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Paul Kinlan › Likes
4 Cop Cars destroyed chasing crackhead through cornfield. WTF?! - http://www.dizzy-dee.com/news...
Brian, Victor Ryden, esther ♥ ♫ and 6 other people liked this
Wouldn't this dude have run out of gas? 4 cars? LOL!
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
from Bookmarklet
Crop-circle of aliens on crack.
- Mellissa
4 cars??? My word. he'd better be paying 100% tax for the rest of his life to pay for that.
- Roberto Bonini
My take is that the idiots that chased this guy through a cornfield, and wrecked their cars should pay for them. There's really no excuse for it.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
anyone remember the movie Signs? there's always aliens inside those cornfields.
- Bora Mesut PALAS
so you're suggesting that the aliens infiltrated the bodies of the cops, and chased the crackhead until they wrecked 4 cars? All as a clever ruse to prevent us from noticing what they're doing to the cows 2 fields over? Makes sense to me.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
International growth has started to completely dominate on FriendFeed since August. Below is an unlabeled graph of page views on FriendFeed this month, broken down by country. Guess which country is the largest green slice below? (Hint: it is not English-speaking)
Jimminy Fuller, Adrian, Myrna and 227 other people liked this
Iran!
- Marshall Kirkpatrick
Turkey??
- Roberto Bonini
from iPhone
We are still blocked in Iran
- Bret Taylor
Turkey
- Cliff Gerrish
Me
- Johnny Worthington
Brazil?
- Marshall Kirkpatrick
turkey, imho.
- 1Co
Oh and good to see you bret.
- Roberto Bonini
from iPhone
Turkey is in fact the green slice. Orange is also not English speaking. Guess which country :)
- Bret Taylor
france
- WorldofHiglet
Japan or Italy? Maybe Portugal?
- Itachi
Hmm.. Turkey is the biggest international... I am not surprised (:
- Ozgur Demir
i totally don't know my FF :(
- Marshall Kirkpatrick
Orange - Russia? :)
- Frère Noël
FF is rising fast in Turkey I guess. And will probably continue to rise for some time. Celebrities are joining too (:
- Hakan Deryal
I am guessing the orange is Canada :P
- Johnny Worthington
COUNTRY OR CONTINENT?UNITED STATES OF AMERICA....
- Pam Gwenzi
@Brent. is USA one of these countries ? or does chart only show internationals ?
- Ozgur Demir
USA is blue. About 23% of our page views now.
- Bret Taylor
Does Australia get a slice?
- Johnny Worthington
@Bret, Can we get more info about Turkey in FF?
- Hakan Deryal
India
- Hayes Haugen
The orange slice is actually Italy, believe it or not. Turkey and Italy have been growing like gangbusters the past few months.
- Bret Taylor
@Bret. yes, your guess is correct (about gangs) (:
- Ozgur Demir
Sweet, correct guess :)
- Itachi
Turkey. hehe :)
- Oğuz Serdar
from Android
What is the gray then, Bret?
- Itachi
what is the gray?
- Mycaptain
some of our friends from US don't know about FF, lol :)
- Ufuk Özgül
Gray is "other"
- Bret Taylor
where other is proxied users from Iran. ;)
- EricaJoy
Both China and Iran would have been in there if they were not both blocked currently
- Bret Taylor
Is Russia any of the other slices pictured above? (other than gray)
- Itachi
That's where Australia is, in the grey :)
- Glenn Slaven
OMG. Friendfeed is going the way of Orkut ;) Btw, is Norway/Scandinavia even visible in all this ? Just curious.
- Thomas Bøhm
@thomas. even though Orkut is Turkish (the guy), it is (site) not big in Turkey.
- Ozgur Demir
Just look at the public feed for 2 secs or 2 hours - yep, definitely.
- Micah Wittman
from iPhone
Facebook has a very similar story as far as I know.. we are a communicative nation:)
- Neşe Uyanık
Who's Gray? It's Gray, Louis of course :)
- Micah Wittman
Thank you for sharing this graph, Bret.
- Micah Wittman
Interesting - though for the sake of data visualization, pie charts are the worst of all.... :)
- See-ming Lee 李思明 SML
See-ming, a-hem, take a look at your avatar ;)
- Micah Wittman
@Bret, what is the exact number of Turkish people on FF?
- Ozkan Altuner
Ozkan, I'd be curious to know too, but I have a feeling there's an internal policy about not releasing absolute numbers, hence the percentages. But it never hurts to ask :)
- Micah Wittman
@Micah, it's the page view, however, not the number of users :)
- Ozkan Altuner
Good point, Ozkan. But I can't remember Visitor or View counts ever publicly reported before. But today could be the first time! :)
- Micah Wittman
Iran :-)
- Nimaa
Everyone knows teh fuckin answer Bret. It's Turkey. Mahir loves you http://www.ikissyou.org
- Ahmet Alp Balkan
from iPod
I'm not surprised that Turkey is the green portion. I've seen more and more Turkish posts in my home feed. I thought it was just a biased sample, but perhaps not.
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
Iran
- Assal
Turkey
- Shey, Jamaican of FF
Intense competition between Iran and Turkey occurred :D
- Nimaa
Hmmmmmmmmmmm...MOZAMBIQUE luminous orange l guess
- Pam Gwenzi
the desire to push the boundaries of internet of the turkish is troubling. the possesive tendecies of the turkish can be observed in the currently popular ''ff bu deYil'' (this is not ff) comment. turks are crowding ff, westerners are in panic!
- ferayebend
turks are invading ff!!! call norad
- aadagger
international growth dominates FF and yet the USA dominates the world. Not always in good ways either. What is the link? I don't think there is one. All I can say is that I love the USA and I love FriendFeed. What does it all mean? More free, cold beer is needed to find the answers.
- Morgan Haley
.. because, Turkish Facebook users are 10-20 years old. FF is very good alternative for older users. (and in addition Twitter is non-useful)
- Murat Tatar
Bret would that mean that FF has around 200K Turkish users? http://siteanalytics.compete.com/friendf...
