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mike seyfang › Likes
Now Cameron is talking about open notebooks
Mike Chelen, mike seyfang and Richard P Grant liked this
the blog as the lab notebook - with links to files, images, comments
- Jean-Claude Bradley
use mobile phone to write to the lab notebook
- Jean-Claude Bradley
he's showing graphs of his lab notebook objects interconnected
- Jean-Claude Bradley
there are no formal semantics in his system but can use tagging very well
- Jean-Claude Bradley
I"m switching to posting comments to my feed - nobody else here :(
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Well I'm here...
- Richard P Grant
true - 4 people :)
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Five!
- Victor / Mendeley Team
six! (JCB - Can you pls link to your 'comments feed'?
- mike seyfang
blogs are great for text, and tagging provides a form of structured metadata. hopefully the next step will be to integrate semantic web technologies
- Mike Chelen
Top Seven Worst Odors Known To Mankind ... - http://antipollutionrevolution...
Brome, Khalid Mirza, mike seyfang and 4 other people liked this
#2. Isonitriles. Unrecognizable by name but recognizable by odor, isonitriles have one of the most offensive smells known to humans. Collectively considered a non-lethal weapon in warfare because of their ability to sedate those who are unfortunate enough to smell them, isonitriles can foul up the air they're exposed to for several days. As stated by Ugi (creator of the Ugi reaction in organic chemistry), "the odor of volatile isonitriles has been describes by Hofmann and Gautier as 'highly specific, almost overpowering, horrible, and extremely distressing.' That's right; the smell is so bad, it will distress you.
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Hey Jean-Claude, I've started reading "the emperor of scent." Glad you recommended it -- I'm going to learn a lot, especially since I know very little chemistry and nothing about scent. Also glad you recommended it, because it's helping me get past a bit of fanciful writing in the beginning and some parts I just don't believe. Also looking forward to learning about the parts you wrote about in your blog.
- Steve Koch
No mention of mercaptans/mercaptoethanol or amines like putrescine or cadaverine?
- Mr. Gunn
To culture strongyloides (a human parasite), you essentially ferment human faeces for a week or so. I'll back the resulting odor against anything else I've ever come across. *shudder*
- Bill Hooker
A couple people in my lab in graduate school decided it was a good idea to throw away squid carcasses in the lab trash can on a Friday. I found it on Saturday evening and it was the closest I've ever come to hurling from an odor alone. And I almost hurled repeated as I carried it to the dumpster. Sorry J-C, but I guess degeneration of this thread was expected.
- Steve Koch
MG - the list does miss some classic beauties like putrescine - that was the first compound I tried to make for fun as an undergrad. I used the Schmidt degradation of adipic acid and poisoned myself with hydrazoic acid: it felt like my head was going to explode. That's when I learned about the importance of using a fume hood :)
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Steve - I will be curious to see what you thought of the book - especially as it pertains to the motivations of people in science. Besides that the chemistry and biochemistry is intriguing.
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Curious to know whether Luca Turin's theory that the nose works like a spectrometer rather than a lock and key receptor system was ever (dis)credited...anyone know?
- David Bradley
Bill - that reminds me of jenkem - a drug of choice for some made from fermented feces - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- Jean-Claude Bradley
David - I don't know - it would be nice to hear from someone working in the field
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Um, that story about jenkem freaked me out so much just now, I can't even think about what the worst smell I've ever come across might be. Jean-Claude, what were you trying to make that putrescine for - anything specific?...
- steffi suhr
Jean-Claude, I'm inclined to think jenkem is a hoax -- but I will NOT be doing the obvious experiment... still giggling about self confessed jenkem hoaxter "Pickwick": "I just don't want people to ever recognize me as the kid who huffed poop gas."
- Bill Hooker
Bill - there are lots of giggles to be had from the Wikipedia piece on jenkem. Hoax or not - what a great conversation piece
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Steffi - I wanted to make it to know what it smelled like - and just the fun of making it
- Jean-Claude Bradley
I have used quite a few isonitriles...benzyl isonitrile tops my list for most smelly isonitrile.
- Khalid Mirza
Loving page 108 of "Emperor of Scent" (yes I'm reading): ' "...Oh, incidentally," [Turin] says, frowning, "the worst natural smell I've ever encountered in my life is rotting octopus. ... Once you smell dead octopus, you never forget it. The only thing that approaches that is isonitriles." He grimaces '
- Steve Koch
In my naive mind, I file squid and octopuses adjacently. Thus, I feel completely justified in almost vomiting from rotting squid smell, even though I've never smelled rotting octopus. But the science side of me is wanting to smell an isonitrile right now. Followed by a rotten squid, and then octopus.
- Steve Koch
Steve - I forgot about that line in the book. I was talking with my students this week about the isonitrile stench and they don't seem to be too offended by the smell. I can tell when Ugi reactions are going on but the odor is not unbearable. Using the fume hood consistently probably makes it very manageable
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Nature Network rolls over and exposes its belly - http://rg-d.com/BioLOG...
Daniel Mietchen, mike seyfang, Abhishek Tiwari and 24 other people liked this
Not really sure why that would have been taken down. Sound reasoning, you didn't slander anyone, or swear like a sailor. Makes very little sense as to why it'd be taken down. It's not like they can be held accountable for anything that's said on their site... If anything, your post would have spurred a great discussion. NN is a little too smug for my tastes, and it's things like this that solidify my decision to stear clear from them.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Poor decision on NN's part, imo.
- Bill Hooker
Sharpening my pitchfork while reading the article.
- Mr. Gunn
Now that I have read the article and my pitchfork is sharp, where do I join up with the angry mob?
- Mr. Gunn
"..on advice of its cowardly lawyers."? What advice? "We advise you to take this post down because ..."?
- Andrew Lang
And here is another reason why I don't want to blog as part of a network ... be that Nature Network or ScienceBlogs.
- Lars Juhl Jensen
looks fairly harmless to me but I Am Not A Lawyer (interesting post too, thanks Richard and Stephen for saving it)
- Duncan Hull
I thought it a good post - I wanted to make some comments about the stuff on peer review panels which I thought deserved some digging into with respect to trust and openness
- Cameron Neylon
I'd like to see what the lawyers' reasoning was, but if we assume their advice was correct, then NN did the right thing (commercially, at least: I don't see that it's their role to throw themselves under a bus on moral grounds). The problem is the crappy English libel laws.
- Bob O'Hara
Time for a science bloggers defence/insurance fund?
- Cameron Neylon
Does anyone know if this has happened previously on scienceblogs.com?
- Katherine Haxton
No it hasn't (I have spies!). There have been legal threats, and apparently PZed was sued but the judge threw the case out.
