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ishak › Likes
The Vortex: The First Round’s on Me « The Guidewire - http://guidewiregroup.wordpress.com/2009...
ishak liked this
Just talked with Scoble for an hour on the way to SFO. Man I love talking with him. Neither of us like white papers, we like software you can use. I asked if he knows how to get a permalink to a message on FriendFeed. He says you click on the datestamp. Sure enough, it works! He says you can 2click it for a fun trick too. I haven't tried that yet.
Meryn Stol, Mathew A. Koeneker, ishak and 60 other people liked this
Wow I didn't know that trick. Thanks you two.
- anna sauce
Cool trick. I love when Scoble shares these.
- Steve Rubel
Scoble is one smart mofo, and a nice guy too.
- Dave Winer
:)
- Susan Beebe
Sweet trick, I was just looking for that...
- Thom Kennon
I would recommend they use the purple hashmark as the permalink symbol. Pretty much the standard in the blogging world (which is where permalinks come from, btw). I use a gif for the permalinks on scripting.com. http://www.scripting.com/images...
- Dave Winer
Cristo - I believe Dave was referring to Robert Scoble @Scobleizer, Alex's brother LOL
- Susan Beebe
Really, no way?
- Susan Beebe
who's Cristo?
- Thom Kennon
He *loves* FriendFeed.
- Susan Beebe
hahhaha! (Edit: I was referring to Robert Scoble)
- Susan Beebe
Oh behave Chris... Is Alex not online? :p
- Brian Daniel Eisenberg
from iPhone
2clicking the datestamp pops up the post in it's own window ..pretty sweet.
- John Blanton
I must not have my browser set up to recognize the diff. between the one-click and the texas 2 click.
- beersage
i like alex too - everytime we talk its great - same experience you mention!
- Allen Stern
Timestamp! Brilliant! I never knew until now.
- Keith Bourgoin
You should check out http://www.tweets2mail.com if you're interested as well, a service to backup your tweets (as well as friends), replies, direct messages, and mentions to your email/gmail.
- NerdyHearn
all that the second click is doing is adding a ?embed=1 to the end of the permalink... and I'm VERY surprised that Dave did not know about this since it was heavily discussed during live chats attached to the Gillmor Gang and TWiT Live streams...
- Chris Heath
That's a great tip
- James Stratford
You learn something almost every day from Scoble. Today, two things, the timestamp click AND the awesome 2click! Thankyouverymuch!
- Mark Edwards
@Anand - single click the date stamp to go to the permalink version of the post. Double click it, to open it in its own window.
- Rick Cogley
+1 what Chris Heath said. I thought this was an old thread or something. Leo Laporte has been talking about this clicking the timestamp thing for at least 3 months.
- Adam Turetzky
I was looking for this for a long time.. Robert knows everything about FF ;)
- Jacque
Me, tool. What's 2click?
- Jason Miller
Slippy it works for me in safari.
- Rick Cogley
from iPhone
wow thats cool so now i can embed a conversation Thanks a million!
- Robert Higgins
Yeah. FFundercats talked about this a long time ago.
- Rochelle
Dave, and any permalink aficionados out there: individual *comments* are reference-able too, but there's no UI exposed, so I wrote a user script (greasemonkey/greasekit) to make it accessible: http://friendfeed.com/friendf... Cheers!
- Micah
Wait until we talk about double clicking on hide! :-)
- Robert Scoble
from iPhone
Guys 2Click != DoubleClick instead 2Click=Click once + wait + Click the timestamp again, Result = new window with real time chat.... COOOOL
- Amit Nangare
What Amit said. And one benefit of either the first or the second click is that it adds a comment window at the bottom.
- Laura Norvig
wow i didn't know it was clickable ..
- deerstep
Awesome, I always wondered how to get a permalink! Thanks Dave!
- Mark Layton
Wow, I'm surprised people didn't know this. However, I'm kind of a friendfeed addict. It's a bit of a problem that so many awesome features of the UI are subtly "hidden". It keeps the interface clean, but it keeps newbies out of the loop and scratching their heads.
- Laura Norvig
Wow. Thanks! How is that possible that so cool features are, not hidden, but, well... not made visible? As a wise guy said once : "a feature that is not accessible could as well not exist".(I know it sucks, but it sounds so much cooler when you say it in french)
- Zackatoustra
Is KBRs Decade-Long Crime Spree Finally Coming to an End? | Corporate Accountability and WorkPlace | AlterNet - http://www.alternet.org/workpla...
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From the page: "How infuriating has it been, the last five years, watching Halliburton and KBR get away with murder? Murder, poisoning, electrocution, rape, human trafficking, fraud, bribery -- their crimes go on and on. But could their decade-long spree may be coming to an end? This year, settlements for old offenses, new exposés and new lawsuits for more recent evil-doings, have resulted in plummeting stock prices, canceled contracts, and a soon-to-be imprisoned former CEO. The latest blow came last Thursday, in a Texas court, where executives for Halliburton and KBR were described in legal papers as conducting a "reign of terror" and functioning "as criminal enterprises." Paying bribes, taking kickbacks, concealing gang rapes, and engaging in human trafficking were among the crimes listed on the May 14th complaint brought not by government or human rights lawyers, as you might expect, but by attorneys filing a class action suit for the pension fund of Detroit's Policemen and...
- Shea Gunther
Cameron Diaz has a recurring role in her movies: the crazy goofy dancer. Watching her doing it in The Sweetest Thing.
Sonos turns your iPhone into music player remote, streams new stations - http://venturebeat.com/2008...
One upshot of this election is that I'm going to study up on socialism. I want to be well versed enough that when some under-informed conservative uses "socialist" as an all purpose reflexive pejorative to anything s/he doesn't like, I want to be able to school them with Sheer Fucking Truth.
Cee Bee, Steve Lynch, AJ Kohn and 10 other people liked this
Have you read "The Peoples' History of the United States" by Howard Zinn?
- Brian Russell
from twhirl
No, I've never read anything by Zinn. I'll add that to the list. I'm sure that will put me on a watchlist somewhere.
- Dave Slusher
Communism and socialism are not the same thing in any case. Surely, actions that work are more important than labels, and merely ideological ones at that.
- Ian May
Nice!
- chris yale
My main thing is that I want to be able to recite some chapter and verse to point out why people are wrong. I already know it is intellectual laziness of the worst kind to call borderline right-winger Obama socialist, I just don't have the underpinnings to really dial in why.
- Dave Slusher
a personal and thus biased look: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news...
- Bora Zivkovic
You think Obama is right wing? Why?
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
@Dave: because labels are just plain wrong. there's no such thing as "A Socialist". it's too vague and generalizing. besides, this country already has socialist policies (kickbacks to farmers for destroying crops, medicare, welfare, etc). the best response is getting the nutjob to specifically identify the issue they have, and deal with the term "socialist" the way someone deals with racism or other generalisms...
- Jeremy Toeman
What I love is the bailing out bonds from our collective taxes is not considered socialist, but opening up the government worker's health insurance plan to the general public, if the citizen wants it (not required) *is* socialist. Seems contradictory, no?
- anna sauce
If you want to understand socialism, read "The Road to Serfdom" by F.A. Hayek.
- Steve Olson
Most sane people would consider Obama centrist, or center-left at the most.
- Victor Ganata
I imagine Sheer Fucking Truth will at worst only hobble them a little. It sure as hell won't stop them.
- Victor Ganata
In comparison to the European spectrum, Obama is slightly right of center. Which makes him very Left in the USA, I guess.
- Bora Zivkovic
Too true Bora, too true.
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
As a European I agree with Bora. The Dems are definitely right of centre.
- Sally Church
Note I say "borderline" and people think I say "way on the other side". Nuance, people! Always accepts right wing frames, willing to mix church and state, support for civil rights fight tapers off at the gay boundary, weak on health care, weak on FISA and fighting for civil liberties. I want to hear specifics on restoring presidency to pre-Bush/Cheney operation as 1 of 3 branches of balanced powers.
- Dave Slusher
...which makes Repubs so far Right they fall off the coordinate system...
- Bora Zivkovic
Yes, Dave, I'm sorry if I made it sound like you said "far right", I wanted to hear why you thought that...
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
The sad truth is as much loathing as I have for his results, Ralph Nader was mostly right in 2000. Our left wing is still corporatist to an alarming degree. He was dead wrong that Gore was indistinguishable from Bush but in the larger sense, both Dem and GOP are covered in the lint from being in the same pockets.
- Dave Slusher
Yeah, that's why I like Obama more than Hillary...Hillary was way deep in the corporate pockets and Obama seems a lot less so, but you know he still is as that's what it takes to win an election these days, I think.
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
Issues that are important to me: progressive taxation; universal health care; universal civil liberties; restoring balance of governmental powers; withdrawal from Iraq; reducing corporate control of government; restoring anti-trust laws; rolling back media consolidations; fixing crooked voting machines; reducing the power of the prison-industrial complex; restoring habeas corpus and eminent domain to pre-Bush/Cheney era status
- Dave Slusher
Those are all good, but what about restoring our place as a leader in K-12 education?
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
Only so much room in the box, list not comprehensive. Yes on that, no on gutting science education because it offends some people's faith in Jesus. No on commingling religion and government. Yes on diplomacy above military intervention. Yes on rebuilding New Orleans before fucking Baghdad and fixing our bridges and canals, et al right at home. Yes on reducing poverty and reducing income disparity. Yes on RESTORING THE GI BILL which led to MUCH WEALTH CREATION in the 50s and 60s!
