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#sciblog conference - http://drbadgr.wordpress.com/2008...
first thoughts on #sciblog http://bridge8.wordpress.com/2008...
"You might think that, I couldn't possibly comment ;-)"
- AJCann
"A good summary Alan, and I agree about the first panel discussion. I was disappointed that the back channel was not as active as I expected, in fact it s a transcript not a commentary happened at the OU Socialearn event http://drbadgr.wordpress.com/2008...... . Perhaps this was because the main bloggers there were in the Nature ghetto and hadn't been pulled out into the real blogosphere yet."
- Jo Badge
listening to richard's audio from final panel session at #sciblog
Ryo on brewer open till 3 with no cover charge and beer and food. Am there now #sciblog
checking out the comments #sciblog on Cameron Naylor's live site http://www.mogulus.com/cameron...
let's try that again! listening to @lisushi 's first podcast from #sciblog at http://sciencegeekspeak.com/
kristinalford: catching up on #sciblog action.... - http://twitter.com/kristin...
catching up on #sciblog action....
hmmm - things quiet at #sciblog (even in the friendfeed room) - will write a little blog post and head off to bed methinks.
Final session - embracing change: taking online science into the future.
Richard P Grant, Martin Fenner, Deepak Singh and 4 other people liked this
I too hope fore livecast - what's up with cameron's mogulus?
- mike seyfang
Cameron is on the panel.
- Michael Barton
Timo Hannay moderating
- Michael Barton
Draw some conclusions from the day, and synthesise some thoughts.
- Michael Barton
Invite members of the panel to share some thoughts.
- Michael Barton
Timo Hannay introducing the panelists.
- Roland Krause
Secret idea for end of session.
- Michael Barton
Don't worry about blogging regularly.
- Michael Barton
Unless you're being paid to.
- Michael Barton
Keep the comments coming - now our only source of info from the event down here in the land of OZ.
- mike seyfang
Blogs have a degree of honesty and egalitarianism. Feeling of mutual support, overlap with journal club or coffee break.
- Michael Barton
Blogging can be cathartic. Blog for ourselves not for our readership.
- Michael Barton
Peter's first blog item: http://wwmm.ch.cam.ac.uk/blogs...
- Egon Willighagen
It's so hot in here.
- Michael Barton
Cameron speaking now.
- Michael Barton
Started blogging 12 months ago.
- Michael Barton
Cameron Neylon: things have moved on. people are no longer worried about loosing their job when blogging.
- Roland Krause
Can blogging damage your career, or have things moved on from that? Peer review and issue of trusting sources and people. Does anything thing that there is a risk you won't get credit for blogging.
- Michael Barton
is there a risk later in your carer that you won't get credit for an idea? That is, if you blog.
- Ian Mulvany
Cameron's blog archive has gone 404... so, no first blog
- Egon Willighagen
Richard Grant, once being seen by his friends as the court jester - now being paid by his faculty to fly here from Australia.
- Roland Krause
Blogging to challenge. Do we assume blogging is bad for your career? How serious do management take blogging? Should you start anonymously?
- Michael Barton
can someone in the room pls thank Cameron for his excellent mogulus videocasts from this morning!
- mike seyfang
Takes issue with the assumption that blogging is bad for your carer
- Ian Mulvany
Showcasing university of Sydney blogs. Arts and humanities faculty not worried about blogging.
- Michael Barton
Blogging very common in humanities.
- Roland Krause
Uni Sydney blogs: http://blogs.usyd.edu.au/support...
- Egon Willighagen
What do admin and faculty think of blogging? They don't - they haven't heard of it.
- Michael Barton
Paradoxical that science people are clued up about Internet, but choose not to adopt.
- Michael Barton
Feeling that if you're not in the lab doing experiments that you must be wasting time.
- Michael Barton
is blogging a waste of time, is it?
- Ian Mulvany
Few years ago, if you were caught emailing you would be considered to be wasting time.
