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Interesting analysis of Twitter's Suggested User List, which @timoreilly objects to in comments: http://twittercism.com/suggest...

June 23 - Comment - Like - Share

Iván Abrego, Rui Pereira, polou/indigo_bow and 63 other people liked this

Scoble, do you feel you're should have been on that featured twitter users list? Or do you feel you deserve a time on it? - Doubledown_inSL

87 more comments

Interesting. But how did the people on SUL get there on the first place? - Alex M.

Well said Robert. - Leo Laporte

Newt Gingrich?? Why *is* Newt Gingrich on the SUL? - RobinDotNet

I would think having Newt Gingrich on the list would invalidate the entire list. I mean, really. - RobinDotNet

Doubledown_inSL: I don't want to be on any default list by a platform vendor that I didn't earn my way onto and that YOU can't earn your way onto it either. This is not a meritocracy. It's a royalty system. One that picks stars and gifts them huge audiences. - Robert Scoble

Ahmed: Twitter picked their favorite people and removed anyone that they saw as a threat to their future business model. Me for talking about friendfeed too much. Leo for complaining about the name. Calacanis for being a pimp. Kawasaki for being too obvious about building his business (Alltop) on top of it. Shall I go on? - Robert Scoble

Doubledown_inSL: you need to take a look at the original conversation if you haven't already... http://ff.im/4iPSZ - Travis Koger

Robert: I see - Alex M.

reminds me of way clubs in NYC let people in #1.Star Power (BIG NAME), #2 Beauty #3 Wealth - courtney benson

one thing would be interesting to map - how many of the people on the list have ties to kevin rose... i am betting some interesting trends would show up. - Allen Stern

Courtney: You forgot women to men ratio! ;) - Travis Koger

Travis, right! - courtney benson

Allen: Leo and I both have ties to Kevin Rose and aren't on the list. - Robert Scoble

Media has always been star-driven... so one of the measures of success of any star-maker is the editorial judgment and wisdom of their anointed ones. Same in Silicon Valley, Hollywood, Nashville, Bollywood... print, radio, tv, movies... it's inescapable... and, Robert, no matter whose list you do or don;t make it onto, you are already a MAJOR star ;-) - Fred Davis

robert - im talking about "in his posse" - justine is(was?), gary, etc. it's something that I've wondered about for a while. - Allen Stern

It's the Web 2.0 Mafia ;-) - Jesse Stay

Fred: thank you (for those who don't know, Fred is one of the co-founders of Wired Magazine and a star in his own right). But I wasn't gifted my "stardom" by a media platform. ;-) - Robert Scoble

Fred, agreed that Robert is top notch but so is Leo, Guy and Jason as well as Kevin - courtney benson

Allen: if you said it's "San Francisco gadflys" or "insiders" then I think you're correct. It's just that Kevin is one that's very visible in that circle. Funny, Howard Lindzen and Jeff Pulver and Fred Wilson are investors in Twitter and they aren't on it. I think all three of them deserve it too. I wonder why they aren't gifted a spot? - Robert Scoble

Robert: surely having investors on the SUL would be a little too inbred, even for twitter? - Travis Koger

Travis: probably. I sure would love to see the thinking that goes on behind the scenes when they decide this list. By the way, I've heard from someone close to the Twitter team that complaining about the list gets you added to a black list where you never will get onto it. Which, funny enough, freed me to complain even more. :-) - Robert Scoble

Robert: I guess it would be a little liberating knowing that technically you could not offend them more than you already have. ;) - Travis Koger

there's always been old boys clubs, the SUL is just twitter's form of it. - BCK

Dave Winer is very quiet tonight. - Mark

Mark: I think he's traveling. - Robert Scoble

I do like his posts. I wish Dave contributed more on Friendfeed though. I think he is a little reluctant because he doesn't want to evangelise FF at all. He isn't interested in getting people from twitter to here, he considers that FF's problem and not something he should freely help towards. I suppose he is the opposite of you Scoble in that regard. - Mark

wow, I met Steve Johnson recently @MarketingProfs B2B and I did not connect his real life self with the Twitter suggested list :D - Valeria Maltoni

also, looks like the editors at People magazine picked who they put on the list :) - Valeria Maltoni

I swear I typed that before I saw People magazine on the list! - Valeria Maltoni

Robert, I think you're engaging in one of the oldest forms of media self-promotion here: attacking others as a way of drawing attention to yourself. I like you a lot and you're generally very positive. But when you start claiming that twitter "took you off the list" because you promote Friendfeed too much, I think you're playing the same kind of media game that led talk radio and its ilk astray. It doesn't speak well of you. - Tim O'Reilly

I wondering if there has been anything showing whether being on the SUL effects a business bottom line, if it does or starts to I definitely can see a problem. - Kim Landwehr

Just guessing but I find it really hard to believe that half the "stars" on the SUL actually write their own tweets. Betting it is all run by a bunch of PR flacks. - Dave Hodson

Tim: you keep making this about me but I am far from the only one hurt by this list. But you are right and it demonstrates just how many strings are attached here even for people who are not on the list. We can't even discuss the list and how anti-community and how it sets up a corruptible system without looking like a selfish jerk. But you forgot one thing: I will not accept a spot on... more... - Robert Scoble

Tim: but I have written my last word on this. You are right that it serves me no good to talk about this and waste my energy on it. It's just shocking to me that you are defending something that isn't a meritocracy. I was expecting you to be the first one to decry this system of royalty and corruptible systems. The fact that you're all for it and, worse, saying I'm doing this just for self promotion, makes me sad. Really sad. - Robert Scoble

You are out of order O'Reilly. - Mark

Robert, you definitely earned your "stardom" but don't forget you also had a helpful platform as a Microsoft house blogger. - Michael Markman

Thats a pretty weak point, Michael. - Mark

Michael: and for that I had to interview and win my job (which wasn't easy). Also I had thousands of readers per day BEFORE getting that job and being a Microsoft employee didn't get me on a default list that was included in a platform service. I also didn't get an unfair advantage against other Microsoft employees and Bill Gates didn't "pick" the winners -- the marketplace did (when I... more... - Robert Scoble

Speaking as a non-celebrity looking in: I'm really bugged by this whole thing. First of all, Robert, I didn't need a SUL to follow you. Or Leo or Tim or iJustine or TechCrunch or anyone else on my list. The SUL means nothing to me. I never even looked into it ( I've been on twitter since 2006 way before the SUL was in place) until this whole SUL scandal started coming up. I understand... more... - Lise

Obviously the SUL is a bad idea all around, or at least the way it is implemented. I can see why they want it; most likely to help with retention of new users. Most people sign up and have no idea what to do. Unfortunately it puts Twitter, those on the SUL, and the people who point out what a poor system it is in a bad spot. There is no way Twitter can say they would be fair and... more... - W. Brant Kesseler

Robert, hey, I know you weren't gifted your stardom, you earned it by being RELENTLESS about doing your thing, and doing it in public forums (whatever the forum), i.e.: sharing!!! - Fred Davis

I think, ideally, SUL's would be personalized, based on your interests, your profile(s), your friends, FOF's, etc. We'd all get a different one, that was (hopefully) more tailored to each of us. The web is about micromedia, and the one-SUL-fits-all approach is so mass media that it doesn't fit in very well... as this whole discussion (and the many others on the SUL topic) underscore. - Fred Davis

http://friendfeed.com/davew... - Mark

Fred: I agree and its a great point. This is almost what Facebook and LinkedIn do to recommend connections. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)

Some interesting points here. Being somewhat of a lightweight compared to some of the visionaries here, I appreciate the opportunity to comment on something that has been bugging me for some time. I wrote about the follower issue a little while ago on my blog, http://bit.ly/NhVQa, and I feel very strongly that Twitter has become a popularity contest for some of its users. The fact the Robert engages others equally, regardless of their VC level, is why I follow him. His value to the community is tangible. - Chris Sparno

I thought LinkedIn had a similar issue a few years ago with the number of connections and they capped the visible connections at 500 and evened the playing field. I like that approach. But it seems that acquiring twitter followers is baked into the twitter dna and they would never create a visible cap at 500. - Jim Posner

Robert, I love you to death man, but why do you waste so much time and energy on this topic? I certainly don't care who is on the list, it just doesn't matter in the scheme of things. Make you own SUL if you feel others deserve to be heard, you have the webspace and the star power to do it, so just do it. Big hug dude. - Rob Fahrni

Fred: I'd love a system like that. Sort of like Alltop or WeFollow.com. That would have been the right thing to do. Jim: exactly. Lise: there is a disconnect between those who do this as a business and those who do it just for fun. Audience size means money. Let me know how you feel when someone at work gets a huge raise without deserving it/earning it (especially worse if you've been... more... - Robert Scoble

Rob: I do have my own SUL. It's http://www.friendfeed.com/scoblei... and everyone on it earns their way on it every day by posting great content. - Robert Scoble

So all those sales people and "MAKE MONEY WITH TWITTER" people -- do they make money off of me if I don't follow them back? - RobinDotNet

I like what Fred said. It really would enhance the service. Tumblr has the right approach, at least in part, on the micro-level with Tumblarity. Each user has their own benchmark. In terms of twitter's SUL, it's fine, there's nothing wrong with it. Twitter is a business. The SUL is one method they use to promote their brand. There's a level of inherent familiarity built into the brand... more... - Benjamin Taylor

PS It's great to see the hulk back, in solidarity. - Benjamin Taylor

So if there was a revolt and nobody followed people on the SUL who they thought should not be on the SUL, would Twitter leave them on the SUL? If you don't follow someone because they are on the SUL, is that as bad as following them because they are? (Did that make any sense, or did I not get enough sleep last night?) - RobinDotNet

Exactly Robert, you work your butt off, and I appreciate you for what you bring to the table. I guess being a z-lister, like myself, leaves me on the outside of understanding why this is such a hot topic? Does this really boil down to money? I'm not trying to be an ass here, I truly don't get why it's so important? - Rob Fahrni

Let's not forget that you can't be the "media darling" if you don't cater to celebs and the popular.Twitter has grown down distinct paths. On one branch are the value creators - they share and create meaningful content, dialog and discourse. On another, are the media hounds, who crave attention and are collecting followers like Pokemon. Those of us who value the former don't pay attention to the SUL. - Chris Sparno

Isn't it kind of like going to google and searching for something, and the first links that show up are the ones that people have paid google money to give them precedence, and they might not even necessarily be the best search result? - RobinDotNet

Chris, nicely put. - Rob Fahrni

Robin, its exactly like that. Good analogy. - Chris Sparno

Benjamin: you don't want to see me when I'm angry! Rob Fahrni: absolutely it's about money. And sex. And influence. And other kinds of measuring I won't mention here. :-) - Robert Scoble

Rob Fahrni: but mostly it's about building a platform that is a meritocracy. I'm an American. I don't like royalty based systems. If you can't earn your way onto this list I don't want any part of it. - Robert Scoble

Oh Robert, you're killin me man! - Rob Fahrni

Rob Fahrni: I'm in a good mood. Peter Himmelman is rocking! http://peterhimmelman.com/furious... Come join us, more fun than debating stupid lists. - Robert Scoble

Then Google isn't an exact model, because it IS a meritocracy, even though it's based on cash. - RobinDotNet

Robin: I've never paid to be on Google. So far Google is a pretty darn good example of a good platform vendor that lets the marketplace decide winners and losers. - Robert Scoble

Don't they have paid links that take precedence? I guess the diff is that though they might have that (and I don't know that they do for sure), they also show everybody else that fits the search criteria. - RobinDotNet

Robin: absolutely not. The paid links were always separate on Google and never were mixed in with the free ones. - Robert Scoble

Robert, I meant killin me in a good way, I'm grinning ear-to-ear. I see your point but doesn't all this attention, even negative attention, just add to the popularity of the thing you despise? You're one of the good guys Robert, don't let this drag you down. I think this is great fodder for a very long essay on Scobleizer. - Rob Fahrni

Got it. That's good to know. So the links that best meet the search criteria are on the top. Hmmm. Sounds like meritocracy to me. You're right, not like Twitter's SUL. - RobinDotNet

It's kind of interesting Robert that you are righteously condeming Twitter for removal from the SUL. As if it a) really matters in the grand scheme of things, b) like this is supposed to be a true meritocracy (I'm uncertain where one exists in the real word), and c) complaining on friendfeed or yourblog will change twitters mind. You are not @aplusk kutchner, or one of the Jonas bros... more... - derikp

derikp: if my son is better at playing soccer and isn't chosen I'd certainly go and talk to the coach and plead his case. But we're not talking about soccer and anyway I'm done discussing this. Onward. I'm glad there are so many people who like royalty based systems and don't understand why meritocracies are important to defend. I guess that's how we end up with countries like Iran and China. Sigh. - Robert Scoble

It's interesting, a number of you have heavily criticized the SUL, yet you're all still using Twitter. Speaks to the power of numbers in the platform. - Bill Kinney

Why should there be a list at all? Follow people that interest you. You make twitter what it is. - Ryan Gerritsen

Bill: You can not like the SUL and still use Twitter. Apples and oranges. I don't like many of the people who live in my town, yet I still live here and like the town. - Curt Mercadante

Granted. I just think it would be more interesting if someone critical of Twitter put their money where their mouth is and stopped using it. Actions speak louder than words, yadda yadda. It seems unlikely given the audiences some people have over there even if it's not a million plus. I also think the tech celebrity is jealous that traditional media has co-opted the platform. It's a fascinating topic. - Bill Kinney

oh when will lame twitter SUL get corrected?! *sigh* - Susan Beebe from BuddyFeed

And, by the way, it seems like the SUL is being used like the same "mass follower" tools that the Twitter folks are seeking to diminish by killing the accounts of those who use them. - Curt Mercadante

Reason I still use Twitter, I still get more responses from my Tweets than in FF. Yet I tend to be more engaged in FF these days but I think the FF celebs usually spark the most engaging threads and the rest of us are trying to get that engagement from our posts. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)

manielse: there's no audience more engaged than one you build yourself by being of service to them. It's tough work and I'll be watching and engaging! - Robert Scoble

Sorry I wasn't complaining, just saying many of us built that in Twitter and find it a little tougher to get traction on FriendFeed with our posts. I think tools like WeFollow, Twellow (and even #followfriday) help build relevant audiences easier. You can even argue that SUL is even a good starting place for n00bs. - manielse (Mark Nielsen)

manielse: yeah, the eco system that's built up around Twitter is quite powerful. On the other hand here all you need to do is follow someone active and they bring other people into your view (every time I click "like" or comment on someone's items I push those items into your view, for instance) so finding new people to follow here is much nicer and much less of a competition. Plus you find new voices that aren't on any list a lot faster here, I've found. - Robert Scoble

Manielse, ditto Robert S - Myrna

Maybe they could reward early twitter users with a day on the list for every month on twitter before 08. If new social networks would promise props in the future I could live without twitter. - Greg Birch

Although the SUL is obviously distorting of the natural community growth of Twitter, and does not really fulfill the functions @Ev and @Biz intended, "power users" not on the SUL who criticize it should know: they sound really vain, chippy, and silly. - Jason Pontin

I don't care who is on the Twitter SUL, and I pay no attention to it. I look for the Twitter feeds that are most interesting to me -- they are not difficult to find, with a bit of searching. I don't understand the preoccupation with that list -- like everything on the Internet, it is simple to route around or ignore entirely. - Sean McBride

Jason: we know that. If I lived in fear of looking vain, chippy, or silly, I'd just stay off the Internet! :-) - Robert Scoble

Robert, I do not know you or Tim but I do follow and have great respect for you both. IMHO (I am an amateur when compared to you guys), Tim was not saying that he supports the SUL. Do I agree with his comment? Nope. Do I like the SUL? No. But it does happen that if you criticise a list while you mention that you have not been included it can sound like you are "jealous" even if you are not and you do have good reasons for not liking the list... so this can be a tricky one! - Pablo Melchor

Really, the personalized way is the only good way... I mean, sheesh, Twitter recommends people like Ashlee Simpson to me, ferchrissakes! So most of the people on the SUL are a total waste for me, and I suppose for most people, when you get right down to it... if I had some $ to burn I'd get some outside research firm like Insight Express to scope out how the SUL is actually viewed,... more... - Fred Davis

I still think most people find suggested users through word-of-mouth and their own social circles. That's the only way to get the people you really want to follow based on your interests. I've also found that using hashtags properly will get the kind of users you want to follow to you before you get to them. - Fleagle

Robert Scoble

I am tracking people on Twitter's SUL like @timoreilly. They can't get people to follow them on Facebook or FriendFeed. Here's analysis:

June 22 - Comment - Like - Share

Steffan Antonas, LouCypher, Andreas Edler and 73 other people liked this

Tim has 617,000 followers on Twitter -- almost all gained because he is on the suggested user list. But he only has 10,000 followers on FriendFeed. TechCrunch has almost the same pattern. Why is this? - Robert Scoble

217 more comments

They can't get people to follow them because the people who added them are not really listening and impressionable. - Louis Gray

You have to be engaged and interactive to have influence. - Louis Gray

It's what I was hinting at this morning. Most of the users on Twitter don't actually take action or DO anything. They aren't followers. They aren't listening. They aren't engaged. So these audiences can't be transfered anywhere else. - Robert Scoble

Twitter is Revolution! Yay Twitter! - Steven E. Streight

This is Twitter's true lock in. - Robert Scoble

Could it also be that they never talk about Friendfeed or Facebook while on Twitter and therefore no one knows that they're actually here? - Kenton

Yeah, Twitter has turned into more micro-rss for me versus conversational. - Tony

Why would any freedom loving person NOT have a green avatar? - Steven E. Streight

617,000, but how many of those are active users? I'd imagine 50% or more are one time users, dead accounts - sean percival

It's all about narcissism for most people unfortunately. - Steven E. Streight

It's impossible for anybody to have 617,000 followers on Friendfeed, because that's about double the active network size. ;) - Shéa Bennett

LOL - Steven E. Streight

Shea: very funny! - Robert Scoble

Kenton, That's it for me. I follow Tim on Twitter, actually find him very engaged there, but didn't automatically assume he was on FB and FF. Now I will - Francine Hardaway

I hate FaceBook - Steven E. Streight

also the chance of someone responding on a sul is higher on friendfeed that is on twitter - Kashif Khan

Shea: the problem with your thesis is that it holds true on Facebook. I have more fans there than TechCrunch does. - Robert Scoble

Also, if you only ever re-tweet instead of putting up original content your followers are going to tend to be more passive. - Kenton

how about them dopey Positive Affirmation tweeters? Ugh! - Steven E. Streight

If I want inspirational quotes, I'll open a Bible thank you. - Steven E. Streight

Kenton: that's true too, but TechCrunch puts up original content and he has fewer followers on Facebook than I do (and I post almost NOTHING on Facebook). - Robert Scoble

Like prob all of you I am on numerous social websites, twitter is not great at all unless you like the constant stream of tweet torrents - it is quick to interact with, that's why I use it the most right now. - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

This is the very basic definition of following, you don't act, you follow. If you want to engage people, you need a community, which twitter can help you to manage but won't do for you. @loic can make many people do something, he has influence, because he built a community, not because he has followers. - Jonathan Belgourari

Jonathan: yup and Guy Kawasaki has a lot more influence than I do and he neither is on Twitter's SUL and he doesn't even write all his own Tweets (he admits he has a team writing them). - Robert Scoble

twitter is also great to find out about people in a quick way, you otherwise wold never engage with. the next step blog, friendfeed, fb or email is just as easy. - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

if you have a lot of followers interaction is very limited. You miss out on so much when you hit the refresh page when you have followers . Im guessing after many attempts of trying to communicate and not receiving anything back ppl quit - Kashif Khan

Jonathan: I call that a "reader" or a "consumer" then, not a follower. Followers do what you ask them to do. :-) - Robert Scoble

Went and looked for him on FB. Not even a photo? Does he hang out there? - Francine Hardaway

on a much smaller scale I've looked at overlaps between my twitter (3000) fb (900) ff (800); there seems to be about 300 people who are common to all three, the rest choose where and how to interact with me. I tend to think of the 300 as my "digital dunbar number". - JP Rangaswami

Kashif: I interact here with almost everyone and I have 42,000 followers here. - Robert Scoble

good point Robert, I don't really consider Facebook a place to go for information like that so I had only really considered Friendfeed. - Kenton

Robert Scoble you are insane that does not count:) - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

Twitter is a different medium to the others, Robert. It's a lot less of a commitment to follow somebody on that network. FF has a relatively tiny user base so a comparison there is apples and oranges. Facebook for the majority is still less about following *anybody* and more about following people you know and trust. Why? Because you're giving away a lot of yourself each time you add... more... - Shéa Bennett

Alex: heheh. I'm not the only insane one. - Robert Scoble

but where is interacting easier , twitter or friendfeed ? - Kashif Khan

haha... - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

Shea: the truth about Twitter is that many people check it out for a few minutes and then never return to the service. Or if they do return, they do so very sporadically. Over here or on Facebook the audiences are much more engaged. - Robert Scoble

I agree with Louis. you have to interact and participate. - Johnny from BuddyFeed

imagine having to track this same conversation using twitters web interface and not having tweetdeck or seismic to help you out - Kashif Khan

Robert: I keep hearing that but I'm very engaged with my network. And I regularly remove the people who I feel don't make any kind of an effort. It's all about keeping things relative. - Shéa Bennett

I am still scared to contact anybody on Facebook, because I don't know if the want to stay private/real friends, or if they like me joining their conversation = I never send friend requests - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

Shea: the other truth about the Suggested User List is these are not organic followers. They are people who opened an account and clicked "add all the suggested users." Before Tim and Mashable and TechCrunch were added to that list I had more followers on Twitter. So did Leo Laporte. So did Guy Kawasaki. So, most of those newer followers that Tim and Mike got by being on the SUL aren't strong followers. That's why they aren't very engaged. - Robert Scoble

I agree re: Twitter - they check it out and then leave - the follow and forget methodology. I guess the real measure of how interactive his followers are would be to request that they do something (click a link, etc.) In reality, if he got 1/10 of 1% to do anything, I'd be impressed. - Jeff Pomeroy

You also have to remember that the majority of FB's 200 million users are non-techy people, many of whom see FB *as* the internet, not just a product of it. I think Twitter's audience is maturer (in terms of average age, as well as content) and less interesting in bells and whistles (videos, music etc). - Shéa Bennett

Jeff: what got Twitter to be so cool is engagedment USED to be a lot higher than 1/10th of 1% for everyone. Now it has gone down. - Robert Scoble

I have no disagreement at all about the SUL. I've written several articles about it on Twittercism. It needs to be scrapped or totally revamped. And yeah, a lot of the followers folk get from being on the SUL are very casual users, assuming they return at all. - Shéa Bennett

Shea: I totally disagree with that thesis. I did a survey of 600 Web innovators, influencers, and press. About 85% are on all three social networks (Twitter, Friendfeed, Facebook). And many of those are participating more on Facebook than on Twitter lately. Why is that? - Robert Scoble

Robert, my 'suggested user list' was full of esoteric treehuggers and feelgood-psychos. I am a software architect and astrophysics hugger instead. Facebook hooks me up with really strange algorithms - meh.. - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

"you reached level 14 in #spymaster" - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

:) - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

Alex: I blocked spymaster. :-) - Robert Scoble

I would too, like many other things, but than I want diversity. I want a lot of different people and opinions to challenge my thinking. - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

Maybe they are participating on Facebook more because they can truly control who sees what when they have their discussions. Twitter allows a lot of 'noise' to occur from unknown followers when these people are trying to communicate amongst themselves. Maybe Facebook or Friendfeed is just the better medium for those types of interactions. - Jeff Pomeroy

Robert: Which thesis? Blasted Friendfeed and its lack of threaded comments. ;) - Shéa Bennett

even on FB its easier to track conversations - Kashif Khan

Jeff, I agree. And I also think 'older people are more comfortable with FB. The 'older folks' on twitter are broadcasting their wisdoms and not interacting - most of them... - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

great listening to you guys - friendfeed proves something right here;) see ya. i'm out... - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

As for why your list are involved more on FB than Twitter, I have no idea. But 600 from either network is still a very small sample. I'm confused how these folk are actually "participating" on FB, too. Specifically, what does that word mean on that network? What do they do? My experience is that over half of my followers go ballistic if I update my status on FB more than about 15-20 times per day. And I'm *very* selective to make sure it's only the good stuff. :) - Shéa Bennett

It is personality vs brand. You Robert, Jason Calacanis, Leo Lapporte, are personalities before brand. We talk to you as real people. O'riley is brand before personality. We are not used to talking back to a brand unless we're miffed about something. It is just not normal. For instance today when you asked my question at the #hpreveal thing it cought them off guard and totally blew me... more... - Ron Hudson

Ron: good point. The real answer is that Twitter totally messed with the system by choosing its own "stars" instead of letting the real stars organically bubble up to the top. Since O'Reilly and Arrington are "chosen stars" their followers aren't strong followers like the ones that they got organically. Even Arrington admits this in analysis. - Robert Scoble

I totally agree with Ron about that. That's what I love about FF and Twitter - it's the first time that we've had anything like a level playing field for discourse. And the ones who don't engage now stand out like sore thumbs. - Shéa Bennett

I always love it when somebody has 40,000 followers but is following 40 people. What a waste. Why even engage? You, Robert have almost as many followers as followees. - Curt Mercadante

for me it seems that given his lopsided ratio, it gives the impression that he is not truly interactive but rather broadcasting and waiting for feedback. - Eran Even-Kesef

An engaged audience is built slowly, not quickly - Jesse Stay

So now when a new user gets on Twitter they see the same reinforced message from everywhere else. "These are people/brands you should LISTEN to" It is not "These are people to get to know and have conversation with" - Ron Hudson

