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Tommy Williams › Likes
No Regrets: The Best, Worst, & Most Ridiculous Tattoos Ever - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news...
Iván Abrego, Bret Taylor, Marco and 58 other people liked this
HOLY CRAP these tattoos LOL!!
- Mona Nomura
WTH?
- Darren Heydon
Well, at least it's not backwards
- Rodfather
The Nike Swoosh and the Jesus "OMG LOL" made my jaw DROP.
- Mona Nomura
hahahaha
- Shevonne
At least they ended it with a unicorn chaser. Sorta.
- invariant - farewell FF
ew ew ew is that hair growing from a mole? what does he do? comb it?
- BEX
That's a stamp if ever I saw one & I'm NO tatoo specialist but, Teachers know stamps!!!
- Disa Albanese
Oh sheesh
- Mike Nayyar
What. The. Hell.
- Zach Flauaus
This is one slide show worth looking through. The entire gallery made me EL OH EL.
- Mona Nomura
One more from Alejandro http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news...
- Mona Nomura
I'm sorry but the "OMG <insert Jesus image here> LOL" one made me laugh.
- Nicholas Kreidberg
And the Lacoste OMG
- Mona Nomura
I laughed at OMG Jesus LOL, but they had me at Patrick Swayze centaur Chippendale tattoo.
- Andy Bakun
I love the stoned Pegasus unicorn sex with rainbows.
- Sparky Crocker
XAXAXAXAXAXA
- Dobromir Hadzhiev
I have to share this w/my sis so she has some sort of defense about why hers "isn't that bad" when dad freaks out
- Sarah Perez
I love these collections. Makes me feel better about my own choices.
- Katie: Witch Of The West
<----- I'm With Stupid
- Mike Lewis
Some people get the most idiotic tats. lol
- orionstarr
wow just wow
- Alfredo
in my view, any and every tattoo is deplorable, rather disgusting para-culture .. where did it start? in prison, with gangs? ... and tattoo on a lady is doubly questionable, and unelegant ... I mean, where is this world going to?
- Petr Buben
Petr - tattoos can be beautiful works of art, it's just that they often are not.
- Sparky Crocker
Petr, tattoos have been around as long as man. Tattoos have been found on mummified bodies from as early as neolithic times and present in cultures around the world. These are awesome though! I love bad tattoos :)
- Jason
Petr, you are very judgmental and I'm not just talking about this thread. You need to relax a little.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF
I am judgmental, yes ... relaxed,also ... was it over the line what I said about tattooes? ..../////. IF the comment was over the rules, would the esteemed author of the post please delete it :] other than that, thank you for the advice :]
- Petr Buben
KICK ASS FACE TATTOO
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
This book is available for the Kindle. Seems like the pictures would be the main draw, and I don't find that the Kindle is all that great for pictures, at least illustrations. Anyone have the Kindle version want to comment?
- Andy Bakun
LOLcat paparazzi
2ndmoon©, Ahsan Ali aka. Slick, Владимир and 259 other people liked this
LOL
- Alfredo
I swear one of those is Scoble and he just doesn't want us to know.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Is that @sockington? :P (P.S. I don't think Sockington looks like that)
- Jalada
LOL good find. Love it.
- Drew Lucas
LOL
- Roberto Bonini
LOL....cat
- Bwana ☠
The cat's face is priceless.
- Josh Haley
LOL
- Jay
My cats have gotten used to it. Indiana poses and trys to get in shots that aren't supposed to include her.
- Rachel Lea Fox
Rachel, that sounds like my son Seth :p
- Josh Haley
*shaking head*
- Ryo / Fuck Facebook
Oh God ((((((((((:
- yasin ghasemi
It's Good ... :))
- Alooche
if only i had a cat to photgraph......... :(
- Roberto Bonini
I LOVE photography
- H.M.Nasrabadi
BEST post ever!
- AJ Batac
LOL
- Arash
LOL at the guy lying on the ground to get the shot.
- Rahul Das
I actually LOL
- Valley
HA!!!
- David Cook
is that scoble with the mullet?
- Jim Hearts FF
damn. Killed another one!
- Jim Hearts FF
Yeah, its scoble :)
- Roberto Bonini
That's the most likes I think a post of mine has ever recieved. And they say they don't like LOLcats anymore huh?
- Josh Haley
thought it was socks the clinton's cat LOL
- BEX
BEX, I love how your profile bit says "I can kick your ass!" :) Not only do I believe that 100%, but I also think it might be enjoyable for some reason.
- Josh Haley
I'm sure that I could get a little whimper out of you ;)
- BEX
Yep, I was right. I'll be in my bunk.
- Josh Haley
:))
- Shandiz
I love how cats pose when initmidated with admirers- not this one though - and hey we are looking through lens of 2nd order paparazi (paparazi of paparazi !!!)
- Rahul Deodhar
نمي دونم حرفامو مي فهمي رفيق يا نه ولي خيلي جالبه
- ramezanifar
This is my most "liked" picture to date, I believe. Long live the LOLcat!
- Josh Haley
A superstar cat !
- Renchin Wang
haha :P
- Michael
kind of celebrity
- amirreader
So where are the pictures of the cat? I must see them!
- Chuck Baggett
I saw this seane in Tokyo, :)
- microwalrus
بله همونطوري كه گفتم خيلي جالبه
- ramezanifar
"Stupidity- hoomans haz it"
- Roberto Bonini
Yes this is the Bill Clinton's cat :)
- Nenko Ivanov
I can haz privacy?
- George Brickner
I SED, NO PICTUREZ!
- Rick Cogley
poor thing....
- theNetImp
What is the actual story behind this picture?
- Mellissa Jane
حالا چرا اينا اينطوري بند كردن به اين گربه؟
- ramezanifar
This is my best of to date, according to number of likes.
- Josh Haley
The Blu-Ray player we've been waiting for is almost here! OPPO BDP-83 Blu-ray Disc Player
telefan, Roberto Bonini, John Wang and 29 other people liked this
THIS is a best of breed product. And it will only cost you $600.
- Alex Scoble
you didn't have a BetaMax picture?
- ɐ ɯıʞ sıɹɥɔ
/me gives Chris the stink-eye
- Alex Scoble
or 8-track player, maybe? heh. :-P
- ɐ ɯıʞ sıɹɥɔ
Honestly, tho, this is top-shelf for what it is. You are right on that!
- ɐ ɯıʞ sıɹɥɔ
I just need to know how quickly it loads discs, my Sony is painfully slow.
- Jamie Ginsberg
Any word on price?
- Andy Roth
$$$?
- Shey, Jamaican of FF
I can get it for $500. If you didn't sign up for the interest list early on you pay the regular $600.
- Alex Scoble
Jason. PS3 is garbage compared to this. Don't make me hunt you down.
- Alex Scoble
It's likely, "If you have to ask how much it is..."
- Kenton
Alex, are those new 500 gig holographic discs going to do anything to Blu-ray now, or is that more of a very long term future thing?
- Mike Reynolds
Tagged this in delicious for future use
- Mike Reynolds
I have no idea, Mike. I honestly don't know that media will last more than another 10-15 years on the whole. If most people aren't doing digital downloads by then, there's something wrong with the system.
- Alex Scoble
How can you know this is a best of breed product when it's not even out yet? Yesterday you were bashing people who give in to marketing hype...
- Kevin Fox
I've been following it for over a year, Kevin. I've read reviews of one of the beta testers. It does things that no other BR player will do. It's Oppo. Oppo kicks ass. Want me to say more? I'm frothing at the bit to buy one. Want me to say more? HYPE! I HAZ IT!
- Alex Scoble
99% of people won't see any difference between this and the PS3. PS3 costs less and also plays games (and does some media serving, etc.) What quality of TV is required to make this a must-have relative to a device that someone may already have?
- LogEx
Kevin, you're my new hero.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Yup, fanboism.
- LogEx
"True 24p™ Video - Many Blu-ray Discs are recorded at 24 frames per second, the same frame rate as the original movie's theatrical release. The BDP-83 can faithfully redeliver the original frames using 1080p 24Hz output (compatible display required) for smoother motion and a flicker-free, film-like home theater experience. It can also restore the original 24 frames per second progressive-scan video from well-authored DVDs and output as 1080p 24Hz."
- Mike Reynolds
And two USB ports!
- Mike Reynolds
Engadget had a nice hands on review of this and the comments made similar comparisons to the PS3. The differences line in the bitstream audio support and some of the more "high end" features that the PS3 lacks.
- Kevin Kuphal
Robert has hijacked Alex's account, hasn't he?
- John Craft
Hmmm. PS3 has 1080p24 and 4 (I think) USB ports.
- LogEx
My PS3 has four USB ports. (And my TiVo has two!)
- Kevin Fox
How shall I start? The PS3 is a horrible upscaling DVD player. This has the best upsampling solution on the market (Anchor Bay FTW). The PS3 doesn't play SACD. The PS3 doesn't output multichannel analog (for those who have a receiver/preamp with multichannel analog in but not HDMI 1.3. I could keep going, but I won't. This totally kicks the PS3's ass for BR duty.
- Alex Scoble
What he said.
- Mike Reynolds
And the difference is that I'm hyped about a product that deserves the hype. It's TRULY best of breed, get it? This isn't fanboi-ism. This BR player does things that NO OTHER player does in one integrated high quality package.
- Alex Scoble
Seriously, I'm sure its spec sheet is out of this world, but I'm looking forward to reading the reports of unbiased reviewers with production hardware before I judge whether it's worth the high price. I'm not saying it's not a best of breed product, but I look forward to actually finding out.
- Kevin Fox
This is a great player, I've followed it for months myself. I'll keep my freebie Denon for awhile and probably wait for nextgen Oppo, but this was one hardware device I've been drooling over for my home theatre.
- jcunwired
But again, the critical question... What quality of TV is required for the 99% to make this a must-have relative to a device that someone may already have (or one that costs less)?
- LogEx
++LE the playback device is always the critical factor. Neil Young makes a rather impassioned argument about this for the audio side of the world.
- ɐ ɯıʞ sıɹɥɔ
LE, you are beginning to annoy me. The big difference on this transport vs the PS3 is in the audio codecs that it can handle. So what TV you have doesn't matter...and you'll be able to tell the difference between this transport and the PS3 when playing a DVD on any 1080P TV. But the big difference is when you have a real home theater with a receiver/preamp that is capable of receiving the multichannel inputs from this beast.
- Alex Scoble
LE, there are two types of people when classifying gadgets (especially HT) - those that want the best there is given their budgets, and all the rest. :) Given that, its either a must-have or not.
- jcunwired
Alex, looking forward to your advice when I'm ready to setup the theater room. We break ground on the new home tomorrow - but won't be ready for the home theater for perhaps 1-2 years.
- Mike Reynolds
Coolness!
- Alex Scoble
Sorry but I think I will stick with my ps3.
- tojfs7931
Good luck with that.
- Alex Scoble
Oh my wow, that is a BEAUTY.
- Mona Nomura
I always wondered how much different blu ray is to dvd, but I have not taken much time to look into it. What is the actual difference between the two?
- Raymond Marr aka Knatchwa
oppo？
- junrxu
$600?! To view a media format that only has MAYBE 3 more years? Do you have any clue how many handjobs down at the warf that will take?
- Matthew DeVries
Blu-Ray is 4 times the resolution of DVD and also allows for lossless multichannel audio encoding/decoding.
- Alex Scoble
You are smoking crack if you think BR will only be around for 3 years. And it also plays DVDs and SACDs. And plenty of people are buying the PS3, which is inferior in just about every way just for the BR capabilities and it's $500.
- Alex Scoble
Except, I can play PS3 and PS2 and PSX games on the PS3.
- xero
Except, xero, most people that I know that bought the PS3 bought it to play Blu-Ray and not for games and couldn't care less about games anyhow.
- Alex Scoble
smoking crack, paying attention to the field. to-may-to to-mah-to.
- Matthew DeVries
When you see studios seriously going to some other format, Matthew, let me know and I'll eat crow.
- Alex Scoble
Hulu, Netflix Instant watch, etc
- Matthew DeVries
To whet your appetite, felix: http://www.prillaman.net/oppobdp...
- Alex Scoble
Ray, the medium itself is more than 5x the storage capacity. Image quality is 480 interlaced lines of vertical resolution for DVD vs. 1080 progressive for blu-ray. Blu-ray will blow your mind in comparison.
- jcunwired
Matthew, we are seriously 5 to 10 years out from being able to deliver blu-ray quality content on the internet in any meaningful way. Netflix Instant isn't even DVD quality right now.
- Alex Scoble
And like I said, when you learn of a studio switching way from Blu-Ray, let me know.
- Alex Scoble
Actually, jc, DVD is 480p.
- Alex Scoble
Blu-ray's not going anywhere. There MAY be an increase in resolution in the next few years, but its going to be a long way off. Not everybody has the available bandwidth to download 1080p content, so the physical medium will be around for a long time.
- jcunwired
If you don't care about quality, we shouldn't even be having a discussion. Be happy with You Tube and illegal downloads where you can hear people munching popcorn.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
ok, 5 years. That's a whole lot of handjobs for only 5 years of use, and a repurchase of all that media. I'll wait.
- Matthew DeVries
Not original DVD Alex :)
- jcunwired
And what you all are saying runs counter to what gdgt, engadget, and all the other podcasts say. Microsoft wouldn't have surrendered HD-DVD if they thought there was a future in physical media.
- Matthew DeVries
They backed HD-DVD because it used the Microsoft Codec. Money is in who controls the license royalties.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
They would have loved for HD-DVD to survive.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
LOL, Matthew. Microsoft couldn't keep HD-DVD going without content. And don't bet on BR being the last media based format either. If they come out with a 2160P spec or 4320P spec, it will again out pace any internet based delivery system.
- Alex Scoble
PS3 doesn't have 'True 24p' ? Can the OPPO play AVCHD from SDHC cards directly? That's all I really care about.
- Rodfather
Since it doesn't have an SDHC card reader built in, it can't do it directly. It does however, have USB inputs for hooking up USB storage devices. Still not sure if it can handle that format.
- Alex Scoble
With technology advances in blu-ray pushing more and more layers (up to 200gb if I recall), even at 4320p a full length movie with 7.1 sound will still fit on a blu-ray disk. It ain't going away anytime soon.
- jcunwired
Sorry, it will play that format. So perhaps using a SDHC USB reader?
- Alex Scoble
I assume it support AVCHD through burned DVD's and Blu-Ray, but I would like direct playback from SDHC cards.. since well, camcorders record to SDHC cards.
- Rodfather
Looking at the spec sheet, it says it can play video video through USB, so I guess it works?
- Rodfather
Even if it kicks the PS3's ass, the price point is way too high. While they may not buy the PS3 to play games, the fact is is that it can play games and do a crapload of stuff that this can't. The tradeoff being better upscaling? Not sure that's worth the $200 & no added functionality premium. Does it do Netflix?
- John Rubier
You're all missing the point. This isn't a consumer device. This is another device that a -phile buys to prove how much better their system is than yours. Same people that spend hundreds and thousands on speakers and other stuff that the average person can't tell the difference using.
- Kevin Kuphal
To call the Oppo a super high end product is not correct. Their specialty is bringing quality for an affordable price. I don't understand how you can say all speakers are the same. Really?
- Eric @ CS Techcast
They're not the same, but in my environment - and I imagine many other people's - spending extra cash on them (like most other devices of this nature), is just throwing it away compared to affordable alternatives.
- Kevin Kuphal
$600 is not an affordable price for something to watch movies with. After a certain point, for the majority of one's listening, speakers are indistinguishable. Perceived speaker quality for most people is logarithmic. Most can tell the diff between a $20 one and a $70, a few less the $70 and $150 one, and almost nobody can tell the diff between the $150 and the $600 one. The same is...
more...
- xero
Kevin, I won't argue the point with you, but you're way wrong. Those passionate about their gear research and compare, and there really is a difference. People don't buy better gear to look down their noses at others, people do so because quality is important. Live with it or not, but you can move along to a thread where you can carry on a quality conversation. :)
- jcunwired
Considering the Denon flagship Blu-ray player is $3800, yes, this is affordable. Where are you finding a name brand $150 Blu Ray profile 2.0 player? If you want to talk DVD's are the same, let's not talk.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Still with the physical media? Meh.
- Internet's Tad
Tad, just like everything I get excited about, it won't be ready for a while.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Is the movie different with 2.0 vs 1.0? Didn't think so...
- Kevin Kuphal
Eric, don't mind Tad. He'd rather have the compromised quality of modern digital media than better quality delivered on physical media.
