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Quality of high-volume users: How will FriendFeed adjust to Facebook's user base? FriendFeed's early community has been able to keep very high quality standards in the early heavy user base. Facebook's heavy users include a lot more network-marketers (which offer services & quality of a more self-promoting type).
Thomas Power, Ed Moltzen, Mahendra (SkepticGeek) and 12 other people liked this
In a conference at Stanford last year, someone from Amazon showed data that the high-volume and low-volume reviewers at Amazon were the lowest quality & most spammy (e.g. I'm praising my friends product, or I'm going to downgrade ALL of my competitors). The middle-volume reviewers were more real.
- Mitchell Tsai
I'm not sure what the proportions are at Facebook, but it's probably the reason why Facebook bans so many people. Due to a lack of manpower (and/or poor management decisions like PayPal), they probably ban 1 good person for every 10 bad people (false positive).
- Mitchell Tsai
The FriendFeed team (due to experiences with Google) probably anticipated users abusing their system, thus started with (1) limits on likes/week starting at 160/wk or lower (2) complicated algorithms for bringing items to the top (or leaving them buried).
- Mitchell Tsai
I think if anyone is abusing the system I would say my.space.com is really bad.
- TERESA
Teresa - What do you mean by "all the various"? I'm concerned that groups like "FriendFeed Feedback" work because it's not polluted by 100 SPAM entries for every real entry. The quality here is quite nice.
- Mitchell Tsai
I have had a lot of trouble with getting various, somewhere even having the protection. It wipe out my whole computer just right after I joined the internet.
- TERESA
Yeah. I joined MySpace too late, and only use it to connect to some musicians/bands who don't have Facebook pages. One of my friends started a Social Network and had 60,000 people, but I didn't relate to anything there. I left slash.dot because the quality of 99% of the comments is so low - it does have "1-5" ratings which help immensely, but the number of inane/sophomoric comments is insane.
- Mitchell Tsai
Google has a high rep. and I have seen a lot of good with them.
- TERESA
oh...you mean "viruses"? Yeah. I like Google's quality. Zee posted a great photo about Google today http://ff.im/6NG8F
- Mitchell Tsai
I think folks that really love the Facebook UI and style ( I am not one of them) will not really want to spend time on Friendfeed. We may be saved. :-) Of course the spamalots will go anywhere and everywhere. It will be up to the core FF community to show them the virtual door.
- Karma Martell
Couldn't agree more. FriendFeed is a bit harder to understand and use than Facebook, which has skewed its audience towards early-adopters. Facebook wants to meet the mob where they live and as a result generally celebrates the mundane. Nothing is that black and white but I can understand why so many people would flee to Google Reader or whatever community seems viable.
- practicehacker
One more point to make: yesterday for the first time I encountered a gaggle of trolls on FF. Guess it would be naive to think they're not on, but I've had such consistently positive and enriching reads on FriendFeed that I was (unpleasantly) surprised. Hope that wasn't the start of a trend!
- practicehacker
lions and witches and trolls. oh my! ;-)
- Karma Martell
I agree with Karma and practicehacker. As for trolls... well thankfully I haven't seen any *cross my fingers*, but if the trend continues, FF may have to adopt a "moderated" style... the moderator's job is only to delete "flagged" posts, with the threshold settable (e.g., only posts with 10 or more flags can be deleted)
- Pandu ● IT Optimizer
Mitchell - Great questions and points to be considered here!
- Susan Beebe
from BuddyFeed
I only interact with my actual Friends on Facebook...I haven't seen the network-marketers although it will be interesting to see how FriendFeed unfolds because of the acquisation.
- Nicholas James
So after reports that FriendFeed is considering a function to truncate threads as well as limit commenting to a select group of people, I had a few ideas I feel might be worth considering in it's implementation.
Josh Haley, Jannifer @wordsforliving, Rob Michael (Atmos Trio) and 38 other people liked this
[Selective Commenters] If a post will now have the ability to restrict who may comment on it, I believe a function should be added to the Hide options to 'Hide all posts where I can not comment'. If I'm not worthy of commenting on their thread, I should have the option of saying their thread isn't worthy of being in my stream.
- Johnny Worthington
[Truncation - Reason] I understand the desire of some to truncate a post after a number of comments but I would like a reason nominated when the truncation takes place. The selection should be mandatory and the list should be made up of 4 or 5 reasons, 'Other' not being one of them.
- Johnny Worthington
[Truncation - Once] Once a thread has been marked by the owner as truncated, this should not be able to be undone. If the user feels compelled to end the thread, that is their decision, it should not be something that is toggled on and of at will.
- Johnny Worthington
[Truncation - Editing] Once the thread has been marked for truncation, all options of the owner to delete comments should be disabled. Likewise, the ability for a commenter to delete their comment should also be disabled. The ability for the owner of the thread to edit the title of the post and any of their comments should be disabled. Likewise, the ability to edit a comment should be...
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- Johnny Worthington
[Truncation - User Stats] I am much more likely to engage in a thread with someone who does not truncate the discussion. In the user stats on their friendfeed.com/user, it should show the number of posts truncated or expressed as a percentage.
- Johnny Worthington
I have always enjoyed the delicate power balance between the owner of the original post and the comments that flow from it. I just suggest these things to help ensure that balanced is not nudged to far in any party's favor.
- Johnny Worthington
"If I'm not worthy of commenting on their thread, I should have the option of saying their thread isn't worthy of being in my stream." - Very much agree with this. Any thread marked this way is clearly a private discussion and there's no need to have it in anybody else's stream at all other than as an ego-stroke "look what we're all talking about" - that's TV, not the web. By default, in my opinion, it simply shouldn't appear anywhere else.
- Mark H
+1 i agree too
- Bhowmik Shah
Johnny, I agree with the ideas you've put forth and appreciate the thought that went into them. However, I still feel this is a solution looking for a problem. If a thread/post has gotten so out of control that it needs to be truncated, I'd bet that it's an equal candidate for complete deletion. You don't stop runaway trains by taking some cars off the track.
