19 hours ago
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Susan Beebe, Kol Tregaskes, Justin Long and 19 other people liked this
Another reason why I resist religious people putting their beliefs into our social code. - Robert Scoble
The American Founding Fathers had this all figured out over two centuries ago. They were coastal elitists. - Sean McBride
Robert +++ for this comment. - Ryo
Correction: He wasn't hanged for being a Christian. He was hanged for converting away from Islam (apostasy) which is a punishable offense under Sharia (Islamic) Law - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A... - Mo J.
propaganda, not remotely true .. mo j's correction is important, and further, there had to be some cross-over of a social/political norm ... just doing this quietly does not incur threat of death in iran ... the source seems to have a pro-christian agenda ... and the title here is very misleading ... - Gregory Lent
Pro-christian and a "Friend of Israel" as shown in the image on the original post. - Mo J.
Good spot Robert - I agree that while principles should be adopted, beliefs should not be forced upon anybody through any form of legislation. However, this happens in the West just as in the Muslim world. - Paul Johnston
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Apostasy should not be punishable anywhere. And no, this is not limited to Iran, or to the Muslim world (or even to the religious world - think John Connally and Joe Lieberman, who were denied Vice Presidential nominations). Even in the US, changing your religion (or lack thereof) can be difficult if your family or community shares the belief that you are leaving. - Ontario Emperor
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They also hate gay people: http://tinyurl.com/4lf4cd Sound familiar? - Rick Powell
Thank you for sharing, Robert. - ChangeForge | Ken Stewart
The worlds biggest scam - Religion, we need to get rid of it for good. It IS the cause of the majority of the worlds issues. - SoN9ne
Thanks for correcting the record, Mo J. and G. Lent. I'm feeling warmer towards the Iranian government and less shocked that an individual soul was exterminated for their beliefs. - Christopher Galtenberg
Wow, that's horrible. Has anyone seen Religulous? the new movie? Makes some good points about religion being dangerous. - Sarah Perez
Correcting the record? A month ago, the Iranian parliament voted 196 to 7 in favour of a bill entitled "Islamic Penal Code" which imposes the death penalty for any male Iranian who leaves his Islamic faith ... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new... - Joel Bennett
I don't think religion is dangerous, but extremism certainly is. You can be an extremist without being religious. Just look at the Soviet Union....? And while I sort of agree with Scoble's comment about beliefs in a social code (e.g. I agree with 1st Amendment) many people's moral beliefs (e.g. do not lie, do not steal, do not murder, etc) come out of their religious beliefs....! - Justin Long
Article on hanged... in Telegraph as well http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new... - Justin Long
Religion tends to create and fuel extremism, though, in the way that only a "my God says you are UNCLEAN" can do... - Jason Carreira
For the record, Ramtin Soodmand was a Christian from birth. It was his father who was an apostate from Islam. - Ontario Emperor
Religion is neither dangerous nor is it the cause of the majority of the worlds issues. The danger and cause is directly related to people who use religion to generate fear and hate for control and power. The same things that have allowed a person think it's ok to kill a gay person in the name of religion are the same thing that has allowed someone to think it's ok to kill a muslim in the name of national security. We should be prompting understanding and not blaming. BTW the link story is sad. - Shawn McCollum
Some religions seem to be xenophobic, intolerant, violent and imperialistic at the very core, at the root. The evil that they do is not a deviation from or perversion of their core message, but an expression of their innermost nature. - Sean McBride
A person's moral code does not come from their religion. But rather their faith comes from their moral code. - Wensleydale Scoble
Two way street, I'm afraid, Alex. That's proven everyday. - Michael W. May
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when you think you know how things should be there is something terribly wrong - adolfo foronda
Thing is, Robert, people put thier beliefs into 'our social code'. Each person has a 'religion' or better put, a world view. no one, should ever be persucuted for thier beliefs. period. - Josh
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So, if some of the more "extremist" Islamic countries view Obama as someone who has left the faith, how effective will he, and by extension, the USA, be in peaceful negotiations with these countries? http://www.danielpipes.org/art... - Mark VandenBerg
god I wish people would just abandon religion altogether already. I'm to the point where I honestly can't say that religion actually brings ANY good into this world. - LarchOye
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It's not religions that are xenophobic, intolerant, etc... It's people. This is a trait of people. People often misinterpret the teachings of the religions to which they belong and use their religion as a facade to hide their hatred and bigotry behind. Attacking the religion for the people's problems is problematic, b/c it empowers them to fight back by saying that you're being anti-religious. - C. K. Sample III
