yes, this is a much better article even if I don't agree with him. - Pedro Beltrao

The article is mostly just a statement of facts about what PLoS has achieved on the business side, versus what they set out to achieve. It looks to me like an exceptionally useful document to OA advocates - OA journals need sustainable business models, and Timo is dead right that the best way to achieve this is open discussion. - Michael Nielsen

Much better than the original. Still I think Timo misses the larger point -- see esp. comments by Bjoern Brembs -- it's time to do away entirely with the *whole concept* of "high-end" journals. Journal-level metrics (impact factor, rejection rates, perceived prestige) simply do not work as a way to rank and evaluate projects, ideas or scientists. Let peer review do what it can do -- weed out the obvious crap -- and let search and database software and the research community do the rest. - Bill Hooker

It also amuses me to see Nature folks with their lace hankies pressed to their horrified mouths over the "kneejerk backlash" and "internet outrage". The original piece was outrageous -- I think most of the responses have been quite calm and reasonable. I guess it all depends whose ox is being gored, no? - Bill Hooker

I'd like to see a publication discussing the economics of scientific publishing in detail. It's clear that there are ways to sustain open publishing. I'd like to get a better understanding of the cost structure, esp in a purely internet publishing environment. - Deepak

Deepak, I highly recommend Odlyzko's 1997 paper. It's dated, but full of insight: http://firstmonday.org/issues/... - Michael Nielsen

Michael, will check it out, thanks - Deepak

@Bill - agree, some of the Nature people don't seem to get internet debate. Sure, it happens rapidly, is occasionally hasty and not fully thought through, brash or even a little rude at times, but we're hardly descending to, say, YouTube comment level here. In general I see commentary by interested parties, rather than a mob waving torches. - Neil Saunders

Hey - I missed this discussion but just posted to Timos blog saying basically what Bill H said --- the original piece was outrageous - Jonathan Eisen

I also commented on the post (of course with my usual plug on getting rid of journals). But I also had another idea: with editors choosing after peer-review, each editor would get the chance to establish a track record: how many of the chosen papers really were high-end? Measuring editor performance objectively... - Björn Brembs

I'm not seeing any comments showing up on the Nascent piece... - Bill Hooker

So, that was true, life exists beyond Paris... Can't be true. - Pierre

This, and the Discovery Channel commercial ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v... ) , make me want to travel sooo bad. - Eva

Yeah, I had the same reaction. Hadn't seen the Discovery Channel commercial - it's pretty cool. - Michael Nielsen

Found a translation of the Bengali lyrics here (see "Stream of Life) - http://www.schoolofwisdom.com/... - "The same stream of life that runs through my veins night and day runs through the world and dances in rhythmic measures. It is the same life that shoots in joy through the dust of the earth in numberless blades of grass [...]" - Michael Nielsen