- Akiva Moskovitz
I'll wait for a portable 1080p Blu-Ray player. If portable and 1080p is even possible. A PS3 should be good enough for me today, but, I'm still putting it off.
- Rodfather
JC. I'm just not convinced that a $600 player or $1000 speakers can increase my enjoyment to a level worth the extra money. I do the same, research, buy quality components, but there's quality, and then there's levels of detail that, to me, don't really matter for my level of enjoyment.
- Kevin Kuphal
Akiva is right, actually. I don't mind a lower quality video in exchange for not having to own yet another meatspace object. In due time I'll end up with the same quality as what you guys have now with less clutter. I suppose I'd care if I had a big TV and awesome audio system.
- Internet's Tad
Rod, it's fine. I have the Sony BDP-S300 player and won't be upgrading anytime soon. We can't always be on the upgrade cycle. I prefer dedicated players for video. Too much noise from game systems for me.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Tad, yeah; that's the big difference right there: when you have a 40+ inch 1080/24p flat panel LCD with 5.1 surround sound and blah blah blah, digital media just doesn't cut it on any movie you care about the presentation of.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Tad, I love downloads, but the compromise is too much for a big motion picture experience. I use NetFlix streaming, but only for one off stuff and TV shows.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Those prices were for speakers, not Blu-Ray players. And it's not a matter of comparison to other high end equipment, it's a matter of comparison to what the average consumer is willing to spend. Yeah, it's a great deal if you were considering the obtusely expensive one. I also wasn't talking about the diff between DVD and Blu-Ray. Anyone can see that difference. I was talking about the diff between 1080p on PlayerA and PlayerB or upscaling one's favorite movie on PlayerA and PlayerB.
- xero
Unless you ripped a Blu-Ray movie to MKV and put it on a HD ;)
- Rodfather
Kevin, acknowledged. Thats a lot nicer way of putting it, thanks :)
- jcunwired
We used to have a huge DVD library, but eventually we realized that almost ALL of it was one off stuff that we never watched again. We've never had a decent home theatre room and there's just too many other things we'd rather spend money on. Eventually I'll be watching 1080p movies while you guys are watching full motion 25MP video or something.
- Internet's Tad
Xero, you are right. The average consumer argument can always be made. Really, good enough is good enough for many. I won't knock that. But, DVD made its way to the mainstream, when VHS was good enough. CRT SDTVs were good enough, but many are buying flat screen HDTVs. I'm saying the average Joe finds the technology eventually.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Speaking of MKV support, is the JVC XV-PB1 any good? http://www.engadgethd.com/2009...
- Rodfather
@Rodfather. Well said. Right now I'm ripping and transcoding WALL-E DVD to Nero Digital to put on my MythTV video library. I will barely be able to tell the difference and it will take up half the space the full DVD does. Same will likely hold true when I move to Blu-ray. I'll have a basic player for the Netflix rentals but digital is where it's at for me.
- Kevin Kuphal
Eric, yes, they do. And they can do so because enthusiasts absorb the R&D costs on the front line equipment, weed out the stuff that isn't as "good", and promote the stuff that is good. Eventually, the tech gets cheaper due to larger productions and better processes and the average joe gets it in their home at a good price. The process works, I just don't like how excited everyone gets when the prices are still so far above where they should be. I'm just here to bring some perspective to the mix. ;)
- xero
I think you are making a generic argument about early adopter tech when this specific player is putting high end features into a much more affordable player. I say this player is pushing that price point down, not up. Is it too rich for many still? Yes. For those that wanted the high end quality, but not the price, Oppo is bringing home the bacon. Should this player be $50? No, the R&D is still expensive. In 4 or 5 years, when the parts are all carbon copy and cheap, then maybe. It happens to all tech.
- Eric @ CS Techcast
Rodfather, my favorite site for A/V gear says there is no review out yet, but folks there are liking it http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb...
- jcunwired
"I just don't like..." So that puts it all into perspective. End of argument :)
- jcunwired
Would be cool if it supported streaming 1080p through the network. That way I could store movies on the desktop, and keep the loud equipment away from the living room.
- Rodfather
Rodfather, cant quite figure that out. Engadget says it does, but the guys on avsforum say thats not mentioned in the manual. That part raised my eyebrows too.
- jcunwired
Rodfather, here's a good briefing on a few from CES. Check out what's said about the Samsung BDP-4600 http://www.highdefdigest.com/news...
- jcunwired
Interesting w/ the WiFi dongle for Netflix. It's probably only for low bit-rate stuff.
- Rodfather
I'm a big movie buff (own a ton of DVDs) but I just can't get into migrating to Blue Ray - just seems like a dead-end (like most physical media). Digital downloads are my long-term upgrade solution.
- timepilot
I don't own many DVDs except for the ones I use to demo my system. Very few movies, in my opinion are worth watching more than once. Which is why I use Netflix.
- Alex Scoble
stretta, there are some real companies out there doing great things that produce this level of fanaticism without the quasi-religious furor and millions of dollars in marketing.
- Alex Scoble
And I imagine that they are working on a cheaper model that doesn't have all the analog goodness. Time will tell.
- Alex Scoble
huh huh huh you said anal...goodness /beavis
- Matthew DeVries
I'm on the fence for getting this, by the way. I'm not sure I can really afford it right now and we just aren't watching enough movies at home to make it worthwhile. I'd be saving $100 buying it now, but there's no sense in going broke saving money.
- Alex Scoble
Even less sense going broke saving money on something you likely won't use at all by next year.
- ɐ ɯıʞ sıɹɥɔ
Heh, Chris. You are smoking some good herb, but that's ok.
- Alex Scoble
I don't think so, but I don't even know what Viewmaster is.
- Alex Scoble
from IM
Wow...did I totally just walk in to that one. *gobsmacked*
- Alex Scoble
LOL!! I wondered too Alex. Hadn't heard Viewmaster for a very long time. I think our cogs both clicked into place at about the same time.
- jcunwired
As a part of our redesign launch, you can post to FriendFeed by emailing share@friendfeed.com, and you can get your feed delivered via email (you can even comment by replying to the messages). See more here: http://friendfeed.com/share...
Brian, Iván Abrego, Isha (Marysia) and 144 other people liked this
You can post to a room by emailing <groupname>@friendfeed.com and direct message by emailing <username>@friendfeed.com
- Bret Taylor
like
- امیـرعلیـــ کنـکـوریـــ
That's cool.
- Andrew Smith
did i just notice the new bookmarklet too?
- patrick
brilliant!
- Edward Zwart
Awesome!
- Anthony K. Valley ©
I assume we need to send the email from the primary email set up on our FF account?
- Kevin Whalen
Hehehe... Nice :D
- Johnny Worthington
You can add email addresses to your account from your settings: http://friendfeed.com/...
- Bret Taylor
You can post from any email address associated with your account. Email notifications will go to your primary address.
- Tudor Bosman
Currently, we support automatic posting (without going through an "approve" page) for Gmail, Yahoo, and MSN/Hotmail/Live.com. We will add more email providers in the future, and we will also have a technical document on what an ISP needs to do in order to get added.
- Tudor Bosman
I thought a saw a "hello world" yesterday that got deleted rather quickly :)
- Frankie Warren
Isn't this a huge spam vector? All I have to know is someone's email address to mail from and I can send stuff to FF?
- Brian Sullivan
Brian: we use a number of methods including SPF to verify that emails came from the actual owner of the email address. If we can't verify, we make the entry go through an approval step before it is posted.
- Bret Taylor
from email
What Bret said; that's why we only support a few email providers right now.
- Tudor Bosman
from email
You should add more Twitter sharing options, so that I can have emailed-posts automatically tweeted. (like by emailing twitter@friendfeed.com). Then FF can become a replacement for services like twitpic
- Daniel Sims
So I could get spammed just by needing to approve posts that didn't come from me?
- Brian Sullivan
I don't see any way to turn it off for my account - does such a feature exist?
- Brian Sullivan
I just tried to send an email to a private group from a different email account and the request to approve it was sent back to the email address from which I sent the direct message. Is this the intended behavior?
- Shakeel Mahate
Shakeel: Yes. In order to approve the post, you have to log in to FriendFeed if you aren't logged in already.
- Tudor Bosman
Brian: as Shakeel noted, the approval request will be sent to the email address that was used to post. If someone is trying to spam, they will receive the approval request, not you. In order to approve, though, they would have to log in to FriendFeed, so they can only impersonate you if they know your FriendFeed password.
- Tudor Bosman
Wow this is awesome.
- Mona Nomura
It is sent to the address that the user claimed does it not ? If they claimed to be me I would get the request? Spam may be an over statement -- but it certainly could be annoying.
- Brian Sullivan
Curious if setting the reply to different than the from will have effect on this? registered with yahoo, but yahoo sends out all mail with gmail as reply to...
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brian, that is correct. We will address this issue if it becomes a real problem; we do have some spam-prevention measures in place.
- Tudor Bosman
Rob: you need to associate with your account the address that you send from (that is, the address in the From: header).
- Tudor Bosman
Tudor, I think your solution is brilliant, thank you.
- Shakeel Mahate
And an IM bot - that would make my work interface a breeze
- Nicholas Paul Gordon
from Nambu
Nicholas: The IM bot is there. Just set it up and use it :-) I'm getting some notices now....going to test sends in a sec
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Tudor: thanks for the clarification
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Nicholas: we have been supporting IM notifications and replies by IM for a while now. Is this not working for you? See http://friendfeed.com/setting...
- Tudor Bosman
Tudor: I'm not seeing IM notifications on "comments on posts I commented on" (and maybe same for posts I liked
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob: we just added that feature last night, so yeah, it's possible that there are some bugs. Looking into it.
- Tudor Bosman
Thanks Tudor. I'll be keeping an eye out for it...I've only got those set (but I did get blasted before I turned off the "Home Feed" notifications
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
pretty cool
- Shevonne
If you're not using Gmail, Yahoo, or whatever, do you have to approve each time you post something?
- Tom Landini
What happened to the stats page that was with the old interface?
- Russ Jackson
this is a gr8 feature..
- Amit
Tom: yes, for now, but stay tuned for improvements.
- Tudor Bosman
Thanks Tudor.
- Tom Landini
Not seeing IM posts to @me going thru. :( This makes me a sad panda.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Added another mail to stream via cellphone, but confirmation reply never came in, a bug maybe?
- Nir Ben Yona
great stuff! i mean ..stuFF .... thanks! ..you are the befft ! .. and will be even beffer .. Im quite sure about that .. LoFFe all the new ffeatures. ! ......... do you think to enable also x@ff.im? it might be handy, save typing
- Petr Buben
AND you guys successfully omitted email signatures from DMs and posts!
- Mona Nomura
is that new Mona? The last DM I sent via email included my signature. (was a few days ago)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
is there email notifications for groups?? i know you can post to groups via email, but i dont see the way to turn on emails out of groups.
- Frankie Warren
So that means no more using the remote key in the email address? That's SWEET.
- Jandy, ConcertMaven of FF
Frankie—Not yet. For now you can add the groups you'd like to receive notifications for to a friend list and enable email notifications for that list.
- Dan Hsiao
Dan: Thanks for the work around... I hope a more intuitive method eventually shows up :)
- Frankie Warren
Sweet!
- TheHenry
Hey everyone reading this on Twitter - come join the party on Friendfeed :)
- Phill Price
I leave for a few hours and FF Co. goes and WINs all over the place. Can't leave you alone for a second :)
- grant fox
Mona, Rob: we tweaked the email signature detection code a bit, and should get rid of the default signatures from iPhone, Blackberry, and WinMo phones, as well as small variations (HI MONA). If you want to ensure that your signature gets dropped, configure the signature to include "-- " (two dashes and a space) on a line by itself before the actual signature text.
- Tudor Bosman
Bret, it looks good, liking the new email and IM features. I've still got a huge suggestions and bug list. ;-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Grant, I went off to watch a rare bit of TV then come back to all this! LOL. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
The notifications rock ! Great work !
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
wow, this is very impressive
- Peter Efland
I could not post via email, because I guess I never confirmed my email address. I updated my email with the same one and clicked on the link that was subsequently sent to me. Now posts via email work.
- Chip Ramsey
Is old interface via mail2ff going anywhere? I'd like to continue authorizing my posts with remotekey.
- Alex Kapranoff
Alex: mail2ff will continue to work
- Bret Taylor
The mails I send on share@friendfeed.com won't show up. I'm using GMail. Is there a issue?
- Ryo / Fuck Facebook
Ryo -- is your gmail address in your ff list of email addresses?
- Brian Sullivan
Brian, yes, I added it about an hour ago and made it the primary and only one.
- Ryo / Fuck Facebook
Ryo: That may be the same thing that was happening to me. Did you try to add the same email address again? It should fire a confirmation email that provides a link. After I clicked the link, I was then able to send posts via my email.
- Chip Ramsey
Chip, it was a new mail address... Will try it again. EDIT: Ahh, now after removing the new address and re-entering it worked. Will test some more.
- Ryo / Fuck Facebook
Ryo: BTW, I'm also on gmail and everything works fine now, so gmail itself probably is not the problem.
- Chip Ramsey
Nice... I will update my contact list asap! Feature heaven...mmmm
- Susan Beebe
Any word on getting other mail addresses to only need authorization once? Have to approve my emails from my cell phone every time is a royal pita!! Pretty please make att.net a single-authorization mail????? Especially since it's an authorized address!!
- RudĩϐЯaЯïan
So should we replace the old <username>+plaza360demos@mail2ff.com with share@friendfeed.com ?
- scott willeke
We just launched a "Secret email address" service that makes it possible to post to groups anonymously from any email address. This is a bit of a power-user feature, but it's a very useful for automated posting from scripts, forwarding email (e.g. customer service email), etc.
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Monique Wooten, Bill Kinney, Rebeca and 225 other people liked this
Here at the office, we use it to forward all of our mercurial changelog emails, server push notifications, etc to a private group. That way, we all see what's going on in real-time (thanks to the notifier: http://friendfeed.com/setting...), and can easily discuss them from the FriendFeed interface. To add a secret email address, click on "Import a service" in the "settings" dialog of any group. For regular posting, you should continue to use the normal email interface though (share@friendfeed.com or groupname@friendfeed.com, see http://friendfeed.com/share... for details). Thanks to Tudor for writing and launching this!
- Paul Buchheit
Shhh! This is very sekret!
- Andrew Trinh
Interesting. My secret FriendFeed toy.
- phil baumann
I'm in my Private Group, but for the life of me I cannot find this option. Wouldn't it be under Edit Settings?
- Nick in Manila
Ah. NOW I see it.
- Nick in Manila
I am loving this feature idea... Very savvy for business use. Thanks!
- Susan Beebe
This won't be happening in the main feed will it? Anonymous posting destroys services.
- Matthew DeVries
Matthew: No. Your home feed only shows things that you're subscribed to. Of course, if you're a member of a group whose admin allows anonymous posting, and you have that group on your home feed, then the anonymous posts will show up there -- but then, you can always leave the group or remove it from your home feed.
- Tudor Bosman
oh this is genius. there's so many use cases that can leverage this. platform +1
- Sameer
Groups already allow "anonymous" posts -- if you (as an admin) add a service to a group, posts originating from that service will show as belonging to the room, not to any particular user. You can think of anonymous posts (whether imported from RSS services, or posted by email) as being the responsibility of the group admins -- it's their job to police them if they deem necessary.
- Tudor Bosman
I see this working for the Confessions room. What else?
- Josh Haley
Sounds like the email can be sent from any arbitrary email address, not necessarily one registered with FriendFeed for an account? So the secret really needs to be kept secret to valid potential posters only.
- LogEx
Logical Extremes: Yes, that is the point; it doesn't matter what address you send *from*. Sometimes you can't control the address that mail gets sent from. A few examples: your datacenter can notify you by email of any problems affecting your servers, but you'd prefer these notifications to go to a FriendFeed group. You are subscribed to a low-volume distribution list, but you'd rather...
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- Tudor Bosman
Paul has explained how we use this feature internally at FriendFeed. If one of us checks in a change (we use Mercurial for source control), Mercurial sends an email to a secret email address for a private group (that all FF engineers are subscribed to); the others see the change immediately, and we can discuss it in comments.
- Tudor Bosman
Tudor, how would you respond to said email if it is forwarded to the group...
- ld
Cool! Very useful for room owners. If you don't have instructions, it's very hard to find. "Sekret"
- AJ Batac
LD: I don't understand. To which of my examples are you referring?
- Tudor Bosman
Oh yeah. Laughing uncontrollably. WOW.
