It's between the stroke one from the neuroanatomist - Jill Barad, I now remember - and the very first one I ever saw, on Seadragon out of MSFT.
- MaryB, BrandingBroadOfFF
from iPhone
"Faux Friendship"- a fascinating essay on the history of friendship: http://chronicle.com/article... (Don't agree w/ everything but still a great read)
Thank you for finding this, it is indeed a great read :-)
- Irma Vermaat
...as you, I didn't agree completely with everything... to make an example, on the point concerning the friendship from the Christian point of view... but on the whole I found it very interesting... Thank you!
- Haukr
BLOGBloke: One day we Twits will suddenly wake up in a cold sweat and suddenly realize all those hours wasted and gone forever. - http://twitter.com/BLOGBlo...
eh. I maintain a healthy distrust of all companies; especially those that grow as quickly as Google has been as of late. of course, time will tell.
- jbrotherlove
Not only are you legally required to agree, DeWitt, but you are quoted. :)
- Louis Gray
Ha. But I was about to add: But please never stop keeping Google honest, and holding the company to the highest standards. Call out Google on any BS or funny business you see. (I certainly do, though I usually do it internally...) I have tremendous faith in the people I work with, but it takes the whole community to do this right. And thank you, Louis, for your help here.
- DeWitt Clinton
My problem is that Google is into so much, and has so many good products, that it puts people into a situation where they end up with too many of their eggs in one basket. And no matter how good the basket is, it's still not a smart thing for people to do. And while Google may not be openly and willingly sharing its data with the government, it's only one subpoena away from being forced...
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- April Russo (app103)
April, if you were running Google, what would you do to make users feel more at ease? I'd be curious to get your take on what we should do.
- Matt Cutts
The way I see it, Google has no choice but to continue on the road its currently on, getting bigger and better/worse. So I have no advice for Google. I do have some advice for the rest of the world, however... Startups need to have a business plan from day 1 that includes the idea of profitability without being acquired by a bigger company. The idea of "build and sell to one of the big...
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- April Russo (app103)
"Google is not going to be evil because it hasn't been built to be evil. Will they work to speed up browsers and Web sites to give them more traffic on their search engine and more ads in more places? Sure. But that's just good business, not trickery." - Google's interests lie in creating a fast, ubiquitous, diverse and distributed web - that's what their business model needs. Today....
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- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
I am not saying to avoid being critical or trusting naively. But I think we should give a company credit for having set a foundation and trajectory that is to be respected and trusted, when others are not.
- Louis Gray
@April - cheers to that. Interestingly, just two years ago Facebook was the little company that decided to go it alone and not sell to the big guys, and now you list them *as* one of the big guys. Who knows, maybe the next big company is two people hacking away in a garage right now, plotting a course not to get bought, but to be the best.
- DeWitt Clinton
I hope so, and I hope there are a lot working in garages with those plans, because we need them.
- April Russo (app103)
They have always worked to align their interests and that of the users - and that was smart and good and created tremendous value online. I have my set of biases that make me suspicious of any business with too much control, too much market share. "Don't be evil" is not a nice-to-have marketing concept, it is an absolute requirement considering the flabbergasting amounts of information...
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- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
Just a sidenote - not being evil is what will keep Google from nailing the telcos with their efforts in GoogleVoice and Gizmo. To win in that market they will have to play a very evil and dirty game. They'll be going against masters at graft and corruption who own the legislators and regulators. If they don't learn to play evil and dirty, they will have a tough time winning in telco...
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- Ken Camp
Louis, I hope you are right. Google is a great company with a lot of great services and a lot of great people. But April and Joelle make some excellent points. I know I do a lot of half-tongue-in-cheek tinfoil stuff, but diversification is always a good idea (intentions can change, there can be rogue actors, etc.), as is pushing to know exactly what information is used, how it's used,...
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- LogEx
I'd suggest Google split up. 1) A super lean, but ultra focused semantic advertising team. 2) A blazingly awesome search company (those datacenters make me wistfully dream of virtual assistants of the future) 3) and split off every other focus (changed from service) they have into a separate entity. Allow the separate business entities to develop independently. Can big companies shrink successfully, you bet. They can do it on their own terms.
