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I'm so annoyed. Doing maintenance on the computer and discovered not only does my son play World of Warcraft, but he recently joined a forum called World of Porncraft, where people submit cartoon characters from the game doing things besides leveling their characters.

May 24 - Comment - Like - Share

Christian Burns , Kol Tregaskes, Michael W. May and 29 other people liked this

oh dear. (how old is he?) - Nathalie, Dreamer of FF

93 more comments

ouch! - Steven Hodson

Nathalie, he's 16. - Trish R

16 and normal, I'd say. - Alex Scoble

Not good... how did he pay for his subscription?? You have to have a credit card... - Her Lindsay-ness

Lindsay, it's a free forum. - Trish R

It's bound to happen. A couple of years ago, we went over to my friends house. Her then 13 yo son had been home alone all day long. I was trying to find something on her TV, when to OnDemand and found he had been watching porn all day long. Talk about awkward. - Anika

Anika and Alex, I know it's normal. He's done it before. I think I spend more time lecturing him about viruses from these sites than actually looking at what's on the site. - Trish R

Teen boys and porn are like Thongs and butt cracks no matter what you do they find a way. - Moved to Facebook

Pedantic moment: You mean malware, Trish. :) - Alex Scoble

Alex, well no wonder he doesn't listen to me, then! - Trish R

My son visited a porn site when he was seven. You will survive. By the way my son, when he was 14 effectively argued against censorship with the FCC commissioner, Jonathan Adelstein, who proposed all sortsof child protectionlaws in his interview with me. Why? Because if you ban porn, he said, you will just make it more interesting. Why did they visit that porn site? A teacher told them not to (whitehouse.com back then was a porn site). - Robert Scoble

So watch out how you react. If you react badly he will just do it more and will be smarter about hiding it from you. - Robert Scoble

Don't worry, it will lessen in time (=they get better with hiding the evidence) ;) - Jemm

That sounds pretty awesome. Don't worry about it. - Alex Knight

It's actually hard not to laugh. You know how World of Warcraft is by Blizzard Entertainment? This site is sponsored by Jizzard. - Trish R

lol @ jizzard - Moved to Facebook

ROFL - Alex Scoble

LOL @Jizzard. Clevah. - Anika

Interesting to watch hoe Parents see this. More kids should get on FF! - Yuvi

@ Robert ,Seven years old? Your son rock buddy:p - Amir

16 year old kids should be in college anyway. I think I was doing much worse at 11. Sounds like he should get better at using a computer though. - Cristo

sovereignjohn: you really aren't living in the real world, are you? My son has his own iPhone. He isn't the only one. If some kid wants to see something on the Internet he'll just ask someone like my son. His first porn experience? Was at a friend's home while the parents weren't looking. Oh, and the kids were so smart that one of them knew how to delete the cookies and history (they never got caught, my son told me about it because he trusted me not to make a big deal about it). - Robert Scoble

@Trish - not the forum, World of Warcraft requires a credit card for subscription... does your son have his own CC? - Her Lindsay-ness

Lindsay, no, he doesn't have a credit card, but there are other ways to play. You can also buy prepaid cards. But he earns his subscription (that I pay for) by his grades and chores. - Trish R

Well, there's much worse a Google search click away. I don't think how you react with have a damn thing to do with your son's future behavior, though. The most dramatic parental meltdown is nothing compared to the power of teen libido. If they're curious, it's there. They'll find it. - Chris Baskind

We have a WoW subscription for our 12 yr old but we play as a family. The game in itself isn't horrible. He's not allowed to group with anyone but us though. We haven't had to deal with the pr0n issue yet though, but I imagine it will be coming in the next 12-24 months. - Her Lindsay-ness

Robert, when I was in college, I was taking some sort of politics class. The teacher had a laptop hooked to a projector and was going to to the White House website to show us something. She typed in whitehouse.com and then stepped away while the website loaded. We were all horrified when the porn came up on a huge screen. - Rochelle