- Webferret
It sounds like a pro-spam feature. Have you thought through all the consequences?
- Tim Tyler
Tim: the group admins should keep the address secret and only share it with trusted services. If the address gets leaked, then the group can get spammed, in which case the group admins can delete it or change it (which prevents all future mail to the old address from being posted to the group). We believe it to be reasonably secure, but please let us know if you notice any problems.
- Tudor Bosman
Tudor, what is that group, so we can get the engineers working on putting the service icons and service sorting back without having to hack the service with scripts?
- Matthew DeVries
Matthew: :)
- Tudor Bosman
Tudor, you said: "posts originating from that service will show as belonging to the room, not to any particular user". But the posts /do/ show up as belonging to the admin user in a _search result_.
- Ahsan Ali aka. Slick
Ahsan, that's a bug that already existed with how searches handle imported content in groups (not specific to this release and already on our list, thanks).
- Dan Hsiao
Tudor, I'm talking about the forwarding customer emails use case. If you forward the email in. I presume it's captured and I can't think of a way to reply to the customer. The discussion idea is cool tho...
- ld
LD: You're right, you can't reply from within FriendFeed. You could have the contact form send email to both the internal group and a regular email address, which you can then use to send a reply.
- Tudor Bosman
That's what I thought... So you might want to characterize that use case as a cc instead of a forward....
- ld
Tudor: btw. regarding mercurial, what's your experience using mercurial in friendfeed vs perforce in google?
- Amund Tveit
Tudor - what I really like is the business use cases you're laying out here, including your own internal engineering ones. Good stuff, as my e2.0 buddy Sameer above says.
- Hutch Carpenter
using this feature to post blog uptime statistics for several blog to blog owners
- Jeroen De Miranda
Its a good feeling when you know that the people behind a certain product know what there doing. Dont we FF Team?
- Webferret
Use case? How can one use the best readily filtering system available (Gmail filters) with best of breed group collaboration (Friendfeed). This is GOING to become the best in its class. I can drop so many business tools(that i pay for) for just FF Private rooms
- Webferret
Already is Webferret, already is...
- Chris Heath
sweet
- D Lets
Turn Gmail Into Your Personal Nerve Center http://www.micropersuasion.com/2007...
- Webferret
Amund: Mercurial works. We use it in a mostly-centralized setup (one central repo that we sync to very often). Can't really compare performance -- our repositories are tiny compared to Google's. We can take this offline if you'd like to discuss this in more detail.
- Tudor Bosman
That's a great add-on. Slowly, FF is going to be our "life center"
- Ozkan Altuner
So this is kinda like when you posted the "advert"? :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Kol: not quite; the "shameless self-promotion" showed up as an entry in your home feed, without any user (or group) name attached to it. Entries imported into a room (via RSS or via email) show up as being in that room.
- Tudor Bosman
OK, Tudor. I'll give it a test later. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
This is a cool idea, but it only seems to import the mail subject title only. Is that right, if so, how do we get the content of the mail in, or is it not meant to do that?
- Keith Bennett
from BuddyFeed
Keith: it works for me. The subject goes in the main post (FF thread title?) and the message appears as a comment to the thread. Maybe you are sending an HTML e-mail?
- alieb
Cheers alieb, I just tested it by forwarding the first mail in my inbox and that didn't show anything up. Creating a mail and adding some text to the mail body works correctly. Thanks for the help.
- Keith Bennett
I just figured out a new use for this feature and it goes in line with Kevin Rose's idea for an Open Source security system. http://www.facebook.com/video... He was talking about having a neighborhood watch like program. Well each neighborhood can have a private room here in FF. If someone tripped an alarm in your house, it would send an email to the secret email for the private group and everyone in the group could be notified via email,IM,SMS,etc.
- Bryan Lee
I think this secret address should be reminded somewhere in each group settings window.
- Zackatoustra
@Bryan Lee. shhhh lol
- Webferret
Zacaktoustra: group admins will see the address in the "services" window (click "add/edit" under Services in the settings dialog). Other group members will only see the words "secret email address", as, well, the address is supposed to be secret and only visible to admins.
- Tudor Bosman
could we have this for home feeds as well? some 3rd party messaging services will send from various addresses. great feature, thanks!
- Mike Chelen
I'm blonde so maybe need to tell you what I'd like to do and see if it works: I would like to have my ATT mail, my Yahoo mail AND my gmail all feed into a FF room so I could read it all at the same time (ATT and Yahoo are partnered so you can't sign into both at the same time. Both go through Yahoo's sign in page.) Is this possible to create? Having ATT and Yahoo feed into my Gmail through FF would be okay as well, btw. I get FF feeds through GMail already.
- Molly
Molly, what you're asking for is totally unrelated to this thread. If i was you I would set up gmail to receive the mail from your other email addresses. It's a bit complicated but can be done. Try reading this lifehacker gmail article first: http://lifehacker.com/374610...
- Chris Heath
Well said Heath
- Daniel J. Pritchett
from IM
Heath, thanks. I told you I'm blonde. :-P I tried your suggestion already and so far haven't been able to hook ATT and Yahoo to my Gmail (both being POP accounts) w/o paying extra. Will work on it again later. It's not THAT much trouble to check all three accounts from different sources.
- Molly
from email
Molly, another option (if att offers it - i know yahoo does) is to set up forwarding so the email is automatically forwarded from ATT and Yahoo to your gmail address. Then once in gmail you can use filtering (by the to: field) to separate out the emails
- Chris Heath
I think that's the paid service from Yahoo. At least it was when I investigated it a few months ago. Thanks for thinking about it for me, though. Us techblondes need all the help we can get re: setting stuff up. I'm kind of on hold right now anyway (trying to recover my domain name and identity....... long story and boring to all but me). Molly
- Molly
from email
Wow! This is awesome! Thanks.
- Svartling
Eat a bag of dicks, California evangelists.
deusdiabolus, Head Ov Metal, Chris Luckhardt and 84 other people liked this
I noticed several people liked this, but don't know what you mean. Could you clarify in the comments?
- Jason Nunnelley
I'm guessing Prop 8 still stands?
- Lindsey is Fierce!
Yep.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Fuck
- Lindsey is Fierce!
REALLY?
- D. Eda Goze
Freakin' take a stand one way or the other! Either let everybody or nobody have same-sex marriages. WHAT DOES IT MATTER? It's just a legal contract in the end (from the government perspective). <sigh>
- CAJ, somewhere else
this is extremely upsetting. F****!!
- D. Eda Goze
OK, I guess it's what I thought - just a jab at California Christians that believe marriage should be man+woman over the court's decision to uphold Prop 8. You guys should get together and burn some crosses in their yards.
- Jason Nunnelley
Labeling California "evangelists" is just wrong. Like it or not, the people voted not to support it. That is more than just a couple of "evangelists"
- Spencer
Jason, California Christians are free to act on their beliefs in their own lives, but why do some of them feel so compelled to infringe others' rights and happiness?
- LogEx
Sounds like they'd like to burn something other than crosses, Jason.
- Craig Eddy
LOL Akiva that makes me feel better :) just a 'lil
- sofarsoShawn
Spencer, you're right. I shouldn't narrow it down to just California. All evangelists and proselytizers can eat a bag of dicks. Better?
- Akiva Moskovitz
I don't get it. When did the constitution change from 2004? http://www.redorbit.com/news... I thought there were anti-discrimination provisions.. wtf..
- Rodfather
I guess the polygamists don't stand a chance, either.
- Craig Eddy
I think this issue is way more than Christians. I mean, even Obama is against gay marriage.
- Spencer
Craig, no, which is nutty because polygamy isn't considered bad by the Torah.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Spencer, Obama's a Christian.
- Akiva Moskovitz
IMHO, the problem is that the evangelical community outspent and outmanuvered the anti-prop-8 folks and generally did their best to mislead the public. They did it because they knew if California voted down prop-8, they'd really lost and also because everybody was distracted by not having a republican in the white house.
- Wirehead
I'm not really sure if there's a better word to describe the dogtwat section of Christianity that's nice and short and memorable, so evangelical would have to do, I guess.
- Wirehead
I don't agree with you much Akiva but I'm with you all the way on this one.
- Jeff Jones
Heh. Uh, thanks, Jeff.
- Akiva Moskovitz
@LogicalExtremes Are Christians in California denying homosexuals the right to live as they see fit? Don't conflate Christians with a political ideology or "marriage" with unions. The issue some Christians take is the word itself. Call it something else, like civil union, and you lose 99% of the friction. But, [gay marriage] isn't simply about living happily and unmolested. The movement wants to force religious groups to "accept" them. It's a cultural conflict, by design.
- Jason Nunnelley
I respectfully disagree, Jason. Calling the civil-recognized legal pairing marriage was a historical accident, but we're stuck with it. Were people centuries ago to have had perfect foresight, they would have called the whole thing a "civil union" and left "marriage" to the churches. But they didn't, so you've got "Marriage the civil thing" and "Marriage the religious thing". And...
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- Wirehead
Saying that you are OK with it being civil unions but not marriage is like saying that Obama is smart for a black guy.
- Wirehead
@Wirehead So, if I don't want to wed someone in my church because my doctrine clearly states I can't do that, I'm a bigot. That's what you're saying. So, all Christians (including Obama himself) are bigots. Some churches won't perform weddings for people that are previously married to other people. Are they also bigots, or only bigots if they won't wed same-sex partners?
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I fail to see how the state recognizing marriage has implications for your church. The procedure and requirements that I have to follow to be married in the Catholic Church exist for me as a person of faith, not for me as a citizen. The procedure and requirements that I have to follow to be legally married by my state are completely different. My Church doesn't have to marry non-Catholics; my state does.
- joey
No, Jason, what I'm saying is that the Catholic church (or any other, for that matter) continues to reserve the right to not recognize a marriage for a wide variety of reasons. There are reasons why they will refuse to marry a man and a woman. We are talking about marriage in the eyes of the law, which already recognizes my marriage in the same terms as somebody who got married in Vegas by an Elvis impersonator.
- Wirehead
Jason, I think you've fallen for the typical lies and misinformation from organizations like NOM and other fear-mongering propagandists. Those of us trying to secure our rights don't care a whit about what churches do or don't do. What we're looking for is the same rights and privileges that opposite-sex couples who are "married" get. It is all about the public sphere and nothing about...
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- S. Charles Balazs
Well-put, joey.
- Akiva Moskovitz
And relying on religion for defending your thoughts doesn't work for me. I'm not religious and don't follow any doctrine other than my own, which is based on respect, kindness, and love. Telling me I'm going to hell based on where I'd like to place my genitals is weak and doesn't work if you don't believe in hell to begin with, so outside of that, what else do you have?
- Derrick
@Derrick. Well, like anything, your belief in it has little bearing on whether it exists or not. Of course that cuts both ways. I think we've commented on this before that hell, also, may just be simply separation from God (we're assuming God exists here, I know, but bear with me). As such, we're, in essence, in hell right now. It really has nothing to do with your genitals (as...
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- Kevin Kuphal
Kevin, I hear where you're coming from and clearly you have a religious sensibility that I A) lack and B) am fine with. But this is also California. How presumptuous is it to think that everyone is a Christian and believes in Jesus? What a slap in the face to Buddhists, Jewish people, Muslims, etc. I don't doubt your commitment to God and I think that faith is a wonderful thing. I wish...
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- Derrick
*nods* Totally agree with your last there, Derrick.
- Kevin Kuphal
It is unfortunate that emotions sometimes overwhelm us. This is a perfect example of bad law. For the the record I believe the word "marriage" should be removed from any federal, state and local law and the word "marriage" should have no legal standing. The logical part is that the population of California voted to amend the state constitution and the state Supreme Court has said that what the voters voted will stand. Isn't that how our republic is supposed to work?
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
No, Mark. Voters should not be able to directly create laws in a republic. That's what the legislative branch is for.
- Alex Scoble
The sad part, MVB, is that the majority shouldn't be able to vote out minorities from anything. It isn't what this country was founded on or what it should stand for.
- Kevin Kuphal
No, Mark. The constitution--at least, the federal one--was designed more to protect the rights of minorities (taken in the broad sense of "those who are in the minority" rather than the racial/ethnic sense) than to propagate democracy, of which the framers were suspicious at best.
- Steve Lowe
On a more serious note, does anyone actually own such a bag. And, why?
- S. Charles Balazs
Marriage is a purely religious institution and thus ought not be regulated by the state in any way. Let churches do whatever they want (and don't want) to do. However, it's going to take us many generations to evolve into that awareness. So in the meantime, since so many civil rights are conferred upon couples (by governmental and private organizations) who opt to marry/civil-une, they...
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- Anthony Citrano
@Alex Evidently in California it is possible. @Kevin I agree. This is a bad law to begin with. @Steve The federal constitution is by design discriminatory in that it provides for many decisions to be made by majority rule.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
@Akiva, I can tell you're upset, but your expletive made me laugh. That's a good one. :-)
- Joey Gibson
@joeybean @wirehead @scbalazs I view the state's business as purely secular, and wish it were so because I don't consider the state my religion's friend. But, I'm trying to tell people how to get along. Want to pass same-sex unions, call it something besides marriage. If you can't handle that because you want religious people to call your relationship marriage, then it's no longer a...
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- Jason Nunnelley
@acitrano I happen to agree with you, that government shouldn't participate in marriage. But, I think government shouldn't tell me what to do in regards to all sorts of things, as our government works to take upon itself more and more of my personal decisions. But, what "rights" are conferred upon a marriage couple that a simple contract can't institute. Besides I oft wish I could avoid the marriage penalty I pay in federal taxes. Is that a privilege anyone else would want?
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I still don't buy locking down a word. To Catholics, marriage is a sacrament. Should I say that Protestants can't call what they have a marriage or that atheists can't call what they have a marriage because they don't define the word the same way Catholics do? And what about people who don't speak English? Can my gay friends have what I can have as long as it has a different etymology?
- joey
I like the way they do this in Netherlands (and other civilized places): Everyone has to go to the court system for a legally binding union that has all the rights included. If you want to get married, go head on to your church of choice, but the marriage has no legal basis. Solves a lot of problems.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
@joeybean Saying they have the "right" to call their union [marriage] is a position of faith. The argument that it can't be called marriage is also a position of faith. If the goal were purely a physical one, this wouldn't be the argument. It's a spiritual war, a social conflict. It's not good enough for Christians to leave same-sex couples unmolested. It's not good enough that they enjoy legal rights. Christians must use the word you dictate to describe the union, and embrace it.
- Jason Nunnelley
Can someone also tell me why polygamists and same-sex marriages are lumped in with each other? Apples and oranges. I dare say same sex marriage has more to do with my parent's heterosexual marriage than those who practice polygamy.
- Derrick
But Jason, I already have to accept that Mainline Protestants, Evangelical Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, and heterosexual Atheists have the right to use that word...and they don't mean it the same way I do. Some of them, not even close. Do I have to embrace it? Not at all. What I have to do is acknowledge that I don't own a word that has taken on secular meaning.
- joey
@joeybean Because Catholics didn't establish the country, its laws or our principals social structure. Protestants did. Catholics are the minority. This comes from English common law (not Catholic) and American tradition (not Catholic). Sorry, I'm dealing with reality and it's often harsh and immovable. If you enjoy arguing, continue to fight the public on the use of this word for unions between two people of the same sex. If you want success, just side step it.
- Jason Nunnelley
And I love being ignored, too. Thanks for that.
- Derrick
@geekandahalf [Derrick] it's because eroding the social definition has consequences. You can't make an argument for same sex marriage and argue against polygamy. That's duplicitous. The norms that govern one govern the other.
- Jason Nunnelley
Derrick, it's because many people lump everything that's not a traditional marriage into one category. It's kind of how the world is divided into white people and not white people.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Derrick, I think that polygamy is lumped in with gay marriage because of the people who think that legalizing gay marriage would inevitably lead to legalization of other types of marriage, including polygamous marriages.
- Rochelle
Derrick, I think Akiva is right. Also, polygamy makes people jumpy and so lumping gay marriage with it creates a negative association.
- joey
Trust me - they are not only dicks where this issue is concerned.
- Rustic Thoughts
@joey - as if gay marriage doesn't make these same people jumpy? ;)
- Anthony Citrano
OK, @Akiva is calling me a racist again because I don't see the world exactly the same way. You're a very open minded thoughtful person. (insert sarcasm since you may not get it)
- Jason Nunnelley
Are you guys bigots against polygamists?
- Jason Nunnelley
Sorry, Jason, that's a leap that I just don't get. What does me marrying another man, someone I love and want to spend the rest of my time with, affect anyone else? Honestly, what difference does it make?
- Derrick
@geekandahalf [Derrick] is has the same effect as allowing polygamy: none on me personally. But, calling people who don't embrace the choices you make (for personal religious beliefs) a bunch of bigots and spewing hatred doesn't improve society. If you're on board for spreading hate for anyone that disagrees with you, then pick up your pitchfork and start killing believers. That's the...
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- Jason Nunnelley
@jason - I'm not. if three, four, five people want to marry, I don't care. It's simply not my business how they choose to live their lives or conduct their romantic / personal associations. Who am I to judge? While that's admittedly a tangent, it's in that same spirit that I strongly support Derrick's point. If two consenting adults want to get married, who the hell am I to judge or deny them?
- Anthony Citrano
As far as I know, there's no widespread movement to stop same sex couples from living together or living the life they desire. The only conflict is over a word. This is a decision by some (several here) to pick a fight with believers because you hate their beliefs and them as people. It's not about peace, getting along, or living your life unmolested. There are obvious compromises to get around these issues. I really think this is more about anger because people don't embrace your beliefs.
- Jason Nunnelley
I never called anyone a bigot, Jason. I don't hate religious folk, or evangelicals, or anyone of the sort. And all I want, all I've ever talked about, all I've ever said (go back through my thread if you don't believe me), is the same rights and freedom as anyone who's apparently heterosexual. Ask anyone, I'm a lover, not a fighter...even with those who have damned me to hell.
- Derrick
Jason, I used Catholicism as an example because they are very particular and rigid about a definition of marriage, but do you really think the Protestant view of marriage developed independently of the institution they broke away from? Or should I then not be able to use the word 'marriage' since I'm not Protestant? It works all ways. And if your argument is going to turn into...
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- joey
@geekandahalf [Derrick] Sorry, in context I'm talking about @Akiva who continually spews quite a bit of anger in the direction of believers and anyone else that doesn't agree with him. I didn't direct that part toward you.
- Jason Nunnelley
@joeybean My state is already quite out of step with my views. I didn't establish the rules, populism, democracy, etc. I've not disclosed how I define marriage but how most people do. And, if you want a democratic state on your side you'll have to get along with the majority, or kill them. I'd rather agree to disagree and sidestep the matter. But, that's me. I'm not in this fight. I'm just sharing a method that will lead you to victory.
- Jason Nunnelley
BTW, I don't have a problem with polygamy (someone else's definition of marriage doesn't change mine), but it would be more complex in terms of contract law, custody, and other things that the state would have to budget for.
- joey
I think the people that created this legislation are in for a world of woe. Equal rights and love for all.
- ‘-.-’ Tutivillus Grift
I love him. He loves me. We want to get married. We can't. FAIL.
- Derrick
@geekandahalf [Derrick] Can you explain to me how a group of people accepting your union as marriage, calling it that, endorsing it, etc. changes your relationship? This is the part I don't understand.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, imagine someone legally taking away your marriage, calling it that, endorsing it, etc. How does that change your relationship. Hopefully that helps you understand.
- Derrick
Jason, your question was already directly answered a few zillion posts ago in this very thread: "I respectfully disagree, Jason. Calling the civil-recognized legal pairing marriage was a historical accident, but we're stuck with it. Were people centuries ago to have had perfect foresight, they would have called the whole thing a "civil union" and left "marriage" to the churches. But...
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- Daniel J. Pritchett
And I'd rather educate and lobby and fight and hope that opinion changes or that the majourity does. I have no desire to inflict harm on people who have a different belief system than I do, but I do have a desire to make sure that belief system doesn't relegate others to life as second-class citizens. And I certainly don't want the state coming for my (hypothetical) marriage next...
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- joey
tl;dr version: Withholding the M word from certain unions puts the onus on them to slowly earn equal rights by overturning or rewriting one law at a time because so many existing laws specify "marriage". Allowing marriage circumvents all of those decades of additional legal hassle at the expense of what appears to be some bruised egos on the fundamentalist side.
- Daniel J. Pritchett
@joeybean My only reason for using polygamy as a parallel is that you can't make a valid argument against it without using religious or social norms in an argument. We actually put people in prison for practicing a lifestyle that nobody can reasonable deny them. It's adults practicing a lifestyle they choose. It is parallel because it's people practicing a lifestyle they believe in when...
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- Jason Nunnelley
@Jason - The polygamy argument conveniently safeguards marriage in its current form. Why shouldn't the status quo have to justify itself? To go further in the opposite direction - what right does *anyone* have to get married?
- Daniel J. Pritchett
@dpritchett That's a valid argument. But, I don't know what these rights are. What "right" do I have by calling my marriage "marriage?" We have mutual obligations and encumbrances because we are married. But, I don't see the big advantage. We pay more tax, suffer more hassles if we go separate ways.
- Jason Nunnelley
Civil unions aren't currently afforded equal status with marriages. By insisting that non-hetero couples settle for civil-not-marriage-unions society implicitly condones a gap in the rights and status afforded to one class over another. Even if everyone accepts the "fine, but don't call it marriage" argument there is still a lot of ground to cover to afford equal protections to all unions.
- Daniel J. Pritchett
1UP Daniel re: civil unions. Suggest a civil union to a heterosexual couple with those restrictions and they'd reject it too.
- Derrick
gonna track down the video Richard Bluestein did after his partner died. Gets the point across as to why marraige in the eyes of the law (not whatever buddy you call god) should be for EVERYONE that wants it. If you aren't moved by it you have no empathy for your fellow human.
- alphaxion
Separate but equal is impossible if only due to the administrative overhead of maintaining two slightly different copies of every law and form and register. Simple IT problem, eh?
- Daniel J. Pritchett
@dpritchett @Derrick I'd take a nonyabusiness relationship w/ my government. Why do you want government so burried up in your life anyway? Nobody can tell me what these wonderful advantages are that married people enjoy under the law. Pay more tax, more encumbrances in the event of a split. Gene Simmons got it right when he said marriage is a bad deal.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I agree that we don't have the right to restrict. Where I can see the state having issues with polygamy from a practical perspective (not social norms) is with the complexity of contracts...who can sign in what situations and with what documentation, who can make medical decisions, what happens to children who have grown up with half-siblings, etc. in the event of divorce? I...
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- joey
Jason, I'd like the option. Currently I have none.
- Derrick
@Derrick, obviously I just don't see the advantage at all. I keep asking people to explain it to me, how it matters, what I'm enjoying that others can't. But, in regards to the state I just don't get it. It's an easy problem to overcome. But, both sides aren't willing to budge.
- Jason Nunnelley
got it.. http://www.youtube.com/watch... it's a very frank and to the point video. Would you like your love for your partner to be described in that way?
- alphaxion
just don't give up guys - water cuts even stones
- A.T.
Never, A.T.
- Derrick
Hetero example of why you need a legal marriage: a friend of mine married very young. They struggled to get through college together and would have been much better off single as far as housing etc. Soon after they graduated he was stricken with a fatal illness. She was his legal wife and could be there with him, sign documents, make medical decisions and eventually bury him. Had they not been married, just "living together," she would have had no legal rights at all.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
1UP m9m
- Derrick
@m9m That's not a valid example of how marriage is better than civil agreements. If he had given those powers to his wife she would have had them w/out a marriage certificate. I have the very same rights granted me through a legal document.
- Jason Nunnelley
It's a good example in that everyone knows what legal marriage means for that situation, whereas personal contracts can be more ambiguous. I won't have to present my marriage certificate should something happen to my fiance (G-d forbid), I will just have to say 'I'm his wife.'
- joey
There are some rights that can only be gained by marriage, not by any other contract. And here in Virginia, the ill-informed anti-marriage-equality crowd OK'd a law that restricts many such agreements between "non-related" people. The list of marriage rights is pretty commonly available, you can start with Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki...
- S. Charles Balazs
Jason: I said "legal" marriage as in civil marriage. In many cases only immediate family counts - spouses and blood relatives. What happens in an emergency when no power-of-attorney forms have been issued? Just recently my uncle was in an accident, unable to name a representative. I could not even get the name of the hospital he was transferred to, could not find out his condition, and had to go through all kinds of legal hoopla to show I was his only relative. Imagine if it happened to your life partner.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
It's not just about a word, and it's not at all about religion. Jason, you may find it unfortunate that the state is involved in institutionalizing religion, but, unless the state gets completely out of it--essentially stripping everyone of these rights (where you wouldn't be able to visit your wife in the hospital because you're "not family")--then we need to apply the constitutional and judicial principles that we do in these issues.
- S. Charles Balazs
One last point that I'm loath to bring up but feel compelled. We're hearing a lot of statements about marriage equality that eerily repeat the same arguments against interracial marriage. Thankfully these were overturned in Loving v Virginia. We will likely have to have our day in Supreme Court as well. Patience and perseverance will yield justice and hopefully enlightenment.
- S. Charles Balazs
Equating race with sexuality is ludicrous. It's not the same thing at all.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, why not?
- Rochelle
No, equating sexuality with sexual orientation is ludicrous. Equating two things that are fixed by genetics (race and sexual orientation) is not ludicrous, it's perfectly valid and makes complete sense...unless you are a bigot.
- Alex Scoble
@itblogger OK, you're a bigot :)
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, can I ask you a question?
- Johnny Worthington
@rochelles I don't think I can convince you if you really believe it's fair to compare the "right" to be married to anyone you choose and it be recognized and called marriage by all to freedom from racially based slavery, segregation, et al. It's intentionally inflammatory and an immature comparison. You can't honestly compare what black people in America have suffered with what same sex couples suffer. It's just not the same thing at all.
- Jason Nunnelley
So you are saying that homosexual people have not had to deal with the same sorts of oppression as those of non-white races? They've never gotten beaten up for their orientation, nor killed, nor denied access to services that others take for granted? And don't call me a bigot when the shoe is on your foot.
- Alex Scoble
@Johnny Worthington You can ask whatever you like. But, this loose and mentally slothful accusation that anyone that doesn't line up with cosmopolitan views on marriage are all bigots is not winning anyone.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, why did I marry my partner?
- Johnny Worthington
Wow. Just wow.
- Rochelle
@itblogger You are a bigot. Dictionary.com has a clear definition of the word, and your statement reveals you're a bigot. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse...
- Jason Nunnelley
People who claim to be "open minded," and thoughtful people who spew hate and bigotry are behaving intellectually dishonest. [Most people in this conversation aren't doing that.] They try to make their points without dehumanizing those that disagree with them. But, some people just spout hate. It's cool, apparently, to spout hate so long as it's against people that aren't on the cool...
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- Jason Nunnelley
@FFundercat I don't know. I'm not sure what you're reasons are. Some people marry for convenience, some because they think the title means something or adds value to their relationship. I don't know, and I don't rely on the state to determine the value of my relationships. I appreciate your engagement, but this conversation (as a group) started as a cheering camp for anyone that agrees...
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- Jason Nunnelley
Yeah, how dare they agree with me. The nerve of some people.
- Akiva Moskovitz
@Akiva I've no problem with that. But, I've got nothing of value to add. I disagree with your hateful position and think spewing hate toward believers is counterproductive. But, do what you wish.
- Jason Nunnelley
Well, I'm quite comfortable saying that people who want to legally forbid homosexuals from having equal rights are bigots. People who don't care if some people have a religious problem with homosexuals having equal rights (because the issue is a secular, state one, not a religious one) are not necessarily bigots. (They might be bigots about something, but ignoring religious anxiety when it's a secular issue is not bigotry.)
- josh neff, Fun Dip of FF
Sorry, Jason, but you are the person who made the claim that sexual orientation (actually you used a completely BS term for it) isn't the same as race or religion and shouldn't be protected as such...as such, the onus is on YOU to back up your claim. Not on us.
- Alex Scoble
I'm not spewing hate, Jason, and you're misusing the term. I disagree (and obviously rather strongly) with evangelism and proselytization. I'm not saying I hate evangelists. I'm not even suggesting that evangelists are second-classed citizens deserving of fewer rights than other citizens. In fact, if anyone's doing that around here, it's them. So, if you want to accuse someone of 'hate', I think you're talking to the wrong crowd.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Jason, we are talking about denying citizens legal rights that other citizens have, purely based on religious motivations. That to me is a clear violation of the first amendment. If the laws were as they should be, civil union would be the legal contract, and marriage could be whatever people wanted it to mean in the context of their own beliefs. Unfortunately, that is not the structure...
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- LogEx
The reason I ask is that according to the current definition, I only married my wife because she is a woman. That is wrong. I am in love with the person, not the sexual organs. I love my wife so much and could not even entertain the idea of not being able to marry her because of the beliefs of another. I have very close friends who share the same love for each other, but are denied the...
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- Johnny Worthington
@Starbuck The camp position is that all Christians are morons, evil, and should be eradicated. You can easily side step them by simply not using language that's inflammatory. For some reason, that's not an option. @itblogger race and sexual orientation simply AREN'T the same thing, period. Recognizing that doesn't make me a racist. One is behavior, one is race. Calling anyone that...
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- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, are you calling me camp? Dude, just because I support equal rights for queers doesn't make me camp!
- josh neff, Fun Dip of FF
Why can't we use the same philosophy of Jesus (for the Christian groups) - Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's.
- Janet
No, you haven't made your point, you've only proven mine. Thanks for playing though.
- Alex Scoble
I'll add, or reiterate, this is not about orientation. It's about choices and behavior, perhaps contract law. There's no law, no group, no movement afoot to stop same-sex couples from living a lifestyle of their choosing. The issue is over a word, and as long as you battle the people that simply have an issue with that syntax, you're wasting energies that could be better spent somewhere else.
- Jason Nunnelley
Well, who owns the word?
- Johnny Worthington
Jason, hate to break it to you, but you don't get to decide what's important to other people.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Basically, my attitude about this is like my dad's about the Civil Rights Movement (which he was very active in): I don't want to change the way people feel about this, I just want to change the laws so that discrimination isn't legal. If you want to think homosexual marriage is wrong, go right ahead. I just don't want you to be able to legally stop homosexual marriage.
- josh neff, Fun Dip of FF
Choice? What CHOICE? I don't have any CHOICES!??!!??? *head explodes*
- Derrick
No, I specifically called you out separately from the camp. I described the camp position, then dealt with your position. Don't knee-jerk. That reactionary process isn't good for conversation.
- Jason Nunnelley
But, D, didn't you CHOOSE to be gay?
- Akiva Moskovitz
No more than I chose to be right-handed.
- Derrick
Any two consenting adults of legal age ought to be able to enter into a domestic partnership contract. They may then call it whatever the hell they please. Problem solved.
- Christopher A Carr
Wait, I missed something. Did California make it illegal to be homosexual? No, they didn't. The people of California voted to support legislation making a "marriage" definition. Marriage is a choice. I chose my relationships and so does anyone that engages in one. You can say it's not a choice, but it doesn't change the fact that it's a personal decision. Love is another topic. Attraction is also. We're not talking about laws against love, attraction, or feelings.
- Jason Nunnelley
Right, we're talking about a group of people being denied a right afforded another group of people. It's as simple as that.
- Akiva Moskovitz
But Jason, love, attraction, or feelings don't matter anymore, cause it's all about your sexual organs.
- Johnny Worthington
@cacarr [Christopher] Look at the thread's history. I said that some time ago, and for that was called a racist, or a bigot, or something. I can't care enough to reread it.
- Jason Nunnelley
Civil. Rights.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
I'm in a domestic partnership contract, it's called a marriage. Derrick can go into a domestic partnership contract, but he can't call it a marriage...
- Johnny Worthington
Jason, I need to read back through it. The point is that the hang up is over a term "marriage." Get government out of the business of "marriage" and it would seem to me that the problem goes away. Grant all adults of any gender combination the right to enter into a contract with all the same legal rights and responsibilities of what is now called "marriage."
- Christopher A Carr
...then let them call it whatever they will in accordance with whatever church/religious sensibilities they do or do not have.
- Christopher A Carr
Legal and christian viewpoints be damned, you cannot grant rights to a part of the population and take away those same rights to another part. This is the most ridiculous of arguments. As a heterosexual male with a heart of gold, I broke down into uncontrollable tears watching the first news footage of gay couples being married. How can you possibly take away that happiness from two...
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- jcunwired
@jworthington Like I said originally. There's a simple option, nobody wants it. The right-wing wants to argue they are the defenders of marital sanctity. The left wants to make themselves to be the salvation of human dignity, because only they care about human beings and their right to live the lives they want. Meanwhile, people are living the way they want regardless. The state is not my friend. The state is not my god.