- CAJ, somewhere else
So threads get out of control. Where is the lack of space? It can't be that. Most threads have very little to do with the orginal post and aren't worth reading anyway. It would be far more useful If people could comment directly with other comments. As for being picky about who is allowed to comment. Hardly social media is it? Why are people's solutions to problems restrictive? We have...
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- tom murphy
I would like to see the ability to branch off conversations to another thread, many times comments have nothing to do with the original post, but are comments on someone else's comments
- Kim Landwehr
Linking and merging threads?
- Anthony Citrano
Well written, Johnny. I suspect trying to micromanage bad behavior with FF options is not going to fair any better than the attempts to manage bad behavior in any other public space. The best set of options are the ones we choose to use for our own behavior. One of those options is to ignore those who don't understand the etiquette of spirited debate. Thanks for posting your ideas - they give a sense of the abuses that can happen if the controls are implemented.
- Polly Potter
I agree with all of these.. except it is only going to make FF more complicated! I'll wait and see how they implement it.
- Tim Hoeck
@Kim .. interesting idea - branch off conversations. .. i also was thinking about the option to set comments as free, open whiteboard, where comments would be placed anywhere, authors might be able to drag them to what they talk about - its the collaboration time! - .....// and, of course, comments with functionality close to posts, that has been mentioned here before ...
- Petr Buben
Johnny, agree on your first point. As for the rest I agree with Tim and believe, though they might be needed, they are over complicating FF. So perhaps the new feature is going to cause more fuss then it's going to solve. Perhaps there is another solution to the problem or perhaps we should deal with the issue in another way?
- Kol Tregaskes
Is "truncated" the right word? Or are we talking about "freezing" or "locking" a post? When someone says "truncated", I think of the functionality as lopping off some comments at the end of a thread. Why would someone want to do that?
- Jason Huebel
I guess the reason I think truncating is a bad idea is because the owner could always go back and delete off-topic comments. Truncating strikes me as being rather medieval. Let's lop off this arm of the post to save the rest of the body-- that kind of approach.
- Jason Huebel
The owner can moderate comments already. Is that what you mean, Jason?
- Kol Tregaskes
Kol, I think what Jason means is actually locking a thread, making it so no one else can comment but not actually deleting the thread. It's common in actual online forums. Johnny is requesting something a step further from that, where when a thread is locked no one can edit or remove their comments; the only thing that would remove them is the original poster deleting the post....
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- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
@Tina, well, my first comment was about locking. But then I realized my mistake and started actually talking about truncating a thread.
- Jason Huebel
I don't think our ability to edit our own comments should ever be removed... ever.
- Kol Tregaskes
I like the idea of locking comments on threads but not for the reason of abuse, more for the reason it could be used for 'sticky' posts. But yes the feature could easily be abused.
- Kol Tregaskes
Actually, the terminology that Johnny is using is a bit confusing. Is "truncate" supposed to mean that the thread is locked, preventing further comments?
- Jason Huebel
I believe that is what we are talking about? If not, ignore all my comments above. ;-)
- Kol Tregaskes
I think so, Jason, but Johnny will have to be the one to clarify when he wakes up.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Also, as for limiting commenting to a select group of people, isn't that what DM'ing a group of people does? So wouldn't adding a checkbox or something that says "Also make this public" be sufficient?
- Jason Huebel
I don't like the sound of "limit commenting to a select group of people". What gives anyone the right to determine who can write anything on here? Forums are about the free exchange of information and opinion. If you publish something into the public domain, that makes you fair game for a discussion. If someone doesn't share your opinion or thinks you're an idiot and says so, that's the way it works. If you don't like that then you should find something else to do with your time.
- Gilbert Harding
@Gilbert, well, I think if I post something I should have ability to put whatever limitations I want on that post. If we followed your train of thought, then why can't I see someone else's DMs? I mean, they're on a public site so I should be allowed to read whatever I want, right? No, I shouldn't.
- Jason Huebel
Either way, locking a thread is not going to (or shouldn't) stop anyone from re-sharing it and posting their comments on their new thread. At least it's away from the abused yet still being publicly broadcast?
- Kol Tregaskes
Jason, a DM is is a private conversation. That's not what is under discussion here. If you want to limit who can read your posts then this isn't, or shouldn't be, the place for you. Unless you go for a private feed everything you post is public and open to comment by any FF subscriber. I would be very disappointed if that ever changed. I get the impression there are some people here who have never experienced a good flame war on Usenet.
- Gilbert Harding
witnessed and even participated in a few. similar crap goes on messageboards, too. i don't see how editing someone else's comments would be all that beneficial unless you're trying to deal with a smear campaign and then you have larger issues to deal with.
- Joe Silence
Perhaps locking down a thread should only be allowed if the owner of the entry is the only commentator up to that point (like an announcement) but once others have commented then it's unlockable? Just a thought. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Announcements would seem to me to be the only candidate for "locking". Other web forums would call that Sticky and comments would be 'off'. All other posts are fair game for comment by everyone. Otherwise this isn't a social media site.
- Gilbert Harding
+++Jason - you're correct... we should have the right to put limitations on who reads our posts, plus who can respond, etc. Because otherwise the "popular" users who are actually just mob clicks who feed on flame wars, would ruin the service altogether. Especially since they have the belief that everything should be open to debate, nobody should be blocked, no comments should be...
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- Jannifer @wordsforliving
But Jannifer, there already are limitations in effect for who can read your posts: a private feed or simply DMing the post to the specific people you want to see it already exist. Either (or both) of these are already in place and either (or both) allow you to have your content appear to only the people you want without anyone else seeing it. To me, the concept of having something...
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- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Thanks for the feedback, everyone. We're working hard to get this feature right and love all the suggestions and commentary around the correct implementation.
- Ross Miller
There is another interesting (but very long) thread on this subject here as well: http://ff.im/55aZH
- Kol Tregaskes
I don't like the idea of limiting a public thread to certain users. Either it's on for all or off for all. I think the idea of perhaps making individual entries private and the idea of limiting the lock feature to threads with only the owner of the thread as the commenter.