- Cem ARGUN
Murat Tatar. So you've seen that Turkish Facebook users demographics ? even though it's unpublished.
- Ozgur Demir
SO when are we gonna party BRET? :)
- Bahriye
Actually, I wonder when Bret is gonna post something like "FF bu degil!"..
- Ozgur Demir
What do we care :) FF is this. And this is the rl. SO THE QUESTION IS: When are we gonna party!
- Bahriye
Bret start learning Turkish. You should have guessed from the reactions the days a.) you changed the design, b.) announced the FB deal. :)
- Cem ARGUN
I've noticed it on my feed. It's all good.
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
I've noticed a huge increase in Iran, peaking at about 7-8am Eastern
- H0llywoodWh0re
Just curious, what's happening with total page views? (I don't trust alexa, compete, etc.)
- Bruce Lewis
@Bret, 1- Turkey, 2- USA, 3- Italy, 4- India, 5- Japan, 6- Germany, 7- UK & Russia 8 - Pakistan 9- Iran 10- Canada.. Is it True?
- Kemalettin Bulamacı
italian power! yeah! ;)
- Dario Salvelli
Anyone worth their weight in tweets knows that it's turkey.
- Richard A.
knew it english speaker are way down
- ffcode
Turkey?
- ★ Soner Gönül
If that is so, can we get some way of filtering by language? I want to follow more international people but be able to ignore them or their friends when they post in what I cannot read :)
- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
Turkiye :)
- Mustafa Çamaltı
italy rules!! :-)
- batta
Turkey
- Melih Bahadır Varol
My bet's on India
- Rod Nicolson
Country dominating FriendFeed? My guess...Brazil (have to bet on the homeland)
- Victoria Harres Akers
Btw, FriendFeed is blocked in Turkish Schools :(
- F. Batuhan Icoz
from iPhone
It's blocked in US schools that I attended as well F. Batuhan :(
- Itachi
Italy?
- Matte
You may have to develop "hide by language" feature very soon.
- Bahadır Yağan
Afghanistan
- Pam Gwenzi
go italy!
- Alessandro
How much does the UK get?
- Kol Tregaskes
Turkey is the winner btw.
- Kol Tregaskes
YEAH TURKEY !
- Çağatay " SKYLAB " Şama
different kind of widgets? I don't like with blue line. years fighting with it :) and option to change fonts. please :)
- Okeane
#Turkey of course ;)
- Volkan Özçelik
IRAN :)
- ДMIROVSKY☂امیروفسکی
Iran خودشم تو روحت که دیشب فرفر و خراب کرده بودی . اگه تونستی بفهم چی گفتم !
- حاج مهدی ©
Gotta be Turkey. It is Thanksgiving weekend, after all!
- Mark "Godt Nyt Ǻr"
:)
- Susan Beebe
Is there any place to get a full breakdown, including the smaller slices, by country with percentages? Thanks.
- Mikeynitle
@bret, what is the number of friendfeed users in total?
- elodeon
reposted via: skutchy origin: skutchy 18 reposts - http://meme.yahoo.com/ivanfil...
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giuseppe c. | markgreene, Justin Korn, Süleyman Sönmez and 10 other people liked this
gorgeous Ivan..
- GökTaşı
Thanks Gök. Hope you're having a great Monday.
- Iván Abrego
:)
- GökTaşı
what is it? some space plantation?
- ffcode
A playground.
- Iván Abrego
how did you stitch it in a circle
- ffcode
@ffcode That's not my work. But, you can see how it's done and some examples here: http://www.webdesignerdepot.com/2009...
- Iván Abrego
it's really very nice. i love it :)
- GökTaşı
nice! this one looks like those gravity creators in space since in space there isn't gravity so a centrifuge machine is employed and food etc is grown on the inside of this centrifuge :)
- ffcode
i'm dizzy
- Morgan Haley
I guess that's another reason I like this type of photography. It does look like the inside of a rotating space station.
- Iván Abrego
RT @jonpauldavies: IN YOUR FACE GREGGS!!!! IN YOUR FACE!!!! @paulkinlan gets his prize from @spookysayers ! WIN!!!! http://yfrog.com/j393hj
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Paul Kinlan liked this
@Scobleizer (1/2) You can't have it both ways. You publicly stated over and over that FriendFeed is dead so people listened to you and left.
Charlotte M, Tony Ruscoe, Jesse Stay and 2 other people liked this
Nginx & Comet: Low Latency Server Push - igvita.com - http://www.igvita.com/2009...
Paul Kinlan liked this
The Twitter "lists" feature has arrived for me...
Paul Kinlan liked this
It is very good.
- Paul Kinlan
Indeed it is, I look forward to the Twitter 3rd party clients adopting list support.
