken Sheppardson
friendfeed's text is too grey. I had to to make http://friendlierfeed.appspot.com to read it - Kevin Marks
good show so far! - Rocky Barbanica
I only go to Friendfeed because my friends are there:-) Easier to see them there. BTW, I'm not seeing a cursor - Francine Hardaway
Thanks Cliff. - Matthew Schrock
Robert, I'm curious, are you aware of Cliqset? Some of the issues you've brought up are problems we're very interested and about to help solve. - Darren
Yeah, I'm barely aware of Cliqset, I will be interested in trying that out. Probably this weekend. - Robert Scoble
cursor moved - Rocky Barbanica
Wanna call me and walk me through it? +1-425-205-1921 - Robert Scoble
ah, I see Daren is here too - Marshall Kirkpatrick
MySpace? Never heard of them! LOL!!! - Rocky Barbanica
ah - cliqset requires a beta code - anyway to get one? - bear (aka Mike Taylor)
Hey Dan! - Rocky Barbanica
looks like we need a standard for these activities in a stream... oh wait there's one! What we need is an easy wait to be a "source" with existing clients (ie. making seesmic/tweedeck activity stream clients for many services, not just twitter/facebook) - Sylvain Carle
Creating a simple and effective way for a social media publishing workflow (avoiding duplication) is very difficult at the moment. - Mark Krynsky
crowd-sourced design; fun - Ian McGee
The IM streams came together in the client. Pidgin, Adium, Trillian, etc. - Ken Sheppardson
Chamillionaire interview on building43 tomorrow hosted by Michael Sean Wright - Rocky Barbanica
Michael Sean Wright is sitting next to me. - Robert Scoble
Ridin' Dirty Chamillionaire? - Daniel J. Pritchett
Yea, the came in the client... but never further than that : Mosaic would have never been the web browser if it couldn't browse any website : http://blog.superfeedr.com/Real-ti... - Julien
"Privacy" means "multi groups" while "public" means "one group", no ? - Baptiste Cadiou
Just signing into Cliqset to see if it solves anything - Francine Hardaway
Public means multiple scale free microcommunities. - Cliff Gerrish
Public = you determine whether or not you're a member, Private = I do. - Ken Sheppardson
Same Chamillionaire, Daniel - Rocky Barbanica
I have to run. - Robert Scoble
Steve: I have to run, I have a Mashable chat I have to do. - Robert Scoble
OK, bye Robert. - Cliff Gerrish
Still haven't gotten a wave invite. 2 people said they sent them - Francine Hardaway
Realtime audience mining (to Mashable) - Arnie Klaus
If blinders = control, we're in trouble - Ken Sheppardson
As long as you let "everyone" view what you're saying, you can't really block any particular person from seeing it. - Ken Sheppardson
nice reference to dynamic memory :) - Hilary Talbot
Francine, Google is metering the invites that are in the queue. It may take a while. - Matthew Schrock
Google Reader has made steps with regards to curation by friends. Louis Gray is my shared items guru :) - Mark Krynsky
to calculate what's trending around your friends, you need a lot of friends ^^ - Baptiste Cadiou
Not if you also expand the network to friends of your friends Baptiste - Mark Krynsky
also http://oneforty.com/item... shows stories your friends read - Kevin Marks
Agree with Mark K - GR does a good job, feedly is a fine app which also provides suggestions. - Dave Martin
I wrote about Twitter Times yesterday which Kevin just mentioned http://lifestreamblog.com/custom-... It's a great way to filter Twitter links by the people you follow on Twitter. - Mark Krynsky
Well, it shouldn't have to be just your friends... I'd like to see some sort of wizard that let you build up groups, e.g. "Create a group of all the peole my friends follow, and show me trending topics among those people" - Ken Sheppardson
Micromessage derivatives. - Cliff Gerrish
Ken, if Twitter rolls out lists soon and allows that data to be passed to the API Twitter Times could leverage that automatically. - Mark Krynsky
I want to see the principal that Twitter Times has released to be created on a wider scale. Imagine that logic expanded across multiple social media services and the people you follow on each of them. Then mash the data across all of them. It become far more interesting and useful at that point. - Mark Krynsky
Kevin, TwitterTimes looks like something actually useful. - Francine Hardaway
Anyone on Cliqset? Couldn't find anyone I know - Francine Hardaway
Mashability toward Monetization - Arnie Klaus
I'm on there Francine but honestly haven't used it much - Mark Krynsky
filtered feeds toward frictionless transactions - Arnie Klaus
What is the value of a user of any app? - Arnie Klaus
appreciate Laura being on GG. enjoying her imput. - Hilary Talbot
this sounds like good advice - Brian Hendrickson
Its great that this show is not tightly limited in time. It allows the conversations to flourish. - Arnie Klaus
Love you Laura! - Francine Hardaway
Bravos, Steve. Good show. P.S. Great to hear that @Pistachio is officially a member of TGG. - Dave Martin
Great show!! - Arnie Klaus
great show - Jamie
yes @hil121 great to have @pistachio here too - very insightful - Kevin Marks
Thanks to all the participants of today's Gillmor Gang. Y'all rock! - Tina Chase Gillmor
Thanks to the audience too - realtime and otherwise. - Tina Chase Gillmor
Jim Connolly
Why bloggers must come clean - http://jimsmarketingblog.com/2009...
