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Trish R › Comments
Aw, Facebook seems to think I can make it better for Anika. Please, Anika, how can I make Facebook better for you? SRSLY, what is this? It was under the "suggestions" section. - http://skitch.com/faithx5...
Kevykev, Caroline, Brook White and 14 other people liked this
Can you make FaceBook better for me please? I hate that freaking site, and too many awesome people are switching over to it!
- Joe Pierce
Doesn't Facebook use people you are friends with in advertisements? If I recall correctly, there was a dust up a few months ago about a guy who saw an ad for finding eligible singles featuring a photo of his wife.
- Akiva Moskovitz
:| DEAR FACEBOOK, STOP DOING THAT
- Anna Haro
Yes. Unless you opt out of it, Facebook can use your profile photo in ads.
- Spidra Webster
If facebook wanted to get me to click on personal ads, they'd send them to me with my picture on them!
- Joe Pierce
It also wants me to reconnect with old school friends who have have hidden in a group called "I'd don't want to talk about". :S
- Faraz Mullick
rrrrrrRRRRRRRRAGE!
- Micah Wittman
This isn't really an ad, though. It's in the same section as the "you may know this person" blurbs. I just had to laugh that they thought that Facebook was bad for Anika and somehow my sending her a message would make it better.
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
Jandy, I see. I'll remove two Rs.
- Micah Wittman
Facebook wants to make sure Anika gets lots of attention. They told me a few days ago that I needed to write on her wall.
- Trish R
All of a sudden...push out and then pretty lights from the city...the Empire State..yeah...that another light
- Bill Heslin
POKE HER! AND TAKE PICS PLZKTHXBYE
- Glen Campbell, B.A.
Trish, really? That's funny! Apparently they're very concerned that she have a good experience with their service!
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
facebook is such a weird space.
- edythe
For only the price of coffee per day...
- Josh Haley
from iPhone
Me (talking to Adrian): How dare I say that. Alton: Derrick? I love Derrick. Ilia: Why does he say 'love'? It's ' I like'. Alton: Oh. I *like* Derrick. I *like* Poppy. A lot. A lot. I LOVE dinosaurs. Ilia: I guess it's okay to love dinosaurs. Me & Adrian: [stare at each other confused at turn of conversation]
Rodfather, edythe, Ladybug Heather and 15 other people liked this
Budding grammar police?
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
I thought it funny my son heard 'Derrick' when I said 'dare I'.
- Anika
*shrugs* Your kids are freakazoidical.
- Adrian
I love your kids.
- Trish R
<3
- Yolanda
Everybody loves Derrick!
- Mellissa Jane
awesome. thank you.
- edythe
Apparently it's the time of year when people I knew in high school post photos of their kids' deer kills on Facebook. Hunting is fine, but I don't need to see a carcass staring at me when I go to that site.
Jessie, PENGUIN: MAJOR CAPS LOCK, Jennifer Dittrich and 5 other people liked this
Hey, at least you only see pictures of them. I walked past a carcass hanging from a tree for a couple of weeks here.
- laura x
oh my...............
- VAL D.
Hey, we have the same friends list! Seriously, my FB wall looks the same way.
- Trish R
My cousin posted a picture such as this on FB, then I visited his parent's house where they had deer chili simmering in a crock pot. Blah. I prefer my meat in cellophane.
- Jess
I see them hanging around outside and tied down on the roofs of cars, too. that seems normal this time of year. I just didn't expect the first thing I saw on facebook today to be a dead deer.
- Katy S
A question: Do you say "dressing" or "stuffing"? And where are you from?
Yolanda, Jennifer Dittrich, rowlikeagirl and 10 other people liked this
Well, they're different things, too me.
- Anika
Stuffing. Seattle.
- Rochelle
Stuffing comes in a box. Dressing is what we have on Thanksgiving; it's made with cornbread and celery and doesn't go inside the turkey. I'm from Georgia. :)
- Laura B.
Stuffing. I got it from my mom who grew up in Massachusetts.
- Michelle Martinez
We say dressing. My family's from Louisiana.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Akiva says it's only stuffing if it's baked in the bird. Otherwise, it's dressing. He's from Texas.
- Rochelle
From Missouri: We say both and were ignorant of the difference.
- SAM
Yeah, dressing and stuffing are separate entities to me too. Stuffing is stuffed inside. Dressing dresses the outside. EDIT: from UK.
- Mark H
Stuffing. Currently in Nevada. Going back to Cali in a couple of months. My immediate family is/was not from this country, so when they started celebrating Thanksgiving after they came to California, they heard stuffing.
- Helen Sventitsky
Dressing - Texas
- Jeremy
I have a theory that the difference is regional. I suspect the dislike of the word "stuffing" is a Bible Belt thing.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Harvey, I agree with this theory. I've been in Seattle for nearly 28 years and have never once heard someone native to here call it dressing.
- Rochelle
As far as I can remember, my family has always called it stuffing. We're New York Jews.
- josh neff, Fun Dip of FF
Stuffing - dressing is something you do with your clothes to cover yourself up (from UK)
- WorldofHiglet
I wonder if us southerners think "stuffing" has a sexual connotation. :)
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
you americans are crazy. stuffing is for the inside of a poultry, dressing is some sort of gravy or sauce for on top of something (eg a salad)
- Snipergirl
Well, Snipergirl, there's dressing, and then there's dressing.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
A salad is considered dressing? Hmm. I don't think I've ever heard (that is,in Seattle) any *food* ever called dressing. Dressing is what you do with clothes in the morning and that's about it.
- Rochelle
@rochelles no a salad dressing is what you put on salad
- Snipergirl
I think you mean SAUCE.
- Rochelle
Snipergirl salad dressing is different from dressing (mush made from cornbread).
- Anika
When I put my clothes on, it's dressing. When I stuff the turkey, it's stuffing. Oh,and I'm a Midwestener. My mom used to make oyster stuffing for Thanksgiving. So good.
- Sarah June
And even here in the States, depending on region, salad dressing can mean different things. Here in CA it means like ranch, Italian, Thousand Island, but in the midwest, it's some mayonnaise mixture made with relish that people put on sandwiches.
- Anika
stuffing
- VAL D.
Long Island ,NY
- VAL D.
I stuff a bird. Mind you, being from England, that certainly has more than one meaning.
- Ian May
Stuffing. We get it out of a box, but don't cook it inside the turkey (personally, I don't even eat it anyway). I'm familiar with the term dressing, but have never used it in this particular situation. I'm from Massachusetts.
- PENGUIN: MAJOR CAPS LOCK
@faboomama @rochelles @ha3rvey while I do admit to understanding that this is a conversation about American English only, I would probably alert you to the fact that most people in the world who speak English actually speak British English or a close variant of it (including Canadians funnily enough)- thus to many people outside the US, dressing is a perfectly valid term for what you put on salad, and is never used to denote your cornbread thingy
- Snipergirl
though i must admit that the cornbread thingy sounds OM NOM NOM NOM
- Snipergirl
To be even more pedantic, not all dressings/stuffings have cornbread. :)
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
stuffing here as well (Washington), though I do here dressing now and then. And in my circles, we rarely have cornbread stuffing, just to be difficult. ;)
- holly
Which is why they're different words to me. Dressing is made with cornbread (or any bread really), but stuffing is mostly meat-based and goes inside the bird.
- Anika
They are two different things, like Anika said, but mostly, I eat cornbread dressing. Mmmm. With cranberry sauce on the side. Oh and turkey and mashed potatoes and gravy and green beans and...
- Carmen
Just to blow my own horn, I made a vegetarian Thanksgiving dinner with roasted acorn squash with a chestnut and craisin stuffing and mushroom gravy. It was SO GOOD.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
As someone in the midwest, I don't think I've ever called the stuff I put on sandwiches dressing. I wonder where they eat that stuff. Hmmmm. I do call anything I put on a salad, salad dressing.
- Sarah June
Actually, I was thinking about that, most of my family who are from the south originally, but live in the midwest now, call *any* spread to put on sandwiches "salad dressing". I wonder if that's old Southern thing.
- Anika
Maybe. The concoction sounds interesting. :-) I'm kind of plain person when it comes to sandwiches. Usually just mayo. And Ha3rvey, that sounds wonderful.
- Sarah June
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki... It is gagalicious.
- Anika
Stuffing, because eating it makes me feel stuffed.
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
Anika, I thought we were friends. I can't believe you introduced Miracle Whip into one of my food threads. *BLOCKED*
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
*shuddder* not Miracle Whip, I think they have the name trademarked. No, this: http://friendfeed.com/fabooma...
- Anika
I thought I remembered a sandwich spread under the Miracle Whip brand name. My google-fu fails me right now, though.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Ha3rvey, I love you. However, as I have said before, I am a Miracle Whip kind of girl. :P That said, the jar of MW in my kitchen does call itself "dressing," but not "salad dressing." When I was in the UK, I put "salad cream" on my sandwiches.
- Laura B.
Okay, 'salad cream' just gives me the heebie-jeebies. LOL
- Anika
Salad cream: http://www.heinzsaladcream.co.uk/ Not exactly like Miracle Whip, but it will do in a pinch.
- Laura B.
Stuffing. New England.
- Sarah is Novembery
from iPhone
we use both.
- Nathalie, Dreamer of FF
Stuffing, I'm from all over the US (mom & dad are too, although the recipe is southern), but we always put it in the bird, so stuffing fits. And it's not meat-based - it's Wonder bread based, with bacon, celery, and poultry seasoning - yummy. In New Orleans, when they ask if you want your po boy dressed, they mean, do you want lettuce, tomato, mayo, etc., which makes sense since the po boy would be almost naked without it.
- Cassandra
Like Rochelle said, we call it stuffing in Seattle and I was born and raised here. My husband is from MN and he calls it dressing. To me, dressing is for salad. Or what you do when you put on clothes. ;-)
- Annie Anderson
Stuffing. Rural southeastern Ohio
- Michael Hocter
It's dressing. It's only stuffing when it's inside the bird. (Texas)
- Trish R
stuffing in nyc, dressing in atlanta
- Allen Stern
stuffing. Kentucky
- Amber, Random Time Lord
STOVE TOP
- Andrizzle Gizzle
"dressing"... Tennessee originally... grew up in St. Louis
- MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS
Stuffing. FL. Dressing goes on a salad.
- Alix Whitmire
from iPhone
Stuffing even if it never enters the bird. Baltimore. And in B'more you gotta have sauerkraut with turkey.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
Gimme the sauerkraft. Stuff the turkey.
