"Children with autism have unexplainable breakdowns -- their outbursts are often loud, aggressive and disturbing. Julian slams himself against the ground or wall while he screams, flailing his limbs. Julian's younger brother, Marcus, 3, squirms away from his parents and runs into the street to oncoming cars because he is fascinated by them. He also screams with such ferocity that his face turns purple and mucus bubbles from his nostrils. Their youngest brother, Aric, also has autism and just turned 1 year old. Photo gallery from iReporters about autism. » Heather Moores remembers that the stares in the waiting room were full of contempt. Onlookers shook their head in disgust and glared, making her feel like the "world's worst mother." This happens every time they go out to the doctor's office, the barber shop or anywhere in public. "You'll hear people talking, 'If it was my kid, he wouldn't behave like that. These parents don't know how to discipline their children. Why don't you shut...
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- April Buchheit
from Bookmarklet
Three children -- all with autism? Maybe there is some clue as to its cause there?
- Brian Sullivan
Why did they keep having children when 100% of their children have autism??
- niniane
My brother is autistic. It was until a couple years ago, after some deep thinking and a bout with therapy that I figured out my father likely has Asperger's.
- Derrick
Niniane, it's always a fight between the "extrapolation" story and the "reversion to the mean" story.
- Daniel Dulitz
Or you could regard autism as a kind of neuro-diversity... as welcome if not as well understood as other kinds of diversity.
- AliceS
AliceS: I don't see how this sort of autism can be a welcome form of diversity.
- Gabe
What about it do you find unwelcome? I'm sure it makes everyday life difficult -- in so far as difficult is defined as having to deal with breaches of cultural and societal expectations of what it is "appropriate" and "normal." Bodies and minds come in all shapes and sizes with all kinds of capacities, facilities, and abilities. The article shows that how we expect people to behave in...
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- AliceS
I do not think it's a welcome form of diversity. I would be dismayed if my child has autism. "Loud, aggressive, and disturbing outbursts" sound very unpleasant, and I don't think society is wrong for not welcoming them.
- niniane
There is a spectrum of autism disorders, and some forms are easier to deal with that others.
- Nick Lothian
I can see how people with poor social skills, or even savants, are welcome. I don't see how this kind of autism could be welcome. My cousin is autistic, and it's like living with an alcoholic: violent, unpredictable, and embarassing to go out in public with -- only he's never "sober" and frequently requires expensive medical care.
- Gabe
Not sure I would agree with AliceS's use of "welcome," but... The parents are described in this article as being more troubled by people's reactions to their children than they are by their children. "Why did they keep having children when 100% of their children are gay," is a sentence I could imagine being uttered in my hometown, based on the (to quote from this article) "disturbing,"...
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- Daniel Dulitz
There's a big difference between being gay, which harms no one, and being loud and violent. A child who slams into walls and flails his arms could easily break things or hit someone. My little brother didn't have autism, but when he was young he was nonverbal until age 7 and until about that age would scream or cry loudly when agitated. Even though my brother never behaved violently, my...
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- Melinda Owens
I think we'd all agree that episodes of violent and aggressive behavior are unacceptable, but some folks in this thread have stated that this kind of autism is not a welcome form of diversity, which I'd strongly disagree with. Children without autism can be loud and violent too, after all. Who are we to be unwelcome to an entire class of children who exhibit more of a particular kind of bad behavior? What about all the other behaviors?
- Doug
I think calling this "welcome diversity" sugarcoats the thing way too much. To give an extreme example, pedophiles have something in their brains that makes them pedophiles and is not curable. They have to live somewhere, but their dysfunction is not "welcome diversity". Likewise, autistic outbursts can be physically dangerous. I have a younger sister with mental and physical...
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- Kamilah Gill
To clarify, I do believe that autistic people should be welcomed, although most people can't tell the difference between a misbehaving child who should know better and an autistic child who isn't capable of understanding. However, autism in this form shouldn't be any more welcomed as a form of diversity than pedophilia, alcoholism, schizophrenia, or psycopathy.
- Gabe
I think that normal children behaving in a loud or violent fashion isn't acceptable either. If I see a child break down in a public space, I try to see if the parents are trying to do anything about it, and then I judge. It doesn't really matter if the child is autistic or not. @Kamilah: If you were supervising the crafts area and the child was going to be in there for any length of...
