 |
|
| FriendFeed is the easiest way to share online. Learn more » |
Marco › Likes
Alp to Alp's feed, ffsms Feedback, FriendFeed Hacks, FriendFeed API, ffScheduler Feedback, Appetite, Social Media Club
ffsms: (now, released for USA) Send Your FriendFeed Posts via SMS! Sign up, get your PIN and post to FF from your mobile phone. It is FREE! #ffsms Try it now: - http://ffsms.com/
Roberto Chibbaro, HealingBrush, Tofu De la Moore and 101 other people liked this
Users from the USA can use our new project "ffsms": ffsms is the first FriendFeed service brings you ability of posting to FriendFeed via SMS. After its pre-release in Turkey, it is available for you! You'll just pay for a standart SMS. Try it now! (Feedback: http://friendfeed.com/ffsms)
- Alp
from Bookmarklet
Kol, you're too fast!
- Ahmet Alp Balkan
;-)
- Kol Tregaskes
congrugulations. :) i have used it in Turkey. It was fantastic. :)
- Onur Şentüre
Alp, who are you using to provide SMS functionality here in the U.S. ?
- Carter Rabasa
Carter, we use services of Zeep.
- Alp
Alp çok iyi işler çıkarıyorsun :) helal olsun
- Mert
Alp, will MMS work and attach files/photos?
- chrisofspades
@chris, no that is just for raw text.
- Alp
(in Canada, so can't try it) but this is fantastic for Turkey and the US - great job Alp!
- Micah Wittman
Micah, I think it may work for Canada but will charge extra fee. btw thanks, help spreadin'! :)
- Alp
Well done Alp :)
- Hamdi Kavak
That's great!
- . -
it's working perfectly. way to go! =)
- Elif Crt
Hayırlı olsun!! Keep up the good work, guys :)
- directeur
E süpermiş bu :)
- Onur Gündüz
When's it coming to the UK? ;)
- Nicholas James
Nicholas, I'm not sure about it. Most probably in a few weeks, it seems nobody wants to use this in the US, so maybe we will never launch for UK. Even Turkish people are using it a lot but American friends haven't liked it. We included launching for Iran in our plans.
- Alp
I read that as FFS MS rather than FF SMS - I liked mine more ;-)
- Graeme Spice
Thanks, Alp.
- Micah Wittman
Oh, you're welcome :)
- Alp
Thanks for the update Alp
- Nicholas James
That's great! Now I'll just wait till they have it in the Netherlands as well - or move to the states, whichever comes first ;)
- James Kuypers
@James I've no idea about how many of FriendFeed users are from Netherlands or other European countries. I think Russia and UK are the at the 1st and 2nd place about FriendFeed usage. Do you have any idea?
- Alp
and Canada?
- Zachary TG
It maybe launched soon.
- Alp
great idea...i also hope it will launched in Italy very soon! :-D
- bevero
How to get large animated GIF's on Friendfeed:
2ndmoon©, Jordi Soler, Tony, Paradox of FF and 34 other people liked this
1. Get a Soup.io account http://www.soup.io
- Mo Kargas
2. Upload gif to your new Soup.io account
- Mo Kargas
3. Come back to FF, go to add new service at friendfeed.com/< YOUR USERNAME>/services
- Mo Kargas
Add a new Custom RSS/Atom feed. Enter the URL of your new Soup.io account ie. http://mokargas.soup.io
- Mo Kargas
TwitPic?
- Andrew Trinh
Done
- Mo Kargas
I'm sure other services can be used, but Soup.io is the only one that worked off the bat easy
- Mo Kargas
Anyone know a size/resolution limit?
- Andrew Smith
@Andrew I don't think there is one on size. I've seen Alejandro post 3mb GIF's with no issues. Resolution I'm not so sure
- Mo Kargas
but what about rooms (that you do not admin) ? :<
- Tim Hoeck
Posting any URL to TwitPic will provide an image in the post but I'm not too sure how it goes for Soup.io.
- Andrew Trinh
from IM
Posterous seems to work too.
- Kol Tregaskes
if you use twitpic, it will be resized and some of the gif may be cut off.
- Alfredo
Mo, you are the man. Thank you!
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
Is there a list anywhere of the sites that automatically post images to FF when you put their RSS/MRSS feeds into here? I want to get images from Google Reader to show up here. If not from GReader, then I need a few other options. Looking for something that's not blocked at work (so not Twitpic, Posterous, similar sites).
- Kamilah Gill
thanks
- Richard Lawler
What software do you use to convert/create your animated gifs?
- Ken Morley
This walkthrough with GIMP shows how to do it from a video file: http://friendfeed.com/rjcc... http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Richard Lawler
Richard, do you need Linux to run Gimp?
- Ken Morley
nope.I'v pretty much only used it in windows
- Richard Lawler
I was bad tempered all day until I finally found this post. Now I know how to post Gifs to FriendFeed. Thanks, Mo :)
- Baard @ Pixum
Homeowner holds intruder at gunpoint. Cops respond to 911 call, shoot homeowner (still on phone with 911 operator) four times in the back, then twice more when he was on the ground. BONUS: 911 tape records cops planning the cover-up. - http://www.courthousenews.com/2009...
polymath22, Vaughn, Internet Strategist and 49 other people liked this
To serve and protect.
- Christopher Harley
As a former cop, sh!t like this just pisses me off. Completely unprofessional conduct on the cop's part.
- Jack (a.k.a. Jeber)
This should bother people a hell of a lot more than the treatment of a skateboarder in SF last week.
- Cristo
I particularly liked the part where they dragged the homeowner out of the house, past his wife and kids, across some gravel, and then threw him on the hood of the car. Serves him right for trying to protect his home and family...
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
Awful. Can't believe the homeowner survived being shot six times though.
- Stephen Mack
Apparantly the cop's aim was as good as his judgement.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
To serve themselfs and protect thier own ass'es.....
- SCS Watching the Sun
This might be the best argument for gun control laws -- so you don't accidentally get shot by police.
- Cristo
Gun control means using both hands.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
Always shoot the intruder first.
- Josh Haley
from iPhone
I agree with Josh. If it was just me maybe I'd feel different, but I'm not going to wait for the cops when my family is in the house.
- Matt Hilton
+Josh
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
Was it poker night at the station?
- Melanie Reed
"we fucked up" — kind of the understatement of the year
- Glen, Bespectacled Elder
Definitely a "shoot first and ask questions later" engagement response. Did he take the the " its a war out there" encouragement from the assignments officer seriously that day?
- Melanie Reed
Gotta love my home state - You can now carry guns into bars - just in case .....
- martha
The only defense that comes to mind is if they can prove a hostile environment existed in that area of the city.
- Melanie Reed
Every time I get to talking about guns and safety and Texas law with my dad, this type of story comes up. This is exactly what he is preparing for, this totally FUBAR worst case scenario. No way he would let the cops shoot him. It's like defensive driving, until you park the car and get out at your destination, you have to assume everyone else is out to get you. When you have a gun, you...
more...
- Josh Haley
I have fired a weapon twice in self defence. Once to save my ass by firing up and over to get someone's attention and once to kill a dog who was attacking a child. I am well trained and will not hesitate. If this were my home there would have been a call for the ME not the SWAT. That's the error that was made: leaving the infiltrator alive.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
If they shot him in the back and when he was on the ground, I'm not sure that he knew the cops were there or that he was able to provide them with information. And I'm sure he was providing as much information as possible to the 911 operator. It sounds like after he had been shot several times, he told them who he was and asked them to not let his family see him that way. At that point,...
more...
- joey
It almost sounds like they went in shooting without even looking. The house owner could of had a bat and he probably still would have been shot.
- Kim Landwehr
Well, they could always offer that they panicked.... but then, doesn't that make it worse?: "my town has officers that panic at the site of a gun."
- Melanie Reed
I really hope the cop that did this feels enough shame to put one in his temple.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
I hope the homeowner sues the police officer and anyone he can get his hands on. I'm not normally one to encourage litigation because we do it too much in this country, but this is one of those cases where someone's incompetence deserves as much punishment as possible. This cop didn't just make a one-time bad judgment call. You don't shoot someone four times in the back and then twice...
more...
- tinypants - Hagitha of FF
I just hope he lives without being too disabled. And he not only sues the city but the cops each personally.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
So much incompetence, it's mindboggling. I'm with tinypants, I detest frivolous litigation, but in this case pretty much anything is warranted.
- Rene Wirtz
This can't be real, can it? They put him on the hood of the car and drove around like that?
- Jan Ole Peek
You guys want to get madder? http://www.azcentral.com/communi... - the officer was cleared of wrongdoing by the Phoenix Use of Force Board.
- Andrew C
ZOMG SUE. Their reasoning is flawed. You don't just walk in and start shooting. I don't know how they do shit in Arizona, but around here you have to actually *warn* the person to drop their weapon before you open fire. The only time the cops are considered within their rights to begin firing without warning is if the suspect fires first. this is just nonsense. Absolute nonsense.
- tinypants - Hagitha of FF
You know what? We have the guy's name and Phoenix is only a few hours away...
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
Some of the AZcentral.com comments actually aren't bad. They point out that the cop's representative's comments are ridiculous: ""If Brian would have known there was a homeowner in there, he probably would have hesitated," Gannon said, "but if he had hesitated, and it was the (suspect), the outcome could have been tragic."" - as the comment says, _the outcome was tragic_.
- Andrew C
Just, wow.
- Anthony Citrano
I hope the Family is doing well, Through all of this...
- SCS Watching the Sun
Corrupt behaviors start high up -then trickles down through the ranks till it reaches someone who interacts with the public. The fact that a cover up was in the works says all there needs to be said about what is going on at the higher levels. We can only reflect on leaders as examples of behavior, and act on what we are shown by example. It is going to get worse folks wait and see.
- ThatDBD
Yup, everything's a conspiracy, DBD.
- Anthony Citrano
Those officers were programmed by a chip placed in their hands to commit that crime.
- Cristo
Wow. I'm shaking my head. Is the budget for training the first to get cut? (BTW- Hi, Martha! I'm here with you.)
- R1CC1
:(
- Mathew A. Koeneker
:(
- AJ Batac
fuck this, i'm going back to bed. *gets shot for taking a piss in his own toilet*
- Joe Silence
ugh
- Marco(aureliusmaximus)
OMG.
- rowlikeagirl
This incident occurred in Maricopa county - home of world famous Sheriff Joe Arpaio. Just sayin'. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- Daniel J. Pritchett
@Daniel - I knew Maricopa county was ringing a bell for some reason. Someone (the state? the feds?) should go in and clean house.
- Andrew C
it seems to be universally true that cops who commit crimes tend to get off lightly or completely. Let's hope this doesn't happen here. Locking up the bad guys with badges would make us all safer.
- winckel
yikes...and MORE yikes - the actual complaint filed by the Arambulas: http://www.courthousenews.com/2009... All I can say is damn.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
And they only sued for $5.75mio. IMNSHO, the Arumbulas should sue for at least 10fold; everyone involved, all the way up to the governor should resign because they all have failed to uphold a job, and the police officers should be put in jail for life (the only reason why they do not face a death sentence is that Tony survived the attack). Dear buddha, this is revolting.
- Rene Wirtz
They need to add a zero to that number and then sue the cop personally as well. Bastard...
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
:(
- chaz2b
The F STOP » Professional Photographers Discuss Their Craft » Article Archive » Michael Levin - http://www.thefstopmag.com/...
Marco, Anthony Citrano and Fossil Huntress liked this
"At age 35, Michael Levin left behind his original career as a restaurant owner to experiment with an inexpensive digital camera. Just a few years later, he has been called a “rising star” by Focus magazine which called his images “soulful and evocative,” and year after year, the prize panels agree."
- Mel Buckpitt
from Bookmarklet
In my dreams I have a big party for all the 3,023 people I'm following and @zefrank is the party leader. The videos he shares inspire.
Marco and Mitch Featherston liked this
Top 20 Gangster #Movies of the Last 40 Years - http://thepulplist.com/2009...
 |
David Cook, MVB (Curmudgeon of FF), Nathan Chase and 25 other people liked this
No Scarface? Weird
- Shevonne
zactly, "say hello to my little friend"....
- sofarsoShawn
if no scarface, i dont count this list credible :)
- ugurarcan
Payback is on the list but not Scarface, things are not right in the world.
- Kim Landwehr
True, the omission of Scarface is problematic, but other great gangster films are missing too, like The Long Good Friday, The Krays, Gangster No.1 and Sexy Beast.
- Baffled
There are 2 jokes on this list: Snatch and The Departed. Okay, at least the latter deserves a spot, but NOT above Pulp Fiction (!). And Snatch? Doesn't deserve to be in the top 20, imo.
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
But I'm glad to see Carlito's Way on the list :)
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
Scarface was a gangster movie? I always felt it was more of a drug flick, not exactly a gangster film, it had fighting drug cartels in it but I don't think that contributes enough to call it a gangster flick. Update: After reviewing the list it should definitely be in there, it looks like they were stretching to get 20 gangster films.
- Jimminy Fuller
I found 2 of the 20 as netflix instant movies: Once Upon a Time in America and Lock Stock and Two Smoking Barrels. Thats funny its the two movies with the longest titles. LoL I tried watching OUATIA but the movie is almost 4 hours long. I feel asleep halfway through it. Is it worth watching completely? I love LSATSB.
- Bryan Lee
Bryan, I think LSATSB is also on Hulu
- Jimminy Fuller
Jimminy: Thanks I own it on DVD.
- Bryan Lee
Bryan: Well, I guess you don't need to watch it on Netflix then, unless you're someplace else and feel like it.
- Jimminy Fuller
The Usual Suspects and The Departed are my top 2. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
GIMP 2.8 and its (huge) improvements to the User Interface! http://digg.com/linux_u...
Techno Todd and Marco liked this
OBAMA WITH LIGHTSABER
xreighted:
isabelthespy:
thecurvature:
amandaw:
apsies:thepoliticalpartygirl:joemuto:
At the White House event today promoting Chicago’s 2016 Olympics bid, in the middle of a fencing demonstration, somebody handed Obama a motherfucking lightsaber. (Swampland)
How can I not reblog this?! - http://nezua.tumblr.com/post...
 |
Marco and Admiral Anika liked this
Marco and Johnny Worthington liked this
BOKEHH – Photography Inspiration Blog » Krakow - http://www.bokehh.com/index...
See-ming Lee 李思明 SML, Marco, /metin civelek and Lars Clausen liked this
Young Barack Obama ! - http://designyoutrust.com/2009...
|
Marco, Lars Clausen, Adem Annaç and Cagdas Seichter liked this
ahah. kaderde young barack obama postlamak da varmış.
- hande
Classic Photography recreated using Legos - http://www.chilloutpoint.com/feature...
|
Amy℠, T. Brent, technopeasant, 老巫师 and 17 other people liked this
sitede çok daha fazlası var.
- hande
tiananmen and CSI NY ?!?! the 3rd one is ... ?
- 麦克.疯
the third one is this photograph: http://tr.im/yBiV
- iwfx!
original photos and the lego editions are shown on the site. you can check! http://www.chilloutpoint.com/feature...
- hande
Thousands call for Turing apology - BBC News - http://news.bbc.co.uk/2...
7 поверхностей Римана, merve, Juvenn Woo and 90 other people liked this
I had no idea they forced him to get chemically castrated after he admitted he was gay. Disgusting. I hope the government officially apologizes for killing one of the great minds of that generation.
- Bret Taylor
from Bookmarklet
More here. Includes link to the Downing St. petition: http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news...