- David Peacock
List of FF tools and services:
nat bas, Roman Zolotarev, Opensource Obscure and 18 other people liked this
When adding to the list, please include the service name, type (bookmarklet, web app, browser extension, etc) and short description including links to the service website and FriendFeed post/group with more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
ffcheck (bookmarklet): The ffcheck bookmarklet gives you a quick way to find out if there are any existing items on FriendFeed related to the web page you're viewing. See http://ffcheck.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
FFHolic (web app): FFholic is a place for FriendFeed users to find lists of most liked and commented entries, most popular rooms and most popular users. See http://www.ffholic.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedTranslate (user scripts and bookmarklets): Translates title and comments of a friendfeed entry to a chosen language. See http://wittman.org/project... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
feed-buster (feed transformation service): Feed-buster is a service that enables automatic importing of images and other media for RSS/ATOM feeds in FriendFeed. See http://friendfeed.com/feed-bu... and http://code.google.com/p... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
FFWho (web app) - FFWho allows you to see people who commented, liked your feeds and subscribed you but not in your subscription list. See http://ffwho.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
F2P (web app for mobile): f2p is a web-based FriendFeed application for mobile users. See http://dev.ctor.org/f2p/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
FriendFeedLinks (web app): FriendFeedLinks is a memetracker that tracks links shared on FriendFeed. See http://friendfeedlinks.com for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
FriendDeck (web & desktop app): FriendDeck is an aggregator built upon FriendFeed. See http://www.frienddeck.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
ffOldAvatars (web app): ffOldAvatars takes you back and shows previous profile pictures of your FriendFeed account. See http://ffoldavatars.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
FriendFeedSpy (web app): FriendFeedSpy is an aggregator built upon FriendFeed. See http://friendfeedspy.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
whendidyoujoinfriendfeed (web app) - Whendidyoujoinfriendfeed finds approximately when you started posting to FriendFeed. See http://whendidyoujoinfriendfeed.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
FFsummary (e-mail service): FFsummary will e-mail your feed summary consisting of popular posts to you on a daily, weekly or monthly basis. See http://ffsummary.com for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
ffsms (sms service) - ffsms brings you ability of posting to FriendFeed via SMS. See http://ffsms.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
ffScheduler (web app): Schedule your FriendFeed posts and send them automatically when you want. See http://ffscheduler.com/ for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
ffollo: http://www.ffollo.com is a simple service to auto follow users who share similar interest as you on FriendFeed. Ffollo will follow users based on how you use Friendfeed.
- Paul Kinlan
friendfeedCommentAnchor (user script & bookmarklet) - Adds a permalink to each comment. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://wittman.org/project... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedCommentMiniAvatar (user script) - Adds a mini avatar to each FriendFeed comment. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://wittman.org/friendf... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
dnd-bookmarklet (bookmarklet): FF bookmarklet replacement with drag&drop support. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedPoll (user script): Report statistics on a friendfeed thread used as a poll / survey. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://userscripts.org/scripts... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedForceHttps (user script): Redirects a friendfeed page to a secure connection and render all friendfeed links on page as secure protocol (https). See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://userscripts.org/scripts... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedFilterByService (user script): Shows only FriendFeed feed entries based on user chosen service types via either an inclusion (services to show) or exclusion (services to hide) list. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://userscripts.org/scripts... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedExpandAllCommentsLink (user script): Adds a link (next to Tools link) to expand all rolled-up comments for every post on the current FriendFeed page. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://userscripts.org/scripts... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedCommentHoverReveal (user script): On mouse hover, long FF comments are revealed (avoids needing to click the "more..." link). See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://userscripts.org/scripts... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
http://friendboo.com (web): directly post your updates to your stream from your phone where ever you are and when ever you want too.
- Ahmet Alp Balkan
Cool 3 of my apps are in this list :) FriendDeck, FriendBoo and FFollo :)
- Paul Kinlan
ffspy (web app): FFSPY allows you to find out who unsubscribed from you by sending you hourly, daily or weekly reports via e-mail. Try it out at http://ffspy.com.
- Ivan Zuzak
fftogo (web app for mobile): FFtogo is a web-based FriendFeed application for mobile users. Try it out at http://www.fftogo.com
- Ivan Zuzak
friendfeedTitleCompactor (user script): Compacts the display of friendfeed entry titles. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://userscripts.org/scripts... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
OPMLtoFF (Yahoo Pipe): Combines all feeds in an OPML file into a single feed for easier importing into FriendFeed. See http://friendfeed.com/friendf... for more info.
- Ivan Zuzak
Here is the new one: FFSendImage (http://ffsendimage.com) provides you to send images via their urls ;) #ffsendimage #yay
- Kaan Şengül
It might be better if you separate tools and services with separate posts. The list is awesome but it will get longer and longer.
- Barış (beyn.org)
ffedit (http://ffedit.com): you can edit your friend lists quickly.
- F. Batuhan Icoz
blocks of time and the mechanical facebook - http://russelldavies.typepad.com/plannin...
Luca Di Ciaccio, Carmelo, goldielocks (Laura) and 2 other people liked this
"The second thing was brilliant in exactly the same way that bubblino is brilliant. It was a very silly and perfectly appropriate physicalisation of the character of a social network. It was a Mechanical Facebook badge,"
- giuseppe
from Bookmarklet
Fwd: 华丽蝙蝠车 | 煎蛋 - http://jandan.net/2009... (via http://friendfeed.com/imrchen...)
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Carolyn Chan, YunusYAMANER(CITRIL), Mo Kargas and 3 other people liked this
Niranjan to Niranjan's feed, Persian Cam, Photo Gallery, Fotos, Photographing, Photography United, Fotograf
"A lightning storm flashes over the Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco Bay." - http://www.time.com/time...
Wulffy, Phyllis Hughes, SuezanneC Baskerville and 8 other people liked this
The Amazing Aerial Photography of Jason Hawkes - http://www.cultofmac.com/gallery...
James Myatt, Emma, Nia and 5 other people liked this
"Hawkes has published 25 books of aerial photography, and is always in demand for clients like big advertising agencies and Wired UK. Hawkes (left, with one his regular pilots) works all over the world — a recent shoot was over Las Vegas — but most of his work in in the U.K, especially London. He shoots leaning out of the door of a twin squirrel helicopter, with a tether, of course. He uses stabilizers and often shoots with a Nikon D3 tethered to a Mac. Digital makes aerial photography much easier. He uses GPS to automatically tag the shots (he used to take handwritten notes) and he can shoot thousands of images every time he goes up. He needs to: helicopter rental is very expensive, and he often needs to clear flights when shooting low over London."
- Baard @ Pixum
from Bookmarklet
Amazing interactive 360-degree panoramic view of the entire night sky | Mail Online - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...
Jason A. Samfield, Christian Hollingsworth, Lumino_GmbH and 99 other people liked this
"A new magnificent 800-million-pixel panorama of the entire sky has been unveiled online today. It was stitched together from 1,200 photos by astronomers at the European Southern Observatory from viewing sites in Chile."
- Benjamin Golub
from Bookmarklet
wow!