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- Melinda Owens
"Eye color is a fascinating topic that mystified researchers for centuries until science provided us with a better understanding of eye color and how it is inherited. When it comes to predicting a baby’s eye color, one can almost be sure the baby will be born with blue eyes. Newborns often have blue eyes, which generally darken with increased exposure to sunlight. By the age of three, a child’s eyes will usually settle into their permanent, adult color – be it blue, green, hazel, amber, grey, dark brown or even blood red."
- Cristo
from Bookmarklet
I've never met anyone with blood red eyes, unless if was from smoking weed or drinking. I think they might look scary. Also, cameras and photo software would be constantly changing your eye color to something else. :)
- Cristo
Simple genetics actually. Used to do this in biology class. Damn. its the science geek in me again. *sigh*
- Roberto Bonini
I guess this chart wasn't made in an asian country :p
- Rodfather
Roberto: Not simple genetics. There are several genes that affect eye color, at least 6 in Dutch Europeans (Liu et al, 2009, Current Biology). I did those Punnett squares in biology class too, but now I know it was oversimplified.
- Melinda Owens
@Cristo: Albinos have pink or reddish eyes.
- Melinda Owens
When I went to China when I was 12 and talked with girls my age there, they didn't even know it was biologically possible to have green eyes.
- Melinda Owens
I find it quite handy that most of my acquaintances & friends have eyes more or less same colour. (also, upon reflection, that in casual conversation we don't have a whole bunch of different words to express various shades and tints of 'brown'.)
- Andrew C
The paper "Fellatio by Fruit Bats Prolongs Copulation Time" on PlosOne illustrates the utility of a journal that accepts papers regardless of subject area or impact. Although its topic is intriguing to some, it would not have fit well into a traditional journal, particularly because it does not experimentally explain the phenomenon it documents.
"Female bats often lick their mate's penis during dorsoventral copulation. The female lowers her head to lick the shaft or the base of the male's penis but does not lick the glans penis which has already penetrated the vagina. Males never withdrew their penis when it was licked by the mating partner. A positive relationship exists between the length of time that the female licked the male's penis during copulation and the duration of copulation." That doesn't really sound like fellatio as we know it.
- ⓞnor
The dictionaries I've consulted give a definition for fellatio that's something like, "oral stimulation of the penis." What the bats are doing qualifies under that definition. It's just that most human women are not flexible enough to perform the act the way the bats do it.
- Melinda Owens
This was the first time I've felt disgusted when reading something while eating food.
- niniane
Very pretty Cell cover ;) This is a color-coded functional map of neuronal responses in the mouse midbrain of a particular mutant mouse after visual stimulation. http://download.cell.com/images...
It does explain why manned space travel has kinda stagnated.
- Andrew C
They might be following Ubuntu's release model. Or perhaps they also - "Release early. Release often." :)
- Space Cowboy
"Have you tried out the new Victoria's Secret 9.04 Jaunty Jackalope?"
- Jim Norris
Is it possible the new releases are driven by fashion instead of technology? (though now that you mention it, I wonder if Nike's Flywire would be a good idea in bras.)
- Andrew C
I agree with Andrew; Victoria's Secret is primarily a fashion company, with models and a runway show, even though it doesn't really make sense for a product that primarily stays out of view to have fashions.
- Melinda Owens
A special audience can be as important as a big audience.
- Andrew C
Was there a particular genetic condition that you were worried about with good reason (maybe because your parents have it), or were you looking for general peace of mind?
- Tudor Bosman
Did you get the cheap package or the expensive one?
- Piaw Na
A particular condition, that I had reason to be concerned about.
- niniane
I got the full version at a discount price. My ex-roommate is an employee and got me in a special friends rate.
- niniane
Charles forwarded this. It's interesting how the writer got so much flack for saying she loves her spouse more than her children, whereas her husband got very little flack for saying the same thing. Anyway, it seems like we should live and let live. If they want to love each other more than the children, that seems fine.
- niniane
from Bookmarklet
And if they don't want to, but they do, what would they be able to do about it anyway?
- Daniel Dulitz
I mean, as long as they both love their children, it shouldn't make much of a practical difference.
- Melinda Owens
I would feel awkward and sad if my parents loved me more than they loved each other.