- Bob O'Hara
The Electronic Frontier Foundation is the best place for info on free speech online, http://www.eff.org/issues... and http://www.eff.org/issues... [EDIT: guess EFF is of no use here, as summed up by Edzard Ernst: “Internationally it's agreed that UK libel laws are ridiculous”]
- The Neurocritic
Maxine thinks we don't understand internet law. http://ff.im/3oSIa We're so ignorant.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
I believe she meant that you seemed to be jumping to conclusions about the reach of the long arm of English libel law as it applies to the Internet. Have a look at the forum discussion she started here and the links within provided toward the end of the second page of comments: http://network.nature.com/groups...
- Heather
Cameron, you're onto something. If it's so easy to silence a critic, this will have a huge effect on all online commentary in the UK. While I do think companies that allow user contributed material have the moral responsibility to stand behind their users, legally if need be, I also understand that many won't. Geriatric traditional media holding companies view all of the web as some...
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- Mr. Gunn
Brian, I think many people don't understand the relation between the law and the internet, including many scientists and lawyers. It's a fast-evolving situation. Have a look at the WSJ and other articles linked to in our Nature Network discussion "using the law to stifle scientific debate" for plenty of examples of what can happen.
- Maxine
Wish I could "like" your response Mr Gunn. That's exactly what I was thinking. If you have to deal with this kind of garbage in the UK, what's the point in even running a forum there? @Maxine, I've been at this forum/internet thing for quite a while now and was using US laws as my reference. I forgot NPG was UK based, and that completely changes the game.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Can NN officially get re-registered in the USA?
- Bora Zivkovic
@Bora, I think it all depends where the parent company is based. At least that's what it seems based on the links Maxine has provided.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Brian, it's nothing to do with where the parent company is based. It's all to do whether the content can be read in the UK.
- f1000
Then why aren't Britains suing American forum owners?
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Why should they?
- f1000
Because I'm sure there's a gigantic amount of slander and libel (as defined by the British laws) going on overseas. That's the whole reason this post was removed, right? An American judge would laugh at this if it ever went to court.
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
No, why don't you pay attention? The post was removed because the NPG lawyers said that NPG would have been liable had someone brought a libel action. Just because someone is defamatory does not mean they're automatically going to get sued. Companies do have to protect themselves because they have lots of money and are easy targets.
- Richard P Grant
You can say what you like Brian because (a) you have no money and (b) no one listens to what you say.
- Richard P Grant
So why doesn't Fark.com get sued every day? And I'm going to ignore your obvious troll there Richard :P
- Brian Krueger - LabSpaces
Because people are generally big enough to take shit from other people, without recourse to law. Bringing a libel action isn't a necessity, you know -- no one is forcing you to bring an action. Libel is a civil action, not a criminal one (in the UK anyway -- Aus/Canadia are I think different).
- Richard P Grant
I'd like to know if NPG really feels no duty to stand behind people who blog/comment in its' forums. They can't police everything that's said, even if they're supposed to.
- Mr. Gunn
Mr Gunn, your questions can be answered to the extent that it is possible by reading the two ongoing discussions at NN, one at Stephen Curry's blog post about the takedown, and one about the legal issues in the Nature Opinion forum. There are also links to articles there that make some aspects of the situation clearer than perhaps you are aware, based on the phrasing of your comment above.
- Maxine
covering it live again today... join me via http://cafechat.wordpress.com/ #edaust09 - http://twitter.com/skytrys...
mike seyfang liked this
@catspyjamasnz in the absence of a conference tag for VETteaching09, then #edaust09 will do - http://twitter.com/skytrys...
mike seyfang liked this
test comment from navy iPhone
- mike seyfang
from Nambu
@patrickkelso thx for #followfriday , i am consoling #cebit friends for having missed #cua09 - which was by far the better event! - http://twitter.com/andragy...
mike seyfang liked this
#cua09 connectivity issues seem to be solved this morning. Fingers crossed! - http://twitter.com/hexytwe...
mike seyfang liked this
Down in Brighton-Le-Sands for #cua09. Have additional responsibilities today, guiding participants through the ICT Roundables. - http://twitter.com/mpesce...
mike seyfang liked this
#edaust09# Im presenting in room 8 at 11:30..Strategic Alignment. Dont miss it ! Lots of pictures for those almost conferenced out. - http://twitter.com/StratGu...
mike seyfang liked this
RT @GoogleAtWork Join us @ 1030 in Riverside to hear the Uni of Adelaide talk about their Google Apps implementation #edaust09 #eduaust09 - http://twitter.com/appsans...
mike seyfang liked this
taking some extra time for proper coffee at cafe w/ @marksmithers. Coffee and a power outlet. What more could a girl want? #edaust09 - http://twitter.com/catspyj...
mike seyfang liked this
#EdAust09 - wondering how many are twittering the conf - poll to find out - go here http://tinyurl.com/dfhoku - http://twitter.com/petahop...
mike seyfang liked this
bandwidth problems - podcasts better as they're low data rate compared to video - don't have to stream in real time #edaust09 - http://twitter.com/stephen...
mike seyfang liked this
@moodler @marksmithers @sambamimi we're using #edaust09 tag. Join us ;-) - http://twitter.com/catspyj...
mike seyfang liked this
People leaving dell marketing session "keynote" #edaust09 - http://twitter.com/bjdavie...
mike seyfang liked this
City Of Toronto: Moving Toward Government 2.0 - http://events.snwebcastcenter.com/cityoft...
Ahmet Yükseltürk, mike seyfang and Richard Akerman liked this
November 26-27, with a webcast. I'm glad Toronto is doing this, and there's some very interesting stuff on the agenda, although the non-participatory nature of the meeting format is somewhat ironic.
- Michael Nielsen
If I read it right, you can also go to City Hall Council Chamber?
- Richard Akerman
Didn't look at the physical location, since I'm not in Toronto. (By "non-participatory", I meant that most people will be passive participants, not that there's no physical event.)
- Michael Nielsen
A personal view of Open Science - Part I - http://blog.openwetware.org/science...
Garret McMahon, mike seyfang, Michael Nielsen and 13 other people liked this
Are there any "independent" organizations that can support concepts of "Open Science" without being "burdened" by the need to compete and standout for the sake of financial sustainability/continuity? So far, it seems like the journals/publishers dominate "Science 2.0" applications like Nature, BMC, PLoS etc. But they use these concepts to boost their own journals, not necessarily...
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- Wobbler
Science Commons are big on platform development but essentially have charity funding (more on this coming in a later part). Are we not our own organisation in essence. As Chad Orzel said 'We are science' so can we not be 'Science 2.0' a loose confederation of like minded and connected people
- Cameron Neylon
Well, the issue I have is not so much with centralized versus decentralized, as long as we can be/are connected, as you say. But I am not sure about having journals/publishers "enable" the underlying foundation. Since their primary objective is not about promoting "Open Science" but about increasing readership/citations of their journals.