- Chris Myles
Oh wow. Totally resharing this, thx!
- Ayşe E.
You're not going to see anything like this in the Northern Hemisphere. This is only the night sky for those south of the equator. But it is cool.
- Nina Jansen
WOW!
- Susan Beebe
LOVE it!!
- Roshan Ramachandran
hmmm didn't supply a link in the article! Ahh its the Daily Mail, to explain to non-UK-ites, the Daily Mail is the UK equivalent of Fox News.
- Toby Graham
http://www.gigagalaxyzoom.org/ for the full thing.
- Otto
Also: High res download here: http://videos.spacetelescope.org/gigagal... (25MB). All images are better when used as desktop wallpaper.
- Otto
wow thats huge! 800 megapixels...
- Matt Ellsworth
Truly beautiful! Makes earthlings so small!
- Cool Wired
wow it's beautiful.
- Benjo Castillo
Burning Man - http://geoeyemediaportal.s3.am...
Shea, taranome, Andrew Terry and 28 other people liked this
Wow!!
- Kol Tregaskes
Anyone been to this btw?
- Kol Tregaskes
I live near Black Rock Desert. Never been to Burning Man, tho'.
- Helen Sventitsky
Several people I know have been, including Veo (http://friendfeed.com/veo), Lucas (http://friendfeed.com/fuerve), and Joey (http://www.friendfeed.com/joeybea...). IIRC, Kevin Fox has been, too.
- Rochelle
Oh cool.
- Kol Tregaskes
Yep, Black Rock City (the temporary city created for Burning Man) is pretty impressive to behold. Most don't realize it's an actual city with streets, addresses and infrastructure.
- veo
I'd love to go here.
- Kol Tregaskes
Here is another shot where you can see the whole city from the air - it's shaped like a big "C": http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- veo
Wow, thanks veo.
- Kol Tregaskes
Rochelle, Kevin F hasn't been ... yet. I'm trying to convince him to go next year. :) Kol, there's a (somewhat sparse) Burning Man group on FF here: http://friendfeed.com/burning...
- Stephen Mack
What happens at Burning Man stays at Burning Man =)
- Brodie Beta
What do you do at Burning Man? Just get naked, or what?
- Kimber Scott
I have many different answers to that but right now the best one is in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Stephen Mack
Thanks Stephen! The last picture I've ever seen of Burning Man was of a naked wedding. Everybody was covered in mud. Of course, that was a long time ago. I never knew they did stuff like this. Very cool!
- Kimber Scott
Kimber, you're welcome, I think they did a great job on that video. But everyone's experience there is different, and can vary wildly -- I'm sure there were mud-covered naked weddings even at this year's Burning Man.
- Stephen Mack
Kimber: We can't talk about what happens at burning man. lol
- Brodie Beta
It's all right, Brodie. I can't talk about a lot of things, too. ;)
- Kimber Scott
I had no idea it was so "organized"... this shows more advance planning than Houston!
- Mark "Godt Nyt Ǻr"
Steven, that is an AWESOME VIDEO! It really translates the exploration/wild party aspect of Burning Many quite well.
- veo
Brodie, have you been then? :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
I think it shows planning better than most cities!
- Nathalie, Dreamer of FF
Thanks, Smee. I've subbed and will watch the vid in a bit.
- Kol Tregaskes
Clearly Burning Man is just a big naked drug fest, man. Nothing interesting there except hippies and burn outs.
- veo
I went in 1994. It was a very different event then.
- Spidra Webster
Spidra, what was it like then?
- Kol Tregaskes
The more I write about fat pings the more I'm convinced it's the only way. We're not trying to solve present use-cases (RSS distribution). We're trying to enable... - http://www.onebigfluke.com/2009...
NaHi, Paul Kinlan, Louis Gray and 3 other people liked this
The key question: What if RSS were on the order of e-mail in terms of number and distribution? E-mail moves pretty quickly now, does it not?
- Louis Gray
Awful Programming Advice - http://bramcohen.livejournal.com/69753...
Anton Yuzhaninov, Haris bin Ali, Vincio and 34 other people liked this
"Subclassing is not an end in and of itself, it's a technique which is occasionally handy. And I'll let you in on a little secret - I personally almost never use subclassing. It's not that I one day decided that subclassing is bad and that one should avoid it, it's that as I got better at coming up with simple designs I wound up using it less and less, until eventually I almost stopped using it entirely. Subclassing is, quite simply, awkward. Any design which uses subclassing should be treated with skepticism. Any design which requires subclassing across encapsulation boundaries should be assumed to be a disaster."
- Paul Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
I tend to agree, at least about the "subclassing is generally bad" part.
- Paul Buchheit
especially true in duck typed languages where you don't need subclassing for polymorphism
- Karl Rosaen
"Occasionally handy" sounds spot on to me. OO languages often lead people to overemphasize inheritance.
- Bruce Lewis
Subclassing seems to be necessary when you are using a library of third party components in a non-duck-typed language and you encounter requirements that one of your components doesn't support. Sucks when it happens, but what else are you supposed to do?
- Jason Wehmhoener
Meh. I disagree, but only provisionally. Subclassing examples are uniformly bad. Subclassing in practice tends to be bad because it's done either a) by newbs or b) by people who've not written lots of OOP, or c) by people who've never had to maintain anything. I've written plenty of good cases of subclasses, which turned out to be extremely handy. The problem with subclassing is that...
more...
- Otto
Otto++
- Claudio Cicali ♋
I think one should be careful to separate sub-typing from subclassing, and interface inheritance vs implementation inheritance, and also virtual dispatch (C++/Java) vs multimethods vs Haskell-style typeclasses. Subclassing as a notion is too broad to apply a brush with all the cons. Implementation inheritance, for example, is usually used to save delegation boilerplate and allow 'hooks'...
more...
- Ray Cromwell
I noticed that implementation inheritance is explicitly excluded from noop: http://code.google.com/p/noop/. I do find it amusing that the language which might have actually had the "best" design for OO programing was Visual Basic..