- ௸ (k2g)
Parents divorce each other all the time, but it's considered horrible to disown your children (even grown children). Their love for each other may be more intense but people seem to expect their love for their children to be more enduring and reliable.
- ⓞnor
from Android
"Scientists have used gene therapy to achieve full color vision in two squirrel monkeys that were born unable to tell red from green. The technique could someday be used on people with colorblindness or other vision problems. All Male Squirrel Monkeys Are Colorblind"
- j1m
from Bookmarklet
I was surprised their brains could process it. What's it like to get a new color in your life?
- ⓞnor
from Android
Saw their presentation of these results several months ago and am pleased that it's published. I wouldn't have expected it either. Given the gene therapy, though, I wonder how strong the percept is of color vision, or whether it's anything like what we experience. You can probably get good enough at interpreting very weak signals- it took the monkeys 5 months? expression doesn't take that long- to succeed in the task while not having good enough signals to use in everyday life.
- Melinda Owens
I guess they'll have to administer it to humans to find out :)
- j1m
The first thing I thought of when I saw this story was "neat, I wonder if they can make regular human eyes into tetrachromats. And then I thought that I'd hate for TV and computer screens and print to look that much flatter than real life...
- Andrew C
There are 2 versions of the red gene that respond to slightly different peak wavelengths. There was a study that showed that women with both alleles, who would be tetrachromats, have slightly better color discrimination than normal trichromats. Our ancestral condition, by the way, was tetrachromatism. Birds, reptiles, and fish all see the world in richer color than we do. Blame our nocturnal early mammalian forebears.
- Melinda Owens
Do tetrachromats see reproduced colour (print, video, film) as flatter than the real world?
- Andrew C
@Andrew: Well, the RGB colorspace already can't reproduce the whole gamut of colors visible by trichromats. And the CMYK colorspace is even more limited. Tetrachromats will certainly see more colors - nuances, if you prefer - than trichromats.
- Pandu ● IT Optimizer
from fftogo
I don't know; I'll go ask some ducks. (For human tetrachromats, the differences between the two red alleles are pretty subtle, so you wouldn't expect a huge difference.)
- Melinda Owens
Well it depends on where the 4th type of cones are most sensitive. If it's near the red cones, then the difference would not be so great. But there are tales of human tetrachromats with the 4th come in between red and green, and they can certainly see much more colors than us trichromats.
- Pandu ● IT Optimizer
from fftogo
I seriously thought Google Street View bot was going to lose it at the end, when he was overwhelmed with takedown/censor requests and just shut the whole project down. "You don't deserve Street View!"
- Andrew C
Google should have Google Japan make the videos for all their products.
- Melinda Owens
I've long wanted a pneumatic tube system for deliveries. Huge infrastructure cost, but it'd make a huge impact on commerce (replacing FedEx). But a friend convinced me that the world is moving towards wireless infrastructure, which avoids many of the last mile issues. So we need little blimps or catapults for deliveries.
- Amit Patel
What we need are self-driving cars. Then you get package delivery for free.
- Daniel Dulitz
In the 19th century and early 20th century, the major cities in Europe had pneumatic systems to deliver letters. The system in Paris apparently had stations every few blocks, and mail was delivered three or four times a day. These systems fell into disuse and disrepair with the advance of electronic communication methods. So this is actually a very old idea.
- Melinda Owens
This will really come in handy in the year 2050 when we will be too fat to leave our houses.
- ௸ (k2g)
Hell is freezing over if the American consumer actually saves money. Me, I'll believe it when people stop spending on $70/month cell phone plans.
- Piaw Na
It wasn't that long ago that savings rate was 10%. Latest report puts it at 6.5%.
- Peng-Toh
Look, it's getting cold around here... :-)
- Piaw Na
"On the other hand, over half of Americans (54%) say they have not changed or cancelled their cell phone service or even considered it to save money, while 13% have done so and 17% have considered it. Half of U.S. adults (50%) have not done or considered cancelling their landline phone service, and only using their cell phone while 11% have done so and 21% have considered it. Also, just...
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- Piaw Na
I had two data cell phone plans. I gave one up. Does that count?
- Larry Hosken
I have a $40/month plan that with taxes and fees is actually more like $48-49/month. I can't find a nationwide plan that's cheaper (for which I'm eligible). Switching to prepaid doesn't seem like it would save me money. No landline. $49/month is not all that different from $70/month- $70/month is not a Cadillac plan. Also, if you're locked in a plan, it's very expensive to switch; given...