- Kol Tregaskes
I think a post owner should be allowed to lock and unlock posts at will. Yes, there's the potential for abuse. But I think the owner's rights to their posts trumps that. What if you ask a question, get the answer to that question and want to lock the thread for archive reasons (to keep it from growing any further)? What if the comments on a post are out of control (in your view) and you want to lock it to force a kind of "cool down period"? The post owner's rights-- that's the key.
- Jason Huebel
If I wanted to be limited, I would just stay on Twitter
- Outsanity
Oh Tina, I wasn't thinking about only allowing certain people to comment - I really don't know what to think about that and didn't even have that in mind. I was only disagreeing about the concept that certain people don't belong or shouldn't here if they don't want everything to be public or unrestricted.
- Jannifer @wordsforliving
I'd like to use friendfeed like a true microblogging platform and have the same options as a regular blog - I can delete a post if I want, moderate comments, etc. I just now realized something!!! - I think some people look at friendfeed like it's a Forum, where everyone's comments should stand once posted. And this makes sense to me now why people think this way if they view it like a...
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- Jannifer @wordsforliving
FF can be used in both ways, Jannifer, that's why it's a great service yet confusing to come. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
I don't view FF as a forum, per se. I reserve the right to delete comments or posts. But I'm also hesitant to delete things unless absolutely necessary. Other users might not be as conservative with their approach. But that doesn't make their approach any more right or wrong, IMO.
- Jason Huebel
Jason, exactly. You are able to use FF in many different ways. It's one of its charms. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
why am i not seeing http://friendfeed.com/friendf... when i search for any of 1) more complicated than it sounds. 2) more complicated than it sounds 3) more complicated than
Kol Tregaskes liked this
Can we please add pics/files when we edit a post?
Kol Tregaskes, Chris Myles, Kishore Balakrishnan and 3 other people liked this
I asked it some time ago as I usually use the bookmarklet and sometimes would like to add a photo to my entries in a second time.
- Flavio
Thanks for the suggestion Glenn! We would love to add this feature, but it will take a little time as it is more complicated than it sounds. Again, thanks for the feedback.
- Ross Miller
What do you think are the major barriers to wider FriendFeed adoption among Twitter users?
Zackatoustra, Stanislas Jourdan, Jorge Barba and 15 other people liked this
The misconception that it's a duplication of services. That and not every Twitter knows that it exists yet.
- Chris, Taskerrific Guy
By the way, both problems are fixed with simple education of users.
- Chris, Taskerrific Guy
FF is too - much - work compared to twitter.
- vijay
Getting their heads out of their asses. If they can understand twitter and google reader, they can understand FF -- no more of this "I don't get it" bullshit.
- Andy Bakun
I think it also appears a great deal more complicated than Twitter (an observation which, frankly, has merit in my opinion).
- Brett Kelly
@Dread - how do we educate better?
- Brett Kelly
FF is more complicated than twitter, but that's because a) twitter has zero features, and b) FF actually does a lot of of the work for you, like bringing in content from other sites automatically, threads conversations, has robust search, and has had less downtime.
- Andy Bakun
I think that the dearth of mobile applications/capabilities is a part of it, as well. (relative to Twitter, I mean)
- Brett Kelly
Just my view, but I think the FF interface is an issue to new adoption. Facebook and Twitter simplify the user experience, I don't think that FF appeals due to the way it looks to the casual user. If FF had a cool user experience, it could drive up the numbers and show the value it has.
- Keith Bennett
from BuddyFeed
It's a question of necessity: not all Twitter users need what FriendFeed has to offer --depth, engagement.
- Brad Kligerman
vijay: that's bullshit. Facebook has 250 million users and it is a LOT harder to use than friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
How long have Facebook and Twitter been around? I think FB has been around for a while and Twitter longer than FF though not sure by a great deal?
- Kol Tregaskes
Only one: twitter :)
- Nikos Anagnostou
I find that I have to put just as much effort into Lists on FriendFeed as I do Making groups in a Twitter client. So, the more work argument just doens't hold up IMO. Most people aren't getting nearly the value out of Twitter that they could be. Friendfeed seems to me easier to understand because the things list Lists re built into the default (web) interface that people use, and they...
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- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
If FF had a better way of importing the people I follow on Twitter (instead of just the people I follow who have FF) I think it could gain significant market share vis a vis Twitter.
- Garin Kilpatrick
The point of FriendFeed is to import your stuff from other sites, Twitter is popular with the mainstream, but how many mainstream people do you know that use 2 or more of the sites FriendFeed can import content from. They just don't see the advantage of using FriendFeed over Twitter if all they're doing is posting status updates, you might not think FriendFeed is too complicated or has too many features, but for the average person it does.
- DarknessFalls
if the point is to import stuff from other sites then sending that info onto twitter just made that reson defunct as why use it FF at all when it just use as a twitterfeed ??? we need more features that set it apart from FB or twitter plus better intrigration of those services we need easyer adoption from those services to FF
- Rollz Chamberlain
I'm a TweetDeck aficianado, and I'm not a huge fan of web-based apps like FF. If they get a good desktop app, I'd be more inclined to spend time here.
- Lisa Logan
Lisa: You can download the AIR version of PeopleBrowsr - we have support for FriendFeed in that. Basically all that's missing from PeopleBrowsr's Friendfeed implementation is duplication of the FF web realtime. (i.e. newly commented posts don't come into the column again - refresh is necessary) - We do, however, fully support FriendFeed Lists, Rooms, posting likes and commenting.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rollz - it's used as much more than a twitterfeed, and beyond that, provides a space in which one can easily discuss the ideas that come in via twitter and all the other sources, whereas that discussion would be very cumbersome on twitter itself
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Personally I believe Twitter is more popular, because there is a fashion for it and everyone heard about twitter, but much less people heard about FF. FF has much more great features while serving same purpose, but in this scenario with social apps, the app that more of your friends use, wins, so generally now the situation FF is in, is pretty without any hope as more people will use it, if more people starts using it, what makes no sense.
- Black Dot
the attraction of Twitter is that there is no thread - no continuation of a thought.
- MikeAmundsen
Exactly and every try to respond to people's messages result in rapid generation of illegible spam.
- Black Dot
Lets face it. A lot of folks on Twitter now would willingly pay money to go see a movie like The Pacifier. Friendfeed is too sophisticated for them. Too many bells n whistles.
- beersage
beersage: I don't think it's any much more complicated than any twitter client app that supports groups. I don't think that's why. I think the barrier to adoption is people saying what you said, and scaring off many that would use FriendFeed. I also think that the overall marketing of FriendFeed could be stepped up BUT, I think they've been wise to keep the systems ahead of the...
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- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I think friendfeed would really benefit from a way to use it as your main twitter webapp. This would pull in many powertwitter etc users. These will then discover the other features of friendfeed.
- TobiasVerhoog.com
The problem I have with FriendFeed as my main Twitter (or FriendFeed) app is that I can't watch a large amount of data simultaneously. I like to have the multi column layout so that I can watch several lists at once. (but even watching through an app, I use friendfeed lists a lot as a way to watch a lot of twitter action)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Is it possible to put comment and like links on comments. Sometimes the comments are more interesting and/or funnier than the post itself.
Mo Hall, Kenley Neufeld, Isha (Marysia) and 5 other people liked this
Little up/down votes would be interesting, but let's not make the interface too complicated. I would like to get rid of things like "USERNAME+++10000" stuff that doesn't contribute to the conversation or comment thread.
- Andy Bakun
So is that hidden comment feature for yourself or for everyone?
- Johnny Worthington
Personally, in nearly all cases it would be for everyone. I guess the share and hide options could be there too.
- tom murphy
Personally, I am unsure about letting the masses vote on what I should be looking at. I like the stream of consciousness approach and things like threading and voted hiding do not sit well with me.
- Johnny Worthington
Best of day is a kind of voting system anyway. Isn't a comment on a post a post in itself and therefore in turn is entitled to be commented upon?
- tom murphy
tom, do you pay tip on a tip at your favourite restaurant? Nothing absolutely right or wrong with layering, but at some point there are diminishing returns. The username++ actually has some strong advantages, at least in my experience on FF - it's a personal gesture that by nature of being hard to count-up/aggregate, isn't a target for being gamed or just used excessively (such as...
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- Micah Wittman
Hi Micah, does anyone tip on a tip in a restaurant? And I am certainly not interested in gaming a system. Especially a socmed system - I have a life. Folks have an option to just comment in sequence. My suggestion is merely to allow the opportunity to adjoin their comments to another comment which may not be directly related to the original post. It's only a suggestion.
- tom murphy
tom, I didn't intend to come across too strongly on this - I've been thinking through the pros and cons of a hierarchical commenting / comments attached to other comments for a while. So this is me conversing and thinking out loud. I keep coming back to my experience with comment systems that go off horizontally and/or require drill-down to reveal who knows how many hidden levels. I'm...
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- Micah Wittman
I like giving out points. +2 for Micah for defending the point system!
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
It's official. I'm back to FriendFeed. And I love it. I've had my soiree with SocialMedian, twisted with Twine, flirted with Facebook, and even had a tumble with Tumblr. (Though, I still have an apartment downtown for Twitter). I've even left my main blog and made FriendFeed my one-and-only. To me, it's the perfect online companion.
zeroinfluencer, Kishore Balakrishnan, Nicholas James and 16 other people liked this
That is pretty bold Bill. Do you think FriendFeed is a satisfactory replacement for a blog?
- Paul Jacobson
Seriously. It's the perfect median between Twitter and more complicated sharing sites like Twine and SocialMedian. And Facebook is full of real-world friends. And very few of them are into the geeky stuff that seems to permeate FF. Which is also what makes FF seem more like what Twitter used to feel like. And as far as my blog goes, I really don't have the time and patience for it anymore. So thank you, FF!
- Bill Bittner
Yes, Paul, I do. My blog was mostly posts of stuff I found anyway. And I want to spend more of my time writing my screenplays and novels, and not my blog. And if I do want to write a longer article than FF permits, I may still post it in my blog, or in my EverNote public notebook or a shared Google Docs document.
- Bill Bittner
Bold, but I like it! We'll be watching to see how that work for you :)
- WorldofHiglet
Hmm, Evernote public notebook as a low-fi blog is an interesting idea.
- Brett Kelly
Ok, that is an interesting approach Bill. I have considered replacing my Tumblr blog with FriendFeed but stuck with it (and since added Posterous) because of their functionality. I do see how this could work and I agree with Brett, the Evernote option is very interesting!
- Paul Jacobson
I'm not saying this approach would work for everybody. Just those with short-attention-span like mine.
- Bill Bittner
Bill, that would probably include me but I am also drawn to shiny objects (in other words, a myriad social services)
- Paul Jacobson
Love it!!!!!
- Myrna
Bill, "short attention spans"-you got me on that one!!!
- Myrna
Welcome back!
- Nicholas James
Dear FriendFeed: I LOVE YOU!! The new 'moderate subscribers' page is awesome, and the ability to view subscribers most recent first is a wonderful addition. YOU ALL DESERVE COOKIES!!!
Daniel Rowley, yasin ghasemi, Shey, Jamaican of FF and 103 other people liked this
ive been away - where where?
- Zee.
editted : Own page > Subcribers , sorry.. :)
- Yunus Tunak
confused - what should i be looking for? Where's this moderate subscribers page?
- Zee.
I don't see it, either.
- Michelle Martinez
Own page > Subcribers
- Threepwood
@threepwood - i see the subscribers by most recent first...but can someone please tell me where "moderate subscibers" is?
- Zee.
friendfeed.com/YourUserName/subscribers?filter=followers&moderate=1
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Try NBY's post http://friendfeed.com/niron...
- Threepwood
thanks Threepwood - i dont get what the moderate subscribers thing is about...
- Zee.
I see it. I have a bunch of subs I wasn't notified of, that's strange.
- Michelle Martinez
On the moderate page you can clearly see who you're not subscribed to out of those who are subscribed to you. Before this morning, the subscribers page was just a vast expanse of pictures with no indication of who you were subscribed back to. The moderate option, combined with 'people I'm not subscribed to' makes it quick and easy to see which of your subs you've not subbed back to. My...