I think the most damaging thing about porn as a teen is knowing your parents have found it. :) FriendFeed is really entertaining for watching some parents react to their kids behavior. I'm pretty sure they are doing much worse than you know. - Cristo

or tennis elbow Cristo - Moved to Facebook

LOL, take it easy. Porn is harmless. Especially toon/fake porn. - Tanath

Oh Lindsay, I just read my post again and I see why you asked what you did. I already knew he played World of Warcraft. I just meant in addition to playing WoW, he's found the porn forums as well. The way it was worded didn't make that clear, sorry. - Trish R

Cristo: most kids are doing far worse, I agree. The stories my son tells me amaze me. Kids getting kicked out of school for smoking dope in the hallways. Other kids have gotten caught having sex. And people wonder why I started talking to my son about drugs and sex when he was seven and making sure the communication lines were always kept open. - Robert Scoble

Many parents don't give their kids the skills they need to survive in the real world. I remember when two kids I knew drank themselves to death in college once they were away from their parents' protective bubble. - Robert Scoble

Robert, that's a common theme. Kids that haven't been exposed to anything going wild in college, sometimes with disastrous consequences. - Cristo

I agree, I went a little crazy when I left for college. I'd never had alcohol and had extremely controlling parents. I quickly discovered frat parties and nearly died from alcohol poisoning. - Trish R

With kids these days I would be relived he is not actually producing and distributing it from your computer. I would however recommended getting him his own keyboard and mouse. ;) - Kevin Murray

I'm not sure what the laws are here in the states, but I actually think it's good to expose teens to wine at dinner as they do in Europe. That way they understand it, and it isn't a big mystery or secret for them to hide. Same for topless beaches. For some reason Americans are really uncomfortable being upfront with what is normal life. - Cristo

Agreed, Robert. We are trying to be accessible to our kid as well so he feels comfortable asking us questions and confiding in us. I had an incident with my mother when I was about 13 and she yelled at me when I mentioned I liked a boy telling me not to fall in love with him because he'd break my heart. That "conversation" basically cut off the opportunity for me to come to her for... more... - Her Lindsay-ness

I would listen to Robert on this if I were you. We raised two boys and they each had computers in their rooms from the mid 90's on. We never banned anything in terms of browsing. Robert mentioned "trust". That's the key. Show them that you trust them and they'll return in kind. FWIW, both boys maintained 4.0 GPAs through college. First one did 4 years in the Marine Corps and 2 combat... more... - Gregg Morris

I trust my son, too. Still doesn't mean I'm not going to monitor his computer activity to make sure he's not getting himself into a bad situation. - Trish R

Cristo: the law in the United States is VERY strict regarding alcohol. No alcohol under 21. Period. It really sucks. If you get caught with alcohol in your hand you can be arrested which ensures you lose your drivers license. I've heard of kids getting arrested on their front porch with a beer in their hands. Giving your kids alcohol is dangerous legally. If one of them gets sick and... more... - Robert Scoble

Trish: he's 16. In two years he's going to be an adult. You really spy on him? That seems like a really stupid thing to do. Well, he probably already has figured out you're doing that and will go elsewhere or be very careful about cleaning up his tracks. You aren't helping your kid prepare for the real world where he won't be living under your protective bubble. - Robert Scoble

@Robert - I thought that if you were in your own home (a private residence) you could allow your kid to have a drink and that some people do give their kids wine at dinner like the adults. Maybe that's just an urban myth I have heard... - Her Lindsay-ness

Trish: trust means that you will not spy on your kids. Think about that one for a moment. It's pretty clear you really don't trust your kids. - Robert Scoble

Lindsay: I had an almost identical experience with my Mom. Now of course, I'm older so it's more natural to discuss relationships, but because of that once incidence, I am never the one to bring up the subject, it's always her. Looking back, this one incident really shaped how I approached (rather, avoided) talking to my parents about relationships. - Angus Burton

Lindsay: I listen to a legal program on KGO radio and you'd be shocked to learn that you are not legally allowed to give your kids alcohol. If they are caught for some reason (which will be pretty difficult to do if they are inside your own home) they can be arrested and it has a lot of negative consequences on driving, especially. - Robert Scoble