- Wobbler
I am all for loose confederation and that's where having services and APIs come in. However, this cannot be done in a vacuum. You need the journals, CrossRef etc to provide APIs etc that we can build on. If they can figure out how to monetize them, then we will be in pretty good shape, IMO
- Deepak Singh
It's also nice to have financial means to support individuals or projects supporting open science concepts (and to have workshops and meetings) but this seems difficult to generate without a formal organization in place...
- Shirley Wu
Shirley - I agree and we're working on that from a number of angles
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Wobbler, I can see what you're getting at. But why worry about why the applications are being built if they work well (and are sufficiently open, natch)? If open science gets done then everybody wins. Does it matter who enables it and why? Next big thing could be from a start-up, a grad student with some free time on her hands, two guys in a garage... that's the great thing about web development. Being in it at least partly for the money isn't a bad thing!
- Euan
What Euan said
- Deepak Singh
That is a good point. Maybe I am getting a bit too paranoid. I guess the key is indeed the applications being sufficiently open enough. Still, imagine the scholar working on the next big thing that does not specifically help a specific journal (publisher) get readership but promotes "open science" for everybody from all different research fields. Is there an organization that that person can go to for (financial) support (without "compromising" the "openness" of the concept)?
- Wobbler
I also think that while publishers are doing a lot of work in this space (and I think that's a good thing - particularly if they want to survive) that a lot of the interesting things are being done in academic research projects, off the cuff side projects, and those loose confederations. They don't always get the exposure and a lot of it doesn't work out but that's where a lot of the innovation is IMO.
- Cameron Neylon
As long as no one works in a vacuum. All of these efforts and fine (and there should be multiple different types), but they also have to talk the same language (http for starters :) )
- Deepak Singh
Well I think talking at all would be a good start - that's what this paper is hopefully about...
- Cameron Neylon
I am just wondering if an independent academic organization to support a platform for academics for the sake of improving "science" rather than as a means to an end for journal publishers could encourage more scholars to participate. Example, the PLoS ONE rating model is an interesting initiative, but it is limited to helping PLoS (ONE) improve its feasibility. A better approach would be a system that covers all OA journal publications from all OA journals. That would stimulate OA/Open Science more than...
- Wobbler
...just a system that is limited the PLoS ONE environment. On the issue of PLoS ONE's system, Björn Brembs suggests taking it a bit further and use reputation systems. Very potential idea to get things moving, but again, limited if it is only for the PLoS ONE environment/community. I think a global reputation system that is based on all the assessment work of scholars for all OA journals gets far more attention (and likely more support/recognition of those same academic communities).
- Wobbler
And that would also stimulate fair "quality" competition between journals, and not have a single journal/publisher hog all the "Science 2.0" scholars because they were the earlier ones to start with the rating/comment thing. And fair quality competition (using volunteers, no less) would give a more accurate view of the distribution of (publication) quality among journals.
- Wobbler
Some non-publisher organisations are starting to take an interest and funders in general are looking at providing a range of services. We can obviously set up our own platforms but the funding has to be thought through in the long term. Who is going to pay for e.g. a commenting platform? Or, given that ultimately the funders may for everything where will the cost be charged and how do we make sure it's good value for money?
- Cameron Neylon
(cont my own rant for a sec). And whether it is "Science 2.0" or full OA that comes first, it is not going to matter: either of them significantly increases the value of digital scholarly communication. And when that time comes nothing screams (financial) continuity harder than having a big community of capable people doing valuable work for you, free of charge. And on that account, Nature is doing a hell of a job building that community. Others, including PLoS, are trying to do the same.
- Wobbler
And the rest are in danger of fighting for "scraps" (e.g. for helpful and capable users and papers). I am not sure if that is truly desirable. Although admittedly, Nature's Connotea is a pretty sweet non competitive service (other than for marketing, but that is more me being nitpicky). Cameron: I think those are indeed important questions to ask.
- Wobbler
There is a real danger of getting poor tools because of a powerful incumbent or early mover with good PR. I think this is likely to happen with researcher UIDs for instance. Whoever manages to make the first effective move will probably end up in control - whereas what would be best is probably some form of federated open standard with multiple authorities that the user can choose from.
- Cameron Neylon
'data-sized peg into a paper-sized hole'—Cameron
Mike Chelen, Jean-Claude Bradley, mike seyfang and 3 other people liked this
"Academic journals alone cannot capture the findings of modern genome-scale inquiry." ...http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/article...
- Duncan Hull
'record-keeping is appalling'; electronic notebooks/data-sharing—is this going to improve matters? One can imagine that knowing you're going to have to make your data available at some point might incentivize you to keep better notes... on the other hand you might be a contrary bugger and not :)
- Richard P Grant
We recently published a paper about the transcriptome of a particular cell type. We only scratched the tip of the iceberg as to interesting analyses. Datasets are not enough, though, for publication in my mind. But you can't require all potential analyses, either, for a paper - or it's infinite. Scientific publications by necessity are about communication, but being forced to communicate all unfruitful lines of inquiry will really muddy the waters. Being *able* to is a good to have option, though.
- Heather
The "paper" is good for focused communication, linking to data (which can be in other places because of format, eg protein data bank or open notebook). Science is not only about datasharing but also about communicating the ideas arising from the data (to various levels of readers).
- Maxine
The point was made repeatedly yesterday that a paper has to have a 'claim'—it can't just be data.
- Richard P Grant
I need to refine that definition though - I like the idea that the paper makes a 'claim' or a 'statement' describing a model - it has a definite place in (web)space and time. Then we can talk about having access to the material that supported that claim at the time it was made.
- Cameron Neylon
the main problem with a paper is it generally needs to tell a complete "story" - and many perfectly good results get left out as being irrelevant to the story
- Jean-Claude Bradley
On the other hand, many papers describing perfectly good data do not get into journals because the "story" told oversells what the data show.
- Maxine
just putting together some slides on this theme for tomorrow - I think it cuts both ways - the people who can't get a publication and the big datasets which get big papers - lets just publish data as data and be done with it
- Cameron Neylon
And I think the point comes down to this - the easiest way to make the paper well supported by the full set of data and analysis is to have a shareable lab notebook, even if it isn't shared until publication - but once you decide not to publish something then the rest can also be easily made available
- Cameron Neylon
Makes sense to me, Cameron.
- Maxine
Maxine - too bad we missed you yesterday...but we did meet a lot of people at Nature
- Jean-Claude Bradley
I'm sorry too, I had unavoidable domestic commitments. Glad you met lots of people other than me!
- Maxine
We had a fun time and met some more people, but you did miss me saying something nice about peer review :-)
- Cameron Neylon
OK, Cameron, I'll have to work on getting you to repeat it next time we meet!
- Maxine
"lets just publish data as data and be done with it" you write, Cameron. I agree with the "lets just publish data as data" bit - but not the "be done with it" because of quality control and rewards (jobs, etc) for two things. Communication (as in discussion above) a third - someone who understands the data needs to do this, either the author of it or someone who is pretty close to the techniques, etc, used.