- Jason Nunnelley
I'm for removing the "marriage" legal language from all currently married hetero couples... If "marriage" has all this Abrahamic religious connotation, then why is government using the term in the first place?
- Christopher A Carr
Because the State don't do shit to you. You have all the freedoms afforded to you. You have the luxury of arguing over a word. Actually encounter some discrimination, in real life, then come back. Until then, you speak from a footing of sand sir.
- Johnny Worthington
Taking away the word 'marriage' is ridiculous. Instead of granting equal rights, you want to change the language so that you don't have to?
- Akiva Moskovitz
Last I checked, changing 'french fries' into 'freedom fries' didn't stick either.
- Akiva Moskovitz
@akiva Actually, I don't care. I'm telling you why some people have a hang up with it. You can keep on arguing it until you get the government on your side. Perhaps you can get them to ban Christianity and create a perfect utopia. Have fun.
- Jason Nunnelley
Right, Jason, because wanting equal rights for everyone means I want to ban Christianity? Good grief.
- Akiva Moskovitz
"All evangelists and proselytizers can eat..." I interpreted this as an angry position against believers. Did I get it wrong? Do you hate Christians? Yes or no?
- Jason Nunnelley
Of course not. Not all Christians are evangelists or proselytizers.
- Akiva Moskovitz
The thing is Jason... this has NOTHING to do with Christianity. Get over yourself. This is not about you, it's about other people. No one here wants to destroy Christianity, they want their friends to be able to call themselves 'married'... I second Akiva, good grief...
- Johnny Worthington
And I also don't really hate anyone. You seem to have an unhealthy attachment to the accusation, Jason.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Akiva: Shit, this is not complex. As things stand, gay couples *should* be able to enter into "marriage" because the right is afforded to hetero couples. I'm for equal rights here... I want to simplify the whole thing by allowing any two adults access to the rights afforded by "marriage." The term "marriage" is unnecessary as legal language. Grant the actual rights, let heterosexual and homosexual couples call this arrangement whatever they will...
- Christopher A Carr
@Akiva, I have an interpretation that you're completely intolerant of anyone that disagrees with you.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, prove it.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Christopher, the world 'marriage' is important for equality. If separate but equal is not okay for the contract, why should we have to accept it for the language?
- joey
Jason, I disagree with Akiva on just about a billion things, and he seems to tolerate me just fine.
- joey
It's a belief, based on reading your comments in this thread. If telling people to eat a bag of whatever, calling people that discuss differing points of views (or simply more flexible points of views) bigots isn't intolerant, then I'm just going to have to realize we use a different language altogether. Since my goal is to get government off my back, I've really no dog in this fight.
- Jason Nunnelley
joey, no you don't. You agree with everything.
- Akiva Moskovitz
I think he tolerates you better than fine, Joey. :P
- Rochelle
Joey: There would be no separation in my proposal. Any two people can enter into a partnership contract...including gay couples. They may then call the arrangement whatever they like.
- Christopher A Carr
Jason, where did I call anyone a bigot?
- Akiva Moskovitz
This is tolerant commentary.
- Gavin
Christopher, thanks for clarifying.
- joey
@Akiva, you didn't.
- Jason Nunnelley
Then you haven't proven any sort of intolerance on my part. There's a difference between disagreeing with people and being intolerant of them. I did not write, 'I wish Christianity would go away,' or anything to that effect. In fact, I didn't call out all Christians at all; I snarked (and I emphasize the word 'snark' here) a particular group of Christians from a particular locality. If you're going to call me 'intolerant', you had better be able to back it up with evidence.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Oddly enough, the whole argument can be solved by christian logic. Isn't it God's job to judge what is right or wrong? If so, then WTF are evangelicals doing in the middle of it all? Or do they not believe their god is up to the task?
- jcunwired
jcunwired, evangelicals believe that it is their duty to 'save' people from sin. They believe that they are doing the work of G-d and not that they're having to pick up His slack.
- Akiva Moskovitz
That comment is bordering on hateful and rude. Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you have to be rude. You could have said it in a different tone. It seems that Christians can no longer speak their opinion without being blasted by left-wingers as being intolerant, rude or homophobic.
- Gavin
FWIW, I'm an atheist of the Sam Harris variety, and am very disturbed that Christian sensibilities are written into law to the extent that they are in the US.
- Christopher A Carr
But to do so Akiva they would need to judge, and according to what I understand about Christianity, this is a serious deviation from the role God plays in their lives.
- jcunwired
@jcunwired and @Akiva, I'd say a more accurate description of evangelicals is that they believe it is their job to expose people to the teachings they follow. I think they would take issue with someone claiming they believed they could "save people from their sin."
- Jason Nunnelley
Gavin, rude, sure; hateful, nope. Christians have the right to speak their opinion as I am allowed mine. The problem is that Christians use their opinion to bully government into doing their will at the detriment of others. When you try to push your religion on me, expect me to push back.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Jason, yeah, that's a much better framing. And my problem with that is your teachings might not be my teachings and you have as much right to force your teachings on me as I have a right to burn your house down.
- Akiva Moskovitz
@cacarr It all started with that "all men are created equal" statement. That, being the basis of legal equality, later emancipation, and continues to be at the root of equal rights law.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, except when it involves homosexuals, right?
- Akiva Moskovitz
^^touche
- jcunwired
Excuse me? Isn't the United States a democracy? Majority rules? How is this religion being pushed on you? You could say the same for same-sex marriage they are forcing their views on the rest of us. Also FYI, marriage is NOT a right. So don't try that one.
- Gavin
Christians, would you be against homosexual couples in domestic partnership contracts calling themselves "married?"
- Christopher A Carr
Gavin, so, two people of the same sex in a city that is distant from yours getting married somehow affects you? And, if marriage is not a right, then why are there bills to determine who has the right to it?
- Akiva Moskovitz
@Akiva, no I'd say that equal rights continue to be protected under the law as our interpretation of it evolves. But, the godless state is not real. It doesn't exist. You'll have to strip it of its roots to eradicate Christian culture from its practices.
- Jason Nunnelley
Christopher, nope. No more than I'm against couples from other denominations or religions or a lack thereof calling themselves 'married.' Which is to say, not at all. I am 150% in support of same sex civil marriage.
- joey
Jason, so, basically what you're saying is that it is Christians who are standing in the way of equal rights for all people?
- Akiva Moskovitz
I believe in full common law rights equivalent to marriage.
- Gavin
I was just wondering if Christians tend to be against the idea that gay couples would have legal rights, or if they are just hung up on the lexical semantics of "married."
- Christopher A Carr
@Akiva The law may have been a big mistake. I think a better way to go about it is to eliminate state control from our unions. But, I'm not a big fan of the state lately.
- Jason Nunnelley
Gavin, so the homosexuals get a consolation prize? What about religious homosexuals who want the same marriage as their heterosexual peers?
- Akiva Moskovitz
So now we equate gay marriage to godlessness.
- jcunwired
Jason, or just let people alone and stop bullying them around. Let. Them. Marry.
- Akiva Moskovitz
The problem runs even deeper than same-sex marriage. In Canada, where I live, we've had same-sex marriage for a few years. In the past few years the homosexual community has taken the burden of rewriting lots of policies to smear non-supporters of homosexuality as homophobes. I have fear of speaking my full mind on homosexuality in my school for fear of punishment.
- Gavin
Christians, would you have a problem with leaving the designation of "marriage" to your church?
- Christopher A Carr
Christopher, some are against both. We have a domestic partnership law here in Washington and there is a group fighting to repeal it on the grounds that it somehow invalidates heterosexual marriages and that it sends a message that the state condones homosexuality.
- joey
Gavin, that's a completely different issue.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Akiva, it's not. This is where these issues lead. Trust me the same will happen in California.
- Gavin
Gavin, so you're against gay marriage because you're afraid that you'll later be painted as a homophobe?
- Akiva Moskovitz
Damn, beat me to it.
- jcunwired
Furthermore, Gavin, it's a rather startling thought that you might think that homosexuals want equal rights just so they can use that as a platform to launch a campaign of slander against those who didn't want the homosexuals to have equal rights in the first place.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Joey, well, I suppose it's not possible to reason with those people.
- Christopher A Carr
Akiva, it's not that I think that, I know that. We've had same-sex marriage in Canada for a few years now, and their influence on government policies, even going as far as changing definitions of words is far reaching. They are demonizing religious people and painting them across the board as homophobes.
- Gavin
@cacarr I think it's clear that most churches simply don't recognize a union between two men or two women as an ordained or sanctioned union by the Creator. Christians largely appose homosexual behavior in any context, under any name. The issue is whether Christians want to police what they view as sin, and most don't. Most Christians view intoxication as a sin. Few would want to police intoxicants or intoxication on private property.
- Jason Nunnelley
Gavin: So what if there are vocal gay interest groups? I doubt -- even in Canada -- that they have anywhere near the clout of religious organizations.
- Christopher A Carr
Gavin, and haven't religious people been demonizing homosexuals as deviants who have no control over their sexuality, are child molesters, and aggressively pursue heterosexuals on a hellbent quest to anally rape them?
- Akiva Moskovitz
Akiva, from a personal standpoint, absolutely not. I don't not look down on these people, I don't insult them, and I don't treat in a degrading way. I simply don't support their lifestyle and I express that opinion. Just because some religious people make those claims doesn't mean it applies to everyone.
- Gavin
@Akiva, by definition homosexual behavior is a deviation from the norm. The rest of that statement is just more bigoted crap. Now you're saying all believers fear rape from homosexuals. This is propaganda. And, builds a case that you've got a personal issue with religious people.
- Jason Nunnelley
Christopher, actually in the school system which I attend gay interest groups have the most say over policy.
- Gavin
Gavin, sure, but it still doesn't answer your paranoia that there's a homosexual agenda that will somehow erode your quality of life. Last I checked, homosexuals getting married won't cause you to suddenly sprout cancer or make heterosexual marriages somehow less irritating.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Jason, I was asking a question. I wasn't offering my position. Calm down, you're going to hurt yourself.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Akiva, yes it does degrade my quality of life. I am roundly criticized and attacked for my beliefs. You should spend some time with me here and you would see that homosexuals aren't the tolerant bunch they make themselves out to be.
- Gavin
Jason, who determines the norm? Check your history, homosexuality was quite the norm in the Roman Empire.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Left-handed people deviate from the statistical norm...
- Christopher A Carr
@Akiva, aren't all Washingtonians fascists? See, that's not a polite question.
- Jason Nunnelley
Gavin, no need to preach to me. I'm a religious Jew so I suffer shit constantly from smug atheists. But I would never, ever do anything to prevent atheists from having the same quality of life as everyone else.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Jason, I could give a crap less about polite. This isn't a tea party. And, for the record, most Washingtonians are stinky hippies.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Akiva, so you're supporting my statement?
- Gavin
Gavin, no, I'm not. Re-read what I wrote.
- Akiva Moskovitz
@Akiva I think the question insinuates a position. That's why I point it out. As for Rome, I'd say most were still heterosexual. The norm, by natural design, is that a man mates with a woman. This isn't complex. It's the standard in nature for most species and especially so amongst humans. I think these sort of debates are mostly fruitless. You're not going to convince most rigorously...
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- Jason Nunnelley
Akiva, can you explain how marriage relates to quality of life?
- Gavin
Jason, so you think that homosexuality is an unhealthy and negative lifestyle? For you or for the homosexuals?
- Akiva Moskovitz
Gavin, have you ever had a right taken away from you? Has your government ever told you that you don't get to have the luxuries that others are allowed? It's an issue of equality. And the onus is on you to prove that homosexual marriage somehow ruins your life not ours to prove that homosexual marraige doesn't.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Jason, denying equal rights under the law is not ignoring. The effort that was put into passing Prop 8 was tremendous. No one was ignoring homosexuals then.
- joey
Jason, and ignoring homosexuals doesn't make them go away.
- Akiva Moskovitz
So Jason & Gavin when do we get to vote on your marriage equality rights?
- sofarsoShawn
Akiva, actually you're comment about an unhealthy lifestyle brought to mind a study done in Toronto. There was a 20% prevalence of AIDS among homosexual men vs a 0.1% prevalence of AIDS among heterosexual men. No margin of error will close that gap.
- Gavin
Jason, I'm not sure anyone has ever asked anyone to "embrace and encourage" a homosexual lifestyle. I think people are simply asking for tolerance and equality.
- jcunwired
Gavin, couldn't encouraging healthy, monogamous relationships help close that gap?
- joey
joey beat me to it.
- Akiva Moskovitz
sofarsoSeán, can you show me where marriage is enshrined as a right?
- Gavin
Gavin, ask the homosexuals who are denied the right to be married about that.
- Akiva Moskovitz
joey, Akiva, so I guess you have no response to the health risk posed.
- Gavin
Sadly another blow against our great republic. Frankly at this point either we legalize Gay marriage or we abolish any legal rights granted by heterosexual marriage. Anything else is an affront to the thousands of people who died for this country.
- matthew john ernisse
It's just been codified as of today in the state of California for 1 ex.
- sofarsoShawn
Okay, so wait. Gavin, you're against gay marriage because you think it's going to pose a risk to YOUR health?
- Rochelle
Gavin, I hate to tell you this but AIDS doesn't know gender. It's a disease. It can be transmitted between heterosexuals as easily as it can be between homosexuals. Unless you think that homosexuals getting married is going to cause you to become HIV positive.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Gavin - that sounds like a health risk for the homos, not for you - not to mention I don't think it has much to do with marriage in general either.
- Sparky Crocker
Rochelle, no but in a publicly funded healthcare state like Canada's I end up having to pay for these folks.
- Gavin
Wow. Just... wow.
- Rochelle
The health risk posed by what? Gay marriage? I didn't realize that it was a pathogen.
- joey
Gavin, well, you're not black so shouldn't have pay for treatments for sickle cell anemia either, should you?
- Akiva Moskovitz
Gavin, and I have to pay for the treatment of people who want to take my rights away. Welcome to society!
- joey
BTW - what do you have to say about a 26.1% HIV positive rate among straight people in Swaziland? Does that mean straight people shouldn't get married there either?
- Sparky Crocker
I'll bet a shiny nickle that in 10 minutes I can find church in California that will happily marry a gay couple. But that isn't what the issue is, now is it. The issue is about granted spousal rights, a legal position. Perhaps, once the emotional outrage has subsided logic will find a way to obtain these very rights which I firmly believe is a) the goal, b) very doable and c) the morally correct stance.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
Gavin - we pay for it down here too. Just because insurance is privatized it still has to break even at a minimum. When large numbers of people get sick insurance companies raise everyones rates.
- Sparky Crocker
Akiva, sickle cell anemia is not limited to African-Americans.
- Gavin
AIDS isn't limited to gays.
- matthew john ernisse
Dammit. matthew beat me to it.
- Akiva Moskovitz
But a 2000% difference isn't a coincidence.
- Gavin
where did you pull out those statistics from?
- D. Eda Goze
A study done in Toronto.
- Gavin
Link to study, please.
- Rochelle
Gavin, you still haven't been able to support your connection between a disease and marriage.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Yes, I'm looking for it.
- Gavin
Take your time. Please.
- jcunwired
Okay, pretend that I'm taking the AIDS argument seriously for a moment...again, wouldn't encouraging healthy, monogamous relationships (as well as bringing health issues and therefore education out of the closet, pun intended) help fight against it?
- joey
Yes, and what Akiva said. Does this study say that gay marriage causes AIDS?
- Rochelle
You know, Gavin has convinced me. I'm now against gay marriage AND infectious disease.
- Sparky Crocker
I agree with you MVB.
- Steve
link? is it only for western cultures? what about Africa. it's funny that it does not sound like a legit "study done in Toronto".
- D. Eda Goze
Frankly who cares? It's not like letting people enjoy equal rights is going to change anything for you. You could say white heterosexual couples suffer from angst and divorce at a rate of 2000% over gay couples. Who cares, if we make anything a state sponsored 'right' that is afforded any legal status what so ever, it is either afforded to everyone equally or it's not. Anything less and you might as well legislate against interracial couples, or interfaith.
- matthew john ernisse
As I have stated earlier it is more about the future consequences of these actions then this direct result. If you read my earlier comments, you will see what I mean. Also I can't find the study right now, but I will continue to look. It may be on my other pc.
- Gavin
Matthew, if evangelicals win this battle, your statement may not be too far from the truth.
- jcunwired
What kind of wine do you serve with bowl of dicks?
- Matthew DeVries
Global HIV infection rates by country: http://www.wolframalpha.com/input...
- Sparky Crocker
Matthew... White of course :P
- Johnny Worthington
I fail to see how marriage leads to AIDS but I'm engaged, so I'm getting a little bit concerned. Somebody help me out, here.
- joey
Anyways, I got into this discussion because of the original message. I feel that if you can't at least be respectful of the other side I don't think you deserve my attention.
- Gavin
Joey - when you get married you are statistically more likely to share needles with your spouse. That's your AIDS correlation.
- Sparky Crocker
Gavin - I've know Akiva long enough to know he only says "bag of dicks" with the utmost of respect.
- Sparky Crocker
Gavin, I'm all for civil discussion, but why should I have to be gracious and respect those who show no respect for others?
- joey
Sparkles, oh thank goodness we prefer inhalants then! (UM, IN CASE MY SISTER SEES THIS, I'M KIDDING!)
- joey
Gavin, thanks for giving me an assload of the attention I didn't deserve then. Just goes to show how awesome I am.
- Akiva Moskovitz
HAHA, YOUR JOKE IS FUNNY JOEY. PLEASE PASS THE NITROUS AND SODOMY.
- Sparky Crocker
@joey Don't show respect for people that disagree with you. It helps to galvanize them and supports their position. It makes your position look like an inflexible and reactionary position. There's no hope for common ground, so it tells them up front they should dig in and defend themselves.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I was tremendously respectful in conveying my opinions to you. You countered by telling me that as minority, my views (and religion) don't matter. That's not common ground...that's one side oppressing another because they have the upper hand at the moment. Why should those being oppressed have to give in and settle for less? And for the record, I AM inflexible with regard to equal rights.
- joey
You could solidly argue because gay relationships are discriminated against it forces them in the closet and contributes to those factors of promiscuous, anonymous sex. No one wants to be an outsider. Whereas if it wasn't considered an "abomination" as the religious fundy's claim and gay relationships through marriage or otherwise were maybe not the norm but at least acceptable, it would help to prevent HIV/AIDS which I see, the higher %s, as being largely due to the discrimination we've just seen today.
- sofarsoShawn
@joey You're applying meaning to my statements that weren't intended. I said this country's language and laws are based on protestant beliefs and traditions. I said nothing about your faith or your personal views, let alone their value or worth. I'm dealing in reality. Exposing history and facts doesn't make me a bigot. Calling me a bigot (not accusing you personally) doesn't change those facts.
- Jason Nunnelley
To they who say that @joey is wrong - if the framers, the lawmakers, the founders of our society thought that the sactity of the marriage extended to the word 'marriage' then they should not have wrote it into secular law. The term for the ultimate binary partnership between 2 people should not have used a holy word, they should have used a legal-ish word. They defiled and bastardized...
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- Matthew DeVries
Jason, I haven't used the word bigot once in this 300-post conversation (as you noted), so I have no idea what you're talking about.
- joey
50 state us estimates, Male-to-male sexual contact: 487,695 Injection drug use: 255,859 High-risk heterosexual contact: 176,157 that is not a %2000 difference. Also for the diagnoses in 2007 Male-to-male sexual contact: 16,749 High-risk heterosexual contact: 11,111 . That is not a big difference. Also %59.2 of aids patients are black. so they should not get married as well right?? aids...
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- D. Eda Goze
Joey - not that it belittles your statements or beliefs, but how are you a minority?
- Sparky Crocker
Matthew, you make a good case against my proposal....
- Christopher A Carr
Sparky, in the context of this conversation, he was saying that the Catholic definition of marriage doesn't matter because Catholics are a minority.
- joey
!!!!! Isn't Catholicism the #2 religion in the world? !!!!!
- Sparky Crocker
@Matthew DeVries Ever since the patriarchs allowed for a writ of divorce the marriage term has been belittled. The New Testament is so confusing because people don't know what the word means, so when it's used in its secular context the readers often misunderstand that it's not talking about a spiritually acceptable marriage, but a union recognized by the patriarchs, then the religious leaders, then the state.
- Jason Nunnelley
If not #1?
- Sparky Crocker
Only if you don't count "protestants" as 1 faith, which in a debate between the catholics and any other protestant faith, they'll always stand together against Rome.
- Matthew DeVries
To be clear here, on the issue it wasn't strictly due to Christian evangelicals, they may have spearheaded the campaign but they were able to ally themselves with largely many of the immigrant communities of the Muslim and Hindu faith who believed/argued as much that this was a "Family" values issue. It's a "fundy" issue so to speak.
- sofarsoShawn
I thought Islam was closely followed by Catholics followed by Pretestants
- Sparky Crocker
@joey What I said is that Catholics didn't found the country, set the law, or establish the basis of its origin. Protestant Englishmen established the language. That's why it's called "English Common Law." Our law is built upon that law and its origins. And, yes, it comes from Catholic heritage, but it also comes from Judaism and we don't forbid eating certain foods as "clean" and "unclean."
- Jason Nunnelley
My grandmother is a 94 year old Catholic's Catholic, still going to church 4 days a week. She supports gay marriage because what she gained from her religion is tolerance, and as mentioned before, she feels as though only God has the right to judge.
- jcunwired
I am deeply saddened by this decision in Cali. I am glad to see that the Friendfeed community are the good peeps that I knew them to be. Legislating exclusion is wrong and a very slippery slope.
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Jason, that's exactly my point, though. Definitions evolve over time and if Protestants can redefine marriage from Catholics (who redefined from Jews) then why can't the secular definition evolve?
- joey
I can clear up the HIV infection discrepancy issue somewhat. HIV is more easily transmitted via anal sex than it is by vaginal intercourse. However, this is not as much the case in much of Africa due to the prevalence of certain parasitic infections the create a situation of increased blood exchange during vaginal intercourse. And single gay men get laid more frequently because, well,...
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- Christopher A Carr
American law is as such: Magna Carta, English Common Law, Constitution, state contitutions, amendments, regulations, social understanding, cultural interpretations, binding legal decisions in recognized courts.
- Jason Nunnelley
Christianity is the biggest in the world. Roman Catholics are the biggest single christian faith, but they are much smaller than the whole of the non-Catholic Christians counted together.
- Matthew DeVries
And Jason, the "major faith" of the founders was Church of England - which as a child of a Catholic and and Anglican, I can tell you, they're same fucking thing, just one has a Pope.
- Matthew DeVries
The court did not legislate exclusion today
- Steve
Matthew, that reminds me of a joke...
- joey
You know, if the framers of the constitution had intended the bible (and a given person's individual preferred translation and interpretation thereof) to be the source of our complete sense of normalcy and ethics, we'd have written the law in terms of the bible. It's a perfectly valid way to frame a government, especially if you provide a lengthy text of interpretations, a la sharia...
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- Wirehead
Church of England = Diet Catholic, all the sins for half the guilt? That one joey?
- Matthew DeVries
Haha, no but I like that. It's 'Why can't Anglicans win at chess? Because they can't tell the difference between a Bishop and a Queen!'
- joey
Christopher Carr - WTF? Did you read a pamphlet about AIDS in 1989 and just quit learning about it since then? All of those are 80's myths about AIDS, with no actual peer reviewed data to back it up.
- Matthew DeVries
The information about associations between parasite load and vaginal HIV transmission in Africa is relatively new.
- Christopher A Carr
@Matthew what @joey was saying was similar, except she wanted me to recognize that since her faith only recognizes a Catholic Church ordained union and yet still calls us condemned sorts married, that we pseudo-Christians should be cool calling same-sex couples married. The problem here is that non-Catholics view marriage as including non-believers, believers, divorced people, etc. The...
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- Jason Nunnelley
Jason - if the framers, the lawmakers, the founders of our society thought that the sactity of the marriage extended to the word 'marriage' then they should not have wrote it into secular law. The term for the ultimate binary partnership between 2 people should not have used a holy word, they should have used a legal-ish word. They defiled and bastardized their own sacrament and now the...
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- Matthew DeVries
Furthermore, over eighty million dollars was blown on this stupid law. Do we want to talk about the *good* that eighty million dollars could have done instead of going to taking rights away from people who happen to prefer the company of the same gender?
- Wirehead
Christopher, link to article or source about the "parasite load and vaginal HIV transmission" please.
- Rochelle
Jason, see what I did there? We're going have "The" debate, not "your" debate. You will be held to debate team standards, which includes, not allowing Straw Men.
- Matthew DeVries
@Steve If it isn't exclusion than what is it?
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Jason, I don't in any way view non-Catholics as condemned. That's not the worldview I'm looking through. I was trying to illustrate that definitions are not owned by any one group. Also, while the Magna Carta certainly influenced the United States, it doesn't actually have legal bearing here. Our legal system also diverges from common law; it's not the sole source. We have constitutional supremacy.
- joey
@Matthew DeVries You're dealing with "should" and I'm dealing with "is." My country wasn't founded by people that believe in the same things I believe in, largely. They owned slaves, traded in religious colloquialisms. They largely didn't practice what many modern Americans would consider sound Christianity. But, we deal with the laws and the culture we're handed by history and heritage.
- Jason Nunnelley
mar·riage [ márrij ] (plural mar·riages) noun Definition: 1. legal relationship between spouses: a legally recognized relationship, established by a civil or religious ceremony, between two people who intend to live together as sexual and domestic partners mar·riage [ márrij ] (plural mar·riages) It's not a religious term.
- m9m, Crone of FriendFeed
Jason - if the framers, the lawmakers, the founders of our society thought that the sactity of the marriage extended to the word 'marriage' then they should not have wrote it into secular law. The term for the ultimate binary partnership between 2 people should not have used a holy word, they should have used a legal-ish word. They defiled and bastardized their own sacrament and now the...
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- Matthew DeVries
@m9m Why two people? Isn't that closed minded?
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, this is a debate over homosexual equal rights, not polygamy.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Mawwage. Mawwage is what bwings us togethew today. Mawwage, that bwessed awwangement, that dweam within a dweam And wove, twue wove, wiww fowwow you fowevah So tweasuwe youw wove And do you, Pwincess Buwwercwup,
- Matthew DeVries
@Akiva Sorry, I didn't realize there were rules. It seems to me if you're going to require people accept a definition of a word that the majority feel means something you don't like, you may as well clean the word up completely and remove all limitations from it.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, I'm just trying to prevent you from derailing this discussion by bringing in practices that have nothing to do with homosexual equal rights.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Christopher Carr - LOL - Yes, all the words that you said are quoted in the articles linked, but not even remotely in the order that you claimed they did, to convey any message remotely supporting your conclusion.
- Matthew DeVries
Jason, if you want to start a debate about polygamy, start a new post.
- Rochelle
@Akiva, you're not convincing anyone to believe anything they don't already believe. This discussion isn't changing anyone's position. @Rochelle I will abstain from this discussion though. I don't like the rules. See, that's how easy it is. Someone here should take notes.
- Jason Nunnelley
Jason, let's also debate the US postal service and their rates, while we're at it. Because, you know, that has as much to do with gay marriage as polygamy does.
- Rochelle
Matthew, what are you taking issue with exactly?
- Christopher A Carr
Well, you do realize, Jason, that over time we've moved from a culture where gays were afraid to come out of the closet at all to where we are today. So, no, the debates on homosexuality have born fruit. Just not in the direction you want them to.
- Wirehead
Call me when we get to man-goat marriage. I have some input for that.
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
from fftogo
Matthew: "ONE of the biggest mysteries of HIV is why the virus spreads so readily via heterosexual sex in Africa, but not elsewhere. A study in monkeys suggests parasitic worms may be to blame" : http://www.newscientist.com/article...
- Christopher A Carr
Christopher, what exactly does that have to do with gay marriage equality?
- Rochelle
Jason, when did I ever say my intention was to convince anyone of anything? I'm just horsing around.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Rochelle, it's a long thread... one of the Christians in the conversation was bringing up HIV infection rate discrepancies between heteros and gays...
- Christopher A Carr
Rochelle, if the gays get married we all get AIDS. Didn't you see them state that as fact? Case closed!
- Sparky Crocker
Also, Jason, your trying to derail this topic has as much to do with my intentions as polygamy does gay marriage.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Rochelle: While I'm on the same side as Matthew on this political issue, he was taking me to task because I think he would prefer that there were no differences in anal and vaginal sex as regards HIV transmission.
- Christopher A Carr
Akiva - in all seriousness I think the two are related. I think a basic human right is love - I don't care who it's between; a man and a women, two men, two women, three men, whatever - so long as it only involves consenting adults what harm is letting people go off and love each other? If someone has two partners should only one of them be allowed to visit them in the hospital on their deathbed?
- Sparky Crocker
But this is off-topic at this point...
- Christopher A Carr
Christopher, you do realize that straight people can have anal sex as well, right?
- Rochelle
Rochelle: pics or it didn't happen!
- Sparky Crocker
Akiva: techno-hippie, thankyouverymiuch.
- Sparky Crocker
Sparky, TWSS
- Rochelle
Of course I do, Rochelle. Blood exposure is the issue, not sexual orientation per se...
- Christopher A Carr
+1 Sparky - twice!
- jcunwired
Uh. I accidentally deleted my last comment. I called Sparky a hippie. Because it's true. He's stinky, too. Just like a Washingtonian.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Akiva, I grew up in Eugene... talk about hippies.
- Christopher A Carr
Hey now - of the many hippy traits I have a strong scent isn't one of them. I'm kinda anal about hygiene and am allergic to fragrances.
- Sparky Crocker
Haha. Sparky said "anal" and "hygiene" in the same sentence.
- Rochelle
I still can't stand the smell of patchouli...
- Christopher A Carr
I have good anal hygiene too, but I wasn't really going to trumpet that horn on that one without your prompting Rochelle.
- Sparky Crocker
Pics or it didn't happen?
- Rochelle
Awesome. You know that one is going to be the post that comes back to haunt you.
- Neal Jansons
from IM
GREAT WE'VE TOTALLY DERAILED THE SUBJECT
- Akiva Moskovitz
The only thing worse than a hippie from Washington is a hippie from Oregon.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Wow, who could have seen that coming?!
- joey
BACK ON TASK: evangelists are dick-bag eaters, everyone else hates on the homophobes.
- Sparky Crocker
DON'T TALK SHIT ABOUT OREGON. Now finish your bag of dicks.
- Christopher Harley
@Joey, should you really talk about something coming on a thread about eating bags of dicks? ;-)
- Joey Gibson
Hahaha. Apparently no.
- joey
I grew up with hippies, they aren't stinky.
- jcunwired
Just stinky nug. :)
- Mathew A. Koeneker
Now that's a BIG gulp
- Neal Jansons
from IM
Wait - stinky nug? Does this provide the tie necessary to say gay marriage == increased drug uses in minors?
- Sparky Crocker
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand scene. Thank you everyone for playing!
- Akiva Moskovitz
This might be one of those test cases for **** can get a lot of responses. :-)
- moon_shadow70
To be very honest, the response this thing got completely surprised me. It was a throw-away comment, a moment of frustration, and a chance to bring in a little aggressive levity to hopefully make a few people chuckle.
- Akiva Moskovitz
It's now your post with the most comments. Very telling that it beat out The Atoll of Succulent Areolae.
- Christopher Harley
Dang. :(
- Akiva Moskovitz
Damn almost 400 comments, that's a lot of dick eating, especially with the bag full conversion.
- Steve C
Really, he had us all at dicks.
- Sparky Crocker
Actually I think I have the solution, one that should be acceptable to Jason Nunnelly. Let's make same-sex marriage legal. People can get married to another person of whatever gender. It's marriage, legally, just like different-sex marriage. But written into the law should be a stipulation that people like Jason and members of his church should be permitted, without penalty, to use...
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- Nathan Rein
@nathan and create an new epithet? cause that's the connotation that word will have in those circles. It's a covenant for the love between the people getting married in the eyes of law, that they are effectively one and can speak for the other when situations arise where they can't do so themselves - whether that covenant has extra things associated with it in someones faith is neither...
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- alphaxion
<hijack>Gavin, out of curiosity, do you live in Abbotsford, BC or in the Fraser Valley?</hijack> I live in Canada - Vancouver to be exact - and I've never seen any evidence of the kind of anti-Christian rhetoric from LGBT communities that you speak of.
- cecily
My Sweet Babies - http://www.flickr.com/photos...
webosapien (Burcu Tüzün), LPH™ and his dog P™, Parth Awasthi and 59 other people liked this
Bella on left and Bruno on right. <3
- Carmen
from Bookmarklet
so adorable
- @CrystalinaB
Another set of boy/girl twins on FF!