- Dave Slusher
Yeah, I'm down with that. +100
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
Yes on alternative energy which will CREATE MUCH NEW WEALTH! Yes on reducing farm subsidies, on subsidizing industrial farms over the family farms, on making unhealthy food cheaper than healthy. No on letting companies externalize their costs to the public while keeping their profits private. That goes 10X for the bailouts. Not only do I want golden parachutes stripped, I want to see fraudster CEOs frogmarched to jail.
- Dave Slusher
@Dave: +101.
- AJ Kohn
Too bad I'm already subscribed to you, Dave, or I'd subscribe to you.
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
I get a little thrill when either Duncan Riley or Mona likes my stuff. Is that weird?
Benedikt Koehler, Dani Radu, Steve Chou and 41 other people liked this
Yes.
- Akiva
He IS human!
- FFing Enigma
The Duncan part.
- Oldengrey (Jay)
Tina: don't get carried away!
- Robert Scoble
Hah!!
- Rah-PM 2012
Robert, it's no fun if I don't get carried away =P
- FFing Enigma
I get a thrill any time someone likes my stuff or comments.
- MiniMage, enterRUPPted
+10 MiniMage
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
God bless duncan riley for raising the bar across the board. he's a ballsy dude. :)
- Patricia
I get a kick out of seeing certain names, that's for sure.
- Neal "thePuck" Jansons
from twhirl
I get thrill when I see Robert Scoble like my stuff... cool
- Wayne Sutton
Robert, I like your stuff too. (pout)
- Jesse Stay
That's about 20 thrills right there!
- MiniMage, enterRUPPted
I like both Duncan and Mona a lot and it's always nice to see them like my stuff.
- AJ Kohn
I was kinda surprised when you started following me the other day. That was, wait let me say it like you would say it MONDO COOL!
- Vicarbott
same here! mark of excellence :) plus instant SHARE impact! w00t! same w/ you!
- Susan Beebe
me too- a bit of a frisson
- anna sauce
Totally normal :)
- Sarah Perez
I shamefully excited when a post of mine pulls a "like" from someone who I know has a ton of followers. Don't hate me!
- Daniel J. Pritchett
I get a thrill when Mona goes ALL CAPS :-)
- Majento
I get excited about Mona, Duncan, and you Robert, and Chris Pirillo and... I can't lie, I get excited when anyone likes/comments on my stuff. It's nice to 1) have your contributions validated and 2) make a connection with other people. It seems especially cool when you know those people from outside the context of FriendFeed (because they have some degree of fame on the web or even TV) or they are a star here in their own right.
- Lindsay
Anyone would
- Lataz.com
Its possible I just taught my children a rather inappropriate ass shaking dance
Nicholas Kreidberg, pcnerd37, Zulema ⋅ spicy cocoa tart and 5 other people liked this
mom of the m'fing year
- Erin @queenofspain
inappropriate is such a relative term
- Marco(aureliusmaximus)
Please tell me it wasn't the Dutty Wine...
- Shey
I love the word inappropriate.
- Pete D
Those of you who missed the Tochidot (Sekai Camera) demo, stop asking what it does. Just wait for the video to be reposted.
Sean McBride, Elliott Ng, ishak and 2 other people liked this
What does the Tochidot do?
- Scoble, Alex Scoble
What does it do?
- Selma
Waiting.
- Roberto Bonini
Google search says Tonchidot does augmented reality. :D
- Tanath
What does Tochidot (Sekai Camera) do?
- Scott Jarkoff
Tell me what it does now Scoble.
- Morgan Warstler
Morgan: you aim your iphone at something, like the Statue of Liberty, and it shows you notes, audio recordings, and other media files (they call them tags) on top of the video of the Statue of Liberty. Very futuristic. But you gotta see it to really get why it was a great demo. Might not be a great product, though. We've got to have it to play with it to decide that.
- Robert Scoble
Tonchibot Demo video on youtube http://jp.youtube.com/watch...
- Andrew Leyden
Isn't this similar to what the sunglasses do in William Gibson's "Virtual Light?"
- Karim
That's a cool video but it made my arm really tired.
- Brian Hendrickson
Chrome is more proof that Google has been taken over by Microsoft. Not one new idea in this mama. It's dull.
Jeff (Team マクダジ ), Gavin, sean percival and 4 other people liked this
Fast though :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
who cares about new ideas. i like it that people are acting on ideas we have already had but nobody has actually made happen yet. +1 google
- Tyler Gillies
Dave this is a beta release, it isn't even at Version 1.0 yet. I'm sure Firefox 1 or IE 1 were not feature rich
- MarkFromIreland
it's version 0.2 in fact
- MarkFromIreland
I love it
- Stefan Hayden
If you read the comic, they were more worried about memory/performance than features. This is meant to be an app platform.
- Brad Nickel
And if stability and performance are delivered, then I am a happy happy customer!
- Brad Nickel
I thought being able to drag a tab out and back in again was interesting (don't know why I would do it, but interesting)
- Jason (not an Argonaut)
all the new ideas are working behind the scenes. At least that's what the comic told me. :)
- Rahul Das
When will Firefox assimilate all of the goodness contained in Chrome?
- Daniel J. Pritchett
Says the guy who's built what, FlickrFan? More evidence of how out-of-touch Winer is with technology.
- abacab
You're all making excuses -- I'm looking for some EXCITEMENT -- not things that should be exciting, or would be exciting if I understood them, but things that actually are exciting -- you know -- like the web was when it first came out.
- Dave Winer
You mean, like RSS, Dave? OMG, that was HAWT. Whoever came up with that is a fucking GENIUS.
- abacab
So Dave, you are unsatisfied, I am satisfied and abacab is just mean. By the way abacab, ever heard of RSS?
- Brad Nickel
I agree
- orionstarr
Heh. Pretty sure this abacadab idiot is actually a robot, a Turing Machine, impersonating an asshole, and doing a pretty damned good job! Anyway, I hope Google comes up with something interesting, for now no reason to switch from Firefox.
- Dave Winer
I do agree with Dave on this. Google, once a trend-setter, now looks more like a trend-follower. IMO this is part of lifecycle of any company, even what many thought was one of the most innovative companies. They took many already ideas and redndered them slick, neat, slightly different here and there and a little bit faster. Then they attached Google name to it and here it goes with all the fuss and buzz that the Google brand brings about!
- Hayk
I'm composed entirely of RSS. Go figure.
- abacab
Dave: Chrome is to browsing what Twitter was to blogging. Twitter didn't bring anything new either. Just forced us to blog 140 characters at a time, if you look at it the right way. Chrome has much cleaner UI and is much faster in my first hours of tests.
- Robert Scoble
so a lower memory footprint and faster response times aren't exciting? man. I wish I lived in a world with hardware that was so fast that everything was already awesome when it comes to browser speed and memory usage.
- Jason B.
I'm totally loving Chrome - once it gets beefed up with my favorite plugins it'll become my default browser.
- iTad
New ideas are nice and all so long as they are good but if old ideas are not broken then there's no need to fix them.
- Kol Tregaskes
I want to try it too. :(
- Lindsay
Maybe we should give Google time. They probably will add more things to it. It does look like any other browser, but it is fast.
- Mol, FF Music Lover
Yeah, it's totally dull. Blazingly fast, simple, and stable. How boring. (Wait, you said *Microsoft*? Sure that's the right metaphor?)
- Peter Kirn
from twhirl
disagree, task manager in browser is huge. Now I can kill pesky tabs without losing all other tabs
- sean percival
Was search original? No! Was Adsense original? No! Was gmail original? No! But they just did it better. The same with Chrome. They just do it better!
- Gavin
It's dull as a browser but potentially exciting as a cross device application platform. All the typical built-in browser goodness will be in applications run like any other program. What's under the hood is hidden, but is what we should be looking at.
- Todd Hoff
@Robert Scoble - chrome does have a cleaner UI than IE/FF - but i still think the Safari UI is a nicer experience.
- Steven Livingstone-Pérez
from twhirl
@Steven: Too bad that Safari will never be ported over to Linux. But Chrome will be.
- Wizetux
"I don't care if there's one fewer cool feature. I just want this product to be ROCK SOLID" - Page 11 - Google Chrome Book. http://www.google.com/googleb...
- RAD Moose
[Engadget]: CTL releasing Atom-powered 2go nettop for $149 - http://x.techwheat.com/1Z3
ishak and Dave Winer liked this
"Desktops CTL, the same cats who brought us the 2go PC laptop , are apparently working up an equally cheap and not-exactly-flashy nettop PC. "
- tech.newsjunk.com
There are so many people who write about Twitter, FriendFeed, etc. these days that I don't bother now. Why add to the noise?
Kate, Kol Tregaskes, Mrinal Desai and 16 other people liked this
I look at it like this: if I were a carpenter, surely I would talk about something other than hammers and nails all day long. Perhaps I'd talk about the house I'm building, the new carpentry regulations, how my boss is a butt munch or the architect is an asshat. Whatever, but it would involve more than going on ad nauseum about the tools I use.
- FFing Enigma
Want to talk about Washing Machines? I'll be seeing the latest tomorrow. :-)
- Robert Scoble
Likewise, Mark. But sometimes, you just can't help yourself :P. I think I'm over it now though.