- Maxine
fair point. In no sense was that meant as just dump data any old how - just that what we tend to do at the moment with eg genome sequence papers server neither the journal nor the data well
- Cameron Neylon
from fftogo
Agree very strongly, Cameron. Journals are dead keen on organised places for data. We are increasingly struggling with problems of hosting on our journal websites innovative and huge formats. As publisher of a paper it is our responsibility to host this online "supplementary" information because an author's own website is not necessarily going to be maintained or accessible. But in some...
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- Maxine
Richard Grant on 'The usual bemused stuff...'
mike seyfang liked this
is here from Australia paid by university to attend blogging conference
- Cameron Neylon
started off on a blog set up for staff by university of sydney http://blogs.usyd.edu.au
- Cameron Neylon
started in August 2006 at usyd
- Cameron Neylon
then moved the http://network.nature.com at 'the scientist'
- Cameron Neylon
why blog? Teaching, outreach, help and advice, sharing data/reagents/protocols
- Cameron Neylon
he likes writing .. nice :)
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Teaching - seminar, tips, feedback from scientists, methods - still working on how to use blogging effectively for teaching
- Cameron Neylon
blogging is still experimental - and that is ok
- Jean-Claude Bradley
been less focussed on lab teaching but on generic stuff for scientists, how to do presentations, but also feedback from the people who are getting taught
- Cameron Neylon
Outreach - talking to arts/humanities, communicating what a scientist is/does, mention of the Open Lab collection 'the eureka moment', the people who just like the pictures as art
- Cameron Neylon
use blogs to get real science in real world
- Jean-Claude Bradley
help and advice - worked in perl and provided advice on how to do that from a wide range of people, including computer scientists, industrial people
- Cameron Neylon
Sharing - protocols, saving money (by finding the right suppliers), further help, USENET over again
- Cameron Neylon
he's still concerned about getting scooped
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Problems - causing offence, someone thought it was possible to identify someone anonymously. How much is allowed? What are the limitations.How much detail? Time away from the bench was a central issue, started writing only at home. A little less black and white about it now. What does the boss think?
- Cameron Neylon
Doesn't have the answers at the moment
- Cameron Neylon
Is any information I give actually valuable without context/reagents. Are methods more valuable than data? Need good help to good experiments with difficult methods. "Gandalf makes cells explode"
- Cameron Neylon
Issues - blogging data that is presented at meetings. Is this the same thing? Stealing vs redistribution. Publication and patent rights.
- Cameron Neylon
yes blogging is disclosure for patent purposes (just like publishing a paper)
- Jean-Claude Bradley
Would liek to see - collaborative, more than one 'hard science' blog, central faculty commitment - support, marketing, training. Arts/humanities community don't seem to have the same worries about whether it is value or 'what the boss thinks'
- Cameron Neylon
marketing teams are interested in using these things for marketing what the institution does
- Cameron Neylon
mention Mat Todd and Synaptic Leap
- Jean-Claude Bradley
mentioning the synaptic leap and Mat Todd's grant to do open drug synthesis development
- Cameron Neylon
challening assumptions - most people have never heard of blogging, even if they don't see the point
- Cameron Neylon
Challenge - is it worth it, if so how does it become mainstream
- Cameron Neylon
many INTJ bloggers here!
- Jean-Claude Bradley
London Science Tour in Pictures - http://network.nature.com/blogs...
mike seyfang and Matt Wood liked this
Just some of the pictures from the science tour.
- Martin Fenner
Nice - although not sure Nature Network is the best host for this; images are rather small and don't link anywhere.
- Neil Saunders
The pictures can also be found with the sciblog Flickr tag: http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- Martin Fenner
mike seyfang liked this
phew - hanging out for the .mp3, will turn it into podcast 2
- mike seyfang
keep them flickr pix coming - remind the rest of the crew to upload and tag their photoz
- mike seyfang
more pics to come!
- Lisa
Final session - embracing change: taking online science into the future.
Richard P Grant, Martin Fenner, Deepak Singh and 4 other people liked this
I too hope fore livecast - what's up with cameron's mogulus?
- mike seyfang
Cameron is on the panel.
- Michael Barton
Timo Hannay moderating
- Michael Barton
Draw some conclusions from the day, and synthesise some thoughts.
- Michael Barton
Invite members of the panel to share some thoughts.
- Michael Barton
Timo Hannay introducing the panelists.
- Roland Krause
Secret idea for end of session.
- Michael Barton
Don't worry about blogging regularly.
- Michael Barton
Unless you're being paid to.
- Michael Barton
Keep the comments coming - now our only source of info from the event down here in the land of OZ.
- mike seyfang
Blogs have a degree of honesty and egalitarianism. Feeling of mutual support, overlap with journal club or coffee break.
- Michael Barton
Blogging can be cathartic. Blog for ourselves not for our readership.
- Michael Barton
Peter's first blog item: http://wwmm.ch.cam.ac.uk/blogs...
- Egon Willighagen
It's so hot in here.
- Michael Barton
Cameron speaking now.
- Michael Barton
Started blogging 12 months ago.
- Michael Barton
Cameron Neylon: things have moved on. people are no longer worried about loosing their job when blogging.
- Roland Krause
Can blogging damage your career, or have things moved on from that? Peer review and issue of trusting sources and people. Does anything thing that there is a risk you won't get credit for blogging.
- Michael Barton
is there a risk later in your carer that you won't get credit for an idea? That is, if you blog.
- Ian Mulvany
Cameron's blog archive has gone 404... so, no first blog
- Egon Willighagen
Richard Grant, once being seen by his friends as the court jester - now being paid by his faculty to fly here from Australia.
- Roland Krause
Blogging to challenge. Do we assume blogging is bad for your career? How serious do management take blogging? Should you start anonymously?
- Michael Barton
can someone in the room pls thank Cameron for his excellent mogulus videocasts from this morning!
- mike seyfang
Takes issue with the assumption that blogging is bad for your carer
- Ian Mulvany
Showcasing university of Sydney blogs. Arts and humanities faculty not worried about blogging.
- Michael Barton
Blogging very common in humanities.
- Roland Krause
Uni Sydney blogs: http://blogs.usyd.edu.au/support...
- Egon Willighagen
What do admin and faculty think of blogging? They don't - they haven't heard of it.
- Michael Barton
Paradoxical that science people are clued up about Internet, but choose not to adopt.
- Michael Barton
Feeling that if you're not in the lab doing experiments that you must be wasting time.
- Michael Barton
is blogging a waste of time, is it?
- Ian Mulvany
Few years ago, if you were caught emailing you would be considered to be wasting time.