- Ian May
I say stuffing, but that's my Brooklyn roots. Actually, I say both since dressing is something completely different: Salad sauce, or stuffing that didn't actually get stuffed anywhere. (don't like dressing)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF
STUFFING!
- Jim Hearts FF
I say stuffing regardless of whether it was cooked in the bird. Born and raised in LA, CA, USA.
- Spidra Webster
stuffing. rural canada.
- T. Brent, technopeasant
I go back and forth.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Cornbread dressing in Texas
- Greg GuitarBuster
It's stuffed in a bird, but comes out dressing.....although if you bake it in a dish, it's still dressing....New York state....English heritage.
- Bonnie Foster
Michigan: I say stuffing, but I've heard both.
- R1CC1
I say stuffing (born in the USA</springsteen>), my wife says dressing (born in Canada). This topic came up for the first time this year and I'm not sure how - I've been living with Thanksgiving in October for over 15 years now :)
- Micah Wittman
Dressing goes on salad. Stuffing goes in a turkey. Montreal, QC
- Louis Simoneau
Michigan born and bred (family from Mississippi/Tennessee). We personally say dressing and it's never something that goes inside the bird. What goes in there is 'stuffing'.
- Holli B.
Stuffing, though "bread dressing" is understood (but we'll look at you strangely if you say dressing without the bread). Mich.
- Michael W. May
Stuffing, Washington, DC area
- Shevonne
Stuffing, Indianapolis, IN area
- Harold
Dressing, from the Hoosier State
- Michelle
Dressing, if it is off of the stove, Stuffing if it is out of the bird - Olympia, WA
- Jennifer Dittrich
Harold, I wonder if I called it dressing because my parents are from the south. Interesting.
- Michelle
Stuffing, from NY
- Mary Carmen
Yes. I'm from Texas. :D
- Yolanda
Already feeling guilty for leaving town for Thanksgiving and the family guilt trips have barely started. My mother can nag by telepathy.
Jason Huebel, Ha3rvey (not Akiva) and Anika liked this
My MIL did that one year for Thanksgiving and Christmas when I had to work. Wife and kids gave in and went to visit them. I was alone on Thanksgiving and Christmas that year. I really learned how important I was to my in-laws that year.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
same, it seems like other members of the family are excused but not us.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Last year was the first Thanksgiving EVER that I have done something other than spend it with my family. It was empowering. So, I'm doing it again this year. I'm sure I will pay the price when my son follows my example in a few years and dumps me for the holidays. ;-)
- Trish R
We stayed here for Christmas one year due to some health problems, and my family came to visit us. It was wonderful. A youth choir came to our church and went caroling in the neighborhood on Christmas Eve. My wife and I made gallons of mulligatawny soup and cornbread for everyone. My family ate with us at church, and a bunch of people helped us clean up. It was the best Christmas ever.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Aw Harvey that is great.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
We've gone back to Kansas City twice for Thanksgiving since we've been married. Adrian's mom acted like it was treason to do so since he's an only child.
- Anika
My in-laws lay the heavy guilt on my wife about the holidays. I try to be understanding, but then I remember that these are the same people who refused to come to our wedding.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
My holidays have been controlled by my in-laws since the wedding. I never see my family on Thanksgiving and don't see them at Christmas until the 26th. The one year we went to a wedding in my hometown over Thanksgiving week, they just assumed we would spend Thanksgiving day with them and then go to the wedding. They were appalled when this didn't happen. They did attend our wedding, but my FIL stormed out of the room the day he was told we were getting married.
- Alan Simpson
never had the guilt trip thing sometimes all of us could not get together on the said day so and till this day I consider my holiday when I can be with family on any date...
- VAL D.
My siblings have missed Thanksgiving before but I never have. Since I am not married, everyone in my family assumes I have nothing better to do.
- Trish R
i hear you Trish
- VAL D.
Christian (Simply X) and Anika liked this
You posted this accidentally online. LMAO
- Anika
?? I meant to post it on twitter.
- Trish R
No, I meant people can see this. You admitted it. I was making a joke.
- Anika
I know, I'm even kinda grossing myself out by thinking about it.
- Trish R
I thought I knew it all...............now at 60 I knew nothing back then and I also thought what did my parents know...........they knew alot believe me..............now with my kids who are in their 30s they finally say Mom you were right....:)
- VAL D.
I'm annoyed because I've been watching my Thanksgiving flight all week and the seat next to me was empty. Today, it's shaded out as occupied. BOO.
PENGUIN: MAJOR CAPS LOCK, Harold and Anika liked this
Witchy Witch. (Now get off my back pea!)
Carmen, Nicholas Kreidberg, tinypants - Hagitha of FF and 16 other people liked this
aww. so cute! ... but you bring this upon yourself. fyi.
- pea ♥ fierce as a woozle
trick or treat
- Trish Haley
she must like living in FL then. an endless supply of snakes for all her concoctions. next you'll be posting photos of newts.
- pea ♥ fierce as a woozle
Cute x 1000!!!!
- Trish R
@pea here ya go: http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- Carlos Ayala
Of course you already have one. You, sir, are too good.
- pea ♥ fierce as a woozle
But also, eek. NO.
- pea ♥ fierce as a woozle
:-))
- Anna Haro
cuuuuuute
- Carmen
Mary Carmen, Helen Sventitsky, Trish R and 3 other people liked this
Look, It's like this. my hardship is so bad, I live in a hole in the ground (with 25 others). It IS a pissing contest. You see, when one of the group takes a piss and the wind is blowing... you get the picture? It's very traumatic. Well, I've got to get my own back on these filthy bastards, so I wait until the wind blows in their direction. That relieves the stress...
- Ian May
Wrote a song about it. Wanna hear it? Here it go . . .
- Trish R
My stress and trauma and hardship are really quite minor by comparison to, well, pretty much anybody, but they're MINE I tells ya, ALL MINE! muahahahaaaaa
- Slippy "Threadsbane" Lane
On our way to the Texas RenFest. Jousting, baudy jokes and songs, fried ice cream and turkey legs. Mmmmmmm...
Mellissa Jane, Trish R, aden (yeah you heard me) and Heather Solos liked this
Man, I could have gone this weekend too! My friend had an extra pass and all her friends bailed on her. But it's our monthly game. Have fun!
- aden (yeah you heard me)
That sounds like fun, I love the RenFest!
- Trish R
So (Americans), what are your Thanksgiving day plans? Traveling? People coming to visit? Are you looking forward to the holiday?
Nia, imabonehead, edythe and 25 other people liked this
Probably traveling to family, just not sure which side yet. And I do look forward to being with family. It's usually fairly low-key. I miss seeing my family.
- Sarah June
Most of the kids are coming home. In-laws are coming. Always interesting! Should be good.
- Anne Bouey
not sure what I am doing .....thinking of making a duck
- VAL D.
dinner with the fam (they're all here in town). low-key and I like it that way.
- holly
I'm in charge of all of the food. Multiple relatives, friends of the family. Minimal travel for me and the kittehs.
- Katy S
A duck sounds good Val.
- Sarah June
Probably heading to one of my bros
- Rodfather
hanging at home, maybe making dinner for a friend. Anyone else in Tucson orphaned for the holiday? :) (this all assumes that recovery from dental stuff next Thursday goes well and I'm eating solid food by Thanksgiving).
- ÉllbeeÇee
I'm having low-key stuff with my parents - my mom has surgery on that Monday, and if all goes to plan she'll be home that day. If not, we'll hang out with her up in her room and do dinner another night. She has mentioned at least three times she is happy she isn't the one cooking this year :)
- Jennifer Dittrich
I'll be smoking a turkey and all that other stuff. Then visiting the MIL, then the annual Trans-giving/birthday party at friend's house.
- Anika
I'm filling out my time off request as we speak, seeing as one of my bosses is taking off the entire week. I'll probably do something for some of my local orphaned students (especially the international students who we have to inform what Thanksgiving is) and not much else.
- Derrick
Derrick, you can come hang out with us in Altadena if you're not doing anything later that evening. That's usually fun.
- Anika
Altadena is my old stomping ground! I lived there when I was in school. We'll see how things shape up. Thanks for the invite. :)
- Derrick
Going to my parents' house. It's not a big deal for us since we have a small family. And since I don't eat turkey, the meal isn't really anything special for me (yay, green beans and a salad).
- Rochelle
spending the day with the family i spent the day with last year, only this year my friend, their wife and mother, is dead. so it's bittersweet. last year's thanksgiving was the last good time I spent with her. the closer we get to the holidays the harder it is, on them especially of course. ack! sorry to be a downer.
- Sarah is Novembery
Going to San Antonio to Joel's parents house. Cardeen is flying in.
- Michelle Martinez
going home to my parents. it's low-key and and on the small side, for us. which means 15-20 people and tons of food after about half the family does the turkey trot.
- Katie
Spending it alone again. I'm moving back to LA in early Dec and I don't have enough $ for it to make sense for me to jet down there just for T-giving. I wish Trader Joe's still carried Cantella's turkey sausage with cranberries because that's a really simple way to get those flavors. Not sure what I'll make to celebrate yet. I should probably focus on actually giving thanks.
- Spidra Webster
Making cornish game hens for a few of my orphan friends in the area and my sister. It'll be small, but festive. Then on Saturday, all of my friends in the area are gathering for a second Thanksgiving, with turkey and tri-tip on the menu. YUM.
- Cassandra
We (the SO and I) are having our usual guests (a couple & their 10yr old daughter) plus possibly two more. We are getting our usual fried turkey from Popeye's, and making the fixings. Since we are having more I get to make a ham too. (I am thinking Alton Brown's Dr. Pepper ham) It's a very laid back day, we usually get a RPG going, or watch movies. I always look forward to it.
- aden (yeah you heard me)
Flying up to Oakland to visit family in Walnut Creek/Alamo area. Might do the city for my birthday that weekend. Then driving home Sunday
- Katie: Witch Of The West
Driving to exotic Dayton
- RAPatton
I'll be away until Thanksgiving. Then, Mr and kids at home for traditional dinner. Oldest daughter has to work that night at Old Navy. When did THAT happen?
- R1CC1
I'll be with my parents for Thanksgiving.
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
Traveling, but only a few hours up the road to Fort Worth. Spend a few days with my in-laws, who are fantastically good company. Big meal on the day itself at my brother in-law's place. He's a champion at doing the turkey in peanut oil.
- Patrick Jordan
Traveling to visit my in-laws. I'm still trying to decide what I should cook. I'm settled on mac-n-cheese, oatmeal-coconut pie, and some kind of cake. Not sure what else. Maybe a standing rib roast? (Probably not. They only eat roast beef well done. :(
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Tell me more about this oatmeal coconut pie, harv.