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- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Screw cookies... I'm offering foot rubs and apple crumble
- Johnny Worthington
Apparently I'm a dumb ass, because I didn't read moderate as control, but as moderate like not excessive. I'll shut up now.
- Michelle Martinez
Tina, agree, also if you sub to someone the page refreshes, wish this was AJAX.
- Kol Tregaskes
I'd like a fluid connection of blog comments and FF comments (one feed updating with both) Alternatively granting myself and reader omniscience would be acceptable. I like having the developed conv all in one place for later writing/editing. Is a credits page with all the contributing commenters acceptable for an ebook?
- Mark Essel
Trying to leverage FF expertise in this comment thread
- Mark Essel
Interesting, I see a lot of subscribers that I never received notifications for.
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
Exactly I have not received notifications for everyone, now I can go to people I'm not subscribed to and suscribe back.
- M F
I'm very glad we could help :)
- Benjamin Golub
Me too =D Now, if only the subscribers page would let me know when I've already requested a sub to someone with a private feed *ashamed for being needy and whiny*
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
@Tina, it sill seems to me that if someone with a private feed follows you, you should automatically be allowed to follow them back, without all the cloak & dagger. Maybe it's because I don't get why people have private feeds on social networks, but that may just be me...
- Joey Gibson
I understand why: there are some people here who've caught flack from their employers about things they've said, etc. A private feed helps avoid that pitfall, and I respect the need to balance participation with keeping your job. I just wish the subs page would tell me 'pending' or something similar so I don't go and try to subscribe all over again...
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Also Tina: I'll fix your issue with requested subs still showing up in that list and the access denied error shortly.
- Benjamin Golub
W00t!! Benjamin gets double cookies! Seriously, I should add FF to the swap box list we'll be mailing out that way everyone can send some goodies.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Thanks for pointing it out Tina. :)
- Russ Jackson
TIna: What is a swap box list?
- coldbrew
Coldbrew: you can check the room here http://friendfeed.com/friendf... Basically, I put some stuff in a box and mail it to person 1. They take some stuff out, put some stuff in, and mail it to person 2. So on and so forth, with everyone getting and giving goodies until the box gets mailed back to me. Then I take a few bits out, and start the process all over again. It's sometimes called a round robin or goodie train.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
While I share in the FF love, I'm hoping there will a scrub of the UI to make it easier to find all these wonderful features they're adding! Thanks to everyone who finds them and posts about them.
- CAJ, somewhere else
So, is a remove like a block?
- Mathew A. Koeneker
I don't know, I've never done it. I think it just stops them from following you...
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Goodie train sounds fun, it is a prestigious gift that keeps on giving
- Mark Essel
Tina: Very interesting. Thanks.
- coldbrew
Like the post, Like the feature
- Lu Tao
Okay, YAY! Now, I can catch up quickly. Ty, FF!
- Kathy Fitch
Tina, I deserve c00k135, too ;P
- Alp
LOL! Alp, I think EVERYONE deserves cookies at some point!
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
This is very very cool ;-) Found something interesting..a subscriber that has 600K+ followers on twitter (and follows exactly 53 there) has only 758 subscribers here, but subscribes to 47K+ (is a model)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Love it! Thank you, FriendFeed!
- joey
How did Mr. Combs get subbed to me? I never got that email.
- LogEx
I love this feature too, thanks FF!
- Edward Zwart
complained about it a couple days ago. use the new feature today. loved it. going to bed.
- Brian Hendrickson
Thank you. We still need to be able to unblock from a list of people we've blocked, however. Seeing people referenced in comments, but with no link to their profile, there's no way to unblock them.
- tollie williams
ooh, that is a nice feature. It says "manage" subscribers now. That makes sense (and Michelle, I thought of the same thing you did at first!). I also love that the groups are back to showing the most recently updated on top. I *really* missed that when it was gone. Lovefest. Hugs and kisses.
- Laura Norvig
Kol Tregaskes to Kol's feed, FriendFeed Talk, FriendFeed Bugs and Ideas, FriendFeed Feedback, The Facebook Experience
To Facebook fans, what do you like on FB that you would like to see on FriendFeed? Do you think Facebook does certain things better than FriendFeed? Is there a reason you like FB over FF, if so, what would you like to happen that would make you switch or use FF more?
Nia, Molly, Iván Abrego and 15 other people liked this
First person to say Poking gets a closeup view of a Size 10 Roundhouse
- Johnny Worthington
Hehe, Johnny. No way do we want poking, what about status updates on the FF bios, for example?
- Kol Tregaskes
hmmm tough question. It's the look, feel, interaction? Can't quite single anything out. Maybe it's simply due to having more friends and interaction on FB for me?
- Sean
Why poking of course... <drops to floor from size 10 roundhouse>
- Kevin Whalen
I'd like more interconnectivity between the services, myself. This is also the same issue I also have with Facebook desktop clients, such as Seesmic Desktop. I would like to be able to "Like" and "Comment" on my Friend's Facebook Statuses, and have them appear on my Friend's Facebook walls, without having to go to Facebook (such as from FriendFeed, for example). Drawback to that, of...
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- Helen Sventitsky
lmao! @ Kevin :D
- vijay
Zombies!!!! And better photo integration/organization.
- Rui Pereira
Slayers!!! And better photo integration/organization.
- ★ Soner Gönül
No, none of these silly zombies/slayers games, hehe. And no apps.
- Kol Tregaskes
I was about to join FB, and then I read its ToS, where FB claims exclusive rights to all my content I put up there. That's when I closed the window. Subsequently, I do not want anything from FB to trickle down, or up, to FF.
- ianf ⌘
Those ToS are worrying though FB "assure" us they don't!
- Kol Tregaskes
You might get a better response posting this on FB. Responses like ... "FriendFeed? What's that ? Lemme check it out"
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
Ahsan, I did, it all goes to FB. ;-) Not a single reply. ;-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Superpoking!