- Michael Barton
Depends what you blog on... if it's about your science life, it is a waste of time... if it's like ELN, then it's part of science activities (IMHO)
- Egon Willighagen
popularity will come - compare blogging now and email in the past
- Jo Badge
they are now making an analogy between email and blogging? If you ask where do you find the time to blog, one could as well ask where do you find the time to email.
- Ian Mulvany
If you're not blogging effectively, you may be wasting time.
- Michael Barton
How can you persuade powers that be as to the relevance of blogging.
- Michael Barton
Down to the success or failure of the researcher. If you're successful, blogging is more likely to tolerated.
- Michael Barton
Some 6-7 people have had trouble with seniors about them blogging...
- Egon Willighagen
pmr asks how many people have had active hinderance vis a vis blogging,
- Ian Mulvany
can blogs be counted as citations?
- Lisa
When do starting counting citations towards blog posts.
- Michael Barton
Mentioned blog on CV. Can be helpful.
- Michael Barton
Blogging can help crystalise thoughts => think through topics.
- Michael Barton
Scientists often feel that blog posts have to be perfect.
- Michael Barton
Paper -> blog is ok, and has been possible for a long time. Blog -> paper is not yet counted by ISI, and does not add to your citation count, and that is an issue that needs to be overcome, but as someone here points out, it can raise your profile as a person who is passionate, interested, and knowledgeable about your subject. The issue of perfection of the blog post is a very interesting point, one needs to be allowed to be imperfect.
- Ian Mulvany
Blogs useful for discussing half-baked ideas
- Michael Barton
Different people are looking for different things in a blog.
- Michael Barton
reluctance to post due to IP issues
- Lisa
What is the importance of protecting IP, in context of posting on a blog.
- Michael Barton
Many kinds of blogs: news items, personal experiences, (raw) research results (ELNs), conference coverage, popularization... this makes using blogs for citation counts unapplicable. I use blogs are easier way of emailing to two or more mailing lists...
- Egon Willighagen
No credit system for posting work on a blog or wiki.
- Michael Barton
What if someone publishes similar work to what you've blogged online, can you claim that you showed this work first? Even if it was on a blog.
- Michael Barton
Cameron makes a very interesting point, who can say that they were the first to report on an issue.
- Ian Mulvany
Somebody stole data from my blog to publish a Nature paper. Will an interview panel or funding body care that you discussed it on your blog first?
- Michael Barton
Plagiarism is easier in the electronic age...
- Egon Willighagen
Incentive needs to change from only publishing papers, to also include blogging.
- Michael Barton
he asks us where he should say 'we were the first to report this' and point to a blog post. Im my opinion this is an important test case and he should absolutely do this.
- Ian Mulvany
If blogging a result becomes the standard for reporting results for the first time, then all scientists need to know this is the case.
- Michael Barton
ahh, another irish accent in the audience, wonder who that is.
- Ian Mulvany
plagiarism is more easily detected in the electronic age http://www.nature.com/nature...
- Jo Badge
People's obsession with 'scooping', recognition, career limiting moves, outing their colleagues and IP issues makes me think that a truly great Research Institution would find ways to remove these significant barriers to innovation. That would create a climate / environment in which scientists are much more likely to innovate. My observation from the land down-under is that those science bloggers who are more concerned with the common good seem to be the most innovative.
- mike seyfang
Blog as discussion rather than a citable piece of literate. Can a discussion in the pub be used as a citable object?
- Michael Barton
Henry Gee thinks that blogs are not citable objects. Blogs have the flexibility to be changed, I disagree totally with this point. It seems to me the culture of the web is often tied to giving precedence to people who have been the first to do x, or say y, or mash up a and b. To be able to point to a source where an idea bubbled up seems always a reasonable thing to do. As ever AW comes up with the clearest comment on the issue.
- Ian Mulvany
Egon on blogs as a replacement for news groups rather than journals.
- Roland Krause
Where is blogging in the continuum between discussion and publication in a scientific journal. Generating kudos to get a job position, or invited to a conference.
- Michael Barton
Many scientists don't realise that science is a continuous discussion. Testing and refuting hypotheses.
- Michael Barton
Blogging is currently a long game which does not bring immediate rewards (like conventional publication), but can lead to longer term career advantages - assuming you survive that long...
- AJCann
Molecular biology is a rapidly changing field. Most papers cited are less than five years old.
- Michael Barton
communicating to society at large?
- Lisa
Richard has sent readers western blots as art!
- Lisa
rephrasing questions to make science more accessible- making citizen scientists
- Lisa
Barriers to adoption for blogging.
- Michael Barton
Panel issue a challenge.
- Michael Barton
No matter blogging, peer review, etc, etc.... the only thing that should count is: "Show me the Data!"
- Egon Willighagen
Challenge from the panel: how can we get senior faculty blogging in a way that's entertaining and useful to the community
- Lisa
How can we get senior faculty blogging that is entraining and valuable. Challenging audience to find and encourage senior faculty to set up a blog.
- Michael Barton
incentive- featured in 2008 version of the Open Laboratory
- Lisa
Winning blog will feature as first entry in The Open Laboratory 2008
- Michael Barton
and they'll pay for you to go to some bootcamp thing too!
- Lisa
Nature will pay for blogger, and blogger encourager to attend SciFoo next year.
- Michael Barton
Winning based on most interesting and senior faculty.
- Michael Barton
Somebody not currently blogging.
- Michael Barton
Big discussion starting on this competition.
- Michael Barton
the RI- come back and visit! :) (a nice place to sit and write a blog post with the free wi-fi - disclaimer I do work here!) :)
- Lisa
http://rg-d.com/BioLOG... — my recording
- Richard P Grant
"Plagiarism is easier in the electronic age... - Egon Willighagen" Nonsense. Please cite your evidence for this. If anything, as Jo said above, plagiarism is easier to detect in the electronic age.
- AJCann
Unconference 3—tracking conversations through the blogoshere
Egon Willighagen, mike seyfang and Richard Akerman liked this
'handles'—tags?
- Richard P Grant
we're talking about metadata
- Richard P Grant
'Nature Blogs'—capturing conversations
- Richard P Grant
Nature Blogs mentioned again. Will launch soon and tries to aggregate all (interesting) science blogs.
- Martin Fenner
—using DOI to track blog discussions on Nature papers
- Richard P Grant
could use cocomment or disqus?
- Jo Badge
using DOI for tracking comments on papers
- Jo Badge
Easiest way is to link conversations by doi. This could also be used for desktop software.
- Martin Fenner
At what stage would we enter the DOI information? Do we have to remember to do that manually?
- Richard P Grant
BPR3 blogging peer reviewed research
- Richard P Grant
The peer review blogger aggregator with that badge thingy: http://www.researchblogging.org/
- Egon Willighagen
problem of discovery
- Richard P Grant
I have to smile because Corie is pointing the camera in my direction
- Richard P Grant
You mentioned those Jo—got links? Speak up!
- Richard P Grant
could you find where a similar conversation already exists/is ongoing?