- Trish R
I know they look like it, but they're not related. But they don't mind being called twins, especially if they can be in the same boat with the other cute FF twin babies. :)
- Carmen
They need Friendfeed shirts!
- Trish R
They need treats!
- Alex Scoble
they are cuties & need some treats from the baker's dog ;)
- mike "glemak" dunn
Mike, they got treats from the Baker's Dog today. :) I think I gave them peanut butter & honey ones.
- Carmen
Trish, it would be hilarious to put them in FF shirts!!! Here they are in their Falcon shirts: http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- Carmen
Seeing this makes me have need for fur fix. Must kiss those puppies for me!
- Janet
Will do, Janet!
- Carmen
ah cool - mine like the cheese and bacon ones, for the those playing at home - http://bakersdog.com/
- mike "glemak" dunn
Carmen, those shirts are cute. They definitely need FF shirts, get to work on that, Carmen. LOL!
- Trish R
Great name, Margo. ;)
- Carmen
what a couple of cuties. The one on the right seems particularly camera friendly!
- Helen Sventitsky
Bella and Bruno are cute!
- Louis Gray
beautiful pups!
- timepilot
Gorgeous!
- Timothy Griffin
Faces only a mother could love. ;-)
- Brian Sullivan
You must be a proud mamma. They are adorable! My boyfriend in college had two of these and when we split up I cried more over losing them than him ; )
- Adriana
lol! I can understand that, Adriana! I am a proud mamma. They are wonderful dogs.
- Carmen
nice-looking dogs. mama should be proud.
- docrivs
Love! :-))
- Anna Haro
Love and miss my dog. She was an Albino Harlequin Great Dane. All white with blue eyes, and the best dog I ever had. They look like a great pair together!
- Michael Fidler
he looks a bit like Brando in this one: http://www.flickr.com/photos...
- j1m
Vibram Five Fingers: Discover the Barefooting Alternative - http://likaholix.com/ryankan...
HealingBrush, John (a.k.a. dendroica), Mia Huang and 65 other people liked this
I am thinking of buying these shoes today.Wondering if other people have bought them as well. Are they good to use on a treadmill?
- Bindu Reddy
from Likaholix
Robby has some like that.
- Paul Buchheit
Paul do you know if he likes it? I have to return the pair of shoes I bought yesterday if I buy these instead
- Bindu Reddy
I am thinking of getting a pair, too, as soon as I make time to hit zombie runner in palo alto. I read Tim Ferris' http://bit.ly/e3tDI, check out the Cautions and Cons - it looks like it takes a while to get used to them.
- David Vasileff
Looks good for running on the beach
- Rodfather
I love mine. I wear them all over town. Wish I could wear them at work. Sooooo comfortable.
- Brian Newman
they are decent shoes but i dont end up wearing them too often because they take too long to put on (i recommend getting some toe socks too) so i still mostly wear flip flops - its just hard to beat the flip flop :P - end result, i mostly only wear them for applications where flip flops arent ideal, like they were nice for climbing over rocks along the shore in hawaii
- bob
look into the KSO verison (keep stuff out) ...try them on in a store...you need to wear for a few weeks walking about first before you try to run...all depends on usaage ...for better advice contact my good pal http://www.barefootted.com
- Gordon Montgomery
I want one of these!
- Sinan Ata
bob, I am a huge flip-flop fan as well.. However you can't wear flip-flops and use gym equipment in this gym I just joined. I wish you could ... So I am trying out figure out what is the next best thing
- Bindu Reddy
Ooooh it's got toes! To scale walls!
- sofarsoShawn
I would love a pair of these, but I hear they don't fit people like me whose second toe (the one next to the big toe) is longer than the big toe. Is that (still) true? Anyone?
- Grey Drane
I've known a couple people who've gotten them, the Sprint model specifically. One has run in them and is working up the mileage and the other wears them all the time instead of regular shoes. I'm probably going to buy some as soon as I get myself over to Coral Gables to try them on in person.
- CAJ, somewhere else
Here's my review: http://piaw.blogspot.com/2008... (and guy Kawasaki thought they were cool http://piaw.blogspot.com/2008...)
- Piaw Na
I bought a pair last week and love them. I'll need another pair though, so I can wear one while I'm washing the other.
- Graham English
Piaw you make these sound like the ultimate Chick magnet :)
- Private Sanjeev
Sanjeev, with my ugly face, they *have* to be, to attract any kind of attention from women!
- Piaw Na
Certainly an interesting concept, but, given no padding and hardly any wear surface that I can see, on reflection much too expensive for presumed fairly short utility, couple of months running at most. Would be nice to try, but then what... I can not conceive of disposable running shoes.
- ianf ⌘
from what i understand running shoes, to be protective, in any case, need to be replaced every several months. Need to protect those joints! Shoes which help you develop muscles in your feet will help do that too, i believe. But I'd assume you'd have to start off slow.
- Marg Uerite
There are two competing theories. One is that you need to "protect" your tender feet from damage. The other is that, as long as you aren't bleeding because you stepped on something, all's good with the world. These only make sense if you believe in the second theory. If I were to start running, I'd probably get a set. But right now, I'm having altogether too much fun biking.
- Wirehead
Wirehead, you mean biking wearing those? Is the sole hard enough to withstand wear and tear of average pedals. It's unfortunate that the makers haven't posted a closeup/ slowed-down video of feet walking and running in Five Fingers whatever [addendum: and so we have to make do with a Vimeo "review" <http://bit.ly/e3tDI> by a third party, which is made up of 5% shoe opinion and 95% am-i-beautiful-or-not third party ego.]
- ianf ⌘
I don't think I like the idea of biking in one of those. No, I have a pair of bike shoes with clipless pedals. But if I were to be running instead of biking, I'd want to at least try Five Fingers. IIRC, there's kevlar in the soles, so just because it's thin and flexy doesn't mean that it's not sturdy.
- Wirehead
Yeah, well that thin kevlar "insole" isn't the wear-and-tear part of it, a thin rubber layer is.
- ianf ⌘
A friend began running barefoot several years ago. He can do 5k now. Of course, Kenyans can run marathons barefoot.
- John Lam
That reminds me of this article, stating that the most expensive shoes bring the highest risk of injury: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home...
- Brome
'Liked' but doesn't stop it being any less rank. R A N K!
- Toby Graham
I ran 5 minutes barefoot on a treadmill yesterday, for the first time ever. My feet really hurt by the end. The muscles, tendons, and ligaments needed to keep your heel from smacking into the ground are severely underdeveloped due to modern footwear.
- Darren
I spoke to a physical therapist about this, and he said that basically, if you have any kind of over pronation, or other foot-type disability, going bare foot is a good way to give yourself knee, hip or neck problems. Remember, the stories of athletes going for miles barefoot are examples of top physical specimen, and you may or may not be one.
- Piaw Na
darren, you hit the nail on the head. Barefoot running or even FiveFinger running should be approached slowly. Our bodies adapted to the tools we thought we needed for running/walking/etc. Your body has to "unadapt" so to speak.
- CAJ, somewhere else
alan, exactly. i'm going to try to work up slowly. i hope i can keep it up and report results in a month or two.
- Darren
our ceo has them. he wears them every single day at work and loves them.
- Charles Hudson
And the nature of your business being....?
- ianf ⌘
just got an email titled "three years of college latter, and.." AND YOU SHOULD GO THE HELL BACK TO COLLEGE KTHXBYE
chrisofspades and Tommy Williams liked this
Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it.
Henry David Thoreau (1817 - 1862)
Tommy Williams and Ladybug Heather liked this
Facebook Launches OpenID Support - Users Can Now Login With Gmail Accounts - http://www.insidefacebook.com/2009...
Ufuk Kılıç, Rui Pires, Darren Heydon and 18 other people liked this
WOW.
- Mona Nomura
from Bookmarklet
I was just reading about it, very cool !
- Nir Ben Yona
Would probably be cool except I always have to dig around to find my OpenID URL since it's harder to memorize than my email address and I don't trust letting the app/browser save the info. Wasn't OpenID supposed to make this easier?
- Glenn Batuyong
While this may not "technically" be OpenID, enabling users to log in via Gmail is a great step. I've actually written about OpenID on PixelBits that generated a pretty interesting discussion here: http://friendfeed.com/monasfe...
- Mona Nomura
Who's in your FriendZone? - http://ff.deasil.com/friendz...
Steven Perez, Steve C, Morton Fox and 12 other people liked this
Not enough penguin!
- The Bohemian Penguin
from fftogo
Quite the even disbursement.
- Derrick
Yeah I didn't really get this chart. I'm not even subscribed to Lindsey Is Fierce (blocked actually).
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
from IM
lol
- Cee Bee
And why did they put you in your own friend chart? :D
- Carmen
Exactly. I'm so confused.
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
from IM
The FriendZone isn't about who you're subscribed to, exactly. It looks at who subscribes to you (first level) and then all the that subscribe to them. Out of that pool of people, it then orders everyone with the people at the top (R Scoble here) having the most subscribers out of that specific pool of people (the people that follow you and all the other people they follow).
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
So basically, Lindsey shows up on your chart not because you're subscribed to her, but because a lot of people who subscribe to you also subscribe to her.
- FFing Enigma (aka Tina)
Aziz Ansari Mad About 'Fake' IMAX - http://movies.yahoo.com/feature...
Michael Scarpelli, Tommy Williams, Andrew C and 8 other people liked this
"Apparently, IMAX rolled out a digital projection system last year that can be easily installed in a normal movieplex and doesn't require those huge film reels of a traditional IMAX projector. The downside is that the screens of these "Fake IMAX" theaters -- as Aziz calls them -- can be as much as a quarter of the size of standard IMAX screen."
- Steve C
from Bookmarklet
But the real problem is that the IMAX Corporation along with its partners, theater chains AMC and Regal Cinemas, are refusing to distinguish between the two formats. Moviegoers will not know what kind of IMAX experience they will have until their tickets have been ripped. The theaters however, are charging the same price for "fake" digital IMAX as they do for "real" film-based IMAX.
- Steve C
IMAX co-CEO Richard Gelfond argued that such a distinction is unnecessary because, "People don't say 'The 3 isn't a real BMW because it's smaller.'" As the LF Examiner -- a journal devoted to "large format" film -- points out, this is an illogical analogy: car buyers would be plenty upset if they paid around $120,000 for 7-series Beemer and instead received 3-series worth only $30k.
- Steve C
When asked about Aziz's internet screed, Gelfond was dismissive. He told MainStreet.com, "The overwhelming majority of comments on that guy's blog this morning, more than 90% of them, are vehemently disagreeing with him. And consumers are confirming this with their continued purchases of tickets." In an apoplectic rebuttal on his blog, Aziz retorted: "WHAT A SURPRISE ANOTHER IMAX LIE....
more...
- Steve C
This blows it's not IMAX if your neck isn't hurting when you leave the theatre.
- Steve C
And now I have a reason to not ever go to an IMAX movie. Lame.
- Alex Scoble
Heck, liked for being the first article I've seen on this with an actual ratio of size-to-size. I don't know what the size of the screen is in my local theater, but it is definitely much larger than the 1/4 size there. I think part of the field of view discrepancy has to do with the seating configuration more than anything else - the "museum" IMAX theaters have very steep seating.
- Jennifer Dittrich
It's hard to picture unless you're there at an IMAX theater but the "real" IMAX theatres are that much larger. The exception being like a local giant theater, like "Big Newport" here in OC that one is about half the size of IMAX.
- Steve C
@Steve C - that sounds similar to the one in Lacey. It is actually quite huge (I would guess at least 60 ft tall), but the seats slope back "normally" for a stadium seating theater, instead of the really steep slope of most IMAX. It does fill your field of vision though, if you're sitting anywhere but the very outside.
- Jennifer Dittrich
@jennifer 60 feet is 6 stories, are you sure? :P
- mjc
"IMAX Mini" !
- Andrew C
Zachary Quinto's fingers glued together for Mr Spock's salute | The Daily Telegraph - http://www.news.com.au/dailyte...
Matthew Arata, Matthew Kob, Peter Stuifzand and 19 other people liked this
I feel him. I can't do it either :(
- Veronica
from Bookmarklet
This is the easiest thing in the world for me, but I could never raise just one eyebrow.
- Kevin Fox
I can do both eyebrows!
- Veronica
I can do all those and wiggle my ears!
- MG Siegler
I can do it quite easily. I'm sure playing guitar helps.
- Chris Luckhardt
I was able to do it on the first try as a kid, and I also do the eyebrow. I can do the other one, too! (Glad i'm not the only one, Veronica. :D)
- Haggis (Sean Loyless)
It was immediately apparent to me watching the movie that Zachary wasn't able to do this properly. Heh heh! Needed a new SFX shot, imo.
- Stephen Mack
I had a feeling at the end that he couldn't, also.
- Veronica
I can't do that either, and my geek friends make fun of me:(
- Fee501st
it amazes me that an able bodied person couldn't do that.
- jccalhoun
I think people who can do the salute are genetically pre-disposed to be geeks. (myself included) Everyone else has to work at it. Also I'm your go-to guy in case there's a alien machine you need me to turn on to release all the oxygen trapped on Mars.
- William Kapes
this is discrimination!
- Veronica
yes it is! Oh well who wants to be a Vulcan anyway....
- Fee501st
I've never had trouble doing it, but I can't roll my tongue.
- Ranger Craig
Zefram Cochrane couldn't do it either and he invented Wrap drive!
- Fee501st
I can do the salute and both eyebrows, unfortunately I can't do 'normal' things like click fingers tho. lol
- Amy
I can salute like a Vulcan and raise my right eyebrow. Can't do the left, though.
- Barry Biddlecomb
from twhirl
Great. Another reason for the Trekkies to bash the new movie
- Fleagle
I can do the Vulcan salute with my left hand, but not with my right.
- Tudor Bosman
Spock's father (from ST IV) couldn't do it either and had to compose them off-camera and then lift them into view.
- Kevin Fox
I used something to space my fingers apart and kept it that way overnight. The next morning, I could do it at will!
- Jason Wong
It's ok he couldn't do that. It's a muscle that has to be trained. He's a good actor and looks like Leonard Nimoy. Oh, yeah... and he's totally hot.[/crush] Anyhoo, I can do it with both hands. But I can only raise my left eyebrow.
- Pamela
good
- 黄的箭
Eh? That's ridiculous, I can't understand how anybody could not do that.. Have I been doing it wrong all these years?
- David Young
from BuddyFeed
Maybe I'm out of line here, but 'the vulcan salute' sounds like what geeks would call 'spanking the monkey'.
- Fleagle
I can do the salute with my right hand, but not my left (which is my writing hand) hmmmmm.
- Charlotte M
Take a Dump In Your Pants If You Need To - http://www.elitefeet.com/take-a-...
Müjdat Korkmaz, Tommy Williams, fx and 2 other people liked this
Gizmodo - Man Threatened, Arrested For Taking Picture Of Open ATM In Public - Atm photo - http://gizmodo.com/5250851...
Mrsth, Kol Tregaskes, Alan Calvert and 24 other people liked this
"Despite the fact that this photo was snapped in broad daylight in a busy Seattle REI store, Shane Becker was threatened by fake cops and arrested by real ones. One of the Loomis & Fargo guards servicing the public ATM threatened to tackle Becker if he tried to leave the store—apparently snapping a photo of the inside of one of these machines constitutes a security threat (although detailed images and data can be found easily online). In fact, one of the arresting officers even pulled the 9/11 card"
- Thomas Hawk
from Bookmarklet
The photographer should have tried to leave to see if the guard really would tackle him. Easy lawsuit cash there.
- Dave Roth
with an iPhone no less.
- Thomas Hawk
Dave - i was thinking the same thing. I read this the other day. mind-blowing. He's going to be rich... detained by PD without RAS = $$
- Jeff (the メガマクダジ of FF)
Awesome, and in a bad way. Thanks, Thomas - reshared.
- Anthony Citrano
While I'm big on photographers rights and everything and I think the Wells Fargo dudes and the cops didn't handle it well... what the hell was this guy doing taking a picture of an open ATM? Seems like he was just trying to test them.
- Kenton
@Kenton - so? Or maybe he likes ATMs? I really hate that line of reasoning.. "well, i'm all for photographers rights.. but in this case, the guy really needs to explain himself.." First Amendment rights are not dependent on a good explanation.
- Anthony Citrano
Kenton: it seems they failed the test then.
- Mark H
Using 9/11 is something I expect from the writing staff of Reno 911.
- Rene Wirtz
+1 Mark.
- Anthony Citrano
Wells Fargo is afraid that everyone will find out the inside of the ATM is just a midget with a stack of 20's and a notepad.
- Dave Roth
TH, I scooped you on this. :P http://friendfeed.com/photo-u...
- Rochelle
@Kenton: Why do you assume that he was trying to test them? An open ATM isn't something you see everyday. Lots of people take a photo when they see something that is not part of their normal everyday experience.
- Jeremy Brooks
+1 Anthony.
- Jeremy Brooks
from Shane's blog post: "I took the picture because I’m fascinated by the insides of things that we don’t normally get to see. I did not take the picture to case the joint. I did not take the picture to threaten the safety of the two Loomis fake cops with their bulletproof vests, hip side pistols and very fragile egos. I did not take the picture to make it easier for anyone else to rob this or any other ATM. I just like to see things that I don’t normally get to see."
- Eddie Codel
i've been warned before for standing and watching.. a pissed of man with a gun talked me into it
- andy brudtkuhl
@ Rochelle. Yes you did. :)
- Thomas Hawk
@Mark, you are totally correct. @Anthony and @Jeremy The reason I said what I said is because of the subject matter. When you have armed guards standing around something "protecting" it, they are likely going to be a little protective. Why couldn't he just have asked first? "Hey that's cool, mind if I take a picture?" He says it's because he's interested in such things; that's fine. If he had asked, they *might* have let him get close enough to actually get a picture that was worth it.
- Kenton
As for photographers rights, I am totally for them. I take a lot of pictures and if someone tried to prevent me (and especially harass me like this) I'd pissed off too. However, I do believe in common courtesy. This is not the picture of the outside of a building or a street. This is of two armed guards servicing what is basically the extension of a bank. Had he asked first, I suspect this would have not escalated to nearly this extent.
- Kenton
And if the guards said no, then what? He still has the right to take the photo. I can imagine it escalating even more had they said no and he took the pic anyway.
- Eddie Codel
Actually @Eddie, he doesn't. Technically it's up to REI, but according to the Photographer's Right, if the property owner forbids you from taking a photo, you are obligated to comply. So he should have asked REI if he could take a picture inside their store. It doesn't give them the right to do anything nasty or threaten you or do any of the things they did in this case. However, had he asked and been denied, he would not have had the right to take the photo.
- Kenton
Kenton, it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission. :)
- Rochelle
LOL, very true Rochelle
- Kenton
Moakler resigns after Miss California flap - Access Hollywood - http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id...
Charlotte M, Tommy Williams, delgado and 4 other people liked this
"“I can not with a clear conscious move forward supporting and promoting the Miss Universe Organization when I no longer believe in it, or the contracts I signed committing myself as a youth,” Shanna’s statement continued. “I want to be a role model for young woman (sic) with high hopes of pageantry, but now feel it more important to be a role model for my children. I am sorry and hope I have not let any young supporters down but wish them the best of luck in fulfilling their dreams.”"
- Jason Toney
from Bookmarklet
Everything about this story is comedy - that Moakler is co-director of anything; that she has a typo in a sentence about being a role model to young women; that people take this seriously; that the release was issued to Access Hollywood; That Trump had no idea she'd resigned; that I clicked on the link.
- Jason Toney
That the press release went to Access Hollywood... very amusing.
- Louis Gray
Moakler herself has posed nude for Playboy, so Carries pictures are no more shocking.
- Charlotte M
Decided to hang out more at FF for a while, because Twitter has messed up its replies system
Carmen, Jamie, Joe Manna and 12 other people liked this
I don't get why they would do it without either (a) asking and listening to feedback, (b) engineering a replacement FIRST, or (c) at least looking at the metrics to see if there were a lot of situations where people received a response from a friend's friend who they didn't follow, and subsequently subscribed to the person... sigh...
- Justin Long
It is hard for me to believe that only 2% have chosen this option. There have been thousands of Tweets about this choice being eliminated.
- Liz
5% of american adults use twitter... how many american adults? not sure what the total over-18 population is, but 5% of 300 million would be 15 million. Thousands isn't much in 15 million people. still got twitter's attention tho!
- Justin Long
I think FriendFeed is certainly getting more buzz and interest as Twitter shuns users.
- Joe Manna
Should try to start a "join friendfeed if you hate the reply system on twitter #fixreplies" thread on twitter
- Justin Long
@Justin you should probably just say join FriendFeed regardless of what you think about Twitter
- Mark Bockenstedt
could be. but a lot of my friends are not the type to join more than one service, and all THEIR friends are on twitter. makes it hard to move.
- Justin Long
It is quite a bit of work to consistently maintain multiple networks but it's worth it
- Mark Bockenstedt
Lessons from the changes in Twitter - http://www.scripting.com/stories...
Jesse Stay, Robert Scoble, Peggy Dolane and 3 other people liked this
I don't know which stuns me more, that Twitter has scheduled downtime or that it is in the middle of the day U.S. time.
Jose Luis Santos, Tommy Williams, Brian Daniel Eisenberg and 6 other people liked this
Twitter's amazing growth stuns me more.
- Gary Burd
Twitter's going down again? I hope our colo stays up this time!
- Kevin Fox
it's not the middle of the day in new zealand, tokyo, guam or the moon
- Allen Stern
Depends where on the moon...
- Kevin Fox
Last Friday Twitter was down for maintenance at 5:30pm Eastern time... I was like :o Guess I'll go make dinner :p
- Jesse Newhart
That was surprising to me too. why run maintenance right in the middle of the day?
- Karoli
It is a strange time. I think it is just so they can have an office lunch party.
- John Spyers
Office lunch during service downtime? That's funny. Anyway, If I knew I need some additional capacity to get me to the end of the day I'd add it @midnight PST the previous night.
- ǝuǝƃnǝ
Every NBA shot in 07-08 season
Nicholas James, Felicia Yue, Russellreno and 63 other people liked this
amazing
- Eren Emre Kanal
I think there's something telling here - players are focused on hoisting up threes, working just inside the line, or layups. There's that conspicuously dark middle ring (I'm guessing 5-10 feet from the basket) that there are far fewer shots from. Either these are the hardest places to get a shot off (because of defensive schemes), or players aren't exploiting these areas to the fullest capacity.
- Mike Nayyar
The dark middle ring is where you have to deal with the most defense AND you're less likely to get a foul call than driving for a layup
- Roshan Vyas
Right. I think the inner peak are layups and if you're not getting that close you're better off with less pressure a few steps out where you can get a good arc.
- Kevin Fox
I'm suprised about the corner 3s tho... that's a tough shot.
- Roshan Vyas
I'm also guessing they're measuring release point, since a player's feet leave the ground farther out than most of those inside shots.
- Kevin Fox
Corner 3's are where shooters camp out, and they're also the shortest 3's.
- Dan Hsiao
The corner 3's are the highest percentage shot (both taken and made) because it's the shortest 3 pointer available. The best teams will exploit the hell out of that shot.
- Mark Philpot
fascinating.
- Alan Le
That's a pretty awesome graphic... Where did you find it? Or did you make it somehow?
- Frankie Warren
Next, I'd like to see year-to-year change, and EVs for each point. The guys who made it (using Processing) are here: http://jasonrbailey.com/?p=127 The raw data is here: http://www.basketballgeek.com/data... More cool sports datavis is here: http://visualizeit.wordpress.com/2009...
- Kevin Fox
Whoa. That inner dark ring really is fascinating.
- Hutch Carpenter
Also note the higher frequency of shots under the rim from the left side vs. the right.
- Hutch Carpenter
Windows 7 in 2009. As previously reported :) - http://community.winsupersite.com/blogs...
James Fridley, Tommy Williams, RAPatton and Akiva Moskovitz liked this
Don't Newspapers Owe Google Money For Helping Them Research Stories For Free? http://www.techdirt.com/article...
Tommy Williams liked this
a sex toy for your dog (no kidding) http://www.flickr.com/photos...
Will Higgins™, Rajtilak Bhattacharjee, Lucian Nicolescu and 3 other people liked this
umm... eeeeeew
- Kevin Johnson
lol!
- Stanislas Jourdan
LOL!
- Rajtilak Bhattacharjee
what a lovely accessory to have just sitting around the house :P
- Tom Ray
Hanna Wiszniewska, Thomas Hawk, Emma and 19 other people liked this
Hey! hey you big-ass shmancy college I paid craploads of money for and was HAPPY to leave, just wanted to thank you for the email this morning informing me that you let my social security number and personal info be STOLEN by computer hacker a-holes. First-class university my ass!!!...
MVB (Curmudgeon of FF), Adrian, Alix Whitmire and 13 other people liked this
I HATE U. http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin...
- Kelly
Meh. Berkeley is so behind the times. Stanford did this years ago!
- Jim Norris
haha, shut up, jim
- Kelly
@Kelly, he means stanford got hacked before berkley ;)
- mjc
haha I know, I know, he just likes to point out any case where Stanford has done anything different/better/before Berkeley......don't get me started ;p
- Kelly
:(
- Anne Bouey
That's okay my top 50 company lost our data twice in last 5 years.
- Steve C
@Steve, no one used your ss#, right? did you file a report or anything?
- Kelly
nope no one used it and we have 10 years of monitoring services. 99% of cases like this lead to nothing much
- Steve C
well Chapman hasn't let that happen. haha. maybe my hocky pocky "non-denominational" school is better after all!
- Kristin Norris
I have no come back to that. Damn you Norris
- Steve C
Hocky pocky? Mmmmm... pocky. http://lamar.colostate.edu/~hillge...
- Michael Scarpelli
Pocky does not look gluten free. damn you Scarpelli
- Steve C
ooo I loves pocky
- Kelly
no idea who did this, but it was through the university health services
- Kelly
One of my alma maters was hacked a couple of years ago. Oh, and I have several boxes of pocky here.
- MiniMage, sheeple of FF
Sadly, college is where I first had pocky.....oh the irony
- Kelly
I've gotten one of these letters from each school I attended. This will actually be my *third* letter from Berkeley.
- Kevin Fox
People seem not to see that their opinion of the world is also a confession of their character.
Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803 - 1882)
Anika, Tommy Williams, Glen Campbell and MVB (Curmudgeon of FF) liked this
Heh people are hyping Star Trek so much that most people seeing it after this weekend are bound to be disappointed. Not that it's not a good movie, but nothing survives that kind of hype machine.
Valley, Eric Florenzano, Tommy Williams and 17 other people liked this
disagree..
- CW™
Actually - it's a great movie.
- LPH™ and his dog P™
Don't think about the hype. Open mind and enjoy the action!
- Martha
Thankfully we have Roger Ebert to give it to us straight.
- Alex Scoble
Usually Alex, you would be on the money, but Star Trek (at least based on anecdotal evidence from people I know who have seen it) seems to be as good as promised.
- Brandon Mendelson
It isn't Schindler's List, Brandon.
- Alex Scoble
Alex what are you reading that equates Star Trek 2009 to Schindlers list?
- CW™
It's a GREAT MOVIE!
- Alex Scoble
Which BTW is a seriously crap comparison.
- CW™
Kirk can over come the Hype Machine. Episode #32 Baby. :P
- Kreg Steppe
They both are good movies for entirley different reasons.
- CW™
Iron Man survived it.
- Michael W. May
The Dark Knight SUPER survived it.
- Mike Nayyar
Schindlers List isn't no Gone with the Wind either, but I still think they hold up on their own.
- CW™
Uhh, Schindler's list is, in my opinion, one of the greatest movies ever made...and no The Dark Knight did not survive the hype machine, in my opinion. Star Trek did for me, but I saw it before everyone on friendfeed started hyping it up. :)
- Alex Scoble
HA! Too true.But still, if a movie lives up to its hype, it's an amazing thing these days.
- Brandon Mendelson
I would rate Star Trek as a 4 out of 5 movie...people rating it as a 5 out of 5 are overselling it, in my opinion.
- Alex Scoble
Alex who do you know that goes to see a movie solely on the Hype of the movie? Its not like its Fantastic 4 where the studio had to hype the shit out of the movie to even generate people to walk through the theatre doors.
- CW™
Alex, compaired to other Star movies... how would you rate this? Star Wars and other Star Trek movies...
- CW™
agreed - i've been trying to avoid the reviews and comments until we can see it
- mike "glemak" dunn
I'm already disappointed. I can't go to see it yet. LOF.
- Josh Haley
I've seen a few comedies based on everyone saying "it's the funniest movie ever" (There's Something About Mary for instance) and without exception, these movies have all been snoozers.
- Alex Scoble
label me overhyper....5/5 I found absolutely nothing wrong with it. Nothing.
- Bwana ☠
I agree, it's not THAT good. Wait for rental
- Jeremiah Owyang
Jeremiah are you serious? Wait for rental? It is a big screen film. You can wait for rental on Milk which doesn't require the space, but Star Trek? That would be like killing 9/10ths of what is so good about it.
- Martha
I'm on the same page as Bwana. It's a 5/5, must see in the theatre film. If that's "over hyping", sorry. It's just my opinion.
- Ken Sheppardson
I feel dumb for not going to the premiere here in LA. I blew it off because I'm not a Trek fan but.. so much awesomesauce showed up that I felt dumb. Anyway, my mom and Leonard Nimoy's mom used to work together. That's the best I can do on the Star Trek situation.
- Anthony Citrano
Anthony - I met Leonard Nimoy when I was in third grade. He was in a local theater performance and stayed at the house of a classmate / friend of mine. The boy invited me over to meet him.
- Martha
Saw it twice. First time with the coworkers, second time with the wife. I was totally scared it wouldn't life up to the hype, but sometimes they end up hitting it out of the park.
- Wirehead
MAJOR NSW ALERT: Rihanna completely nude (photos) http://www.johnnyikon.com/pages... Holy wow, she is bangin' via Dan V. #fb
Franz Sittampalam, DO ANYBODY NO MONIQUE, Mike Nayyar and 24 other people liked this
Classy, Rihanna.
- Derrick
DAMN! Look at that ass! Oh, and the rest of her ;)
- Michael Forian
I must admit I just think she is a beautiful, powerful woman, that is in touch with her body. But it is hard to say something without sounding really sexist. I think.
- Ruud van Wijngaarden
She is SMOKIN'
- Mona Nomura
Amen.
- Ruud van Wijngaarden
I've never been much interested in her... until now. I love hot chicks who like to take naked pictures of themselves and store them in insecure locations.
- Joey Gibson
hot!
- Violet Mae Lim
Her body is AMAZING.
- Mona Nomura
from IM
Her attitude is what really gets you imho.
- Ruud van Wijngaarden
She is one of the nicest, most down to earth people I have ever met. And (cringe if you will) Chris Brown, too. Check out this month's issue of Vibe -- I think it's on stands now. Their security did a tell all. :)
- Mona Nomura
from IM
Awesome !
- Faraz Mullick
hawt!
- Jorge Escobar
Wow. Just wow.
- Zulema ◕ ◡ ◕
She is straight off. the. chains. Seriously, I am now an even bigger fan.
- Mona Nomura
from IM
part of me wants to like this and part of me wants to like this
- Joe Pierce
Hey, you got it, flaunt it if you like. It doesn't last and ... what's the big deal about nudity anyway?
- AJ Kohn
Is it naked celeb day? Cassie was naked earlier this day somewhere… Still, my vote goes to the Panamanian cricket chicks and they where dressed (and prolly shopped).
- Remo
Why does this need a New South Wales alert?
- Bryce, Low in Sodium
Cassie's was a publicity stunt, her album is dropping soon. As for Rihanna, I don't care if it was publicity or not. The woman is smokin'!
- Mona Nomura
Can't, for the life of me, figure out why I should care about any of this.
- Akiva Moskovitz
My friends g/f just agreed that she was hot. So for some reason he decided it was time to show her those nude pictures of Chyna.
- Joe Pierce
Akiva, your secret is safe with us. Promise we won't tell Rochelle!
- Mona Nomura
Trust me, Mona: she agrees with me.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Dude...Rihanna is SUPER hot. I mean, for a skinny chick...WOW. She got more curves than spaghetti junction...
- Rahsheen ™, Coach of FF
Mona you're my favoritest ffer ever! :)
- jcunwired
Wonder what the story behind this is.
- Dennis Jackson
Umm, wow! She is HOT!
- Rahul Das
woahhhhhhh
- Shevonne
Dennis - Frankly, it was a jab at Bad Boy to kick Cassie out the limelight (imho). Ri-Ri > Cassie ANYday.
- Mona Nomura
ummm... wow
- Internet's Tad
Damn. She's banging like bloods and crips.
- DO ANYBODY NO MONIQUE
To be honest, this is one of my biggest wishes come true.
- Mike Nayyar
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