"Never. Again. This place is just appalling. Because this is a local business I've been trying (really, really trying) to support them instead of going to Guitar Center. I've been buying strings,…"
- Jonathan
"“As hard as it is to believe, bankers who are living on the Upper East Side making $2 or $3 million a year have set up a life for themselves in which they are also at zero at the end of the year with credit cards and mortgage bills that are inescapable,” said Holly Peterson, the author of an Upper East Side novel of manners, “The Manny,” and the daughter of Peter G. Peterson, a founder of the equity firm the Blackstone Group. “Five hundred thousand dollars means taking their kids out of private school and selling their home in a fire sale.” Sure, the solution may seem simple: move to Brooklyn or Hoboken, put the children in public schools and buy a MetroCard. But more than a few of the New York-based financial executives who would have their pay limited are men (and they are almost invariably men) whose identities are entwined with living a certain way in a certain neighborhood west of Third Avenue: a life of private schools, summer houses and charity galas that only a seven-figure income can stretch to "
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
Wow, the numbers boggle me. How does the world get so off kilter like this? They have a point, in that many of those people worked hard to get where they are, but wow, I'm speechless. Makes my payments seem small in comparison, but by percentage, they are the same in that regard...
- Danielle Closs
This sounds crazy but the numbers here are actually on the low side, aside from having a driver (most senior bankers I know don't have one.) A $1.5mm apartment is _moderate/avg_ here in Manhattan where price per sq foot can exceed $1500. Apartments on the UES run $4-6mm, in my less desirable neighborhood it's $1mm+ for a 1-bedroom, $2-3mm or more for some 2+ bedrooms. A senior banker would likely have a place in the $5-8mm range. This is why nobody can afford NYC.
- Tom Karlo
I couldn't live a life that forced to me to keep up appearances just to fit in. I wonder why they feel the need to do so?
- Admiral Anika
Just to add to that, someone just closed on an 870 sq ft, one bedrm apt in my building for $1.3mm. ($1500 / sqft). That's in a down market, the buyer was a surgeon. I know lots of junior bankers who live 40-60 minutes outside of Manhattan because they couldn't afford a place big enough for their kids here in town.
- Tom Karlo
I think a big part of the expense, at least as I read the article, has to do with the fixed costs of real estate and children's education commitments. To divest from the real estate means big losses and giving up a child's school may be one of the hardest things for any parent to do.
- Thomas Hawk
I'm just glad and feel very lucky that I've got my four kids in a good public school right now.
- Thomas Hawk
@Anika I don't think I could live a life like that either, but it's not entirely their fault that our society dictates that this is the way they need to be to be in that industry. However, if anyone can change the way the industry is, it is those people that are a part of it. It takes guts to stand up and really make a change in a system so long set to these standards. I am just glad that I never wanted to be a big city banker... Or maybe, the atmosphere of the industry is what caused me to not want it.
- Danielle Closs
Do you think that if enough people can't afford to live there, they will [be forced to] leave, and then the costs will lower, because of less demand, and then things will even out, with regards to housing? I'm hoping for a similar scenario in Michigan with the job market, where enough people leave the state (they are leaving in droves), there will be enough jobs left for those that stay.
- Danielle Closs
Sometimes life is difficult, with difficult choices. A financially large compensation package is a reward for a job well done. Since these caps would only be placed on those companies that received some sort of bail-out, it can be argued that these individuals have not done a good job and therefore do not deserves to be financially rewarded.
- MVB (Grinch of FF)
While I don't personally live in Manhattan, I have friends who do on a lot less than $500k a year. And I'm kind of hoping that the fallout from this brings down prices in the city to the point that someone making what I make can afford a place there...
- Eric P
In today's technology economy, there is no reason they have to live where they live. Move your operation to a place with lower cost of living. Wall Street does not have to be the center of the universe. It's almost all electronic anyway.
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
MOVE! Sorry if you can't live on the Upper East Side anymore and pay $30K a year for private school for EACH of your kids. Sorry you will have to give up you house in the Hamptons. Sorry you can't park your BMW 7 in a heated garage for $500 a month. Sorry....welcome to the human race!
- John Flynn
It's nice to say "move out of New York" but the other option for a banker is basically London, which isn't any cheaper. Banking is _not_ an electronic business at the senior level - this is investment banking, which is basically client service, not commercial banking, which is what most people think of when you say "bank." Some of these people are going to move, but if you've been a banker for 20 yrs, it's not so easy to just find another job, sell your home in this market, and yank your kids from school.
- Tom Karlo
They need to take their identity out of what they earn and own, and it is not always easy, but they could live nicely in some smaller place for a while until things start rebounding.
- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
Ask yourself, if you had $1MM to invest, do you want to trust it to the guy who looks like he knows how to make money? Or the guy who drives the Honda Civic and has an office in the strip mall next to the Quiznos? The schools, the addresses, the parties, and the vacation homes are all signals that the bankers know how to make money for themselves, and therefore for their clients. If you can afford those things, you must have made a lot of money for other people to get paid like that.
- Ryan Kuder
If we calculate the rent of the White House and all Obama's servants, he makes more than 500,000 a year. Let Obama move to the projects and bicycle to work everyday! As far as secret service protection goes, Obama can buy a gun and protect himself from terrorists on his way to work! <sarcasm>
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
@Ryan, but go back to what Mark VandenBerg said, and should these people be rewarded, if their companies are asking for a bailout? While I agree with you in the sense that the finery is necessary for the right image, I think it can be (and will have to be) done on less, and I do think that those that are in leadership in the companies that are failing (even, and especially, big banks) should be well, for lack of a better word, punished.
- Danielle Closs
Something has to be done, and I don't envy those that have to make the decisions about what...
- Danielle Closs
Yeah, Danielle, you hit the nail on the head. These guys, by and large, don't deserve the posh life because they and their brethren have screwed the pooch in royal fashion.
- Alex Scoble
All you guys blaming the bankers for the Mortgage crises, but it was the FED that kept the interest rates so low that everyone in USA thought they could become the next millionaire from buying a new house! The banks should have requested a high down payment not almost zero down!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Oh, the poisonous thoughts that come to mind .......
- Martha
And those of us with conventional 30-year mortgages in modest houses are going to have to pay for all this.
- Julie Barrett
from twhirl
@Igor I was not necessarily blaming the banks, but stating that they obviously did not practice good business if they need a bailout, right? I have heard of many smaller banks that practiced good business, and are actually not hurting at all. I think the crises stem from a multitude of happenings from different places, that all coincided at the same time. It's also not just the lower interest rates, really, it's the people that were greedy and thought that they could get rich quick off of house sales.
- Danielle Closs
Yeah, I'm blaming the financial wizards who decided that it wasn't enough to make money on the crap subprime loans they were pushing, but thought up the brilliant idea of floating 20-40 times the value of the mortgage to the market in the form of mortgage backed securities and credit default swaps. The Fed keeping interest rates low had very little to do with this mess. That was a very weak link in the chain of causation.
- Alex Scoble
These financial idiots are the NUMBER EFFING ONE REASON for this mess. Without these guys it would have been like 2000 lb. bombs getting dropped on a few communities, with these guys it was like a nuke was dropped on Las Vegas and New York.
- Alex Scoble
@Spidra I agree with you, the cover never tells the whole truth, but society still expects big bankers to be a certain way, as the do expect engineers, geeks, or doctors to be a certain way. We need to change this system of the cover tells the story, as well as fix the economic situation. Fall back and regroup, get back to basics, and just be more genuine, all around... Easier said than done!
- Danielle Closs
Of course if we cut their salaries drastically, many of these imbeciles will move to other industries and screw them up as well. Perhaps we should leave them in banking...
- MVB (Grinch of FF)
I think they should be put to work holding up lamp posts, Mark. That's about all they are good for.
- Alex Scoble
Alex, the derivative market was not regulated at all. The FED should have been regulating it. If you place a pot of gold in the middle of the street and no one watching it, someone will take the pot home!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
@Mark, lol! You have a point, but do we want them playing with our money still? Maybe we make them make a mandatory change in industry, as long as it's not something important, like the medical industry. Of course, come to think of it, is there an industry right now that can afford to be screwed up more?
- Danielle Closs
The fault still lies with the crooks, Igor and not with the cops missing the crime. You need to stop sticking up for these asshole crooks. It's making you look like an asshole as well.
- Alex Scoble
Ryan, I agree with Spidra. If I had a mil, I would invest with the frugal guy driving the old honda with a record of making money for his clients. Not the guy who's leveraged to the hilt and just getting by.
- Greg Guitarbuster
The problem with investment banks and bankers is that they compete for higher returns. Bankers compensation is tied to higher returns. The more the banks make the more the bankers make. It is in their self interest to take risk. Instead fixing the salaries to a fix number like 500k it is better to fix the salaries to the profits of the banks.
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Alex, I am not sticking up for them. I would not want to be a banker in the first place. But with capping their pay, we will make the banking problem take longer time to fix. People will not work so hard for so little money. They will go work for Asian and European banks or hedge funds.
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
@Igor Right, because if the salaries have a specific set limit (glass ceiling), they won't be as productive, because they know once they hit that limit, there is no reason for them to continue pushing harder. Salesmen on commission work harder, because it is in their hands how much they make. Their bankers "sales" directly influence the success of the bank, and if they have a glass ceiling, then the bank won't do well when the bankers hit that limit.
- Danielle Closs
This seems to me like it's not going to work [to help the economy], except to punish the bankers...
- Danielle Closs
Igor, then the banks should be hiring tribal warlords and drug cartels, people that know how to manage risk. Oh wait, the bankers are holding their money already.
- Greg Guitarbuster
These banks need to be punished, Danielle. Without accountability there is no trust and without trust there are no markets.
- Alex Scoble
This is more a political move by Obama Administration to get support from his constituents. Obama is the president already, what is he trying to prove? He needs to sacrifice some goats for the public? LOL
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
@Alex So, this is more about punishing the banks, then about cleaning up the economy. Seems to me that many people have the wrong idea. As long as there is a focus, one way or another. I was [as are many others] under the impression that this was a money-saving tactic... Anyone have figures on how much it might save, if any, or if that part of the equation matters?
- Danielle Closs
Greg, Taliban Hamas, Al Qaeda are all available! They have lots of Saudi experience! LMAO
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
This has nothing to do with saving money, in my opinion. We are saying that banks that have taken bailout money don't deserve to pay their employees exorbitant amounts on the US taxpayer's dime. It's punitive. As it should be.
- Alex Scoble
Igor, Taliban is not available, they are signing a long term consulting gig with Pete Session, Texas congressman who wants to build a Republican insurgency
- Greg Guitarbuster
Alex, the USA government is the biggest investor in these banks now. Is it not in the government interest to hire the best and the brightest to make their investment go up in price? The USA government represents the USA people, so it is the American people investments. But then maybe Alex likes to work for free on Friend Feed! LOL
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Well I guess not many people will be attending business schools over the next decade or so. Better enroll in Medical school and become a doctor. Better pay!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
These idiots already proved that they aren't the best and the brightest. AND they proved that they aren't worth their pay by doing serious harm to the economy.
- Alex Scoble
@Igor We could go back to their education, that would be a good place to start. We all know that our education here is going downhill. Of course, the thing of it is, it happened, let them figure out how to fix it, I don't want to hear any more about how it is costing me money...
- Danielle Closs
It's all just a big blame game, and I'm done with that, let's just learn from the past, move on, and try to fix it...
- Danielle Closs
They proved that peer pressure defines them! They behaved and did how was expected of them by their shareholders. Maximize returns on investment. If they did not take the risk they would have been fired.
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Ah yes, the cliques from highschool really do still exist in the "real world".
- Danielle Closs
Actually the shareholders of the banks are to blame for this mess! They shareholders and the directors should have voiced their discontent with the amount of risk the banks are taking. I personally have been out of the stock market since 2004. I did not believe in the real estate get rich ponzi scheme. I sold all my stocks in 2004 and have my money in bonds, no Lehman. ;-)
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Danielle, education and morals. This is business school basics. They should have learned at Wharton and Harvard business ethics and responsible investments.
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
the pumps don't work cause the vandals stole the handles
- Greg Guitarbuster
You know, my heart bleeds for those people who are struggling to survive on only $0.5mio ...