- Richard P Grant
For the record, resolve DOIs with: http://dx.doi.org/DOI, where DOI is the doi you are resolving...
- Egon Willighagen
Zemanta is a tool (IE/Firefox) plugin to suggest pictures and links.
- Martin Fenner
Richard, google for 'userscripts life science' for the paper that disucces the tool that modifies a publisher's webpage indicating that a paper has been discussed on Cb or Pg...
- Egon Willighagen
I think the problem is useful tags not just in the posts but also the comments
- Richard P Grant
I'm trying to pay attention here, Egon
- Richard P Grant
Richard, no rush... this log will be around for long after today...
- Egon Willighagen
Euan talks about FF
- Richard P Grant
FriendFeed is a useful tool, but doesn't link back to the original blog (unless using plugins).
- Martin Fenner
Mutiple references to the same original data can happen on FriendFeed.
- Martin Fenner
We just got very meta
- Richard P Grant
Userscripts for the Life Sciences - http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-21... - nice work
- Richard Akerman
Where's Peter M-R when we need him?
- Richard P Grant
Cameron is talking great sense about stuff that isn't papers—'subjects' as a whole, concepts, ideas...
- Richard P Grant
Yay! We're trashing wikipedia!
- Richard P Grant
Another wise comment from Maxine—what we're doing here, today, is NOT mainstream.
- Richard P Grant
I just made the point that I'd like to see measured data more central in linking papers, discussion, etc
- Egon Willighagen
Journal publishers and libraries have a special role here.
- Martin Fenner
'A central semantic web problem' —Andrew Walkingshaw
- Richard P Grant
We need doi's not just for papers, but for all kinds of objects.
- Martin Fenner
Yeah, all very good points, but how the hell do we do anything useful??
- Richard P Grant
ISBN ISRC UPA— Andrew
- Richard P Grant
We can't consistently name proteins... (Jenny, http://network.nature.com/blogs...)
- Richard P Grant
Andrew makes the point it's NOT a technological problem, it's a social one: which is what I was saying.
- Richard P Grant
The ubiquity script 'addInChI this' has just been suggested to help bloggers overcome the technological problems of semantic blogging...
- Egon Willighagen
Ubiquity gets mentioned: http://labs.mozilla.com/2008...
- Martin Fenner
Chemical ubiquity scripts: http://rguha.wordpress.com/2008...
- Egon Willighagen
ah, yes, Jenny Beard is on the ball
- Richard P Grant
Massimo is the win!
- Richard P Grant
JC Bradley says that we should perhaps accept that there are multiple conversations and accept that...
- Richard P Grant
if 'we' scientists want to give the public good information why don't we all make sure that there is an accurate up to date entry on wikipedia in our subject? It will probably come up first on a google search
- Jo Badge
Jo, the major problem is that if you edit a wikipedia article it tends to get edited right back :/
- Richard P Grant
here you all are, Twitter has gone quiet on the #sciblog front
- mike seyfang
Jenny blogged about something that someone had already blogged about.. but the framing can be different, which is good. Ties back to the creativity session
- Richard P Grant
Mike, it was getting troublesome to maintain them both!
- Richard P Grant
Mike, you're the perfect example of what we are discussing here... split ups of discussions, which should be joined...
- Egon Willighagen
@RichardP That's not been my experience on Wikipedia Richard. If you substantiate your entry with publications, you can get reversions frozen as vandalism. This takes time and effort, no recognition for this type of activity from institutions, but I agree with Jo's point entirely - Wikipedia is the public face of science, not blogs.
- AJCann
wikipedia -richard - then edit it back. the power of the crowd only works if there is a crowd - if scientists embraced this idea, it would stick
- Jo Badge
Session ended.
- Egon Willighagen
whereas the experience of wikipedia that I have (second-hand; the stories make me run away screaming) indicate that it is more or less impossible to get something _true_ on wikipedia if a wikitard has control of the article. It's just not worth the effort.
- Richard P Grant
Breakout 5: Science blogs and online forums as teaching tools - http://network.nature.com/forums...
Alison Raab Labonte and mike seyfang liked this
MArtin is talking about organization... how German ;)
- Richard P Grant
Jeff:
- Richard P Grant
he's doing the student blog participation schtick
- Richard P Grant
2 types blog participation 1. writing 2 responding
- Richard P Grant
Barriers - time expertise, interest "What's in it for me?"
- Richard P Grant
Writing Benefits solidify knowledge through explanation, become meber of scientific community, develop communications skills (IMPORTNT ONE), understand state of the field
- Richard P Grant
Incentives—blog for course credit? Competitions? (10 grand? Who's paying?)
- Richard P Grant
responding... clarification questions, developing relationships (and with potential advisors. NOt sure incentivizing students to comment is valuable)
- Richard P Grant
challenges—is it legitimate information? Responsible use?
- Richard P Grant
Bad blog use: mandatory course on online communities—students don't want to have a mediated discussion once out of class. Artificial.
- Richard P Grant
Good: expedition blogs
- Richard P Grant
Question: how do we get the Nobel Laureates to actually blog? Question for the wrap-up panel. "Every lab should have a blog"—Jeff
- Richard P Grant
Once the box is open, people expect it to be there (email...)
- Richard P Grant
Issues of libel/defamation?
- Richard P Grant
Oliver Obst "The Library view"
- Richard P Grant
how a library communicates with people (scientists, clinicians) who do not physically visit the library, cf students
- Richard P Grant
wiki as repository for weblog entries that need to be re-referenced ('micro-lessons')
- Richard P Grant
15 minutes for a blog post? You're joking. Not for something so high profile.
- Richard P Grant
'you must end each blog entry with a question'
- Richard P Grant
Martin Fenner "The good paper journal club"
- Richard P Grant
online forum is a better journal club format
- Richard P Grant
integration with bookmarking tools, etc.
- Richard P Grant
The kitchen is rather noisy
- Richard P Grant
We're being very rude to students here. Some of them will do stuff out of interest—there doesn't have to be a quid pro quo, does there?
- Richard P Grant
Teachers, I'll grant you, probably need incentivization more than the students
- Richard P Grant
@RichardP Very few UK undergraduates will do anything without being assessed - blame the school exam system.
- AJCann
Blogs are complementary to traditional methods. Not a substitute. Maybe some feel that blogs are a threat and we need to emphasize this more?
- Richard P Grant
Assessed Online Discussion Groups In Biology Education: http://www.bioscience.heacademy.ac.uk/resourc...
- AJCann
AJ, that's outrageous. Are they afraid this stuff gets in the way of drinking time?
- Richard P Grant
Zoe from Times Higher Education wants to know how popular teaching blogs already are within Universities
- Richard P Grant
@RichardP UK schools train students not to waste time on things which are not assessed - one of the perils of over-examination (bloody league tables).