- Alex Scoble
FF has already drifted far too close toward Facebook for my liking. Facebook is like the training wheels lite version of the Web 2.X Social etc., with it's vertically integrated walled garden bringing everything under one roof. FF does absolutely everything Facebook does, without walling it off. I can manage my photos with the service I want, I can blog with the service I want, I can...
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- Matthew DeVries
The thing I like about Facebook has nothing to do with the technology: I like Facebook because many more of the people I know in real life are there. FriendFeed is nice technology but there's a distance to the information coming through there because very few of the the people I am subscribed to are actually "friends"--they're just people I "know" through the Web.
- Tommy Williams
I like that I can restrict certain content (i.e. photos) to certain circles of friends.
- Jeanine W.
Jeanine, yeah that could be incorporated in FF, perhaps selectively restricting what non-subscribers can see or by having 2 or more levels of friends but fear this would complicated things.
- Kol Tregaskes
I'm with Tommy, the main reason I use FB is because of all the RL friends that are also on it. Though the reason I like FF is for the same reason--not so many RL friends- :)
- Kelly W.
That is a really interesting ? My personal use of FB is fairly static. However my business use is becoming much more dynamic. Facebook business pages are growing rapidly and organically. I previously imported customs feed here into a private Feed. I then ported out interesting content that I found contained in those feeds. The new FF limits that activity and I have noticed changes in...
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- Eric Logan
Events (I don't want it in Friendfeed, but that's the main reason why FF can't replace FB) and photo-tagging.
- Jérôme Flipo
FF Direct Messages Suggestions: Suggestions for Direct messages (DMs) in the new FriendFeed UI: #betakoltaglist
Stylish Eve liked this
Related posts here: http://beta.friendfeed.com/search...
- Kol Tregaskes
1. DMs to everyone regardless to if you subscribe to each other, but with a on/off toggle.
- Kol Tregaskes
IGNORE: 2. Public DMs (LOW).
- Kol Tregaskes
3. Change “Direct messages” to “Notices”: http://beta.friendfeed.com/friendf...
- Kol Tregaskes
IMPLEMENTED: 4. IM alerts for DMs.
- Kol Tregaskes
5. DMs also shared to a public feed need to be far clearer so the user knows the message is publicly visible: http://beta.friendfeed.com/friendf...
- Kol Tregaskes
6. Distribution lists for DMs: http://beta.friendfeed.com/friendf... and http://beta.friendfeed.com/friendf...
- Kol Tregaskes
1: I assume you mean a toggle like "accept DMs from people you don't subscribe to". 2: makes no sense to me. 3: Agreed. 4: +1, but a bad implementation could ruin the idea. 5: My gut reaction is that there are a lot of logical pitfalls lurking about here. 6: I don't really like the idea of distribution lists. If you just add to a feed, everyone can see it anyway. What we need is a way to draw subscribers' attention to the presence of a new item.
- Karl Knechtel
Karl, for 1, I believe DMs will be open to everyone regardless of whether each of you subscribe to the other. If so, then a toggle to turn it off for people who don't want to be DM'ed would probably be need.
- Kol Tregaskes
Karl, for 2 I think this can actually be done anyway, you can post to a user but also to your own feed, thus a "pulbic" DM. So can ignore 2.
- Kol Tregaskes
Karl, the idea for 6 came up from Alex as he sends out his stock market game results as DMs. If you look at one of these the list is huge and messy. Sure the names need to be seen but to have a dist. list that you can post to would be far easier to maintain than adding all those users every time you post to them. So it's more a private dist list you can create, edit and use.
- Kol Tregaskes
can i delete a DM sended to me? i don't want to see it and his comments.
- Felter Roberto
a choice "comment only to sender" or "comment to all"
- Felter Roberto
Felter, you are able to delete the entry but that would delete it from your DM page and he feed. There is no way to remove it from his feed only and thus turned into a private-style DM. Interesting feature to have though.
- Kol Tregaskes
Felter, I think the two comments options would get very complicated. What does everyone think, though?
- Kol Tregaskes
if i receive a DM, my reply could be important only for the sender, why all the other have to read it?
- Felter Roberto
7. The ability to send a DM or DM to multiple users and groups via email You can reply but not initial send atm. [cannot find reference post, sorry but was with discussion with Johnny]
- Kol Tregaskes
8. Ability to unsubscribe to a DM (remove yourself from the feed: http://friendfeed.com/friendf...
- Kol Tregaskes
@Kol .. I believe that gentleman's name is Roberto:]] ..and i suggest - focus placed directly into the tet box once typed "gd"
- Petr Buben
9. Ability to mark DMs as "read": http://friendfeed.com/friendf...
- Kol Tregaskes
Adding services (feeds) of myself to FriendFeed takes time and having done that, one rarely revisit the page to add more over time. FriendFeed should be able to discover services as used and add them to FriendFeed in ongoing manner, would be great. I've thought of Firefox addon, to fulfill the goal...
lily2008661 and Kol Tregaskes liked this
There is a chance that greasemonkey script or bookmarklet (manually triggering the check) will work too.
- Myroslav Opyr
Any FF add-on for FF should include a few more things than just that. I have a list somewhere...
- coldbrew
I'm not about addon itself, but about the autodiscovery feature. Using FriendFeed should be simpler then copying out your misc Facebook URLs... It is not that complicated, but not trivial yet.
- Myroslav Opyr
I think I'd like the service icons back, looking at my feed it very confusing as it's very unclear what are diggs, greaders or ff posts.
Neil Saunders, Andrew C, James Myatt and 21 other people liked this
I'd only be after a small icon.
- Kol Tregaskes
I was just making a post for this... "My only other feedback after an hour of beta is... can we have a small service favicon somewhere in each post? It's a nice visual to help the brain prioritize what to look at. I want to know at a glance who it's from and where it's from, without reading the timestamp line. A picture's worth a thousand words."
- LogEx
There appears to be no related entries any more! :-(
- Kol Tregaskes
Posting a link is not possible anymore.
- Peter
Big people pictures, who wants that? This isn't twitter? It's about content!