I'm with Robert on this one. I think spying on a 16 year old kid is wrong, unless they are doing something already that warrants it, like selling drugs or doing heroin. Surfing porn is not enough to make spying right. - Cristo

Robert: I don't think police have the authority to stop drinking on private property unless the party is "out of control" or not being controlled in some way. - Angus Burton

i agree with robert that theirs a time when you have to let go and let your kids find their way, however your allways there to guide them if they are heading down the wrong path - AV

Angus: inside a private home you are right but if they walk out onto the porch or are visible from the public sidewalk all bets are off. Angus: I've heard enough stories from parents calling KGO radio to know that they can be arrested, even if on private property but they must be visible to cops from public pathways. - Robert Scoble

I don't consider monitoring his computer activity "spying" on him, Robert. If you're ok with your then 7-year-old looking at porn online, that's great. However, I don't want my son getting his sex education from pornography on the internet. I can't stop him from seeing it, but I can take the opportunity to discuss it with him and make sure he's informed about treating women... more... - Trish R

Robert, you mean Len Tillem's show? I wrote a simple iPhone interface to KGO that I find pretty useful: http://www.streetlight.com/iphone - Cristo

Cristo: yeah, I love Len Tillem's show. I listen to it a lot. The stories of how people screw up their lives are very interesting. - Robert Scoble

Cristo, where are you from where you don't know about American laws? I thought you were in California. - Rochelle

Rochelle, I live in a little hill town north of Firenze. Please recite all American laws to me, so I may learn from your wisdom. - Cristo

Trish: my son told me about the incident. The other parents did not find out about it. Why not? Because they were spying controlling uptight parents. One of the seven year olds knew how to delete the cookies and delete the history to make sure they wouldn't be caught. All you are going to do is ensure your son makes sure he doesn't get caught by you. If you think your parenting style... more... - Robert Scoble

Monitoring computer usage is spying, whether it's parents or the government doing it. If your kid is 7, then spying might be a good idea. At 16, I would say it is not a good idea. - Cristo

Porn doesn't make people disrespectful. Unless he's looking at violent porn, you have nothing to worry about. - Tanath

Robert, just like everything else, we all can't be you. We really wish we could, but what good would a world full of perfect people be? You'd have nothing to do or no one to correct if we all did it your way. - Trish R

Chris, I'll get right on that. So you're on the west coast.. of Italy? http://friendfeed.com/cristob... - Rochelle

Rochelle, you can start by telling me whether there is a federal law prohibiting the serving of wine to one's offspring under the age of 18 in a private residence. I am interested in which code violation this is. - Cristo

Chris, liquor laws are all state-by-state so there are no federal laws for it. - Rochelle

Trish: well, let me know how that attitude works out for you and your family. Glad you feel spying on your kid is "trusting" them. - Robert Scoble

I thought kids could drink with their parents, too. I'm pretty sure they can in Texas, I've seen them do it in restaurants. - Trish R

Rochelle, I see. So in order to understand your American laws, one must understand the code system for each of the 50 states. Can you tell me for your particular great state of Washington, if there is a law preventing the serving of alcohol to minors in a private residence? - Cristo

Robert: it sounds like the laws you are talking about must be local to California. In Michigan, where I am, if there is a supervising party, say a parent, then a party with alcohol is free to occur without intervention. On college campuses here, the police can't actually arrest anyone unless they are on public property. I've heard of instances where they wait until someone steps onto... more... - Angus Burton

Trish: I haven't heard of children being able to drink in public with their parents, but on their property they are allowed to, afaik. - Angus Burton

At 16, a substantial percentage of girls in Tokyo are already trading sexual favors (30-something salarymen, generally) for Prada handbags. Toon porn is not that big a deal... - Christopher A Carr

Maybe it's just because I'm from a small hilltown north of Firenze, but I'm surprised there is so much confusion on the American law, given that Rochelle was surprised that an American would not know the law inside and out. - Cristo

Cristo: here's the law about serving alcohol to minors: http://safestate.org/index... The thing about laws is that if the law breaking happens totally within the confines of the home it's very hard to enforce. But if they walk outside and are visibly drunk, or they get in a car, or they are seen with a wine glass on the porch? All bets are off. - Robert Scoble

No American knows the law inside and out, Cristo, including lawyers. - Trish R

Trish: Feel free to kick Kyle's ass. You're the parent. Fuck Scoble or anyone else who judges you. - Chris Baskind

Chris: you're right, but I've seen the carnage that spying parenting leaves. Kids are smarter than you give them credit for. A FREAKING SEVEN YEAR OLD KNEW HOW TO HIDE HIS TRACKS. If you think your 16 year old needs spying to "trust" then you have issues. - Robert Scoble

"I don't want my son getting his sex education from pornography on the internet..." Your 16 year old son? At that age, he may well be getting his sex education from engaging in sex. I was at that age... - Christopher A Carr

Christopher, he could be, you're right. That's why I will continue to discuss safe sex with him and the appropriate and respectful treatment of women. - Trish R

Now that's a conversation I would want a drink for. :) - Cristo

Christopher: I had that conversation with Patrick starting at age seven. When we told him we were having a third baby he asked "geez, haven't you guys heard of protection?" Ahh, the fun of raising kids. - Robert Scoble

Robert: hehehe...I bet you wish you had gotten that on video. - Christopher A Carr

Christopher: yeah, one of those fun moments in life where you have your own words thrown back at you in an unexpected way. - Robert Scoble

The 16-year-old plays World of Warcraft, so he's probably not having sex. - Vezquex: God of FF

Just an FYI for Trish: "Research findings indicate that sexually explicit material in itself does not foster negative attitudes or behavior, but when it is accompanied by images of violence, the risk of subsequent violence is significant." http://www.ncjrs.gov/App... - Tanath

And I can link to more studies indicating the harmlessness of most porn. - Tanath

soverignjohn: my 19-month old can turn on an iPhone and play his favorite apps already. If your 16 year old hasn't gotten the skills to navigate the real world without spying things are wrong somewhere. - Robert Scoble

*I* have issues, Robert? I'm not the one playing junior-grade Dr. Phil here, hectoring a single mother on how she should feel about her kid's internet mischief. And FWIW, I know Trish well enough to state -- without equivocation -- that she is an engaged and responsible parent. We should all do so well. - Chris Baskind

Whoa, everyone take a deep berath. We can discuss our opinions without attacking each other. - DO ANYBODY NO MONIQUE

Chris: an engaged and responsible parent shouldn't feel impelled to spy on their kids. That tells me there's distrust going on there. But maybe that's just me. My son tells me stories from the playground that tell me otherwise. - Robert Scoble

Uh...didn't Trish say she was just doing maintenance and found the directories? Hardly constitutes spying. - Neal Jansons

sovereignjohn: I'm saying that you can't protect your kids from all evil. I wasn't the one who gave my son an Internet computer at age seven to surf alone. That happened at a friend's house. Anyone who thinks they can control their kids is wrong. And even if you can, then you don't give them the life skills they need to deal with the real world. I see that carnage when religious kids get to college and drink themselves to death or go crazy on porn and the Internet cause their parents kept them off. - Robert Scoble

If my 19-month old figured out how to surf the Internet I'd be most impressed! - Robert Scoble

Robert Scoble: Especially if the 19 month old figured out how to find porn - DarknessFalls

Trish you're cool, as usual Robert is taking a small point and making a big thing out of it. Part of what he says is true, trust is key and I'm pretty sure you know that already. But I also think that a parent needs to know about what's going even if they are attempting not to "pry". Robert might call that "spying" but I just file that under "hyperbole". - John Hardy

Maybe he got re-directed? - wowfreeze.blogspot.com

Didnt even know this existed... ewww. - Shawn Whitmire

Trish mentioned she wanted to impart respect for women. I suppose that means, at the very least, not physically abusing them. While I was never predisposed to mistreating women to begin with, I recall that the correct behavior was reinforced more by my interaction with prosocial adult males, than by words from my momma. Men are more inclined to say "If I catch you doing x y or z, I'll... more... - Christopher A Carr

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South African power outlets :)

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