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C.K. Sample III: I would argue that some ideologies, both religious and secular, are manifestations of the worst parts of human nature. Their xenophobia and hatred of cult outsiders expresses their innermost essence. Ideologies of this kind are essentially tools of domination and control. Any ideology which rigidly divides the world in a fundamental (and fundamentalist) way into us vs. them is probably a scam run by a power mad self-appointed priesthood. - Sean McBride
Alex, I'm not sure I agree with that. Many people are born into a religion and inculturated into it, and develop their moral code on the basis of their religion (e.g. The Bible or the Quran or whatever says...). I remember my first faith moment when I was quite young, about 5 years old. Every moral element of my code originated from religious teaching... - Justin Long
@justin "do not lie/steal/murder" are so very generic concepts. Religion framed those concepts and gave context to common sense ideas, which could have happened without religion as well. In the past if you killed the man who killed your brother was it murder or justice? A religious belief system should have as much right as a non-religious belief system, the problem is that when they clash it turns into a fight rather then understanding. - Shawn McCollum
LarchOye, people of faith do plenty of good things in the world, as a result of their faith. Unfortunately there are also people of faith who do plenty of bad things. And people are not going to abandon their religion. The majority of the world is religious in outlook.... - Justin Long
all: i find Jonathon Haidt's [http://bit.ly/4DAyN8] work on 'inborn moral values' pretty interesting. his TED talk [http://bit.ly/OFIjO] gives a quick summation of what his research sez are the five moral values built into our genetic code. - MikeAmundsen
Shawn, I agree they are generic concepts. My point was that I was taught them by my parents on the basis of our religious code. In my personal life, my moral code came FROM my religious teaching, not vice-versa. Granted that they might have originally come TO my religion FROM an earlier source, I was only talking about me personally. Maybe I misunderstood Alex's comment. - Justin Long
@C. K. Sample III - “I believe that nobody has a clue what really happens after you die. Not the Pope, not the preacher at my folk’s church, not some Tibetan monk who has meditated and pondered all his life - no one! I believe that religion is personal and is for every individual to decide for his or herself. Mostly it’s none of anybody’s business what I believe. I believe that public prayer is for show. It should be done in private and kept between you and your supreme deity, whomever or whatever it may be. I believe that maybe one day we might find some of these answers through scientific experimentation and observation.” - Tabitha Ames, from Travis S. Taylor's "Warp Speed" - LarchOye
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@LarchOye, I would generally agree with a lot of that! as a Christian I'd say that I take the afterlife on faith, that I don't have anything that conclusively proves it to me. I believe - as did Jesus - that faith is personal and a matter of personal decision. I do believe there is a place for public, corporate worship as a way of fellowship, but a lot of public prayer can be for show, as Jesus criticized the Pharisees for (and I could criticize a number of people today)..... - Justin Long
why is there evil in the world? "If there's evil, there is good, if there is good, there you posit a moral law to diferintiate between good and evil, if there is a moral law you must posit a moral law giver..... if there's no moral law giver, there's no moral law, if there's no moral law, there's no good, if there's now good, there is no evil. what is your question?" [ravi zacharias] - Josh
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And there is evidently evil, or Google would just say "Don't be bad" :) - Justin Long
Despite what we think of the current administration, there's one thing we should all be able to agree on: Iran scares the crap out of me. - Fleagle
Iran doesn't scare me. If Ahmadinejad was the Supreme Leader maybe. What scares me is america's posture towards Iran. - Shawn McCollum
Fleagle - why are religious fundamentalists in Iran scarier than religious fundamentalists in the United States, Israel and other nations who are deliberately trying to provoke World War IV and Armageddon? John Hagee is a close adviser to Joseph Lieberman, and Lieberman is a high-level adviser to John McCain and Sarah Palin. Judeo-Christian fundamentalists in the U.S. have access to a huge array of WMDs. I have often heard them declare that we should use them against entire nations in a first strike. - Sean McBride
In India, there are groups (both Hindu and Muslim) that advocate killing of members of the other religion, and often commit those crimes as well. At the same time, there are people of both faiths who would like nothing better than such dickheads to get out of their lives and just let everyone live in peace. These extremists have political representation and the country has had to face communal riots time and again. But once you look at it closely, you see it is not at all about religion. It's just crime. - Vijayendra Mohanty
For me, religious fundamentalists are "scarier" in Iran because (1) there are more of them, (2) they have more instances of mob violence killing individual believers, (3) there is less of a chance of someone in our govt provoking WW4 (checks-and-balances) than there is of Iran instituting draconian anti-religious persecution. What has to happen for us to actually use a WMD? They have to be authorized, and they can't just be authorized by a president - there is a system of confirmations required. - Justin Long
sigh. killing in the name of religion. When will we ever get along? I hope we can all do something to stop this. - Dave Q