- Peter
I like that I posted this in 2 rooms and the comments are visible in both rooms. :-D
- Kol Tregaskes
^^ now that is really cool!
- vijay
I agree completely. An icon is needed.
- Brandon Titus
Yeah, one thread in more than one room, very cool. Without making things too complicated... is there a way reshare (when it's reintroduced) could allow this? (ie, not starting over...) It would have to be a choice b/c sometimes you'd want to start over, other times you'd want the context of the whole thing. Anyone want this?
- Edward Zwart
I would really like the ability to have my profile not indexed by search engines. Facebook gives me this option and with the amount of information that Friendfeed is pulling into the site, it would be nice if it could be non-Googlable. Some of us would like for our employers and potential-employers to have a harder time finding out every detail of...
Voyagerfan5761, Atul Arora, Bruce Lewis and 7 other people liked this
to have a harder time finding out every detail of our lives. I don't think I do anything horrible here but I definitely would like to not expose my employer to my religious beliefs or my political beliefs.
- Andrew
You can do this. Make your account private. If your account is public it should ALWAYS be available to Google.
- Robert Scoble
Agree with Robert. If the account wasn't available via Google but was available via a direct link it would give you a false sense of privacy and security.
- Oleg Podsechin
Why would it have to be available to Google if it isn't Private? I would like the ability to find people and have them find me... through the site. And it wouldn't be a false sense of security. It would just let me know that most jobs interviews I go to won't have easy access for perusing my digging activity going back a few years or checked out which youtube videos I've favorited. I...
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- Andrew
If you can link to it, it will be found. Google is not the only thing that indexes your FriendFeed information (Surprise! http://www.ffholic.com/UserInf...) , and it's about the only thing that would honor a noindex directive. You're asking to break the best part of the web, that it's searchable, in order to create a shanty town of a false sense...
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- Mark Trapp
Occasional: because I hate sites that try to break the Web. If you don't want to be public, just go private. It makes the model very clear and easy to understand for everyone. If it's public Google should be able to look at it just like I'm able to look at it.
- Robert Scoble
First off, Google is about the only thing that matters in terms of searching. If Cuil wants to index it I doubt my future employer will be checking them. I don't believe in 100% security, but having a nice buffer between work and play can be nice. 2) Having the account completely private creates a situation where you are never on the receiving end of a "Friend of" posts. Which means you...
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- Andrew
Robert: Why is that breaking the web? I don't agree with this moral case for indexing. Obviously there are already tools built in to Google and other search engines to allow for this sort of thing. And it doesn't seem to be breaking the web right now.
- Andrew
Occasional: FFHolic indexes all of your FriendFeed activity, and Google indexes FFHolic. See how this gets absurd pretty quickly?
- Mark Trapp
Occasional: because the Web is somethng that shouldn't have walls and shouldn't be locked off to one service or another and should have an easily understood security and privacy model. I far prefer Facebook's approach. If you are going to build a walled garden, build a walled garden, but that's not the Web as it should be.
- Robert Scoble
on flickr i thought there was an option to have your photostream non-indexable? i may have read that wrong... but at any rate, i can certainly see how all of this gets complicated pretty quickly.
- edythe
Occasional: I also really hate people who behave one way online and another way in front of their employers. That's hypocrisy of the worst kind in online communities and one that should NEVER be encouraged. It also is a lame belief because if it's online it will get passed around to your employers anyway.
- Robert Scoble
Mark - I see what you are saying. But I think you are misunderstanding my point. I completely recognize that nothing less than a complete wall of privacy encryption will 100% protect my info. But rather than a solid wall, I would like an opaque partition. Just like a bathroom partition, there are ways for extraordinarily sneaky eyes to find their way through if they really want to, but...
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- Andrew
Occasional: you already are doing that by not using your real name. So, no worries. I just really despise your attitude, though, nothing personal. If you are behaving so badly online that your job or future job is in jeopardy, why should we want you as part of our community here?
- Robert Scoble
This thread is perfect material for a blog post on taking your real world identity online ;)
- Oleg Podsechin
Robert - I think that is an easy position for someone like you, someone who lives 100% openly online, to take. If you are in sales, you may not want your clients to know your political affiliations. It probably won't come up, but if it does it can only alienate your client. You may not want them to know whether or not you practice their religion. Again that information can only hurt the...
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- Andrew
Occasional: it's not even a weak privacy mechanism. Search Google for "mark trapp." Guess what appears as result seven? Your employer will find everything you do even if FriendFeed stopped allowing Google to index your stuff, merely because everything else that's indexing it (and does not honor noindex directives) is in Google as well. So you're not doing anything other than patting yourself on the back wrongly for creating a hilariously ineffective solution to your problem.
- Mark Trapp
Occasional: well, I've found that being public online helps me get jobs that are compatible with my personality. If someone can't stand working with a Democrat agnostic Muslim, who has naked photos of themselves on the Internet then screw them. There are plenty of jobs out there. On the other hand, if I wanted a job where being politically neutral is a requirement, then I would just behave that way online. Seems you've done a good job, though, by just using a fake name.
- Robert Scoble
Robert - Don't you agree that there are some discussions that there are 100% appropriate for non-work environments and some that aren't? I mentioned politics and religion previously, but there are plenty of others. Are my experiences at a concert really work appropriate? I'm not saying that at work I put on a facade, but I definitely am not as open with my non-work related opinions as I am here.
- Andrew
Mark: not to mention, but if you post something in public FriendFeed then I will link to it, quote it, retweet it, etc. Those things will get indexed and, so, your potential employers will learn all about your weirdnesses online anyway. Me? I'd just rather be myself and take the consequences therein.
- Robert Scoble
Mark - Most employers are going to put your name into Google, Myspace, and Facebook. If nothing comes up that is offensive then they aren't going to hunt much further online. Which is why I don't believe 100% security is needed, just a veil.
- Andrew
Occasional: I saw an NEC executive get fired for posting a racially negative statement under a FAKE NAME without using his company's email address. Someone figured out who it was, told the boss, and the boss fired him. I saw a Microsoft employee get fired for hitting on my boss inappropriately at a club after work hours. He was wearing a Microsoft shirt. Truth is you can get fired for almost anything, especially in California and Washington, which are "at will" states.