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- Melinda Owens
Did you do this just to test your bandwidth? hehe
- imabonehead
jzawodn@t61:~$ du -sh enwiki-latest-pages-meta-current.xml.bz2 9.3G enwiki-latest-pages-meta-current.xml.bz2
- Jeremy Zawodny
I was going to use it to show off indexing documents using Sphinx for next week's Linux Magazine column. But I may have bitten off more than I can chew. Hmm.
- Jeremy Zawodny
I'm positive that Ian is correct because I read it in Wikipedia ;)
- Sam Pullara
Did you get the pictures as well? enwiki-latest-pages-articles.xml.bz2 is text only.
- Melinda Owens
Well, Britannica only recently started offering free access in exchange for contribution if I recall, so they may be worried about what Ian said.
- Richard ¿digame? Walker
@Ruchira: It seems to me as one ages, the eyebrow hairs tend to get curly, which makes the eyebrows seem thicker and bushier. Or maybe only young people get their eyebrows waxed?
- Melinda Owens
"Providing health care is like building a house. The task requires experts, expensive equipment and materials, and a huge amount of coördination. Imagine that, instead of paying a contractor to pull a team together and keep them on track, you paid an electrician for every outlet he recommends, a plumber for every faucet, and a carpenter for every cabinet. Would you be surprised if you got a house with a thousand outlets, faucets, and cabinets, at three times the cost you expected, and the whole thing fell apart a couple of years later? Getting the country’s best electrician on the job (he trained at Harvard, somebody tells you) isn’t going to solve this problem. Nor will changing the person who writes him the check."
- Larry Hosken
The Mayo Clinic example is a great example of providing the right incentives, thereby driving the system to achieve the goals. On the other hand, I remember once being part of the Kaiser Permanente System once, and my experience was horrible. I never saw the same doctor twice, and nobody had any context. I opted out and went with PPOs (which I'm sure is expensive) and have no regrets....
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- Piaw Na
That's funny, Piaw. My friend had cancer and was very pleased with Kaiser in San Francisco. He had to visit several different specialists repeatedly, and all of them had all of his test results right at hand because of their electronic record-keeping. He was very happy with Kaiser, and his cancer was cured. When he had to switch insurance later, he found that whenever he saw a doctor,...
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- Melinda Owens
I liked Kaiser because I could always get an appointment within the same day. When I researched more private variants/doctors, just probing, they usually told me that if they were my doctor I could see them next week! Pretty useless! I'm still confunded that you need to make appointments. Both in Sweden + Holland + Germany there is walkins, at least in the morning, and you're guaranteed...
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- Jonas S Karlsson
I found a great primary care physician after talking to people who knew the doctors for a long time. He gets me same day appointments, and even calls in prescriptions over the phone to my pharmacy for me if I need it. One of my friends has nagging knee problems, but every time she went to Kaiser she got the runaround. She asked me for my recommendation for an orthopedic/knee doctor, and...
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- Piaw Na
"There is an island located between Greenland and the North Pole called Spitsbergen... ...one of the best places to do astronomical, meteorological or climate research. Hence, the remote and pristine landscape is marked by installations of technological and scientific equipment." Christian Houge goes there and photographs the equipment.
- Larry Hosken
The Norwegians in our lab have been there. They were given rifles to shoo away polar bears.
- Melinda Owens
But skin itself is (somewhat) conductive. I wonder if one could lay down some sort of insulating layer first, or if you just have to design circuits taking a large amount of leakage into account.
- ⓞnor
If the resistance of the ink was much less than the resistance of the skin, it should be OK, especially with small currents, right? Regardless, I wouldn't let anyone test this stuff across my bare chest near my heart.
- Melinda Owens
But isn't that exactly where you would want all the blinky lights?
- ⓞnor
At last I can replace my clumsy+ error-prone tinfoil hat with a simple faraday cage drawn directly on my scalp.
- Larry Hosken
interesting. i disagree with discouraging "self-belitting" discourse (i think you're already framing the subject right there) -- there is nothing wrong with admitting weakness, and it's often a form of bonding.
- Neha Narula
it would be nice to see the "six short transcripts" to see exactly what they mean (i.e. what people in their survey were reacting to).