- Richard Chen
how very sad.
- Sheila Taylor
Pretty bad for the "good guys" in WWII, eh? Doubly sad that it (apparently) caused him to commit suicide. So we lost one of the greatest minds in computer science in his early 40s.
- Joel Webber
What a sad story... I hope they do apologize. Here's a link to the petition, but you have to live in the UK to sign: http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/turing...
- Shannon Jiménez
If the British government doesn't apologize for murdering Turing, they will be no better than the Nazi enemy that threw homosexuals into the gas chambers alongside the Jews and Gypsies. Wasn't he supposed to be on *our* side? The *Law* didn't think so...
- Dennis Jernberg
We're still not very nice to gays. Apologizing for the past makes a statement. Correcting the present makes a difference in people's lives. I hope we do both.
- Andrew Warner
from iPhone
The man was an absolute genius, its a pity he could not live further to expand our horizons of thinking. His abstract computing device called "Turing Machine" is for computer scientists what speed of light is for physicists, an ultimate limit of computation
- thequark
Andrew agree. This is sad. I hope we can "correct the present."
- Rick Cogley
They should apologize for throwing Oscar Wilde in the clink as well.
- Joel Webber
If we follow the line of reasoning where the current government must apologize for all previous governments then it eventually reaches the point of absurdity. Besides how meaningful is an apology on behalf of someone else?
- Adewale Oshineye
Ok, I was being a bit silly about Wilde (there are plenty of things the Victorians could apologize for). But Turing was abused by what could be argued to be the "current" government (or at least political system), and that we still think of as the "good guys" (for wont of a better term) in WWII. And it was only ~50 years ago.
- Joel Webber
ACM Statement Regarding British Prime Minister Gordon Brown's Apology on the Treatment of Alan Turing ACM (09/11/09) Hall, Wendy ACM applauds Prime Minister Brown's statement on the treatment of Alan Turing, writes Dame Professor Wendy Hall, ACM President. ACM has long celebrated the fundamental contributions of Alan M. Turing not only for his instrumental role in British code-breaking...
more...
- ǝuǝƃnǝ
I would have a lot more respect for some Obama opponents if they just admitted it was a racial thing. #justsayin
Marco, Dennis Jernberg, Justin Yost and 28 other people liked this
That's why they call them "closet bigots" Rah - Except for Holden and a few others :)
- Joe
No, no. Look, it's not "racial," per se, it's just that, you know, he's "foreign."
- Christopher A Carr
I don't think those people have even admitted to themselves that it's a racial thing, Rah. We all know that "racism is bad", so they've duped themselves into thinking it's some other thing which gives the same results.
- Derrick
I mean, you know, I have lots of black friends and stuff.
- Christopher A Carr
Christopher, I've seen serious posts that say exactly that.
- Derrick
Derrick, I'm pretty positive you've hit the nail on the head there.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Only some, Holden. Only some :)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Derrick: Oy.
- Christopher A Carr
I voted for Obama, but only the white half.
- Cristo
And I'm actually dead serious. If people were to come out and just say they were against anything he tries to do cuz he's black, I'd be fine with that. At least I'd know where it was coming from. But all this closet/veiled racism is just frustrating.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Out-groups are out-groups, I suppose.
- Christopher A Carr
Holden, did you read the text of the speech?
- Joe
Rah, who wants to admit they are bigots?
- Joe
Holden, regarding that issue, think of it like this: If you have raised your child in such a manner that a single speech from some dude (which is how kids probably view the POTUS) can indoctrinate, infiltrate, and warp your kid's mind (which the speech doesn't actually do, nor is it aimed at anything political) you have failed as a parent. My parents don't shield us from anything because they're quite confident they've given us the tools to think on our own in a rational and positive manner.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I'm most concerned with Obama's policy on accidentally leaving pets in vehicles.
- Cristo
The point is, they shouldn't need to be. Secondary point is, it's normal for presidents to talk to the kids at some point. Why is it a big deal now?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rah - If you have raised your child in such a manner that a single speech from some dude (which is how kids probably view the POTUS) can indoctrinate, infiltrate, and warp your kid's mind (which the speech doesn't actually do, nor is it aimed at anything political) you are bat shit crazy.
- Joe
Straight up.
- Joe
What in that speech is threatening?
- Joe
I watched the Bushes talk. I watched Reagan talk. I even watched that Dukakis(sp?) guy talk. Did it have any effect on me as a youngin? Nope. I based my opinions on my personal experience and how I was raised. There is nothing some 3rd party is going to say to me in one sitting that's going to ruin me. I'm sure this goes for any young person. They do actually seem to have a built-in bullsh*t filter...unless you broke them.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
The right was pretty crazy during the Clinton administration, too. (Remember the "ZOMG!! Hillary killed Vince Foster!!!11!!" type of stuff?) But I don't think a white president would inspire the claims like foreign birth and corrupting schoolchildren by telling them to stay in school. That just adds an extra level of crazy.
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
Like telling kids to try to achieve.
- Joe
Holden, just because times are hard does not imply the president has the power to influence children through the TV. It's just freaking silly and I think you know it. He's the President of the United States of America. If you don't want him to talk to your kids, why do you even live in this country?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
"Every single one of you has something you’re good at. Every single one of you has something to offer. And you have a responsibility to yourself to discover what that is. That’s the opportunity an education can provide," Obama's prepared remarks say. "We need every single one of you to develop your talents, skills and intellect so you can help solve our most difficult problems. If you don’t do that – if you quit on school – you’re not just quitting on yourself, you’re quitting on your country.”
- Joe
Taken from the speech.
- Joe
Truth is, we have a lot of growing up to do.
- J. Abdul-Qahhar
I know I would keep my kids away from that! :P
- Joe
This seems like a silly thread, given no one on it seems to be disagreeing that Obama should give the speech to the kids.
- Cristo
Then get off of it.
- Joe
But I'm lonely, and this seems to be where everyone is. :)
- Cristo
Seriously? I wouldn't. I'd just call them silly bigots and move on.
- Jason Nunnelley
Cristo has a point, though. I don't know that anyone on FriendFeed has actually said they don't want kids watching Obama talk. Holden has only said he understands why parents might be concerned given the times we live in, which isn't the same thing. :)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rah people on FF did say that today - look on Tad's thread. http://ff.im/7Llqp
- Joe
People only hate Dick Cheney because of his lesbian daughter. Makes as much sense.
- Jason Nunnelley
If I liked Dick Cheney for anything it would be *because* he had a lesbian daughter.
- Derrick
Not because he shot a man in the face Derrick?
- Joe
Well, I don't actually like him at all, so it's a moot point.
- Derrick
Derrick, is it because he's [mostly] white or because you think his policies are terrible?
- Jason Nunnelley
Or because he has multiple DUIs in his past?
- Joe
Don't skip the 5 deferments during Vietnam.
- Jason Nunnelley
For me? It's cuz he's white. I can't stand me some white folks. They always tryina keep a brotha down and stuff like that. (j/k, for those who don't know me)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Hahahaha ROFL
- Joe
For me it's because he lives in Wyoming. I find the food there repulsive. (In general, before any of you food snobs start arguing with me, I know Jackson has some good restaurants, but when the local fare is usually elk and bison without any good seasoning, it's not a happy stomach for me.)
- Cristo
I think you guys just don't like him because he doesn't sing or dance.
- Jason Nunnelley
The latter, Jason, but he doesn't have the burden of being a minority in this culture.
- Derrick
As a species, if we can't defeat our innate, primate tribalism, we best at least start figuring out some interesting hacks/workarounds. ...or it will eventually kill us all.
- Christopher A Carr
Derrick, should I forget all my differences with Obama's policies because he may have been treated harshly for his skin color? Is that something I owe him - a pass on disagreement?
- Jason Nunnelley
Wait, since when does anyone owe Obama anything but respect as the POTUS?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Jason, why the backlash? I said my peace about how I felt, and I'm not quite sure why all of a sudden you feel compelled to back me into a corner. Do, think, feel what you want. You certainly don't answer to me.
- Derrick
Uh oh. An argument is breaking out amidst our general agreement.
- Cristo
Coach Rahsheen, I do respect his position as the president. Does that mean I can't disagree with him, or does it mean I don't have a right to voice my opposition? You said everyone that disagrees with him is a racist.
- Jason Nunnelley
Derrick, I'm just giving you a hard time. I'm sorry - I'm not really trying to start a fight with you.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, do you respect President Barack Obama's character?
- Joe
Uh, thanks?
- Derrick
Coach Rahsheen, actually I may be overstating what you actually said. I perceive that to be your position. Maybe I'm wrong.
- Jason Nunnelley
Did I? Maybe I misspoke. I just said some of is opponents are just racist or basing their opposition on his race.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I'm sure some people can come up with cohesive and respectable arguments as to why they don't agree with his ideology and potential policies, but I think most of it is just blatant racism since I've heard very very few people speak intelligently against our current President of the United States.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rah, seriously though. Why does it have to be all or nothing? I voted for the man, and I disagree with some things, particularly the bailouts. I disagreed with our previous president on these too, and I didn't vote for that guy. In fact, I bet I could find things I disagreed with for every president I've been aware of in my lifetime.
- Cristo
J. Deakins, I don't know much about his character to be honest. I have serious issues with some of his past associations. I dislike many of his political leanings. I respect much of his position on constitutional law and happen to agree with much of it. I think I believe Rev. Wright when he says that the president knew his positions while he attended his church and I don't buy the idea...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
I disagree with Obama about many things. I had even more problems with Bush. I wouldn't have wasted my energy complaining about Bush giving a "stay in school" speech. What would there really have been to get upset about? But people are disproportionately out of whack over Obama giving such a talk. How to explain it? Don't know....well, I think I do, and it stinks.
- Christopher A Carr
Nah, it's not all or nothing. I don't think we should have bailed anyone out either. That was a stupid move and a waste of money.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rasheen, I'm questioning "I would have a lot more respect for some Obama opponents if they just admitted it was a racial thing." That sounds awfully broad brushed. It sounds like you're saying all conservatives, Republicans, Libertarians and small government advocates are bigots.
- Jason Nunnelley
Uh Rah - tell that to all my family members who are autoworkers in MI......
- Joe
Jason, I'm pretty sure the word 'some' was included in the original post for a reason.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Rasheen, like I said. Maybe I'm misinterpreting your original statement.
- Jason Nunnelley
J.Deakins, just because they benefited from it, doesn't mean it was good for the country. I'd tell them what I think. I have no problem with that.
- Cristo
and why wasn't it?
- Joe
Jason, I'm only saying *some* (maybe even most) of them are bigots. Not all. J. I'm not sure that enough jobs were saved due to those bailouts...since some people still went home without jobs. Also, I'm mostly pointing at those stupid banks who used the money to take vacations and give bonuses to the very employees who helped the banks go under.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Because they make shitty cars, and have for way too long. They should figure out how to innovate, like in silicon valley.
- Cristo
The auto industry is one of the last large manufacturing entities in the U.S.
- Joe
Who is bailing out Apple, Google, Microsoft, and Facebook?
- Cristo
Right - like non union companies.
- Joe
Tina, "I think most of it is just blatant racism" is more direct. I don't question Rasheen's honesty here. I'm just challenging whatever he really believes. I'd like him to clarify what he actually believes and address the possibility that he harbors some irrational assumptions about the character of people that fundamentally disagreed with Carter, Clinton and continue to maintain political philosophies that are in conflict with the president.
- Jason Nunnelley
Yup, all of those are non-union for most employees. I don't hear those employees complaining either.
- Cristo
Are you listening?
- Joe
I'm reading what you're writing. Is there something I'm not seeing in invisible ink?
- Cristo
"I don't hear those employees complaining either."
- Joe
Jason, I know there are fundamental disagreements involved here. I don't think that no one should ever disagree with the POTUS. What I take issue with is people who would benefit from Obama's policies taking issue with those policies. This shows that there is obviously something deeper at work that goes beyond actual common sense, education, or intelligence. My conclusion is that it's racism or just blatant stupidity.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Yes, I don't hear the engineers and other employees in high-tech complaining about not being union employees.
- Cristo
J.Deakins, Cristo, Coach Rahsheen is it possible that our financial mess is caused by crooked banking practices that Congress has known about for decades, fundamental dangers in derivative banking and a continued dependence on a debt driven economy? Neither Bush nor Obama had or have a plan to deal with this core probem.
- Jason Nunnelley
Yes.
- Cristo
Jason, I think you hit the nail on the head there, but it's also outside the realm of this discussion. We know that we live under a "questionable" gov't, right? That's not even a partisan issue.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Coach Rahsheen, I honestly think Obama wants my life to improve. I believe that in his mind the ideas he proposes will make the planet better for everyone. But, I also see a pattern. He's doing the same old stuff that presidents before him tried. Carter believed his energy policy was going to save America also. But, it didn't stop me from sitting in gas lines as a child.
- Jason Nunnelley
Coach Rahsheen, see it's not outside the conversation. I want most of the Obama regulatory and power seizure to fail because I am concerned about future scummy politicians more so than his administration. For example, we pay a lot of our income for private health insurance. And, I like the idea of some of the HR3200 proposals. But, a Health Care Czar kind of creeps me out. How do you...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason. It's healthy to doubt the policies and ideals you're being fed. I can't fault anyone for that. To fight tooth and nail against things "just because" is what the problem is.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Health Care Czar? Where does that come in at?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Coach Rahsheen, [for example] well I like portability and insurance company regulation. I don't like a Health Care Czar. I don't like a single payer plan. I do like expanding Medicare payments. Most of us aren't just anti-Obama. But, our opinions are often slandered as such.
- Jason Nunnelley
I think the Dems should just get all their votes together and pass health care. Screw the GOP, we gave congress a clear majority and mandate. They need to find their spines and get it done, I don't care if gets 0 Republican votes.
- Joe
What if I want my Daughter to see the speech, actually any Obama speech, even though I disagree with some of Obama's policies? I'm not a closet racist or bigot, I just disagree with the President on some issues. I don't think it makes any sense to put everyone who disagrees w/ Obama in the racist/bigot category. But, maybe I have misunderstood this thread?
- Kurt Starnes
You don't like a single payer plan. So don't buy into it? Insurance company regulation? We have that now? I sure as hell don't have any damn insurance cuz it costs too much and I basically have no options right now. What will Obama do that hurts YOUR situation?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I'd be wary of having any agent of the federal government talking to my kids without my permission... However, after pondering a bit, I think there will be more good than bad from this. I respect those who feel otherwise. And no, it's not about race for most. It is a very new thing for a President to send a personal message directly to children. It's good that there are people who...
more...
- Gus
Kurt, I'm not putting every Obama opponent in a box. Only the racists/bigots. Cuz they deserve to be put in a glass box where everyone can see them. Although, that's not ever going to happen :)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Gus, it's not new. That's the issue.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I think I called them bigots more than anyone else did and I stand by that.
- Joe
@Coach - Well, there's no place for those such people, of course.
- Kurt Starnes
J.Deakins, I happen to agree with you. Problem is Dems don't want to do it alone because they're afraid it'll backfire in mid-cycle elections.
- Jason Nunnelley
If they don't do it -they will lose.
- Joe
Rahsheen, it is very new for a President to introduce himself directly to school students on a live TV link. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
- Gus
Coach Rahsheen two issues: the Secretary position (which I don't like) and single payer. First, I don't like single payer for a lot of reasons - that's a long discussion. If you don't have insurance, then it's virtually impossible for any plan to make your situation worse, isn't it. But, most Americans benefit from a healthcare system that is fed by private health insurance money. I'd like to fix your problem without making my situation worse. I'm already paying more than I can stomach.
