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Michael Wuensch › Likes
I am actually VERY excited about FriendFeed going to Facebook. This is a HUGE win for both companies! More later.
Nicholas James, Eric Standlee, Rene Silva and 73 other people liked this
+1 (without the more later ;)
- Orli Yakuel
Big news.
- phil baumann
Oh, I can't wait to hear how this shakes out...
- Travis Tasset
With any luck FB will rework the UI to make it more friendly and it can gain some market
- James
Absolutely. Great deal all around. Congrats to everyone involved.
- Tom Guarriello
If Facebook uses the FriendFeed interface, then I would agree it is a great idea.
- Rob Diana
I'm hoping for better, faster feature development.
- Jeff Harbert
yes, definitely win-win
- Wolfgang Heinrich
huge win for both companies ?? is it a win for the FF community ?? who comes first ?? the business or the users ?? I bet you within 6 months, I wont be using FF as much as I use it now !!
- Peter Dawson
i agree - facebook has been getting on my good list this past year and I just love friendfeed.
- Chris Jackson
Just as I re-dedicate myself to using FF, FB acquires them. If FB can integrate FF's deep feature set, it would be a win-win-win.
- Jim Duncan
True or false: Facebook needs FriendFeed more than FriendFeed needs Facebook.
- Joel Zehring
I'm excited too, but at the same time I'm afraid facebook may make some wrong moves with their acquisition. We've seen this happen before.
- Steven (optionshiftk)
this is not a good day for Twitter....
- Giorgio
I fully expect to just see FriendFeed as a separate entity to go away with its technology being absorbed by Facebook.
- Mike Flynn
Very True.
- Steven (optionshiftk)
Joel: Absolutely true.
- Adam Reyher
I caught Robert's reaction to the news on my iPhone: http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- Robert J Taylor
from iPhone
If this makes it so I have one LESS place to go to follow my social media, then it will be great. I already have too many different places with different people and different conversations for differ purposes that overlap and make it unnecessarily complicated.
- David Rondeau
FF > FB? not great, actually. diversity is better than monopoly. and i'm concerned about aggregation features getting deprecated (in the name of progress and chrossing the chasm and all that jazz.. of course ;)
- jacek
This is a IP, technology and talent grab.. I don't see the 2 sites being consolidated
- Dave Senior
It may be a big win for both companies but is likely a big lose for FF users.
- Brian Sullivan
FriendFeed functionality on Facebook would be nice. The reverse, not so much. They're trying to address two entirely separate purposes and as such, need to remain completely separate.
- Adam Reyher
I hope Facebook turns into FriendFeed. That would be great!
- Wo
I'd really love to see the real-time threaded conversation feature of friendfeed be adopted by facebook.
- Steven (optionshiftk)
Looking forward to your analysis Robert
- Ken Seto
I can see development of FF slowing down as the team brings the tech over to Facebook
- Dave Senior
Indeed, Brian. FF devotees should be pissed over this. I can't believe Facebook will do anything but carve out a few choice pieces of FF meat - likely making them even more Twitterish - and dump the rest. FF will be gone within six months.
- Shéa Bennett
This is a huge win for both companies, and a huge fail for every net surfer.
- TiTi
yeah it may not be that bad. maybe i'm exaggerating.
- Edgar Rodríguez
Well, I think the FF team can certainly help the Facebook UI. But, all I take away from this is FF going away.
- Yolanda
One thing to consider is this: If we have "trusted" the FriendFeed people not to screw things up, hopefully we can trust them to make sure they're still in control in the terms of the acquisition.
- Adam Reyher
Yes, Robert. Like TiTi said, huge win for both companies, huge fail for the people who like FriendFeed. "Welcome to FaceFeed! Would you like to take a quiz?"
- Zach Flauaus
I think this is definitely a huge win for both but maybe not for the users. I think it could be good or bad for users but I hope that Facebook will allow FriendFeed to continue and push the envelope with emerging technologies. I imagine this is Facebook and FriendFeed teaming up against Twitter.
- Brandon Titus
.-( Good for Friendfeed, but horrible for people that like friendfeed and hate facebook &their UI or where FB is blocked
- Del_
may be
- Ahmet Soyata
It's good timing. FF uniques fell almost 10% in July.
- Shéa Bennett
this is bad news for twitter, me thinks.
- Brian Ries
Absolutely, Robert. Its a very good tech acquisition for Facebook, they get a great team with a well developed technology stack. It lets the FriendFeed founders get a good, early exit.
- DGentry
I hope so. I know my initial reaction was not as negative as most of the others I'm seeing in my stream. Maybe I'm just being naive.
- Herb Hernandez
Hopefully this means the power of friendfeed will be utilized. Awesome news
- Marcus
This is why I follow Mr. Scoble, yes that is Mr. Scoble :) always has his fingers in the breaking news.
- dennis podgorski
I'm fired up about this union between FriendFeed and Facebook. With the exception of my social media group, I've used FriendFeed primarily as an aggregator--despite it's being my favorite GUI and functionality. I think this is going to bring the substance to FriendFeed that it's been missing. Very exciting!
- Jim W
I have a hard time drawing my line of Public v Personal. I use Twitter & FriendFeed for public use and I use Facebook for private use. I have not even once made a status update on Facebook. I am not sure I want FriendFeed on Facebook. I am intrigued about the possibilities of integration but I am not sure I will adopt.
- thestaticfrost
The power of FF will be used -- but it won't be pretty and won't be for good.
- Brian Sullivan
I have to agree with Robert on this. I think this is likely to be a great deal moving forward. I'm excited about it, and happy for the FriendFeed crew. They've done an AWESOME job.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I am not as excited about this. I don^t like Facebook as much
- nchenga
i think this is going to add more value to Facebook
- Lee Kent
concur robert
- mike "glemak" dunn
It certainly makes sense, and I agree that it adds value to FF. I wonder how many of the 250 million users of FF will be using it in its current form.
- courtney benson
Just surprised this didn't happen earlier. Facebook has been mimicking FriendFeed's functionality for a while now. Nice that FF is finally getting paid for their R&D efforts.
- Aaron Strout
I think this will make me drop friendfeed or facebook
- Nicolai Rygh
Please explain - this may be win for Friendfeed - but as far as us the users/fans... we're the big losers in this right? I really really can't stand Facebook :-( Help us have hope...
- Jannifer @wordsforliving
ruination.
- Joe Silence is not dead
I will wait and see approach @ all
- polou/indigo_bow
here is the explanation, FF have t sell the soonerr, better then laterr, they choose the right momment, wave is there and it is a big promise
- abdellah
when Google start wave, they surely shown their non desire to acquir FF it was implicite
- abdellah
All Your Feeds Are Belong To Us
- Ian Tindale
I'm hoping for the best.
- Jim Connolly
The idea here is growing on me. I see the business case...I'm still not sure as to the impact on Twitter and different users who prefer one tool over another and/or use the two differently.
- Derek Shanahan
I'm trying to defer my pessimism...but I feel an "I Want Sandy"-type fail in the wings. As for FF needing to sell, that wasn't the case; the founders had the money to keep it going for as long as they wanted, basically. We'll see, I suppose. We'll see.
- Ken Kennedy
This is really interesting. This will bring a bigger pool of social media services to people. As it is now, regular folks don't venture further than Facebook, with this acquisition, many will realize that there is a plethora of great other services and social media websites that they can engage in.
- Rami Taibah
Ya know when you get a bad feeling about something - I have one about this deal. Can't put my finger on it, but it don't feel right.
- Jim Connolly
FriendFeed now to get BIGGER than Twitter?
- Jim Connolly
"when Google start wave, they surely shown their non desire to acquir FF it was implicite" - I think that probably covers it.
- John Craft
Isn't this the kind of daring move that Yahoo should have made?
- Andrew Warner
Seems like a HUGE win for Facebook. Not so sure for the future of FF, though.
- Chris Wood
This is really interesting. This will bring a bigger pool of social media services to people. As it is now, regular folks don't venture further than Facebook, with this acquisition, many will realize that there is a plethora of great other services and social media websites that they can engage in. On the side of the coin, I am kind of worried about FB privacy issues and data portability
- Rami Taibah
is there a dislike button anywhere? I did exactly the opposite FB never appealed, FF rocked...
- Valeria Maltoni
FriendFeed will not be the same place, in terms of the community, but this keeps friendfeed around for a while. Awesome! Where's Arrington? Did he reopen his account?
- Benjamin Taylor
Whatever FB and FF does, don't tell Oprah... That's a sign it's over..
- Timothy Latz
FF isn't blocked at work, FB is. FF usefulness would nose-dive for me if blocked.
- Brett Veenstra
Brett: this is likely to pave the way for more client applications for Facebook, which will not be blocked at work.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Medien in der Krise: Warum Deutschland Blog-Hemmung hat - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Kultur - http://www.spiegel.de/kultur...
Michael Wuensch liked this
We added a 1-click login for Twitter users, so now it's easy for all your friends to try http://friendfeed.com
Liz, hIpPy, Adam and 418 other people liked this
To RT, click http://twitter.com/home... It uses OAuth, so no password is required, and it automatically finds your Twitter friends on FriendFeed! It also imports your profile and picture. Big thanks to http://friendfeed.com/bgolub for making all this happen! (also, existing users can go to http://friendfeed.com/friends... to find Twitter, Facebook, and Gmail friends)
- Paul Buchheit
fan bloody tastic! So we can post here and Twitterers can comment away without any complaints! The only think you need to try and do is bring in comments (about a share) from twitter into here! :)
- Zee.
This is great...should help new users quite a bit.
- Mark Krynsky
Bravo!!! Very nice!
- David Cook
nice
- Joe Azzara
thanks for making it effortless
- Vedran Agovic
That's fantastic! Keep it up guys!! :)
- Internet's Tad
I'm hoping this will help to entice people over here. I'd much rather talk to people via FF than Twitter
- WorldofHiglet
FrF + OAuth. Like.
- tobe
Refresh your FriendFeed to see an updated first comment from Paul, including a link to RT this news: http://twitter.com/home...
- Dan Hsiao
OK, I admit I'm dense. As an existing user will this help me find the folks I follow on Twitter?
- Laura Norvig
Cool, is it possible we could have the ability to bulk import or non-FF Twitter friends as private feeds so we can track them in FF? :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Laura, existing FriendFeed users should just go to http://friendfeed.com/friends... and click on the Twittter (and Facebook and Google) icons to find their friends. Kol, not yet, but I'm hoping to add something like that soon (improved imaginary friends).
- Paul Buchheit
Thx, Paul - guess I haven't been to that page since the launch. btw, I'm definitely coming around to the new friendfeed (colors notwithstanding).
- Laura Norvig
Great to see the standards working -OAuth fro Gogole and Twitter login on Friendfeed
- Kevin Marks
That's a great tool, Paul! Found a few from Twitter and Facebook I didn't realise were on FF...:)
- WorldofHiglet
Oh man, that is suh-weet. Works really well.
- Laura Norvig
Paul, that would be wonderful, thank you. I'm keen to use FF as a kinda Twitter client. I'd love the ability to import my group I've created on Tweetvisor too but that would additionally require exporting facilities from Tweetvisor, and from asking them they've told me it's low priority (which is fair enough).
- Kol Tregaskes
That's fantastic! Sharing with all of my not-yet-friendfeedified twitter friends. Thanks, Paul!
- Eric Johnson
This IS good. Thanks for the hard work, Benjamin Golub.
- Micah Wittman
Love that you guys are making the entry more enticing. What about refining what FriendFeed is further? Like: Twitter + conversation. For new people who don't get it and most without the time to get it, simplifying the message or experimenting further with your "first impression" on your splash page might be worth a try. Example: wouldn't it be cool to have a live conversation streaming to show just how FF has a leg up on the scattered Twitter stream?
- kilbuda
this is fabulous!!!
- Angela P.
It's so convenient for new comer like me!
- tsssimon
Just tried it and it works great.
- Iván Abrego
i have tried this too and am richer by 33 Twitter friends
- jagannath rao
Nice work. Keeps getting better around here :-)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
WOW! 313 new Twitter people! Amazing what the OAuth did. Amazing. That just completely Rocks!
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
That was just too easy, and found a bunch of Twitter people. I just subscribed, but I hope they participate. I'm sure I'll have to trim later.
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
Thanks for everything Benjamin and the others, that is really great. :)
- Alp
I was subscribed to exactly 100 of the people I follow on Twitter. Added 93 more. Funny, this is actually helping me find people I *don't* want to follow in either place.
- Laura Norvig
I'm looking forward to the "advanced imaginary friends" section which lets me as an existing FriendFeed user view all the twitter updates from people that don't use FriendFeed.
- Brian Sloane
很好，继续努力
- Kunshou（困兽）
Sweet!
- Don Strickland
Just posted this to my stream then saw this, Cool stuff Paul
- Charlie Anzman
Some time ago I spent lots of time in removing my Facebook-Friendfeed integration, and didn't succeed, Facebook refused to remove it. Since that - no info about any other my services to Facebook, ever.
- orie
Happy to hear that there will be an improved imaginary friend option!
- Jacob
The improved imaginary friend feature will be great. No need to visit Twitter much then!
- Pinksy
How do we give virtual bucks to Paul, oh I see a like button here. Off to work on the influence funnel, who cares about dollars, I want eyes ;)
- Mark Essel
FriendFeed is constantly bringing new value to the service. I'm loving it!
- Amie Gillingham
its relay cool
- Kaspar Minosiants
great idea
- andy brudtkuhl
Oh Thanks i was looking for something like this
- Asahi
Is the imaginary friends feature completely disabled for the moment? Or am I just not looking in the right place?
- Mark Jacobs
Mark: imaginary friends have been replaced by groups.
- Robert Scoble
When is OpenID coming up?
- Mohammad Abdurraafay
This feature is AWESOME :) Bravo!
- Iain Baker
I just imported 8,000 new Twitter friends. Worked MUCH BETTER than last time.
- Robert Scoble
Smart move guys. A quick way to grow FF users is to tap into the current hot properties. Can't believe other Social Networks are so slow to respond.
- Neill Adamson
Paul, is there a way to sync it so that people I no longer follow on Twitter are unfollowed on FriendFeed?
- Jorge Escobar
Great news on the advanced imaginary friends. That plus the ability to comment back to Facebook posts as easily as we reply to Twitter would be killer.
- Kevin Kuphal
Finally! :-)
- Richard Joerges
Not sure why this wasn't implemented a while ago but it's a welcome addition.
- Jason Williams
None of my Facebook contacts are on ff.
- JECO Photo
So how do existing FF members use it?
- Tiffany Monhollon
Ca passe 50 fois par jour ce truc là sur FriendFeed ! C''est pas possible d'arr^ter, j'en ai marre de le voir franchement ... ^^
- Jean-Marie Gall
from twhirl
Tiffany, existing FF members should go to http://friendfeed.com/friends... to find their Twitter, Facebook, and Gmail friends.
- Paul Buchheit
Encore ?? C'est pas possible ! ;(
- Jean-Marie Gall
from twhirl
RT'd ;o)
- Rob Sellen :o)
@Robert cannot seem to do that with groups. What I want to do: Concentrate different RSS feeds (e.g. newswires) which do not necessarily have an account in any other social network into one imaginary friend's collection of feeds.
- Mark Jacobs
Mark, "groups" (formerly "rooms") are able to import feeds just like regular users (and imaginary friends). See https://friendfeed.com/xoogle-... for example (imports the blogs of all known xoogle startups). The only thing special about imaginary friends is that they don't have usernames (or rather we assign a random 128 bit username).
- Paul Buchheit
Paul, the DM option on imaginary friends should perhaps be removed. Also, imaginary friends do not show up on the search dropdown list when you type in their name in the search box.
- Kol Tregaskes
Paul, is it possible to automatically create "imaginary friends" from twitter following list? What I would like is to read all my Twitter in FriendFeed; many of twitterers though are not on FF, so I have to create them by hand which is tedious. Also, it would be nice to allow to add them to some special list.
- Ihar Mahaniok
Ihar, see my comment up in the middle and Paul's reply. Looks like FF are working on it. :-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Nice tool, discovered some more contacts !
- François Granger
love this guys wonderful
- Thomas Power
This must be the reason for all the new follows I've been getting over the last few days. Congrats!
- Michael Fidler
That's actually quite useful. Thank you!
- snapixel
Still would like an imaginary friend than making bunch of Groups to simulate peoples that doesn’t use FF. BTW, unlike the Facebook Connect login, when I tried logging in using Twitter, it made a new account for me on FF instead of opening my own (which also has Twitter activity added).
- Natsuki Seika
ditto to natsuki...
- Steve Austin
Wow, real nice and simply to add my Twitter friends :O
- Rosenkrieger
Good move!
- Lantrix
Is it possible to add this to a wordpress blog?
- Arturo Pelayo
@Arturo: http://wordpress.org/extend...
- Saxtus
hi me sid m new member of dis site.........
- Sidra Kanwal
The beginnings of real-time translations on friendfeed: http://ff.xlhit.com Demo, search for "leggo": http://ff.xlhit.com/s...
Paul Lindner, John E. Bredehoft, CantorJF and 29 other people liked this
More info on this here: http://xlhit.wordpress.com/
- Robert Scoble
It does Twitter, too. Very cool! http://www.xlhit.com/
- Robert Scoble
Cool!
- Kol Tregaskes
Oh. My. Suddenly a whole new section of the internet just opened up to me.
- Andy Bold
this is interesting. thanks for sharing robert. do you know the people behind this? I'd like to speak with them asap.
- Brian Daniel Eisenberg
Brian: http://friendfeed.com/charlie is the guy behind it. I want him to add Farsi.
- Robert Scoble
Very cool.
- Nir Ben Yona
Playing around more with this I think this is absolutely huge. Imagine if we had this during the Chinese earthquake! Except it doesn't do Chinese yet, but it does do Japanese and it rocks at that, from my first tests so far.
- Robert Scoble
Robert: I used Ubiquity back then, but this one is much better !
- Nir Ben Yona
Farsi may be hard, but I'll take a crack at it.
- Charles Ying
one of the beauties of translating twitter is that due to the 140 character limit people mess with the grammar all the time, so translations dont feel any more clumsy than the originals
- Joelle Nebbe (iphigenie)
have you seen meedan yet- arabic to english and vice versa.
- RedMonk
wow, this is really cool :)
- Susan Beebe
Great--thanks for sharing!
- Kathy Fitch
The xlhit service looks really useful, thanks for pointing it out. Also worth noting that any service delivered via XMPP can use a Google Translate bot in a group chat -- see http://googletalk.blogspot.com/2008... for more.
- Daniel Dulitz
There needs to be a way to suggest improved translations, like Google Translate has. Suggesting improved translations might be good practice for those learning languages, perhaps schools could get involved in the process.
- Chuck Baggett
xlhit now has Chinese search for Twitter (it already had it for FriendFeed :-)
- Charles Ying
Fascinating project. Now I just need to target the languages that I want to survey. Here's my search for fingerprint mentions in Spanish http://ff.xlhit.com/s...
- John E. Bredehoft
More ways to share your Google Latitude location - http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2009...
Nicholas James, Nick Stone, Karl-Anders Johansson and 4 other people liked this
Latitude should publish to Fire Eagle, no question.
- Daniel Dulitz
one of the coolest 404 error page: http://www.bluedaniel.com/dfdf more: http://www.presidiacreative.com/101-pur...
Michael Wuensch, Lu Tao, Waldemar Schott and 3 other people liked this
very cool page
- david miron
from twhirl
Noteboek on Vimeo -- coolest video I've seen in a long time. Thanks Jared Spool for sharing this! - http://vimeo.com/4116727...
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David Erickson, Faethon Koussouris, Cem Ozkaynak and 84 other people liked this
Really excellent.
- Michelle McCormack
White Stripes!!
- Michelle McCormack
That is one impressive notebook. Crazy dutch.
- Mitch
Amazing! I am envious of this person's creativity. :)
- Cheryl Jones
I want one. For real.
- phil baumann
As I watched, I was hoping the system time would update, but it never did.
- Robert Peña
Take on Me Noteboek: http://www.youtube.com/watch...
- David Newman
If only my notebook started as fast or shutdown as quick!
- Shivanand Velmurugan
I like the face scan! :)
- dafire
very clever!
- Kevin Eklund
Cool!
- Tony C
Wow. This one merits a triple-like button.
- Eric Johnson
is Follow Friday. Who is the person I am least likely to follow? Answer here:
Svetlana, polou/indigo_bow, Chris Wright and 23 other people liked this
scobleizer :)
- Amit Nangare
Alex
- Johnny Worthington
me. i'm the infamous FriendFeed thread killer :)
- imabonehead
ashton kutcher
- Kiran Patchigolla
Is the correct answer "Someone who just dumps their feed here and never interacts?"
- Johnny Worthington
Oprah?
- Taehoon Kim
Anyone not on Twitter, Facebook, or FriendFeed
- Jesse Stay
@Johnny It is as far as I'm concerned. Though I don't think it's as bad as I used to. If people are going to be aggregation only perhaps they should consider a private feed?
- Mo Kargas
Mo, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just someone Robert probably wouldn't follow :D
- Johnny Worthington
@Johnny I know, I'm on friday arvo ramble mode :D
- Mo Kargas
...there is no spoon.
- .LAG liked that
@grandma
- Nick
dunno... but that avatar photo's starting to scare me.
- David D. Griffith
Anyone w "eggplant" in their handle is probably pretty low in the pecking order.
- Gerald Buckley
I'm gonna hold out to see who wins your #unfollowsaturday hheh. I'm probably more interested in your "Subscribe Sunday" anyhow.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Anyone who uses twitter as a blog post rss feed. bleh.
- Eric Gonzalez
Someone who signed up a year ago and has never posted anything.
- Eric Florenzano
Barack Obama.
- bnoise
L. Ron Hubbard
- Jemm
Don't you follow everybody though Robert. Jus Joking. I wouldn't follow Charles Manson, I heard he is a killer!
- aerobroken
Oprah?
- Kevin Eklund
Scoble follows Mike Arrington -and he NEVER participates here.
- Roberto Bonini
Is FriendFeed FollowFriday FFFF or F(4)?
- Anthony Citrano
from BuddyFeed
I'm starting ho think that here we should follow few people as possible and start use groups better. Unlike in twitter, in FF, with a powerful use or filters and the ability "collect" threads (with comments and likes) in "My Discussions" is possible to unfollow a lot of peoples (friends, smarts, and scobles excluded ;D )
- CantorJF
If "social media expert" or "social media junkie" are in the description, it is an automatic no go. Edited to add: on twitter anyway. On FF I pretty much follow anyone.
- Martha
Veronica Belmont (Look) http://www.thetechnewsblog.com/2009...
- Jim Connolly
Yourself, because you already know what you are going to say.
- Jeff Weber
Me, @ZacharyTG
- Zachary TG
me @techwag - I only need one more person to hit 400 which would be a milestone for me. Pretty cool actually, that would make twitter the place I am the most followed. 257 on FF, 193 on Facebook, 200 readers on RSS on average, 200 per day on techwag, seeing if I can just hit 400. Kinda funny really.
- Dan Morrill AKA Techwag
Thanks hit 401 - Thank you to the two people who signed up - r/d
- Dan Morrill AKA Techwag
Me?
- Kol Tregaskes
"follow as few people as possible"! - ok, get your point @luccio but still think social should be a central aspect in social media.
- Peter Efland
and to answer scoble's question: any of the apparently gazillion turks on friendfeed.
- Peter Efland
probably me Robert <LOL> but I think you do follow me, so the point is moot!
- Allen Harkleroad
@twitshitters
- Rob
The most disgusting idea I've heard lately is:
Thomas Power, Azzam, Oliver Bouchard and 52 other people liked this
That you are only worth something if you have tons of followers.
- Robert Scoble
Getting your self worth from people who follow you is totally shallow and, anyway, out of your control.
- Robert Scoble
Far better way to judge your participation on social networks? What is the quality of the people you are following? Better inputs = better output.
- Robert Scoble
By the way, I heard that someone said this on Oprah yesterday. I'll try to find a clip.
- Robert Scoble
worth? value? all in the twitter/ff area or IN REAL world? that's the most digusting idea (confusing real world/economy with net tweets).
- Nikos Kouremenos
Nikos: it's a disgusting idea in real life AND on social networking!
- Robert Scoble
I think it's funny that there's now tools to help you get more followers. How? By following people who autofollow. Lame.
- Robert Scoble
Why the need to judge at all? To each his own.
- LogEx
Thought only belongs to a select group. Now that's disgusting.
- Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
Yeah auto follow sucks. I tried that and then had to unfollow a lot of people. Twitter became noise instead of fun.
- Brian Thompson
Robert: All I meant to say, is since you're a great writer please focus on REAL issues. Keep it up
- Nikos Kouremenos
'number of followers' as metric in social networking is so pre-Web 2.0 - the age of mass media
- Yung-Hui Lim
That computers are a roadblock to development. (so said Mulayam Singh Yadav, an Indian politician).
- अभिषेक(Abhishek) Das
Completely agree. That's asocial media IMO. http://www.blindfiveyearold.com/asocial...
- AJ Kohn
Brian: I have a how-to video that shows how I read Tweets here: http://friendfeed.com/e...
- Robert Scoble
Brian: in the video I show how you can use Twitter and friendfeed together to get past the noise. The noise is actually fun, if you know how to surf it. Even last night I was ahead of all the tech bloggers in knowing that Obama had picked a new CTO because of this system.
- Robert Scoble
Always thought auto follow was lame, why would I want to follow a bunch of people that say nothing that interest me just to build up numbers, but then I was never very good at popularity thing in high school either.
- Kim Landwehr
Kim: I agree, but I needed to be able to get DMs from everyone and Twitter's DM system requires I follow everyone. Friendfeed's system, where I can follow you and then follow other people more closely by putting them in lists is FAR superior.
- Robert Scoble
Teabagging.
- innesm
donating only if you win a competition is kinda up there... ;)
- Krikit Media
agreed Krikit :) .. why not just donate in the beginning and still have the competion for funs sake
- Kashif Khan
there´s one interesting thing in online vs. offline: we know from neuroscience, that listening to people we hardly know is processed by our brain as fiction. what much better related people (friends, family) tell us is processed like non-fiction, taken for real and saved deeper in the brain. so auto-followers and filter-junkies won´t "listen" even if they seem to technically do. but online there´s some relevance in being linked with the more the better. so far about value of quantity...
- esther ♥ ♫
precisely, Kashif :)
- Krikit Media
The idea that your only value is in the numbers, is a value system many people subscribe to. I can see where there may be value, as in the case of an analyst trying to gain some understanding of something, or for businesses where they need the information from many. But Robert, you made a REALLY great point in our discussion when you said, for example, Nielson ratings only need 1000 different tv watchers from across the country to get a good mix of the masses. After the first 1000, what is the point?
- Sheryl
Reference to the above question I posted: http://stardustglobalventures.com/2009...
- Sheryl
Scoble: Thanks for the info. I watched the video and that helped. I guess one has to pay attention to both streams though as tweets from people I follow that don't have friendfeed won't show up in my stream here.
- Brian Thompson
The most disgusting idea I've heard lately is that a famous a-list blogger is doing something mysterious with some yet to be named internet "fanatics" in "building 43"... Secretive and funded by a big company, it sounds very industrial age to me ...we are way past that at this point, we are even past the information age.
- Tweet Feeds
So let's just hide the follower count. Job done! Now everyone is equal and you live and die by your content...
- Bob Walder
from BuddyFeed
You obviously never had to worry about ratings. The number of people "following" my shows has been the ONLY thing that has mattered for 30 years. I'm not so sure it's such a bad metric.
- Leo Laporte
Leo, I'm beginning to agree with you there. Engagement is important, but first impression comes from that list of people following you. However, with it being so easy to gain followers on Twitter (by gaming it), do follows mean as much on Twitter as they mean elsewhere?
- Jesse Stay
Whether or not it's a good or bad metric surely depends on one's goals. It's not an inherently valuable metric, though, and what's strange is that so often folks do treat it like one. Last year when Plurk was taking off, I spent lots of time playing there. "Karma" rapidly became the obsession. Interesting, because just gaining followers isn't the only thing that drives that number up, but still too bad that it became the sole driver for so many--the cynosure of their every move.
- Kathy Fitch
It's a mistake to think that a new medium that is as flexible as twitter won't model what happens in other mediums.
- Ryan Massie
You're telling me that when you speak it's inherently irrelevant if anyone is listening? You can't have engagement without an audience. But obviously the numbers on Twitter are now irrelevant. It's as if the Nielsen company decided to "adjust" the ratings based on their own opinion of a show's merit.
- Leo Laporte
The idea that being the focus of many increases a person's worth is very, very old. It won't disappear, any more than any other form of vanity will disappear. Saying that you only follow or are followed by a certain type of person is just as vain, and just as legitimate an aspiration. It's not a bad thing, though I can see how having the Nouveau Tweets come along would be annoying to those who've been around for awhile.
- jojo, adventurer
The difference between Leo Laporte's view of "audience" versus Robert Scoble's view of his network in real life and online punctuates the difference between old and new media. An audience is a passive thing that "responds" to you and a network is something you "participate" in where there's give and take. Just because Laporte uses new media tools doesn't make him new media. Seems he just revealed here that he isn't.
- Debi Jones
Leo: followers get you and me paid but if that is how we get our self worth (I know in your case it is not) then that is a sad life indeed. Oh, by the way, I blogged when I only had two readers. You don't need a large audience to give a speech. I give speeches to my sons all the time! :-)
- Robert Scoble
Debi: Leo gets paid by having lots of people listening. My paycheck relies on that too. But my self worth does not rely on it and I would still do this whether or not I was paid. (In last downturn I did it while not getting paid).
- Robert Scoble
I'm tempted to do a demo that I can hit a million followers with little to no effort, just to show why it's so flawed. It's really easy on Twitter - followers mean absolutely nothing there.
- Jesse Stay
Jesse: exactly.
- Robert Scoble
1 million is old and busted . We need a new number ;) . Worth of a person != net worth of a person
- Kashif Khan
Whether or not "anyone" is listening is quite a different thing than "more is always better." If we're talking a mostly one-way broadcast that is one's livelihood, then, sure, more is always better for your income. If it's a workshop or a studio atmosphere we're after, then "that's *way* too many!" becomes a real possibility. True, even, of performances--certainly from the audience perspective.
- Kathy Fitch
Absolutely. Quality of audience is as important as quantity, especially in situations where interaction and conversation is important. Even our advertisers care as much about _who_ is listening as how many. That's how we compete with much larger media outlets.
- Leo Laporte
It only takes days now to reach 10s of thousands...shouldn't take long jesse - overall the numbers on twitter are useless and meaningless
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I have a quote on my monitor that says: "_______________ healthy, and numerically strong." Fill in the blank with whatever, but it says the same - numbers don't tell the whole story.
- Gary Walter (gwalter)
It's much more important to me who is listening, and what they have to say in response. It doesn't matter if the whole planet heard it if they weren't listening.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob, good point. "Listening" really is quite a different thing than "hearing." In some settings--where exchange is key, or teaching is the goal, or a sense of intimacy is important, for instance--smaller audiences (per performance, at least, if not overall) actually increase the chances that everyone will come away feeling that the experience was a success.
- Kathy Fitch
The way I know that people are truly listening, is by whether or not, and how, they respond...If I don't get thoughtful responses, I know I have not delivered my message. I do the same for others. This is how we become successful together
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I'd rather have an incremental increase of followers as opposed to a large amount at once, and I'd prefer followers I can talk with, joke with, discuss with or learn from. It's still down to the quality of the followers you have, not the number. And really, if all your followers aren't listening, then it's not worth having so many.
- George Hall (Australia)
that brands could 'takeover' social media!? Ha, people move away from each successive over application of traditional advertising in this world.
- Kemp Edmonds
Wealthy, B-list celebrities saying they will only give cash to a good charitable cause, if enough people follow them on twitter!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- Jim Connolly
Robert I get that audience is important if you want to attract advertisers in one current model. However, if you look the end results of Twit.tv and what you do, there is a very noticeable distinction. Leo Laporte broadcasts and his audience has conversations in chat rooms while he is broadcasting. That not very different than what CNN or other old media outlets do. I'm just pointing that out. - As for your point about self worth, that really feels more like a strawman. There are other angles to consider.
- Debi Jones
Can you monetize a large enough audience - yes. Are your contributions or interactions in social networks somehow lacking value because your audience isn't large? Of course not. One question to ask is how big does your network need to be for it to be responsive and help you get things done?
- Debi Jones
How we realize the benefits of online social networks where we can increase the number of our "weak ties" or acquaintances? The foundational study "The Strength of Weak Ties" by Mark Granovetter http://is.gd/i1s2
- Debi Jones
Money Quote from Strength of Weak Ties: "It follows, then, that individuals with few weak ties will be deprived of information from distant parts of the social system and will be confined to the provincial news and views of their close friends. This deprivation will not only insulate them from the latest ideas and fashions but may put them in a disadvantaged position in the labor market..."
- Debi Jones
Debi - I don't think the size of the network need be very large to get things done. It just has to reach the right people. If you don't know who those people are, the numbers can help you find them. I can use the size of my own network as an example. As I decide what I want to get done, I find no difficulty reaching the people I need to. And at the size of my network, I don't miss opportunities to listent that I might with a larger, more blanketing network.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
(which is not to say that I'm arguing with you) :)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I like seeing my numbers go up, but really, I'm here to provide value for myself first of all. If others gain value from it too, all the better. But really, I'm here to keep tabs on all you guys and learn from you, and pass on what I learn in case there's anyone out there interested enough to hear it again from me.
- Chris, Taskerrific Guy
My opinion is, if you don't want to hear it from me, that's your loss, not mine. I can still see what you have to say, so I'm not losing anything by you not following me.
- Chris, Taskerrific Guy
Then there's this article from The Economist with commissioned data analysis from Facebook's Data Team. Primates on Facebook - http://www.economist.com/science...
- Debi Jones
And the detailed analysis directly from Facebook's Data Team. http://overstated.net/2009... - Maintained Relationships. The network diagram clearly illustrates The Strength of Weak Ties where light lines connect two clumps of conections under All Friends - http://overstated.net/wp...
- Debi Jones
I know these kinds of people Robert I see them in public on a daily basis.
- James Robertson
I change mine to "a discussion wherein lots of people just confidently say aphoristic sounding statements".
- innesm
Why @brandon_wirtz is wrong about Twitter being a great place for a conversation (discussion here over next few minutes):
Jay Neff, Colin Charles, Mark Aitken and 26 other people liked this
1. You can't bundle Tweets up and permalink to them like I can here.
- Robert Scoble
2. You can't participate on Twitter live where everyone else who isn't following you can see what's going on like this: http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei...
- Robert Scoble
3. Finding the item that started a conversation can often be a real pain in the ass. Not here.
- Robert Scoble
Ooooh, someone with my last name ... don't see that very often!
- Rene Wirtz
4. People can't add onto the metadata of the original tweet, which makes it easier to find. You can do that here. For instance, I can add a keyword, say "wirtzwrong" and in a few seconds you can search for that term and find this item.
- Robert Scoble
4B. The search is already indexed: http://beta.friendfeed.com/search...
- Robert Scoble
Robert, I really like how you're starting to write tweet-saavy posts here - auto-tweeted to Twitter - that are drawing the conversation back to FF for comments, etc.
- Scott Loftesness
Agreed. That is why FF should focus on being where twitter conversations occur instead of actively ignoring tweets
- Christian Anderson
FF just does conversations better than Twitter
- Christian Anderson
5: Brandon Wirtz is an idiot. Proof: http://twitter.com/brandon... he wants to monetize my conversation. So embed this widget into your freaking blog and monetize me!
- Robert Scoble
Well put Scott & Christian
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Actually that was #5: you can embed this chat widget into your blog. Embedding a single conversation over on Twitter is difficult.
- Robert Scoble
#6: I can keep this conversation free of off topic comments, noise, and spam. You can't delete other people's tweets on Twitter so any search will be full of noise, spam, and off topic comments.
- Robert Scoble
twitgrid is pretty horrible, and it's all over ustream.tv just creates massive amounts of link spam and garbage @replies
- rob friedman
Karoli: that is provably wrong.
- Robert Scoble
I think stuff is way easier to find here. I can narrow the search better. And Save it for ever
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Karoli: I can permalink to this thread: http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei... Try doing that over on Twitter.
- Robert Scoble
Karoli: and I can search for this conversation in the future using "wirtzwrong" and find it. I can't do that on Twitter.
- Robert Scoble
Robert: I dont know that you'll get a lot of argument about conversation being better here. They simply are. The new beta features make this that much more pronounced.
- Christian Anderson
This just kills me from this guy "I hate friend feed because the disucssion doesn't near my ads"
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
trying to follow a conversation on twitter is sometimes like playing the old game of telephone, you only get half of the conversation and have to guess the other half, and you can't go back , on friendfeed you can join the conversation at anytime
- Kim Landwehr
my challenge with FF is it or its community don't see it as a conversation engine.
- Christian Anderson
Rob: exactly. Brandon is all about getting more from his Google Ads.
- Robert Scoble
I love friendfeed for driving traffic where I want it to....sure does it better than just a tweet about the same thing
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
The built in discussion threading in Plurk is appealing, but it's too web bound--the unique interface doesn't travel as well. Nice to have it all in one spot, though. Twitter on the phone, on the web, from TweetDeck, in FF, to blogs, from blogs--not so sure I want the thing to take over like that.
- Kathy Fitch
Getting the money is one thing, I don't really have a problem with it...he's just missing out on a huge traffic source because he doesnt get that conversation drives interest
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob: true enough. I get a lot of traffic now from friendfeed to my blog, even though most of my comments happen here.
- Robert Scoble
Friend freed is not nearly as intuitive as Twitter either. I'm not stupid, and friend feed just doesn't click with me I hunt for how I find the disuccsion, I still cant figure out how to go directly to this thread rather than see it on my view.
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: that's bullshit.
- Robert Scoble
And I hit enter so apparently that was Post? rather than Hey I want a new line?
- Brandon Wirtz
Totally agree with your points, Robert. I miss Twitter two years ago when real conversations would be going on for an entire hour or more, and random people would see and join in. Great community. Not today.
- Marina Martin
of course they do...and the more people are interested in your conversation, the more they're interested in your blog and everything else they do
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
On Twitter your comments are mixed in with everyone else. Here? All we have to do is permalink to a single conversation. http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei...
- Robert Scoble
I think we need to take one for the team, all jump onto the most popular platform, and go from there. Accuracy of information is higher when it comes from more people, and Twitter has more people.
- Colin
You can't point oprah to this or grandma and have them just know how to use it.
- Brandon Wirtz
and I've said it before, I get WAY more traffic from a tweet that comes from friendfeed saying "Liked" than just a tweet about the same thing....and the like gets retweeted at least 5x more than any other tweet
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I see FF as a place for chatting and Twitter as a place for announcements/questions (though they're harder to get answers for nowadays). I can't turn on SMS notifications via FF to hear when my Seattle friends are at a local bar, for example.
- Marina Martin
Colin: that's also bullshit. Accuracy of information does NOT go up with a larger crowd. Brandon: you are telling me that I can't link Oprah to this and have them understand how to use it? http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei... Then they don't deserve to be on Twitter, either.
- Robert Scoble
I'm happy if Oprah cant use this
- Lasse Johnsen
Marina: announcements are about all its good for anymore
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Lasse: Oprah can use this. It's just like Twitter. It's not rocket science.
- Robert Scoble
Scoble, it's not bullshit, filtering can be improved on Twitter as well. All I have to do is thread conversation, add meta data like "likes", and Twitter has to open it to real-time
- Colin
Karoli: that searching on friendfeed isn't dramatically better than searching on http://search.twitter.com
- Robert Scoble
Threading is nice, but there are tools to view conversations on twitter as threads. And yes twitter sucks because if one of Scoble's friends responds to me we may have a convesation no one else can see. but Right now having this disucsssion I type, and type, and type, and you dont' see it until I post, and I dont' see what you are talking about. So it is really only good if I'm going to rant, not if I'm going to discuss
- Brandon Wirtz
Colin: Twitter doesn't have likes or comments or threading.
- Robert Scoble
FriendFight!
- Jesse Stay
What if someone gives it those?
- Colin
wow
- rob friedman
Colin: then it'll be copying friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
lol Jesse
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: what the hell are you smoking?
- Robert Scoble
But it will have Twitter's user-base.
- Colin
Colin: a bunch of spammers and celebrities?
- Robert Scoble
Colin: did you notice that Ashton's millionth follower hasn't even Tweeted yet. It is a bot. I am laughing my ass off.
- Robert Scoble
A bunch of people period. I listen to everyone before I make my opinion. (Or try to) =)
- Colin
It is a fact that Twitter has not added any new fetaure related to usability for a long time. Friend Feed makes a fantastic job at beta.friendfeed.com. It is good to see some competiton !
- Leonardo R Nogueira
lmao @ the bot for apluk
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
To my sensibilities, it becomes more of a "correspondence" than a "conversation," per se. The back and forth over days on the same subject might not even be more than exchanged haiku, but it is a sharing of a sort of spiritual connection you would never think of the internet as fostering. I see the change in ways of texting as a reconnection to the old customs of letter writing and correspondence on theories, ideas, politics and humor. I understand your point, but a limited tool is what you make of it.
- Phil Boiarski
Putting the widget on the blog is technically against Google Adsnes TOS since I dont' control the content, if you leave racist, profane, or what have you comments on my post about sponge bob.
- Brandon Wirtz
Rob: here's the millionth follower of Ashton: http://twitter.com/Sinners...
- Robert Scoble
I agree with Colin that Twitter + third-party apps can be a full-fledged FriendFeed competitor. Speed will remain an important problem for Twitter though. Right now, it's really 10x slower than FriendFeed. If Twitter gets its infrastructure in order, the race will get interesting.
- Meryn Stol
Well, you can't *make* people like something, even if it seems for all the world as if they ought to like it, and it would serve them well. I'm guessing most of the folks endlessly pushing the "be a social networking guru" recipes on Twitter aren't all that interested in conversational spaces like this. Feels like a threaded BB. For real rapid fire conversation, I'd still like to head into a MOO, but I lost. Too many folks just didn't get it, didn't see the appeal, found it overwhelming.
- Kathy Fitch
hahahaha! that's pathetic.
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
how many of those bots do you suppose are aplusks own bots ?
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
And Yes as someone who makes 200k a year blogging monetization is an important part of that strategy. People may say that makes me not a blog purist, but you know what I can blog 8 hours a day because I'm a sell out 4 hours a day.
- Brandon Wirtz
Meryn: if Twitter relies on third parties to make conversations and live chat possible, it will fail to come even close tohere.
- Robert Scoble
Brandon: how you making money off of my Tweets?
- Robert Scoble
hmm
- rob friedman
What if Twitter keeps buying 3rd parties and integrating the best features into their own brand/site?
- Colin
My 2 cents? As Karoli is saying, I think, people are talking past each other here. Real-time chat is often more about socializing than "discussion. A forum (e.g. Nabble) is a threaded discussion. FF is a bastard hybrid of both, but is still more like blog comments on steroids. Twitter is a hybrid that more resembles a "wall" where something gets noticed in a large or small crowd. They all have a place, imo.
- Shoq
Threaded conversations from twitter is easy to put on a blog page, Chris Pirrilo had a tool built.
- Brandon Wirtz
June 21, Robert Scoble: "Twitter is for telling the world what you are doing (taking a shower) not for having conversations. They just don't work here." http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei...
- Majento
Brandon: you could embed a widget like these: http://friendfeed.com/embed and you would be able to make money off of my friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
Phil, you sound like someone who would find the flow of a MOO conversation very satisfying.
- Kathy Fitch
Karoli: press 'q' to pause/unpause if comments are "flying out the window"
- Mark Traphagen
Brandon: wrong and I use Pirillo's tool. That's static, not live.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, why? As long as its back-end is fast enough, it won't matter. You can do anything with those 140 chars messages. Maybe at some point, no-one looks at the actual tweets anymore, and we only look at apps (supporting pictures, videos and more than 140 char messages)
- Meryn Stol
Shoq: so I'm not replying to you here? Oh, please.
- Robert Scoble
Meryn: I still read thousands of tweets every day. TweetDeck to the rescue!
- Robert Scoble
robert you gotta get something that works better than tweetdeck ;)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
By the way, did you know you can open this conversation up in a popup window? Visit here: http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei...
- Robert Scoble
Robert, what I meant was that - in the future - you may read those tweets in a whole different way. Also with threading, >140 chars (spread over multiple tweets, but invisible to you) etc.
- Meryn Stol
Robert, remember this? Nothing changed IMO http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei...
- Majento
Then click the timestamp again.
- Robert Scoble
I love those popup windows
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I see nothing happening here that I can't do in twitter, most of these comments are no more targeted or on topic than the randomness of Twitter, the comments are mostly under 140 characters, and so I see no added benefit, and since Twitter has a larger audience I get more value from twitter.
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: I just gave you a ton of things that Twitter does NOT do. I guess you can't read. I prefer people who can't read stay over on Twitter. They fit in with the celebrities and spammers better there.
- Robert Scoble
the threading you cant have for sure on twitter brandon...that's actually up to the replyer to click the right button or it's not threaded
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
All that said... I hate Twitter. It just sucks less than this does.
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: rooms? lists? filter? meta-data? photo? embedded videos?
- Jérôme Flipo
Guess he's never heard of FriendFeed then.
- Nicholas James
Twitter is a recognizable brand, and I just want to get a lot of people into the conversation.
- Colin
@Brandon you should stop arguing, big green robert scoble is about to explode :)
- xavier vespa
A FriendFeed-like UI could be built on top of twitter right now, except for the speed. It would be limited to the speed of Twitter API, which is a total joke.
- Meryn Stol
heheh xavier
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
so lay your trap on twitter than drag them back to your cave(friendfeed)
- rob friedman
Colin: I have 80,000 followers on Twitter and I'm getting far fewer responses to things than I am here on friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
that works really well rob
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Colin: my blog is getting more traffic from friendfeed than from Twitter on most days, too.
- Robert Scoble
lay the trap from frindfeed to twitter
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Ohh, thanks for the link to the pop up. Faster and much more MOO-ey.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon, i've shared more than a few threads with comments of over 140, around 350 :-)
- Majento
Robert, You introduced me the same Day to both FF and Twitter. You may have more traction here, but for reaching an audience that is monetizable, sustainable, and in my opinion enjoyable, I prefer twitter.
- Brandon Wirtz
That's because FriendFeed is threaded, real-time, but probably mostly because you are FriendFeed's biggest speaker? =)
- Colin
the internet is all about cannibalizing one service for another, we early adopters just drag our friends 20min late to the beginning of the party, and in a year or so we'll be dragging them somewhere else.
- rob friedman
Brandon: it's pretty clear you are religious about Twitter cause you aren't even able to admit that it has a lot of things that Twitter doesn't do.
- Robert Scoble
I would also say twitter has better ettiquette because you would never have called me an idiot at a conference, or on twitter. And you will on FF.
- Brandon Wirtz
Hmmm. This conversation itself makes Robert's point. This is the first real discussion I've ever had that at all flowed from Twitter. So!
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon: how are you monetizing my Tweet?
- Robert Scoble
Brandon: I'd gladly call you an idiot on Twitter. I've done that to lots of people over there, when they earn the title.
- Robert Scoble
It's been said before, but there is in fact room for both. No one is an idiot for choosing one, the other, or both. Its a personal preference. I'll be glad if everyone one day realizes that. But if they don't that's their choice as well I suppose.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
Well, the first one I've ever witnessed, anyway. "Idiot" is fairly tame as epithets go, though, isn't it.
- Kathy Fitch
I monetize your tweets all the time. You make a point, I make a counter point, and my followers who aren't part of the cult of scoble have a discussion with me about it. I sell services all the time because of things you and Guy Kawasaki argue over.
- Brandon Wirtz
I remember Robert suggesting that people call him out "Robert you idiot!" :-)
- Majento
Troy: that's not my point. I use Twitter all day long. I have a computer that does nothing but run TweetDeck. But TweetDeck is a horrid place to have this kind of back and forth conversation.
- Robert Scoble
Rob is right about the constant moving west, I think.
- Kathy Fitch
because... Twitter has more people with money to spend. It's not near as elitist.
- Brandon Wirtz
Early adopters are restless creatures.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon: you are funny.
- Robert Scoble
<--never spends a dime on any twitter related item.
- Kathy Fitch
Indeed Robert, Tweetdeck UI is a joke for conversations. Only thing it's usable for is monitoring/search.
- Meryn Stol
Kathy: yes we are, aren't we? Notice we haven't seen a fail whale here.
- Robert Scoble
Tweetdeck is excellent for aiming one's attention effectively.
- Kathy Fitch
Kathy: these discussions happen frequently (and yes robert...never a sign of a whale!)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Why use Tweetdeck when you can use a relatively good web service that parses twitter efficiently?
- Majento
I like it.
- Kathy Fitch
It's reminiscent of a MOO discussion--cool.
- Kathy Fitch
haha
- Majento
Can't throw things at you, though, so I do miss the object orientation.
- Kathy Fitch
Kathy: here's a list of all conversations that have had more than 100 comments: http://beta.friendfeed.com/search... Brandon, that's another thing you can't do on Twitter.
- Robert Scoble
ty robert.
- Kathy Fitch
its interesting watching the conversation here, and in the FF air app, sometimes the webpage updates first, sometimes its the air app. obviously you can only reply using the page.
- rob friedman
peoplebrowsr works way better majento and runs on the web
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Robert, Love you as I do, you bring audience with you where ever you go, which makes your view of things very different than others. on FF you are a leader, and everyone on there knows who you are. But like your loathing of Facebook, when you step in to a more mainstream medium you dislike it.
- Brandon Wirtz
You are right a lot of Twitter is illiterate, you only get 140 characters not much room for 12 letter words
- Brandon Wirtz
Facebook is eminently loathe-able, though.
- Kathy Fitch
/me throws wifi card @person
- rob friedman
Brandon: I don't loath Facebook. It just isn't that useful for someone who is trying to have public conversations with lots of people.
- Robert Scoble
cracking up at rob.
- Kathy Fitch
guruvan, i think i tried it before...
- Majento
Here's all conversations that mention Brandon Wirtz. Another thing Twitter can't do: http://beta.friendfeed.com/search...
- Robert Scoble
But there are 100 fold as many Twitter users, and I make money monetizing the masses.
- Brandon Wirtz
beta out very soon majento
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Thing is, who cares if Twitter sucks for conversation. If someone doesn't like it that much they'll try to find something better, and may end up here. Though I have seen a lot of people say are just fine with the way twitter does back and forth. They are not wrong. It is their opinion. If it works for them, fine.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
awww Brandon has a man crush on Scoble. :)
- rob friedman
Rob, in a MOO you could whisper behind backs, too.
- Kathy Fitch
And as soon as Twitter can do that Scoble? What does FF have over Twitter then, it's design?
- Colin
lol @ rob
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Kathy: I'm whispering behind your back on DM's here.
- Robert Scoble
I think one of the FF devs said something about new DM features. maybe whisper?
- rob friedman
Twitter isn't a conversation, though. It's noise that sometimes resolves into a shape, but often doesn't.
- Kathy Fitch
Robert and I have debated things for 5+ years we were both MVPs and both worked at MSFT with the title evangelist, and we got stuck in death valley together.
- Brandon Wirtz
Kathy you could do thast with am IM client ;) or in a DM conversation
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
DMs work the same way as regular conversations
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Btw, there's another great service when it comes to threaded convo, it's small, Kwippy.com
- Majento
Colin: I've been on Twitter nearly three years waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting....
more...
- Robert Scoble
Rob, I've never loved IM
- Kathy Fitch
I really did love MediaMOO.
- