To which I could add the growing sensation that frankness and off-the-cuff responses are no longer welcome (except, perhaps, from certain people) in the LSW room, which is really troublesome. The two aren't directly related. - Walt Crawford

Well, frankness and off the cuff responses are always more acceptable coming from some people than others, not because they are actually more acceptable but because we live in the troubled human world wherein some people are more popular than others. - laura x

Who is Frank & why are we cuffing him off?! - awd

laura: As in, "there isn't an LSW clique/inner circle, except there really is but nobody wants to admit it"? - Walt Crawford

"Frankness and off the cuff responses are no longer welcome" - I know how you feel. There are only so many years of it a human can take before cracking! - Maxine

The sad part is there is the appearance of cliquiness in that likeminded folks (such as several subsets of LSWians as a microcosm of society at large) tend to get a little echo chambery at times & most all of us assume, when we post, that there will be charitable reads of their not fully formed nor well expressed musings (and when reading occasionally slip and *assume* these poorly defined postings are actually ad hominems or outright hostile when the charitable reading clause is violated) - awd

if *you* think it is useful, do it. You better than anyone should know there's no all-encompassing agreement on anything in librarianship, Walt :) - ωαřмaiden TeamOtto

Someone organized should set up and run an LSW "Charitable Reading" Common Craft video contest :) - awd

Agree with the Weary. If you think it is useful, do eeeet. Who cares what some people think? Now about cliques in the LSW.... I probably hang out with some of the SLA/LSW cliqueset, since that is who I have met most often. I feel like I have really missed the ALA and other types of librarians for years, because SLA was my home. I shouldn't have been so insular in my thinking all these years. And the LSW has opened my eyes to other viewpoints and perspectives, some of which mesh with my viewpoint and some don't. - The Ghost of Library Past

But it has been good for me to read and see all of the various viewpoints... - The Ghost of Library Past

I do think that people are suffering from bouts of "too much seriousness" (something I'm likely to be guilty of) and that perhaps we all need a little break. LSW has lots of academic librarians who are just starting new terms, so perhaps that's making people edgy? For me, while I don't necessarily understand why you're doing the liblog study, I consider that your job to show me once you're done. Even just making a list and saying: Look at all this! Did you know THIS MUCH was out there is pretty cool. At least for me. :) - John: Clockwork Librarian

I can assure y'all that KGS doesn't dictate what I regard as worthwhile--I just find it amazing that anyone feels they are in a position to say what is and isn't worth doing in the field. But hey, KGS has pushed my buttons for years, so this is nothing new. (Somebody I've never heard of saying that tracking liblogs might distract from True Librarianship: That was different, but easily ignored.) - Walt Crawford

Otherwise--I think BBJohn may get it right: There does seem to be a chunk of Too Much Seriousness now and then. Sometimes, I even add to it. - Walt Crawford

Re: "the growing sensation that frankness and off-the-cuff responses are no longer welcome (except, perhaps, from certain people) in the LSW room, which is really troublesome." To echo what Laura said above, I think it's unavoidable when you have a space where the personal and professional cross over in weird ways and where there are 500+ people signed up and a reasonably large subset of that group posting frequently. People's expectations are different. People's reactions are different. Stuff happens and sometimes it pisses us off. As I said in the "fines" thread, I think it was mostly a genre problem where some people thought they were in a "whoops, surprize fines!" thread and some people thought they were in a "practice and ethics of fines for librarians" thread. - Your Neighbor Steve

Walt's first study of the library blogosphere is one of the things that provoked me to start my blog. I can assure you, Walt, that your current study didn't provoke me to stop my blog. I have mostly lost interest in library blogs and feel like most of the air has been sucked out of that subculture. Personally, I would be most interested in reading a new essay about librarians' blogs if it added to my understanding of that feeling. Why do I feel that way? Do most people who write and read librarians' blogs feel that way? Is there a whole sub-sub-culture that is going great guns that I just don't know about? Why does a person choose to start a blog about librarianing in 2010 and why does another person choose to stop? Those are interesting questions to me. - Your Neighbor Steve

I'm very interested in the liblog study for some of the same reasons Steve mentioned - the blogosphere in general is quite different than it was a few years ago and blogging means different things to different people. Anyhow - people minimize things they don't understand and generalize their opinion to the entire field (goodness knows I do it all the time). - Christina Pikas

Interesting thread. If I do it right, I think the new study, much more narrative (if I can do it right), will provide partial answers to a couple of Steve's questions, although only a couple of them. (There is a subculture I was only vaguely aware of in earlier studies that is, in fact, going great guns. Other questions, I can only provide really indirect evidence.) - Walt Crawford

With apologies for perpetuating the threadjack: Jeff, I think where it went off the rails is that both you and joan interpreted my comments as an attack on things you'd already expressed in the thread. (Please to correct me if that is incorrect.) And, in re-reading the thread, I get that. But honestly, I wasn't really thinking about what anyone else had already said when I responded. I just saw joan's seemingly earnest question about how waiving employee fines was different from retail employee discounts and had a response based on my perspective as a municipal employee. I told you what we were doing and why. But once phrases like "elevated rhetoric" and "aggressive" and "chill out" became attached to my comments, I felt like I was the one being attacked. The Godwin's Law comment doesn't really change my opinion on that. (If anything, it seems like I'm the one being called a Nazi here.) But anyway, I see why both you and joan would have felt attacked by my comments and I apologize for that.</threadjack...for now> - Greg Schwartz

This is why I was asking about the links and blogrolls in libraryland. I find it interesting that the profession works hard to make connections between pieces of information (where a subject like "Civil War" will connect histories, diaries, political analysis, tactical analysis, and life during those times) doesn't have an interest in doing the same for blogs. While vanity and sensitivity to others feelings were reasons given to why such things are not utilized, to me it's an interesting quirk to find this as a prevalent model. I'm willing to think maybe it's just me, but that's my observation. - Andy

Walt - As I commented before her and she stated she agreed with me I thought I'd offer my 2 cents. My comment had nothing to do with you or your analysis but rather annoyance with others I've heard declared blogs "tired" or "over". And I wonder what Porter was getting at, not in a negative or hostile way I just thought it was an odd question for him to be asking. I took KGS response the same way. Nothing meant by it other than "hmmm interesting question, now why would you ask that?" - Bobbi Newman

Gotta admit, I couldn't read it that way. I read KGS's comment as saying we shouldn't care how many liblogs there are, or why. Maybe that reading was assisted by the other person who seemed to say that tracking liblogs takes away from being a proper librarian. But since none of the comments is likely to cause me to abandon a few months of work, it's sort of irrelevant. - Walt Crawford

The LSW wouldn't have an inner circle, it would be more like the LSW Venn Diagram - W!cKeD Underpants Captain

I am also not sure how an inner circle is functioning in these particular controversies. - Your Neighbor Steve

@Walt - well I can't speak for her, only for myself and my intent. As I'm not in the habit of disparaging others work publicly or privately or with off handed snark, I can only hope you took my comment in the spirit it was intended. - Bobbi Newman

O - rochelle rochelle

um... +1 to RoRo? - awd

That's our inner circle, I'm thinking. Or her O face. - Your Neighbor Steve

Me & Ro are the inner circle?! W00t! - awd

You are at the white-hot center. Can I get you some water? - Your Neighbor Steve

w a t e r *ssssssssssssss* - rochelle rochelle

Yeah, I like the mix, too. The mix creates hurt feelings or drama sometimes, but so does life. - Your Neighbor Steve

M - Christa

G - awd

I also like the mix--until someone takes offense, which happens once in a while. As to the Facebook stuff, Bobbi, no offense taken. - Walt Crawford

Life is rough. My brain is fried. I need a milkshake. - Georgie Bestie

It brings all the boys to the yard. - Miriella