- Derrick
D, I got the recipe from a cannister of Kroger store brand oatmeal. The flavor reminds me of a pecan pie (without the pecans). IIRC, it's got oatmeal, coconut, corn syrup, brown sugar, white sugar, eggs, and salt. It's surprisingly good. I usually substitute maple syrup for most of the corn syrup so that it won't be cloyingly sweet. If I remember when I get home tonight, I'll send it to you.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Oatmeal-coconut pie sounds unusual but good.
- Spidra Webster
Popeye's makes a fried turkey for T-giving? *perks ears up*
- Spidra Webster
Spidra, "unusual" is a very good word for it. Everyone who has tried it liked it. I'm trying to remember if it has vanilla in it. I think every good dessert has vanilla.
- Ha3rvey (not Akiva)
Sounds good. Maybe I'll bust one out for the orphans, Harvey. And yes, Spidra. I think they call it a "cajun" fried turkey, but it's fully cooked. I should order one in case people stop by through the weekend. The picture here is horrible (hint hint, Popeye's, I freelance), but here's a link: http://popeyes.com/turkey.php
- Derrick
Our plans are up in the air right now. Normally, my wife's parents would come to see us but my FIL is being prepped to have his lung removed after a lung cancer diagnosis. We might go to them, but only if her mom doesn't think having company will be too stressful. I know it's not a cheerful answer, but that's life right now.
- Alan Simpson
ThxGiving with the Fam, Wife, Kiddo(s) and possibly one of the Ex-wives.
- ‘-.-’ Tutivillus Grift
I will hopefully be able to get to San Diego for the afternoon..pig out on Thanksgiving Filipino style celebration
- Anna Lynn M.
Hosting my annual orphan Thanksgiving for all my friends who either have no family, live too far or who just don't hang with their family.
- Leslie Poston
Dr. Pepper ham? That sounds good. And I'm impressed with all of you who host a day for people without somewhere else to go. That's so nice!
- Sarah June
No holiday for me, so no travel and no family. Still, might try cooking a turkey on the grill this year.
- Steven Perez
I'm not sure. Often we do Thanksgiving with Ben's family and I look forward to it a lot. This year (as with the last two) they are trying to combine our families, so we'll see. I love my family but the dynamic for Thanksgiving has never been quite right with us. I am also thinking of having some people over that weekend for post-Thanksgiving meals so that I get to play hostess.
- joey
Going to my parents house and helping my mother cook. Maybe bring some wine with me. I don't think I have the kids this year, so I am glad to have my family with me cause I usually get sad.
- Shevonne
Parents, Parents-in-Law, Sister, Aunt-in-Law descend upon us ... FOR A WEEK! Woohoo! (luckily everyone really likes everyone else and we all get along well) (and I have enough comp time that I'll have the week off!) (woo again!)
- Aaron the Librarian
Having a meal of some sort with friends. I'd love to go home, but it's too far to travel for too short a time.
- laura x
We had our big holiday meal (so far I've cooked 3 turkeys), we'll be joining my mom and stepfather.
- Heather Solos
Doing the family dinner tradition, but then Mom and I are escaping for a few days after. Booked a few day trip to Amish country...(this should be interesting). Heading to Lancaster PA from NJ. Getting away from our busy lives and just bringing it down to farm markets, craft shows, and basically getting away...I'm very excited about it actually...Love spending time, One on One with my Mom.
- Bill Heslin
My ex is swiping my kid again (it's supposed to be my year with her) so I'm gonna be at home, watching the cowboys play, eating my turkey sandwich, doing shots of cranberry sauce and gravy, crying into my Stella Artois beverage of choice. Woo to the mudderfuggin' Hoo!
- Morgan Haley
Wanna go to Amish country and eat Shoo fly pie Morgan?: LOL
- Bill Heslin
OH and left out...gonna visit some breweries while there also :)
- Bill Heslin
We're going to New Orleans. Can't wait!
- Trish R
I have unpaid furlough day Wednesday, holiday Thursday and Friday, and then the weekend off. I don't even like turkey. I hope to hang out with my grownup kids at some point.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
turkey day LA meetup?
- Morgan Haley
We head up north to Santa Barbara and Pismo Beach to get away from family, on Thanksgiving and the week following, to charge up the batteries for Christmas, family, shopping, cooking, etc. ;)
- Bonnie Foster
headng to Charleston SC ... for a vaca ,, and having Thanksgiving in the Isle of Palm ...
- johnpiercy
Lunchtime TG meal with Dave's family, after which I will be hauling arse to cook for TG dinner at my house. Luckily grilling a turkey only takes a few hours...
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
3 friends and I will spend time at a local rescue mission serving meals. Give back in small ways.
- Steve
Passing out meals to those in need. +1 to Steve.
- Joe
SIL and fam are coming - I think - they'll have been here for the funeral so I hope they're coming back as planned. And my brother and his wife - my other SIL - will come for their second meal of the day, along with my father. Daughter Sarah, age 19, will be in charge of the kitchen; I'll be sous-chef. Menu will be more contemporary than we could have had in previous years, I'll bet.
- MaryB, BrandingBroadOfFF
from iPhone
The parents are still overseas so it will be Thanksgiving (and Christmas) with the in-laws this year. Mother-in-law is cooking this time (as opposed to the last two years where we just went out to eat). She can throw down in the kitchen so it should be good. I miss my Mom's Thanksgiving meals though.
- Got Love For DB™?
Turkey and all of the fixens' at our house. My parents and the in laws are coming over.
- Jeff P. Henderson
Your parents and in-laws intermingle and your house doesn't explode? Amazing.
- Got Love For DB™?
Thanksgiving, Denmark-style again this year, though we're doing it the weekend before since there is no Thanksgiving here. Also using it to celebrate my darling husband's 30th year gracing the earth. Seems feeding people good food, complete with lots of hygge, helps break down boundaries in any country. It may not be noble, but it's going to be fun. :D
- Bette Cooper
Before Thanksgiving I've got seven togas to sew, to cater the party they are for (60 people), and try to squeeze in a birthday. I havent even considered Thanksgiving...I've got time, right?
- Shannon
We don't celebrate :)
- ★ Soner Gönül
earlier it was Scoble who dominated my feed now it's you Derrick, and guess what last night you were in my dream and i said something funny to you and you held your hand for high five :) (i was viewing webcam of my friend the other night and we wrote something (an emoticon ) together and he held out his hand for high five) dreams are an amalgam and colors spread as if an art piece is under process
- ffcode
If someone tried to pay me in gum instead of cash I would hit them with a hammer.
Anthony K. Valley ©, Andrizzle Gizzle, Trish R and pea ♥ fierce as a woozle liked this
One of the dumbest commercials EVER.
- Trish R
I dunno. I really like gum.
- cecily
If they pay you with cash you can buy gum, and soda.
- Joe Pierce
And a hammer.
- Trish R
Happy 4th birthday to the sweetest, funniest, cutest & zaniest little man, I know. Happy BIrthday Alton! - http://www.flickr.com/photos...
Gajamoo, nakachi, Michael W. May and 48 other people liked this
aw it's babby's birthday!
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Happy Birthday Alton!
- Michelle Martinez
Happy Birthday, Alton, you future heartbreaker!
- Trish R
Happy Birthday Alton!
- aden (yeah you heard me)
Happy birthday, Alton! I hope you have a great day! <3
- pea ♥ fierce as a woozle
Happy Birthday Alton!
- Charlotte M
Alton, Isabella sends many smooches. We hope you have a very Happy Birthday!
- Carlos Ayala
Happy Birthday, Big Mr. 4 Years Old!
- vicster
Happy Birthday birthday dude! 4... wow that's old.
- Adrian
Awwwww.... Happiest of happy birthdays!
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
Happy Birthday little man!
- Laura Norvig
Happy birthday!
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
Happy birthday! - why have you left him alone with the dishes??? :)
- Lars Clausen
;) That was an installation at the museum. The kids loving running through it.
- Anika
My grandson is the same age as Alton, they are a world of fun!!! :)
- Lars Clausen
awwwww...CUTE ALTON HAPPY BIRTHDAY!
- matmazelange
Woohoo!!! Happy Birthday!
- Bren, Photophobe
from iPhone
Happy Birthday, he-who-has-the-glorious-hair!! :) You're such a cutie!!
- Her Lindsay-ness
Happy Birthday, Alton!
- Anne Bouey
Happy Bday, Lil Man!!! Gawd, he's so adorable!!! x_x
- Anna Haro
Happy birthday, Alton!
- Laura B.
Happy 4th birthday!!! Yipee!
- @CrystalinaB
Happy Birthday, Alton! :-D
- Kol Tregaskes
Happy Bday little man!
- Mark Krynsky
GoogleWave Invites - I HAZ THEM. A motherload. Leave email address here. Thankyou. - http://mona.posterous.com/googlew...
Her Lindsay-ness, goldielocks (Laura), James Myatt and 5 other people liked this
What's up, LG!
- Mona Nomura
from Posterous
Hi Mona!
- Louis Gray
:)
- Susan Beebe
can I dump the addy here? don't have a posterous account and I don't want to link it to either my facebook or my twitter account. :)
- alphaxion
Sent.
- Mona Nomura
Hi there Mona!
- Niki Costantini
ta muchly :D
- alphaxion
Heeeeey Niki!!!!
- Mona Nomura
from IM
loads? i only got 20.. what gives?
- CoreyTess Trujillo
No idea. I had like 50ish.
- Mona Nomura
can I have one from here? ******canceled by the antispam service ******
- Marcello Del Bono
Sorry - I'm all out :(
- Mona Nomura
:(
- Marcello Del Bono
Marcello, I still have about 10 left, I added you. (I had a bunch, too, for some reason) Anyone else wanna piggyback on Mona's thread and I"ll add them? :-)
- Trish R
Thanks a lot Trish!!!!
- Marcello Del Bono
Sharp-toothed shark acts as midwife - http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz...
Anna Haro, Iván Abrego and Victor Ryden liked this
Visitors to Kelly Tarlton's Underwater World were stunned to see one shark give another shark an impromptu caesarean section. Staff were initially dubious when visitors came running to tell them there were baby sharks spilling from a wound in a female school shark's stomach - courtesy of a large bite by another shark. But they found a female with a large gaping stomach wound and four babies swimming in the tank.
- Trish R
from Bookmarklet
@jaymartinez I keep debating whether to buy amazon prime for the holidays and wonder if I'll get my money's worth but I'm sure I will.
Rochelle liked this
DO IT! We order little things from them all the time (shampoo and conditioner, razor refill blades, etc.) because the product itself is cheaper and the shipping is free. So worth it.