- Shey
is anyone into rubberbands? i like the way they stretch sometimes and hold stuff at other times. all hail rubberbands!
- Cee Bee
let's talk about ubiquity instead!
- J450N
What happens if you put a rubber band into a washing machine?
- Ontario Emperor
from fftogo
Stupid Blogger - amen.
- Mark Dykeman
Robert, don't get me started on Washing Machines. The Japanese kick our ass. The machines have fuzzy logic built in so that you put in your clothing and soap and press start. It figures out the rest. The same with dryers. The japanese have done a lot of this kind of stuff with all sorts of machinery.
- Rob Diana
Ontario: you get a clean rubber band.
- Robert Scoble
ishak - it's not that people aren't writing good stuff about it. I benefit from learning about what's in the new FriendFeed Beta and changes to other Web 2.0 services. But after the bigger blogs write about it... they usually cover it pretty damned well. Why add to the noise?
- Mark Dykeman
Robert: actually, I'm interested in dryers - I think we need a new one. Thks.
- Mark Dykeman
CeeBee - I responded on Twitter, but I'll just state my preference for paper clips and those bad@ass bigger ones here.
- Mark Dykeman
Shey: none of us can help ourselves about these services. Look at this comment stream as an example!
- Mark Dykeman
lol. i got it. to answer the question, i guess some people are genuinely interested in discussing these services and/or issues that pertain to them, but they easily take on a life of their own a lot of the time, which kind of contributes to another group of people going against the grain and wanting to have little to do with these services or discussions. it's like beating a dead horse.
- Cee Bee
We continue contributing because not everyone follows the same info source. I re-share because it's helpful to my network.
- Glenn Batuyong
Twitter and FriendFeed need the noise to work. You have to feed the seven-headed hydra or it will eat you.
- LinkingIndiana
Glenn: resharing... you've got a good point there and I get that. it does get a bit noisy when audiences overlap, but if you're part of a group that isn't so familiar with the technologies, then your input can be very valuable to them. Fair point.
- Mark Dykeman
@indymike - fear the 7 headed hydra, more fearsome than 3 headed Cerebus!
- Mark Dykeman
It's the one thing WE KNOW we all have in common. ;)
- tehKenny
@tehkenny - good point about things in common.... who are you again? ;)
- Mark Dykeman
right. as i tweeted yesterday (http://tinyurl.com/6z2ory) ... "Twitter is like the street. So, why are washingtonpost and other news companies still writing about the street?! http://tinyurl.com/5cmfm2"
- Kevin Sablan
from twhirl
@Vincent - yes, and I'm not as interested in these topics as I used to be, so until I find the right opportunity or slant, I probably won't write about them.
- Mark Dykeman
@Mark I'm juss dis guy, yu know?
- tehKenny
@tehkenny - sounds like a Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy reference to me!
- Mark Dykeman
That's part of switching from Stage 2 to Stage 3 of an early adopter. Others will continue to fly the flag while you can just enjoy using the service.
- Louis Gray
@Louis - works for me.
- Mark Dykeman
Thank You!
- Jeff P. Henderson
How to Use Friendfeed as a Collaborative Business Tool - http://www.chrisbrogan.com/how-to-...
Ms_Krista, Brad Garland, Jim Swi.... and 28 other people liked this
finally one of the sharing and/or micromedia sites got the simple group thing right - this is working well for us with the Social Media Club room which replaced our mailing list - it is also working pretty well for a research project at my agency we just started yesterday
- Chris Heuer
I have added the Friendfeed app to my Facebook profile. I love how I can share something from my Google Reader, then it shows up on Friendfeed, Facebook, Blog Catalog, MyBlogLog, etc. I can have activity in many places with one click!
- Mary-Lynn
@ejang can you elaborate what you envision being a Social Media Newsroom using Seesmic? Would love your thoughts, thanks
Hayk, Sameer, ishak and 6 other people liked this
can i just pop in here? it's one thing to have us un(der)informed masses gabbing about breaking news, but when people post breaking news, there's always that huge gap of space while others wait for verification. if there were credentialed people on seesmic verifying news, that lapse when things are urgent won't happen.
- Anika
Gregory and Faboo Mama, thanks, interesting, could you also tell me how you would see it. Read: what would you do if you were in my shoes to make it happen?
- Loic Le Meur
whether you hire staff or just try to get users credentialed, that's up to you. but across all subject matter, it would be nice to have an "authority" on there. so say for politics, you should have tried to credentialed some people for the DNC and RNC conventions. real time conversations with delegates, politicians and all that stuff. locally, i use seesmic to get a take on angelenos state of mind. i am going to interview local politicians via seesmic that sort of stuff.
- Anika
but anything your 'citizen journalists' create can be edited in your office and posted like seesmix or newspop. imo, creating this under newspop would give you a lot more content from places that rachael can't get to.
- Anika
Agree with Faboo Mama. kind of a Mahalo-like news emission. Also, if there would be a way for users to specify keywords like "business," "politics" etc which would become topics of those news emissions.. like watch-words when they pop-up in some news or media outlet, they are somehow vblogged by volunteer Seesmic users or dedicated stuff and put on Seesmic.
- Hayk
Loic talk to David C of SPot.us he heads up a crowd sourcing journalist effort
- Fred Grott
sounds a bit controlled. I don't like this newsroom idea even though I know it will make you a lot of money Loic. It has too much pretension towards interactivity when the reality is television on demand. On a theoretical playing field this is the lowest common denominator... but then again so in porn. Have fun kids!
- NoahDavidSimon
Faboo and Hayk interesting, would you pay them or just promote them? I don't have an investment budget for that... This business model has been tried by many and failed up to now. Mahalo is a good example (not failed) where everybody is just doing it for fun I guess.
- Loic Le Meur
Why not partner with journalism schools? Also second the motion to talk to digitaldave@twitter (David Cohn)
- Howard Rheingold
Mark, yes, will write a blog post about this soon
- Loic Le Meur
Loic also check out Current.TV - they have user-generated news shows too. An Al Gore company. I can introduce you to the CEO and COO if you are interested
- Chris Saad
I mean that Micro interactions with brands are very powerful tools for marketers to engage with users. Not only News and press release can do but also seesmic release can do.
- Ejang
that's the beauty of it, there's so many people online willing to whore themselves out for a logo behind them, they'll do it for free as long as they get promoted, credentialed and have access to contacts. As Chris said, look at CurrentTV. There's a lot of good content there being generated by users. Granted a lot of those users are film school students, rich kids, or people with gov't backing, but for the most part, the content is good. There's just nothing really "current", nor is there conversation.
- Anika
thank you so much all, I am digesting all your comments please keep them coming!
- Loic Le Meur
i am working on a news information sharing idea and have a site WOT News being finalised, a citizen journalism site so to speak. Would love to have a chat sometime...if you are interested.
- Don
I think you & Pitch Engine could find a way to revolutionize social releases.I was thinking the other day,you'd be a great fit!
- lonnie b hodge
Don, would love it. lonnie, will definitely talk to pitch engine
- Loic Le Meur
Loic, do you think about adding a Skype-like calling feat to Seesmic: calling real time/ video conferencing? and surely someone must have mentionned the topical videos. Not only crowd sourcing journalism volunteers - BE sure there are many who would willingly do that off their work and time. Topical videos like social media issues, leadership, how to start a company, etc. IMO there is a HUGE cash-in possibility. Say a video of 5mins feating advice from some VC (?) for 99cents or smth like that?
- Hayk
Hayk thank you very very interesting
- Loic Le Meur
Presidential Era Gas Prices - http://bitsandpieces.us/2008...
Grant Bierman, Steve Rubel, David Cook and 13 other people liked this
Here's the interesting bit for me... Plus and Premium are still 10 cents apart. So the price for Regular has increased 352%, but Plus only 300% and Premium by 274%. Over time, assuming the 10 cent gap is a hard and fast guide to gas stations, it may be more economical even for drivers with boring cars that don't need it to get the highest quality fuel? (In other words, why not have a 30 cent gap between each level?)
- Louis Gray
we're still paying $7 more than that in the UK so count yourselves lucky
- Phill Price
The real question... is premium subsidizing regular, vice versa, or do they all really cost the same to manufacture?
- Tinfoil 2.0
Louis: Because you want to encourage people to pay extra for the higher grade fuel? The smaller the gap, the greater the chance of upgrading.
- Andrew
Alot of nice points.
- Andrew Baron
Well, we can see here that W and Cheney have served their masters well. Really well.
- iTad
Not like Baron cares...daddy can just loan him gas money...ooops did I say that?
- Andrew Feinberg
hehe - just rabble rousing... though I'd guess that since he and cheney and rice all came from the oil industry their buddies are pretty happy
- iTad
Trish: Especially considering profits are going into the pockets of the man on the right. (our right) :)
- Mona Nomura
Bottom-right. I wouldn't doubt bottom-left too.
- ·[▪_▪]·
I just deleted a comment and blocked a person due to being lame with personal attacks esp. that have nothing to do with this article. Its the third person Ive blocked on ff. I also have blocked two people from Twitter. I'm not sure if its the right thing to do, but found myself to be happier not having to be constantly bombarded by them because I dont think they are nice or valid and actually forget about them for long periods of time.
- Andrew Baron
Actually Mona, it's more likely you and I that are the profiteers: http://www.energytomorrow.org/economy...