- Nick Lothian
Otto, I would use "subclassing User objects based on login method" as a good example of misusing inheritance. What if Users vary in other ways, are you going to create subtypes of each one? The login method should not determine the type of user, but should probably be its own object (with a generic login interface perhaps).
- Paul Buchheit
I think standard OODA principles (which are rarely followed) would advise against putting responsibility for knowing how to log in on a User object. Login code must typically be privileged and depending on security mode (sandboxed vs capability based) you wouldn't necessarily want privileged code inside of user, which is likely an object that has many consumers.
- Ray Cromwell
As much as I generally avoid subclassing, the one place where I used it most effectively was a Shape class that I wrote for a vector drawing program. I didn't have a Square class, but you can be damn sure that Ellipse and Rectangle were closely related -- the only difference is the Paint() method! And why wouldn't RoundedRect be a subclass of Rectangle?
- Gabe
I don't do a lot of OO programming, but last year I was teaching a python for linguists class, and we did cover OO some. I used an example of a bird class, with a subclass for penguins, in which the fly() method was overwritten. Is this example just as bad as the rectangle and square? Do people agree with the comment that a subclass should have all the same properties as the parent class (specifically that width = height for a square, but not a rectangle)?
- Robert Felty
Rob, I tend to think that subclassing is good for when you want to describe an object that's just like some other object, just with a few differences. Why write a whole new Square class? Just take a Rectangle and override Height and Weight to make sure they're always the same.
- Gabe
If I were teaching beginners, I would just tell them to not use subclassing. People learning to program should focus on learning to program, not learning a set of language features.
- Paul Buchheit
SICP agrees with you, Paul.
- Bruce Lewis
Would you teach them to use objects and interfaces?
- Cristo
Not to start with, but certainly before subclassing.
- Paul Buchheit
If you were teaching beginners, why would the word subclassing ever enter into their vocabulary?
- Gabe
I'd tell them to start with Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs :)
- Ray Cromwell
But Ray, that book uses a weird language, Scheme. Would you use a web site written using Scheme?
- Bruce Lewis
^Is that even possible? LOL did Scheme in freshman year, hated it
- LANjackal
The Syracuse University CS program used Scheme as the first course back in the early 80s. it was an interesting choice. They also used the first edition of Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs, so that's probably why.
- Cristo
I'm still waiting for Ray's answer. If Scheme is such a good language for thinking about programming, would you use a web site written with it?
- Bruce Lewis
I think these days Python would be a good learning language, combined with a text like Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs using Python.
- Cristo
Article claims: "Taken literally, it would never make sense to make a full-blown class for such a trivial piece of functionality. There simply would be more lines of code taken up making declarations than could possibly be saved by convenience." That seems likely to be untrue if you have a program which uses a lot of Squares. So: the article's case seems pretty feeble.
- Tim Tyler
I like the book SICP not because of Lisp/Scheme, but because of the way it incrementally attacks programming problems. Truthfully, it can be taught using any language, although some are more concise than others, and stuff like C pointers and manual memory allocation obscure some algorithms.
- Ray Cromwell
Ray, I was trying to trick you into agreeing to use http://ourdoings.com/ but you didn't fall for it. Curses, foiled again.
- Bruce Lewis
Really, it's hard to imagine a better programming language for beginners than Python. In particular, Python programs do what it looks like they should do, and you don't have to waste time hunting for missing brackets or semicolons.
- Gabe
Paul, users are actually a good example because your users tend to not vary a lot from one to another in many ways. They always have the same fields, etc. Generally speaking, of course. Also, the login method is an important way to separate user types because different methods require different approaches to keep the user "logged in" sometimes, and also might require differing inputs...
more...
- Otto
from iPhone
@Gabe BASIC, COBOL, and FORTRAN? :) I think human beings being very visual creatures, and visual feedback providing pleasing stimulus, some language deeply integrated with graphics is probably best for first language, ala turtle graphics or EToys.
- Ray Cromwell
Ray: Python is also good because it doesn't have arcane syntax (like COBOL and FORTRAN). I agree that BASIC is a great language for beginners, but it's just too old. If you modernized BASIC, I think you'd come up with something like Python.
- Gabe
MIT recently switched to Python for their into programming courses (I think from Scheme). I like "Think Python" as a nice introduction to programming. Best of all, the book is open source (written in LaTeX) http://www.greenteapress.com/thinkpy...
- Robert Felty
You can make a good case multiple inheritance is bad, but subclassing is such an integral part of OO languages like Java and C++ that I can't see any way you should avoid or discourage its use. You can argue when you should teach it to new programmers, but any experienced programmer developing any non trivial architecture or API should be making extensive use of it in the right places. Its a primary mechanism for code reuse, maintainability and consist behavior. Reference Cocoa, Android, Qt...
- Ed Millard
No one has mentioned Smalltalk/Squeak as a teaching language. These languages are very nice for teaching because of the way the runtime image is integrated with the IDE as a kind of persistent database. People can write code to tickle objects, inspect anything, and see immediate results. EToys is a classic example of what you can do.
- Ray Cromwell
I think a good amount of problems (with subclassing) comes from the packages/modules system and importing classes from other packages/modules creating on the long run messy dependencies between modules (and violating module isolation); I find Gilad Bracha's Newspeak an interesting take on this problem, you can read...
more...
- Marco Fabbri
Otto's example has a baked-in assumption that each user only has one login method, whereas (as FriendFeed shows) having multiple login methods for a given user is an advantage. If you subclass for login method, you make it very hard to support logging in the same user in different ways...
- Kevin Marks
tornado's auth example uses subclassing :) but actually, it looks like it's designed so, using multiple inheritance in python, you can mixin multiple auth types? http://github.com/faceboo... another reason why this issue isn't so cut and dry :)
- Karl Rosaen
Kevin: Not at all. You can have the same user with multiple login methods. That's the beauty of it. You're storing the login methodology separate from the underlying user in that manner. I've done this before, it works fine for any number of login methods, on all users. The one you instantiate is just which way they used to login that particular time. If they login differently, you...
more...