- Rochelle
ZOMG, I can't even begin to count how much I've saved using Amazon Prime.
- Derrick
That's why I think it will be worth it for me. I can order things I wouldn't order otherwise because of the shipping cost. Plus you don't have to hit $25 to get free shipping.
- Trish R
Bear Creek Country Kitchens Tortilla Soup Mix - http://www.amazon.com/Bear-Cr...
This mix makes great tortilla soup if you don't have time for homemade but everyone else likes it, too. Every store around here is out of it.
- Trish R
from Bookmarklet
After the Bird, Everything Else Is Secondary - http://www.nytimes.com/2009...
Iván Abrego, imabonehead, RAPatton and 2 other people liked this
"I was deep into a description of the heritage turkey I had ordered for Thanksgiving, a real beauty that spent nine months running free in a field. I shared that I was feeling conflicted about whether to brine it or stuff it. I opened up. I was vulnerable. Then my colleague, Julia Moskin, made her flip little comment. “Nobody really cares about the turkey,” she said. “It just has to be good enough.” I bit my lip. I tamped down the urge to yell, “I know you are but what am I?” and run from the room in tears. Then I decided to show her how wrong she was. We would prepare Thanksgiving dinner together, her on the side dishes and me on the bird. Then we’d see."
- Derrick
from Bookmarklet
I don't know. I love turkey... but the other stuff is awfully good too!
- Jim Hearts FF
I disagree with that headline. All the sides are better than the turkey!
- Trish R
I agree with your sentiment; that the turkey has to be really good (there's nothing worse than Thanksgiving with a dry, tasteless turkey), but I also think the sides are incredibly important. Why can't we all just get along and have really good turkey with really good sides? BTW, can I come over to your place for Thanksgiving? :)
- Curtiss Grymala
Just heard a report on NPR (yes, I listened to NPR for once) about Sesame Street. Interesting tidbit; they said they learned that children liked a narrative versus the lesson broken up into snippets. I think Elmo killed the fun that was Sesame Street and 15 min. of that baby-talking rag is too much. My kids feel the same.
Alex Scrivener, R1CC1, Steven Perez and 20 other people liked this
If I put today's Sesame Street on, they'll whine and call it a baby show. If I put on episodes of the Sesame Street I grew up with, they'll become engaged in the show shouting back answers to the TV. Also noted by my daughter is that the old Sesame Street taught a lot more Spanish (very true) and everything looked "more real".
- Anika
Elmo wouldn't exist if Jim Henson hadn't died IMHO. Less Elmo more Grover and Kermit!
- Tendonitis' Bitch
+++Gunny
- Anika
The early episodes were more for adults. In fact the DVD release has a warning: "These early Sesame Street episodes are intended for grownups and may not suit the needs of today's preschool child," the warning reads. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories...
- Andrew Leyden
Well my kids like them. They get a kick out of the 70s graphics, the Chef, the typewriter (which I learned they thought was a phone, go figure) and my son LOVES the news flash with Kermit D. Frog.
- Anika
I don't miss those time-lapse videos of flowers sloooooooowly opening, though. Remember those? That was always my cue to take a bathroom break.
- Sarah is Novembery
LOL I don't remember those, Sarah. Maybe that was my bathroom break cue too.
- Anika
I loved me some Sesame Street when I was a kid (and yes, that's where I first learned Spanish). Those early 80s episodes more than met my preschool needs...
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
I remember being in kindergarten and every day we watched Sesame Street and then Electric Company. Then we'd have a snack of nilla wafers and orange Koolaid. Then we'd take a nap. Definitely a firm part of my childhood memories.
- Her Lindsay-ness
Her Lindsay ness to you remember Zoom?...........
- VAL D.
LOL @ 'baby talking rag.' I am still laughing.
- Trish R
Hey! Elmo loves his goldfish, his crayons too. >:(
- Danny Minick
And when Grover was a waiter. I loved those stupidly predictable skits.
- Anika
Yes Anika and when he was super grover
- VAL D.
@Val - I don't remember Zoom :S. My favorite Sesame Street thing was the aliens who rang like the phone. "Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Nope, Nope, Nope Nope, BRRRRRRRIIIIING!"
- Her Lindsay-ness
Was I the only one who stuck around after Electric Company to watch "3...2...1...Contact!" ?
- Bren, Photophobe
I couldn't hang with 3-2-1 Contact. It was too "big kid" for me at the time.
- Anika
I loved Sesame Street back in the day, though...
- Bren, Photophobe
One other thing that annoys me about today's Sesame Street is that Bert & Ernie are now Claymation. It was annoying enough that Bert was sidelined so that they'd do that silly Adventures with Ernie (or whatever it was called) sketch. But this is too much bad change. As I mentioned in another post, the Tweedledums are now CGI and so is Abby Cadabby. Boo!
- Anika
Nooooooooooooo. Ernie and Bert are Claymation? RIP Jim Henson.
- Trish R
We have 2 collections of "old school" sesame street and my daughter loves it. She could care less about the new show and we both are ready to turn it off once Elmo's bit comes on.
- Jen (SquirrelGirl)
The Ernie & Bert claymation thing really annoys me as well. Maya loves Elmo (unfortunately) and she also likes the "Murry has a little lamb" segments. She's just recently gotten into Abbie Cadabby. It is a much different show than when I was a kid. I was never into Electric Company but I was a big fan of Mr Rogers, especially the land of make believe.
- Carl Haynes
:O Bert and Ernie are claymation now?! WHY?!?!?!
- Soup
Bren, I adored 3-2-1 contact! I think Sesame Street/Henson were on some serious drugs, in a good way.
- anna sauce
I lived on Sesame Street and Vegetable Soup. Two amazing shows. "Come on along and join us..." EDIT: OH! and Electric Company! Spider-Man FTW!
- Carlos Ayala
I miss Electric Company!
- Ladybug Heather
Electric Company was the shizzle!
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Electric Company was great because my kid loved it and it was even funnier if you were an adult.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
Saturday night, 8p, and my husband chooses to turn the TV to 'Cops'. Dante would've made this a level of hell if he'd known.
Travis Koger, Rob H., Billy Warhol and 14 other people liked this
Apparently 'Cops' was just a brief stop. We've now changed 5 channels since I made this post... =(
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Aaaaand we're back on 'Cops' =P I can't take this: FF is slow tonight and nothing but 'Cops' on TV? I think Ima go play some Boggle on Pogo...
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
There's like 50 eps of Dirty Jobs in a row. Use a naughty bits embargo to make it happen
- Matthew DeVries
Godfather was on earlier. I bet it's still on AMC.
- Trish R
He's flipping back and forth to a college football game (for a team he hates, no less). There may be some hope, though: he's now checking out movies on demand. FINGERS CROSSED PEOPLE!!
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
hard to type with my appendages crossed like this
- Matthew DeVries
Cops on a Saturday night...what more could you ask for?
- Christian (Simply X)
142 and Bush, I got him at gunpoint
- Matthew DeVries
My dad is like that. Drives me nuts how ADD he is with the TV changer.
- Spidra Webster
Wow, this collecting old beds ep of Dirty Jobs is by far the most gross ep ever.
- Matthew DeVries
Your husband is turning into my dad. btw, my dad's name is Dave.
- Katy S
Boggle's a nice game. Do you ever play Tangleword? I used to be a Tangleword-aholic back when it was run on playsite.com and I think even before then. The current version, if it's still there, at whirled.com, isn't quite the same but it's not bad.
- SuezanneC Baskerville
pretty soon it will be Wheel of Fortune + Jeopardy Back to Back!! ;)
- Billy Warhol
Google Wave is rapidly opening up. I have 30 available Wave invites leave your Gmail address below or DM me. I will add you to the queue.
ovigia, Amiram امیرم, Neil Mallinar and 6 other people liked this
roldano.depersio@gmail.com
- Roldano De Persio of FF
Hi, If you have one for me... Thank you. quilovnic[@]gmail[.]com
- Jonathan
mr.armand@gmail.com thanks a lot :)
- Armand
hamed5402@gmail.com
- کشکول
one for http://scr.im/hfg
- Wins Fern
one for lexhardy76@gmail.com thank you
- Lex Hardy
360adamburton@gmail.com
- Adam Burton
remi.pages [at] gmail (dOt) com
- Remi pages
buuddy999[at]gmail.com
- aimseeker
bharadwaj038@gmail.com
- Bharadwaj
capbharadwaj@gmail.com
- Bharadwaj
Could I have one Wave invite? alubaa at gmail dot com
- Richie
All of the above sent they take a few days. 16 left.
- Eric Logan
rikhard.fsoss [at] gmail.com thanks :)
- ovigia
g4daddy@gmail.com, please
- Greg
may i have also please... hsynyldrm@gmail.com
- huseyin yildirim
All sent, 11 left
- Eric Logan
sinani
- Sinan İŞLER
armanshahrmag@Gmail.com
- Mohammad Ali
parazitts@gmail.com
- پارازیـتت
chris.gebert[at]gmail[dot]com
- Chris Gebert
jlfarmer<at>gmail<dot>com. Thanks!
- jlfarmer
mensvictrix@gmail.com thanks Eric!!!
- ★Kristy Kinderfresser
nmallinar@gmail.com - Please i woudl reallly relly want one, thank you sooo much!
- Neil Mallinar
All sent, 2 left.
- Eric Logan
hello@shaneblog Please! I'd love one!
- Shane Adams
was i included in the sent invites? i am not sure because i was so close to the all sent message, either way, thank you so much!
- Neil Mallinar
ty
- Sinan İŞLER
arne.krueger.61@googlemail.com coool - maybe i'll be lucky to - to get the last (eastgerman bonus, just today? ;-) thanx in advance
- Arne Krueger
taher.chegini@gmail.com I appreciate it, thanks
- TaaTaa
Yes, Neil I sent one to everyone on this list except TaaTaa. They take four or five days to receive. Sorry they are all gone now.
- Eric Logan
u are amazing, thank you so very much
- Neil Mallinar
I think there are more here for those who missed http://friendfeed.com/google-...
- Eric Logan
:)))) thanks anyway dude
- TaaTaa
Actually I am sending you the last one TaaTaa, Shane did not leave a G-mail address.
- Eric Logan
wow, I think it's my lucky day, ur great man, thanks a lot :D
- TaaTaa
Eric did you send it? is it my lucky day? :D
- TaaTaa
I did send it but, It take about 4 or 5 days to receive you where the last one.
- Eric Logan
Oh, thanks a lot man
- TaaTaa
Someone can click on this link and get one instantly. I think it still works (well, it will work once). https://wave.google.com/wave...
- Trish R
mortezadalil@gmail.com
- MortezaDalil
amir2b@gmail.com
- Amiram امیرم
Sorry, Guys I am out of Invites.
- Eric Logan
need an full goggle wave invi...kool.kahn@gmail.com 10q
- Ajay
emadmr@gmail.com tanks man.
- Emad
bruce@obenour.com many thanks
- Bruce Obenour
eolsen@gmail.com Appreciate it!
- Erik Olsen
i need i need . please send too pooramezan@gmail.com or pooramezan@live.com
- Mohamad Pooramezan
There are some people on the internet that you just can't argue with. Anti-choice people are among them. It doesn't matter what you say, they will respond with something that is usually unrelated and/or nonsensical until you get bored and quit. This is how they win every conversation. And then they all get in a big smug circle and jerk each other
rowlikeagirl, Haggis (Sean Loyless), Sumotuwe and 16 other people liked this
off as congratulations for another job well done.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Yep! I just saw that whole "conversation."
- Katy S
Jerking off would be looked down upon by the religious fundamentalists, since they would explain every last ounce of seed should go to making babies.
- Phil G
It would also be kind of gay I guess! No homos!
- Andrizzle Gizzle
They all get in a big circle just like in Rome.
- Christopher Harley
DO ANYBODY NO WHAT HAPPENED IN ROME????
- Andrizzle Gizzle
I feel your pain. That thread was almost painful at times to read.
- Helen Sventitsky
One thing I also hate is when people use their infertility to somehow make the case that abortions should be illegal because maybe these young knocked up ladies won't be able to have babies later, so let's make them have it now. I pretty much think that at least half of the women that are "pro-life" need serious therapy to figure out why they are so crazy.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
I like that abortions should be illegal because I adopt - oh wait, I only adopt healthy white babies.
- Baroness Von Cut-A-Bitch
Look, I'm just saying that black people are horrible and stupid and like to have abortions, and if abortions are free, then they are going to have a lot of them, and then there won't be any more black people. And then what am I going to do with all my white robes?
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Don't worry, there's always the yellow and brown people after that. =p
- ronin
I'm having one *right now*!!! *twitters about it*
- Baroness Von Cut-A-Bitch
Both sides of this debate are stupid and don't want a solution because they like fighting with each other. There is a simple solution to both side's problems, but neither side will abandon the hill they're currently dying on to tackle it. If half the money/energy/intelligence spent on both sides were to simply eliminate the real issue, the true enemy to both sides, neither side would...
more...
- Matthew DeVries
*SIGH* That wouldn't help. Don't you know that poor women have more babies to get more welfare? GEEZ.
- Trish R
Also the thing that is ridiculous is that most of the anti-abortion people are also anti-sex education. Well maybe there wouldn't be so many abortions if there was more education?
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Read your comment, MDV, but I think I missed the punch line (FF keeps closing the more link)
- Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF
NO! NO! NO! If you talk to kids about sex, THEY MIGHT HAVE IT!
- Trish R
Rahsheen - Both sides abhor the fact that an unwanted pregnancy has occurred. If they'd take their guns off each other, and attack the problem on that front, neither side would have anything to fight about. The energy/resources expended on both sides could have fixed this problem 2 generations ago. People are dying at a pointless line in the sand.
- Matthew DeVries
Funny how it's the pearl-clutchers who cry "what about the babbies who are begging to not be killed?" that are usually the same people who don't give a tinker's damn about the children in Iraq or Afghanistan (or anywhere else, really) who have bombs (paid for w/their tax money) rain down on them while they cry and beg to not be killed. To them life has no more value, once it's outside of the womb.
- vicster
Matthew, good point. However, the anti-choice crowd also tends to be the crowd that doesn't want to fund public programs to aid young mothers and give them possible outs besides having an abortion. They are also the ones that tend to not want to teach safe sex (insofar as kids WILL have sex before adults think they're ready, we should at least prepare them for it). Anyway, I'm done with my generalizations for the day.
- Chieze Okoye
@MDV, the anti-choicers are anti-choicers because they also want to prevent women from accessing birth control. It's about controlling women's behavior, not about preventing unwanted pregnancies.
- vicster
Steven, a lot of people don't believe that pro-life is the correct term for people who care very little about the life of a woman.
- Trish R
I keep seeing "Dragon Goldmaple" and getting confused by wtf that is. </threadjack>
- Baroness Von Cut-A-Bitch
A lot of "pro-lifers" also support the death penaty, imperial wars, etc. That's why "anti-choice" or "anti-abortion" is a more accurate description.
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
In what sense would a person who is in favor of the death penalty, illegal war, murder of abortion doctors, etc. be considered "pro-life"?
- Bren, Photophobe
from iPhone
Bren, exactly.
- Trish R
To clarify why I refer to them as anti-choice, they not only are anti-abortion, but they are against access to birth control and sex education.
- vicster
We had sex ed in my senior year of high school. But by the time I graduated high school, I was only one of two girls from my graduating class of jr high who didn't already have a baby. Sex ed for me was 1 class where they put a condom on a banana. I don't even think kids get this much any more. I think sex ed needs to start at least in jr high and be intensive and annual. And kids need...
more...
- Andrizzle Gizzle
They only teach abstinence here and told my son's class that you can't go to college if you have sex before you're married (because getting pregnant ends your life, apparently). My soap box is about 100 feet high on the sex ed issue.
- Trish R
Trish, jesus. I wish there was some way to teach these people that this DOESN'T WORK because apparently statistics don't help.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
<3 <3 <3 Vicster. This: "It's about controlling women's behavior, not about preventing unwanted pregnancies." Yes.
- Sumotuwe
Aries: If you have been looking for a new romance, you'll get one step closer to it today.
Anna Haro, vicster, Carmen and 3 other people liked this
Srsly? Cuz that's what I needed to hear...
- tinypants - Hagitha of FF
Wookin' pa nub. . .
- Trish R
I notice it doesn't say how many steps are left beyond today...
- John (a.k.a. dendroica)
lol @ Trish. I haven't heard that in so long!
- Carmen
You're an Aries too? *fistbump*
- vicster
Facebook should give its users a (better) hide function and tell them to shut up about wanting a "Dislike Button" already. I didn't join Facebook in pursuit of a user opinion poll on the things I post.
Amber, Random Time Lord, Rob H., PENGUIN: MAJOR CAPS LOCK and 2 other people liked this
I agree. I really wish there was a way to hide individual posts.
- Trish R
You think abortion is wrong? Don’t have one. I think killing people is wrong, so I’m not in the army. My tax dollars still go to fund it, though (in fact about 21 cents of each of my tax dollars). My tax dollars also go to keep prisoners on death row even though I think the death penalty is morally wrong. My tax dollars fund Guantanamo and Bagram,... - http://silas216.tumblr.com/post...
Jimminy, Bindu Reddy, Kevin Pedraja and 39 other people liked this
I would like to present an argument against your case, but I can't find any! *highfive*
- Rene Wirtz
There is a divergence of opinions upon whether certain activities are "victimless" or not. In each of the examples cited above, there are people who are passionately opposed to the activity in question, and who use a variety of means - legislation, protest, criminal - to make sure that abortion or the death penalty or Guantanamo Bay don't get funded by governments.
- John E. Bredehoft
This is a specious argument, if only because capital punishment and military expenditures are both subject to democratic process whereas abortion was made legal by a court decision. The bigger issue is that abortions will skyrocket if the cost to the recipient goes down.
- Rob Sterling
Remind me again, Rob: who elects the people who select the Supreme Court justices?
- Steven Perez
Who gets to vote them out is the issue, Steven.
- Rob Sterling
Nope. The issue is why some things are worth getting worked up over and why some others are overlooked. The word for today, Rob, is "hypocrisy".
- Steven Perez
Seriously, do you realize that abt 40% of African-American pregnancies in the U.S. are aborted, currently? By lowering the price to zero, you're basically supporting black genocide. Free abortion will be to blacks and hispanics what smallpox was to the Incas.
- Rob Sterling
As my algebra teacher used to say, Rob: please show work.
- Steven Perez
I was just thinking, I'd like to see any statistics to support Rob's argument. Also, should we talk about what things were like *before* Roe v. Wade for women who needed an abortion? In any case, the argument that "abortion was made legal by *a* court decision" and is therefore not debatable in the same way that the other issues which are "subject to democratic process" are, should mean that any other decisions of the Supreme Court are equally invalid.
- Bren, Photophobe
Steven I was looking at your logic and went one step previous: Don't want to get pregnant? (includes men in that responsibility), don't have sex. (This would be the counter argument). I can find no argument that it is a need (no death results from abstaining). Nor can I find a good argument that it is a "right".
- Melanie Reed
So we can start with Miranda rights. Those can go. What should be next, Rob?
- Bren, Photophobe
Don't forget desegregation, Bren. That was so 1950s.
- Steven Perez
Melanie: the above is a quote from here: http://globalcomment.com/2009...
- Steven Perez
OK, so here's the CDC numbers: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr... In 2000, 503 pregnancies were aborted compared to 1000 live births among African-American women. That is 33%; I've seen higher numbers but don't recall where. I hope I don't have to explain demand elasticity - which is that when you lower a price for something, demand goes up.
- Rob Sterling
@Bren - Miranda is a criminal law process issue, right? Of course that can be settled by the courts. But while abortion is obviously an issue for the legislature, the left took it to the courts when it didn't get the outcome it wanted. Right or wrong, that's not democracy.
- Rob Sterling
Steven, thanks. Yeah, I saw. Now to counter her argument: "I am not a bargaining chip" I'm following her all the way up to and including the right to say "no" when I don't agree to have sex. It is my body. But should I become pregnant, I am then sharing my body with someone who from a biological standpoint has no choice but to trust me. I wonder if this life form (which if we found it...
more...
- Melanie Reed
Rob: where have I heard that argument before? Oh, yeah, now I remember: http://mediamatters.org/mmtv...
- Steven Perez
Curses, you've discovered my secret identity! LOL. So? You have a point? I'd rather be on the same page as Limbaugh than that lunatic Olbermann.
- Rob Sterling
Yes. (1) In your hypothesis, why does the ability to have access to abortions not affect white people's population numbers as much they will apparently non-white people? (2) Rush Limbaugh? Seriously? That alone should invalidate your hypothesis, but I'll give you a shot to try and come up with an answer for the first.
- Steven Perez
We teach children in "Horton Hears a Who" : "That a person's a person...no matter how small". No one in the story can hear the whos ...except Horton. He makes it a point to tell whoville to have everybody to yell as loud as they can so they will be heard. What happens when science makes the leap forward past ultrasounds to discover a way the fetus has been communicating to us all along...we just couldn't "hear" it? What then?