- Mattb4rd
Mattb4rd, sure would be nice if my funds were seeing the kinds if gains big oil are. Besides, there are probably many investors that don't invest in funds that invest in fossil fuel related industries on moral grounds. Similar to not invest in the tobacco industry. Personally, when I invest in energy, I prefer to invest my money in renewable. So I don't own any big oil.
- ·[▪_▪]·
@Andrew I hope I'm not one that you blocked. My link to the Obama / X!a photos is editorial commentary. One thing has nothing to do with the other. It's the same as your photos in my opinion.
- Mattb4rd
@nicerobot Find a new mutual fund or 401K. Mine have averaged better than double digits for decades. Big oil nets around 9%.
- Mattb4rd
Andrew, about the blocking. It's your purgative. My personal opinion is to never delete a comment but blocking persons whose content you have decided you never want to see is completely reasonable.
- ·[▪_▪]·
Andrew: life is too short to deal with jerks :)
- Mona Nomura
Finally. +1 Aaron :)
- Mattb4rd
Are you saying 16 years of inflation should lead to a 4x multiplier?
- Jason Carreira
I'm talking about these kinds of percentages: "Exxon Rides Oil and Gas Prices to 36% Gain in Profit" http://www.nytimes.com/2006... "reported a 33 percent gain in second-quarter profit" "Profit from oil and gas sales climbed 68 percent to $10 billion" http://www.app.com/apps... Yet the stock prices are not reflecting these same percentages.
- ·[▪_▪]·
@nicerobot that's because their profit margin is the same. Their costs have gone up that much as well.
- Jason Carreira
@nicerobot The root of the "evil big oil" argument is that only a few elites benefit from gains. My take is that you and I are the beneficiaries of such a "windfall" and that's not a bad thing. "You and I" includes the bafrillion people that are employed by "big oil", their families, and their family's families. More even than you and I, the US Government, the biggest drug dealer on the planet via taxation, is by far the largest beneficiary. The US Government, by the way, is not W and his cronies.
- Mattb4rd
No, it hasn't
- Jason Carreira
@Matt, yes, I feel so enriched when I fill my car...
- Jason Carreira
A large part of those "costs' are bonuses and salaries of their executives as well as spending to the refineries that they own. You're fooling yourself if you think owning stock in big oil is offsetting gas price increases.
- ·[▪_▪]·
@Jason: Maybe you shouldn't inhale so deeply while pumping gas :)
- Mattb4rd
Have the salaries of _all_ the employees of big oil gone up relative to the price of gas so that the employees are not impacted at all by gas prices? If not, then you're argument fails because it means the employees have essentially taken a pay cut because their own company is costing them more to work for them.
- ·[▪_▪]·
Additionally, by your argument, if I employ lots of people, it doesn't matter how I obtain the money I use to pay them? Anyway, I'm not opposed to companies making a profit as long as they pass it on to shareholders and employees. The reason big oil sucks is because they are _actively_ fighting against moving to renewable energy. That's what's frackin evil!!
- ·[▪_▪]·
@nicerobot. Your honesty is refreshing. The logical fruition of your thought process, as it is outlined here, is that capitalism is evil. I'm about to post some photos of 2 "cappulatte's" I just made. That's more fun to talk about. :)
- Mattb4rd
Capitalism is evil in some regards but I'm not an absolutist so it isn't either-or. Watch a documentary called "The Corporation". I agree with much of what is presented in that documentary. At the same time, capitalism is a wonderful system in many respects. It just isn't suitable for anything requiring compassionate, humane endeavors. If more people were to clearly undersatnd when capitalism works and when it doesn't we could probably solve a huge rift that exists between republicans and democrats.
- ·[▪_▪]·
@loiclemeur - what's the chance of adding generic Laconica support to Twhirl? The TWiT Army awaits with interest!
Sam Harrelson, ·[▪_▪]· and ishak liked this
Sprint lowers phone-as-modem tethering cost - http://www.jkontherun.com/2008...
ishak and Dave Winer liked this
Kevin, I have the flip question -- I have a Sprint EVDO modem. Can I get a cell phone that uses the same number and account when I'm not using it to connect to the net? I know it's a weird question, but my iPhone is flaking out and I desperately need a cell phone asap.
- Dave Winer
No can do Dave. Sprint (and Verizon) use CDMA technology, not GSM tech like AT&T. That means there's no SIM card tied to your phone number... your DEVICE is tied to the phone number. I.E.: the modem phone number is tied to the modem so that phone number can't be used for a phone while the modem is under contract. :( BTW: not a weird question at all. ;)
- Kevin C. Tofel
I think that you can have a sprint store change the device on the account from the card to a phone, but they will require you to add a voice plan, and might require you to remove the pc card data plan - depends on how smart the CS person is. So frankly while it might be possible technically, the human side would not go along with it. It would be simpler to open a new line with any carrier.
- Royce Mathew
Royce, I don't think that would solve Dave's situation. Unless I'm reading his question wrong, he wants one phone number / account, i.e.: when he's not using the modem (and therefore the phone # tied to it), he wants to get calls on a phone at that same number.
- Kevin C. Tofel
ok, my bad.
- Royce Mathew
Jason Calacanis's advice on how to get PR for your startup boils down to this: be Jason Calacanis (http://www.alleyinsider.com/2008...)
Ken Schafer, Carla Thompson, ishak and 3 other people liked this
We Try So Hard To Be Medicore - http://howtosplitanatom.com/news...
Kim, , anna sauce and 10 other people liked this
What have you always wanted to do that you haven''t yet?
- Steve Spalding
Even our spelling is mediocre. :)
- Morton Fox
LOL @ Morton
- Robert Seidman
Le sigh, fixing. It's days like these that I wonder why I peeled myself off of the ceiling. Try to make a point and get bullocked by the title. :)
- Steve Spalding
great post, inspirational :)
- Tim Hoeck
Thanks a lot Tim! @Morton it's fixed now, it probably won't register here for a bit. Thanks for the heads up. ;)
- Steve Spalding
Is your company on Twitter? Here's what I'm seeing: The Evolution of Brands on Twitter http://www.web-strategist.com/blog...
Tim Aldiss, Casey, Tiffany Winman and 5 other people liked this
just retweeted the best just retweeted the best strategic roadmap for brands on twitter I've seen so far. strategic roadmap for brands on twitter I've seen so far. I question if brands will need experts to deploy such a strategy. Is this a reverse logistics and customer-driven model? Can startups do this better?
- ishak
from twhirl
Y Combinator To Offer Standardized Angel Funding Legal Docs - http://www.techcrunch.com/2008...
Tom Stitt, Mrinal Desai, Peter Renshaw and 72 other people liked this
"Early stage venture firm Y Combinator, which has funded over a 102 young startups, has “open sourced” the legal documents that they provide to their startups to use as they seek additional funding. The documents were created with their law firm, Wilson Sonsini Goodrich & Rosati"
- Paul Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
Love! ;-)
- Erhan Erdoğan
Link to the documents: http://www.ycombinator.com/seriesa...
- seman
Thanks for the link. Good stuff.
- Jason Carreira
Paul Graham is doing a terrific job. FEw days ago, for thr first time, they published a document showing what kind of startup ideas they particularly look for, and now this!!! Cool.
- Hayk
Thanks
- Baris Bulut
Anyone know why the documents were taken down so abruptly last night?
- Gerald Buckley
This is the longest rant I've seen by @scobleizer in a long time. This one, regarding PR http://scobleizer.com/2008...
Julia Gorzka, Jill O'Neill, Sarah Perez and 7 other people liked this
I'm mobile, but it's in my Google Reader feed. (I can't display scobleizer.com on Windows Mobile 5 with IE4.) I'll read it in a bit.
- Ontario Emperor
from fftogo
Just shared it. There;s some food for thought in there for a lot of people
- Charlie Anzman
Just read it myself. I'll comment on Scoble's feed in a bit (once I follow up on another thought).
- Ontario Emperor
from fftogo
I actually started reading it on my ipod touch, do you realize how much I had to scroll?
- Jeremiah Owyang
Great rant. Makes a lot of sense as well.
- Roberto Bonini
RT @QueenofSpain Blogger gets SUED http://www.mountainx.com/news...
David Potts, Kathleen Mazzocco, Sean Brady and 7 other people liked this
this kind of stuff sickens me. The blogger will win but she will have to spend $20,000 to defend herself.
- Robert Scoble
The VP of Programming for Vision Media TV (the purported scammers) brags out loud on his site that he's converted to Christianity and he has degrees in Philosophy and Religion (http://www.matthewmcmahon.com/). Any time some one brags about these things, a douchebag/swindler/filthy politician alert goes off in my head. Perhaps we ought to write to his church, which is listed on his website, to let everyone there know what kind of a person he is.
- Raoul Pop
This game is very common. Every time a breathless mktg pers comes in and says "they want to put us on TV" I ask for how much.
- Brad Nickel
and this is where the blogosphere /EFF MUST Step in and help.. and make a ruckus .. WTH sues a for $15M in puntative and $5M as damage.. that company s/NOW be paying th blogger for all the legal stress she us udnergoing !
- Peter Dawson
And we could just buy stuff from her site: http://www.theokobox.com/. That would make it partially worth it. Contacted a litigator I know to rep her. See if he will for the PR factor.