Robert, wouldn't the organic SUL just be the top 100 most-followed? Which even before the SUL got going wasn't exactly a bastion of quality. All Twitter needs to do is mix things up - when I sign up (or check the SUL at any time), the service should give me X of its own recommendations, and the same amount that are tailored to me by my own interests. Of course, for this to really work... more... - Shéa Bennett

Curt: lots of people use these things for broadcasting. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, but I do prefer to follow people who engage. - Robert Scoble

Hey Louis Gray are you anti-SUL like many of us in this thread? - Mark

I followed @timoreilly for a while on twitter, but didn't find him interesting enough to keep following. It's true that @GuyKawasaki doesn't write all his own tweets, but I like them and look forward to them (if one of his ladies have written the tweet they will have their initials at the end of it.) I follow you, Robert, because I like your tweets too. I will follow anyone who follows... more... - Andrew Jordan

Shea: I can see about 100 ways to build a useful SUL. The current SUL just serves @ev and @biz 's own egos and purposes. - Robert Scoble

Mark: just remember that Twitter has signaled to the world that anyone who begs to be on, or complains about the SUL will never get onto it. - Robert Scoble

Robert: I agree. Between us, if they added you overnight, would you ask to be removed? I suspect you would, and I know at least one other has. - Shéa Bennett

Robert: Why do you think you are not on the Twitter SUL? iJustine was on it (til she was removed) - yet no Scobleizer - It makes zero sense. - Jim Connolly

Shea: yes, I will ask to be removed. I know one person who removed himself too. (Jay Rosen, journalism professor). Why would I ask to be removed? Because it's a huge gift and one that I would feel I need to disclose every time I talk about Twitter. Look at how many times I'm asked whether I'm paid by FriendFeed. Well, everyone on the Suggested User List is being paid by Twitter. - Robert Scoble

This feels like irc without the useful tools like tab-auto-complete. I keep wanting to ssh out and open irssi. . . - Ron Hudson

Aw man, I miss IRC. - Jason Nunnelley

There's a group of people I follow on twitter not to be part of their conversation but to inform conversations I have with people I know. My friends/acquaintances don't use friendfeed so I have little use for it. Facebook I leave for friends/family and twitter/web forums are for acquaintances. - Jonathan

Jim: three reasons I have never been on Twitter's Suggested User List: 1. Technically I was difficult to put on the list before they got rid of the @ reply functionality (I was one of the 3% who turned that feature on). 2. I talk about FriendFeed all the time (I wouldn't add someone who talked about a competitor all the time to my service either). 3. I have had days when I'm too noisy... more... - Robert Scoble

Does anyone know or have links to comments made by people on the SUL about the issue? - Mark

Robert: Thats a very honest and almost certainly accurate answer. - Jim Connolly

Mark: I've had some contact with @adventuregirl. - Shéa Bennett

There is a risk here of course regarding complaining about the SUL that one could easily be accused of sour grapes; that is, along the lines of, "How did THEY get on there, and not me?" Although I also suspect that the majority (the masses, if you will) on Twitter don't really care at all about things like the SUL, and are fairly blasé to the criticisms about it. I sincerely believe... more... - Shéa Bennett

Mark: honestly I've been following the SUL and other than when Veronica ripped me a new one for asking whether there was some sort of corruption to get on the list (big brands get on the list, for instance, and this list is totally corruptible because it is NOT a meritocracy) I can't remember ever hearing someone on the SUL discussing it in public. They know better because they are being gifted hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of followers and they don't want to be removed. - Robert Scoble

Mark: It's REALLY hard getting answers from people like Veronica Belmont or Pete Cashmore. They are both really cool people, but neither have replied to anything I have asked them, in relation to their SUL places. It's like they have been gagged. - Jim Connolly

Mark: It's here http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009... - Jim Connolly

Shea: most people will not care, that's right, until they figure out they are peasants in a royalty system. Then they will seek out systems that are meritocracies. The tide is already moving. - Robert Scoble

Robert: To your earlier point re: Tim O'Reilly - if the SUL system is broken and really just a method whereby new twitter users follow & forget, are these people truly "being gifted hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of followers"? - Jeff Pomeroy

I'm sure most of them don't wanna look a gift horse in the mouth. Is that the right metaphor? hehe - Mark

Hmm, I'm not sure Robert. Nobody seemed to leave FB when they were at risk of being sold out - the numbers just went up and up. I think the people who truly fight for this stuff are always in a real minority - they seem more prevalent because they're loud! :) I think most people drift away from social networks when they seem to have run their course, like MySpace. - Shéa Bennett

Jeff: yes, they are because they are now owning the top of lists at http://www.wefollow.com and other places. Also they are getting PR on TV shows worth many thousands of dollars (journalists love picking sources with huge numbers after their names). Finally: SOME of these followers DO engage. - Robert Scoble

Maybe Tim is too focused? he is not a chit chat BS guy enough to interest large amounts of people... Focus gives value but value that is high and very specific to certain (few) people. As you hinted Robert, value is not a matter of # of followers but of real impact /traction. People will listen and act more upon what is said on FF. FF is more value than traffic. - Harscoat

Maybe if a few dozen of us from this thread @reply the big players asking for a statement on their placw on SUL they will respond? - Mark

Scoble: I'm not sure they/we will seek out meritocracies. Like I said before it is not expected. I can go to crackberry forums or IRC if I want to be respected in a niche I think Facebook is more likely to draw people who want to be heard by their peers, because generally it is people you already have an established hierarchy of popularity with. It's high-school all over again. We tend to hang with our group and don't expect to be heard in others. - Ron Hudson

Don't get me wrong - folk will put their name on lists, and that kind of non-committal stuff. But when it comes to the crunch and, you know, actually quitting over change, they rarely do. - Shéa Bennett

Jeff: Yes they are, because most of them are selling some kind of advertising on their sites / blogs / podcasts etc. These are often sold on volume of eyeballs, and these will have increased by tens of thousands of percent after gaining all those Twitter followers. - Jim Connolly

"you did receive a gift. Advertising is sold by 1,000 viewers. Ask Ryan how much 1,000 people are worth. You did NOT earn that gift by any objective measure." - Rob Scoble, Feb 2009 - Mark

Mark: Unlikely. I think Robert is right - far too much to lose. Man, if they added me to the list, this time next week I'd be a millionaire! ;) - Shéa Bennett

Calacanis was widely quoted as saying a slot on the SUL was worth $250,000 US. - Jim Connolly

Robert: keep those threads coming, I get to follow good people on real-time, it's better than any Twitter SUL :) - Nir Ben Yona

Harscoat: I don't disagree a bit. Ron: good point about people not seeking out meritocracies. It does pollute the community, though, and people do figure that out eventually. If anything Facebook went the other way by limiting EVERYONE to 5,000. That brings celebrities down to everyone else's level, which builds good feelings and keeps marketers out. - Robert Scoble

It seems like the tech celebrity all seems to treat these systems the same, as places where they can acquire a mass following. I view myself as an average everday user of these systems, and view all three differently. And as they evolve, they all have different and divergent uses for me. It's not apples to apples... (also, tiring of SUL) - Bill Kinney

Jim: It's worth far more than that. Mashable is close to 1 million followers. The account tweets about 15-20 times per day, most back to their own site. That network size is worth millions. TC isn't far behind, and is already saying Twitter is about 10% of their traffic. Jason's semi-serious offer was probably high at the time, but I think a spot on that list now over 12 months is worth easily a million bucks to a brand or power-blog. - Shéa Bennett

Bill: yup. Today I was talking with Alexander. He says that people will continue seeking out "smaller" spaces. My wife likes Facebook better than FriendFeed or Twitter for that reason: she feels it's the place where she can talk with just her circle of friends. - Robert Scoble

tidbit of info: spoke to someone last night (who shall remain nameless) that said they went up by >10k followers per day when they were put on the SUL. They still consider that their real follower numbers are closer to their organic growth rate. - Bill Sanders

I hope all the big players move to FF soon so I can stop visiting twitter.com altogether. - Mark

I mean, $1/user that you can hit 15-20 times per day, 365 days a year, and if they unfollow, you're going to get another 40-50,000/week because you're on the SUL? I cannot believe Twitter doesn't monetize this feature. - Shéa Bennett

Shea: I think you are probably right - the numbers are insane and the SUL system is totally corrupt. - Jim Connolly

Robert, saying that people like me "can't build a following on Friendfeed" is silly. There are only so many networks that you can put time into. For whatever reason, I've chosen Twitter. You've chosen FriendFeed. The fact that I have 10,000 followers on FriendFeed is good news, given that I don't spend time here. Heck, I had 5,000 on Twitter when I started paying attention and using the service. - Tim O'Reilly

Thanks for coming Tim, do you agree with Robert that your SUL status is a "gift" and one in which makes it difficult for you to report on twitter honestly? - Mark

And for what it's worth, the SUL isn't very useful except for bragging rights. I had about 60K twitter followers when I went on the SUL; my peak click through-rate has perhaps doubled now that I have 10 times as many. Organic followers are what matters, except, as I say, for the media credibility that you get from people who don't know any better. - Tim O'Reilly

After all, the SUL is giving you lots of clicks, and clicks = page views and page views = dollars? - Mark

Tim: this post isn't only about you. But you must admit that you had fewer followers on Twitter than I did before you got added to the Suggested User List. You are getting gifted hundreds of thousands of followers per month. They aren't engaged. They won't do what you ask them to. Have you studied the hit rates the things you retweet are getting before and after getting on teh SUL? - Robert Scoble

Tim: You deserve to be on the SUL, but many of your SUL buddies don't. It really stinks, the way some of those names were added, and people like Leo Laporte and Scoble were blanked. - Jim Connolly

Totally, I only open up my facebook to those I have established relationship with - my choice to do so. I publish and share things of a more intimate nature there that I won't share on other services where my profile is more public. Facebook works quite well for that. I almost laugh at those that say that facebook has to match what twitter is doing or face extinction (and I've heard various arguments to that effect), that the "walled garden" will be their downfall eventually. I don't agree. - Bill Kinney

Mark - being on the Twitter SUL has absolutely no influence on what I do or do not report about Twitter. - Tim O'Reilly

Thanks, Tim x - Mark

Ahh, I see you have studied the hit rates and your observations match mine. These aren't "real" followers and they aren't engaged. Twitter did that to remove people they don't like from the top of the leaderboards (like Calacanis, Laporte, and me). - Robert Scoble

Is this about numbers (i.e. ratings and money) or is this about engagement? - SawyerTraining, Inc.

Incidentally, was iJustine removed from the SUL for something she said? Just wondering. I'd be interested to see if somebody on that list could be very critical about Twitter and stay on it. - Shéa Bennett

Tim is unsurprisingly savvy on the matter: "my peak click through-rate has perhaps doubled now that I have 10 times as many. Organic followers are what matters, except, as I say, for the media credibility that you get from people who don't know any better." In other words, organic followers are worth 10x more clicks/$$ than SUL followers. - Daniel J. Pritchett

Robert, did you recently share a Whisky with @Ev? What are the twitter bosses saying about the SUL and yoru complaints? - Mark

Tim: how do we know that, though? If you paid me hundreds of thousands of dollars per year I would need to disclose that to my audience and it would be very tough not to be influenced by that money you're paying me. Twitter is paying you a huge sum of money in followers and yet you say it has no influence on you. - Robert Scoble

Mark: I didn't bring it up with @ev (other than to make a small joke that he was building his own celebrities with the SUL, which he nervously smiled at). Why? Because I'd rather have these discussions out in public where you can see them and know that I'm not playing "footsie" with Twitter to get onto the list. - Robert Scoble

Sure it changes Tim's experience of the service and (at the least) doubles his direct financial rewards from the service but he's presumably not working on a word of mouth contract with them. The only way to be *completely* sure there's no conflict of interest would be for oreilly.com to block/redirect all direct or indirect clickthroughs from Twitter and I'm sure we can all agree that's not feasible. - Daniel J. Pritchett

That's just like the Robert we have known for a long time... - Amit Nangare

If this is about engagement consider that for me most of my engagement is "downstream" with my followers (who are few but important to me) rather than "upstream" where I look for trends, leads, and insights. I only interact upstream on rare occasions when I feel I might have something to add (and this may not be one of those times). - SawyerTraining, Inc.