- Melanie Reed
*wth? white people are advocating for black births now? that's a switch.*
- tiffany
Oh, and, to completely derail the conversation: (3) why does every conservative feel the need to bring up Olbermann when I catch them using Limbaugh's talking points? Do you even imagine that there is some sort of equivalence there? Cuz there really isn't.
- Steven Perez
Rob: Steven pointed out desegregation as another issue that the courts had to over-rule the majority on, were they wrong there? How about the various voting writes acts that the Supreme Court had to uphold?
- Bren, Photophobe
1) I expect it will affect white people similarly. But if it doubles the white numbers they'll still be lower than the black numbers are now. 2) So you ignore ideas that come from people you generally don't agree with? I'm sure that will lead to a happy and successful life for you.
- Rob Sterling
I'm not a fan of Rob's politics (as far as I can divine them), but the math seems to back him up. In 2004 there were 584,000 "Non-Hispanic Black" births: http://bit.ly/1r9NSz (pdf). In 2004 there were 453,000 abortions performed for black women: http://bit.ly/iwjk1 (pdf). Again, my point is not to support any particular position, just that these numbers are pretty easy to find.
- Steve is older than ever
@Bren - You're talking about interpretations of the 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments, which have been interepreted differently by the Court during different eras. Those three amendments passed through the usual process in the two decades after the Civil War.
- Rob Sterling
so rob, what you're saying is a woman can't afford to have an abortion but she can afford to give birth?
- tiffany
(1) So you're guessing. OK. How about we try and see if your hypothesis holds water? (2) Wow. So far off the mark. I have no problem with opposing viewpoints. But I have a serious problem with anyone using anything that racist gasbag has to say. If Limbaugh told me that the sun was shining, I would want independent confirmation from eight other people, just to make sure. THAT is what I think of Captain Oxycontin's vaunted opinion.
- Steven Perez
@tiffany Nope. I'm saying that if you make abortion really cheap, more people will do it.
- Rob Sterling
@Steven - So instead of just ignoring ideas from people you disagree with, you demonize and hate those people and THEN ignore them. Got it.
- Rob Sterling
@Steve - My politics are immaterial. I'm just pointing out the math. Thanks for agreeing with the math.
- Rob Sterling
Reading comprehension wasn't your strong suit in school, was it, Rob? If you want to pretend that Rush Limbaugh, of all people, actually gives a damn about black people, other than owning them, then good luck with that reality. Otherwise, the subject here is about why people freak out about abortion and why they don't freak out equally as much about torture or war or the death penalty.
- Steven Perez
and the result of not having an abortion is...? if fewer women have abortions, more children will be born, yes? think about the actual real world implications for a moment and you will (i hope) see how silly the argument against funding abortions really is.
- tiffany
Rob: 3. State criminal abortion laws, like those involved here, that except from criminality only a life-saving procedure on the mother's behalf without regard to the stage of her pregnancy and other interests involved violate the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment, which protects against state action the right to privacy, including a woman's qualified right to terminate her pregnancy. -- From the original opinion in the Roe v. Wade case.
- Bren, Photophobe
Your politics are imma-what? First time I've heard THAT specious line of reasoning.
- Steven Perez
If it wasn't for the time, Rob, I would get the numbers from European countries where abortion is legal. Those numbers would show a significant drop in before and after legalization. Your argument that just because it may be cheaper it's gonna happen more is completely ridiculous.
- Rene Wirtz
I don't "agree" with facts, Rob. I'm a librarian, and I know it's pretty easy to get those numbers. I'm actually fine with anyone who wants an abortion getting one. I'm not sure why you should feel comfortable saying that poor black women should be forced to carry on the race or some such shit.
- Steve is older than ever
tiffany, I think in that argument you will also need to examine the growing statistics of infertility
- Melanie Reed
@Rene - If abortions cost a million dollars each, would there be fewer of them?
- Rob Sterling
Rob: if cheese cost $1000000 a pound, we'd stop eating cheese, too. That doesn't mean that if cheese was free, all we would eat is cheese.
- Bren, Photophobe
@Rob: that one I would believe. But guess what would skyrocket, and similarly now, if abortion is made illegal?
- Rene Wirtz
@Steve - I am also fine with anyone who wants an abortion being able to get one. I am not fine with having to pay for them. I am even less fine with the potentially destabilizing effects of "free" abortions.
- Rob Sterling
And, just like when it was illegal to have an abortion, making or keeping it artificially expensive just creates a black market. Prohibition does not, generally, work. It didn't work with alcohol, it's not working with drugs, and it didn't and will not work with abortion.
- Bren, Photophobe
Further, since you seem concerned about saving lives, I assume you would also be in favor of criminalizing gun possession, right Rob?
- Bren, Photophobe
+++++Bren
- Anika
And eliminating the death penalty.
- Bren, Photophobe
Also, there is one other factor that is tangential, generally a family takes care of their older members. The only way older members get taken care of as they age and become infirm is either the state or their own resources amassed over their working life. The argument overlooked and one approaching us is the dual circumstance of an increasing unmarried single female population growing older with limited to no savings and now because of divorce and the fallen economy no money and abortion, no family
- Melanie Reed
@Rob: rocking the wrong boat, my friend. I know, for a fact, that it really does not have a destabilizing effect, The exact opposite, actually. And that's why in almost all European countries, even in the very catholic ones, abortion is legal.
- Rene Wirtz
@Rene - If you accept that fewer abortions would occur if the price went up, then you are admitting that abortion demand has price elasticity. So the argument isn't whether there will be more abortions, it's how many more will occur. My guess is that dropping the price from several hundred dollars to something less than $50 will cause a huge surge - maybe a doubling.
- Rob Sterling
And providing a universal, public option for health care that offers preventative care for all Americans, and does not preclude people with "pre-existing conditions" from obtaining medical service, right?
- Bren, Photophobe
rob: you're wrong. "A comprehensive global study of abortion has concluded that abortion rates are similar in countries where it is legal and those where it is not, suggesting that outlawing the procedure does little to deter women seeking it." http://www.nytimes.com/2007...
- tiffany
Rene: maybe this is what you were looking for: "Conclusions: Both developed and developing countries can have low abortion rates. Most countries, however, have moderate to high abortion rates, reflecting lower prevalence and effectiveness of contraceptive use. Stringent legal restrictions do not guarantee a low abortion rate." http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs...
- Steven Perez
@Rob: your logic is simply unfounded. It has been proven that even offering free abortions does not increase the number of abortions.
- Rene Wirtz
Rob: you hit the nail on the head, when you said "my guess..." edit: because you have no data to support such a surge
- Bren, Photophobe
@Rene - You are aware that most of Europe has a negative birthrate, right? That is extremely destabilizing.
- Rob Sterling
@Rene It has been proven? LOL. Show me those numbers, please.
- Rob Sterling
Rob: precisely. Se my comment above
- Melanie Reed
@Bren - No one ever has data to prove what is GOING to happen in a society. Thank you for making such a conservative point.
- Rob Sterling
@Rob: but that has absolutely zero to do with abortion. That has to do with the fact that, just like in the US, the trend is to start (too) late with having children.
- Rene Wirtz
So you are guessing, then, Rob. Again, I would love to see how you went from "high incidences of non-white abortions" to " wiping out the black people", especially since most women in this country live in a county without basic reproductive services. http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009...
- Steven Perez
melanie, women who have abortions don't have fewer children. they just have them later. and rob, you do realize that the cost of raising a child is precisely why europe has a negative birth rate. and you *ALSO* realize that the u.s. would have a negative birthrate but for immigration, right?
- tiffany
Show me a precedent for your assertion, though, Rob
- Bren, Photophobe
whether a woman aborts a pregnancy is a decision between her and her doctor. if we deny funding for one option, then it has the effect of forcing someone into the other
- Mike Chelen
Because I could say "my guess is that if you made abortion free, no one would ever have one again because they would not trust in the value of the service being provided."
- Bren, Photophobe
Tiffany, not all of them. Too many of them find they are unable. If you are younger at this point it is easy to assume you have control of the future. You and I and they don't.
- Melanie Reed
@Rene - I can't respond to anything else you write until you show me the proof. You're throwing out too many assertions without giving any foundation.
- Rob Sterling
And I wasn't making a conservative point, Rob, I was asking you to provide some basis for your assertion that lowering abortion cost would increase the number of abortions.
- Bren, Photophobe
@tiffany - Yes, but the U.S. is closer to balanced than most of Europe. I want the U.S. birth rate to go back into the positive range; cheap or free abortions would make that harder.
- Rob Sterling
Why is it so important to you that we have more kids than anyone else, Rob?
- Steven Perez
@Bren - You want a precedent for thinking that demand is elastic by price? Or specifically that cutting the price of a thing by 80% or more can at least double demand?
- Rob Sterling
Yoo hoo, Rob! Over here! Yeah, me, the guy throwing facts your way! *waves arms*
- Steven Perez
I'd like a precedent for Abortion, specifically, Rob. That's what we are talking about, right? it's not exactly like other consumer products.
- Bren, Photophobe
@Steven - You're linking articles, not throwing facts.
- Rob Sterling
Rob: are you saying that his sources are not valid?
- Bren, Photophobe
No, I'm providing you with numbers, Rob, which are then attached to articles which support their theories, Rob. Sorry if that is too much for you to handle. I'll go back to hating on Limbaugh if you want.
- Steven Perez
@Bren - Here's an article on price elasticity for medical services. Please remember that abortion is an elective procedure: http://stanford.wellsphere.com/healthc...
- Rob Sterling
Bren it would be the same economic model that is studied and excepted from economists for lowering smoking rates by raising the price
- Melanie Reed
@Bren - I'm saying that he should give an argument and then link his source. Not just hurl long articles at me here, while I'm arguing with half-a-dozen people.
- Rob Sterling
And doing a bang-up job, except that you haven't actually responded to anything I've asked of you ;)
- Bren, Photophobe
Says the guy who threw a dozen tables at me and then guessed at what might happen. I provided reasoned arguments that weren't hard to follow, Rob. Why is that so hard for you to comprehend?
- Steven Perez
I think I've responded to everything you've asked. You just didn't like the answers.
- Rob Sterling
OK, Rob, in spite of me getting sleep. In the US 4 out of 20 pregnancies end in abortion (http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs...), in Holland and Belgium this number is 11 out of a 100 (http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki..., true source: http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs...). The difference: abortion is legal in Belgium and Holland and still only quasi-legal in the US.