- Mark Essel
I agree that the public DNS is not likely a tipping point on the evil scale. But "Not going to happen" --implying never? -- are you saying that Google is somehow special, blessed, different from every other corporation on the face of the earth?
- Brian Sullivan
@DeWitt, I follow all of those regularly, thanks. Perhaps best on another thread or offline to convey some of my more detailed concerns. @Can, very true, ISPs are notorious for bad data practices, but from my perspective I think the main reason that DNS raised this issue yet again is the growing extent of access Google has to people's online activity.
- LogEx
@Matt Cutts: I would ask the Chrome and Wave teams to make the use of Google technologies possible and easy *without going through Google's servers* (as a 20% project). A Chrome + Wave system à la Opera Unite... Sure, the result wouldn't compare to Google's own cloud computing offer, but it would prove that Google is serious about our privacy and independence, and that "cloud in...
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- Jérôme Flipo
Killing Etherpad WITH all users' data looks nothing short of evil. Really, Wave is not ready to take its place.
- Alex Kapranoff
from Android
I'll have to do some tests to see if this is any faster than my local ISP DNS.
- Benjamin Golub
hmmm... and the reason behind this offer?
- MikeAmundsen
They will then know every single domain name that every user is trying to resolve, and how often, etc.
- Glen Mistletoe
DeWitt that doesn't mean they aren't copied elsewhere or they will actually follow through with the policy.
- Todd Hoff
anyone know what appears when the domain request is invalid? i.e. will i see a google search page w/ ads?
- MikeAmundsen
Yay! This is super cool. I'm using it to work around my ISP (Comcast) hijacking DNS requests.
- Joe Beda ()
Another cool thing are the vanity IP addresses that were obtained for this: 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4. '8' is a lucky number, you know.
- Joe Beda ()
@Todd: Actually, the privacy policy is pretty clear about what's temporary and what's permanent. If temporary logs were "copied elsewhere" as you suggest, it would be a pretty obvious violation of this policy. And I think it's pretty unreasonable to suggest that Google wouldn't "actually follow through" on its own privacy policy.
- Joel Webber
Joe, do you know who had 8.8.8.8 prior?
- Micah Wittman
Fast, doesn't seem to hijack 404s in any way. But I will have to go over the privacy policy carefully, in the context of Google's broader privacy policy. I wish we knew if the NSA had direct access to Google's traffic like they do for ISPs. This will certainly give Google a lot of data about web use.
- LogEx
Joel, it's just a policy. If the NSA or some other agency says Google won't get this slice of spectrum etc then don't be surprised of all that traffic is split off some switch somewhere into total information awareness.
- Todd Hoff
@Todd - half the company would quit in protest on the spot if Google even contemplated doing something like that. Including our own founders. But here's a question -- what could a company do that would reduce your fear? Clearly you use the Internet, and DNS, today. What assurances did your ISP make that cause you to trust them? Personally speaking, I find the Google DNS privacy policy a heck of a lot more reassuring than my ISP's. At least Google is promising in writing to do the right thing.
- DeWitt Clinton
People don't know DeWitt. All those fat internet pipes hook into switches that have tap lines on them. And are there any examples of people quitting en masse in protest? I've not seen it. There's nothing people can do to reduce my fear because I know too much about it. Those promises don't matter. They can change at anytime and there's no external verification and as I said, the data is...
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- Todd Hoff
I wonder how much this gets traction beyond things like Chrome OS where Google can require the client to use their name servers. DNS is an abstract concept to most people, and for businesses, Google Public DNS doesn't offer the level of control other managed DNS services offer (like OpenDNS, for example). As an IT guy, one thing that I see missing is the ability to manually refresh the cache. I'm also interested to see how Google respects TTLs.
- Mark Trapp
BTW, here's the Speakeasy Privacy Policy: http://www.speakeasy.net/tos.... Here is Comcast's: http://www.comcast.net/privacy.... Here is AT&T/SBC's: http://www.att.com/gen.... Guess what? None of them publish a log deletion policy and ALL of them reserve the right to do nearly whatever they want (even sell) your personally identifiable information, including IP addresses. Those ISPs are seeing every bit of traffic from our machines today.