- Otto
actually, no, looks like tornado auth is intended to mix *one* auth mechanism in, but as Otto mentions, you could do this for the appropriate instance
- Karl Rosaen
@robert felty, thanks for the link to the open source python book. I'm learning more about it now.
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
@lanjackal I'm a fellow engineer and number crunchers of almost 14 years. My coworkers are split between Matlab and C++ for default implementations. Three of us use both pretty regularly (although I lean towards c++). I prefer faster construction, flexibility, and execution of c++ and the libraries we've fashioned. Matlab has superior visualization tools but takes FOREVER to run anything intensive.
- Mark Essel
from iPhone
The difference in creating Rectangle and Square classes vs creating methods to create square and rectangle in a polygon class is that in latter you do an Object Oriented Analysis first, rather than pushing your own limited knowledge of system requirements (like you think of a requirement for rectangles and squares but don't think about entire system) into design
- thequark
The technology behind Tornado, FriendFeed's web server - Bret Taylor's blog - http://bret.appspot.com/entry...
"Serhat Ozan", Bryan Tsai, Sebastian and 293 other people liked this
We have open sourced our web server. Download it at http://www.tornadoweb.org/. Check out the Facebook announcement at http://developers.facebook.com/news...
- Bret Taylor
from Bookmarklet
See a live chat demo: http://chan.friendfeed.com:8888/
- Casey Muller
*have no idea what I am looking at*
- Joe
Wow! Thanks so much, Bret and co!
- Doug Beeferman
this was very interesting; good job
- RAPatton
neat
- anna sauce
I wonder what the engineering decision was to not use a WSGI interface.
- mikepk
mikepk: it supports WSGI, but it is not WSGI by default because WSGI does not support non-blocking I/O for things like hanging connections. See http://www.tornadoweb.org/documen....
- Bret Taylor
This actually is a very good piece of code! Thanks folks!
- directeur
cool, Bret, thanks :) I was just heading through the docs now.
- mikepk
Thanks for doing this, Bret! That's some pretty cool stuff.
- Keith Bourgoin
that's great. thanks..
- Onur Gündüz
oh man, this is so awesome, thanks guys!
- Charles Ying
Is "tonado" a typo?
- Bruce Lewis
from fftogo
I'm hacking my own python web framework at the moment, so now the choice on whether I want to switch gears to this or not. I'm liking what I see so far.
- mikepk
Bruce: Yes
- Casey Muller
Wow.. Thanks!! pretty much makes my day.. which is scary in it's own rite.
- Chris Myles
Great news! Cheers to the FF team!
- Egon Willighagen
Nice new title Brett.."Facebook Director of Products".. a good sign of things to come!
- Chris Myles
very very glad to hear this bit: "Tornado is a core piece of infrastructure that powers FriendFeed's real-time functionality, which we plan to actively maintain."
- Chris Heath
Great work
- James Myatt
does this have any implications for friendfeed.com in terms of competition and shelf-life?
- Franz Sittampalam
Franz: enables widespread adoption which leads to greater influence of the technique
- Mike Chelen
So excited this is out. So many personal projects I have been wanting to build with it :)
- Bret Taylor
Bret, do you have a set of coding conventions you use? E.g. looks like you use mixed case for classes and underbar separators for methods.
- Cristo
Fantastic, Bret (and team)!
- Micah Wittman
A very good project!...you know if will be possibile to use Tornado with other technogies except Python (such as JEE, Ruby On Rails, etc.)?
- Nicola Junior Vitto
Cristo: we tried to use the official Python coding conventions, though we may have inadvertently strayed. Those conventions are: ClassNames, method_names, variable_names
- Bret Taylor
Brilliant! I hope you can provide very valuable input for the next round of #python WSGI, which desperately needs a next round ;)
- Uche Ogbuji
Re: WSGI needing help, see http://www.b-list.org/weblog...
- Uche Ogbuji
grt
- Xitong Liu
"Facebook's opensource technologies" link is broken on tornadoweb.org ..
- Onur Gündüz
Onur, worked for me - and still works now
- Chris Heath
Very cool, in case someone needs a high-end Web Server for a project, FriendFeed just open-sourced theirs, & apparently, it screams..
- Alex Schleber
Nicola: there is a Ruby example - http://gist.github.com/184760
- Mike Chelen
thx Mike, but this is a kind of eventmachine (that sounds good) for Ruby, not a Tornado client or wrapper...isn't it?
- Nicola Junior Vitto
Excellent! Thank you. Was eagerly waiting for the day to come after looking this just 1 month ago; "changeset: 5afb8a445cad / date: 2009-08-11 16:34:48 / description: Initial open source packages" http://changelog.friendfeed.com/2009...
- NaHi
from f2p
Chris, yes it is fixed.. I swear it was broken ..
- Onur Gündüz
Good catch, NaHi. :)
- Micah Wittman
Thanks guys. Really appriciated.
- Roberto Bonini
from iPhone
That's great. thanks Bret :-)
- Nimaa
Nice job on the non-blocking stuff Bret!
- Mitchell Tsai
"We have open sourced our web server" @bret took over a year but is worth the wait. thx for the follow through ~ http://bret.appspot.com/entry...
- Peter Renshaw
Ohhh, ummm, btw, your underhanded behind the scenes sell out still rankles my human decency, & a lot of others too, as should yours...thumbs down/dislike x 47.5 million dollars, however not being bitter of course, keep ignorance & bliss
- sofarsoShawn
As I expected :) brilliant
- FFTornado
that's the sound of I believe 100000000? or so hands clapping...& giving you the BOOOO-URNS if I'm not mistaken...
- sofarsoShawn
oh you sonsabitchez this fscking rules! why so badass, ff? thank. you. :)
- mike
So, can we say; Python is the future?