- Robert Scoble
The best policy is to always behave online like it is on the front page of the New York Times. That way nothing bad will ever get back to your customers or your boss. If you work in a situation where you'll get punished for discussing politics, then don't. It's that simple. If you want freedom of speech, then get a job where that's acceptable.
- Robert Scoble
*munches popcorn*
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
Occasional: when I do hiring if nothing comes up in Google I never would hire you. It tells me you're not compatible with the job I'm hiring you for. :-)
- Robert Scoble
Robert - As a Democratic Nudist Muslem going through a crisis of faith, I understand this concern well. And I actually switched from using my real name just for that concern. It may be silly but it makes me feel better that the hub housing every thing I ever do online isn't the number 2 thing that comes up when you search for my name on Google.
- Andrew
Rahsheen: stop hogging the popcorn and pass some over here. You crack me up.
- Robert Scoble
Occasional: everything in FriendFeed is indexed in Google not just by FriendFeed, but by other things like FFholic. When your employer searches under your name, they will find everything you do in FriendFeed even if FriendFeed stopped indexing your feed because everything you do is showing up, multiple times, via other sites. Your FriendFeed activity is all over the web, and all of it...
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- Mark Trapp
By the way, I'd give the same advice (to only post stuff they'd be happy seeing on the front page of the New York Times) to someone on Facebook. How many times have we seen weird pictures leaked from a "private" Facebook profile? It's easy to capture the screen and repost. Of course, in my case, I don't mind my shower photos being posted. If someone isn't going to hire me because I have weird photos up on Valleywag then I don't want to work there anyway.
- Robert Scoble
I think that having a online identity, even if you are discussing religion/politics/Lindsay Lohan, shouldn't be a bad thing. I have the confidence to speak my mind, have my thoughts be put on record and use my real identity. Technically I don't think employers can discriminate based on religion or political affiliation, realistically, who knows.
- Will Higgins™
Mark, FFholic is actually a good point. There is no way to push the subsidiary networks out of Google.
- Andrew
Robert - I will say that you are in a very different position than most people. You live online. You've been pushing your identity here for years. Most people just want to play around online. It is a secondary activity to their job, not the core of their job. So your experiences may not translate to the rest of us that don't publish our phone numbers on our websites. Not that what you've accomplished doing so isn't very impressive.
- Andrew
Occasional: I agree that I'm far different than most humans (although most college kids on Facebook put far more of their lives online than I do) but what I'm telling you is a very informed opinion. If you think that employers in the future are only going to use Google you are totally wrong. HR departments are getting very adept at using a number of tools. Also, YOUR REPUTATION is most important, whether it's online or off. If you think your reputation is safe just because you kept your dirt off of Google..
- Robert Scoble
...you are totally wrong and in danger of doing yourself some serious career damage. Photos, videos, text can easily be emailed around. I'd rather be on the side of saying "only type and produce stuff on your computer or phone that you'd be happy seeing on the front page of the New York Times." If you do otherwise, I guarantee you you'll get embarrassed or worse.
- Robert Scoble
I feel like I should point out that I don't really have any dirt I'm hiding. I'm just trying to keep my employers/future employers from having complete access to my political thoughts and lack of a religious association. As an overweight 31 year old, there aren't any nudie pics that I know about or that I can imagine anyone wanting...
- Andrew
first - love & agree w/ rahsheen's reaction - second, this thread is the ff equivalent of link baiting, andrew its a presence aggregation service of other services you're active on, simply don't integrate your services and don't participate on ff - then your "affiliations" & "preferences" will be secure - amazing to me that robert & mark (two really smart guys) are actually trying to education you and you're sticking by your naivete...
- mike "glemak" dunn
mike - I don't think it is naivete. I would be surprised if other people didn't feel the same discomfort regarding the social aggregator exposure. Mark made a good point about FFholic, which I acknowledged, and Robert's point was more of a feeling that morally the entire web should be open, something I don't believe is the case today or will be at any time in the future. I don't believe...
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- Andrew
true andrew, but the room is also for feedback on those suggestions, which is what you've been getting on this thread - requires listening on your part though...
- mike "glemak" dunn
Another example of why I dislike this 'related entry' thing
Photon, LogEx, Mladen Srdić and 3 other people liked this
The entry that is visually interesting is hidden for a blunt text-only entry
- Peter
I'd like the option to do without this feature.
- Peter
...or get the way the feature works improved.
- Rodrigo
it shows most recently commented or liked entry first
- mjc
I hate this. I wish the pic was on top. How about a setting to turn off related filtering? I'd rather wade through "duplicate" entries than expand them one by one!
- Oliver Ortega Chua
It's also annoying having to pick through sometimes multiple related items if it is a Google Reader share or a Digg for example to look at the comments. Would make sense for related items for FriendFeed to roll all the related comments in together - although I'm thinking that would be *way* more complicated to implement than the URL matching they appear to be doing at the moment.
- Richard Peat
I would suggest to have the entry with the most data (comments + likes + images) as the main topic and put all others under related.
- Andreas Gohr
I'd suggest it should prioritise FriendFeed shares?
- Kol Tregaskes
@Kol... I think that's the best solution. Someone who takes the time to post here, with pics, Likes, conversations, whatever, is much more important than a bunch of people jumping on the bandwagon with Digg, Google Reader, StumbleUpon, etc.
- LogEx
One of these days, I'd like to see a little more flexibility in what we can import. I'd like to be able to import a specific tag from my Delicious account instead of every post. Or from Diigo, I'd like to be able to import "lists." Or playlists from YouTube, or sets from Flickr.
Dave Walker, Tanath and Mathew™ one of a kind liked this
Each of the things I've mentioned here publishes an RSS feed, so it would theoretically be possible to import them as if they were blogs. But if you do that, you lose all the associated content other than the title and the link. It seems like it wouldn't be that complicated to add that functionality (though I'm just guessing on that).
- Nathan Rein
Definitely need tag functionality. Been bugging for this for a while.
- Tanath
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