Thanks Mark. To be honest, I don't even know what the affiliate % is - I just genuinely LOVE this theme. - Jim Connolly
Robert Scoble
First photos of Ryan Soroush Scoble. - Robert Scoble
Congrats. - Spencer
Love! - Robert Scoble
Thanks, we're having lots of fun except for getting woken up after three hours of sleep. :-) - Robert Scoble
that is one very alert kid Robert. Congrats again. - Rhys Amos
Just awesome, Robert! Do you have some stats? Weight? Length? Give my best to your wife :) - Robert Couture
Oh and I don't see an iPhone in those little hands yet :) - Robert Couture
Robert: 7 lbs 13 oz. Born at 11:32 pm. on Sept 19, 2009. 20.5 inches long. - Robert Scoble
He's adorable. Also I notice Sequoia Hospital puts their name on the onesie. Thats smart; just a bit of free marketing, in everyone's new baby photos. - DGentry
Welcome to the our small world Ryan "happiness" Scoble! - N.Onur ATAHAN
Congrats Robert! He looks beautiful. - Devon Govett
Congratulations! - Warner Crocker
Congratulations to you and Maryam (and Milan and Patrick as well) - Brian Sullivan
Congrats - you have time to breed? - Dave Hendricks
Dave: it's amazing, huh? :-) - Robert Scoble
He is beautiful Robert! - earl wallace from twhirl
Congratulations, - Michelle
:) ای جان - Noosha
yay scobles! - metalerik from iPhone
welcome to this ..... world! i hope you're luckier than us!!!!!!!!! - Alaedin Fazel
Congratulations Robert and Maryam!!! - Amit Morson
Curieux cet emmaillotage de bébé... Cela ne se fait plus... - Polluxe
i LOVE new babies! he's so alert by the time he gets his clothes and blanket. congratulations! - Trish Haley
Congratulations, and welcome to the little one. - Sally - Skyrimmin' It
RSS FTW! Congratulations. - Tom Horn
Congrats ! - Guy Vander Heyden
CONGRATULATIONS to the Scoble family. The baby's beautiful :) - Jim Connolly
Congratulations, very happy for you and your family! Best wishes. - Harold Cabezas
my heartiest congratulations! I'm so happy for all of you! - Howard Greenstein
Congrats Rob.......He's got your looks too :-) - Alex Marrow
Jim Connolly
Who's awake?
Not Me - Brent - Yes I am
I'm a work - Johnny
Yes Johnny. you are a piece of work. - Brent - Yes I am
Yes, awake already. - PKN MaNiAc
I'm just about to start coffee number 2 - should be awake shortly...... - Jim Connolly
Louis Gray
London haz been achieved. Blimey.
hurray you're safe good luck on the Heathrow Express to Paddington - Thomas Power
In England Sleep is productive and worthy of your time. - OCoG of FF, Jimminy
Take lots of pictures! - Jesse Stay
Welcome to my home town Louis! - Jim Connolly
Jim are you coming along tomorrow? - Thomas Power
Looking forward to tomorrow Louis ! - Geert CONARD
Louis, where in London are you going? Any time to browse around? - Kol Tregaskes
Thomas: Hi - Just seen your message. Sadly not - but would have loved to gone along. Let me know how it goes for you and if I can help in any way. - Jim Connolly
I hope you have at least a little time to be a tourist. - DGentry
yes we're taking him out tonight for a little tour and dinner - Thomas Power
Tour, eh? I should bring my coat. - Louis Gray
Big Ben, Parliament... Big Ben, Parliament... Big Ben, Parliament... - Josh Haley
I would take the coat Louis, did you experience central London yesterday? (It didn't stop raining the whole day, very miserable) - Charley M
No wonder the interwebs were so quiet! - Jenna Bilotta from Android
LOL Josh...you forgot High Tea with Lizzy - WoH: Professor MOTHRA
Enjoy Louis! (What no i-pic of Big Ben yet?) - Charlie Anzman
I read this as "London has been archived." Too many Outlook questions from users today. - MiniMage
come and join us for Louis' event today from 10am http://www.ecademy.com/module... - Thomas Power
if you can't make the daytime Louis is speaking again tonight at 7.45pm http://www.ecademy.com/module... - Thomas Power
Thomas, is there a Ustream of it? - Jesse Stay
Steve Gillmor
why's the video private steve? - Chris Heath
Private videos hurt us all. :) - Louis Gray
Facebook's garden is so completely walled, that any video you take there is automatically private. It must drive Robert Scoble crazy when he shoots there. - Bruce Lewis
Thanks for unprivatizing it Steve! (edit: wow 51 minutes!) - Chris Heath
Thx 4 that - Johni Fisher
This makes me feel that no more efforts will be made to improve FriendFeed once their current load is done. This is the first time I've felt like that - I'd love some confirmation one way or the other, especially from a development standpoint. Do we continue writing software for FriendFeed, or should we focus all our efforts towards Facebook now? - Jesse Stay
Jesse, to me it sounds like paul was saying FF will take a back seat to FB in priority. I'm only 13 minutes into the video, but so far that seems to be what he's saying. - Chris Heath
Even if the guts of FF make it into FB, there's no way that the interfaces will stay the same. The FB API and the FF API are like apples and oranges. So, developing anything on top of the FF interfaces at this point doesn't seems kind of pointless. - Carter ♥ JS
Bob, I really enjoy developing for Facebook. And they've shown it's getting much better. - Jesse Stay
Bob, we don't go anywhere... stay here. - Chris Heath
Bob, I think you'll see a lot of what FriendFeed is doing further integrated into Facebook. I'd love more confirmation on what these guys will be doing within Facebook though so I can be more assured. That said, I know the guys at Facebook and I trust the direction they're going. It's just a bigger network to do that with, so unfortunately it will happen slower and more carefully. - Jesse Stay
FriendFeed is awesome just as it is... if there were no more features added I would be just as happy... as long as FF stays online. - Chris Heath
Bob, Facebook isn't that much of a walled garden - yes, you can make it a walled garden, but they are opening up, little by little. Pages, for instance, are completely public. - Jesse Stay
Bob, you're getting ahead of yourself here and making assumptions. Let the dust settle and see what happens. - Chris Heath
Bob, yes - that's the concern. However, when I say slow, I mean they just have more features to release and improve because they have much, much more features than Twitter or FriendFeed. They're still launching new things weekly, often several times a week. - Jesse Stay
Bob, they don't have plans to kill FF any time soon. My hope is just that they either continue updating FF or push the efforts they were going to put towards FF and put that towards Facebook. I'm guessing the latter will happen. - Jesse Stay
have you guys watched the video? - Chris Heath
Steve: Thanks for this!! - Jim Connolly
Lots of smiles from Paul. Better quality than that brunch interview. :D - Rob Schieber
Should be no surprise, Facebook is priority, FriendFeed features on back burner if they're more intensive, involved. - Rob Schieber
This is an outstanding talk about the ping services relating to real time web. Love it. - Rob Schieber
Probably a key area of development here is comment nesting. Will Google Wave come out of the box with this? - Rob Schieber
Is comment nestiing really a necessary feature? - Cliff Gerrish
comment nesting doesn't work with real-time updating comments - think about it... - Chris Heath
Real-time happens at every point in the discussion, a la Wave, but it diffuses attention. A single point of update helps the eye find the most current comment. - Cliff Gerrish
Nesting works 1 level deep - that's how we do it with Echo. Any deeper and it does gets confusing - Chris Saad
Jim Connolly
Key gene 'controls disease fight' - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1...
"A master gene that helps mobilise the immune system to fight disease has been discovered by UK scientists. It causes stem cells in the blood to become disease-fighting "Natural Killer" (NK) immune cells." - Jim Connolly from Bookmarklet
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