- Brad Nickel
anybody with more organizational skills than myself want to setup some sort of fund (heck even paypal?). I'd be willing to chip in some $ to help this person...and no offense to the lesser known people on FF, but my comfort level would increase if it was a well known FF'er...
- Jeff (Team マクダジ )
I wonder if every blogger that is reading creates a post the rips apart Vision Media TV for unethical practices , would they sue each and every1 of us ?? Call for action here !
- Peter Dawson
Sign me up for the fundraiser. Maybe there should be a blogger charity fund instituted as this kind of persecution occurs more often.
- Kathleen Mazzocco
AirTran rocks! We gave up our seats on 9 am flight, then again on the 11:30. Will fly 2 DEN tomorrow biz class & got 6 free RT tix (3 each).
ishak liked this
Bloggers Are Hard to Please and Hard to Pitch: Some Mistakes in Pitches from Startups | Profy | Internet news and commentary - http://profy.com/2008...
David Clements, Jeff (Team マクダジ ), Кто здесь? and 2 other people liked this
Svetlana: "I have decided to compile my own list of the most common mistakes that startups make when pitching bloggers (or at least what I consider mistakes myself).""
- susan mernit
Susan, thanks for sharing, glad you've found this post worthy enough.
- Svetlana Gladkova
from twhirl
Svetlana, you are welcome; it's a post everyone in @techstars should read.
- susan mernit
Radar Online : Hitler Twitters! - http://radaronline.com/exclusi...
Bluesun 2600, Adam Teece, ishak and 5 other people liked this
Friendfeed seems to be adding friends automatically. 28 new friends in a couple of days. Has this happened to anyone else?
Matt Shoffner, Hao Chen, Dan V and 4 other people liked this
Really? I usually get email notifications on new friend requests. Never had that happen to me, but I have much lower volume of friend request than you I'm sure.
- Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Leo: Not happening here. Mind you my friend count must be tiny relative to yours, perhaps it is happening to power FF users.
- Jon-Paul Bussoli
Not new friend requests - people are getting added to my friends list without notice. I've pared it down to 127 again. Let's see if it goes back up. Weird.
- Leo Laporte
Yes. It happens here, too. I think it's due to the Facebook FriendFeed application. Are you using that?
- Robert Scoble
You can change that in the settings, Raymond C, getting updates of friends of friends that is... I turned it off. Too much noise.
- rykos
i noticed it too. i've been receiving posts lately from people i haven't subscribed to. the messages weren't shared by friends either.
- alanoakes
@scobleizer - yep. I am using the Facebook FF app. So people can use it to put themselves on my Friends list? Or is it a bug? The people who appear are quite random - some of them haven't even configured FF, which makes me think it's a bug.
- Leo Laporte
not happening to me....
- Loic Le Meur
I wish it was happening to me... ;P
- xero
Leo - here is what the FriendFeed FAQ says - "Yes, FriendFeed works with Facebook. You can connect your Facebook account to your FriendFeed account by adding the FriendFeed Facebook application. Your friends will automatically be kept in sync, and you can put your FriendFeed on your profile and in your Facebook mini-feed. The easiest way to connect your FriendFeed and Facebook accounts is to click the Facebook link on your account settings page."
- Atul Arora
I've noticed some friend recommendations, where I see notes from people I follow follow. Perhaps thats it (they do say XX is a friend of Leo Laporte" etc
- Dom Barnes
@Leo - If its auto adding people to your facebook you might want to send a message to the tech team at FF and let them know, also CC it to Facebook. Sounds like a bug to me.
- Raymond C
When I joined up to FF a couple of days ago, you were noted as popular along with a bunch of other people, and I was encouraged to add you (as a friend?).
- Bec Rowe @d0tski
@Leo per Scoble that is a feature of the Facebook app. Ultimately I uninstalled it so that I could keep my friends list manageable.
- Steve Rubel
Trying to access the settings on Facebook I am getting a page load error that the connection was interrupted!
- Joe Dawson
When does social networking apps cross over to being intrusive and counter productive ? What is the tipping point ? Classic e.g above :)-
- Peter Dawson
They 'seeded' the service similarly for any new user - smart at "that" phase
- Mrinal Desai
Does this mean... we're not really friends?
- brad sucks
Leo, our Facebook integration auto-friends as new friends from Facebook join. I am working to make that (a) an option, and (b) add notifications. Sorry for the confusing UI.
- Bret Taylor
@Bret thanks for clearing that up
- Hao Chen
Global Neighbourhoods: About Loren Feldman & Michael Arrington - http://redcouch.typepad.com/weblog...
Benjamin Kohler, Anthony Citrano, Jason Calacanis and 26 other people liked this
It's good to get Shel's perspective on this whole thing.
- Thomas Hawk
I wrote my thoughts on the most recent shel israel video here: http://www.1938media.com/shel-is... I was attacked by all the trolls on Loren's site. I think more people need to voice their feelings to Loren's sponsors, eg Zong, Cnet, etc. If all Loren's key partners get a lot of complaints, Loren may rethink his strategy
- Adrian Bye
CNET is a sponsor? This is crazy. These people have lost their minds. Dan Farber used to be a mensch. You must be mistaken.
- Dave Winer
Dan Farber is the one who HIRED Loren. He also did a puppet interview. here's a link to the "news": http://mashable.com/2008...
- Robert Seidman
CNET is trying to get all edgy. Fail.
- Cyndy
I was wondering why Dan and CNet thought this a good fit, but hey that's their call.
- Mark Forman
Well, I just put a link to Shel's article on Scripting News. I don't normally ask people to link to things but this is one of those times -- link to Shel's article let's make sure that all of TechCrunch's sponsors find out what's going on. I've had enough of this. I can't believe all the people that are dirty here, and I don't understand what for. If there were some embezzlement or fraud it might make sense. But to destroy one harmless person? This is ridiculous. What the fuck is TechCrunch's CEO doing?
- Dave Winer
I'm not sure about edgy, but like it's new parent CBS, scrambling to attract "younger viewer demographics"
- Robert Seidman
I can't imagine CBS wants a scandal.
- Dave Winer
Dave, the PTC is trying to knock "Swingtown" off the air, Loren would be small potatoes relatively speaking.
- Robert Seidman
I just sent an email to Dan Farber. I've known him for 25 years. He's always been a good guy.
- Dave Winer
what Dan Farber's email ? I would like to tell him that I dont support Loren's pranks no more. It was fun while it lasted.
- Peter Dawson
I got an email through to David Marcus, the CEO of Zong. Zong is the sponsor of the "shel israel puppet" show. His blog is here: http://www.davidmarcus.net/
- Adrian Bye
wow, this is really starting to heat up.
- Thomas Hawk
I just had a long phone talk with Mike Arrington about this and other topics. I'm not going to post any more on this until I've had a chance to think a bit about it.
- Dave Winer
Well, let us know your thoughts.
- Andru Edwards
When the dude said he did not like it, that's when it stopped being funny. Which was a long time ago. There's really not that much to think about beyond that. Stop. No. I don't like it. Pretty hard to misinterpret.
- Dominic Jones
I understand the notion of feeling attacked, but all industries deserved to be skewered. In fact it's a duty I think. Puppets are a great platform for this, and Loren is essentially satirizing an industry that, while it produces amazing things, can take itself too seriously. I think he is welcome until he's unwelcome. Such is life.
- Seamus Condron
I think Loren is doing a major public service with his puppets. They are funny and poke fun in great ways. But if a guy is losing key parts of his business, then its a different story. That is hurting him and his family. Dave, I really look forward to hearing your thoughts. Perhaps there's an inside story we are not aware of.
- Adrian Bye
lawl - mike scared dave
- Mark Lepzig
looking forward to hearing your thoughts after your conversation with Mike Dave. If it changes your thinking on this I'd be seriously interested in why. Obviously something Mike said had an impact on how you feel about this now or you wouldn't be taking the time away to think about it. I hope you can share what he said to you with the rest of us.
- Thomas Hawk
No he didn't scare me. Geez. And my sympathy for Shel will not change either. I encouraged Mike to help him. Obviously that's his decision.
- Dave Winer
Dave, you seemed to be escalating this campaign to go after Loren's advertisers/sponsors. I'm not saying that is the right or wrong thing to do, I'm just curious what Mike said and how it may have changed how you think about the situation.
- Thomas Hawk
Just a note: I don't know how this translates in English, but french people say: "Le linge sale se lave en famille".
- directeur
Welcome to the interwebs-where "dead horses" are resurrected only to be kicked again.
- Mark Forman
Just used the FriendFeed block command for the first time. It's every bit as good as Twitter's. "Nick" need not worry about his FF getting clogged with whining. :-)
- Dave Winer
My French is horrible directeur, but I think the loose translation would be "Don't air your dirty laundry in public"
- Robert Seidman
Robert: Yes, that sounds the same :)
- directeur
Just wanted to say by that, that involving the crowd we are in such things just give them more importance (than they deserve?) and maybe can harm too. IMO it's always wiser to filter, jauge and ponder things calmely first. The web is such a mess... take something, push it through an amplifier and the result will be bigger than the original
- directeur
Directeur-And you don't think many of the people involved in this discussion are aware of that and doing it for that reason?
- Mark Forman
Mark, heh :)
- directeur
Touche! is la francais,non?
- Mark Forman
Oui touché! :) (though I'm not french neither) :)
- directeur
Farber is on the case ...