- Jason Nunnelley
Past presidents have spoken directly to the kids. Obama has already provided the speech he's going to give for your perusal.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Gus: There are analogs. Not really a new thing.
- Christopher A Carr
I don't remember any President ever speaking directly from the White House to students in particular on a live TV link.
- Gus
I once watched a Space Shuttle explode on a live feed at school.
- Christopher A Carr
Did you ever have an agent of the federal government introduce himself to your class via satellite TV from DC?
- Gus
Rasheen, Secretary of Health and Human Services is the position - the text talks about how this person will set the standards for how much profit an insurance company can earn, etc. The problem is that if you deplete cash reserves for an insurance company, who bails them out when they run out of funds during a crisis? We do! It's the people that gave you the bank bailouts wanting to take over the health insurance industry.
- Jason Nunnelley
"Agent of the government?" Like a governor or a president? Oh, scary.
- Christopher A Carr
The "federal" government, even...*shivers*
- Christopher A Carr
SEC. 116 B is what really bugs me about HR3200. And, what I'd really like to know is why you don't have insurance now? How can we fix that problem? What's the issue? Here, a family spends about $400 a month on private health insurance and <$90 for a single person under 40. If this isn't affordable, I assure you a bulky national plan isn't going to be cheaper. The government does nothing cheaper than private enterprise. It may be better, but it won't be cheaper.
- Jason Nunnelley
Gus, Presidents Bush Sr. and I believe Jr. as well as Ronald Regan all gave speeches directly addressing school children. This is not a new thing.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Ok, so if you don't think the government can undercut private offerings, why are you worried about it?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Coach Rahsheen, most people don't take issue with Obama's published speech. It was the little thing about students writing in how they were going to help the president. It sounded political. People wondered if he was asking children to help him get his initiatives passed, etc. There's no longer anything for anybody to fret over. The president addressed the real conflict and everything...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
So if the private sector has not been able to provide affordable insurance and you don't believe the government can do it, then what is the solution. I'd like to hear viable proposals from those who are against the government run option.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Jeff, can you point me to when a previous President directly introduced himself to [all American] students from DC via TV?
- Gus
Coach Rahsheen, I'm worried about the Secretary making the same kind of mistakes the regulators made with banks. I'm worried about paying more taxes for more pork and theft. I'm worried that entangling the government in the insurance business is going to allow even more theft of public funds. I'm worried about medicine becoming a popularity contest instead of science.
- Jason Nunnelley
Guss, It has been linked to several times on other threads. I'll go look for the links.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Reagan did Gus
- Joe
Jeff P. Henderson, how can you say the private sector hasn't provided affordable health insurance? I have private health insurance, like most people. The uninsured are the minority. There's Americans that can't afford food, so why don't we nationalize the grocery stores? No, that's not how we handle it. We subsidize people. I've no problem offering subsidies. And, truth is, most people...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Gus, Here is reference to the Bush Sr. address in 1991 http://www.c-spanarchives.org/library...
- Jeff P. Henderson
Jeff P -- but none of those presidents were Negroes. :-(
- Christopher A Carr
Jason, I think the insurance business is one of the most corrupt still out there. You know all those salesman that have given that profession a bad name? Insurance salesman. Why is your insurance so high? You probably don't even get sick that much. It's because the entire industry is ALREADY broken. A public option could only help and, please correct me if I'm wrong, but where does it say YOU will have to pay for MY insurance? (since I don't have any and all)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I remember seeing speeches of Presidents in school on TV, but never a direct message. Like I said, it's not a bad thing. It'd be like the Prez coming to your school to chat about staying in school. That's a good thing. I bet Republicans will follow Obama's example from now on, even though some are wary of it now. That means, if Sarah Palin is ever elected prez, students will get to meet her at school too. yay! ;)
- Gus
Jason, If my employer weren't footing the bill for a majority of the cost of my family's health insurance, we could not afford the coverage I am getting. My family's gross income is quite good by most peoples standards.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Gus, I don't mean to pile on here but why does this concern you?
- Jason Nunnelley
It's the topic of the thread. Or did I read the topic incorrectly?
- Gus
Jeff P. Henderson, let me correct a misconception you have about compensation. You're employer isn't paying for anything but your labor. You're being paid in the form of health insurance, but that's compensation. Your employer isn't just paying your expensive health insurance premium because they're nice guys.
- Jason Nunnelley
I think the topic has meandered quite a bit since the thread started...
- Jeff P. Henderson
So, I'm not out of place if I stay on topic, am I?
- Gus
I'm no sure where you're coming from, Gus, but the president talking to the kids is just not a new thing. Most of them have done it.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Gus, I'm proving I have political ideas that aren't bound by racism. I'd like to see you defend your position too. Stay on topic if it pleases you.
- Jason Nunnelley
Definitely, Jeff. I was just trying to give the bigots a chance to state their positions plainly. Of course, they won't.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Jason, If I opt out of all health insurance coveage, my employer will give me something like $50 more per pay period. I guarantee you that my health insurance costs WAY more than that.
- Jeff P. Henderson
I got jury duty tomorrow so I am going to bed - good thread, good nite.
- Joe
Jeff P. Henderson, that's a policy to try to manipulate how you accept the compensation. But, they're not providing insurance out of their good will. You could become a private contractor (like me) and likely receive more compensation if your skillset allows it. I get paid much more an hour than typical hourly employees, but we pay cash out of pocket for things like health insurance and retirement. That leads me to /know/ what these things actually cost.
- Jason Nunnelley
Rahsheen, point me to an example of a direct message from a President speaking directly via TV introducing himself as the President to all American schools simultaneously. I don't remember that ever happening before. I've seen speeches, but not direct messages to students like this. I think Obama is doing something new, but just because it's new doesn't mean it's bad.
- Gus
Gus, I'm still curious why this bothers you. Presidents have addressed classrooms before, whether in person, on television, on tape, etc. But, modern technology allows them to do it somewhat differently. The question is, why does it concern you?
- Jason Nunnelley
Gus, he's already provided...in advance....the speech he will deliver. That means that you've had a chance to see exactly what he's planning to say to the kids in advance and all your claims of this being something new are null and void. I don't recall getting advanced copies of the speeches I watched from various presidents in advance.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Jason, I'm not sure how we got on the topic of compensation. I stated that if my employer weren't paying for a bulk of my health insurance coverage, I would not be able to afford it. i.e. If I were self employed with the same Gross pay as I have now and had to pay $1500 -$2000 per month for my health insurance I could not afford it. I would either have less insurance coverage or none at all.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Just coming into the convo at 145 comments later....I completely disagree Rah. yes, some, but some are like me who are completely against government and see that there's no difference between Obama and Bush, except Obama is a better speaker than Bush could ever hope to be. Not a racial thing, it's a government thing.
- Ⓐ ☠ slayerboy ☠ Ⓐ
Jeff, the reason I got on compensation is because you are paying it. So, you can afford it. Most people who have health insurance receive it this way. The employer based model is this little gimmick where employers offer insurance as part of their compensation package to sweeten the deal. You'd never consider taking a job paying the same amount of money less the insurance. You'd say...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Mike VanLare, oh crap. You just said Obama was a good speaker.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I'm guessing you don't live in California. Insurance is VERY expensive here. I also have a wife and two kids to insure.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Rahsheen, providing an advanced script doesn't mean a direct address from the President to all American schools has happened before.
- Gus
I have what is considered a competitive insurance package from my Silicon Valley employer. My out of pocket in the past 12 months was on the order of ~$6000. Half of that was for braces for my daughter, which dental insurance only covers about 20% of.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Jeff P. Henderson, no I live in Alabama where things are much cheaper (lower taxes too). We insure a family of four for about $400-600 a month. And, we spend the first $1K out of pocket each year for each family member. But, California is one of the most regulated liberal states in the union. One has to wonder how my wild wild west state has that kind of disparity in costs. I also have access to some of the best leading edge health care in the nation.
- Jason Nunnelley
OK, look like the topic has strayed. Laters.
- Gus
Rahsheen, All, sorry to hijack the thread with health care discussion. Probably should start another thread.
- Jeff P. Henderson
http://friendfeed.com/jasonn... There ya go. We can complain about health insurance all we want.
- Jason Nunnelley
I still want Gus to explain his concern.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, you can read my previous statements. I think you must have come into the conversation late or you've missed everything I've said. No need to repeat.
- Gus
Gus, I read it. I just didn't consider it a clear explanation of why this bothers you.
- Jason Nunnelley
Gus, look I realize it's propagandish. But, it's also no big deal. How do you feel about local law enforcement coming into the school, like the Dare program or similar antidrug propaganda? In fairness to those that don't understand why you have a problem with the president talking to your kid(s), I'm not sure what damage you fear it may do. It's not any different than his address to the nation on television. Plus, I think you can watch it yourself.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I've already said more than once that Obama's speech to students is a good thing. Do I need to say it in a different language? :)
- Gus
Gus, if you read the speech, then you can see that he's actually at a school, and his speech at that school is being broadcast nationwide. He knows this, and is speaking to everyone, and the students at the school. Just as Reagan did, just as Bush, Sr. did, and maybe even Bush, Jr. It's not a new thing, but yes, it is a good thing. I've also seen a space shuttle explode while in school,...
more...
- Bette Cooper
Now that I think about it, is his speech being delivered in English only?
- Gus
I wouldn't be surprised if it was translated into Spanish for those classrooms where only that language is spoken. But I don't know. If not, it probably will be soon.
- Bette Cooper
Gus: That could be a function of having come from some evil "federal" government.
- Christopher A Carr
I'd like to watch it, actually.
- Bette Cooper
"I'd be wary of having any agent of the federal government talking to my kids without my permission... " ---- Gus
- Christopher A Carr
Gus: Would you have felt the same way about Bush (the Elder) or Reagan?
- Christopher A Carr
Carr, I think my statement you quoted above has the answer to your question. :)
- Gus
Gus: pfft.
- Christopher A Carr
I don't believe you would take issue with Reagan giving a speech about kids staying in school...
- Christopher A Carr
I don't believe you.
- Christopher A Carr
When Bush spoke to students, Democrats investigated, held hearings http://su.pr/5Imto8 (via http://su.pr/9UdMwH) -- Interesting in consideration.
- Jason Nunnelley
@Jason - I just read that this morning. How about that.
- Kurt Starnes
Most people don't like him because of his failing policies, not his race. His poll numbers are nearing 30%, that's not racism behind it. And to be frank, I think it's pretty sad that Obama supporters can only resort to pulling the race card when dealing with people who oppose him.
- Spencer
I didn't care for him speaking to children, not because of his race, because he is deceptive like every other politician. I suppose he didn't mention how much debt he is leaving them with.
- Spencer
"Unlike the Obama speech, in 1991 most of the controversy came after, not before, the president's school appearance." That seems an important difference to me. But Dems were wrong to bitch about it. When he said: "Block out the kids who think it's not cool to be smart," he was giving good advice.
- Christopher A Carr
Christopher Carr, people who are screaming foul about a tiny number of people who objected to the original assignment are still pretending that the president's people didn't recognize it could have been misinterpreted and therefor changed the language to what he said today. The president has been much better about dealing with objections than his activist fans. He simply changed the questionable material and didn't called everyone (or, most) that objected a racist.
- Jason Nunnelley
I just think-- as a general rule-- that politicians are all talk and no real solutions. Everything is a band-aid on a patch on a wad of bubble gum. Republican and Democrat alike... Sadly (and despite my initial cautious optimism) Obama has proven to be no different.
- Jason, Secure
And to be fair, I think there is sometimes a reverse racial thing, as well. Just because he's the first African American to be President doesn't give him extra bonus points. He still has to get a job done. I agree that it was a historic moment when he was elected, but that moment has passed and now we need solutions to real problems.
- Jason, Secure
OK, I was wrong. This controversy was much bigger than I thought. My kid's school didn't have the pres' speech, I've got egg on my face and I'm legitimately embarrassed. I don't listen to Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, so I completely missed the firestorm and organized attempts to sabotage the president's attempt to deliver a good speech (which I watched today after school with my children). I'm embarrassed.
- Jason Nunnelley
Great thread. I've stayed up waay past my bed time reading it. Sadly I agree with Jason Huebel. I think there's so much gridlock and opposition and bickering and posturing in our government and nation as a whole there is little hope of anything getting done. No real change is possible in this current system. I don't think that's Obama's fault. I don't think it's Bush's fault. That's...
more...
- Give 'Em DBizness
Obama is trying to bring change, but people seem hell bent on blocking it at every turn, as if what we have already is working.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rahsheen, I like some of what Obama wants to do. I strongly dislike other stuff. For example, I don't like his dedication to wealth redistribution. I think governments have proven consistently that corruption overtakes regimes that thrive on taking from one group to give to another. But, I respect his position, and I don't think he's a bad guy. I just disagree with a few of his ideas. I think people can disagree with him without acting like wingnuts.
- Jason Nunnelley
It's fine to disagree, but it seems to me like his hands are tied. The things he is trying to do are not different from what he said he wanted to do, but he's being blocked and protested against at every turn. Then, those same people complain that he hasn't done anything. How do we know he doesn't have the answers if we don't even bother giving his ideas a chance?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rahsheen, BTW, re: my prior post. Obama has smartly said he won't dramatically increase tax rates during this term because he doesn't think the economy would survive it. But, he's also said he thinks we have an ethical responsibility to use the tax code to create equity. It's a fundamental viewpoint on social structure that I just happen to think fails in practice. But, I think he's...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
You may be right, Jason, but I think we may be in a tailspin at this point. There are things we do that definitely need to change or we will fail as a country. Look at the auto industry.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
'Scuse me while I...wait, what are we talking about?
- s t e v e
Rahsheen, the Democratic Party has a powerful majority in the House, Senate and he's in the White House. Rush Limbaugh can blow a lot of hot air. Republicans can chant and complain. But, they aren't in power. Obama's challenges aren't the Republicans or conservatives. And, he's spent trillions already with practically zero friction (besides a bunch of angry rallies). I'll agree our...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
I just point out the auto industry as an example of something that was working fine, corruption and all, for generations. Then, the wheels came off. (pun intended). I'm actually not sure why he's not just ramming stuff through. He keeps trying to negotiate. Maybe I'm missing something.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rahsheen, I'll tell you the biggest problem America has: character. We don't believe our politicians. Multinational corporations run our government. And, the banks are run by guys that would have made gangsters from the 20s envious. I'll tell you what happened to the auto industry. It was built on debt. The same problem happened to housing and eventually all durable goods. We all lived...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Agreed, Jason. I wasn't actually down with bailing out the banks OR the auto industry because I felt as if they were too far gone to save. It's like your wife running up your credit card, so you give her another one to use while you pay off the first one. WTF?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rahsheen, so what do you and I do now? Can we agree to band together to hold these billionaire power brokers accountable and refuse to empower them by supporting politicians that cater to their financial whims? The money we spent on the bank bailout -- and don't kid yourself, nobody really knows how much it is at this stage -- that money could have funded amazing education, healthcare...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
I'm definitely willing to take a step back and look at the bigger picture. Left or Right, we're all getting scammed and many of us don't even see it.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
If we can find common ground there, we can change the world.
- Jason Nunnelley
I don't think it matters which politicians we support at this point. They've proven time and again that once they get to Washington their efforts are mostly ineffectual. That is either because they were corrupt to begin with and simply hoodwinked us to give them our vote or their intentions are good but dysfunctional Washington bureaucracy stifles their ideas and efforts. I think Obama falls into the latter category.