- Michael Barton
Depends what you blog on... if it's about your science life, it is a waste of time... if it's like ELN, then it's part of science activities (IMHO)
- Egon Willighagen
popularity will come - compare blogging now and email in the past
- Jo Badge
they are now making an analogy between email and blogging? If you ask where do you find the time to blog, one could as well ask where do you find the time to email.
- Ian Mulvany
If you're not blogging effectively, you may be wasting time.
- Michael Barton
How can you persuade powers that be as to the relevance of blogging.
- Michael Barton
Down to the success or failure of the researcher. If you're successful, blogging is more likely to tolerated.
- Michael Barton
Some 6-7 people have had trouble with seniors about them blogging...
- Egon Willighagen
pmr asks how many people have had active hinderance vis a vis blogging,
- Ian Mulvany
can blogs be counted as citations?
- Lisa
When do starting counting citations towards blog posts.
- Michael Barton
Mentioned blog on CV. Can be helpful.
- Michael Barton
Blogging can help crystalise thoughts => think through topics.
- Michael Barton
Scientists often feel that blog posts have to be perfect.
- Michael Barton
Paper -> blog is ok, and has been possible for a long time. Blog -> paper is not yet counted by ISI, and does not add to your citation count, and that is an issue that needs to be overcome, but as someone here points out, it can raise your profile as a person who is passionate, interested, and knowledgeable about your subject. The issue of perfection of the blog post is a very interesting point, one needs to be allowed to be imperfect.
- Ian Mulvany
Blogs useful for discussing half-baked ideas
- Michael Barton
Different people are looking for different things in a blog.
- Michael Barton
reluctance to post due to IP issues
- Lisa
What is the importance of protecting IP, in context of posting on a blog.
- Michael Barton
Many kinds of blogs: news items, personal experiences, (raw) research results (ELNs), conference coverage, popularization... this makes using blogs for citation counts unapplicable. I use blogs are easier way of emailing to two or more mailing lists...
- Egon Willighagen
No credit system for posting work on a blog or wiki.
- Michael Barton
What if someone publishes similar work to what you've blogged online, can you claim that you showed this work first? Even if it was on a blog.
- Michael Barton
Cameron makes a very interesting point, who can say that they were the first to report on an issue.
- Ian Mulvany
Somebody stole data from my blog to publish a Nature paper. Will an interview panel or funding body care that you discussed it on your blog first?
- Michael Barton
Plagiarism is easier in the electronic age...
- Egon Willighagen
Incentive needs to change from only publishing papers, to also include blogging.
- Michael Barton
he asks us where he should say 'we were the first to report this' and point to a blog post. Im my opinion this is an important test case and he should absolutely do this.
- Ian Mulvany
If blogging a result becomes the standard for reporting results for the first time, then all scientists need to know this is the case.
- Michael Barton
ahh, another irish accent in the audience, wonder who that is.
- Ian Mulvany
plagiarism is more easily detected in the electronic age http://www.nature.com/nature...
- Jo Badge
People's obsession with 'scooping', recognition, career limiting moves, outing their colleagues and IP issues makes me think that a truly great Research Institution would find ways to remove these significant barriers to innovation. That would create a climate / environment in which scientists are much more likely to innovate. My observation from the land down-under is that those science bloggers who are more concerned with the common good seem to be the most innovative.
- mike seyfang
Blog as discussion rather than a citable piece of literate. Can a discussion in the pub be used as a citable object?
- Michael Barton
Henry Gee thinks that blogs are not citable objects. Blogs have the flexibility to be changed, I disagree totally with this point. It seems to me the culture of the web is often tied to giving precedence to people who have been the first to do x, or say y, or mash up a and b. To be able to point to a source where an idea bubbled up seems always a reasonable thing to do. As ever AW comes up with the clearest comment on the issue.
- Ian Mulvany
Egon on blogs as a replacement for news groups rather than journals.
- Roland Krause
Where is blogging in the continuum between discussion and publication in a scientific journal. Generating kudos to get a job position, or invited to a conference.