- Oldengrey (Jay)
Directeur-franc-fooled :D
- Mark Forman
I am not a fan of Loren's but I believe he is doing a performance more then a personal attack - both of their attention meters have gone up as a result, which is Lorens real goal/purpose (for himself obviously). I disagree with a lot of what has been said but have not wanted to bring more attention to the whole situation so have remained quiet, hoping Loren would grow tired and this would end sooner. If there are real damages here, they wont be resolved in the court of public opinion...
- Chris Heuer
With all due respect Chris, passing judgment is easy when you are not caught at the receiving end. Lets see what will happen when you are at the receiving end of something similar and scares away your sponsors. I think public opinion counts here.
- Vic Podcaster
In cases of bullying, the best remedy is one that comes from peers. People in the crowd observing have to step forward and say it is not right. Just reciting from the manuals on schoolyard bullying, which is ironic given the ages of those involved.
- Dominic Jones
from twhirl
I've met Loren several times and he's a very personable guy. I had an exchange of emails with Shel three years ago that were extremely ugly. When Loren made the first puppet video I don't think he had any idea it would take off as it did. After working in PR for so many years Shel should have know better then to write that blog post. Shel needs to contact Loren and ask to be interviewed by his namesake puppet so he can laugh at himself and we can see that he isn't such a bad guy after all.
- paul mooney
As an interesting side-note, before the puppet I had no idea who Shel was. Since then I've added his RSS feed. I'm having trouble that believing this publicity has been bad for his site's pageviews.
- Andrew
This is totally disgusting - http://images.scripting.com/archive...
Ron Sela, Tyson Key, Igor The Troll יִצְחָק and 53 other people liked this
Some joke. They go after his sponsors, so guess what -- now he doesn't have a sponsor. That's a joke? Only if you're a sadist. Maybe if it's so much fun to be mocked by Calacanis and hisfriends, they should start picking on some people who could fight back and maybe hurt them. It's cowardly to pick on Shel, who has too much pride to say how much this is hurting him. Maybe Calacanis shoudl offer to sponsor Shel's show to show he's not such a bad guy. He's rich, Shel is not. All around this is disgusting. People who think they can have fun while hurting someone else need to take a good look in the mirror.
- Dave Winer
I don't find the situation funny at all. The average age of bullying seems to have shot up immensely as the web matures. Too bad some of its users aren't maturing as fast. And just between you and I: I don't need someone I don't know to tell me the "best links" on the web via an ad-based human service. I'm quite capable, thank you. ;)
- Kevin C. Tofel
Thanks Kevin. It's nice not to be totally out there on my own on this. Another thing to think about. Do you think they would be doing this if Shel's name was Kathy Sierra? Why is it funny to destroy a middle-aged Jewish guy? There's got to be a way to shine the public light on what Calacanis and Arrington are up to here. It's a warning sign to other people not to cross them. It's anything but a joke.
- Dave Winer
"Maybe Calacanis should offer to sponsor Shel's show..." I think this an excellent idea; is only fair if Jason wasn't out to destroy Shel's career; ties it all up and we all move on; and is great publicity for Mahalo speaking from a purely PR perspective, which Calacanis would probably consider a plus.
- tamera
Sounds like the same thing the guy who tried to "pants" me Every. Single. Day. at lunch in junior high would say. "It's just a joke! You need to lighten up!" :-( Bullying knows no age limits, it would seem. We should all just follow Wil Wheaton's immortal advice from PAX last year - "Wil Wheaton says, Don't Be a Dick!" - http://tinyurl.com/5jlxmp
- Josh Bancroft
Tamera, glad you like the idea. I've suggested it to Arrington, he never responded. Maybe he doesn't have so much money, but he sure knows how to attract sponsorship -- and he *says* he's friends with Shel. It would really round things off for them to pay Shel for the fun they're having destroying his rep. (And Heather Harde, why doesn't she step in and stop it. It amazes me the people who just stand by and do and say nothing.)
- Dave Winer
Josh, there are a lot of people in Silicon Valley who need to hear Wil Wheaton's advice.
- Dave Winer
Calacanis is one of the few people I actually blocked on Twitter. He exploits his users for his own personal benefit and takes advantage of his sphere of influence across socnets. Personally, it takes a lot for me to block someone. Nuff said. This whole episode is not healthy for the community regardless of which side you happen to fall on.
- Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Wanted to mark this as a like, but thought I would be misinterpreted... I like that people are pointed out the childish behaviour that is stemming from someone who is supposed to be mature, against another person.
- Ian D. Nock
Never got why anyone thought the puppets were funny. It was a grown man making a fool out of himself. BTW if Shel thought it was funny, then it was a joke.
- Mack Collier
Brian, I did the same
- Shey
Go ahead and mark it as a "like" -- everyone understands what that means in FF. Not that you like it but you saw it and recommend it.
- Dave Winer
On many occasions I had the pleasure of interacting with Shel, a thorough gentleman, great thinker with highest moral values. I have nothing but great respect for him. This is totally not acceptable and Jason should sit down and think what it would be like to be at the receiving end - if the situation was reversed.
- Vic Podcaster
Getting tired of this crap. Shel needs to lighten up? How about this, HE DOESN'T LIKE IT, and has STATED AS MUCH. That means it should stop. End of story. Instead, since Loren has friends with influence on the Internet, like Jason and Mike, he continues. It's selfish. It's low-rent.
- Andru Edwards
There's never an excuse for bad manners. Jason owes an apology.
- Dave Martin
Mixed feelings on this. I actually like Loren's sense of humor much of the time. I thought his posts he did with his 5 year old nephew Ethan talking about tech were hilarious. I don't know all his stuff though and have heard people say he's made racist remarks which I wouldn't approve of. At the same time I appreciate Dave standing up for decency and for Shel. That's a good thing and Dave frequently takes on a cause even when it's unpopular or if he's supporting an underdog because of his convictions.
- Thomas Hawk
I'm right there with you Dave. Though I don't think Shel would want Calacanis as a sponsor.
- Amit Morson
But... did Shel lose his sponsor *because* of Loren or Calacanis? I'm not so sure. Maybe SAP just didn't see the value/ratings in sponsoring Shel's show anymore. Has SAP said why they didn't reup? Sponsors drop on and off all the time for any number of reasons. Did Loren go too far with Shel? Probably. But I'm not sure he necessarily ought to bear the blame for the loss of the sponsorship, unless SAP says that's why they dropped him.
- Thomas Hawk
I declare a JEW FIGHT. first one with a puppet gets a ham sandwich... come on Winer. Piggie, Piggie, Piggie, ... weee Piggie... and the piggie is Scoble
- NoahDavidSimon
It's not about the lost sponsor. That is secondary. It's about the bullying and abuse.
- Andru Edwards
I'm also not sure why picking on Shel is labeled "picking on a *jewish* middle aged guy. It would seem to suggest that Shel was partly picked on for being Jewish and I tend to doubt that since Feldman is Jewish himself. What relevance is there to the fact that Shel is jewish?
- Thomas Hawk
Someone versed in "social" and "communications" should have seen the marketing and publicity GOLD in Feldman's antics and rolled with it accordingly. I'm hard-pressed to find Shel a victim of anyone but himself here. Did Loren go to far? Maybe. Did Shel react almost totally incorrectly? Absolutely, imo.
- abacab
from twhirl
At times in junior high (yes, I'm referencing junior high which should be a clear sign of things) when I was being bullied or made fun of I a) ignored them and b) stuck to my motto that 'insults from idiots should be taken as compliments'. I don't know Calcanis or Arrington personally so I can't say their idiots but I think Shel can make that call. This whole thing only really survives because people are gawking.
- AJ Kohn
it isn't Punch and Judy... but Punch and Judah. I'm kicking Igor the Troll's ass right now
- NoahDavidSimon
Andru, my name is not Shel. If you want to beat up on someone here, beat up on me. But before that, examine your own motives. Why do you need Shel to shut up if he's hurting. Explain that first.
- Dave Winer
Thomas, we'll never know why SAP didn't re-up, and why do even need to discuss this. We do know that these people took aim at Shel. If there's even the slightest chance it increased his misery then it SHOULD STOP and people should stop blaming the victim here. How would you feel if you were Shel? And more important -- what would you do if you found one of your kids participating in something like this? What would you say to him or her at your sitdown? You should say that to yourself.
- Dave Winer
Dave, re-read my comment. I was defending Shel. I am saying that Shel didn't like the abuse, stated it, and therefore, it should stop. It's just common decency and common courtesy. I'm with you on this one ;)
- Andru Edwards
Whether it is true or not that people didn't stand up for Shel b/c it was a joke, it's in bad taste and I don't like it.
- Phil Glockner
Come on most of you sound like all ladies! There is no Fair in War! We are in Social Media War! So fight you Pussies!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
I don't just think his Jewishness has anything to do with it, I'm sure of it.
- Dave Winer
Just heard the Lauren side of the story here.. http://www.1938media.com/about... Lauren claims that this is payback to Shel, since Shel has tried to pull him in the past.
- Vic Podcaster
Regarding Jason's involvement, he only makes an appearance in the original puppet video. I think he and others shouldn't have been part of this that's Dave's point. Dave?
- Vic Podcaster
Okay so the puppets are a way of getting revenge. Thanks for clearing that up. All you guys who think it's funny now have your answer. It's not meant to be funny, it's meant to hurt.