- Ozkan Altuner
Nice code. Started to look at it today. Thanks for doing this. Now to start testing this on some projects I had been working on.
- Altan Khendup
What OS do you guys run FF on?
- Diego Barros
Diego: we run on Linux.
- Bret Taylor
from email
@bret just out of curiosity - what would necessitate usage of such an engine for a *personal* project? :)
- Michael Bravo
Michael: it is a nice framework to use for any project in my opinion (though I am clearly biased). If you are doing anything real-time like the chat demo, something like Tornado is certainly necessary/useful regardless of the size of the project.
- Bret Taylor
from email
@bret and for little-sized hardware? should have try it on Maemo based :)))
- A.T.
@silpol I kinda fail to see Maemo devices being used for servers (unless it's some kind of satellite-based or other covert server maybe :) )
- Michael Bravo
from IM
@mbravo you never know... there are some unusual (and cool) apps for web servers, granted you abstain (on purpose) from classical models, e.g.server farm somewhere there and herds of clients connecting to it...
- A.T.
Bret: Cool, thanks. Just out of curiosity, which flavour of Linux is preferred by FriendFeed?
- Diego Barros
I think this is the best answer for the ultimate question: "Does python needs yet another web framework?" While most of us would say why, when one come across this, a real world proven technology, serving zillions of pages a day, one would say, well, why not. actually, why not even take it an try to integrate out next web app with it? great job! seems like joining FB won't do you any harm ;-)
- Tzury Bar Yochay
We've seen tornado vs twisted, how about tornado vs rails? http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Tzury Bar Yochay
http://chan.friendfeed.com:8888/ It doesn't work. I'd like to see chat.js :)
- Анатолий Шарифулин
FriendFeed's web server, open sourced? This is great! Welcoome, Tornado!
- Thierry R. Andriamirado
Bret: how do you proxy long-living connections through nginx? Vanilla nginx buffers everything.
- Alex Kapranoff
nginx has a configuration option to turn off buffering.
- Tristan Seligmann
FriendFeed Not Twitter, Is The REAL Real-Time Search Engine - http://shegeeks.net/friendf...
Paul Kinlan liked this
pubsubhubbub - We gotta come up with an acronym for this! - http://code.google.com/p...
Eric Logan, Mac Sharp, Paul Kinlan and John E. Bredehoft liked this
Here are some I've been thinking about lately: PU-SU-HU-BU or how about PUSHUB?
- Bryan Lee
People have been calling it "Hubbub" for short. I've also seen PSH (pronounced "Push") or PSHB.
- Brett Slatkin
I have seen PSHB. But I always pronounce Pubsubhubbub with its full name. And I bet Brett would like to know who I introduced it to today. :)
- Louis Gray
I think Hubbub sounds good.
- Bryan Lee
Bah! =P I also saw that "PuSH" going around as the short version, but I think that's still too generic and ambiguous. In conversation I always just say 'Hubbub.
- Brett Slatkin
Thats 3 now for Hubbub. I declare it the new short name for pubsubhubbub. :)
- Bryan Lee
bub, just bub
- Cliff Gerrish
Ok I get it now. Pub=Publish, Sub=Subscribe, Hub=the central server but where does the "bub" come in? I guess the bub is for Awesome. hehe
- Bryan Lee
"hubbub" = all the talk about it ;)
- Brett Slatkin
Seems like PSHB is emerging as the standard... although I wouldn't mind PUSHUB...since I sorta... well... for some reason I own pushub.com. Hm.
- Ken Sheppardson
i like the long name pubsubhubub has an anti acronym feel, but is and acronym
- Robert Higgins
Video Game Classics Tie Designs - http://www.walyou.com/blog...
Mustafa Dalcı, Lily, Brian and 25 other people liked this
Oğuz Serdar to Oğuz's feed, Architectural & Interior Design, Funny Pics and Videos, Ideas & Inspiration, iDESIGN, Creative Design, Photography United
80+ Strange and Fantastic Buildings Architecture - http://www.instantshift.com/2009...
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Al fine, Ahmet Kutay, Mine Ekim and 16 other people liked this
"On the difference between the ideals of “architecture” and mere “construction”, the renowned 20th C. architect Le Corbusier wrote: “You employ stone, wood, and concrete, and with these materials you build houses and palaces: that is construction. Ingenuity is at work. But suddenly you touch my heart, you do me good. I am happy and I say: This is beautiful. That is Architecture”."
- Oğuz Serdar
from Bookmarklet
BBC NEWS | Technology | Thousands call for Turing apology - http://news.bbc.co.uk/2...
Thierry Lhôte and Paul Kinlan liked this
the great brain of the world
- Igor Poltavskiy
from Bookmarklet
How Big Is the Apple iPhone App Economy? The Answer Might Surprise You - http://gigaom.com/2009...
Fabio Angelucci, sean andersen, Sebastian and 3 other people liked this
"If I were to tell you that Apple’s app economy was worth more than $2.5 billion a year, you would laugh hysterically, shake your head and walk out of the room, yes?"
- Oğuz Serdar
from Bookmarklet
SaveOurSmile: madafan.com and Paul Kinlan liked this
Driftwood Sculptures - A natural history of Britain -I love these driftwood sculptures of life-size horses by Heather Jansch. They are built from driftwood collected on local beaches. They seem to capture the energy and movement of real horses. Image from here - http://iberianature.com/britain...
Bill Scherer, Kimber Scott, Paul Kinlan and Iván Abrego liked this
No one like these? These are wonderfull
- Chris Bellinger
Oğuzcan Yavaş to Oğuzcan's feed, Crazy Gadgets, Creative Design, Ads of the World, Advertising and Media, Funny Pics and Videos
9GAG - Toilet-Time Golf - http://9gag.com/gag/10888/
Nihan Cumraligil, Tom Graber, Jan Ole Peek and 12 other people liked this
عالمی داره ها!!!
- Business Blogger【ツ】™
Only guys would think this is a good idea......