- Michael Barton
Many scientists don't realise that science is a continuous discussion. Testing and refuting hypotheses.
- Michael Barton
Blogging is currently a long game which does not bring immediate rewards (like conventional publication), but can lead to longer term career advantages - assuming you survive that long...
- AJCann
Molecular biology is a rapidly changing field. Most papers cited are less than five years old.
- Michael Barton
communicating to society at large?
- Lisa
Richard has sent readers western blots as art!
- Lisa
rephrasing questions to make science more accessible- making citizen scientists
- Lisa
Barriers to adoption for blogging.
- Michael Barton
Panel issue a challenge.
- Michael Barton
No matter blogging, peer review, etc, etc.... the only thing that should count is: "Show me the Data!"
- Egon Willighagen
Challenge from the panel: how can we get senior faculty blogging in a way that's entertaining and useful to the community
- Lisa
How can we get senior faculty blogging that is entraining and valuable. Challenging audience to find and encourage senior faculty to set up a blog.
- Michael Barton
incentive- featured in 2008 version of the Open Laboratory
- Lisa
Winning blog will feature as first entry in The Open Laboratory 2008
- Michael Barton
and they'll pay for you to go to some bootcamp thing too!
- Lisa
Nature will pay for blogger, and blogger encourager to attend SciFoo next year.
- Michael Barton
Winning based on most interesting and senior faculty.
- Michael Barton
Somebody not currently blogging.
- Michael Barton
Big discussion starting on this competition.
- Michael Barton
the RI- come back and visit! :) (a nice place to sit and write a blog post with the free wi-fi - disclaimer I do work here!) :)
- Lisa
http://rg-d.com/BioLOG... — my recording
- Richard P Grant
"Plagiarism is easier in the electronic age... - Egon Willighagen" Nonsense. Please cite your evidence for this. If anything, as Jo said above, plagiarism is easier to detect in the electronic age.
- AJCann
Unconference 3—tracking conversations through the blogoshere
Egon Willighagen, mike seyfang and Richard Akerman liked this
'handles'—tags?
- Richard P Grant
we're talking about metadata
- Richard P Grant
'Nature Blogs'—capturing conversations
- Richard P Grant
Nature Blogs mentioned again. Will launch soon and tries to aggregate all (interesting) science blogs.
- Martin Fenner
—using DOI to track blog discussions on Nature papers
- Richard P Grant
could use cocomment or disqus?
- Jo Badge
using DOI for tracking comments on papers
- Jo Badge
Easiest way is to link conversations by doi. This could also be used for desktop software.
- Martin Fenner
At what stage would we enter the DOI information? Do we have to remember to do that manually?
- Richard P Grant
BPR3 blogging peer reviewed research
- Richard P Grant
The peer review blogger aggregator with that badge thingy: http://www.researchblogging.org/
- Egon Willighagen
problem of discovery
- Richard P Grant
I have to smile because Corie is pointing the camera in my direction
- Richard P Grant
You mentioned those Jo—got links? Speak up!
- Richard P Grant
could you find where a similar conversation already exists/is ongoing?
- Richard P Grant
For the record, resolve DOIs with: http://dx.doi.org/DOI, where DOI is the doi you are resolving...
- Egon Willighagen
Zemanta is a tool (IE/Firefox) plugin to suggest pictures and links.
- Martin Fenner
Richard, google for 'userscripts life science' for the paper that disucces the tool that modifies a publisher's webpage indicating that a paper has been discussed on Cb or Pg...
- Egon Willighagen
I think the problem is useful tags not just in the posts but also the comments
- Richard P Grant
I'm trying to pay attention here, Egon
- Richard P Grant
Richard, no rush... this log will be around for long after today...
- Egon Willighagen
Euan talks about FF
- Richard P Grant
FriendFeed is a useful tool, but doesn't link back to the original blog (unless using plugins).
- Martin Fenner
Mutiple references to the same original data can happen on FriendFeed.