- Dave Winer
"Before anyone else can stand up for Shel, Shel needs to stand up for Shel. Or roll with it, which could have had him and his sponsors laughing all the way to the bank.... but nooo. - abacab via twhi" Pithy words! I cannot believe Shel Israel wrote Naked Conversions and now he is crying the Blues! Come on, Shel is a joke, a has been!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
"Just heard the Lauren side of the story here.. http://www.1938media.com/about... Lauren claims that this is payback to Shel, since Shel has tried to pull him in the pas" The link doesn't work, but if he's going for 'payback', why is no one calling for Loren to 'just lighten up'?
- Mack Collier
I hear you Dave. And I like Shel a lot. I think he's a genuine guy, a straight shooter and one of the nicest people you will ever meet. And as said before I think it's admirable of you to stand up for what you think is right here in this case. And I do think Loren pushed it too far in this specific case. Again, but... Loren has largely defined himself as a comedian. That's his shtick. Comedy frequently pushes the envelope....
- Thomas Hawk
Again, it doesn't matter what his status is in your eyes. The issue is that someone is bullying someone else. It's childish and stupid, and if the person on the receiving end asks for it to stop, it should stop. Case closed.
- Andru Edwards
Thomas, show me where I said anything about Feldman? I think you guys are the problem -- you think destroying another person is funny. Give Feldman credit, he's honest enough to say it's not about being funny, it's about revenge. Thomas your problem is that you know and like Shel. And yet you excuse this, even justify it. Stop deflecting, the issue is YOU.
- Dave Winer
...(cont). Lenny Bruce, Howard Stern, etc. They are comedy and entertainment. Do/did they say hurtful things about people. Sure. I'm just so sure where the exact line is. Were people saying it was "too far" when Feldman described Nick Douglas' beard as pubic hair on a face back when he was still working at Podtech? In general I probably tend to give comedians a wider berth than maybe I should.
- Thomas Hawk
BTW didn't the first puppet video appear on www.shelisrael.com? And now he's claiming it was 'payback'? Wow it's like 3rd grade PE all over again.
- Mack Collier
oh please Dave. Take your meds.... it's a PUPPET. The PUPPET did not damage SHEL.... the puppet made Shel famous. You have a puppet, arrington has a puppet, Loic has a puppet, and i was done up as a baby!!! Did any of use lose our sponsors, show, or were we damaged in any way!!??! please. it's comedy... oh yeah, its a PUPPET! Really. For the love of God please make a Calacanis puppet and do 10 shows a day.... it's flattery of the highest form.
- Jason Calacanis
So where's the line, Jason? Did you just give everyone carte blanche to say whatever they want about you? I mean if they upset you, they can just say 'well it was JUST a joke!' and that means you lose the right to be offended, right? It doesn't matter if YOU thought the video about Shel was funny, what matters is how Shel took it. Have no idea why you can't see that.
- Mack Collier
Jason you are a Freaking Puppet and VC are pulling your strings! But you know the game and Poor Sell cries baby tears! LOL Come on, what a joke, Shell is being Bullied by Loren! Are we in Kindergarten! Ok, Bad Loren, behave or go to the corner! ROFLMAO
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Dave, I thought you were talking about Feldman, your screen image references 1938 media, which is essentially Feldman. I don't think anyone destroying Shel or anyone else is funny. I've already said that I think Feldman pushed that bit too far. Are you saying that this is not about Feldman but about Calacanis? And if so why? I haven't followed the whole story very closely.
- Thomas Hawk
I don't know Calacanis very well. Met him in Seattle once and he wanted me to stop taking his picture. http://www.zooomr.com/photos...
- Thomas Hawk
Mack Collier: Well, it is a puppet... does anyone take a puppet seriously? I mean, it's not like the puppet was killing people. The puppet was doing serious interviews with Kevin Rose, Loic, Kara Swisher, etc. It was all in good fun, and Loic, Dave Winer, Scoble, and Arringon all loved their puppets. We live in a free country with freedom of speech... comedy is aVERY important aspect of our freedom. If someone wants to make a puppet about me I'm totally cool--just say techcrunch50, mahalo.com,+calacanis.com
- Jason Calacanis
Jason. I don't love the puppets, so please take my name off that list. Further, we already have the data that the Shel Israel puppet is a way for Feldman to get revenge on Shel, so it's not a joke, and definitenly not funny, and not something I want to be part of. I *know* that it hurt Shel. So maybe you could stop supporting it now that you know that. Another thought is you could personally sponsor Shel's show as a way of showing it's all in fun? We know you've got a lot of money, Shel doesn't. A thought.
- Dave Winer
Jason, we all think it's funny. I love the puppets. The question is loyalty. If Shel was my friend or associate, which he's not, and I knew he wasn't happy about the whole thing. I'm 100% sure I wouldn't have assisted, promoted the person he was upset with. Shel handled this wrong. Loren did nothing wrong except being maybe too rough, but the real crime here is Shel's "friends" and associates who decided to hide behind "it's a joke, get over it" more than "I probably shouldn't support my friend's attacker".
- Jim Kukral
One guy and a puppet. Like it or not, the world needs the Loren Feldmans of this workd, they help keep the rest of us honest. Those that don't get it are going to suffer.
- Dennis Howlett
from twhirl
On the playground, by the flagpole - 3 o'clock. Fight. Honestly, I really don't know much about what's going on, but this is a public forum - and this sounds like something where a phone call should be made, either apologizing or at least talking about the situation with all involved so everyone understands. Hissy fits on either side, doing this on the Internet just doesn't seem appropriate in this situation. Soon this will devolve into senseless name calling.
- Vince DeGeorge
You don't like your puppet Dave!?!?? how is that possible... shocking since it's such a perfect send up of your delusional hypocrisy and mental instability. Really dude... it's a puppet. Shel--a grown man--is hurt by a puppet??!!?! The genius of social marketing and community building has been crushed... wait for it.... wait a little more for it... a puppet? Really? A puppet... really?
- Jason Calacanis
By the way, Gary V is handling it right. What Shel should have done. Embrace it and ride it.
- Jim Kukral
Two points here that some seem to be overlooking: 1 - Did Loren honestly mean for the video to be a joke? 2 - Did Shel take it as a joke? Shel obviously didn't think it was funny, so the question then shifts to Loren's motive. If Loren honestly intended the video to be a harmless joke, common sense dictates that upon seeing that Shel was upset by it, he would have immediately reached out to Shel and apologized. Apparently he didn't do that, and that speaks volumes about his intentions.
- Mack Collier
Loren says that this is payback. Payback for what? Shel must have really pissed him off badly somewhere along the way if this is payback and not a joke.
- Thomas Hawk
Why don't you all just whip them out and measure? Lets get this over with once and for all. You ALL try to destroy each other. I've watched it. No one more than another- some are just more successful at it. The puppets are funny. If they weren't, this would be over. I've met Shel twice and Loren once. I've talked with all of you on some level a few times. You call bs on me, I call it on you. It's the ability to go get drunk and move on here that is key. Geez.
- Erin @queenofspain
one could actually make a reasonable argument that for most involved in social media being involved as a "puppet target" like this is actually a big opportunity for PR/branding/awareness - it's just a question of how you spin all the publicity
- Deva Hazarika
Holy crap, you are all such fucking drama queens. What is this, LiveJournal? Is Shel going to pull a Kathy Sierra and take his toys and go home, now? ... I really miss the old 1980's BBS flamewars.
- Dossy Shiobara
Mack Collier: Loren said OVER AND OVER again that Shel should just buy into the joke and he would end it. Instead Shel started with the legal threats and attacking a *puppeteer*. Loic and I both told Shel to just embrace it and Loren would let up. Shel knew exactly what to do, and I think Shel will at some point reveal that his hurt reaction was all a social media experiment. There is no way Shel is hurt by a puppet... it's impossible for an expert on social media to not understand such basic concepts.
- Jason Calacanis
@jason - maybe shel is the savvy social media PR guy here...
- Deva Hazarika
It's one guy and a puppet but the tech blogosphere needs the Loren Feldmans of this world. Without them, who'd clean out the tank of the hyperbolic crap that accumulates? @jason - you don't believe that last statement, do you? Look at the way Shel made gaff after gaff on this and then continued to throw out snide remarks in Twitter.
- Dennis Howlett
I find this all amusing yet pathetic at the same time. Dave, Jason, Shel etc are all supposed to be leaders within the tech industry but with all of this, you are acting like spoilt children. Your all supposed to be grown men but can never resolve anything in a civilized manner and to be perfectly honest, I’m starting to questions the reasons why I’m following the on-going conversation....
more...
- Duke Newcombe
Payback? Are you serious? I forget, who is supposed to be the crybaby of the two?
- Mack Collier
At this point I'd like to raise a practical question... http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- Thomas Hawk
I'll start... CHERRY!!!!
- Thomas Hawk
Loren the Puppet! LMAO
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
@jason, the puppets may be funny, they may not be, that's subjective. Personally if I never see you in a hot tub again it will be too soon... but I digress... the point is that "social media" shouldn't be about eviserating someone who, in the end, is pretty harmless isn't he? Shouldn't we be attacking *ideas* not the person? So Shel's videos sucked, okay, cool, lambaste him and move on, it's when it gets to the level of personal attacks (on all sides), and piling on, that it crosses the line....
- tamera
I just subscribed to every single commenter in this thread by the way.