Tim: It is impossible for you to be totally unbiased regarding Twitter, surely? - Jim Connolly

I like to think that after Robert had that whisky from Ev, his life spiralled out of control, a bit like something in Michael Douglas' The Game. Three days disappeared in a blur, and when he woke up, the only working login he had left was on Plurk. ;) - Shéa Bennett

It's impossible for any business to be completely unbiased regarding media outlets that cover/enable them, Jim. The best we can hope for is full disclosure, published conduct guidelines, and ombudsmen. - Daniel J. Pritchett from IM

Mark: also that wasn't an appropriate time socially. His wife was there, it wasn't an on the record type event, and it's not nice to be a jerk on a Saturday night. - Robert Scoble

Well I suppose twitter sends money to the SUL via followers, how is it it any different than Dell sending money to you via free laptops? - Mark

Daniel: We are talking about a 6 figure 'gift' from a company, to a group of people who write about that company. This is a really big deal. - Jim Connolly

@Shéa Bennett: Ijustine - man did that get old fast. That's what happens after 100 episodes of the same "yeah, yeah, you can ask ij" - Asgeir

Daniel: it's pretty hard to figure out that people are on the SUL. You have to have a new account and look every few days. Some people are building tracking systems to watch who is added and who is taken off (iJustine was on for a while but isn't anymore and she now is losing followers, if you watch the charts). Disclosure? People who are on this list don't see it as a gift. - Robert Scoble

Fair point, Rob x - Mark

It's simply a matter of scale, Jim. There is no realistic way for Tim to remain completely objective aside from eschewing Twitter altogether. As long as he is above board re: his dealings with Twitter that's really all that anyone can expect of him. - Daniel J. Pritchett from IM

Mark: if I take gifts I disclose it. I'd rather have the followers the SUL gives someone than a free laptop. A laptop is only worth $2,000. Getting on the SUL is worth many many more times that. - Robert Scoble

when i said "you", i didnt mean any of you in particular with the laptops - Mark

"you" just sounds better than "one" - how english of me - Mark

Good point, Robert. Perhaps Twitter should make it super obvious that people are on the SUL. It *would* be nice if text from SUL tweeters was visually distinguishable from regular tweeters so that we could know to (not) pay attention to it as per our preferences. - Daniel J. Pritchett from IM

One respectfully disagrees :) - Ian Betteridge

Regarding iJustine, I'm guessing she was pulled from the SUL early May? Check the chart: http://twittercounter.com/compare... If that date correlates, that probably says all we need to know about the benefits. - Shéa Bennett

Robert - do you think all Twitter-related content published by SULers should include a boilerplate disclaimer such as "BTW I get zillions of clicks through Twitter's preferential treatment" at the top of every story? - Daniel J. Pritchett from IM

Daniel: at Steve Broback's Twitter Conference the Twitter employees were visibly uncomfortable talking about the SUL. It's interesting that they added a "verified" icon to my account but they aren't identifying who is on the SUL. - Robert Scoble

Whoa, Shéa - Mark

It was cool of Tim to 'almost' talk about the SUL here. The guy's a tech legend and is there on merit - I just wish the list was balanced so others who equally deserve a slot had one. - Jim Connolly

Daniel: yes. If the New York Times journalists were receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars from a company they cover, wouldn't you expect them to disclose that? - Robert Scoble

I won't argue with you there at all, Robert. I would be happy seeing disclaimers and graphics denoting SUL status. I was thinking the problem was more Twitter's than Tim's but I suppose it's both. - Daniel J. Pritchett from IM

That graphic blew my mind, Shea. Thanks! - Daniel J. Pritchett

how about twitter sul = 300.000+$/month want it? buy it. full disclosure=? - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

Are most professional journalists doing online content paid based on page views? - Mark

or is it pay per article? - Mark

Jim: I wish the list was a meritocracy and based on your actual usage and value you add to Twitter. Personally I wish we had a list a lot more like wefollow.com or alltop.com than what Twitter came up with. Mark: yes. - Robert Scoble

Robert: EXACTLY! - Jim Connolly

Mark: Journalism companies get paid by 1000 page views. That's called CPM. They then usually pay their reporters per article, or per word, or they are salaried. - Robert Scoble

One reason is FriendFeed lacks a way of linking to other users in a post. On Twitter you can @timoreilly or @TechCrunch and I'd click on them and see if they are worth following. Since you can't do that on FriendFeed I don't bother to look to see if they are worth following. - ChiliMac

Jim: I find it insulting that Oprah was added to the Suggested User List after doing only a dozen or so entries on Twitter. How did they know she would be a good Twitterer after only that few? How insulting is that to all the other people who put tons more work into the system? - Robert Scoble

I don't think this SUL thing is about numbers, it's about ego and personality. Can you live without expressing your personal believes and have PR people do your job or say what you have to say out loud on public and give up the courtesy and goodies. Why is it about personality? Example: When Scoble came to visit my country (Israel) everyone could have a talk with him directly without... more... - Nir Ben Yona

ChiliMac: funny, I found you just fine and subscribed to you here. It's a different way, though. Here you put full URLs into the message. Like "hey, everyone, follow ChiliMac here: http://friendfeed.com/chilimac " - Robert Scoble

Robert: If being on the list has negligible value as you proposed (and Tim essentially confirmed) in terms of click-throughs, are we perhaps being overly concerned with its 'benefits'? If Tim's network has gone x10 and his clicks are x2, it's likely that his gain is from a lot of people who followed him organically (i.e., normal network growth). - Shéa Bennett

Robert: The Oprah situation took the SUL issue and exposed it for what it is; a 'buddy list.' Not based on merit or value. I only heard of Twitter because of you and Leo. There are hundreds of thousands of early users who only discovered Twitter off you and Leo's mentions. How soon they forget! - Jim Connolly

Shea: perhaps we are overly concerned. But I notice that people don't often remove themselves from this list, and even when they do (like in Jay Rosen's case) it's only after really thinking through the ethical responsibility of taking a huge gift from a corporation that they potentially cover. - Robert Scoble

Jim: exactly. I really hate it when companies love you when they are getting started because they need a few evangelistic users (ICQ started with only 40 users, so that's all you really need) but then they stab you in the back once they don't need you anymore. That's why more than a few bloggers now ask for stock or fees to cover their companies. Me? I will continue being a sucker for an entrepreneur with a great product or service. - Robert Scoble

I'd prefer an tiny audience that listened and commented, than a huge audience that ignored me - Mark Essel

value is the way and not arbitrary will from kings (ev and biz eg)... so this thread opens one's eyes to the not so fair and ego driven aspect of twitter as a cy ( I still remember @ev with the Trump daughter in front of the white house ;) - SUL = buddy list of @ev and @biz... liked Jim suggestion - Harscoat

I agree about Oprah but Twitter wants names on there - people that the 180 million Facebook users they don't have on Twitter right now will recognise. Everybody knows Oprah. It isn't about being a 'good Twitterer' (which is of course a relative term - one man's P. Diddy is another man's Jack Schofield) - it's about new users going, "Hey, I know this person." and that validates the... more... - Shéa Bennett

I wish Twitter wold make it easier to connect with people that has same interests. wefollow is on the right track, but people add themselves to categories they don't belong in. The one with most follower under #photo has, as far as I can tell, never written anything about photos, or photo related news - Asgeir

Engagement has value, but I understand most folks just like to read. I'm fine with that but engagement helps me improve my perspective while blogging - Mark Essel

social networks is about money not about us or social or socialism;) which brings me back to the point: the sul list is pure advertising and should be treated as that. Put a logo next to it: Advertisement: we recommend these ppl - done. 'We' will find each other anyways and the big old economy corps will always bully Robert or Leo out of their way:( - Alex 'BuckyBit' Covic

there are the "cooperators" and "free riders/defectors" in life (in evo psy terms) - Robert is a cooperator (interested in the overall value for the group rather than his own personal interest)! pointing at entrepreneurs with great product and services for the community. Do not change - Harscoat

Twitter is really just a broadcast medium, you can be influential and be on the SUL, but it's more likely you just have a bunch of people checking out the service once and never looking again. FF allows you to build value and relationships around conversations. Take this very thread. Which is more monetizable in the long run? I think twitter will just become another protocol, FF provides a far more valuable service. But that's just my opinion really, and it all depends on how YOU define "useful" - John

I try to participate, but I have anywhere from 60 to 80 hours of work a week, and adding Twitter and FF to the list increased my hours. So I can't always participate even though I want to. - RobinDotNet

Robert, I'm intrigued by your success and focus on this subject. I wonder, how do you think a group fairs compared to a single personality? At the moment, you're the king of social media in my opinion because of your engagement. The attention you command is ten fold the value of Ashton's million plus drive-by fans. But, could 10 top-notch social folks stuck to a brand (like Mashable's core Twitter brand) out-perform a single guy's personal touch? [Sorry, I did go a bit OT] - Jason Nunnelley

The truth is the SUL list on Twitter falsely inflates everyone numbers who are on it, I suspect if Tim O'Reilly wasn't on the list his numbers percentage wise would be just about the same whether we are talking Twitter or FF. I also think that since FF doesn't have an auto follow method, like twitter, their is more thought put into who someone is going to follow. - Kim Landwehr

Kim: That's true, but it's not just a question of auto-follow. One, Facebook doesn't allow one-way following - you have to be 'friends'. Two, for most people, letting somebody friend them on FB is a fairly big deal as that person then has access to a lot of your life (personal details, photos, etc - it AMAZES me how many people put their cellphone number on Facebook, and then just... more... - Shéa Bennett

I agree SUL is billboard advertising. Essel-i support that 'just like to read' is fine for some. That's how I participate with Wikipedia and I can see some on twitter will simply be there looking for new eddies in the river of news. FriendFeed and Facebook lead for those of us wanting greater depth: No matter if you are a platform or a "personality" how is quality engagement promoted... more... - Lane Rapp

Jason: I am often at a disadvantage competing against brands with many people employed like TechCrunch and Mashable. What was interesting was that I (and others like Leo Laporte, Calacanis, Kawasaki, et al) was able to compete before the SUL propelled them above me and into a different league. At least on Twitter. Everywhere else I'm still kicking their behinds. Which is worth studying,... more... - Robert Scoble

I am not on the Twitter SUL. I have 15,000 on Twitter and 2,700 on FF. Could it be that there are fewer peeps on FF? - Beth Kanter

Beth: that's a pretty common ratio, but doesn't match anyone's who is on the SUL. But, you miss my point. On Facebook (which has far far far more people than Twitter) TechCrunch has far fewer fans than I do but on Twitter he has far more, all artificially gained. If TechCrunch were smart he'd have those people also follow his fan page on Facebook. - Robert Scoble

But you bring up an interesting point, Beth, for another thread. Why aren't your followers good followers of yours? I imagine you've told them about friendfeed. Why don't your followers listen to you? I thought it was just me. - Robert Scoble

I just don't use facebook at all like i do FriendFeed or Twitter. - Geoff Schultz

What about the shear time to keep up with the topics of the day? For me twitter is all about reading quick short headlines, getting a pulse on what's going on, and then making a decision on what topics are important enough to engage deeper on. FF, FC, blogs, etc are the place to go deeper into the conversation. If you buy off on that, then the math comes into play,Twitter is the grand... more... - Robert Wilkins

Oprah, by the way, has 1,619,000 on Twitter and 760,000 on Facebook. I wonder how many followers Oprah was gifted by being on the recommended follower list, but you can see why Twitter is doing this. The higher Oprah's numbers are on Twitter the cooler Twitter seems and the more hype it gets and the more celebrities want to chase Oprah, even if they are for fake followers who don't mean that much. Brilliant strategy on Twitter's part. - Robert Scoble

yea, oprah=cool. you toting your camera maybe not so much to mainstream, glad to see the new hulk photo ;-) - Lane Rapp

Lane: Oprah is cool? Have you seen her Tweets? Not cool at all. - Robert Scoble

I have very different uses for each: Twitter, Facebook, FriendFeed... - Kelly A Nelson

Robert, Oprah's tweets are indeed superficial. Totally not engaged. She would do well to use twitter to engage both her audience and her causes between seasons. My joke was framed sarcastically enuff, but was to support your entire discussion here, that the SUL is rigged for twitter and celeb marketing. - Lane Rapp

Meh. all these celebs taking twitter away from us geeks :( its ours :( - Mark

Ellen Degeneres does a good job in my opinion - Lane Rapp

Mark, give twitter to the masses, sometimes I get the feeling FF wants to remain a niche. I can't say I would be disappointed as long as the lights stay on. We can contribute like we do on NPR. - Lane Rapp

Lane: they said that about Twitter two years ago. The thing is here that FriendFeed has nooks and crannies that can let us hide from the masses a lot better than we can hide on Twitter. - Robert Scoble

Beth, I think the difference between Twitter and FF is two fold, compounded and a big indicator as to why Robert may fair so much better here and FB. Twitter simplifies the competition (if there is such a thing, though people perceive it's real, so it is). It's all about followers and extremely competitive to gain them. FriendFeed is culturally different, and conversational. This kind... more... - Jason Nunnelley

Yes we can hide away in little corners, and even go private rooms if we want a little insider chat. Friendfeed is our underground movement! - Mark

Something Robert has done that works best in more conversational SM is brand himself as an all around cool guy. He's not "Robert Scoble the tech guru." Mashable and Techcrunch are very limited in their scope, so readers are likely to read their blip about their preferred technology and move on. Robert engages his readers on a multitude of topics, much more conversational. He'll actually... more... - Jason Nunnelley

Robert, thanks I'll do my part to welcome the masses while I learn more about the nooks and crannies. I noticed how all the FF user help rooms are active, but the Facebook user groups have limited discussion. - Lane Rapp