- ⓞnor
I'd like to see them too. Self-belittling means something different to me than admitting weakness.
- Daniel Dulitz
Wait, educators might teach students to avoid displays of self-promotion? Meaning, like, college professors? How would they even recognize it in the first place? Is this article a spoof?
- j1m
http://dan.egnor.name/biases... - the scenarios are summarized in the third page ("page 8"). The fact that they have exactly one scenario of each type seems kind of suspicious to me, though it's apparently true that different groups reacted differently to the same scenario description.
- ⓞnor
As an engineering male, I have to admit that I react badly to "Just so you know, I don't know how to write a preface". It's one thing to admit weakness - "I've never written a preface before" or "I guess I'm not really sure what goes into a preface" - but "I don't know how" sounds like they're actively refusing to do it and unwilling to learn how. This is especially because there's...
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- ⓞnor
just so you know, i don't have permission to access biases.pdf. (Not like I'm refusing or anything!)
- j1m
" "I don't know how" sounds like they're actively refusing to do it and unwilling to learn how." - I gotta say, that particular wording does not bring those connotations for me.
- Andrew C
My reaction to the whole document: Oh please.
- j1m
j1m - exactly the kind of belittling comment the study talks about!
- Andrew C
sure, but what's your point? perhaps you're suggesting the study is non-sucky? I was not finding that, it turns out.
- j1m
I was just being silly. I only skimmed the study, to be honest.
- Andrew C
In the original paper, the differences measured between "engineering men" and "others" were often statistically significant but were small in magnitude. Also, the students analyzed in this paper were all freshmen or sophomores in college. I am not surprised that teenage males like to promote themselves and are intolerant of people who make mistakes. Most of them eventually grow up.
- Melinda Owens
"This impatience with speakers who admitted vulnerabilities extended to cases in which the self-belittlement appeared to be strategic - such as conceding one's own weaknesses in order to help a teammate "save face" or using an "I-statement" to soften criticism." -- This sounds exactly like the sort of thing that I see engineers do all the time, especially the more mature ones. Maybe this article should have read "Young male engineering students can be dicks"?
- Joel Webber
Thanks ⓞnor for hosting the link. Yeah, people handle differences better as they grow up. But I agree that undercutting oneself ("but I'm just being picky") isn't the most effective strategy on a team. It's the opposite of bonding-through-weakness -- undercutting muddies the message. Is the criticism important or not? If it is, being gentle and direct is better than cutting and...
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- Daniel Dulitz
I definitely do the "I'm just being picky" thing, especially when I *am* just being picky, and the issues at hand are pretty minor. It's true that a better way to soften criticism is to sandwich it between praise and express some appreciation for the work someone did. It's too easy to ruin someone's day by responding to their code/document/idea review with fifty small complaints.
- ⓞnor
My experience has been that there are some environments that reward aggressiveness and self-promotion, while there are others that reward consensus-seeking behavior. Each behavior have its place, and each has its failure modes. The hard part is navigating between the two, so that you don't lose valuable insights (or fall into a design-by-committee mentality) on one hand, or become a dickish environment on the other.
- Joel Webber
i had no idea this conversation was happening here. friendfeed fail! anyway, i have to say this article really resonated with me. I work in a group that is known for being pretty intense when it comes to group meetings and criticism. My working style is more that I like to admit what I don't know up front. Unfortunately, I don't see a lot of that happening -- perhaps less so now in the...
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- Neha Narula
The use of confidence to accomplish good things may be one of the most important parts of leadership. Shutting down pointless debate and encouraging convergence, good. Forcing premature convergence and blocking out useful knowledge, bad. So Neha, I can see how the posturing overconfidence you describe can be very discouraging -- it's aggressive: don't challenge me. But posturing...
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- Daniel Dulitz
i agree with what i think you are saying, which is that honest assessment is a good route to take. unfortunately i don't think that happens as much as it should in CS/Engineering -- there is a lot of overposturing and nitpicking, aggressive criticism. I don't agree with what I also think you are saying, which is that unwarranted confidence has its place.
- Neha Narula
in addition, i think it's also important to understand that if you're in a situation where EVERYONE acts over-confident, but its known and accepted, it won't be as harmful as when different people have different expectations. From my experience, being in a situation where everyone is very polite and quick to admit vulnerabilities can be very warm and encouraging in the beginning learning stages, but frustrating once you master a topic.