- Stephanie Segel
speaking as a guy, i think this is heinous.
- Joe Silence is Dr. Teeth!
Knock, knock, knock!!! You ever coming out?!
- R1CC1
Better than reading mag.
- Business Blogger【ツ】™
Are you playing with your putter again?
- R1CC1
Fwd: Taken at the Right Moment! (via http://friendfeed.com/advertl...)
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levonardo, Chris Heath, Katie is Frittering and 15 other people liked this
w0w
- Ahmet Kakıcı
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1... is another one I just saw
- Paul Kinlan
@Paul, that's good too, thanks.
- Müjdat Korkmaz
wow that good!!!!!!! i likend!!!
- Bethzaida Almendarez
Is there a quick way of deleting unwanted auto added on follows by ffollo?
Paul Kinlan liked this
I have zillions f feeds added on and am trying to un-follow them the painfully hard one by one way ...in the mean time I have disabled ffolo
- viki saigal
SOMEONE PLSE HELP - DROWNING IN A FLURRY OF POSTS
- viki saigal
Looks like you're down to 498 subs now. I don't know an automatic way, and I've never used ffollo, but the best thing to do is go to http://friendfeed.com/friends... then click "Add/remove friends" at the top, then in the dialog box that appears, click off the ones you don't want to see in your home feed. Then create a new list, such as "ffollo" and repeat those steps to turn on the ones you want to see in the new list.
- Stephen Mack
Thanks Stephen ! but this is bloody nuisance . To unfollow people is a complete nightmare - you can check in any time you like but you can never leave !
- viki saigal
Well, what's ffollo's URL? That tool caused the mess, they should be responsible for cleaning it up!
- Stephen Mack
ffollo is www.ffollo.com - however there are numberous options for it not to clog your main feed up.
- Paul Kinlan
you can also go to "collage" in ffollo and it will open up a list of everyone it followed, click on the icon and it takes you to their page.
- Paul Kinlan
Trying out ffollo to make new friends on FriendFeed.
Gerald Hildebrandt, Валентин, Morton Fox and 10 other people liked this
Let me know how it goes, or post to the Ffollo Group http://friendfeed.com/ffollo - I am still ironing out issues.
- Paul Kinlan
Ah, now I understand why I did get lots of new Friends but didn't get any message about it. Maybe FF isn't supporting it?
- Ton Zijp
I learned my lesson on Twitter...no thanks.
- ‘-.-’ Tutivillus Grift
Tutivillus: Ffollo is slightly different from similar twitter apps.
- Paul Kinlan
Ton: I don't beleive that you not getting the emails is to do with Ffollo
- Paul Kinlan
Still it's strange. Maybe I should give FF some feeddback on it. Sometimes I'm getting the mails, but most of it I don't.
- Ton Zijp
Ive not always got all notification emails in the past weeks or so and some came like a day later but I don't think it is related to ffolio
- M F
Guy's I'm having good success with ffollo. It only follows people that are engaged in conversations I'm already participating in, or people who like stuff I like. This is much more organic and secures real connections. I would like a flush option to dump everyone that didn't reciprocate at some point. I know this isn't a popularity contest like Twitter, but it'd be nice to clean out people that just don't like me.
- Jason A. Nunnelley
BTW, on my much more active account [jasonn] it's picked up nearly 2K extra users. FYI this account is my tech-only account, AKA tekany (tech anything).
- Jason A. Nunnelley
Me either. And i think it will works :)
- Müjdat Korkmaz
I am pretty sure I can a batch unsubscribe, but I am wary - I never implemented it in twollo.com because it is ripe for abuse.
- Paul Kinlan
It'd be a great premium service (say $2.5 or $5 a pop). Charging would fund your development and limit abuse.
- Jason A. Nunnelley
I have a charging model on Twollo, although not for premium features, but for priority usage (it has 40,000 users at the moment so it can be slow)
- Paul Kinlan
You should check out SocialToo's method of revenue access. They're doing it on a fee for service basis.
- Jason A. Nunnelley
А зачем нужен Ffollo?
- Валентин
for some reason i find that twitter has nuked about over 6,500 of my "tweets" (i really hate that word) and now i have an impressive 9 (including today's 3)!
Steven Perez, Alex Scrivener, Daniel J. Pritchett and 8 other people liked this
anyone else experience this or was i one of the lucky ones? figures
- Cee Bee
that really does suck! Not noticed any problem with mine :(
- WorldofHiglet
They nuked a bunch of mine from last year as well. Grrrrrrrrrrrr....
- Helen Sventitsky
You must have created some kind of black hole with one of your tweets, if the world is gonna end we know who to blame. <insert dramatic chipmunk youtube link here>
- alieb
"supposably" it seems to be a problem quite a few other people are having as well. this isn't right though. i used it for bookmarking certain things and now they've disappeared. i've been out of the whole social internet thing for the last two weeks and not sure what the cause of this could be
- Cee Bee
several DDOS attacks on Twitter could be the cause. For many days you could not follow, unfollow and in certain cases update your status directly either (you had to use a 3rd party app). Some issues are still being experienced, this could be related to them.
- Carlos Ayala
yeah, i'm down to 87 from about 3K on this account. I import all of my tweets into iCal and a google calendar with the help of http://twistory.net/ so Twitter imploding doesn't bug me as much anymore.
- pea
ahh...no shit. i did not know about that attack thing. weird
- Cee Bee
In non-related news, did you know you can now customize your FriendFeed theme?
- pea
@innovate had the same thing happen to him - lost thousands of Twitter updates
- Stuart Miniman
i did not know that either. i feel like a guppy in this social media lake
- Cee Bee
DO ANYBODY NO WHAT HAPPENED TO CEE BEE'S TWEETS? :D
- Yolanda
I was having around 4,798 tweets, looking for something special to be that 4,800th tweet... All of a sudden, I got something below 300 only! Damn, it broke my heart.
- Jackie
i feel your pain jackie. i do
- Cee Bee
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