Kevin Fox
Google’s ‘Don’t Be Evil’ Mantra is ‘Bullshit,’ Adobe Is Lazy: Apple’s Steve Jobs | -
Google’s ‘Don’t Be Evil’ Mantra is ‘Bullshit,’ Adobe Is Lazy: Apple’s Steve Jobs |
"On Google: We did not enter the search business, Jobs said. They entered the phone business. Make no mistake they want to kill the iPhone. We won’t let them, he says. Someone else asks something on a different topic, but there’s no getting Jobs off this rant. I want to go back to that other question first and say one more thing, he says. This don’t be evil mantra: “It’s bullshit.” Audience roars." - Kevin Fox from Bookmarklet
Funny how evil is in the eye of the beholder. I don't doubt that Google would like Android to make the iPhone irrelevant, but that's not evil; it's competition. And not even as harsh a competitive tactic as Apple's holding Google's iPhone apps in limbo because Apple is afraid they might succeed. - Kevin Fox
I think Jobs sees all competition as zero-sum, so he seems to think Google's out to destroy the iPhone. But I don't know anyone at Google (including on the Android team) that thinks this way. A healthy, heterogeneous market is good for everyone, Google and Apple included. - Joel Webber from BuddyFeed
Totally agree, Kevin. It's all psychological bullshit to appeal to incite the fanboys. - Amy
Agreed, Joel. Google's certainly trying harder than Apple to broaden the smartphone market beyond the high-end. I think Google would be a lot more satisfied if they covered Nokia's global footprint than if they surpassed Apple in unit shipments. - Kevin Fox
Also, not that it matters but Google bought Android two years before Apple started selling the iPhone. It's not like Google suddenly decide to infringe on Apple's turf. - Kevin Fox
Jobs' rant is bullshit. It is, indeed. - Claudio Cicali
Isn't "don't be evil" about how you treat your customers, not your competitors, anyway? Paul? - Jim Norris
I don't know where people get the idea that competition is evil. I say competition is good :) - Paul Buchheit
Jobs is afraid of a strong competitor. - devran
It saddens me how most of the comments on all the articles covering this story agree with Steve that Google is somehow evil. Le sigh... - Michael Leggett
Google was so lost in the browser for many years. Most of the companies who are not Web oriented were not even interested in what Google was doing. And now current acts such as Android and Chrome OS get their reactions, because all suddenly Google changed roadmaps -- suddenly means last 2-3 years in my scale. - Burcu Dogan
Nokia didn't enter Apple's market and sell iPods or iMacs or MacBooks, I wonder how Nokia feels about Apple's entry into smartphones? ;-p - Ray Cromwell
do we really need to compare companies? - mehmet t. akalın
also any developer dealing with apple found. and adobe-flash plugin could get the idea what steve says.. - mehmet t. akalın
Yeah - those are the types of things a cult leader says to his cult to get them to rally against the enemies ;-) - Jesse Stay
I say.. even this cute company called Apple is bullshit too.. They are lazy bastards as well.. - Pico Seno
Well said, Aaron - motivation is good for us all :-) I like new Google AND Apple technology. - Jesse Stay
If I were sitting there at the iPad announcement, I would have been waiting for a runner to come down the aisle to throw a sledgehammer through the screen with Jobs's face on it. - Gabe
@Paul, you're starting to sound a little too much like Gordon Gecko - Fleagle
Are you implying that competition is bad Fleagle? Monopolies tend to be abusive, or at best lazy. Google competing with the iPhone may not be what's best for Apple, but it's better for the rest of the world. I declare it 99.9% good :) - Paul Buchheit
No @Paul, I actually don't care to be honest. I just love the movie "Wall Street." - Fleagle
Oh yeah, cool movie :) - Paul Buchheit
@Paul as a matter of fact, there had been historical records of true business competition had been causing more harm than good (water supply services few centuries back in London, UK), but you probably won't agree for sake of "competition being good by definition" :) (oh, and I am "all pro competition" too, but I do like historical facts) - A. T.
@Paul also Apple vs Google vs very-few-more-key-players vs rest-is-negligible fits perfectly oligopoly case - do you like oligopoly? :) - A. T.