Lane (WARNING: shameless promotion) I'd be happy to host more conversations in newb regarding Facebook if you like, post tutorials, videos, etc. Are you more often a question source or an answer source? <edit> Meaning, I'd like to have someone else post help there if I start pushing my readers to the group. - Jason Nunnelley

Anyone heard any news about new friendfeed features? Sure would be cool to be able to post images and things in the discussion thread. - Mark

I hate to hit and run, but 90% of the people I follow I follow because I've seen them say interesting things and participate here. - Steve Lowe

Steve, why is that Hit and Run? - Jason Nunnelley

Is the FriendFeed back-end on Scala already? :) - The Pageman

Jason, I'd like that and think the rural, the elder, the poor, the disabled, and much of africa who get better high speed net access will as well. As fast as these platforms are growing the users have to help out with the concierge desk. I've got questions and I'm still newb enuff to answer some with empathy - Lane Rapp

Lower counts on friendfeed IMHO is due to the fact FF lacks the sexyness of Facebook. The FF User Interface is cleaner, simpler but lacks eye candy, of the FB I do think UI is better than Twitter, but lacks the 3rd party apps which promote usage. The 2 ff aps on the iPhone are #horriblizers ( original word from @lovinkat) - derikp

If more people used clients that don't require following people to group them and/or see their tweets, the followers would n't be half as relevant on Twitter. I converse with lots of people I don't follow on facebook and FriendFeed. - guruvan (Rob Nelson)

Robert, the bottom line is people follow people for three reasons: content, content and content. The question is what difference does the SUL on Twitter make if most people just ignore boring content and move on? - Jason Nunnelley

My mom joined Twitter today (that tells me its not Myspace, so much for my original thesis) but she didn't necessarily want to follow this suggested list, but from talking to her, it sounded like it was "fostered" onto her. I don't know what the steps look like since I joined a long time ago, but it sounds like for a newbie you are pretty much going to auto follow these people - Stephen Pickering

I have more friends/followers on Friendfeed than I do on any other site - Joe Dawson

the followers picked up from SUL are folks who are getting started -- it's like the old PCH magazine subs: renewals and engagemt were horrible but the audience inflation paid back in ad dollars. The social web is about "finding" an audience, just like the old days before you could use web clout to open the spigot and drive a massive audience. The SUL is a Web 1.0 artifact, like cutting... more... - Dan McCarthy from BuddyFeed

Robert, et al: There was some important information shared in this thread yesterday, and I've put a lot of it together in a post for Twittercism, focusing on comparisons between the follower counts of Tim, Robert and iJustine. Appreciate your thoughts. Cheers. http://twittercism.com/suggest... - Shéa Bennett

isn't 10000 followers on friendfeed just about the same percentage of the community as 600000 on twitter? - Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)

Stephen, you have to unclick the people you don't want to follow in the SUL. - Jason Nunnelley

Great thread. Thanks Robert. - Mark Davidson from BuddyFeed

Thanks for sharing - great info Robert!! - Laurie DesAutels

If what you say is true, then the terms need to be changed. As for them not transferring to any other social network, why is that even necessary? There's a great study out there that states 90% of your network will be lurkers anyway. You'll never know that they exist, however, it's still comforting to know they're there.... - Mike Shields

Robert: Now that you mention it, I will tell them about FriendFeed. - Beth Kanter

Robert: I hate it when there's a "food fight" over ideas. Please remember that Twitter is still trying to find a business model. These $100,000 gifts are basically Calacanis "Bucks"... you can't actually buy anything with them except the promise of VC investment. VC investment is simply mortgaging your future. - davem51

Was it wrong with Radio from UserLand had some suggested feeds to follow? No. It was a smart business idea and Adam Curry invested to get more readers. Smart attempt to save Userland from failing. - davem51

I met Tim O'Reilly in 1990 working the O'Reilly booth at Usenix. It was one of the most interesting conversations I have ever had at a conference... Tim knows how to present idea but more importantly he has the biggest ears in tech. He's got an Open Source Mind. - davem51

am i on twittr? - j edmonds

Leo Laporte to Leo's feed, TWiT Conversations

Live now, FLOSS Weekly 73 with Tim O'Reilly, Jono Bacon, and Randal Schwartz. http://live.twit.tv. Discuss here...

June 10 - Comment - Like - Share

Dr. Apps, Zehn, Daniel Rowley and 21 other people liked this

Tim should spend a week on FriendFeed. He can always go back. - Ken Sheppardson

378 more comments

I liked this - ramiles

Yup FF is a much cooler place than Twitter - Jeff

I wonder if there is a Friendfeed app for the Itouch? - ramiles

You can point it at http://friendfeed.com/iphone. Don't know about apps. - Ken Sheppardson

Welcome, Tim :-) - Ken Sheppardson

So - now we all move to here ;) - LPH™ and his dog P™

What was that book that Leo mentioned? - Troy McConaghy

Wow, FriendFeed users sure do have to convince themselves that they're better than Twitter. - Stuart Jones

Thanks Ken - ramiles

click the timestamp twice - Ken Sheppardson

you get a pop-up the second time you click on the timestamp - Ken Sheppardson

Hello, Tim. - Matthew Gifford

Hi everyone. And hi Tim! - Vlad Bobleanta

Hey everyone - Eevee from IM

Hello! - Benjamin Taylor

Howdy Benjamin - Divya Mistry

Hey all! - Simon Oliver

Yes there is a app - ramiles

there is a few of them - ramiles

about 4 2 free - ramiles

how do I open a new page so the comment box stays at the bottom ? - John Hillestad

dbl click time stamp and resize window? - Thomas Perez

http://friendfeed.com/twit-co... - Ken Sheppardson

^-- use that link - Ken Sheppardson

John -- click on the time stamp - LPH™ and his dog P™

The book Leo mentioned was Team of Rivals by Doris Kearns Goodwin - Tim O'Reilly

How did you do that Ken ? is there something I am supposed to click ? - John Hillestad

click the timestamp twice or add ?embed=1 after the url - Vlad Bobleanta

I really miss FF support in Tweetie for the iPhone! :) - Carl-Fredrik

ok thanks - John Hillestad

Carl---- BuddyFeed, Amigo, or AlertThingy are decent on the iPhone - LPH™ and his dog P™

I see carl - ramiles

I just bought AlretThingy - ramiles

Whadya know... http://friendfeed.com/iphone looks just fine on the Pre too. Cool. - Ken Sheppardson

I've got my pink Camel book sitting on the shelf next to me. :-) - Ken Sheppardson

ramiles - good purchase -- - LPH™ and his dog P™

you got the - ramiles

PRE - ramiles

Thanks LPH - ramiles

I remember seeing Dale Dougherty give a presentation RE GNN and The Whole Internet back in 1992... - Ken Sheppardson

Since I started watching TSS i have has a crush on Sarah Lane - ramiles

Hello everyone. :P - Kate Phillips

I have used linux in verious distros - ramiles

hard to choose which one is best - ramiles

ramiles - yes -- my only green desktop is CherryPal - a great little device with Ubuntu. http://cherrypal.com/ - LPH™ and his dog P™

It's the difference between wanting "enough" and wanting to take over the world. - Ken Sheppardson

Tim, can you discuss the importance of Richard Stallman? The crazy-ass zealot is important to any movement. Doesn't he act as our conscious? - Scott Smith

"Money is a hack that got out of control" - nice one - Keith Harrison

It isn't a word ;) - LPH™ and his dog P™

i wish i could keep the pop out window ontop of my screen - ramiles

me too...ramiles - mark dekruyter

Love oreilly's books. - Cody C

"In the July 1999 issue of Print magazine, Darcy DiNucci wrote a piece titled “Fragmented Future” about Web 2.0 vs. Web 1.0..." -- http://www.cole20.com/who-coi... - Ken Sheppardson

the oreilly books are a great source - ramiles

Can Tim discuss the importance of Head First books on technical documents/books? - Scott Smith

the first O'Reilly book I bought was The Whole Internet User’s Guide - happy days - Keith Harrison

i think thats the book i bought as well when i first got on the internet - ramiles

http://www.oreillynet.com/onlamp... - Ken Sheppardson

David Stutz -- http://www.synthesist.net/writing... - Ken Sheppardson

LEO your the BOMB - ramiles

You know a guy/gal is quite a wonderful "speaker" when he/she's talking more than Leo on common topics and history :) - Divya Mistry

What about Leo's the BOMB? - Dekz

Divya - Agreed - Najeeb Mirza

Haha. Agreed Dekz. - Divya Mistry

Najeeb- Yea.. usually Leo has to give pointers the guest.. but not here :) - Divya Mistry

yep - ramiles

Why Google is Offering 411 Service - http://radar.oreilly.com/2007... - Ken Sheppardson

Yeah wow Tim seems very knowledgeable. - Kate Phillips

"In short, I'm speculating that the 1-800-GOOG-411 service is designed to harvest voice data to build Google's own speech database, rather than licensing from Nuance or another player." - Ken Sheppardson

Very insightful man - Cody C

He's a visionary - Cody C

my dad has that in his Cell phone already - ramiles

Tim: How do you avoid "group think" in this type of scenario? Just because everyone "believes" something is a certain way .. doesn't mean that it is ... - LPH™ and his dog P™

wikipedia FTL? - Thomas Perez

lph we all need to think about this - Preternat (Ken Cadby)

Thomas: I was going to ask about Wikis too - LPH™ and his dog P™

see it all the time on wikipedia.... published facts vs commonly accepted "facts" - Thomas Perez

I think that Wikipedia is always checked for true facts - ramiles

LOL @ ramiles - Dekz

...... - Thomas Perez

the problem is in peoples' definition of "true" - Thomas Perez

be great to hear tim's view on google wave and where that is heading? - Simon Oliver

I caught some of this live, will definately download and listen when it's posted. - Michael Koby from BuddyFeed

Thats what I was thinking. - Kate Phillips

Dakz thats a true fact - ramiles

There's a difference between folks complaining about the fact that services don't give away what they have and not being open to letting anyone pay a fair fee to access it. There's no published process for me to pay for Twitter API (firehose) access right now, for example. - Ken Sheppardson

"Open" doesn't necessarily have to mean "free" - Ken Sheppardson

i use twitterfon for my itouch - ramiles

a great twitter app for my touch - ramiles

We just need a level playing field. - Ken Sheppardson

Speaking of land grabs... we have the Facebook land grab coming up Friday. - Ken Sheppardson

how many here use facebook and twitter and myspace - ramiles

Yep Facebook one will be big - LPH™ and his dog P™

I use all 3 - Kate Phillips

yeah.... - Thomas Perez

i use twitter mostly, a little facebook. no myspace ever - Thomas Perez

Yes, integration of new social services is going to be important - LPH™ and his dog P™

I use all 3 - ramiles

FriendFeed gets it. - Ken Sheppardson

i follow so many people - ramiles

I just learned about friendfeed today - ramiles

Welcome, Ramiles! - Ken Sheppardson

ramiles - you came to the right place - LPH™ and his dog P™

I just set out today to learn a bit more about friendfeed but i've have an account for a while. - Kate Phillips

Kate - why a private feed on a social service? - LPH™ and his dog P™

thanks Ken and LPH - ramiles

Ugh, My FriendFeed app keeps crashing on my Itouch - ramiles

Yep - my handle is taken on Tumblr -- but unused :p Hopefully I can convince Tumblr to let me have it -- - LPH™ and his dog P™

What do you mean? Private feed? - Kate Phillips

Kate: When we put a cursor over your name it says u have a private feed - ramiles

I wish Google Profiles was used on FriendFeed - LPH™ and his dog P™

Tim's really amazing! - Lyderic

LPH: It's the default for new users. Kate: If you go to the "settings" link in the upper right under your image, there's a checkbox for "private feed". You should uncheck that so everybody can see what you post :-) - Ken Sheppardson

Actually, I have my FF badge on my twitter account ;) - LPH™ and his dog P™

I wonder if its becuase my itouch is jail broken - ramiles

I actually don't know why It says that. hehe - Kate Phillips

Ken - what is the default for new users? I missed something in your thoughts. - LPH™ and his dog P™

LPH: Private feed is the default. I've noticed it when creating a couple of temp accounts. - Ken Sheppardson

Thanks did that fix it? - Kate Phillips

OH -- didn't know that. - LPH™ and his dog P™

Kate: yes.. fixed :) - Divya Mistry

Thanks I had no idea. ^^ - Kate Phillips

I think if Twitter is replacing your blog, doesn't it mean you had "pointless" blogs to begin with? I *never* associated blogs with short posts. A blog post was well-thought-out and expressive. Am I thinking incorrectly? - Divya Mistry

Divya -- I changed my personal blog to simply include the 'activity stream' - LPH™ and his dog P™

There've been a number of articles lately talking about how many folks actually "lurk" on Twitter etc. - Ken Sheppardson