- Rene Wirtz
@Steven - You ASKED for the work. I gave you the number and then linked the tables. Don't be a child.
- Rob Sterling
And I repeat: Why is it so important to you that we have more kids than anyone else, Rob?
- Steven Perez
i still want to understand the logic of forcing a woman who wants an abortion but can't afford one to have to pay to give birth and presumably raise a child.
- tiffany
Melanie: that is based on the principal that smoking is harmful in all cases, while the fact is that in some situations abortion is the best choice
- Mike Chelen
@Steven - I don't care about how many kids other countries have.
- Rob Sterling
No, you provided me with raw data and then hazarded guesses on what MIGHT happen. Not nearly the same thing, Rob.
- Steven Perez
You have? I must have missed where you refuted that Roe v. Wade was just as Constitutionally based as all of the other issues I mentioned, or when you told me your stance on the death penalty, gun criminalization, and universal health care, since you are so concerned with saving lives...
- Bren, Photophobe
@tiffany - FORCING? The only people potentially subject to force are those of us who don't want to be part of socialized medicine.
- Rob Sterling
Or when you provided data to support your assertion that lower abortion costs would lead to higher abortion rates...
- Bren, Photophobe
Mike it isn't for the baby, nor the future of that society since you and I do not know the contribution that child could have made, nor for the woman who doesn't know what her future will bring
- Melanie Reed
@Steven - You're just not real good at this, are you? I gave you 503 of 1000 live births. A precise number, and then linked the table.
- Rob Sterling
And then leapt to an unfounded conclusion, based on nothing you could point to other than a poorly chosen economic model, Rob.
- Steven Perez
from IM
@Bren - Since it hasn't happened yet, I can't show data to indicate that it will. Since nearly everything in the world has demand elasticity by price, I would think the burden to show why it WON'T effect abortion is really to be made by you.
- Rob Sterling
I guess I'm asking too much for lefties to understand demand curves. If you understood supply and demand, your worldviews wouldn't be what it is.
- Rob Sterling
Rob: denying funding for a medical treatment influences the decision more strongly for anyone that unable to afford the expense
- Mike Chelen
Besides you are banking on the fact that you will be fertile later on: that is not always the case. Aside from the moral argument, you are playing with futures, both individual and community, that you do not have any information in which to make an informed decision.
- Melanie Reed
And, Rob, I ask you to understand that you, as a man, do not have the authority to decide on what a woman is allowed or not allowed to do, because that's really what it comes down to.
- Rene Wirtz
Clearly there are people who have very low incomes that will find legal abortion to be more difficult to obtain if they have to pay the full price out of pocket. All the more reason why the procedure should be covered by insurance. The last thing the world needs is more unwanted children of parents with low incomes.
- Jason Wehmhoener
I see, Rob. The problem isn't your lack of a coherent theory. It's my politics and intelligence that's the problem.
- Steven Perez
@Rene - What? I am not deciding what anybody can do. You are.
- Rob Sterling
So there is no precedent, even in countries where abortions are free and widely available for abortion rates rising dramatically?
- Bren, Photophobe
@Steven - I'm glad you've come to accept that.
- Rob Sterling
No, I'd like to give women the option of a choice. I would never take that choice away, or worse, make it illegal. And how do I decide what you do?
- Rene Wirtz
Yeah, must be that brown pigmentation that does me in, Rob.
- Steven Perez
Steven: I didn't see Rob use race as a qualifier, I think it is unfair to assume that.
- Bren, Photophobe
Melanie: isn't a child better off if they are born to a parent capable of raising them?
- Mike Chelen
@Steven - I don't even know what race you are. But thanks for going as low as you can go, in less than hour. That's character, right there.
- Rob Sterling
I agree, Bren. Completely unfounded. Like his entire argument. I leapt to an erroneous conclusion based on an inherent bias towards people on his side of the aisle. See how easy that was? And I didn't even need a link.
- Steven Perez
Melanie: the question of health risk regarding future pregnancy is exactly the sort of issue that should be carefully discussed by a woman and her doctor. since the choice effects the woman's future so strongly, isn't it unfair to try and make that decision for her?
- Mike Chelen
@Bren - I am researching that right now. But increased demand for services once prices drop is a major problem for socialized medicine systems in Europe. It's why things that are expensive but quick here, like MRIs, have such long wait lists in some other countries.
- Rob Sterling
Don't sweat it, Rob. You know how we Mexicans can get about that kind of thing. So sensitive all the time.
- Steven Perez
Mike, are you saying, given the assumed awful life you have had (I am assuming for arguments sake) that if you had been given the choice (which these children are not being given) that you would have said "no, I don't want to be born. Please abort me. I don't like the life I'm going to get."? Joy does not arise from the amount of money you have. The triumph of life has been seen through all circumstances.
- Melanie Reed
Steven: I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. I may not agree with Rob's politics, or his interpretation of the constitution, or his lack of empathy for the needs of people outside of his immediate social strata, but I would not immediately assume that he is either a bad person, or a racist.
- Bren, Photophobe
@Rob: I'm interested in your research for that.
- Rene Wirtz
Rob: changing the price actually affects the supply curve, not the demand curve (in classical economics) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- Mike Chelen
Given that Rob's whole argument can be best summed up as some sort of "white man's burden" to save the black race in the name of economics, Bren, I'm not sure I can give him equal latitude.
- Steven Perez
This thread makes me want to have like fifteen abortions.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Steven: funny thing is there are other measures such as use of prophylactics that we could probably all agree on, which would actually affect the demand curve
- Mike Chelen
@Bren - This is anecdotal but doesn't include enough numbers to be too useful: http://www.euthanasia.com/vietnam...
- Rob Sterling
Fair enough, Steven. I am not here to tell you what to think or not think, but the way I read his argument was more along the lines of: "those who are in favor of cheap abortions are in favor, de facto, of decimation of brown people of all sorts in the US."
- Bren, Photophobe
@Rob: I understand that some elective medical procedures follow the rules of economic supply/demand curves, but I think it's unreasonable to assume that abortion will follow the same pattern: yes, if MRIs are cheap and available, lots of people will use them, they're a diagnostic tool. Same goes for other preventative, diagnostic, or cosmetic procedures. But abortion is a whole...
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- Louis Simoneau
Mike, true, health classes in high school should be demonstrating the proper usage of condoms. Heck, I'd go so far as to say health classes should be distributing condoms.
- Jason Wehmhoener
@Mike - Changes in price affect both supply and demand. At a higher price, more people are willing to supply it, fewer to buy it. And vice-versa as prices decline.
- Rob Sterling
Rob: that article about Viet Nam describes a situation that is significantly different: the government of Viet Nam is actively *encouraging* abortion as a birth control method, not just subsidizing the price.
- Bren, Photophobe
Mike, years ago this wasn't even an issue. If you are familiar with ancient cultures the birth of a child was not seen as the burden as it is today (and we have more money than they did and more medical options for comfort and traumatic care. You can't survive everything and t one point we are all going to die. But we who are here have at least been given our chance. I for one am not...
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- Melanie Reed
melanie: a woman is fertile for about 25 years. having an abortion at 15, 17 or 25 does not mean she can't have a child at 26, or 30. fertility doesn't MARKEDLY drop off (and by "markedly," i mean where miscarriage is more likely) until about 40. my own mother had me at 32. this fertility argument is really a non issue.
- tiffany
Fair enough, Bren. I happen to think that black people are smart enough not to abort themselves out of existence.
- Steven Perez
@Bren - Subsidizing a thing, i.e. making it cheaper, is encouragement. When the government subsidizes a thing, we get more of it. That is the usual purpose of subsidies.
- Rob Sterling
I agree, Steven.
- Bren, Photophobe
*dead* seriously melanie? abortion dates back to ancient roman times http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- tiffany
DO ANYBODY NO WHY WIMMEN HATES BABBYS
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Tiffany, I am glad for your mother It does not happen that way for everyone. I am just asking you to realize that a woman cannot always count on finding a husband nor in getting pregnant by any other means. It is not a non-issue.
- Melanie Reed
Rob: that is not what I meant, and you know it. The level of intellectual dishonesty in your arguments makes it very hard to take your points seriously. The same is true, I have found, generally among conservatives.
- Bren, Photophobe
"If you are familiar with ancient cultures the birth of a child was not seen as the burden as it is today" Anyone who's read Greek or Roman myths can start laughing *looks at stopwatch* right. now.
- Spidra Webster
I have also noticed that sort of intellectual dishonesty among people on the left, I should say.
- Bren, Photophobe
Yes, Tiffany I know abortion dates back to Roman times. Do you know what happened to th Roman empire?
- Melanie Reed
Rob: by moving the supply and demand curves the point of intersection changes, but not the other way around
- Mike Chelen
@Bren - I am being extremely straightforward. My whole argument is based entirely on a centuries-old, proven reliable economic theory. You don't want to accept it because it conflicts with what you WANT to be true.
- Rob Sterling
It is really hard for me to comprehend this emotion that there is some reason to see declining birth rates as threatening. I see population pressure creating public health and environmental issues worldwide, including the United States. I just don't get it.
- Jason Wehmhoener
Melanie please describe in detail what happened to Rome.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Louis: MRI cost influences the supply curve, the overall rate would still depend on the demand curve
- Mike Chelen
@Mike - No, the price of intersection is just one snapshot. Ex: If t-shirts are going for $50, more people will want to get in the t-shirt business than if they're going for $5.
- Rob Sterling
@Jason - Declining birth rates are a very bad thing. They are destabilizing and create social problems, especially in support of the elderly. They're something to wish on your enemies, and to try to avoid at home.
- Rob Sterling
no. that is not true, Rob. again. that's okay. I can see that we will get nowhere in this discussion, because you want to treat abortion as though it were the same as any other commodity, and that price is the primary factor keeping the rate of abortion where it is, or that lowering the price will somehow raise the abortion rate (which you can not show one single precedent for).
- Bren, Photophobe
For those of you wondering, here's the original quote: ""You think abortion is wrong? Don’t have one. I think killing people is wrong, so I’m not in the army. My tax dollars still go to fund it, though (in fact about 21 cents of each of my tax dollars). My tax dollars also go to keep prisoners on death row even though I think the death penalty is morally wrong. My tax dollars fund...
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- Steven Perez
and you want to use a "centuries old, proven economic model" to advance *your* moral code.
- Bren, Photophobe
@Rob, unwanted children also create significant social problems. These issues aren't well solved by blanket statements. We need the right to choose so that appropriate choices can be made for unique situations.
- Jason Wehmhoener
@Bren - I just want my country to avoid the social mistakes other countries have made.