There's competition where each company tries to out-innovate the other and there's competition where they try to undermine the other. In my experience Google represents the former. - Kevin Fox
Jerome, that's crazy. - Kevin Fox
The nice thing about Android is that it is monopoly/oligopoly resistant because it is open source. If Google pushes it too far, or stops innovating, someone else (e.g. Microsoft) can fork it and create their own competitive strain of Android. The same is not true of iPhone obviously. - Paul Buchheit
is that really true Paul? Isn't this Google slamming into MS and Apple trying to take market share with another prop system? - Thomas Power
Yes, I think there are already some non-Google Android devices, though none of the popular ones are. I doubt Microsoft will ever do it for the same reason that they aren't adopting WebKit for IE, but technically they could (and perhaps should). - Paul Buchheit
Android's already being used in several non-cellphone devices like media players from Archos and Barnes & Noble's Nook e-reader. - Kevin Fox
How's it feel to be, according to Valleywag, the face of Google's counter-Apple strategy post-Jobs lashing out? Bloggers are silly. - Mark Trapp
I think it's funny that Ryan Tate didn't mention my staunch advocacy of Apple's stance on Flash. - Kevin Fox
I'm rolling my eyes at that gawker article. (Nice find, Mark.) - Stephen Mack
I want to know when Facebook is going to build their own Android phone. ;-) - Jesse Stay
O sweet so this thread is a developing news story about a news story about a #headexplodes - LANjackal
Or what I really want to know is when Ryan Tate is going to start using FriendFeed ;-) - Jesse Stay
You guys might want to check out Gruber's additional perspective on what Jobs said. Note, in particular, the updates. It sounds like the original report painted his comments more harshly than they were delivered. - Kevin (aka ThreadKilla)
For the record (and since there are now a lot of people reading this thread who don't know me, my stance and my tone) I totally get why Steve said the things he said, and I don't really begrudge him for it. It's sad that he chose to rally his troops by implying that the other guy's got it in for them, so they'd better fight back hard, but it's nothing compared to calling your competitors Nazis: - Kevin Fox
I'd like to ask Apple about their thoughts and plans about Maps, and about online advertising, two businesses that Google entered first. - Kevin Fox
Really? I thought he was mad at Microsoft and IBM a *lot* in the 80s. The whole 1984 ad was a poke at IBM. It is funny though that externally he says that nobody's come close to where the iPhone was 3 years ago, but to his own troops he's saying 'Google's out to get us, so watch out.' - Kevin Fox
Not that old-mindsets are particularly constructive, but I think Jobs, in particular his mindset, is a product of the OS wars of the '80s and '90s. Microsoft was out to get Apple with its second-rate products and infinite cash reserves: Apple was the last stand between Microsoft, the death of innovation, and the proliferation of mediocrity. Now that Microsoft has been vanquished, the new dragons are Google and Adobe, against which Apple was to defend innovation and great product design. I'd say it's more quixotic than it is nefarious or angry. See Jobs talk about Microsoft in the same way several years ago: - Mark Trapp
I think the only thing standing in the way of Google-targeted ad campaigns like Apple's "Redmond: Start your photocopiers" ads is the fact that Google's brand is viewed even more favorably than Apple's. Apple can't publicly attack a company that people love without taking a serious hit. - Kevin Fox
Very true! Check this out: - Kevin Fox
Apple is afraid. They don't enter the search business because they know they can't win. Google sees a way to put customers/devs first and does see a way to succeed. - Nathan Snyder
Kevin: I think the 1984 ad was a poke at what Apple was to become in 2010. - Gabe
++Gabe - April Buchheit
Respectfully, I think the level of Google fanboi-ism is equal to that of Apple. Google is an innovative company. So is Apple. Neither is devoid of warts. - Kevin (aka ThreadKilla)
I love both Apple and Google, but I hate it when they fight or act spoiled. - Kevin Fox
Yes, and despite (or because of) SJ being kind of a nut, Apple is still awesome and I'll be buying a tablet :) - Paul Buchheit
It's fun to watch extremely controlling people throw tantrums when they don't get their way. Waaaaaah! - Garmon Estes
Apparently there can only be one maker of phones. Does that mean that phones with keyboards are evil? - Sam Levine
Jérôme, both :) - Paul Buchheit
Schmidt should have excused himself from Apple's board conversations on the iPhone, when he was well aware that Google is (secretly) working on Android & Nexus One. This definitely falls within the definition of evil. I'm actually surprised it's legal. - Tal Broda
I don't think Android was secret -- Google bought the company a long time ago. - Paul Buchheit
Kevin, isn't this 1-2 years too late? - Tal Broda
None of you feel that Eric Schmidt sitting on Apple's board while developing competing technology is evil? - Richard Luther
It was disclosed to Apple and they chose to continue having him on the board (or do you think he just make up a random excuse to leave the room every time the iPhone was discussed?) Why would that be evil Richard? - Paul Buchheit
I don't get it. Why do Apple fanboys hate competition? I personally love it that the iPad is perceived as competition to the Kindle. Competition is good for the consumer! - Piaw Na
@Piaw Okay, fine. Let Jobs sit on the Google board while developing an Apple search engine. - Richard Luther
Richard, if he disclosed that fact, and Google still wanted him on the board, then there would be nothing wrong with doing that. - Paul Buchheit
And I wouldn't mind at all if Apple tried its hand at a search engine. In fact, they did do spotlight. :-) - Piaw Na
Here's the deal, folks. It's not about hating competition, it's about hating working together. Apple and Google have historically had strong ties. The two companies have worked closely on many products. Both companies have benefitted, and IMO consumers have benefitted. Do you think Google helped or harmed that relationship when they decided to compete directly with Apple? - Richard Luther
They harmed the relationship but helped the world. That seems like a fair deal to me. We should be nervous when big companies get too close. - Paul Buchheit
I was always uncomfortable with that relationship. - Piaw Na
Richard, Google decided to enter the mobile OS space before Apple had a phone. - Daniel Dulitz
This is a movie we've seen before: - Richard Luther
Paul, I agree that the competition this situation created is great for us, the consumers, but if you look at when Eric recused himself, and consider when the first iPhone shipped, you will see a problem. - Tal Broda
Sure, I see a problem, but the problem is too MUCH implicit collusion between Google and Apple, not too little. I do think that it is probably true that the close relationship between Google and Apple led them to compete less than they otherwise would have, and that was a bit "evil". But that makes it GOOD that that is changing. - David desJardins