- AJCann
MF sez we're only just starting because admin and faculty don't know what a blog is; I can empathize.
- Richard P Grant
AJ, I'm as disappointed as you are. So much for encouraging creativity?
- Richard P Grant
@RichardP: Blogs by teachers or blogs by students? Both as rare as hen's teeth in life sciences. More common in arts subjects (as reflective journals by both students and teachers).
- AJCann
that's a good point, and something I want to raise at the Wrap-Up session. take a look at http://blogs.usyd.edu.au/ and count the science blogs
- Richard P Grant
thanks Eva for that link- this is something I wanted to ask other people about- the use of science blogs in teaching (at school level). More thoughts on this later I think. I'd love any other recommended links people have for science education blogs.
- Lisa
“Matt Wood - how to make friendfeeds and influence people” - http://friendfeed.com/e...
Deepak Singh, Roland Krause, Jo Badge and mike seyfang liked this
microblogging fills in the cool stuff between blog posts
- Cameron Neylon
we're back with the video but light levels are bad
- Cameron Neylon
or rather my camera isn't coping well
- Cameron Neylon
lots of services to help with microblogging
- Cameron Neylon
twitter obviously most well known
- Cameron Neylon
contraints appear limiting but actually enables exciting stuff within limitations
- Cameron Neylon
we're going rather meta - everyone going across to twitter
- Cameron Neylon
rapid response e.g. earthquake - rapid information transfer due to low barrier to entry
- Cameron Neylon
need to find your own voice
- Cameron Neylon
just like blogging you will also find your niche
- Cameron Neylon
useful for science to get conversation going - however, how about those scientists who worry about their ideas being stolen by their competitors?
- Jo Badge
just realised I am broadcasting my laptop screen :-) http://www.mogulus.com/cameron...
- Cameron Neylon
can be overloaded with information
- Cameron Neylon
Social aspect is very important in twitter (context).
- AJCann
continuous partial attention to what is going (i am already way too busy)
- Cameron Neylon
twitter is like a waterfall - stream of posts coming in - stick your head in - see what is happening - get a feel but you don't necessarily need to dive in and mark everything you read
- Cameron Neylon
can lead to less frequent posts, more frequent updates
- Cameron Neylon
matt thinks it is important to get the ideas out there and start the conversation
- Cameron Neylon
Series of tweets can turn into blog posts later.
- AJCann
comparison to the scientific method - the loop of idea to publishing paper, getting feedback, but takes time -microblogging can fill the gaps in the publishing process
- Cameron Neylon
matt brown is recording a better video of the slides - so will try to get them linked up later
- Cameron Neylon
an easy low stress way into open notebook science
- Cameron Neylon
open notebook tweets, lab team tweets, checking on the current temperature of the lab or group - can collaborate with other groups
- Cameron Neylon
you would need a VERY good relationship with your lab members for a PI to monitor lab tweets without it feeling like big brother
- Jo Badge
twitter has an API -> automated notebook science -> laboratory (instrumentation) tweets (sequencer tweets)
- Cameron Neylon
connected scientific method - connecting with people - connecting with instruments - private or public comments
- Cameron Neylon
like the idea of automatic tweets for sequencers etc. back to the original cambridge coffee pot!
- Jo Badge
connecting to other resources (Library tweets)
- Cameron Neylon
risk of single point of failure - twitter has had reputation for poor availability - currently a lot better
- Cameron Neylon
other services such as identi.ca - implements twitter API but distributed rather than localisd on servers
- Cameron Neylon
but don't just want text - can send links to audio/video/photos etc
- Cameron Neylon
talked about publishing - also need to consider subscribing - one person has many feeds - think I can see where this is going :-0
- Cameron Neylon
Aggregation is a rescue for multiplicity of streams
- Cameron Neylon
here comes friendfeed :-)
- Jo Badge
onto friendfeed - probably won't describe this in detail here :-)
- Cameron Neylon
Would love to be just now in the room next door... but I can see the slides from here...
- Egon Willighagen
learn from people that you trust - link through people that you trust - discover new friends - and friends of friends
- Cameron Neylon
enables conversations about any specific item
- Cameron Neylon
showing martin's feed of the tour of London yesterday
- Cameron Neylon
you see the network that you trust - 'in the network we trust'
- Cameron Neylon
therefore high signal - low noise
- Cameron Neylon
talked about subscription and publication - the key to microblogging is that you do both in one place/service
- Cameron Neylon
this enables facilitated feedback - rapid and interactive
- Cameron Neylon
Likeit: Facefeed ;)
- AJCann
case study: The Life Scientists Room http://friendfeed.com/rooms...
- Cameron Neylon
and follow on to props for the BioGang http://openwetware.org/wiki...
- Cameron Neylon
Same old faces popping up in all these places - very small community online at present.
- AJCann
and applause
- Cameron Neylon
question of spam or nonsense if for instance it is taken on by instutions
- Cameron Neylon
@Eva - we all need multiple online personalities, personal and professional.
- AJCann
question on the volume issue - how do you cope? Basically have to take the attitude that you're not following all the time
- Cameron Neylon
question of finding another filter - the use of friendfeed to maintain the context of a specific conversation
- Cameron Neylon
Dunbar's Number: http://scienceoftheinvisible.b...
- AJCann
OOPS - forgot to hit refresh on this thread - discussion starting to fragment, here, twitter and mogulus chat.
- mike seyfang
So that is YOUR laptop screen Cameron, you have also broadcast your probiscus once or twice ;-)
- mike seyfang
I can't get onto the chat room on mogulus for some reason - but I think we're starting to push the limitations here. I am not seeing other people's comments until about five minutes later
- Cameron Neylon
Question on the concern about scooping - how do you persaude people?
- Cameron Neylon
the session on MB is getting the most MB comments ;)
- Ian Mulvany
and we're done here. Roland Krause was the questions I think
- Cameron Neylon
First Panel Session - Blogging the scientific life
Richard P Grant and mike seyfang liked this
Mo's just eaten all the panel time in his intro...
- Richard P Grant
Grrrrl Scientists - it's odd to talk about blogging - that's what I do on my own about my research
- Cameron Neylon
Grrlscientist is making the point that we're real people.
- Richard P Grant
The public thinks we're odd - we have some other way of communication - maybe brainwaves or something - the idea of the blog was to write about what its like to be a scientist - to give people are view of what the life is like
- Cameron Neylon
Grrl Scientist: "People might think we talk with brain waves"... no, just FriendFeed :)
- Egon Willighagen
difficult to meet people and have a conversation about what you do - to tell people what science is about
- Cameron Neylon
Jenny Rohn - has the public actually met a scienitst on average? They see people on TV but the response you get is often dependent on how you describe what you do
- Cameron Neylon
could there be an equivalent of the 'police procedural' for science?
- Cameron Neylon
science is a messy human endeavour - maybe that can lead to more trust
- Cameron Neylon
Mo asked a very odd Question
- Richard P Grant
Anna Kushinir - the problem with the way scientists communication with each other is that it is closed off from everyone else
- Cameron Neylon
Language of science is off-putting to the public??
- Richard P Grant
Grrrl Scientist - the power of getting the original authors of a paper to talk with the public reading the blog
- Cameron Neylon
Grrlscientist is saying that it's fantastic for the scientists to communicate and that the public actually loves them
- Richard P Grant
Anna: sciblogging as a support group
- Richard P Grant
Anna Kushinir - blogging as a support group - needing support through the challenges of scientific life
- Cameron Neylon
A: dealing with the stress of grad school, finding people who had the same experiences
- Richard P Grant
damn - may be about to lose power....
- Cameron Neylon
Still good to go here
- Richard P Grant
Jenny Rohn - potential problems with this with respect to anonymity or lack thereof
- Cameron Neylon
Jenny taking about nonymous blogging: how being known and saying things might be detrimental
- Richard P Grant
Acceptance of scientists talking about their life, it's not always great
- Richard P Grant
the problem of having a timestamp on your comments - and people can see what you are doing
- Cameron Neylon
Grrlscientist's READERs paid for her to come!!
- Richard P Grant
Grrrls scientists thanking her readers for porviding the funds for her to come
- Cameron Neylon
how cool is that?
- Richard P Grant
Mmm... it seemed to me that Grrrls would not have come otherwise... though the idea is cool... I wished my readers payed for my expenses :)
- Egon Willighagen
Heather is asking about the differences, what you get out out of posting on a blog rather than a forum
- Richard P Grant
GS has a 'journal club' thing going
- Richard P Grant
Great - twitter is over capacity - looks like this here thread is the place to hit refresh!!
- mike seyfang
JR doesn't seen much of a difference
- Richard P Grant
Sometimes people play Mornington crescent
- Richard P Grant
but that comes to a natural and sad end...
- Cameron Neylon
Corie has just asked if blogging as a communication-with-the-public tool actually works
- Richard P Grant
I don't know if GS actually answered that
- Richard P Grant
Jenny wants to open up NN to non-scientists...
- Richard P Grant
JR just asked the Scienceblog crowd to link to NN. Damned right.
- Richard P Grant
How do people think about their audience? Jenny and Anna are hopefully accessible to 'the public' but not necessarily written that way
- Cameron Neylon
Question about anonymity and its plusses and minuses
- Cameron Neylon
Question about anonymity, with respect to comments and actually writing weblog entries
- Richard P Grant
Jenny doesn't feel she could be anonymous because she feels accountable for what she says - tries to avoid mentioning colleagues by name
- Cameron Neylon
Jenny couldn't be anonymous, she says. Problem with not dumping colleagues in it, which is my major reason for being pseudonymous at the Labrats
- Richard P Grant
'preternaturally friendly'!
- Richard P Grant
Grrrl scientists started off as anonymous because she was told that it would damage (in fact destroy) her career
- Cameron Neylon
going down with lack of battery very soon
- Cameron Neylon
JR: not being anonymous -> more friendly. GS was warned that blogging showed she wasn't serious about science and could lose her career (!). But I don't think that fear has really materialized
- Richard P Grant
GS is still *for* anonymity
- Richard P Grant
Anna thinks the internet already means people are nasty therefore anonymity in comments probably doesn't make things worse.
- Richard P Grant
JR: imparting to the public that scientists _disagree_ with each other
- Richard P Grant
this is what I always say — science isn't about facts. We argue amongst ourselves
- Richard P Grant
GS: blogging intrinsically valuable because records evolution of scientific thought
- Richard P Grant
GS ignores hostile commenters. Then goes into attack mode. Heh
- Richard P Grant
JR is for ignoring them—animal behaviour
- Richard P Grant
Jennifer Rohn really wants to run her own lab
- Richard P Grant
Remind me to compare and contrast with *arts*/humanities blogs
- Richard P Grant
Damn that battery - audio and video stopped. This text is good but not AS good as listening.
- mike seyfang
GS making the point that encouraging people to go into science is not the same thing as educating people, trying to increase scientific literacy. There are too many scientists already, she says!
- Richard P Grant
GS again, about toeing the party line in order to keep her job. She has to be anonymous, but I'm still wondering whether this is so, given my experience with USyd.
- Richard P Grant
AK: Science is not scary, it's OK to be a scientist. Good summary.
- Richard P Grant
Ben Goldacre Keynote
Richard P Grant and mike seyfang liked this
Yes, just started... great to be here! Great lecture room!
- Egon Willighagen
props for rpg for getting money out of a university
- Cameron Neylon
we can all be famous for 15 people
- Cameron Neylon
what is the long temr plan for science communication beyon tutus with the periodic table printed on them?
- Cameron Neylon
why can you be obscure when writing about literature or music but not about science
- Cameron Neylon
its the nerds who are being neglected - the people who did biochem at leicester and are now senior manages at woolworths
- Cameron Neylon
story of a pr fluff story of treatment for dyslexia - criticism appears in pdf somewhere two years later. Saying something wrong on a blog gets an instant response
- Cameron Neylon
Rapid response nature of blogs forces you to be more flexible - comments can lead you to realising you were wrong
- Cameron Neylon
mainstream media is spineless and only deals in positive anedcotes - bloggers can be much more courageous
- Cameron Neylon
tuned into the mogulus stream - friggin awesome!
- mike seyfang
if you want to write a column in a newspaper - find the number and ring them up - they ask if you can write - you say yes - and that is it
- Cameron Neylon
after he wrote a critical blog post someone else bought tht e google adword for the drug and re-redicted it to the blog- company was not happy
- Cameron Neylon
once company went bust an exxciting open conversation taking place online
- Cameron Neylon
bloggers chasing people making specious claims online - for various cranks this is quite disturbing - particularly those making lots of money
- Cameron Neylon
it would be difficult to do something like linking MMR to autism today because there is an army of nerds/bloggers would take apart the detail and point to the real data
- Cameron Neylon
to sum up - mainstream media sucks at covering science - blogs can expose the failings but can also covers science stories much better - actually comes from people who know what they are talking about
- Cameron Neylon
BBC radio 4 is a good example of science journalism because 80% of wordcount is from the scientists talking about their own work
- Cameron Neylon
just expressed some concern about being videod (too much swearing) :-)
- Cameron Neylon
need less professional writers - and more people to edit the material directly from the people who know
- Cameron Neylon
value of direct contact with the writer - timely writing - ability to argue
- Cameron Neylon
'but the internet is full of nutjobs' - is the public view - how do I know who to trust. Deriving a new form of trust based on links to the primary source - the importance of a new form of trust based on your experinec of their writing and linking
- Cameron Neylon
blogging embodies hard core peer review as it should be
- Cameron Neylon
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