- Thomas Hawk
@jason... if you meant no harm and really participated all in good fun, then just man-up and say "hey Shel, sorry your feelings got hurt, it was meant as a compliment, and hey, Mahalo and you could both use some publicity so why don't I sponsor you". Stop telling him to "get over it" and start recognizing why he may think it went to far. Personally I think he should have embraced them at first, but then things got nasty on all sides... Why not just bring it to an end... even SNL retires skits...
- tamera
It seems like "satire" and "bullying" are getting all mixed up together in this conversation. Surely there's a difference between parodying someone in puppet form and tormenting them, schoolyard-style. I mean, is "Saturday Night Live" bullying Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama every week? When you agree to become a public figure, isn't part of the deal that someone might take issue with what you do and make fun of you?
- Lon Harris
Hey, can someone make a puppet of me and I can pretend to be hurt and offended as good as the next guy ... my crappy blog sure could use the attention! You can't _buy_ this kind of buzz, seriously.
- Dossy Shiobara
Feldman didn't go after Shel's sponsors who are still sponsoring FastCompany TV with Scoble. Just not the bit with Shel. As I understand it. Bottom line is that Shel's shows were a disaster. Sticking that shotgun mic up Jeremiah Owyang's nose while drinking coffee was comedy in its own right. Made more so by the fact it was supposed to be a serious show.
- Dennis Howlett
I would think most people aren't sweeping in to "save Shel" for two reasons: 1). he's most often a condescending self-important dick 2). it's a puppet, who cares!
- Roebot
All this silliness and drama just proves a simple point - tech pundits are not inherently more mature, objective or insightful than any other random sampling of humanity.
- Soulhuntre
Oh - that and I couldn't care less who either the puppet guy or his supposed victim are. Never heard of em.
- Soulhuntre
Would anyone be interested in sponsoring my show. It's a fun, flirty, fashionable golf show? I just got a really sweet book deal, now I need someone to sporsor my show. Anyone?
- patricia hannigan
Dave, I'm sorry but you're overreacting and acting irrational as usual... I was shocked when saw your comment stating Shel is attacked because of being 'a middle aged Jewish guy'... Oh c'mon! This has nothing to do being Jewish. I live in the middle east and sick of this "poor jews. all time victims of defamation" story... In contrast to your views, Loren's puppets didn't hurt Shel Israel but made him even famous. Look at the real Shel's interviews (oh my god! they suck) and then watch puppet Shel's...
- Berk D. Demir
I’ve decided to boycott all of these ‘Tech Leaders’ products and services, and I will petition others to do the same until they can start acting like ‘adults’. Until then, I’m no longer interested in anything they do or say.
- Duke Newcombe
It's not really about the puppet is it? Really? I mean Loren started in on Shel before the puppet showed up: http://www.youtube.com/watch... Personally, I think the puppets are funny, and Loren's not doing anything guys like Robert Smigel (Triumph) haven't done before. Beyond that, it seems like most folks outside the situation can see that you've got a few guys who just don't like each other pretending it's all business.
- Ken Sheppardson
Puppet Shel has made much more informative and professionally hold interviews. Watch Kevin Rose, Calacanis, Dan Farber, Kara Swisher episodes. From the perspective of journalism they excelled... And please stop connecting the SAP sponsorship withdrawal with the puppets. Real Shel criminally underperformed in his job and for many times SAP sponsorship was totally irrelevant.
- Berk D. Demir
Stop.
- Ian D. Nock
I for one enjoyed the puppet show. Keep up the good work Loren, you make the Internets more entertaining
- Jeff Hoard
I think that Shel is saying that he is defeated .. the joke is over on him but the puppets are funny - I don't think that the people who did the shows with the puppet where going after shel .. it was entertainment. I do puppet shows to my kids they love them. If it is true that Shel is suffering from financial loss then I blame Fastcompany and Scoble. They should have stood by their guy...
more...
- John Furrier
Loren, if you ever do a Thomas Hawk puppet, make sure it's a *Canon* camera strapped to it's face and not a Nikon, alrighty?
- Thomas Hawk
I'd feel honored if someone thought I was interesting and unique enough to be made into a parody starring a puppet. Liken up, man 'cause that Comcast truck ain't goin' no where!
- Mark Frost
from twhirl
let's be clear here. this show wasn't about satire or parody - it was an absolute attack time after time against shel. watch what loren says in his interview with dan farber of cnet - he says it was personal. Loren is the current bandboy of the calacanis and arrington crowd but eventually he will be dumped when he is done with. go read what duncan riley said - its pretty interesting - seems like arrington put loren up to this if you read it. is cnet forcing loren to drop the crap?
- Mark Lepzig
Mark, where did Duncan say that Arrington put Loren up to it? It was kind of obvious, but I'd like to see it in writing.
- Dave Winer
i cant find it dave - its in his ff stream though
- Mark Lepzig
wow. I wish I had time to get all wrapped up in internet wars. *shaking head*
- Trula
Jason? It's not just a puppet. It's also a domain name, stated intents to "ruin his career" and repeated videos/twitters/blog posts to the effect that Loren is intent on doing that. If it were 'just a puppet' it would be funny... Loren is funny. This little war amongst friends no longer is.
- Lucretia Pruitt
@Lucretia: yeah that domain name... the point to register shelisrael.com was to show how he's irrelevant to web and the paradigms he's talking about. A man dubbing himself "senior advisor" on new media and social media skips to register his OWN name ".com" domain... Well done. Poor Shel isn't he? You as an IT consultant, made a smart move and registered your own domain lucretiapruitt.com on Feb 1st, 2008. Good for you... Bad for old Shel.
- Berk D. Demir
Mike, that's not true. Why don't you get on the high road and find out what you can do to help Shel. The guy is hurting. Be a mensch.
- Dave Winer
Mike, what you say is not true. I have to deal with some problems on my site right now. Back in a few minutes.
- Dave Winer
Easy for me to say not being in the crosshairs, but I agree with Erin on meeting and having a few beers. We could get drunk and let our guards down or have a real bar brawl and get it over with. Maybe then we could get somewhere.
- Larry Kless
I really doubt arrington has any malice. The videos ARE funny. There just comes a point when its time to stop and move on to another topic. We've reached that time now.
- Adrian Bye
It's not as if Loren, whose job title can only be described as professional troll, is a particularly good troll. The reaction he has gained is out of all proportion to the quality of his trolling. I guess he just picked the softest targets.
- Paul Montgomery
Unless Loren can debunk Scobleizer I cannot hold him in esteem! His picking on Shel and Dave while fun, he is taking it too far! Loren, grow up or get the fuck out!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
Why the heck are folks targeting Shel? Reminds me of 3rd grade playground evil tactics and mental/social games/competition... super immature behavior. I think this unhealthy behavior needs to stop NOW. I like Shel a lot and totally respect his work. Why can't these evil people get a grip and grow up? Must have way too much time on their idle hands.
- Susan Beebe
@Berk - wow yes... you can use Whois... very impressive. You'll note the date of the register right? Hm. Perhaps because while I've had my business domains for 12 yrs now, it wasn't until *after* Loren decided to register shelisrael.com that it occurred to me that someone might just be petty and vindictive enough to register my name as a way to try and attack me - so I protected myself. You see, if it's not your nature to figure out ways to attack others, it doesn't come naturally to pre-emptively register.
- Lucretia Pruitt
" we'll never know why SAP didn't re-up, and why do even need to discuss this." - because you stated in the ORIGINAL comment that he no longer has a sponsor because they went after them. so what is it? Bringing the SAP thing and the Jewish connection is a crass way to make your argument
- Jamie
@Lucretia I think your view is a little bit emotional and irrational. It'd be one's very own fault not register a name domain. Much serious fault if your name equals to your business name. When someone starts to linger around and irritate people with their extremely low quality work, another one will step in, register and make fun of them. On the reversal, someone could excel at his work but still hadn't register it. This time a malice will register and try to hijack the success of target's personal brand.
- Berk D. Demir
On the other hand, reading "sarcastic" comments like "wow you can use whois" makes me think you're in self preservative aggressive mode :(. i don't know what did get you but the conversation wasn't about you. I wondered if you had a name domain. then referenced it to make my point... people serious about their personal brand, do register a name domain. sorry i'm not a smart ass as you would think. and sorry if I hurt you in someway. never intended... :(
- Berk D. Demir
We have now learned why Jason has been so behind the puppet - today he is using it for Mahalo. If Shel was smart, he would file harassment charges in state court. If this was local, it would absolutely be harassment.
- Mark Lepzig
I think this whole thing can be summed up in one word: FASCINATING!
- neovids
The Feldman puppet videos I've seen have been hilarious. Calling him out for comic ridicule is like taking offense at Don Rickles calling you a hockey puck.
- Rogers Cadenhead
@1938media Loren Feldman you are a Total Douchebag! Just remember what goes around, comes around! So Fuck You!
- Igor The Troll יִצְחָק
I think Loren and Shel should bury the hatchet and do a charity fundraiser together and that Loren's "Council" should kick in big bucks as sponsors: http://broadcasting-brain.com/2008...
- Mark Dykeman
Dave, you are right that if Feldboy started puppet-mocking women, a mob would form in protest.
- jeneane sessum
I am so going to miss Jason's astute, indepth sensitive commentary if he actually is retiring from the blogosphere.
- shelisrael1
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