Twitter is more than a blog more communtative - ramiles

i heard that the ratio was 80% consumer 20% creator - Chris Heath

I'm not a lurker - but a wall-flower ;) - LPH™ and his dog P™

I'm a lurker - John Matulich

it sounds like Google Wave is the next big thing. - Michael Sanchez

LPH- Yea, I guess it all depends on how you'd define blog. I always thought blog was sort of pseudo-newspaper-Opinion section. - Divya Mistry

And so didn't think of Blog as a one-line post.. hmm - Divya Mistry

SFGATE.com (SF Chronicle website) now has a twitterfeed on the front page as of..... this week sometime. following other news outlet twitter accts - Thomas Perez

UGH this is aggervating my App keeps crashing out to main screen - ramiles

I started "blogging" in 1996 -- so it was just a stream of activity - so it is based on the definition. The word blog didn't even exist in the 90s .. - LPH™ and his dog P™

on my touch - ramiles

i had a wordpress blog - ramiles

used to blog on yahoo when they had a blog - ramiles

LPH - I see where you're coming from. I just associate "activity stream" with someone's webpage. It's not a blog, but a page to *know* the person. And to know their opinion/interests I'd go to blog.yourwebpage.com - Divya Mistry

I agree with you Michael. I saw video of the google wave and it blew me away. - Kate Phillips

google HUD in your car would be something - Thomas Perez

what is google wave - ramiles

*ANY* GPS HUD would be slick... - Ken Sheppardson

how about a global social network message 'recall" app - Benjamin Taylor

google it - Thomas Perez

Google wave brings all the things there talking about together - Michael Sanchez

Thomas - think of road banners... "Click it or ticket" AND "stop Google HUD" - Divya Mistry

Thomas -- and many "news" stations on t.v. are simply quoting twitters .. funny really - LPH™ and his dog P™

I learned the multiplecation tables in elementary school for example through 12x12. Thats given way to the calculator widget on my igoogle page. @Ramiles An example of something lost and something gained. - John Brazel

but imagine GPS.... plus all the info google maps provides (photos, reviews, MyTracks) plus everything else, gmail, twitter, facebook (viewing friends realtime location displayed on HUD) - Thomas Perez

I wonder how far the LCD/LED technology is from being able to add a layer on the inside of your windshield... - Ken Sheppardson

or strangers for that matter. interaction with other drivers beyond a few scowls and "gestures" - Thomas Perez

any thoughts on what Google is doing with Wave - wingman

John whats that have to do with anything - ramiles

Leo: Has Tim tried out Wave? - Ken Sheppardson

Ken, wouldn't OLED be able to do that? just another layer in the windshield - Chris Heath

Leo put Kim Commando to shame - ramiles

komando - Preternat (Ken Cadby)

Actually, I don't really get Google Wave :( - LPH™ and his dog P™

Leo puts Kim Komando to shame - ramiles

thanks for the correction ken - ramiles

who? - Preternat (Ken Cadby)

Ihnatko prints google maps directions mirrored backwards and puts the paper on the dash. Analog hud. - Joel Zehring

Great job Tim ! Very thought-provoking - LPH™ and his dog P™

LPH- Once we actually get to use it, it'll be easier to understand. - Divya Mistry

ya it was a good convo. Tim - Michael Sanchez

Nice job... HAH - Ken Sheppardson

Good joke Leo - LPH™ and his dog P™

Awesome show LEO - ramiles

LOVED the show Leo. - Divya Mistry

good show LEO - Michael Sanchez

Would love to be a guest on Leos show - ramiles

Really good shoe, thanks Leo et al. - John Brazel

firefly, whats that :-p - Thomas Perez

http://www.hulu.com/firefly - Kate Phillips

glad i could catch the end of this show, what a great interview - Chris Heath

Firefly was a really good TV show - Kate Phillips

awesome show - ramiles

I have the complete show - ramiles

Firefly lead to serinity the movie - ramiles

was written by Josh Weldon who did buffy the vampire slayer - ramiles

I own the series - ramiles

Are we going to get a new thread Leo? LOL - LPH™ and his dog P™

sorry, :-p = sarcasm, but i'm sure someone didnt know. did he just hint at a firefly videogame? - Thomas Perez

Joss Whedon* - Thomas Perez

Thanks for the correction Thomas - ramiles

but i dont like to be publicly be corrected - ramiles

make sure your facts are true? - Thomas Perez

they are - ramiles

how many here have seen the series - ramiles

I saw the series and the movie loved them both - Kate Phillips

never heard of it before today - Michael Sanchez

highly recomend it - Thomas Perez

Ditto - ramiles

is it on Hulu? - Michael Sanchez

the guy thats in Castle was in it - ramiles

sure is - Thomas Perez

Yes I posted a link earlier - Kate Phillips

there is even a baldwin brother in the show - ramiles

one you probably never heard of - ramiles

Its has all 14 episodes avaliable. - Kate Phillips

cool thanks i'll have to check it out - Michael Sanchez

I would reccomnd to buy the series its only like $50 - ramiles

hes not one of the baldwins, but his last name is baldwin...... - Thomas Perez

Thomas I think he is - ramiles

check wikipedia :-) - Thomas Perez

hahahahaha - Dekz

wiki isnt always true - ramiles

good times, leo - Thomas Perez

"I think that Wikipedia is always checked for true facts - ramiles" - Dekz

thanks Dekz ;-) - Thomas Perez

I wonder when leo is going to take advantage of all of the different angles you can have going at once with bitgravity? - Kate Phillips

I know I would like to see it like how they did on Digg Nation - Michael Sanchez

Yeah that would be wonderful. - Kate Phillips

where all the cams are live and you get to pick what you wanna watch - Michael Sanchez

Kate, you can't do the multiview live since leo would have to send each camera's feed out to bitgravity - the diggnation multiview was not done live - Chris Heath

I saw one day they were talking about it. They were talking about talking with bitgravity to work out something for them. - Kate Phillips

It was a while back when they were still on stickam. - Kate Phillips

At least when stickam was on the main page. - Kate Phillips

yeah it might be possible one day, but probably not - Chris Heath

I remember TechTv used to have it where u could click on what cam u want to view like the studio cam or cubicle cams - ramiles

Dekz leave me alone - ramiles

thomas ur right he isnt - ramiles

cant wait to see the game - ramiles

i hope it follows the show - ramiles

I hope they show or play some of the music or game - Michael Sanchez

that would be nice - ramiles

I hope its not just for the PS3 I hope they put it out for the PC as well - ramiles

I doubt that. - Michael Sanchez

Sony owns the game company that they are working for. - Michael Sanchez

thats sucks - ramiles

are they really - ramiles

bringing back doll house - ramiles

I'd pick watching Leo Laporte any day over network television. I have live.twit.tv streaming on my 42 inch plasma via a pc, who wouldn't enjoy that! - Jim Lavin

jim your spoiled - ramiles

but Plasma is out dated - ramiles

you should replace it with a LCD TV - ramiles

ya i run my Mac Mini on my 42 LCD TV - Michael Sanchez

you have the new LCD tv Michale - ramiles

Michael - ramiles

ya - Michael Sanchez

hehe I run my laptop upstairs to my 30" lcd when i head to bed so I have something to watch at night. - Kate Phillips

CRT's still rule - ramiles

I watch the Planet Green channel when i head to bed. a lot of good stuff on making your house green and off the grid - Michael Sanchez

I have enough shows to watch that have been tivo'ed - ramiles

Any of you play any videogames? - Kate Phillips

i do kate - ramiles

the TIVO is the wife's... lol - Michael Sanchez

I still have the Xbox and PS2 - ramiles

havent upgraded yet - ramiles

ya i play Gears 2 on xbox - Michael Sanchez

and Killzone 2 on PS3 - Michael Sanchez

i do agree with spending 50 on games - ramiles

think its absurd - ramiles

MIchael how old r u - ramiles

24 - Michael Sanchez

HAHAHAHAHAHA - ramiles

between boxee, video games and work I tend to be entertained easily. - Kate Phillips

I am 38 - ramiles

ramiles: I'm not spoiled, I'm just another gadget geek with a lot wire running all over the house. - Jim Lavin

why is that funny o.O - Thomas Perez

you got some years on me... lol - Michael Sanchez

Jim your totally spoiled - ramiles

yep but your married I am single and unemployed at the moment struggling - ramiles

Jim I am the same way.. - Michael Sanchez

I used to work at intel and there's some really young people with some really nice gear at home lol. - Kate Phillips

kate u married or single - ramiles

ya i am 24 and i make over 100k a year as a Tech - Michael Sanchez

where do u work Michael - ramiles

I'm single. Not dating though. - Kate Phillips

k - ramiles

for a construction company. managing there network. - Michael Sanchez

Wish I could make u kind of money - ramiles

I am going for my BS in Network Security - ramiles

What do you do for a living ramiles? - Kate Phillips

in between jobs Kate - ramiles

I do freelance web design and PC tech - ramiles

good stuff i have my bachelor degree from ITT tech - Michael Sanchez

Very cool ^^ - Kate Phillips

I am getting my from Colorado Tech - ramiles

in Cisco networking - Michael Sanchez

Michael where u from - ramiles

CA - Michael Sanchez

I do some freelance PC tech work on craigslist - Kate Phillips

like 2 hours away from where leo is - Michael Sanchez

you went here fro school cool - ramiles

hows that kate - ramiles

MIchael u ever met leo - ramiles

Kate: do you make good money from craigslist? - Michael Sanchez

finding jobs from craigslist is tough - ramiles

Ramiles: no I haven't had the privilege. - Michael Sanchez

Most jobs are really easy clearing up viruses. Stuff like that. - Kate Phillips

i have talked to him on the Phone in the old TSS days I have also talked to Kevin - ramiles

would of loved to talk to Sarah Lane - ramiles

Kate: ya i ask because i do a lot of PC tech for the family on the side and i was thinking about putting something on craigslist for it - Michael Sanchez

Post a number and people call. I usually charge by the hour on how long it took me to fix it. Generally i charge a lot less than an hour of say a best buy like 20 do an hour or an install of a new OS for cost of software and $50. - Kate Phillips

I would do network setups - ramiles

and troubleshoot - ramiles

I am running Windows Home Servere here - ramiles

Plus i help them with a lot more like suggesting opensource software which is what i really try to interest people in. - Kate Phillips

kate where u from - ramiles

I have installed a few routers as well. - Kate Phillips

California. Sothern cali - Kate Phillips

seems a lot of your are i Cali - ramiles

I am in chicago - ramiles

I was just in Sothern cali at Disneyland for last week - Michael Sanchez

My Dad wants to open a business fixing PC's with me. Not sure when he really wants to do it though. - Kate Phillips

i have done both disneys - ramiles

I really want to see Disney World - Kate Phillips

I havent made it to Disney World yet.. - Michael Sanchez

I want to do Universal and see the harry potter world - ramiles

Its been a while since I've been to universal. I prefer the shows and shopping at Disney Land to the other crazy rides. :P - Kate Phillips

Been to Universal but never seen harry potter world. but its been some years since i've been there - Michael Sanchez

the Potter world is something new - ramiles

Why I asked about the games earlier is I just pre-ordered the game "Aion" - Kate Phillips

I am a first person shooter kind of guy. - Michael Sanchez

I'm in the beta for Batlefield Heroes - Kate Phillips

Love that game. - Kate Phillips

oh wow how is it? - Michael Sanchez

Its pretty nice the beta is down right now though. - Kate Phillips

What is it it never heard of it - ramiles

Been down almost a week. - Kate Phillips

it looks cartoonish. - Michael Sanchez

my friend just bought infamous - ramiles

http://www.battlefield-heroes.com/ - Kate Phillips

but good - Michael Sanchez

mac support? - Michael Sanchez

it dont look like it - Michael Sanchez

Let me look and check on something see if there's anymore beta keys left. - Kate Phillips

not really into the mmorpgs - ramiles

Not sure if it has mac support - Kate Phillips

the new Iphone blows the pre away - ramiles

I know Curse.com is giving away keys - Kate Phillips

http://www.curse.com/keys... - Kate Phillips

Here's the site to get a key you just need to log in to get it no need to buy anything. - Kate Phillips

kate ur into the mmorpgs - ramiles

I play MMO's in just about all forms - Kate Phillips

Play Guildwars a lot - Kate Phillips

Love the PVP - Kate Phillips

kate how old r u - ramiles

:O - Kate Phillips

lol im 30 - Kate Phillips

ur 8yrs shy of me - ramiles

wow i feel young - Michael Sanchez

no offense - Michael Sanchez

no offense taken - Kate Phillips

wow 10gig an hour - ramiles

dang thats a lot - Kate Phillips

mpeg2 - Chris Heath

i love my Mac - Michael Sanchez

Here's the google wave video that wow'd me http://wave.google.com/ - Kate Phillips

or shall i say Mac's - Michael Sanchez

WE LOVE YOU LEO!!! - ramiles

Google Wave is the next BIG thing i think - Michael Sanchez

Definatlly Email 2.0 - Kate Phillips

And so much more - Kate Phillips

is that his wife? - ramiles

no - Kate Phillips

She works with leo - Kate Phillips

i remember that episode - ramiles

glad i bought the SET - ramiles

it has a huge following - ramiles

I love the theme song - ramiles

its a combination of old and new technology - ramiles

nd the language they speak is chinese - ramiles

Have a good evening. - Kate Phillips

See you guys later. - Kate Phillips

later - Michael Sanchez

later kate - ramiles

wheres he going - ramiles

hello - ramiles

KOIT! - Thomas Perez

i accidentally left my computer connected to live.twit.tv and was rewarded to find abbey interviewing leo!!!!! so awesome - Thomas Perez

i'm sorry, abby* - Thomas Perez

OMG I REMEMBER RUSH ON KNBR!!!! - Thomas Perez

Dvorak started Leo's carer, I have to re-think my life, ha... - Marc Bochy

This is fun watching Leo's daughter Abby argue about the time left for her recording session. lol - rob friedman from twhirl