- Neha Narula
I find some people don't get that I'm joking when I make ridiculously grandiose statements about myself in a dry tone. =/
- Andrew C
In my experience honest assessment doesn't happen as much as it should anywhere. I'm not saying that unwarranted confidence has its place, but that confidence in the face of incomplete certainty is often warranted. Emergency responders may well be unsure of how things will turn out, but they don't start their engagement with "well, I'm not sure how things will turn out." They approach...
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- Daniel Dulitz
So confidence is like a drug in that sense. It has positive effects, but it can be abused. And it often is. Sometimes I even do it, but less often as I've become more personally secure.
- Daniel Dulitz
"Less than a month after its debut, Omegle [chat with random strangers] is drawing about 150,000 page views a day, according to Mr. K-Brooks" - http://www10.nytimes.com/2009...
Isn't there a bit of that flavour here has well? Less randomness maybe, strangers often.
- Brian Sullivan
I've never been asked to cyber on FriendFeed...
- ⓞnor
I've never been asked to cyber in an airplane or a supermarket.
- Daniel Dulitz
Maybe you've been going to the wrong supermarkets.
- ⓞnor
But I live so far from the Marina...
- Daniel Dulitz
Talking with strangers in real life incurs very real risks that don't occur with talking with strangers online. I have friends who have been chased or stalked by strangers who began by chatting with them on the bus or on the street. Also, it is far easier to end a conversation with someone who is weirding you out online than someone who is stuck in a vehicle with you. That said, I don't find this service appealing.
- Melinda Owens
I feel like this could be a really potent idea if it did something more ambitious than uniform random selection of participants... like if it learned features to predict whether a chat will last for more than a few minutes -- for example, word pairs from the users' chat histories -- and then biased the selection toward higher-expected-length sessions.
- Doug
Horrible gas and diarrhea are symptoms of lactose indigestion. Anyway, what's with “intolerance” in this age of tolerance? Few ever assign the majority “lactose tolerant” nor other labels. The majority is always just the norm (so get with it, you deviant!) But here's the secret: lactose digestors are the mutants.
- John Lam
As mutant powers go, it's not exactly up there with eye laser beams.
- Andrew C
All mammals, by definition, at birth can metabolize milk, and all but humans lose that ability once weaned onto their adult diet. After all, we can't all feed by sucking on each others' teats in a perpetual energy machine. But not even most human populations—typically only descendants of northern and western Europeans and African Masai tribes evolved this adaptation.
- John Lam
Could be either the milk or the coffee. I seem to remember that very strong coffee on an empty stomache would irritate it, although this is not an allergy. It's more likely the milk, though. Does the same thing happen after you eat ice cream?
- Melinda Owens
I do not have this problem after eating ice cream or cheese. But I often have this problem after drinking a mocha.
- niniane
How about milk? Ice cream and cheese do not have that much lactose compared to milk, I'm told.
- Andrew C
You seem to like chocolate, so I'm assuming that's not what it is. It probably is the coffee, then. To really check, you should drink hot chocolate and see if it makes your stomach feel the same way.
- Melinda Owens
Niniane, you of all people would realize that (at least from what you've disclosed) there are startlingly few data points here. Given this, correlation much less causation seems tenuous at best. I'd see about having friends offer to help with doubleblind studies (caffeine, decaffeine, milk, milk substitute... though the latter would be tough to mask :P). Okay, and in more seriousness, feel better!
- Adam Lasnik
I like where people suggested to split up the potential stomache-inducing ingredients of a mocha and make separate experiments... =P (cough cough)
- Andrew C
Could you survive without a credit card? (I mean just credit cards, debit cards are just plastic representations of real money so they have different rules.)
No I really meant just credit card. Yes, you are allowed to have a debit card. :)
- EricaJoy
Yes, but it would painful when traveling.
- Cristo
Survive? Yes. I always pay it off anyway, so it's just a matter of replacing cash, not a way of life. But it would make buying from Amazon.com hard. :-)
- Piaw Na
Yes. Did for many years until I was planning to buy a car. Needed to bump my credit rating a bit.
- Rodfather
I've never really used a Credit Card for anything other than true emergencies. I think I could survive just fine.