- DeWitt Clinton
DeWitt, I went through that, and I'm still left wondering what Google's caching does. It doesn't explicitly say that Google will always respect the TTL on a record, and I don't see a remedy to resolve an outdated cache (for example, if Google fetches a record with a TTL of 86400 10 minutes before I change that record, if there's no way to force a manual lookup, even changing the TTL to...
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- Mark Trapp
@Mark -- I can't see how to force a manual refresh either, but I'll find out. I agree that it's necessary in some situations.
- DeWitt Clinton
Mark, that page DeWitt linked to seems to infer that they respect TTL for prefetches: "The complexity of the name selection problem makes it impossible to solve online, so we have separated the prefetch system into two components: a pipeline component, which runs as an external, offline, periodic process that selects the names to commit to the prefetch system; and a runtime component, that regularly resolves the selected names according to their TTL windows."
- Matt Mastracci
@micah Level3 owns 8.0.0.0/8 and Google has 8.8.8.0/24. BTW, 7.7.7.7 is owned by the US Dept. of Defense.
- Joe Beda ()
Matt, what concerns me about that is it seems they interpret the TTL as a range of times they're allowed to ask for a new record; that is, if they automatically refresh records faster than the TTL, that's okay, as long as they don't hold onto it for longer than the TTL. A TTL shouldn't be a guideline: if I set a TTL to 86400, unless I manually tell you to fetch it again, you shouldn't...
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- Mark Trapp
Cool, added them to my list of servers that dnsmasq is to use.
- Grant Bierman
The RFC does specify TTLs as "a 32 bit unsigned integer that specifies the time interval ... that the resource record *may be* cached before it should be discarded" I don't know if there's ever going to be a rock-solid guarantee that a resolver will cache your records (its cache could always overflow or become corrupted). Jumping TTLs isn't half as annoying as the broken resolvers that cache one of your round-robin DNS responses for all their customers for days, though. ;)
- Matt Mastracci
Oh yes, checking too quickly is definitely a better problem than checking too slowly. One of the things we used to deal with was managed DNS that charged by the record lookup; in cases like that, you absolutely want people to respect the TTLs you specify or it can wind up costing you dearly. I don't really know if companies still get away with that (we get managed DNS for free now), but...
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- Mark Trapp
I'm not happy with this. I feel it is a step too far. They could know and control way too much... from the OS Chrome to DNS/ mweh! And then what about a system fail! Laugh! I'm sure Murphy is working on it. How much of the network could go down with it. #don't-put-all-your-eggs-in-one-basket
- DC Crowley
As part of Google efforts to make the web faster, they're announcing Google Public DNS, a new experimental public DNS resolver.
- LouCypher
from Bookmarklet
"Google Public DNS is a free, global Domain Name System (DNS) resolution service, that you can use as an alternative to your current DNS provider. To try it out: Configure your network settings to use the IP addresses 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 as your DNS servers"
- DeWitt Clinton
OMG this is sooo..... much better than the AT&T DNS severs that I was stuck on. I was starting to wonder why every bandwidth test site measured accurate throughput, but pages that pull content from multiple domains were incredibly slow to load. After flipping over to these DNS servers, the latency on each page dropped dramatically.
- Bill Strathearn
"Today, as part of our ongoing effort to make the web faster, we're launching our own public DNS resolver called Google Public DNS, and we invite you to try it out."
- Lasse Johnsen
from Bookmarklet
Now people can REALLY say Google is taking over the internet. Fine as a search engine, but as the DNS provider that routes you to the correct IP? I'm questioning this. How much do you think they will report to other companies/agencies/third parties?
- CW™
Along with reader interest, AOL's algorithm will also try to predict how much marketers would be willing to pay to advertise next to stories on certain topics. In this way, when AOL's algorithm assigns a story, it will also come up with an amount of money AOL would be willing to pay to see it created.
- zeroinfluencer
from Bookmarklet
I think this kind of algorithmic spec work will be increasingly popular. It's more like Amazon Mechnaical Turk when it should be more like Craiglist or Match.com. ;-)
- Rob Myers