She did good..... - Marc Bochy

she did awesomely - Thomas Perez

Robert Scoble

My SXSW goal: find people who are thinking big. Know anyone who is doing that? Tell me here:

March 7 - Comment - Like - Share

Squid, paul mooney, Kol Tregaskes and 42 other people liked this

Yes...@jjsnyc will be at SXSW and we're doing some BIG things here...check out http://www.BIGOmaha.com - Jeff Slobotski

39 more comments

I know a couple ;) - Marcus Nelson

I just started a company, so I'm thinking big — will be good to see you at SXSW: last time I saw you was at SXSW 2005 and the time before that was at a conference you were running and I was speaking at in New Orleans in 2001 so it must be a 4-year thing :-) - James Tauber

Robert.. I realize you have a job and a role. However, there is nothing bigger than getting the truth out about 9/11: http://billgiltner.blip.tv/journal... - bill giltner

No one's thinking bigger than Uservoice - cheers Marcus Nelson - represent for Santa Cruz this year. - Sol

Robert - can I suggest you look for people who not only are thinking big but are playing or want to play big! - Krishna De

I'm thinking big about my new book Escape from Cubicle Nation -- it would be fun to connect at SXSW. More here: http://www.portfolioimprint.com/2009... - Pamela Slim

Can't help but recall this quote "Go Big or Go Home!" - Walt Ruppar

We're thinking BIG here in Aquila TV in Birmingham, England. We're also all about diversifying and collaborative work, because we know that this is where our industry is heading. I'm @melkins on Twitter and will be in Texas next week for SXSW. - Mars Elkins

Even the thoughts are big in Texas. ;) How about: our work to accelerate the demise of the office building and the rise of the sentient city: http://bit.ly/ehUs - Sean Savage

@respres & @billlubin have created Social Media Marketing Institute. I think that's got potential for strong growth as a training entity. Might be worth chatting with them. As to tech start-ups, @doverbey with @roost is worth watching. (www.roost.com) - Paul Chaney

Most of them lived in XV century :) Romain Gary in XX - Vitaly Pimenov

I'm thinking big...if, by big, you mean changing the world ;) I'm the founder of http://www.EpicChange.org & http://www.TweetsGiving.org & will be speaking on @jeffpulver 's "Social Media for Social Good" panel on 3/16 at Stubb's BBQ: http://pulverblog.pulver.com/archive.... Hope to see you there! (Funny, my first real step into the social media space was on @SamLawrence 's blog "Go Big Always" http://gobigalways.com/guest-p...) Hope to meet you at SXSW! - Stacey Monk

Just chiming in to echo the Uservoice sentiments already expressed here. Go Santa Cruz! - Nick

WE ARE! (www.turn2live.com) Come check us out at the Porter Novelli entrepreneur's lounge at Fogo on 3/13 and 3/14. - Cliff

My son-in-law, Saul Griffith, is making the case that the entire economy needs to be turned towards sustainable energy. That's big think.... See http://blog.longnow.org/2009... - Tim O'Reilly

Hi Robert, @TugglMatt here, founder of Tuggl.com (very beta!). Our goal is to create a competitive atmosphere around corporate responsibility, rewarding local businesses that are doing good by their customers and their community. By quantifying social responsibility and sending more customers to those businesses doing it the best, we can prove that doing good is good for business. Would love to tell you more about our venture and how we plan on changing local commerce and building better communities. - Matt Buchanan

Have you ever interviewed Lee and Sachi LeFever of CommonCraft.com? They're big (explanatory) thinkers. - Darren Barefoot

I hope you get a chance to see what we're up to at Minggl these days, I think you'd agree we are thinking big. - Marcus Irven

These are all great ideas. We'll have many of them on the SXSW show on Ustream: http://www.ustream.tv/sxsw -- this is going to be a lot of fun, the channel is being done by some very creative people/musicians (Peter Himmelman, for instance) and you'll hear more about it later in the week. - Robert Scoble

I'm developing a semantic social infrastructure for OpenID that interlocks the relationship graph and activity graph. Users control social identity and privacy for every situation, all while building and managing digital legacy. Our system turns every person, group, network and event into a portable domain that is semantically linked to all associated domains and semantic properties. Result: A social web that reflects our real lives. Would be happy to demo. - Paul Daigle

Robert - Thanks for tweeting about UStream Studios - You know I'm excited and you know why. Look forward to seeing you there and watching the justSignal Tracker (right side of link Robert put up) fly. - Brian Roy

Hi Tim. I agree with you about Saul. If you want to see him and many other really big thinkers speak, take a look at a conferece site I launched last night at http://i2i.xprize.org this is exactly what you are looking for Robert I'll bring you program at sxsw - Mark Krynsky

I'll be launching a Blog/Internet site focused on QR Codes <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...>. Destined to be the next big wave in mobile marketing and mobile advertising. Just look to Japan to see the potential <http://www.japanmarketingnews.com/2007...> - Roberto Ayala

You should check what the folks at Tarpipe http://tarpipe.com are doing. Big things in a technical way :) - Ricardo Vidal

Does thinking about big (tall) beers count? If so, I'm a 30-minute video for ya - 2 minutes of best beers talk and just 28 minutes for you and Rocky to provide a bit of filler :) - Patrick Jordan

You should check out @thepoint if you haven't yet. The founder and the CTO were there last year and are attending again. - Tim Letscher

@Mark Krynsky - wow your http://i2i.xprize.org site looks awesome!! nice work! - Susan Beebe

I'm a Venture Capitalist/Serial StartUp launcher in East Africa. If you aren't thinking outside of America these days, I question how big you are really thinking. If you'd like to attend my panel @ http://my.sxsw.com/events... - Jon Gosier

Jon: I'd love to meet you at SXSW, totally agree. - Robert Scoble

Hey Robert! Our Blellow beta is live and we'd love to give you a demonstration. We'll be at SxSWi, I look forward to meeting you! http://beta.blellow.com - Haggis (Sean Loyless)

Robert, indeed meet up with Jon. He can bring you up to speed with all things happening in and around Africa. - Meryn Stol

misterjt! tiffanybbrown! michellej! etc. etc. seriously though.. - Anna Lynn M.

I'm thinking big. - Pete Barry

Pete: then I want to meet you. Where, when? - Robert Scoble

I'm thinking Canadian. Is there anything bigger? - Chris Luckhardt

Fantastic! I'm in Austin. We don't have to wait for my next trip West to have coffee. Let me know what your schedule is. - Charlie

Chris, Texas is definitely bigger than Canada :-P - Jesse Stay

@juliegomoll is thinking big about the future of work over at LaunchPad Coworking - Michael Funk

Whrrl will make a big splash with some big thinking. come to our party: http://www.facebook.com/home... - Matty

I'm looking for people who are thinking big about work spaces, what will replace the cubicle, what the office environment will look like in a decade, how we'll be working and how that will impact offices (if we'll even have them). Help is appreciated. - Chris Stevenson

Todd Cochrane

Watching Tech Bloggers blog on their sites about politics is pretty stupid I have unsubscribed from 5

November 2, 2008 from Twitter - Comment - Like - Share

Eric D. Brown, @baratunde, Ambar Pansari and 10 other people liked this

Agreeeeeeed! - Joshua Schnell

73 more comments

disagreed. you found their blogs interesting before, but now a few errant posts on one of the most important elections our generation has ever seen has made you decide their content is no longer interesting? - Jeremy Toeman

I agree it's silly on commercial blogs but yeah, unsubscribing is pretty hardcore. - Zee.

Tech bloggers talking politics often gets very similar to movie stars talking politics. - Andrew Leyden

People who DON'T have a political opinion right now scare me. - Robert Scoble

This election is one of the most important in recent memory for the tech industry overall. If any tech blogger isn't telling you that right now they really aren't a good tech blogger. - Robert Scoble

I think what he's saying Robert is that he subscribed to tech blogs for tech & not politics. - Zee.

+1 Robert - well said. That means the either don't have a clue, don't really care, or are too ill informed to really make a decision = EPIC FAIL - Susan Beebe

I'd have to agree with Zee. If someone subscribes to a blog about bacon do they really care about what politics have to with bacon? Only if it was to outlaw bacon. BTW, I don't like bacon. - Mathew™ one of a kind

Zee: you can't separate tech from politics. Where did the Internet come from? Politics. Where does broadband policy come from? Politics. Where does Internet regulation come from? Politics. Where does university funding come from? Politics. Anyone who says tech and politics can be separated is uninformed and, worse, just wants to read press releases. Well, sorry, I'm going to tell you what I think. I'm not a press release regurgitator. - Robert Scoble

Mathew: if you subscribe to me you should expect more than tech. I'm a geek. I'm a blogger. I'm a human. And I have conversations with smart people. I haven't met a smart person lately who hasn't told me what they think about politics. - Robert Scoble

I see both sides of this. I started a new blog for politics when I realized a large amount of my social media content was being consumed with politics and the election right now as a way to try to find a middle ground. - Neal Jansons

Perhaps Robert has explained why I have gotten into these conversations and gotten animated about it. I normally just vote and yawn at political talk, and my behavior is confusing me. I'm pretty sure I know more about the candidates than I've ever known about any, and I didn't set out to learn anything. - MiniMage, sheeple of FF

Trust me Robert, anything from you I expect more then just the main topic at hand. - Mathew™ one of a kind

Politics is powerfully enwound with every aspect of technology. Smart people get this. - Sean McBride

So, basically, Only Politicians are allowed to express their opinions on politics? Movie stars and tech bloggers are not qualified somehow? I would like someone to explain to me how someone's career prevents them from having intelligent opinions about things besides that career. Anyone. Help me out. - Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF

+100 - Allen Stern

Robert, I personally subscribe to you because of who you are and because I love you - not really about tech for me...and you're not really a commercial blog either...so I'm not really speaking about you. But should Louis Gray for example started posting about politics frequently, i'd probably not be immensely pleased. (ps. just chucked in the i love to lighten the mood of the conversation) :) - Zee.

agreed Mathew. Plus... the internet isn't only american. It's also about knowing your audience. If you're audience is going to your site for personal opinion...then it's a little more feasible to give your political thoughts. If they're going for news/specialized information, then giving your opinion on something outside of that isn't ideal. - Joshua Schnell

Rah, of course not...but I'm saying and i'm going to put this in capitals so everyone can see...COMMERCIAL TECH BLOGGERS. Bloggers that have advertising on their blog and say they blog about tech. - Zee.

