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Louis Gray
Should Browsers Block Ads by Default? - http://technologizer.com/2009...
August 7, 2009
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Valentine Valov, Peter, Vishwajith and 33 other people liked this
Yes. Or at least give us an ad-blocking extension. This is the thing I miss most about Chrome from Firefox (though I prefer Chrome's minimalism.) [Edit: position later changed to "no," but they shouldn't block ad blockers either. We should have tools that we can turn on if we want. Some popups and some websites are downright annoying.]
- Justin Long
But then how do those who use the net for a living earn that living then?? its a personal choice.. I don't want the browsers deciding what I see..
- Rob Sellen :o)
I agree but there should be a checkbox??? I just think it should be easier than it is now. I *do* appreciate Chrome's blocking of popups. That's the sort of ad I hate most. I don't mind Google's text ads, but I do mind big garish things. And I hate websites that are little more than ads.
- Justin Long
No, and stop stealing from me by blocking ads. I have to pay for webhosting somehow. Don't like my ads, don't come to my site. I love you all.
- Bwana ☠
No, though easier controls would be nice for the masses. The bigger issue though is we need some serious reform in how the ad-tracking industry operates.
- Tinfoil 2.0
No. That is how people make a living.
- Ruud van Wijngaarden
Guess I'm changing my answer to the same as Logical's. "No, but easier controls would be nice."
- Justin Long
No. I see it as morally wrong, which is why I don't use an ad blocker. If I don't like an ad, I don't pay attention to it.
- TeraDyne Azurepaw
No. It's how a lot of small sites support themselves. If it wasn't for a few bad sites with ridiculous amounts of untargeted ads, we wouldn't need ad blockers at all.
- Jan Ole Peek
TeraDyne - why would you see an adblocker as morally wrong? what about fast forward on a TiVo?
- Justin Long
Justin, fast-forward on a TiVo is different assuming you pay your cable or satellite provider and don't just use it for off-the-air broadcasts.
- Tinfoil 2.0
I don't have a tivo but my father-in-law does. He pays for DishTV. But there are still ads. Is it morally wrong to fast forward through the ads on a show? Why?
- Justin Long
What is the difference between "not paying attention to an ad" and "using an ad blocker"? I just don't get the comment about it being morally wrong.
- Justin Long
This is something I predicted would happen in 2008, and it didn't. I hope somebody does it, but it's unlikely in my opinion.
- Louis Gray
It's the only thing keeping me from using Chrome
- Alex Scrivener
I have no qualms about fast-forwarding through TV ads, particularly since I'm paying a premium to get satellite service to begin with. But I probably I wouldn't be so aggressive about blocking internet ads if the tracking wasn't so invasive.
- Tinfoil 2.0
While we're at it, let's deliver half of our content if a browser blocks the ad. No, how about a 1/3. We'll call it even.
- Bwana ☠
Holden, wouldn't it be great if a Web browser had a checkbox to on/off ads, just like it does for popups or cookies?
- Louis Gray
Ads? What are those? Seriously now, I can't remember the last time I clicked on an ad. It's not that I don't want to support this and that blogger, I really do. But my brain seems to have created a filter. I don't intentionally ignore ads each time, on each site, but somehow I don't see them. So maybe that was meant to be past tense. I do use ad blockers. Not because of text ads, obviously. But to speed loading times for pages. It's ridiculous to have to wait a minute until a page is fully loaded because the flash skyscraper has a timeout.
- Vlad Bobleanta
Are you talking about ANY ads Louis?
- Rob Sellen :o)
Yup.
- Louis Gray
Bwana, today's ad blocking people are not usually the target psychographic anyway.
- Tinfoil 2.0
For all using Chrome: http://adsweep.org -not developed anymore, but still works decently. Successfully blocks at least 50% in my experience.
- Vlad Bobleanta
This discussion sickens me
- Bwana ☠
Justin: I also don't use a Tivo, but I hardly ever watch anything on TV. The difference is that a lot of websites are run by people who aren't being paid for their work, while TV shows have a budget and are kept alive by the viewers.
- TeraDyne Azurepaw
I see... well to me in my opinion the best ads don't look like ads anyway ;o)
- Rob Sellen :o)
I am agreeing with Bwana.. people NEED to make a living, we are not all so lucky as to be being paid by others...
- Rob Sellen :o)
As for the making money argument, maybe it's time for content creators to move past this one. EXCEPT the text ads.
- Vlad Bobleanta
No. If you want to get good content for free, suck it up. Don't click on them if you don't like them. But sites need to do a better job at laying out ads. If you compromise on your reading/watching experience by having intrusive ads or ads taking up more prime space than content, your site will suffer.