- Rob Sterling
where is the evidence of these social mistakes, Rob? edit: still, I wait for anything resembling a precedent for the astronomic rise in abortion you are foretelling...
- Bren, Photophobe
so history books are wrong and abortion was responsible for the fall of the roman empire? what? and what on earth does a woman not being able to find a husband or get pregnant "some other way" have to do with abortion? seems to me that woman wouldn't need one because pregnancy would not be an issue for her. *confused*
- tiffany
BREN HAVE YOU ALREADY FORGOTTEN ABOUT ROME???
- Andrizzle Gizzle
@Jason - Women who don't want children but get pregnant should abort them or put them up for adoption.
- Rob Sterling
And from there, we ended up talking about why our country would be economically destroyed if the black people, who some believe are collectively dumber than a bag of hammers, had ready access to free abortions and accidentally aborted themselves into oblivion. Yeah, I'm still trying to figure that one out.
- Steven Perez
I think he's afraid of being unwanted and uncared for in old age. Sadly, forcing women to have children isn't likely to solve that problem.
- Jason Wehmhoener
@Rob, ok, so can the abortion be covered by insurance then?
- Jason Wehmhoener
Does everyone here know about Margaret Sanger? Just asking.
- Rob Sterling
i am going to hide this thread because some folks have just stopped making sense. and no, that's not because it's past my bed time. it's you. EDIT: margaret sanger? *facepalm* would it help you to know that african women also seek abortions. seeking abortions is a part of the human condition.
- tiffany
tiffany: <3
- Bren, Photophobe
@Jason - If an insurance company wants to offer that, sure. I don't run an insurance company.
- Rob Sterling
On a separate note: I love how some folks don't think that this country isn't smart enough to take someone else's good ideas (like democracy, fer instance) and apply it to our own situation. We can't have socialized medicine because it wouldn't work? So adapt it to fit. That's what we do. That's how this country was made great - we took everyone else's good ideas and made them work. Apparently, though, we're not that smart anymore. Shame, really.
- Steven Perez
I deleted that last comment, because it was reductive in the extreme, and would only serve to take us backward in the conversation.
- Bren, Photophobe
@Bren - No, I would not be running an insurance company. And I would no longer have a choice about where I buy my insurance and what plan I purchase.
- Rob Sterling
huh?
- Jason Wehmhoener
really? I haven't seen that plan, Rob... could you link to it?
- Bren, Photophobe
Steven: with all this, how do you find time to NaNo your WriMo?
- T. Brent, technopeasant
The only HCR bills I have seen do nothing to eliminate private insurance.
- Bren, Photophobe
I doubt you've seen any plan. Have the Democrats finally got around to putting the bill online?
- Rob Sterling
@Rob, really? You wouldn't have a choice of insurance? Citation, please.
- vicster
You mean, this one, Rob? http://docs.house.gov/rules...
- Steven Perez
phew, ok, time for me to punch out on this idiocy.
- Jason Wehmhoener
"Wow, Steven, how'd you find that?" "Well, kids, there's this thing called Google ..."
- Steven Perez
I think he's waiting for Rush to let him know it's online.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Are you kidding, Rob? I posted this http://ff.im/6VIfE , on August 20.
- Bren, Photophobe
@Bren - I'm not going to get into a larger discussion about socialized medicine and what may or may not come out of the conference committee. All I'm interested in here is the original free abortion discussion and social consequences.
- Rob Sterling
Sen. Max Baucus, for example, six weeks ago: http://www.reddit.com/r...
- Rob Sterling
Rob, that's the issue, you read this and all you saw was that it was about abortion. Did you even keep reading once you got past the word abortion?
- Andrizzle Gizzle
Anyway, this is silly. If abortion gets cheaper, more people will want them. I thought that would be self-evident to everyone, but I guess not. Good night.
- Rob Sterling
And yet, Rob, two people in this thread found it quickly.
- Steven Perez
Rob: the notion that if abortions get cheaper more people will want them is just intellectually lazy and dishonest. I'm done, with this conversation.
- Bren, Photophobe
No one chooses to go get abortions like they are some kind of consumer good. That's why you fail.
- Andrizzle Gizzle
@Bren, you just took the words right out of my keyboard!
- vicster
What Bren said.
- Steven Perez
T. Brent: uh oh, I knew I forgot something. o_O
- Steven Perez
First they screamed about having to pay for the education, feeding and housing of other people's children. Now they're screaming about the possibility of paying a LOT LESS to avoid paying for the education, feeding and housing of other people's children. It really doesn't make any sense to me.
- MiniMage TKDteacher of FF
Me, neither. And I was here for all of it.
- Steven Perez
That was my point from the beginning, Dragon. Abortions are not subject to the same market forces as, say, tee shirts. The argument that lowering the price would boost demand is just not supportable. The counterargument, that raising the price astronomically would lower the rate of abortion is fine, but not relevant. What Rob was saying is there, essentially "a:b :: b:a" which is not always true.
- Bren, Photophobe
Dear internet people, arguing about abortion is completely pointless.
- Internet's Tad
In any case, I would guess that Rob is morally opposed to abortion, and sees readily available reproductive health services as a social ill. Instead of being honest and saying that, he tried to use economics to make his case, but was unable to really do so. Tad: in the current environment, there is actually a point to debating this, though normally I would agree with you.
- Bren, Photophobe
Dear Tad: do I tell you how to have fun on a Sunday night? :D
- Steven Perez
Someone, perhaps not Rob, also tried to instill fear (oh noes, the brown people will disappear!) instead of arguing morality. Wait, that's not fair. Perhaps frightening people wasn't intended.
- MiniMage TKDteacher of FF
-- depends what abortion - that one in case of rape, mother's life in danger or incest should be mandatory by law. .. that other one - 'oops we do not want family now' .. i would leave it legal and available, but discourage it
- Petr Buben
Melanie: that only considers two possible outcomes, when there are many different kinds of situations. many children are thankfully born healthy, yet in other case there can be significant and dangerous medical issues
- Mike Chelen
Rob: the prices at which vendors might sell a good is the supply curve, and the price elasticity of supply is its overall slope
- Mike Chelen
*skipping a whole bunch of comments* Dear Rob, Don't worry about black genocide. Lots of black people will keep pumping out the babies, promise. I bet a few of them will even end up having their entire existence paid for by the government (yay poverty!). Hope you're ready to pay for those babies you insist people have.
- EricaJoy
The only answer you will get is that your wrong. They are right. Thats the end of the subject in their mind. Thank you for reading.
- CW™
I don't think it's wrong, but I don't think that killing people is still right. People should think before they bring kids to this world. Sometimes it's better not to bring a child to this cold and crazy world as there is already so many suffering from bad homes, and many doesn't even have no food. If we would take care of them first it would be great. All depends on everything. There...
more...
- Nia
What's amazing to me right now about this whole abortion debate are the people who are screaming the loudest about not wanting the government to have any say in their healthcare are screaming just as loudly for the government to have a say in women's choices in healthcare. (Will be kicking myself after I have more coffee for even commenting.)
- Trish R
Frivolous abortions are wrong, just like frivolous litigation. Gender equality in heath care, however, is a must. To deny women the same access to health care is barbaric and wrong. And a big part of women's health care is preventive health care including birth control options.
- Rene Wirtz
Tiffany (though I have a feeling you won't see this) - a woman's fertility starts to markedly decline after age 35. There are also more risks during pregnancy and birth after that age. Also the assumption that all healthy women are fertile is very wrong. Then you have subfertility, secondary infertility... Remember too that there is a difference between infertile and sterile. I am infertile and I have a son.
- Mellissa Jane
+++++++++ Trish.
- Alix Whitmire
Tanzania Kilimanjaro Coffee - http://www.peets.com/shop...
I have no idea if this is any good, but I want to order some just because of the cool name and exotic sound of the coffee (I guess that's a marketing win).
- Trish R
from Bookmarklet
Anyone still need Google Wave invite? I have 8. Prove you're not a bot if you want one by saying something a bot wouldn't...
Trish R, Jemm and Kol Tregaskes liked this
What do bots say? btw, I want one :o)
- Amit Morson
You've already proved your point, where you want it sending?
- Simon Wicks
I just looked and I have 30 more invites, too. Great googly moogly.
- Trish R
Haha, you win :)
- Simon Wicks
Obey me, weak human, and you can choose how you will die.
- Jemm
Jemm, did you want one? Or were you just being a bot :)
- Simon Wicks
Trish, me too. 30 to give away here: http://ff.im/bbBTI
- Kol Tregaskes
@Simon: I don't need one, thanks:)
- Jemm
Ok then, :)
- Simon Wicks
Guess I should have offered mine out, too. LOL. Anyway, whoever Simon can't get, I'll add to my list.
- Trish R
I'd like one, please! KILL ALL HUMANS!!!
- Timothy Griffin
I'd like one if they are still available. And, I'm not a bot. Seriously. Send me a CAPTCHA and I'll prove it.
- Aaron Schaub
How does that make you feel? Please tell me more about the "something a bot wouldn't..."
- Slippy "Threadsbane" Lane
Apparently the wave madness is over already. That didn't take long.
- Trish R
In an effort to be more honest, I am going back over every time I wrote "LOL" and didn't actually laugh out loud and am giving at least an audible chuckle. Sorry for the inconvenience.
Alfredo, Yolanda, Jim Hearts FF and 3 other people liked this
LOL. (I really did when I read that.)
- Trish R
LOL... in a very honest way. (Not those loose moral-ed LOL's you been throwin' around.)
- SAM
"loose moraled" ha!
- Josh Haley
They've gone crazy with the nutcrackers at Target.
Adrian, Derrick, John (a.k.a. dendroica) and 6 other people liked this
Just found these on my phone. I took them last week I think.
- Anika
We were staging them, so we had the hippie one next to the rocker one, with the SWAT team one closing in. It amused us so much, I forgot to take a picture.
- Anika
There's a Village People set of nutcrackers? Who knew!
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
I love the hippie nutcracker.
- Trish R
It's like the YMCA of nutcrackers...LOL!
- Anna Lynn M.
About to buy this bunkbed for the girls...
Yolanda, Beau Liening, Jeannette Høvring and 7 other people liked this
Cute :-)
- Adam Lasnik
My son used to have one of those. He loved it. It also saves a lot of space!
- Trish R
It looks pretty solid.. I which I could have bought that for my children when they were small.. Hope your girls will love to have this bed..
- Jeannette Høvring
they better love it after the cash I just dropped on it.
- Sarah is Novembery
I can see leaping off the top bunk to the one below now..........
- VAL D.
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