Hrm, I have ads and I say I blog about tech, but I'm not a commercial tech blogger. I kinda see where you might be going with that, though. I was mostly speaking to Andrew's comment above. Either you like a blogger or you don't. If they go "off topic" about a major historical event and that causes you to unsubscribe, I would assume you were not getting much out of that blog anyway. That was just the straw that broke the camels back. - Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF

Zee: I have advertising on my blog and I say I blog about tech, but, again, tech and politics are intertwined. Or did you forget the Microsoft anti-trust lawsuit? Or, did you forget that the candidates come to Silicon Valley to collect our money? Why should we just give the candidates money and not have anything to say? - Robert Scoble

I'm with Scoble. I use my blog to talk about issues that I believe my readers ought to be paying attention to. Talking about the candidates' positions on issues relating to tech seems worthwhile to me. Odd too that the original appeal of blogs that they were based on personal opinion and a personal voice, and now they are supposed to stay in prescribed channels? Part of the appeal of social media is the possibility of transforming how people interact and learn about issues. - Tim O'Reilly

I guess if Engadget started talking about politics I'd agree, but I don't see that as a real blog anymore. In my mind a real blog is a single voice of a person and anyone who doesn't have something to say about politics right now scares the heck out of me. - Robert Scoble

Robert, with all due respect... Scobleizer is about Scoble, not just tech ;) - Bastard Operator From FF

it depends, is the post about how politics is affecting an issue involving technology, or is the post about a political issue that has nothing to do with technology. The first one I have no problem with , the second I might just stop reading till after 11/4 , no reason to unsubscribe. - Kim Landwehr

Im with Scoble and tim and Zee here. - Roberto Bonini

I will give you that politics and tech are somewhat intertwined. But, that does not mean that if I reading a tech blog that I want to constantly see things about the election. As long as its about an event (i.e. The Microsoft anti-trust lawsuit) I'm ok, but if its just someone constantly talking about the election or something like that then its going too far. - Mathew™ one of a kind

Speaking of which, I just saw Tim O'Reilly post here. His post on Obama is one of the best-thought-out pieces from the tech industry about the choice we have to make this Tuesday. - Robert Scoble

I have to disagree with your Robert, a blog doesn't have to be just a single person, it can be as many people as you want. Besides, if Engadget didn't have a large group of writers they wouldn't be able to have as much content as they do. - Mathew™ one of a kind

Politics is so intertwined with everything. There is nothing it doesn't touch. So expect to see it everywhere. Unless you pay for the website service don't complain. This only happens every two years or at the very least every four. - CW™

Here's Tim O'Reilly's piece: http://radar.oreilly.com/2008... Great piece. - Robert Scoble

Slashdot posts political info all the time.. I don't see people crying over that. - CW™

Matthew: well, in Tim's case I've seen 99% tech in the past month and 1% politics. I think my blog is about the same. My FriendFeed, on the other hand, has had a lot more politics because I think it's important. - Robert Scoble

Imagine Germans in the high tech industry in the 1930s professing to be bored or irritated by politics and political subjects. Meditate on that image. - Sean McBride

Sean: IBM machines were used to build the databases of the Jews in Germany. You can BET that I would have said something about that, if I was writing in the 1930s. Exactly. Technology and politics are very closely combined. Not to mention that Silicon Valley is a railroad town (you can still see the final spike in our transcontinental railroad in Stanford's museum). Our whole industry got its start because of politics. For any tech blogger to try to distance him/herself from that would be absolutely wrong. - Robert Scoble

Thats great then. Ands honestly I wouldn't know as I don't read a lot of tech blogs and haven't noticed a problem. But, I just want to get people to see another POV. - Mathew™ one of a kind

Guys guys, i think is really pretty straight forward. If you're a commercial blogger (your blog is your main source of income) and you say that you blog about startups, webapps and emerging technology. I think it is fair to say that blogging about politics and anything aside from those three things is pretty stupid. If your blog is about **you** because you're a personality of some sort then yes you should be able to post about whatever you want & if people unsubscribe screw 'em. - Zee.

rambn: that's OK. I'm sick of the McCain dividers and name callers. Let's call it even. We weren't in charge the past eight years. - Robert Scoble

Everything is Politics, from the way you walk to the tax you pay. - Angelos Markos

Robert - you picked the perfect example to illustrate my point about Germany's high tech industry in the 1930s. High tech workers who think they can stick their heads in the sand with regard to politics cut quite a figure. - Sean McBride

Robert - P.S. I definitely don't want to dictate their political views. But I do expect them to be well-informed about political issues, especially those entwined with high tech, and to be able to discuss these issues in an intelligent way. - Sean McBride

and frankly, as much as I respect Tim O'Reilly - the "Why I Support Barack Obama" stuck out like a sore thumb..as it was from the company blog. Had it been from his own personal one (which i don't believe he has) I wouldn't have been surprised by it. - Zee.

Sean: yeah, I just visited the Holocaust Museum in Washington DC a few weeks ago and they had an IBM machine there and explained how it was used to build a database on all Germans. Demonstrates we always need to think about HOW our technology is being used by politicians. Speaking of which, if Obama wins I wonder who'll be the CTO he picks. Ed Felton is the favorite among geeks I talk with. - Robert Scoble

Zee: if you follow Tim's blog you'll see that is not just an "O'Reilly" blog but is also his personal blog. Oh, and heck, his name is on his company, so maybe they are one and the same? You think? - Robert Scoble

@Biran Norwood. Maybe have a read of the comments in this particular case before throwing that in? - Zee.

Naa I don't think Robert. It's the company blog no doubt about it...Yes he blogs on there, yes it says it's his blog...but it's not the same as your blog or any random joe's blog. - Zee.

rambn: well, when you say you are only sick of one side of the political debate, that sort of marks you as a supporter of the other side. If you were a Ron Paul supporter you would have pointed out you are sick of both sides. If you thought voting doesn't matter you would have said that. So, just what were you trying to say? - Robert Scoble

I only post about tech stuff, until my latest post about Prop 8 http://alpascual.com/blog... - al pascual

Zee - my impression is that high tech industry leaders overwhelmingly favor Obama over McCain. They find the culture of the current Republican Party to be alien and hostile to their own. As I recall, Google employees have been making financial contributions to Obama over McCain at a ratio of 24 to 1. Tim O'Reilly is expressing the views of the culture in which he is embedded (and helped... more... - Sean McBride

Zee: well, at the top it says "by Tim O'Reilly" -- and he makes it very clear he's speaking for himself in the piece, not for all his employees. I'm sure there's at least one or two McCain supporters there (my producer, for instance, is a McCain supporter so when i blog it's pretty clear I'm not blogging HIS opinion to you). - Robert Scoble

Interesting discussion. This is one of the reasons I'm glad I didn't pigeonhole my blog as a "writing" blog or an "author" blog (and I stay away from tech - that gets 8 hours of my workday already). I'm not much of a "personality" yet (I do HAVE one, I think), but it's a better fit for the mish-mash of thoughts I care to share on my blog. I'd hate to be...limited to one topic, and I can barely keep up with one blog - I don't want ten to express all the different facets of me. - Holly Jahangiri

Also, I wouldn't unsubscribe; I'd comment to the author. If they kept writing about topics that turned me off or seemed inappropriate to the audience at large, THEN I'd unsubscribe. - Holly Jahangiri

Oh, i'm not discussing who he supports here...that's nothing to do with it. It was just the fact that it was a political post. I think we can agree that O'Reilly is named after Tim O'Reilly but it is very much a tech media company now and he blogs on their company blog as Tim O'Reilly. It's not his blog the same way scobleizer.com's is yours. If Arrington wrote a post about why he supported McObama (whoever) then i'm certain there would be an uproar on techcrunch...personal blog would be a different story. - Zee.

I think the point being missed here is that if you have the attention of a slew of people, you can (or believe you can) do and say damn well anything you want. 'Smaller' bloggers may well sacrifice nontrivial loss of subscribers if their niche and focus is diverted. - abacab

My problem is with people like Dave Winer who I have followed for years despite his shrill Berkley political rantings. Yet the moment I made a single comment on one post (simply pointing out the author of an article he linked was incorrect) he made here on FF, he blocked me. So despite whatever insight he may have on Tech, which I value, the politics has greatly soured the experience. - John Rubier

Zee: I disagree with that. Tim's writings has always been personal and about what he cares about. Generally that's more on geeky smart people side of things, but I didn't mind it one bit because it was clear it was his thinking and it came with his byline on it. I didn't view that any differently than other executives speaking out on politics over the years (usually they support Republicans because of the tax advantages, but this year almost all of them have switched to the Democratic side of the ticket). - Robert Scoble

I respect and listen to tech experts who are experts on tech all year round. If you're all of a sudden going to become a political pundit, sorry, that respect doesn't just funnel over. - Shey, Jamaican of FF

John: that's just Dave. He stopped calling me (we talked almost every day for years) because I interviewed someone he didn't like and supported him. Personally I've blocked a few people this year for taking idiotic stances too. My entire life now is focused on having conversations with smart people, like we are having here. Sometimes people demonstrate they aren't smart and we get enough of that on Fox. No need to listen more here if they aren't willing to have a conversation. :-) - Robert Scoble

Shey: I never said you had to respect their opinions. But politics is part of the tech industry and it is important to cover. If you disagree with someone's opinions, seems to me you should state the case for what you believe. If your ideas are better, they will win in the marketplace. - Robert Scoble

It can't be said too often: fair, free and open debate is the heart and soul of functioning and healthy democratic societies. Let the best ideas win in the free marketplace of ideas. - Sean McBride

@Brian It's pathetic how a comment like "Maybe have a read of the comments in this particular case before throwing that in?" causes you to react like a little girl. - Zee.

It's about leadership - an industry commentator like scoble or oreilly needs to share their experience. If I want tech press releases, I'll subscribe to tech press releases. If I want to hear from a person, then I'll follow a person. I reserve the right to unsubscribe from the rabidly obsessed - whether talking about Microsoft or Palin, but that reflects a person that is not the enquiring commentator I want. - Alistair Nicholson

I specialise in Government IT. Policy affects schools - do you want your country competitive in 5, 8, 20 years? That is being determined right now. Policy affects research - will you have patents to underpin your industry? IP rights and downloading issues affect almost everything - vibrant industry or patent/music portfolio holders. So .. from your real people leaders do you want sugar-coated bits of news while the big issues of the day are ignored? Then don't subscribe to people who care - try Fox. - Alistair Nicholson

Oh .. and for the Bacon manufacturer comment. Do you think there are many large meat processing firms left that DON'T track politics (mostly local) - PETA, waste discharge, effluent, water charges, rates, payroll tax. The worker on the floor doesn't think about it, just as a sysadmin might not. If you want to play a higher role or loyalty to your industry - it matters. Up to you. - Alistair Nicholson

not a clue what Midol is Brian, but whatever the case - I hope you find time to grow up & review your original reply with regret one day soon because it is, without any doubt, pathetic. Blocked, au revoir. - Zee.

well, take this in context. Todd is quite conservative and I'm sure the bloggers he unsubbed from are not. I'd have a hard time with it, as myself, if I was surrounded by conservaties - so I can understand that perspective. fwiw, as conservatives go, Todd's also a pretty nice guy. - Marshall Kirkpatrick

The way this campaign has shaken out a lot of people are saying some very outlandish things. It is one thing to have a dialogue and agree to disagree.But I have heard some pretty Vile and Outlandish things come out of people I once thought were pretty level headed. It is as if people have simply lost their minds. If you treat your blog as a business then the last thing you want to do is piss off 50% of your readership which ever side of the fence your on. - Todd Cochrane

FWIW the original tweet was not pointed at Scoble as he has always covered a wide gambit of issues and I may agree to disagree on some issues he puts out but the commentary has been rational . The original tweet was directed at some blogs that I have been reading that have been commercially tech for a long time who have become pretty political these past few months posting commentary that was beyond inflammatory. - Todd Cochrane

Good God Todd Get over it already, when the "shit SO HITS THE FAN" as it has in the last eight years anyone not interested in political correction from the complete and utter failure of an admin to "DO RIGHT" I thought O'Reilly's piece was clear, succinct, I appreciated it. I think it is admirable. - Chris Darling

My perspective is a lot different, you have to remember I am both a Iraq and Afghanistan vet now retired. I am not doom and gloom about the economy my company (no longer startup) is in the black having had an amazing fiscal year with no slow down in site. We don't have venture guys to worry about shutting us down as we are well into the black and can survive a long time if income stopped today. We don't need a government handout and we really don't want to pay another 7-11% in taxes each year. - Todd Cochrane

The problem is that injecting your politics into a non political setting is, quite frankly, kinda rude and off putting. I unsubscribed to a show I loved in the past because the hosts just couldn't resist validating each others political views on many shows (this was 2 years ago BTW). Currently I will remove friends from Twitter who can't seem to resist telling me when their candidate of choice farts. - Mike James

I know what you mean... At first, I felt uneasy about tech people talking politics. Namely Gruber freaked me out. But seeing the well tempered Tim O'Reilly coming out of the closet changed my mind. Saying I belong to "Group A and not Group B" is showing profile. Of course, by now we know: stating your political opinion as a techie is not such a risky move -- unless you're a Republican techie: Tech people are 99% liberal. Why? You can be progressive and conservative at the same time. - Oliver Reichenstein

Todd, considering your political tweets last week, I wonder if you unsubbed because they got political or because you disagreed. Regardless, I'll take your advice. - Nerraux

Tweeting on my personal tweet account is one thing. I have no issues putting political views on my personal blog in fact I have in the past but I don't post political commentary on my tech site or in my podcast - Todd Cochrane

Tim O'Reilly

Comment on: Patents: GraphOn Sues Google for Connecting Databases to the Internet - http://www.readwriteweb.com/archive...

August 18, 2008 from FriendFeed MT Plugin - Comment - Like - Share

Can't believe the patent office allowed this. Someone ought to talk to Rob McCool. As I recall, his original design for CGI in the NCSA web server in 1993 was to allow the web server to talk to a database. Certainly everyone was doing it long before these guys filed their patents. - Tim O'Reilly from FriendFeed MT Plugin

Frederic

Patents: GraphOn Sues Google for Connecting Databases to the Internet - http://www.readwriteweb.com/archive...

August 18, 2008 from ReadWriteWeb - Comment - Like - Share

Tim O'Reilly

Ray Stevens "The Pirate Song" by Marty Berk - http://www.youtube.com/watch...

June 27, 2008 from YouTube favorites - Comment - Like - Share

This isn't from me. It is from some other tim o'reilly - Tim O'Reilly

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