- The Fat Oracle
what did i do to deserve this? what else would you rather i did for a living? perhaps report on tech news but take money in exchange for saying nice things about companies?
- Marshall Kirkpatrick
Marshall, let's charge $12.50 for 5 words
- Bwana ☠
Bwana, I have to agree. It goes to show what scoiciety is like. They want "something for nothing".
- TeraDyne Azurepaw
Louis... can I say you wield that wooden spoon so well ;o) kudos.. :-D
- Rob Sellen :o)
I suspect it will be difficult to get Google to implement this on chrome - NoScript is a staple of mine for FF, hands down best script!!
- walidmREALTOR
Ads go... internets die... simple...
- Rob Sellen :o)
Kamath: Agreed. Bwana: deliver none of the content if an ad blocker is used, if you so please. Or pull a Murdoch as you suggested. No one is going to stop you.
- Vlad Bobleanta
Microsoft will clearly never do it in IE, nor will Google. That leaves Firefox and Apple, and I leave it to your imagination to itemize the pressures these organizations would be under not to do it.
- Tinfoil 2.0
You guys want to rob content providers and smile while you're doing it. Fine. I don't have to like it and I will say something about it.
- Bwana ☠
But for those who insist on the moral or whatever other reasons ads should be tolerated... put some pressure on your ad networks not to use annoying ad styles and to trim way back on the tracking data (cookies, Flash LSOs, etc). Then it becomes not such a big deal with a lot of people. Simple and comprehensive ad blocking will never be in the mainstream browsers, and those who go out of their way to add blockers are not your target audience anyway.
- Tinfoil 2.0
If you don't like my ads, don't come to my site. It's that simple.
- Bwana ☠
I'd say let people turn off ads after a set amount of time on a page. I want to see the ads just not all of the time I am on a site with long form content.
- David Sandey
from Friend Deck
What RIGHT do you have to block someone's INCOME on THEIR site/blog??
- Rob Sellen :o)
Holden, I always am willing to pay for good products.
- Louis Gray
Bwana, who in this thread has ever sent you via your blog any money?
- Louis Gray
You have. And if you block my ads, I'll gladly return the funds :)
- Bwana ☠
Holden, that you are supported by ads on your blog is an illusion.
- Louis Gray
Louis: +1. but to answer the initial question, I don't think brothers should fiddle with the design and "content" of the sites they show by default. Plugins are good enough for me. And anyone who wants to block ads knows about ABP and such.
- Vlad Bobleanta
With full RSS feeds and increasing content in social networks, viewing actual blogs is presumably on the decline anyway, so bloggers will have to evolve and find new revenue models.
- Tinfoil 2.0
LE: Precisely.
- Vlad Bobleanta
I don't think the browser has any business blocking ads out of the box. Blocking ads is not an exact science. It's not like disabling Flash or CSS. Now, a plugin blocking ads is just fine. I understand the arguments about messing with someone's livelihood, but I think I also see what LG is getting at here.
- Rah-PM 2012
Which is why I get an Adsense for Feeds check
- Bwana ☠
Justification doesn't make it right. There is no gray (no pun intended) area here
- Bwana ☠
That's great for you Bwana, seriously. That's a good adaptation that I suspect gets through to people.
- Tinfoil 2.0
No. Ads are the secret juice that funds much of the internet, leaving it free for all to enjoy.
- felix
Thank you Andy. That's MY point
- Bwana ☠
If the sites overdo it, don't visit. Don't use that as justification to block ads everywhere.
- Bwana ☠
1) I didn't write this post. Others did. 2) I wrote a long post quite a while ago about how the common "I blog for ad revenue" model is broken for most people. 3) I will pay for good content and services. 4) I think having an option to turn off ads - all ads - would be a good move. 5) I still like Bwana anyway. :)
- Louis Gray
My most controversial post on this topic from the way back machine: http://louisgray.com/live... "Most Bloggers Don't Deserve Any Ad Revenue"
- Louis Gray
ad blockers should notify the site they are blocking ads from to give them the option to limit content
- Rafael Robayna
Rafael - that's my thinking. Welcome to shareware on the web
- Bwana ☠
None of this is personal, but Louis knows, when I feel passionate about something like this, I'm not going to bite my tongue :)
- Bwana ☠
Here's another point on this from back in 2007 when I saw ad revenues on the Web were going to hit a wall (which later happened). http://www.louisgray.com/live...
- Louis Gray
No, or I should pay for the site's maintenance.