- Give 'Em DBizness
My son has to have a permission slip signed to listen to the president's address. :( I'm ashamed to be living in Arizona now. I wonder if he'll get picked on for listening to the speech? Part of me doesn't want him to play with any of the kids whose parents don't sign the slip.
Billy Warhol, Brian, Chris Martin and 84 other people liked this
Given from what I've seen on the news, it ain't just Arizona. I can't believe the legs this story has.
- Derrick
I think this whole thing means parents have no ability to teach their children reason and debate. Now it's all about shutting up the other side. Would anyone like another Red Scare? Sure, I'll take two so I have an excuse to throw barbs at the other side and call them names. Stupid.
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
from iPod
Yeah, you know my thoughts on it: http://friendfeed.com/bluecoc...
- Lindsay is in 20-ten
It means a lot of parents are (a) stupid to begin with and (b) unwilling to take on the responsibility of "teachable moments" themselves. Or, you know, be a parent.
- Spidra Webster
In my younger years, I watched a speech by Reagen, Bush Sr and Clinton while they were in office that was directed towards school kids my age. We didn't hav eto sign anything and the schools made it mandatory :/
- Tsali, The Native of FF
Permission slips for teaching about sex, I get that. Some families and cultures prefer not to have the schools take care of that. But permission to listen to a historical speech? Do we need to start giving permission to learn about WW2 and the genocide? There are halocaust deniers out there. How about learning about Martin Luther King Jr and his I hAve a dream speech? It's race-based,...
more...
- Pete Delucchi
from iPhone
It just bothers me that these are the same people who told us to respect the office of the President, no matter who is occupying it when people were upset about going to war. And it scares me how much HATRED there is for Obama. Issues aside, just the pure hatred and aggression people feel towards Obama is frightening.
- Trish R
Maybe I'm just biased, or conditioned to think this way, but when I see all of this Obama backlash, the first thing that pops in my head is: WE DON'T WANT NO BLACK PRESIDENT.
- Derrick
Derrick: we don't want THAT black president. If Clarence Thomas, Thomas Sowell or Walter E. Williams ran, I'd vote for them in a heartbeat.
- Craig Eddy
And Craig, if one of them had been elected I'm sure there would be absolute outrage that parents were keeping their children home because that president were making a speech to schools.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
It's ridiculous to require a permission slip for this, but I support giving parents the opt-out option.
- Craig Eddy
@Tina: it's convenient that you can ascribe racist intentions to every criticism of the President, but that doesn't make it valid. UPDATE: oops, I mis-read your comment, Tina. Sorry. Strike this here, I'll use it in a second tho....
- Craig Eddy
Well Tad, it is not the kids faults that there parents are bigots.
- Joe
@J. Deakins: it's convenient that you can ascribe racist intentions to every criticism of the President, but that doesn't make it valid.
- Craig Eddy
Opt out? Hope he leads them in the pledge then the parents can opt out of the pledge opt out of respecting the flage opt out of respecting troops in time of war - yeah its 100 days after Bush and we sorta forgot that in time of war with troops on the hostile ground you respect your Commander in Chief - opt out of that
- WarLord
Doesn't mean it is invalid either Craig, but please sugar coat it.
- Joe
WarLord, Jehovah's Witnesses already do opt out of saying the Pledge of Allegiance.
- Rochelle
Some parents prefer to do the critical thinking for their children. Not permitting or opting out of the viewing is a perfect way to let your child know it's not important to form your own opinions or respect the POTUS, but listening blindly to the ideology of your parents is paramount.
- Pete Delucchi
from iPhone
@Pete: I'm sure that would apply to allowing a valedictorian to thank God for their accomplishments too, right?
- Craig Eddy
What a good group of crazies to use as an example Rochelle.
- Joe
My high school Freshman was bummed he wasn't getting to see it. He wanted the opportunity to "point out all the fallacies". It was a proud moment for me.
- Craig Eddy
Yes I'm aware of both Witness and Adventist "Graven Image" views that however is a tiny side issue to the larger one of hyper patriots suddenly deciding that their partisan politics is more important than our troops at war
- WarLord
J.Deakins, my point is that there already are groups of Americans who don't recite the Pledge. Although I don't personally agree with their religion, I give them the space and right to practice it. *shrug*
- Rochelle
Craig is drinking Cheny's cool aid.
- Joe
*blink blink*
- Nathalie, Dreamer of FF
Whatever Rochelle - they are crazy. No need to be PC there.
- Joe
No need to be civil either, of course.
- Craig Eddy
If the parent wrote the speech for the valedictorian, then yes, Craig. Otherwise, give credit where it's due, God, Allah, Buddha, all the same.
- Pete Delucchi
from iPhone
Civil like Bill O'Rielly?
- Joe
or civil like Rush?
- Joe
Oh, I didn't realize Bill O'Reilly or Rush were in this conversation. But way to deflect.
- Craig Eddy
Examples of GOP civility.
- Joe
I seriously doubt many valedictorians need/want their PARENT to write their speech for them, but if makes you feel better to think that, go for it.
- Craig Eddy
How civil of you Craig.
- Joe
Craig I'm waiting how do you feel about disrespect of Commander in Chief in time of war with our troops in harms way - those permission slips provide aid and comfort to America's enemies
- WarLord
I think those men are both entertainers who are paid to generate an audience.
- Craig Eddy
I think all the John Birch members will not be allowing their kids to see that speech either.
- Joe
Why isn't he going to see it, Craig? Are you not permitting him? Why not give him the opportunity to debate those "fallacies"? I think it's important for children to be able to figure out things for themselves eventually, you are there to guide, not brainwash. Brainwashing leads to backlash and extremism... we all need more moderation and the only way to achieve that is to expose ourselves to conflicting viewpoints and consider them objectively.
- Lindsay is in 20-ten
@Lindsay: It's for K - 6 as far as I know. I would never "shield" him, and we rarely discuss politics. He has formed his opinion through his own reading.
- Craig Eddy
J.Deakins: respect for another person's religion is not "PC." It's actually one of the core founding principles of this country. I don't happen to believe what the Witnesses believe, but I also don't think it's necessary to denigrate their belief here or anywhere else. #justsaying
- Bren - il Machia
1UP Bren.
- Rochelle
@Bren: respect for another person period. Whether its religion, politics, or choice of football team. Without it, we're doomed.
- Craig Eddy
Rochelle and Bren - *yawn*
- Joe
You know what I do think that children should hear speeches from god fearing GOPers - kids need to learn fear, hate, and intolerance - what better place to do it?
- Joe
Its been one election and 100 days but suddenly with a change of parties the Office of President and the Commander in Chief is far less deserving of respect. No longer dissent un american or unpatriotic. Partisan politics in time of war with troops in harms way is just a yawn. The hypocrisy of this dramatic and cynical sea change is breathtaking.
- WarLord
oh Bren we have a group based on tolerance and mutual respect among those of different backgrounds in FF, many folks you know are in there, you are welcome too.
- Joe
As well as the rest of you: http://friendfeed.com/the-sol...
- Joe
OK, I'll be a contrarian here. If this were a "political" speech about foreign policy, health care, or some issue that's a subject of political debate, I'd totally support the need for permissions slips, and I might even give the school board an earful about it...
- Ken Sheppardson
... Maybe I'm just being naive, but it never occurred to me that's what the President had in mind. My expectation is that to note the start of the first school year since he took office, he'd offer a "school is important, study hard, listen to your parents, and maybe you can grow up to be President" message. I mean you might disagree with him on politics, but do you really think he's a complete idiot?
- Ken Sheppardson
Ken, but don't you realize? That's all part of the illuminati-socialist-fascist plan! If people become educated and stay in school, they might demand government that works for them. The horror.
- mikepk
It is hard to fathom how far, how firm and how fast present divisions have taken hold. Confirms for me that ideology overcomes rational thought for many.
- Eric Logan
No Ken, the last President was the idiot.
- Joe
1up mikepk
- Joe
1up Eric
- Joe
Parents will let their kids listen to pro football players and pro basketball players, rappers and celebrities ... and yet they won't let them listen to the President for fear of "ideology". Rational thought has obviously been lost in the process here. People are getting way too bent out of shape over this.
- Allan Besselink
"President George H.W. Bush delivered a nationally televised speech to students from a Washington school in fall 1991, encouraging them to say no to drugs and work hard." -- http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn...
- Ken Sheppardson
"In November 1988, President Reagan delivered more politically charged remarks that were made available to students nationwide. Among other things, Reagan called taxes "such a penalty on people that there's no incentive for them to prosper ... because they have to give so much to the government." -- http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn...
- Ken Sheppardson
...just for context.
- Ken Sheppardson
Many parents who's kids won't seeing the speech will be watching the new Sarah Palin/Michelle Bachman TV show : "Crazy Talk"
- Joe
I get annoyed at the bogeyman of the evil all-controlling Government (capital G). If we strive to the heights of our own ideals then we, the people, should *be* the government. You know, that government of the people, by the people, for the people, that shall not perish from the earth. All that stuff? By framing every debate as "regular folk" vs "The Government" you're essentially saying democracy is a failed experiment.
- mikepk
There's a different set of rules for this POTUS let's be real here.
- Michelle
I thought it was for grades K-6, too, but my son said they're seeing it in high school (for the ones who have permission, of course).
- Trish R
You know what, George H.W. Bush attended by High School graduation. I wasn't a fan of Bush but I was still pleased and honored to have the President at my graduation and proudly shook his hand when I got my diploma. I recall watching a video of him talking about saying no to drugs and the Thousand Points of Light as well. Long story short, if the President is going to address children...
more...
- AJ Kohn
Bush's CIA directer Tenet was my commencement speaker in college...... I skipped it and went camping in Estes Park, CO instead.
- Joe
How can you become educated about a person's idealogical and political beliefs if you refuse to listen to what they have to say?
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
I don't think I'm being paranoid, xenophobic, or exhibiting low self esteem to say that I don't want classroom time taken up by political messages, unless I'm sure there's going to be a teacher there who can frame it as that after it's been presented and offer context and explain that there are alternative views. In the context of a Political Science class, fine, but as part of just some general assembly where the kids immediately head off to gym class after, no thanks.
- Ken Sheppardson
And I now have in my head Reagan's 1988 message that included the comment that "taxes can be such a penalty on people that there's no incentive for them to prosper ... because they have to give so much to the government" not any sort of hypothetical Obama speech. [That comment was in response to a Q from a student, not part of the prepared/approved address, BTW]
- Ken Sheppardson
I will be sharing this speech with children in India, it has universal appeal
- Aaman (Clone of FF)
Last school year, my son was in his English class, and the election came up. Many people spoke up with hate messages about Obama. My son spoke up in support of Obama and asked them why they hate him so much. The teacher asked my son, "How many states are there in the U.S.?" My son said "50." The teacher said, "Then you're smarter than Obama." So how is that not a political message in a...
more...
- Trish R
Yes, Trish, the teacher was wrong. But, since we have yet to actually see/hear the speech, how can we know what the content may be?
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
@Ken: Come on! They're over at someone's house and they hear something and there's no one to provide context. Or in the mall or ... anywhere. And why is it the job of the teacher to 'frame it'? I usually agree with you but here ... we're coddling children and parents WAY too much. The line of thought here is that nothing that is of any intellectual debate should be presented in school - that MAAD should be shouted down because I really think we should be talking about smoking instead.
- AJ Kohn
This is political posturing with kids as the pawns - it's that simple. One teacher over a single year will have 1000x more opportunity to influence a child's thinking counter to how the parent is trying to influence he/she. Some people home school for this reason, but that's not applicable in this situation since we're talking about a public school here. PUBLIC <--- hmm, important word here.
- Micah Wittman
Sorry, AJ... for a second there I was imagining we had a school system that actually teaches kids critical thinking skills and has a different set of standards than the mall or my neighbors' basement. I forgot. Nevermind. ;-)
- Ken Sheppardson
+1 Ken
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
Seems like to me, people don't want their children to hear messages from the president only when they views differ from their own. I can't ever recollect such vitriol when the president was going to talk to kids (wasn't GWB talking to school kids during the 9/11 attacks?). What makes it so different now? Obama is the FIRST PREZ to ever talk to kids, ZOMG!?!
- Derrick
I just know I want to watch the address now to see what these parents are keeping from their children. (Thrilled to be Canadian)
- Nathalie, Dreamer of FF
Text of the speech here: http://www.whitehouse.gov/MediaRe...
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
LOL. Wow, that's why I live in Canada. LOL.
- Zachary TG
Thanks Mark. seriously. parents don't want their children to hear that? *shakes head*
- Nathalie, Dreamer of FF
After reading through the speech all I could think was that I wish someone in a position of influence (other than my parents) would have given me that talk when I was a child.
- joey
Seriously? You need a permission slip to watch _that_?! It's totally bipartisan. No political agenda, just a message to stay in school and keep trying.
- Sparky
To anyone who feels like it's necessary to see the speech before you approve your child watching it: Would you have demanded to read the speech beforehand of Ronald Reagan, George HW Bush or George W Bush before allowing your child to sit in a classroom and watch?
- Trish R
Those other presidents weren't black, Trish. FYI.
- Derrick
Anybody believe this speech wasn't re-written over the past couple of days? Anyways, much of this is PR to try and stop his sinking poll numbers.
- Spencer
One step forward, 3 steps back.
- Trish R
trish, it's looking more like 1 step forwards, tricked out delorian ride back
- alphaxion
I had to sign a permission slip for sex ed. A political gimmick (as some perceive) might justify a permission slip. I couldn't imagine telling my child's school that my child couldn't attend the broadcast. That's especially a bad idea if you really believe it's just a dogmatic political engagement. It's a great opportunity to learn, regardless of your political affiliation and especially so if it's controversial and politically charged. Sounds like fun :)
- Jason Nunnelley
If I was a student and my parent did sign the permission form for me or my teacher or school opted out of the broadcast, I would ditch school to find a way to watch it.
- Pete Delucchi
from iPhone
sheesh - whatever your politics listening to the President of the country giving a speech specifically for students seems to me at least exactly what kids should be experiencing in school (whether public or private or home)
- Shannon Clark
I think you'll get a kick out of this, then. >> http://friendfeed.com/rochell...
- Miss Elle
By the way, I'm with everyone who is saying, "Racism." This is what I see, as well. If it were a white president, there would be considerably less pure anger. Sure, I get it, some of you can come up with reasons why you don't like this policy of that policy, but the fact of the matter is that white presidents have done much of what Obama is doing in the past and you didn't hate then....
more...
- Miss Elle
Cecily, I don't get your point. You dissented. Some people choose to dissent today. Were you not paying attention to all the people who hated Reagan in the 80s? Do you think Republicans and folks concerned about Obama's cult of personality originated the idea of opting out? This is a direct result of all the free thinking from Republican administrations and more conservative times - kids suing schools because a coach prayed before a football game.
- Jason Nunnelley
Cicily, if you're saying it was OK for you to dissent but not OK for today's youth (or their parents) to dissent then I'm afraid that's hypocrisy. Conservatives keeping their mouths shut when the "Just say no," campaign was going on (with which they agreed) and freaking out over the "What are you going to do for Obama?" campaign is consistent with their own personal views. It's no more hypocritical than you voting for the person you want to win.
- Jason Nunnelley
It's just as silly for you to deny someone's feelings about big socialist government as it is for someone to say you only like Obama because he's black. You're both equally guilty of dehumanizing the conversation. It's not productive. So long as you like conflict, that's cool. You're feeding a fire of hate, but that's your choice.
- Jason Nunnelley
Miss Elle, then I call bovine waste. It's untrue. Where have you been the last 8 years. When did the left show respect for the office of the presidency? That's either completely blind or dishonest.
- Jason Nunnelley
If my daughter doesn't get to hear the speech or I see a permission slip come from the school, I may have to homeschool her. This is a positive message by the President of our Unites States, not Hugo Chavez. The fact that it has come this far is frankly an embarrassment. The Right is lashing out like a wounded animal of the drubbing in the election, and instead of licking their wounds...
more...
- Vince DeGeorge
from iPhone
Where have you guys been? How did you miss all the nasty, vile rhetoric about Bush? Can't you guys just admit that you're political idealists that have no patience for the messages you don't like and accept that the guys on the other side are the same? Do you have to pretend it's about race or some other silliness? Even the left and right in DC manage to get together and have a beer afterward. Look at the Republicans that bemoaned Ted Kennedy's death. Buying into this whole hate stuff is for suckers.
- Jason Nunnelley
Word of mouth sure called little-Bush several levels of idiot. However, never once was there any nationwide attempt to make schools require permission slips when showing Bush to schoolchildren. This is about the permission slips, not about what is said at home.
- Miss Elle
Miss Elle: new tactic, old game. Never before did anyone use social media, direct advertising, cell phones, etc. as successfully as the 08' Obama campaign. Look, these are separate issues. One is the legitimate concerns of parents (right or wrong). The other issue is Republican tactics (which are sleazy). Calling everyone that's caught in the snare a bigot or evil is a bad idea. You...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Cecily, your'e wrong. They burned him in effigy, held mock trials, crapped on the flag. If you judge anyone that disagrees with you by the most extreme examples, then you're painting with an unfairly broad brush. As for the guy with the gun, he didn't shoot anyone and broke no law. I'd bet there's 10 or so guns strapped to someone at nearly every Republican meeting in my home town,...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
@Jason -- But permission slips? As a schoolteacher, and an independent voter, I was totally behind the "keep your kiddo home" thing. That seemed to be more of an individual choice. Permission slips is messing too much with education, methinks. (It should be noted that my school isn't showing the speech though I think some of my beloved knuckleheaded kiddos could benefit from a strong stay-in-school message.)
- Miss Elle
Look, we don't have any stupid permission slips in logic driven Alabama. I agree it's stupid.
- Jason Nunnelley
http://www.nowpublic.com/world... Is this the gun toting guy at the healthcare forum?
- Jason Nunnelley
It's just embarrassing as hell.
- Tad
I agree with that Tad. Why there would be permission slips required to see the speech is bizarre.
- Craig Eddy
For the record, carrying an AR-15 (AKA Assault Rifle) to a rally is a very bad idea. People shouldn't do it. But, to a gun carrier (and anyone who carries a gun is going to carried a loaded gun - cause an empty gun does one no good) this is an exercise of liberty. I disagree with that decision, just like the people that want to keep their kids home when Obama speaks. But, it doesn't mean they want to murder people.
- Jason Nunnelley
A permission slip - wtf?
- Mona Nomura
Quite messed up and that is my using my good language. School Fail!
- Mathew A. Koeneker
I really really hate to point this out: These are the nut cases which were running the place during Daemon Cheney - Bush debacle era. Now can you see why the rest of the world thinks we are nuts to let this kind of thing happen here. USA is looking pretty bad - nothing these guys are doing makes us look like we have 2 cylinders going in a 4 cylinder engine Dudes Chill Love your neighbors
- ThatDBD
Cassie's principal (she's a 4th grade teacher for those not in the know) isn't allowing it to be shown in her school because of parent complaints about "propogandizing"...Yet another example that racism isn't dead in America just because we have a black president.
- Alex Scoble
Holden, there's no other rational reason to explain the reaction that parents are having to this event.
- Alex Scoble
In all honesty, I just don't see how the things going on surrounding President Obama are not related to race. Take everything as a whole and it just doesn't make sense. Race seems to be the missing piece that makes it all fit together. Obviously, some people have actual grievances with Obama (even though he hasn't actually done anything yet), but nothing else explains the retarded stuff going on right now. (Funny, Alex and I agree for the same reason)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Trish: You asked "To anyone who feels like it's necessary to see the speech before you approve your child watching it: Would you have demanded to read the speech beforehand of Ronald Reagan, George HW Bush or George W Bush before allowing your child to sit in a classroom and watch?".... I think so, yes. I wouldn't ask to review it in the case of Obama because I trust him to keep it non-partisan. Those other guys? Watch out... ;-)
- Ken Sheppardson
Dear Parents Who Don't Want Their Children Listening to Anything Barack Obama Has to Say, Ask your child what they want to be when they grow up. If their answer is not "I want to be YOU mommy/daddy," please stop trying to turn them into you. Thank You, Those of Us Who Enjoy People Who Have Formed Their Own Beliefs and Opinions
- EricaJoy
1UP Erica
- Derrick
Jason - carrying an AR-15 to a rally is an "exercise of liberty"? Can people start exercising some responsibility? Once again, another prime example of "just because you can, doesn't mean you should". I am really starting to wonder what drives people anymore. Apparently people are more driven by party-politics-babble than they are by thinking. Nobody made this big of an issue about any of the aforementioned presidents, Republican or otherwise. This is just plain stupid.
- Allan Besselink
Hey, wingnuts! Maybe you guys want to try reading the speech before you freak out: http://friendfeed.com/us-poli...
- Steven Perez
I read the speech. I concur with POTUS! Stay in school. Be responsible for your future. Learn all that you can. Show up. All seem pretty sensible ideas to me.
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Mathew, yeah but it's kind of sad (to me at least) that the POTUS has to say this kind of stuff to the kids today... shouldn't parents be passing on those types of things to their kids already?
- Chris Heath
I agree that it seems as if many parents have given up the idea of being the role model for their children. Another argument entirely. I applaud the fact that POTUS is being forward thinking.
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Allan Besselink, if you're talking to me you didn't actually read my post/comment. And, Scott, if an AR-15 is too much fire power for an individual, then so is any hunting rifle. A .223 is no more powerful a firearm than anything you'd use to shoot a deer, elk or wild boar. This is simply a pro-gun vs. anti-gun issue. You either think guns are evil and should be banned or you believe in the right to keep and bare arms. Some people believe in the right to keep and bare arms.
- Jason Nunnelley
Why would you need a gun at a rally? Simple question. Simple answer?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Scott, does that limit end at my front door? People carry guns concealed in my state - I can carry a gun practically anywhere, especially in public spaces. You just don't know I'm carrying. Like I already said, I'd never carry a gun to a rally because it's a bad idea. I think that is a mistake. But, to a person that carries a gun everywhere else, it's not a hostile act.
- Jason Nunnelley
Coach Rahsheen, I usually keep a license to conceal carry. And, I never feel the need to carry a gun anywhere. I most often carry in transport to shoot for fun. I like guns. They're fun. I would never carry to a rally. It's a bad idea.
- Jason Nunnelley
Come on, Jason. Are you serious? I could see if you're just carrying concealed all the time just because that's what you do. I don't have a problem with that. Carrying a rifle to a rally when you have said you want the president dead can only be seen as an act of aggression. I don't care if people carry guns, but people are definitely abusing their right to bear arms just recently.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
WRT I do not understand why it's supposed to be OK to bring guns to rallies for *THIS* presidents term but it's never been before. Mind you I grew up in Alaska. I am no stranger to guns and I love that people can use them to shoot the moose that make tasty jerky (dear anybody in alaska, please send moose jerky). I also think that people should have the right to keep a gun in *most*...
more...
- EricaJoy
from IM
Jason, your words: "But, to a gun carrier (and anyone who carries a gun is going to carried a loaded gun - cause an empty gun does one no good) this is an exercise of liberty." That wasn't hard to read. "Responsibility" goes with rights - guns or otherwise. I agree with Coach - where's the need, "rights" or otherwise? People are too quick to jump all over having the "rights" but fail to...
more...
- Allan Besselink
Erica - yes, I think we have what people have, in history, called a "double standard". I fear we are now discovering the deep dark underbelly of the populace, more so than ever before.
- Allan Besselink
Yes, Allan. I already said that. Scott, this whole notion of an "assault rifle" is silly. I can kill a person just as effectively with a "deer gun," as an "assault rifle." It's a designation based on how the gun looks - it's practically meaningless. I realize that antigun people don't understand that an assault gun and a hunting gun are the same thing. I also realize that antigun are...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
It's not a designation based on the looks of the gun, although that's how the assault gun ban was written. An assault gun is different from other types of firearms in a few important areas and must meet more than a few of these criteria. It must fire a high speed projectile, have a high capacity magazine, be easily configured for auto or multi-round fire and have a rifled barrel (be fairly accurate up to 400 meters. That's what makes it different from a hunting rifle.
- Alex Scoble
And yep, a well trained crazy with a bolt action M14 sniper rifle is much more dangerous to the public than a crazy with an assault rifle, if they are in the right place, such as a clock tower.
- Alex Scoble
Don't understand exactly how gun rights belong in this debate. I personally don't have to look any further than Iran and June 2009 to realize that the right to bear arms are vitally important in a free country.
- Eric Logan
Thread drift or no thread drift - it's still inane to require a permission slip to listen to the President.
- Allan Besselink
I agree, Allan and us much as I hate it the visibility of an underbelly also seems apt. Hopefully, its exposure provides a cathartic opportunity at some point in the future.
- Eric Logan
"Every single one of you has something you’re good at. Every single one of you has something to offer. And you have a responsibility to yourself to discover what that is. That’s the opportunity an education can provide." <-- I could really have used hearing that as a kid.
- Alix Whitmire
Anyone who would not allow their children to hear that speech should be ashamed of themselves. Period.
- Joe
You know, I keep trying to tell folks (in two separate threads) that dismissing the fear some express as political duplicity ignores a growing sentiment in this country. Most of the rabid anti-Obama were also people who thought the Bush administration was drifting toward fascism. There is a strong thread of thinking in this country that our government is being pushed to a dangerous end by both parties. It's not fake emotion. And, it's not shrinking.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, that might be the sentiment where you live, but where I live the anti-Obama people were almost all very avid supports of the previous administration. VERY.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Jason, you may have a point there about growing anti-government attitudes (on some issues) across parties (that's worth several threads thread in itself), but it's the rabid anything that's misplaced, and to fear something so straightforward as this speech is just silly, if not either (or both) pure partisanship or veiled racism.
- LogEx
Tina, LogEx: I've said this a dozen times - but I happen to have zero problem with the President's speech. But, I think it's a bad idea to ignore the real emotion behind the success of the campaign to trump up concern over Obama's address. I also think it's a terribly dismissive and ignorant statement to call anyone that has concerns over the speech a racist. Reactionary? Sure. Racist? No. Its not about race. It's about socialist vs. free market. Most people don't care what race Obama is or isn't.
- Jason Nunnelley
It might be simplistic to reduce it to race, but I can't help but consider that a factor. That's not to say that the other things aren't, but there's too much divide, too many people not willing to talk about it, too much history in regards to race in this country to say that it's NOT a detail. EDIT: But then again, I'm a black man in America, so that's my bias.
- Derrick
There are two factors here: tabloid political spin doctors and legitimate political dissenters. Neither are driven by race. The political spin doctors are responsible for nutty stuff like Palin claiming Letterman suggested someone rape her daughter. That's insane, and I'm pretty sure she knew it when she said so. Likewise, there was a single line in the original speech that's been blown...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
I've never said anyone called anyone a racist, or that the people involved are racists. I reiterate, things involving race can be racial without the people involved being racists. Big difference.
- Derrick
Derrick, go to a Republican rally and say you're for lowering taxes, reducing federal spending and reducing the amount of involvement the government has in people's lives. You can be as black as coal, they'll embrace you. Get some lily white guy to go to the same group and say he's for universal healthcare, more taxes and tell them you think people shouldn't be allowed to say things...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I would say that most of these people don't understand what socialism or free markets are. Most of what I've seen is spouting extremist talking points that have no basis in fact.
- LogEx
Black as coal?
- Derrick
LogEx, yes. We totally agree. But, I'm trying to suggest the whole walk a mile in the crazy guy's shoes line. Just because someone's views aren't completely logical or well thought out doesn't mean they're lying about their motivation. If you empathize with people you can change their hearts and minds. If you dismiss them, you'll get nowhere.
- Jason Nunnelley
Derrick, is that an offensive term? It wasn't meant to be nuanced. I'm just pointing out that a man's color doesn't matter as much as his ideology. You think all these right wing folks would embrace Hillary Clinton?
- Jason Nunnelley
What I'm saying, and I'm not discounting ideology, as someone who thinks that gays should be able to get married, that those who have should help out those who have not, we should be more inclusive, and we had no business in Iraq, etc., I clearly differ from those who are more conservative. I'm also someone who is forced to never, never, never forget that he is black. I'm certainly...
more...
- Derrick
+10 Derrick
- Joe
Derrick, I can't understand but I do empathize that being a minority is a particular burden in today's culture. I remember dealing harshly with a great guy in business a long time back and he decided it was because he was black. It had nothing to do with that. I got stuck between a rock and a hard place and he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. It was about money, not race....
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
I think that's the point I'm trying to make, Jason. Things in this country have conditioned people of color to be consumed with race, and people who aren't minorities rarely give it a second thought. Until both groups understand this, there will always be some gulf.
- Derrick
Derrick, I realize that. Let me tell you (for personal peace and understanding) that most white people are judging you for your education, performance, manner of speech, and a whole host of other things. Your race isn't in the top five, likely not in the top ten. If they mess you over it's because that's what white people do. There is an ethnic European culture, and part of it is race...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
I understand that Jason, and realize that in a perfect world, that wouldn't be a factor. But, by the same token, race neutrality can backfire. I *am* black. I have had experiences as a black person in this country that have added to how and why I do things. To cut *that* out and ignore it completely is just as bad, in my experience, as it is to be a blatant racist. Resumes can only tell a person so much; you still have to conduct an interview.
- Derrick
Derrick, just keep in mind that as a white man I can't possibly understand where you're coming from. It's always going to be alien. You say "I am black," and I say "so what?" I can only recognize the effect that status has as an intellectual exercise. I've never dealt with you based on race, just like I've never dealt with anyone based on race. So, it's much more relevant to me that we...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Which is my point. I can't just erase it from the factors of which I live by. Racism is a plague and I think we can both agree on that, but for me to reduce racial matters, that of my livelihood, to something like snake handlers in the mountains of Tennessee isn't something I just can just...do. But I hear you, and I am grateful for the dialogue.
- Derrick
Derrick, I can recognize intellectually that it effects you personally. I realize that there are still a lot of racists out there. But, for you to deal with me based on what some racist did to you is like my wife dealing with me based on what some guy she dated in high school did. I realize it happens, but it's completely disconnected. Rahsheen's assertion that if I don't like Obama...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
Derrick, BTW - my frustration is with Rahsheen's comments and not your comments. You're sounding pretty logical. Rahsheen's assertion that if I dislike Obama's politics I've got to be a bigot is infuriating. I'm not even so much arguing for me. I'm not really a big anti-Obama guy. I have a tad less frustration with Obama than I did with Bush. But, I just can't assign all political beliefs to race. It's too simplistic.
- Jason Nunnelley
I can't speak for Rahsheen, and I'll say it again, things can be racial without being racist. I don't know why someone called you a bigot; I didn't call you one.
- Derrick
As a retired teacher this whole event just shows me that teachers hands are tied.