- Bill Strathearn
yep, i've never had a credit card to prove it ;p
- chaz2b
Sure, no problem. It's mildly annoying when you try to rent a car (some places accept a debit card, some don't), and there's the whole credit-rating thing, but I was able to get a mortgage with no credit card history. Eventually I got one for the car rental thing, and also for better fraud protection (it's easier to reverse a transaction). But I've never had a paycheck-to-paycheck lifestyle, it might be more important in that case as a little extra flexibility that's less usurious than a payday loan.
- ⓞnor
I pay off my credit card balance every month, so yes, I could. I've never carried credit card debt; I use it for convenience -- and, as egnor said, for fraud protection. In a fraud case, you don't pay the fraudulent charges, so the credit card company has an interest to resolve the issues as quickly as possible; with a debit card, the money is gone from your account at the time of the transaction.
- Tudor Bosman
Yes, but the thing is convenient. (I pay off the balance every month too.)
- Andrew C
I've been using just a debit card for the entirety of my life with the small exception of GOOG funded trips on the corporate credit card. I also have a credit card that I don't use except for one notional transaction at the start so that I actually have a credit history.
- Adewale Oshineye
Already do. Bit of a hassle if an emergency happens, but otherwise, life is good.
- Steven Perez
easily - use my CC far less now that debit cards are no longer quite as expensive to use internationally
- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
Yes. I could also survive without flush toilets. And a comfy bed. And dental floss. But I wouldn't enjoy it. I, too, pay off my balance each month in full, but I like the ideas of earning cash back (2% on my Schwab card now) and having a $50,000+ cash advance if needed in an emergency.
- Adam Lasnik
hard for me to get along w/o a card.
- MikeAmundsen
Sure, but I don't see why I would. As many have already said here, they're awesome if used properly; 21++ day *minimum* float; purchase protections and warranty extensions; travel bennies up the wazoo (rental car insurance, etc.); even affinity points (airmiles, etc.)
- Anthony Citrano
So I started this post because I was curious about people's dependency (admitted or not) on credit cards. I'm interested in how we got to the point where it is unusual to not have a credit card. If anybody has some credit card ads from the 50's, I'd love to see them. I want to see how the banking and ad industries made everybody think they NEED a credit card.
- EricaJoy
from IM
We pay for virtually everything we buy using credit card. It helps track expenses and provides detailed accounts for budget management (of course we pay the balance 100% every month as well).
- Brian Sullivan
Erica, I think you may be looking at this from the wrong angle. While it's possible that the credit cards, through clever marketing, created demand and shaped perceptions, I think it's more they MET demand for an increasingly consuming-oriented society, where people felt compelled to look more prosperous than their neighbors. I think it's that latter issue that's more interesting and telling.
- Adam Lasnik
So the banks saw that everybody wanted to play keeping up with the Joneses and thus the credit card was created? I'm not sure I buy that. It's possible though...
- EricaJoy
from IM
No, no... there was a huge demand for people to buy more things, but they didn't have the cash, so they needed a way to borrow cash: easily, frequently, and without a lot of paperwork. I think credit cards filled that niche. Also, there's issue of crime. When faced with carrying lots of cash around town vs. plastic, I think everyone feels safer with the former (if you get robbed of $200 in cash, you're out $200; if someone steals your CC, you're generally not out much if anything).
- Adam Lasnik
So in the 1950's the demand to buy more things begat the credit card? I'm not sure I buy that either. AFAIK, our national obsession with "things" (aside from big ticket items like cars and homes) didn't really take off until the 80's.
- EricaJoy
from IM
Yes, but it would be inconvenient. I didn't realize until a few years ago that you didn't have to pay the entire balance off every month. Conversations about credit cards make so much more sense now.
- Melinda Owens
coworking if you set it up before hand during work hours, 2x if you fail to work at all
- paulm
Is that like a homework party? But at homework parties, you work on homework collaboratively.
- Melinda Owens
Is that like a LAN party, but with wi-fi?
- Jim Norris
In grad school some of us would get together to work on research. We would each bring our laptops (or papers to read), spend a few minutes setting up some goals, then do a 45 minute block of work - no talking or checking e-mail. Then we would take a 5-10 minute break to chat, eat, drink etc., then another 45 minute block. We would do 3-4 blocks at a "party".