- Erfun
Andy: If the content is unique enough, and not available elsewhere for free (I realize that's saying the same thing twice), people will pay. But 99.999% of content is not unique enough. Sorry.
- Vlad Bobleanta
Subscription models failed because people were generally cheap when it came to the web. "Everything is free or else we'll find a way to get it for free" I know there's a lot of folks who would pay and honestly enjoy it. But there are those who WILL justify: 1. Stealing the content and reproducing it elsewhere (THE WEB SHOULD BE FREE!!) 2. Not pay at all and consider me a money hungry wolf 3. Launch a campaign to smear my name
- Bwana ☠
And since they justify it, they don't see any wrong in it.
- Bwana ☠
Are ads a problem for someone here ? I mean ok, ads should not be the main income for bloggers and startups but it helps, secondly do people really care ?
- stanjourdan
@Andy: actually kachingle.com has an interesting model of paid subscriptions which I find very promising, and have shown that a substantial part of the web reader population is willing to pay for the good content they consume.
- Stephan Osmont
For what it's worth, I do not block ads with any third party apps on any of the browsers I use.
- Louis Gray
Stanislas - I believe some take extreme cases and apply it to everyone
- Bwana ☠
@Bwana : ok, did i miss something then ?
- stanjourdan
Not really, some people care more than others
- Bwana ☠
Louis: Suure... :)
- Kevin Arth
no
- Wayne Sutton
I just listened to a debate, where people argued about the power of default settings; because many people keep everything set to default. I think when ads become less of a boring interruption and more value focused, people will be fine about them. Right now though Louis, most ads just get in the way of what I want to read or do online.
- Jim Connolly
In France there is a startup called GeekBooster that offer to place ads for blogs in blogs pages. The concept is that clicks does not make you earn money but points that enables you to place your own ads on others blogs. And that's cool because you can discover new blogs. Probably a detail, but i like this service and it would be a shame for everyone if it was blocked. Sight
- stanjourdan
JIM: especally the ones that pan across your screen and block or obscure the content.
- Kevin Arth
Wow! I just came back after a brief lunch... this was quite the enthusiastic conversation!
- Justin Long
I simply don't understand this moral outrage people get upon seeing web ads. When you watch TV (which many of you are also probably paying for) do you scream at the commercials? When you read a magazine (which you've probably paid for) do you place your hands over the ads? Why is it that when you browse a website - for free - (whether or not you believe it deserves to get any sort of revenue) and there's a banner there it's a huge problem that must be fixed by ad blocking?
- felix
Moral outrage is the wrong word. But yes, when I see commercials on TV, I skip them with TiVo. When I get commercials on the radio, I change the station, or turn on Sirius Radio (Commercial Free) from the iPhone.
- Louis Gray
when ads come on TV i flip channels. but then i'm usually watching PBS so pffft.
- Joe The Sausage
Yeah!
- Dobromir Hadzhiev
@louis - if it isn't moral, than what sort of outrage is it? You are opposed, on what grounds, to being shown ads on an otherwise free website?
- felix
In general is not seeing ads on a page (banner blindness is documented) really so awful that it would be worse than putting most ad driven websites and services behind a pay wall?
- felix
I have no problem with ads, as long as they don't interfere with the overall experience and don't spy on me/follow me. Unfortunately, that's increasingly rare.
- AllisonWagda
My main gripe against a lot of ads is the speed penalty they impose. I tried running Firefox without AdBlock Plus running and Google Reader was siginficantly slower as well as many websites. If you watch whats loading, its not the site, but the ads that are slowing things down.
- William
Not by default but the ability to install adblock is desirable to me. Not everyone has pretty ads like Bwana. I also agree with the slow loading issue of sites with many ads. It completely kills a good web experience when you visit a site and have to wait for a doubleclick server to sent you that drug-you'll-never-use ad which, when it finally does load, blinks incessantly next to the first and fourth paragraph of plain text you are trying to focus on.
- Dale
i don't use ad blockers either.
- Edgar Rodríguez
I just want to be able to block slow ad sources. Sometimes the ad loading adds up to 2 minutes in page load time. It sucks. If I see I'm waiting for one source, that isn't the content source, I should be able to block it. Or weed it out simply.
- Andrew
No, in many cases I prefer ads than having to pay for content. With the amount of reading I do I would have to be very rich.
- M F
If browsers start blocking ads, simple websites would try to block access to such browsers, the sophisticated ones will make it impossible for such browsers to distinguish between content and ads. At the end of the day, an ad is html & javascript. Its not very hard to fool such a browser.
- Vishwajith
btw, ads can be useful and add value to the page.
- Vishwajith