- kevin i mills
Does this only affect public schools, or is it an issue with the private institutions as well?
- Kittyburgers
Wow. Over the top.
- Rick Cogley
Lest we all think there was no outrage when President Bush the first spoke to students: http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion...
- Craig Eddy
I didn't call anyone anything. Just for the record.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
+1 Rick. And to think this all started with the issue of a permission slip being signed. No wonder people in other countries look at all of this and say "WTF?".
- Allan Besselink
@Craig Eddy: Thanks for pointing out that link.
- Kittyburgers
Coach Rahsheen, I perceived your statements (in the other thread) to be quite knee-jerk, assumptive. You've clarified that you were only talking about "some," though I'm not sure how one falls into this category. I'd consider the number of people that dislike Obama's policies because of race to be a tiny number compared to those that take issue w/ his policies.
- Jason Nunnelley
@Jason Nunnelley: I don't think any reasonable individual would disagree with that. The race issue would most likely be minimal.
- Kittyburgers
Kittyburgers, unfortunately I think otherwise rational people do disagree with me. It's a personal experience I can't understand - nobody that has lived a life without the experience unique to people of color can really understand it. We can only recognize unique experiences and viewpoints we don't understand. To me (likely you too), race just isn't a big deal. To someone that has their...
more...
- Jason Nunnelley
White of me?
- Jason Nunnelley
I think injecting race where it doesn't already exist is a counterproductive viewpoint. I understand why it may develop in one's psyche. I don't understand it. But, I accept that people who tell me about this feeling are honest and telling me their sincere feelings. As we develop a deeper understanding of each other I'd like to think we develop a more correct interpretation of others' beliefs, even if we disagree with them. The question is, is there hope?
- Jason Nunnelley
Sad + Pathetic!!!!!! + this is AMERICA!!??? WAKE THE HELL UP PEOPLE!!! I can't believe this Garbage is Happening in America of all places* It's a Bloody Disgrace!! Good Riddance to Bush + Brainwashed Flock NeoCon Taliban-like Religious Zealot MORONS!!!
- Billy Warhol
I'm late to this, but I have to say it's far more stinky where Jason sits than where Cecily sits. Jason, you seem to ignore the fact that Cecily's school was going to force each family to document why each child didn't show up for the Reagans, while the schools of this day were forcing parents and children to provide documentation to hear Obama speak. Dissert was not permitted for Reagan. Dissent was the default for Obama. Pure, udder (spelling deliberate) fecal matter.
- MiniMage - HLtW
Ours (in conservative O.C., CA) was opt out - if you *didn't* want them to watch, you had to sign and return a slip.
- Denise Howell
You know I love you guys, I do... but seriously? Sometimes US politics is bat-shit insane #obamaeatschildren
MVB (Curmudgeon of FF), (jeff)isageek, Scott of Two Countries and 15 other people liked this
I agree!!!!
- Jeff P. Henderson
We are not our politics, JW. xo
- Derrick
drama... that's how it always is with the popular kids ;)
- Marco
Yep.
- nakachi
I don't have an excuse, explanation for any of it. I'm sure sitting outside the boarders looking in, you wonder WTF! Well inside we kind of scratch our head and go WTF too.
- CW™
wingnuts are into the idea that a black president is going to tell their children to go out, do dope, bang, and call everybody cracker.
- lisbethwest
most days its best to just ignore it Johnny,
- Tony C (Unrated)
Derrick, I know that well... Just sometimes the noise projected overseas is so loud it's hard not to live on sterotypes :)
- Johnny Worthington
Try living here! I learned to ignore politics years ago and have been much happier since.
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
Life is too short for politics.
- Michael McKean
What Sean and Michael said. I pay enough attention to be aware, but I've got things closer to heart that have my attention.
- Derrick
Too many people making money off of this crap for the last 20 years to be taken serious.
- Tony C (Unrated)
I think a lot of this controversy comes from Obama being so unpopular so early in his presidency. He's done a lot of polarizing things (like pushing for lots of spending on things conservatives don't want), which I respect that he is capable of doing.
- Kevin L
@lisbethwest: I like crackers of all varieties... but most people I just call weird.
- Bette Cooper
Some of the very unromantic reasons why women sleep with men | Mail Online - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail...
|
edythe, K.D., MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS and 17 other people liked this
"Not long ago, I was talking to a single friend about her recent conquest. 'To be honest, I only slept with him out of politeness,' she admitted. I was not surprised - as women's labyrinthine reasons for having sex go, that's pretty basic, stock-in-trade stuff. Perhaps men will find that a little shocking, depressing even. But they shouldn't. Indeed, they wouldn't if we hadn't all been fed a Utopian myth that men and women have sex purely because they're crazed with lust for each other - or, in a long-term partnership, because they still adore each other. Any woman past the age of 16 knows what idealistic nonsense this is - and finally, there's research to prove it. As the Mail reported yesterday, in a new book, Why Women Have Sex, 1,000 women were interviewed about their real reasons for saying 'Yes' when they could have said 'No'. Boredom, winning favours and to get rid of a headache were high up the list. These results suggest that comparing the intricate physiological and...
more...
- RAPatton
"84 pc of women have sex simply to keep their partners quiet or to get help with the chores. You may feel shocked at the hint of prostitution - the bartering of our bodies for a bit of DIY - but within a committed relationship is it truly so different from any other trade- off which ultimately nets both participants what they want? Women have always been practical when it comes to ensuring their comfort and security - and sex is an immensely valuable commodity."
- RAPatton
"The authors also found that women have sex in a bid to 'win' - to poach a man from another women or to secure his long-term commitment. Then there's 'jealousy' sex, which involves having sex with someone else to re-ignite a partner's interest. Callous, yes, but most of us are not above a certain amount of low-down scheming when it comes to sex. Less shameful triggers for liaisons...
more...
- RAPatton
I feel so.... used
- RAPatton
lol: "So, should we really be shocked by these findings? Some people will find them refreshingly honest, others depressing. They will bemoan the fact that 40 years after Cosmopolitan explained we were supposed to have orgasms, too, women are still swapping sex for household chores and lying back for the sake of a quiet life."
- anna sauce
I always assume women sleep with me because of money. Or sympathy.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from iPod
Friend of mine had a regular deal with her husband, sex for him doing the dishes. Still married.
- anna sauce
"If it would get you to do chores, it'd be 10 times a day" don't ask where I heard that...
- Jason Wehmhoener
Betty Friedan is rolling in her grave (is she dead?) Kinda sad.
- anna sauce
Wait a second. I'm suposed to get sex for doing the chores? I´ve been doing this wrong for 9 years!
- Eoghann Irving
from fftogo
The article doesn't mention where the 1,000 women interviewed were from. I wonder if region/culture plays a role.
- Andre P. Siregar
from iPod
Wives are the leading cause of mistresses.
- Christopher Harley
from iPhone
LOL @ Robert. Gay men have sex because the day ends in 'y'.
- Derrick
oh nooo!!! this is not true.. is it ?? is it??!! oh well then, we play along ;)
- Gtp19
RAP... you know, I can live with it.
- MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS
"And I had heard that men who have had strokes and cancer lose their sexual confidence." Is that true?
- Mahmood Padura Aval
What is your vi.sualize.us URL? Mine is: http://vi.sualize.us/koltreg... #photog
Jesper Lind, Arda Çetin, Irma Vermaat and 13 other people liked this
I added the 'popular feed here: http://friendfeed.com/visuali... but it doesn't work too well. I have a separate feed for *just* my vi.sualize.us bookmarks here: http://friendfeed.com/kol-vis... #whatsyoururl
- Kol Tregaskes
Serial bookmarker! ;)
- ◄ani625Ξ
Yep, love it. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
I used to be the same, but it lost steam somehow
- ◄ani625Ξ
I've somehow managed to keep at it for a while without burn out. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Just me then. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
http://vi.sualize.us/victorg... haven't updated since a while
- diego morelli
Thanks, Diego. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Anyone else use vi.sualize.us?
- Kol Tregaskes
I haven't started yet, but do have an account. Never felt the need with FriendFeed around. :( http://vi.sualize.us/jcunwir...
- jcunwired
Keep 'em coming, I'll add you all later today. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
http://vi.sualize.us/davide/ just signed
- Davide Patti
Cool.
- Kol Tregaskes
Any more?
- Kol Tregaskes
Why does everyone assume that Chris Brown is a woman beater just because he beat a woman once? Seriously...think about that.
Pete Delucchi, Jimminy Fuller, Joe Dawson and 11 other people liked this
BECAUSE. HE BEAT. A WOMAN.
- Derrick
I tried marijuana once, does that make me a pot head?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
No, but it makes you a marijuana smoker
- Johnny Worthington
Why does everyone assume dude down at the state penn is a rapist just cause he raped a woman once? Seriously... think about it.
- Tad
No, but it literally makes you a drug user. How did you only do it once? Man that's how it started with me, now it's all heroin every day all day.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
I only killed that guy once, DOES THAT MAKE ME A MURDERER? (and he was an ass.)
- Derrick
*ponders* I would say that the assumption is probably rooted in the psychological underpinnings of anger management and the cycle of domestic violence. By the time a person (male or female) is publicly charged with (and admits to) committing an act of domestic violence, it is (in the vast majority of cases) NOT the first time s/he has acted on the violence cycle. The comparison with pot doesn't really equate. One is to self. The other is to another person. Very different.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
He's more than a woman beater - he's a craven coward, pathetic miscreant who deserves to live the rest of his life working at McDonalds.
- Tad
It's easy logic, if you're a celebrity and you do something or are accused of something the public doesn't favor... you deserve the chair (Example: MJ = Child Molester, Kobe = Rapist).
- Hugh Isaacs II
Not the same thing, Tad. Also, just cuz I tried pot once doesn't mean I need an intervention.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
He apparently beat her more than once so how many times it is it acceptable to hit a woman before he is labeled a woman beater?
- pea
He apparently beat her more than once? Never heard that, pea.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
It came out in the court proceedings.
- pea
It was stated at his sentencing by the judge that he beat her on at least 2 other occasions.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
I'm sorry, but beating up someone weaker than you is one of the absolute LOWEST things that a man can possibly do. To do it to someone you are apparently "in love" with is even worse. He should never make another penny based on his previous celebrity.
- Tad
The key difference is whether an act is beyond all ethical boundaries for society. Murder, rape, physical abuse all qualify. A little weed is just a difference of opinion with antiquated laws.
- LogEx
There must have been no evidence of these other two beatings if the judge didn''t do anything about it.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
*lights incense with LE*
- Derrick
That doesn't mean they didn't happen.
- Tad
Guilty until proven innocent.
- Hugh Isaacs II
Not talking about the gravity of the act, just the labels. Definitely doesn't mean they didn't happen, but it doesn't mean they did, either.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
He was proven guilty - and admitted his own guilt.
- Tad
Rah, I'm curious...why do you feel the need to be the counterpoint for Brown? I'm all for devil's advocate, but I think this case, with him admitting it, makes it pretty clear.
- Derrick
If he admitted to beating her, then it probably happened, right?
- Tad
Rah, it goes back to my previous comment about Michael Vick. If I did it, it would severally effect my standings in life, my social circle and potentially effect my future earnings to the point where i could not continue with level of comfort I have become accustom to. Don't think Brown is going to be any poorer for it in the long run.
- Johnny Worthington
This topic really steams me the hell up. Civilized society is founded on protection of the weak. For a powerful man to beat someone is to show that he's not a man at all, but a beast - worthy of nothing.
- Tad
I used to get my ass beat by a woman on a regular basis. I could have easily defended myself, but then I would be sitting where Chris Brown is now. Actually, no. I'd be sitting in a prison cell, but everyone would still be calling me a piece of shit woman beater.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
A Scottish old timer in Scotland, in a bar, talking to a young man. The Old Man says, "Lad, look out there to the field. Do ya see that fence? Look how well it's built. I built that fence stone by stone with me own two hands. I piled it for months." "But do they call me McGreggor-the-Fence-Builder? Nooo..." Then the old man gestured at the bar. "Look here at the bar. Do ya see how...
more...
- Rob Haas
What would my defense be? Oh the chick hit me first? Yeah right.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Oh the stories I could tell here about the justice system and domestic violence. The number of people (both men AND women) who get away with some of the most atrocious acts because there were no eye witnesses and because often it's a matter of one person's word over another...it's enough to make to make your skin crawl. Seriously. Unless someone ends up bloodied or dead, then it's a matter of he said/she said.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
Rah - defending yourself and beating someone up are two completely different things. I spend several hours a week working on learning to vigorously defend myself without harming whoever would be harming me.
- Tad
A hallmark of a man is self control.
- Tad
Men and women both need to know that they do not have to be in an abusive relationship. I think they were both terrible for each other. I don't think she's super awesome either.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
The judge gave him 1400 hours of community service, and instituted a restraining order and made it very clear that if he violated said order she would put him in prison. What about that is not doing anything? This isn't people throwing about a "label" on the basis of rumors on some celebrity gossip magazine or web site. This is what happened in court. How much benefit of the doubt is this man supposed to be given?
- pea
Right, and how many people know how to defend themselves without injuring the other person? I had 2 options. Hit her or throw her. Both would result in injury and I would be in jail. No questions asked.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Or leave
- Johnny Worthington
I'm just saying people need to stfu about him. Stop being so angry at him. He went to court and they ruled against him.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I know Rah - it may take me the rest of my life to learn how. It sounds like you made it out of the situation (eventually) without harming her. Not saying it was right or easy.
- Tad
Leaving *sounds* easy, Johnny. It's not so easy, though. Took me 13 years.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
I'm angry at the people who'd still give an animal their money. He's not worthy.
- Tad
It's kind of hard to just leave when she won't let you. Or when she has you trapped in a corner and is punching you in the head. Or when she has decided she's going to cut you with something. Especially when you'd be leaving her with your child.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I never said it was easy, just an option.
- Johnny Worthington
Rah - that's NOT the situation Chris Brown was in, or even close. Don't put him in the same position that you were in. In that situation I don't think I'd hold too much against you for defending yourself even if it required hurting her. Not saying a court would agree, but there's a line that has to be drawn somewhere. Again... NOT what Chris Brown did.
- Tad
My issue with the Chris Brown situation is the same as with Vick. Everyone is just mad because they're celebrities and people feel like they haven't suffered enough, but that's not your place to judge people. Don't watch Vick play. Don't buy Chris Brown's album. Fine. But don't go around with all this hate in your heart for them. It's just sad to see to me.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Even if Rhianna had beat him first, he had resources you never had.
- Tad
So it seems to me that this really isn't about Chris Brown, Rah, it's about whatever horrible situation and circumstances you were under with this person. Which are two different things.
- Derrick
How does anyone know what his situation was? It's not like he'd put it out in court. Like I said, he'd sound like a moron and everyone would laugh. Everyone acts like they were there, but none of you were.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
@Johnny: True - it is an option. However, it's not a "simple" option by any stretch of the imagination. This is an extremely complex subject...and there are any number of mitigating factors involved. Fear for self or children being just *one* factor. Toxic relationships are what they are.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
To point, Coach, I agree with you that none of us knows his heart. I'm certainly not his judge. However, I wouldn't trust him for 5 seconds - given his history...and given mine.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
Again Rah, remember if he HAD been in the same position he's a filthy rich millionaire who could hire people to do what you didn't have the resources to do. It's not fair and I certainly can't relate. :( I shouldn't be so judgemental. It's hard not to. I'm sorry - I didn't see things from your point of view.