- Rene Wirtz
"Silly Putty® has been around for more than 50 years. From its origins in a scientist's laboratory in 1943 and its introduction to the world in 1950, Silly Putty® is an American classic that has not lost its popularity. The actual formula for this product is: 65% - Dimethyl Siloxane 17% - Silica 9% - Thixotrol ST 4% - Polydimethylsiloxane 1% - Decamethyl cyclopentasiloxane 1% - Glycerine 1% - Titanium Dioxide"
- Live4Emma (L4S)
from Bookmarklet
Anyone remember Silly String? I had hours of fun spraying it on a ceiling fan we had at one house, many years ago...
- Tyson Key
It is a wonder SP didn't kill a whole generation, me included, with those ingredients.
- Russellreno
LOL...i don't think i ever ingested it, but i'm not so sure that many ingredients with the endings of "ane" and "ide" can be THAT healthy for you in the long run! O_O
- Live4Emma (L4S)
I can't even pronounce most of those ingredients
- Neil Bernhart
I think they removed the asbestos around 1982
- Ken Morley
Speaking of cool science toys, my grade 5 science teacher used to let us play with the liquid mercury... the actual liquid! He'd pour a little into the palm of your hand :o)
- Ken Morley
L4S - yes, everything ending in "ide". Beware the deadly Dihydrogen Monxide..
- Will Higgins™
Which ingredient makes it so delicious?
- Jonathan
"Barack Obama's getting a Cadillac-styled new Presidential Limo tomorrow. While nice, we're more interested in the Gatling gun-equipped Suburban that follows Cadillac One. Here's video of the bullet-spraying Chevy in action."
- Tudor Bosman
from Bookmarklet
Is that really a Gatling gun? Those were around at the turn of the LAST century. It seems like kind of old technology.
- Robert Felty
they are still pretty solid technology - a lot of systems still use them, like i think the A10's main gun is as well as the radar controlled guns on ships, etc - its a pretty effective solution for dealing with heat dissipation and high rates of fire
- bob
also, they should show some targets in the video, like a car or something - as it is, kind of boring
- bob
There's a difference between the civil war era gatling guns and the modern gatling gun that was designed by GE in the post WWII era. Civil war: hand cranked and could throw out 1000 rounds per minute...Modern gatling gun: mechanically cranked and can throw out between 4000 and 6000 rounds per minute depending on design.
- Alex Scoble
This was the pilot for the guys who now make the SNL digital shorts like "Dick in a Box" and "Jizz in My Pants." Watch it. Trust me.
- Jonathan
from Bookmarklet
"They were cheap. I got the $200 ones instead of the ones that were $400. Just 'cause I'm trying to be, you know, a good person."
- Ross Miller
from Bookmarklet
Tricia Walsh-Smith "(I'm Going) Bonkers" music video | FilmDrunk - The movie blog with the world's strongest kegel muscles - http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/...
"Watching her take the pistol from her belt, unbutton her jeans and slip into bed I somehow couldn’t quite equate the woman in my arms with the bodies I had seen in the local morgue, their heads shattered by gunshots at close range, murders she confessed to having committed. High on a combination of the heady tropical climate, local rum, grade A cocaine and in the arms of nubile 22-year-old, fantasy and reality became blurred. It felt like I was living in a Quentin Tarantino movie."
- Paul Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
Great story, and for someone with such a short attention span I'm glad I stuck with it.
- Toby Graham
"“When I killed the first person, I was afraid, I was scared. I killed the first person just to see if I could. But there is an obligation to kill. If you don’t, they kill you. That’s why the first was very hard, because the person I killed was kneeling down begging, crying and saying, ‘Don’t kill me. I have children.’ That’s why it was difficult and sad. But if you don’t kill that...
more...
- bob
You've got to admit, there's really no profession sexier than assassin!
- Gabe
@Gabe: Just don't leave the toilet seat up.
- Dylan Parker
This is just an incredible read......
- Iain Baker
Yes, very sad. Sad that life unfolds leaving so many people in the world with a difficult choice and sad that the author has to immerse himself in these worlds to tell the rest of us about them. Must be very hard.
- Peter Butler