- Robert Felty
An essential part of the definition is that you're not collaborating. (Otherwise you'd just call it "working with X"). Hence it is not like a homework party. Jim, my understanding of LAN party is that you are using the LAN together, e.g. to play Starcraft. So it's not like a LAN party either.
- niniane
It does similar to Robert's research party though. :)
- niniane
A prof in my program studies the effect of drugs on fruit flies. After inhaling cocaine fumes, flies just fly around very fast in tight circles.
- Melinda Owens
So if they flew into a crack house, they might not fly back out?
- ⓞnor
Maybe crackheads don't care about hygiene, or maybe the saying is more about the phantom bugs symptoms that some drug users have.
- Andrew C
I'm not sure if the argument is right; many people die from heart disease, but I don't think we can say that better diet and exercise would have prevented 100% of these deaths.
- Nikita Borisov
His argument that we shouldn't worry about things that don't often happen doesn't make sense. Some events are infrequent because we actively prevent them: people don't die of measles in the US anymore because we vaccinate. I don't know if airport screening deters terrorists from getting on planes. However, he is not arguing that airport screening is ineffective; he is arguing that it doesn't matter anyway because terrorists are rare. But he doesn't show that terrorists are rare in the absence of screening.
- Melinda Owens
Right, likewise, we may want to focus on more rare deaths that are easier to prevent (say, driving deaths) than more frequent ones that are difficult to address (say, heart disease)
- Nikita Borisov
Economically I think we'd want to allocate each dollar (or minute of effort, or whatever) toward the purpose that will bring the largest reduction in risk for that cost, i.e. equalize the marginal utility of investment in every form of prevention. I'm sure someone out there has done a cost/benefit analysis.
- Jim Norris
I remember back in the day, people would use ytalk to chat to their friends who were sitting right next to them... I'd be tempted to try calling that "computer-mediated interaction" or something. (oh wait, that's a real term.) But "each doing their own thing" is kinda just... each doing their own thing. People did and do that with books, after all.
- Andrew C
it need to be bidirectionally intentional. "bonding" is not specific enough. It needs to be something like "co-working", except more descriptive.
- niniane
If someone asked you what you were doing, and that's what you were doing, some good short answers would be: relaxing; hanging out; nothing. None of those things is actually *defined* as being together without interacting. (I assume the laptops are optional?)
- j1m
The laptops are not optional. They are an essential part of the activity. "Nothing" is not descriptive. I want it to be very clear. e.g. j1m asks "what are you doing?" and I say "co-working with egnor" and j1m should understand that egnor and I are each on our laptops, only occasionally speaking to each other. "relaxing" and "hanging out" imply more interaction with each other. "ignoring" has a negative connotation. "surfpodding" sounds like a japanese internet cafe. that's the best one so far...
- niniane
I suspect what she's trying to find a name for is the phenomenon where people engaged in solitary projects often seek to co-locate with others for sociability and companionship, even if they're working on totally unrelated things. You often see small 1-2 person startups sharing a space, partially for economic reasons, but also because it gets lonely being completely by yourself for days on end.
- ⓞnor
People do use "coworking" for this sort of thing (http://coworking.pbwiki.com/), but to me "coworking with egnor" makes it sound like niniane and egnor are working together on the same thing, which isn't what she means. It's still unclear to me why a word is necessary.
- ⓞnor
The degree of affection depends on the people who are coworking, I guess? It sounds like sometimes they don't know each other at all, sometimes they recognize each other as regulars at a cafe, sometimes they're professional acquaintances, sometimes they're friends. There are lots of couples who hang out and work on their respective stuff, that's so ordinary that nobody would even think of using a word like "coworking" for it. I don't know what you even mean by "affectionately" vs "professionally".
- ⓞnor
I don't understand all these words in torque's list of constraints. Anyway I think that the people should know each other and enjoy each other's company. Strangers who happen to sit near each other do not count in my definition of co-working. I guess I'll just use "co-working" if nothing else comes to mind. Then lots of misunderstandings are bound to arise in the future when I twitter "co-working with X".
- niniane
After the kids are in bed my wife and I do that often. Its nice to be close to the person you love but doing what interest you; though sometimes we will both be on FB. Now it really gets weird when the two are sitting together and IMing each other.
- Steve Sill
Parallel work, from parallel play, which is the psychologist's term for what children do after they only do solitary play and before they really play with other children.
- Melinda Owens