- Tad
All I'm saying is, none of us know why he did what he did, but we are all passing judgement as if we know the whole story and I think that's wrong. People *hate* this boy based on this incident and don't even know what sparked it. She could very well have been the aggressor and just came out with more bruises. Sure, I relate it to my situation, but I'm not blind. I just have the ability to see past "Oh, he beat a woman's ass!" and actually think about the situation.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
You rail against generalizations but you're doing the same thing. I'm not mad at him because he's a celebrity. I dislike the MAN because he beat the shit out of a woman. I don't give a good goddamn how many albums he's sold. I couldn't even name on of his songs so no, this isn't me hating on a celebrity and I think it's unfair for you to dismiss everyone's feelings about this by making...
more...
- pea
Further, if it was a woman beating up on a man, I would dislike her as well, celebrity or not. This isn't about gender. This is about someone else physically exerting their power over someone and that's pure crap.
- pea
If I implied everyone was hating on him just because he was a celebrity, I apologize. That was not my intention. If it was a woman beating up on a man, it wouldn't be news. Period. How could a frail little woman beat on a big strong man?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
FWIW, I'm angry because I sit in a room once a week for two hours looking at women just like me who can't figure out how to put their lives back together after someone who said they loved them battered them. What he did makes me angry. Period.
- Kisha, Well Conditioned
from BuddyFeed
Not all women are frail and not all men are big and strong, and besides that, physical abuse is wrong no matter for what reason or gender. I'd file charges on a woman at the drop of a hat if she assaulted me
- Tad
This thread has made me so angry that I'm afraid I'm unable to articulate without setting off fires.
- Derrick
Rah, I was once in a similar situation, too. One night, an insanely jealous girl I was dating went completely off on me. She slapped me, and when that didn't get the reaction she wanted, she started throwing punches. Since I was at her place, I pushed her down and backed out of the door. After I left, she took off in her car after me. The night ended when she totaled her car chasing me.
- ha3rvey (big appetite)
It's not even the fact that people are upset with him over what he did, but it's the level of anger and hate that is disturbing to me. Same with Vick. People want to hang Vick. How does responding to these people's actions with anger and hate solve anything?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Well, Coach, I will say that the use of words like "love" & "hate" aren't quite the same as using a word like "brilliant" (from the other day). People frequently misuse love & hate towards other people in the same way they would describe *things* - which is a nasty habit. I *HATE* lima beans for instance (and no, the lima beans didn't do anything to me other than offend my palate). I...
more...
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
Vick doesn't bother me nearly as much as Brown, but both of them did things that are completely unacceptable in a civil society.
- Tad
What ever happened to forgiveness in our society? Why do we seek to crucify everyone, even after they've faced a court of law and judgement has been handed down? How does your grudge against someone benefit you, your life, or the world we live in? These are just things that both stories make me think about. Your negative thoughts or feelings toward another person don't hurt that person. They only hurt you.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Rahsheen, very good point.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Forgiveness is also personal. It's not an arbitrary act that "society" can truly grant. This is just my position, of course. I agree with you that negative emotions against another person don't hurt the other person; they only harm the person feeling them. But forgiveness isn't easy for people who *perceive* that justice hasn't been served - and often (I'm guessing) they're identifying something personal in their own lives that they relate with - on either side of the situation.
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
Do you feel the same, even about serial child molesters? NOT equating what Chris Brown did with child molestation, but the question is valid.
- Tad
Oh Tad, that is a can of worms question...very valid question, but very different type of situation. Chris Brown & Rihanna are both adults. Serial child molesters target people who are not in a position of consent to begin with. That places the molester in a *very* different position (pun unintended).
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
Tad, that is a sticky issue. In a black and white world, I would say that is a person did their time and was 'rehabilitated' then yes. But in reality this is rarely the case. No one can say for sure that someone is really 'rehabilitated' and statistics show that this is rarely the case with these types of people.
- Jeff P. Henderson
If a serial child molester did their time or whatever and came out alive after not being murdered by their fellow inmates, I wouldn't hold a grudge against them. I wouldn't wish any ill will towards them. I wouldn't forget what they did, though. I also wouldn't let them anywhere near my kids.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Exactly, Jeff. Both are crimes of "control" - that is one trait they have in common. But the dimensions of difference are not remotely comparable. Sexual predators cannot be (based on everything I've read) be rehabilitated; whereas someone with anger management/cycle of violence tendencies *can* be, if they make the conscious effort. It's like trying to equate heroine addiction to caffeine addiction...
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
(Coach - you basically just provided the same sentiment I gave where Brown is concerned. *chuckle* Once time is served and the debt "repaid" to society, I wouldn't harbor any ill...but I certainly wouldn't trust him.)
- ProsePetals (aka Denise)
There is so much humanity hanging out to dry in this thread, it's painful. Violence, male/female double-standards in domestic abuse, personal vs. societal justice system impedance mismatch, children caught in the middle, living through unthinkable dilemmas — it's all there and more. Like I said, painful - and deeply rooted. But at least in a forum such as this the unspoken can be said. It's critical to understanding your fellow human being; and, for some, it helps in rebuilding a life.
- Micah Wittman
Rahsheen, would you want to live next door to the convicted child molester once he had done his time? Would you want your young daughter to live next door to him? For most people the answer is no. It should be yes, but the reality of it is that people are very hesitant to forgive or to believe that these people are now safe to be around. This is the dilemma that is faced by every city once a violent sex offender is released from prison. It is happening in East Palo Alto California right now as we speak.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Society collectively shuns criminals after their punishment (imo) to show that society does not accept the behavior. It's punishment to pick up trash on the side of the highway for 150 hours, but what trust have you built by doing that? Hating someone is extreme when you don't know them, but the feeling of betrayal for supporting a celebrity and the disgust at illegal/immoral behaviors...
more...
- Heather
Rah's viewpoint can only come from someone that sees these people a part of his community, which is very admirable. I agree with Tad that "A hallmark of a man is self control." Repentance (or whatever you would call it) and personal improvement are other wonderful hallmarks. Human society has historically discarded people that fall outside the boundaries of acceptable behavior. Most of...
more...
- Marco
Micah, the problem is that the court system has this double standard built into it also. It can be a very unfair and unjust system.
- Jeff P. Henderson
I would say that sexual predators are definitely a special case and the fact that I would even be alerted or could find out that my neighbor was one based on our current laws is a whole different can of worms. On another note, does anyone realize how much better off we would be if we actually did forgive people after they'd done their time? Maybe they *would* change their behavior, knowing that they could have a new start, but most will never be redeemed.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
The problem is that many violent criminals, especially sex offenders are mentally ill and can not use common reason. So knowing that they would be forgiven and could have a new start would not be an incentive to stay clean after they had done their time.
- Jeff P. Henderson
The Smoking Gun has Brown's March arrest record: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive.... I hear where you're coming from, Rahsheen, and I feel for the circumstance that you describe, BUT somewhere between 40% and 70% of women who are killed each year are murdered by husbands or boyfriends (source: WHO; stats do not include rape). This is not forgivable. As a...
more...
- Yvette Ferry
Rah, you have your anecdotal evidence; I have my former roommate's, her friend's, & can get more. Stories of female aggression vs males aren't the norm. Where're HIS bruise & bite marks? Doesn't mean it didn't happen; just means your anecdote can't help CB. I think it's possible for a larger, stronger individual to restrain another w/o pummeling/biting. To be forgiven, one must desire &...
more...
- MiniMage - HLtW
I am not trying to help CB. I'm trying to help those that are violently against him. I don't care about Brown either.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I'm not sure 'stfu' will feel like help, Rahsheen. My point being, if that isn't the way you felt minutes after typing it, how do you know others aren't just reacting from their own places of hurt and frustration, too?
- Kisha, Well Conditioned
from BuddyFeed
I said a lot more than STFU in this thread. If people are reacting based on "their own places of hurt", that's even more reason for them to step back and actually THINK about what they're feeling. The tweet that started this convo was RT'd with everything after the ? cut off, which just fueled the fire. Nobody actually got the point of what I was saying.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Very good point, Fikisha! Even if they weren't identifying in some way, people hate being conned, especially by those who have/had it much better. Maybe there's some jealousy in there, and they don't want him to regain a status they could never have, especially since he lost it by acting like he could do whatever he pleased, law and the well-being of others be damned.
- MiniMage - HLtW
*nodding* I know you said more than that. Feelings and responses so close to the sentencing may very well be transitory, is my point. Your comments have been much more reasoned since the one I referenced. I think there will be a dropoff.
- Kisha, Well Conditioned
from BuddyFeed
It's admirable that you wish society as a whole was much more forgiving but there are some things that are hard to forgive. For me it is very hard to be objective about these issues. Do I hate Chris Brown? Do I wish him dead? Do I wish him ill? No. But neither do I respect or like what I know of him. Now, I don't want to seem to be picking on you but when you make such a statement, you...
more...
- pea
I think we should be more forgiving of criminals, but their punishment should not just be locking them up with other criminals for a while. To forgive there needs to be some level of trust, and rehab combined with some sort of effort to prove they actually learned/felt bad could be capable of that. Also, about how male victims are treated differently, it seems to be a horrible loop....
more...
- Heather
Forgiving a sex offender doesn't mean I'm going to let them babysit my kids. It means I'm going to give them a fair chance to redeem themselves. Yes, he beat her. He went to court. He was judged. The case is over at this point. Where would we be as a society if we actually forgave those that served their punishment and gave them a chance and redemption?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I also don't understand why people make assumptions about how Chris Brown feels about the situation based on random paparazzi footage and an old interview.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
How old was the interview?
- Johnny Worthington
I actually have no clue and could be wrong on that part. I thought I'd heard on TV it was recorded a while back, but only now released.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
i'm gonna repost this cuz i think i placed it in the middle of a discussion about pedophiles and was consequently ignored:
- Marco
Rah's viewpoint can only come from someone that sees these people a part of his community, which is very admirable. I agree with Tad that "A hallmark of a man is self control." Repentance (or whatever you would call it) and personal improvement are other wonderful hallmarks. Human society has historically discarded people that fall outside the boundaries of acceptable behavior. Most of...
more...
- Marco
With regards to Vick - While I think of what he did with the dogs as deplorable, and personally think he should never have the opportunity to own pets of any kind again, he did his time. He's still doing his penance, or trying to, and as such, deserves a chance to prove that he has changed. He appears, in the interviews I've seen, to actually understand what he did, and feel remorse for...
more...
- Bette Cooper
^^That!
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
A law enforcement officer once told me if he had to respond to a domestic violence call, and both people were pointing fingers at each other, if one had bruises and the other didn't, he wouldn't be arresting the one WlTH bruises.
- MiniMage - HLtW
If you cheat on a test, your a cheater. If you steal a candy bar, your a thief. If you force dogs to fight each other and kill the ones that don't make it, your an animal abuser. If you beat the shit out of a woman your a woman beater. If you get your dick sucked in the White House, your re-elected. :D
- CW™
You don't think MOST of the presidents had that? They were married, and that was home for most, I believe.
- MiniMage - HLtW
What's the point in all that labeling? Think back in your life. How many things have you done once that you would feel justified in being known as for the rest of your life?
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
again with the "once?"
- MiniMage - HLtW
Well, Harpo beat Sofia but he's no woman beater. Tho, he was beaten by his woman... #Trigonomics
- Outsanity
Ok, a few times. Does it make a difference? Especially when it turns into "possibly did", "almost did", and here say....
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Seriously, if one actually thinks hitting a woman is wrong, and is no woman-beater, wouldn't he be so shocked at his behavior after the 1st, maybe 2nd blow, that he wouldn't keep going and throw in a bite and a choke for good measure? If not, at what point does his non-woman-beating dimwit brain tell him that this isn't what he does (especially to someone he professes to love) and make him stop? [edit: fixed to avoid confusion]
- MiniMage - HLtW
And what's to say that she didn't keep attacking him to provoke the 2nd and 3rd blow? Just because he didn't come away with much damage doesn't mean he was the aggressor. This is my reason in repeatedly pointing out the fact that we don't know what happened.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I can concede we can't be 100% certain, but I fail to see the logic in the idea that someone getting her butt whipped by a larger, stronger opponent would keep fighting when the opponent had a desire to stop, & that she would be able to do it w/o leaving a mark on the apparent Ninja, so as to deceive investigators & everyone else involved in determining the truth. There might be logic...
more...
- MiniMage - HLtW
Rahseen, let's assume, for argument, that she went after him, passionately. Let's say she called him every name in the book and kicked him, hit him, slapped him, punched him. That makes her an ass. There would be no excuse for that behavior, and it doesn't justify her being beaten up. Her blood was found all over the interior of his car. This doesn't happen when you are trying to...
more...
- Yvette Ferry
Bull. The average person is not trained to restrain people. All you can think of in the heat of the moment is what to do to keep this person from killing you. If you have never been attacked physically and out of the blue, you may not understand, but your first reaction is not "Oh, let me restrain this out of control person without harming them because they are obviously out of their mind right now"
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Ha! I'm a scrawny girl. If someone punched me, I would break in two and die. I can't physically restrain anybody. However, you would not have to beat me bloody to physically restrain me, or most women. I have been suddenly assaulted by a mugger who broke my rib and a finger, and I was attacked once by someone who broke my jaw. I (skinny ballerina girl) defended myself, each time. It's what you do, by instinct.
- Yvette Ferry
Not trying to diminish your experience, Rahsheen. My opinion is not more valuable than yours, or anyone else's. I'm just trying to say that our condoning violence is dangerous. And we are programmed to dislike domestic violence, and I think this is a good and positive thing.
- Yvette Ferry
I don't think this is about /condoning/ violence, though; it's about not raging violently and endlessly about some event where the facts aren't actually known.
- Tristan Seligmann
Tristan, what other facts would we need, here, in order to form informed opinions?
- Yvette Ferry
Why *would* Chris Brown, an R&B artist, suddenly and violently attack a small women with whom he is romantically involved? Either he's insane, or maybe she just wouldn't stop coming at him with a stilleto. Maybe because he was sleeping with someone else? I dunno. I wasn't there, but that's also why I have no STRONG opinion about what happened....because I don't know what happened and neither party is saying what happened. Has Rihanna come out and said anything? Not that I recall....
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I have no idea. But are you saying that, if she was beaten bloody, she might have brought it on herself, and so the world should not judge the guy who beat her up?
- Yvette Ferry
Its because the assumption is that he (like so many other people that commit a serious offense) built up to it, and that what we saw was the end result of a pattern of abuse as opposed to a single, regrettable lapse in judgment.
- J. Abdul-Qahhar
I HIGHLY doubt Rah is saying that, Yvette... what I believe he's trying to say is that, without knowing the whole story, and in spite of what the papers, radio, TV, and internet say, we don't know the whole story, getting worked up to the point of extreme emotions over someone who may or may not care that people are having that kind of reaction, is a waste of time. I believe, completely...
more...
- Bette Cooper
Assumptions. Exactly.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
so just clarifying, if i rob a bank, but I only do it once I am not a bank robber? Interesting legal framework ya' got goin' there.
- Bahiyyih
Has nothing to do with legality. It has to do with labeling people based on one incident. Someone who has one drink is not suddenly an alcoholic. Someone who owns one fancy tech gadget is not suddenly a geek. Someone who beds one woman is not necessarily a ladies man. Reading one book doesn't make you a bookworm.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Woman is singular. Therefore if you beat one woman you are a woman beater by definition.