- Martin Fenner
We just got very meta
- Richard P Grant
Userscripts for the Life Sciences - http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-21... - nice work
- Richard Akerman
Where's Peter M-R when we need him?
- Richard P Grant
Cameron is talking great sense about stuff that isn't papers—'subjects' as a whole, concepts, ideas...
- Richard P Grant
Yay! We're trashing wikipedia!
- Richard P Grant
Another wise comment from Maxine—what we're doing here, today, is NOT mainstream.
- Richard P Grant
I just made the point that I'd like to see measured data more central in linking papers, discussion, etc
- Egon Willighagen
Journal publishers and libraries have a special role here.
- Martin Fenner
'A central semantic web problem' —Andrew Walkingshaw
- Richard P Grant
We need doi's not just for papers, but for all kinds of objects.
- Martin Fenner
Yeah, all very good points, but how the hell do we do anything useful??
- Richard P Grant
ISBN ISRC UPA— Andrew
- Richard P Grant
We can't consistently name proteins... (Jenny, http://network.nature.com/blogs...)
- Richard P Grant
Andrew makes the point it's NOT a technological problem, it's a social one: which is what I was saying.
- Richard P Grant
The ubiquity script 'addInChI this' has just been suggested to help bloggers overcome the technological problems of semantic blogging...
- Egon Willighagen
Ubiquity gets mentioned: http://labs.mozilla.com/2008...
- Martin Fenner
Chemical ubiquity scripts: http://rguha.wordpress.com/2008...
- Egon Willighagen
ah, yes, Jenny Beard is on the ball
- Richard P Grant
Massimo is the win!
- Richard P Grant
JC Bradley says that we should perhaps accept that there are multiple conversations and accept that...
- Richard P Grant
if 'we' scientists want to give the public good information why don't we all make sure that there is an accurate up to date entry on wikipedia in our subject? It will probably come up first on a google search
- Jo Badge
Jo, the major problem is that if you edit a wikipedia article it tends to get edited right back :/
- Richard P Grant
here you all are, Twitter has gone quiet on the #sciblog front
- mike seyfang
Jenny blogged about something that someone had already blogged about.. but the framing can be different, which is good. Ties back to the creativity session
- Richard P Grant
Mike, it was getting troublesome to maintain them both!
- Richard P Grant
Mike, you're the perfect example of what we are discussing here... split ups of discussions, which should be joined...
- Egon Willighagen
@RichardP That's not been my experience on Wikipedia Richard. If you substantiate your entry with publications, you can get reversions frozen as vandalism. This takes time and effort, no recognition for this type of activity from institutions, but I agree with Jo's point entirely - Wikipedia is the public face of science, not blogs.
- AJCann
wikipedia -richard - then edit it back. the power of the crowd only works if there is a crowd - if scientists embraced this idea, it would stick
- Jo Badge
Session ended.
- Egon Willighagen
whereas the experience of wikipedia that I have (second-hand; the stories make me run away screaming) indicate that it is more or less impossible to get something _true_ on wikipedia if a wikitard has control of the article. It's just not worth the effort.
- Richard P Grant
“First podcast of #sciblog introductions posted to http://sciencegeekspeak.com/fe... - http://friendfeed.com/e...
Thanks @lisushi for the audio!
- mike seyfang
got any audio ?
- mike seyfang
attracting scientists, anyone recall that 'sex can wait, I want to be an engineer' billboard #sciblog
#sciblog - Cameron Neylon doing a great job covering panel live at http://friendfeed.com/rooms...
mike seyfang: #sciblog ALERT! Live stream of Ben Goldacre keynote NOW -> http://www.mogulus.com/cameron... (via Twitter) - http://twitter.com/fang...
mike seyfang: looks like #sciblog is underway - @rpg7twit has met @lisushi = great start. (via Twitter) - http://twitter.com/fang...
having a wee snooze before #sciblog tonight - hoping to catch some of you online tonight
wearin my london science blogging conf t-shirt #sciblog
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