- Benjamin Golub
from fftogo
*blink* and you're serious. "Why *would* Chris Brown, an R&B artist, suddenly and violently attack a small women with whom he is romantically involved?" BECAUSE. THAT'S. WHAT. ABUSERS. DO. i saw a man grab a woman around the throat and push her into a wall for way way less than what rihanna supposedly did. i've had friends assaulted for way less. HE BEAT HER ASS BECAUSE HE COULD....
more...
- tiffany
If he did it once, he'll do it again. Apparently this incident was a "did it again" that would make him a woman beater, abuser. This time I would say he brutalized her. This is a terrible story but there are women who LIVE this daily. To lessen the impact of what he did flies in the face of all those women who have been abused and are being abused right now. I can't get with it AT ALL.
- Michelle
I find it odd that a court finding of guilt is not enough to judge whether or not someone did the wrong thing. Rah, I see you saying the finding of guilt should be enough, but also we shouldn't assume he's guilty. I don't understand how those things go together. Yes, she could have been verbally abusing him, or physically gone after him. But what he did was not just enough to protect...
more...
- Heather
Not saying whether he did the wrong thing or not, just saying that labeling him a woman beater is a bit much to me. Also, if she was actually being aggressive, we can't assume that she stopped being a threat at some point just because she had bumps and bruises.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Thanks, tiffany. Your comment exactly shows what I don't like about this whole situation. I'm done. I guess it's not possible for some people to look at this situation objectively and I think I've pretty much fully explained my POV, but it's like no one is actually hearing me. Which is fine. For the record: I don't condone what he did. I'm not trying to downplay shit. I just think many...
more...
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
I know he's done with it, but I wish someone could explain to me how anyone could be 50/50 on it. A car is not an apartment with one door out; how the heck could she have forced him to fight her? You open the car door; you get out. Men's shoes are easier to run in. Men run faster. Talk about projecting a personal experience. I know I'd be pretty upset, if I'd ever done anything to help...
more...
- MiniMage - HLtW
(Image) - http://mokargas.soup.io/post...
 |
Mert Erkol, CannonGod, Leandro Ardissone ⍨ and 88 other people liked this
What the heck is even going on here?
- Kyle Wegner
Maybe he has a Saturday Night Fever
- Johnny Worthington
Fire-ants in his pant? Stop, Drop and Roll!
- Dean "Karnatos" Michaud
lol! it looks like someone has dropped a spider down his back
- Jay
Quite clearly they are all on a spaceship anchored close to the sun... This guy's gravity boots malfunction, causing him to be pulled towards the sun's great gravity
- Johnny Worthington
Here's the video, with audio http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Ken Sheppardson
It happened live on one of the biggest Turkish TV channel.
- Jacque
guys, he's barrel-rolling.
- bora "head" basman
If I'm not mistaken, sabri bey: Havada durdum şahitlerim var.
- Ken Sheppardson
Ken this means "I floated on the air and I have witnesses".. Aha the guy is really out of his mind.
- Jacque
Looks like the other guy is a politician. So, this guy is just terribly offended by what Mr. Politico said, he had to roll away.
- Yolanda
Poor guy was intended to convince people that he can float on the air... As far as I remember, he got kicked out of the studio right after this... Sooo ridiculous!!! haha
- Onur Kabadayi
really?! ahaha!
- Jay
I dunno, just find it hilarious how quickly the guy changes demeanor
- Mo Kargas
This guy must be on acid.
- Peter Ghosh
Am I the only who thought "You are not the father." ?
- EricaJoy
EricaJoy, I think you just nailed it! LOL
- ha3rvey (big appetite)
Mental
- AJ Batac
He kinda did float on air there for a second.
- Josh Haley
Haha Erica
- Rodfather
This crazy man was claming that he has some unnatural abilites coming from his spiritual believes, like flying etc. Well, seeing this proves what he is capable of =)
- Hakan Deryal
lol EricaJoy
- Gus
this one is even funnier spoof : http://www.bobiler.org/t...
- Alemsah Ozturk
:)))))))))))))))))))
- Farshad
:)))))))))))))))) عجب خشانتی !
- RokhSaare
just , trying to fly - I've seen live :)
- Umut Çetinkaya
I don't know why people think this guy is weird. He came to the TV show with claiming that he can fly! I think he is very stable and rational guy. His actions reflect his ideas.
- denizoktar
look out his sigthness before taking off... he got in his airfcraft..:))
- Soner Bayır
Good one Erica ;)
- Alejandro
Wow, he just sat back down on the sofa like nothing happened. Thanks for the video link, Ken.
- Andrew C
OMG, that's weird and funny :D
- Kristian Salonen
Hey ! He is my uncle assholes ! He can really fly! Can't you see ?
- fred feed
It was a Jack Black impersonation. Not too shabby. But seriously, unreal.
- Micah Wittman
now we know how Glenn Beck's gonna react when his last sponsor ditches him.
- Joe Silence
It was a very Belushi-like stunt.
- Peter Ghosh
he believes he can fly... don`t let anything stop you dude ! keep trying :)
- Ersan Bilik
tragic!!
- Baris
Mixed Signals | Psychology Today - http://www.psychologytoday.com/article...
"How well we understand ourselves has a profound impact on our ability to navigate the social realm. In some areas, we know ourselves better than others do. But in other areas, we're so biased by our need to see ourselves in a good light that we become strangers to ourselves. By soliciting feedback from other people, we can learn more about ourselves and how we're coming off. Only by understanding how we're seen can we make sure we're sending the right signals. To be understood by others, in other words, the first step is understanding ourselves."
- Anna Lynn M.
from Bookmarklet
"In Akira Kurosawa's epic movie Rashomon, four witnesses provide only partially overlapping—and at times contradictory—accounts of the same robbery. In the same way, no single perspective on the self is complete. That's why we need to augment our self-views with the views of others, not only to overcome our personal biases, but also because other people have access to information we miss."
- Anna Lynn M.
great article!
- Melissa
I’m a Photographer, Not a Terrorist - How to Shoot in Public With Confidence - http://digital-photography-school.com/im-a-ph...
Tracy McLaughlin, James Myatt, winckel and 5 other people liked this
"These days, photographers are routinely made to feel like terrorists. Highly suspect criminal characters who must be watched closely. Case in point? Picture me walking around the Winchester Saturday market taking macro photography of the fruit & veg stalls…followed by two police officers (see the dangerous photo in this post). It happened. Seriously. Another example? Trying to photograph my son’s baptism in a privately rented swimming pool and being denied because it was ‘against child protection laws’. My son’s baptism! Once in a lifetime event, people!"
- Baard @ Pixum
from Bookmarklet
I would encourage you to support UK photographers who have been arrested under anti-terrorist legislation for taking ordinary everyday photographs. Alex Turner is one recent case > http://monaxle.com/2009... . The Not A Crime campaign is to help bring the issue to the attention of the public at large to highlight how far Britons' freedom and privacy have been eroded by arbitrary police action. The site is here > http://www.not-a-crime.com/
- winckel
Top 10 Facebook WordPress Plugin - http://blog.taragana.com/index...
|
Nilesh, John Serra, Dave and 2 other people liked this
"Bloggers are increasingly using self-hosted WordPress as their platform for voicing their thoughts. Well, it's not just because WordPress is free, but there are some cool WordPress plugins that help bloggers to plug themselves to any popular site. We had already done with Wordpress Plugins for Social Networking from your Blog. Now we decided to get you the WordPress plugins for world’s largest social networking site Facebook. It offers a great way to get highlight your WordPress blog. If you ready to share your Facebook-life with your blogging take a pick at our top 10 Facebook WordPress Plugins."
- Oğuz Serdar
from Bookmarklet
Dostum wordbook eklentisine benzer bişey arardım, görür görmez yükledim, sabahın 6'sında mutlu ettin beni... Eyvallah...
- reha37
Reha: isini gordugune sevindim, wordpress bollugu diyelim. :)
- Oğuz Serdar
Shy little biker - http://pixdaus.com/single...
Kol Tregaskes, Ksana, Iván Abrego and 8 other people liked this
Precious.
- Anne Bouey
Netflix Had Me At “We’re Sorry” - http://www.techcrunch.com/2009...
Matt Ellsworth, Peter Fedin, Shakeel Mahate and 18 other people liked this
The refund is just icing on the cake. Too many other companies not only give you no icing, and no cake, but they steal your cake, punch you in the face, and then blame you for the whole ordeal.
- MG Siegler
from Bookmarklet
I almost did a blog post as well. Yours is much more effective. :-)
- Jesse Stay
you should do one too jesse. stuff like this should be rewarded.
- MG Siegler
Agreed
- Jesse Stay
Jesse, I agree with MG. You should blog about it, too. Companies that actually care about their customers should be rewarded positively.
- Pandu ● IT Optimizer
from fftogo
I don't think a big company like Comcast or AT&T can afford to do this. It's bad econocs for a biz with few competitors to be so nice to its customers. If anyone has an example of a giant acting like Netflix, I'd love to hear it.
- Andrew Warner
from iPhone
This happened to me a while back, too. I was getting kind of irritated about not being able to watch online (which is about all I use Netflix for), but they fixed it fairly quickly, and apologized. I was actually a bit surprised at how much better it made me feel.
- Joel Webber
I sent a dvd back to Netflix and after a week or two, I noticed that they hadn't sent me a confirmation of receipt. It got lost in the mail. I guess it happens all the time for them, so it was no big deal. They simply made a note and sent my next dvd. I thought I was going to be on the phone arguing with them about the dvd and defending myself against accusations of theft. Not at all. Netflix reminds me of Amazon circa 1996...customer comes first, second, and third.
- Bryan R. Adams
I got 3% credit
- Matt Ellsworth
"Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." - Terry Pratchett.
Brome, amygeek, holly and 22 other people liked this
you're a dodo.
- pea
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish and he'll leave you alone.
- Yolanda
Set a fish on fire and you'll eat for a day. Teach a fish how to fire and you'll be running for your life. (Assuming the fish has a laser strapped to it.)
- Stephen Mack
I just LOL'd in public!
- Zulema ◕ ◡ ◕
from BuddyFeed
Hehehe....somebody said dodo. :)
- Jon, the Beartato of '10
from Android
Stephen, only Sharks are allowed to have "frickin' lasers" strapped to their backs.
- Joe "The Anvil" Pierce
Flickr: The Help Forum: [closed] Artist Joachim Schmid says Copyright doesn't exist on photo sharing sites - http://www.flickr.com/help...
Roland Hörmann, Céu de Buarque, Hariprasad and 15 other people liked this
""There’s also no general copyright protection for digital photographs found on photo sharing sites; even if the host says so. Copyright protection depends on the individual photograph’s originality." schmid.wordpress.com/about/faq/ Hoping for some clarification. I have no evidence he's appropriated anything of mine, but he has been publishing books on Blurb that use 'vernacular photographs' from photosharing sites. "The series Other People’s Photographs centers on the themes presented by everyday, amateur photographers. Images found on photo sharing sites such as Flickr have been collected and ordered in a way to form a continually expanding encyclopedic library of digital photography. Each book is comprised of images that focus on a specific photographic event or idea, the grouping of photographs revealing a language of modern vernacular photography. These books are available through my website.""
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
That's quite a strange view of copyright coming from Mr. Schmid. If as he says, "If you don’t want them to be seen by strangers you should not display them in public", then any display of copyrighted works in public (which would include museums) would automatically render them public domain. He further asserts "Copyright protection depends on the individual photograph’s originality. The...
more...
- Nils Sandin
help me out here Thomas... how does this snob get to dictate "originality"? hell most sports photographers would be assed out if this was the case. what keeps him from photocopying out of Sports Illustrated? it is public and most often unoriginal. the reason is because thy would sue the F outta him. but the little person is not so prone to take this action, leaving him to be the...
more...
- Marco
A nice example when a Flickrite fights backs: http://www.flickr.com/groups...
- Nils Sandin
I'm still trying to figure out exactly what's going on with this one but it's hard to tell. Flickr locked the thread so people can't sort it out in conversation. I think he may be using photos from Flickr and making blurb books out of them and then selling the books.
- Thomas Hawk
This dude needs to be hung by his F'ing thumbs and then some - http://schmid.wordpress.com/about...
- Brent - Loving Life
This makes me sick - http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- Brent - Loving Life
Where does this dude get off? He states he doesn't even hardly use a camera himself. I am so pissed right now ...
- Brent - Loving Life
One huge reason I don't put pictures of my kids on public web sites. I don't need some dude making a book of them.
- Kenton
yep, Thomas, that seems to be the case. they did refer him to the appropriate forum. i think it was more a matter of thread placement. it would have been nice to see some kind of official or unofficial response of reassurance from Flickr staff.
- Marco
It might be time to buy one of his books and copy all the photos in it. Maybe put them all on Flickr or something.
- Kenton
If you block someone on Flickr, does that prevent them from seeing your public images as well? If so, we should all go in and block him.
- Kenton
I added my 2¢ here as well: http://www.flickr.com/groups...
- Nils Sandin
Yes, he searches Flickr for photographs that meet his theme and then assembles them into Blurb books that he sells. No credit or compensation to the photographer. He must be unaware that there are professional and represented fine art photographers who use Flickr.
- Bryan Formhals
But basically, the photographer will new know unless they happen to buy his book or are alerted by another photographer. Not to mention his work has been discussed by two pominent photography bloggers who don't even mention anything about the theft.
- Bryan Formhals
Kenton, from what i read, no blocking someone does not stop them from viewing our images.
- Marco
Ok, fine, you get Flickr to block him. He'll just go else where and steal other works where ever he feels the need. I have my work in many places throughout the Internet. I can only hope he is the only one, which I doubt severely, doing this and that his sales are terrible.
- Brent - Loving Life
Thomas, have you seen this FF thread on a Flickr account that was deleted by someone else other than the owner? very sad there are no backups. i would have DM'd you but i can't, i don't exist in your FriendFeed ;o) http://friendfeed.com/carlina...
- Marco
Marco, I hadn't seen that. Thanks for pointing that out. That really sucks. Carlina was a contact of mine on Flickr. Flickr needs to address the restore issue sooner rather than later. Stewart Butterfield said that it was a "mistake" over 2 years ago for Flickr not to have the ability to restore deleted content.
- Thomas Hawk
Brent it looks like he's been doing it for 20 years, it is just now that he has started blatantly stealing stuff from Flickr. Unfortunately it looks like he's quite highly regarded in the European artistic community.
- Kenton
So apparently he was going around on the streets and finding photos that other people had lost or had discarded. What a life. Now the Internet appears and his hunting grounds have become much richer. He should have all computer privileges removed from him so he can go back to the streets where he started.
- Brent - Loving Life
Yes Kenton, 20 years of living off of other peoples work. I don't have words right now to describe what I think of this low life.
- Brent - Loving Life
Apparently, here is some of the work he has "lifted". Weather these made it into any of his books, I don't know. - http://foundonflickr.wordpress.com/
- Brent - Loving Life
Thomas, your persual of Flickr over ethics and copyright issues is admirable. Always interesting to read.
- Martin Bryant
from iPhone
If you can find it... and if there's something worth protecting.. there's been cases before.. http://www.out-law.com/page-84...
- Tyson
Additional Flickr discussions here: http://www.flickr.com/groups...
- Nils Sandin
Plus an update from Blurb here: https://friendfeed.com/la-pura...
- Nils Sandin
I really love some of these quotes from his FAQ's: "The collectors and museums that purchase my work do this because they appreciate the originality and quality of my work."...........I ask WHAT WORK? You're stealing other peoples work!........"Other than that I think it is more interesting to come up with one’s own ideas rather than copying existing ones.".........Then you must lead a...
more...
- ChiliMac
Other ways to read this feed:
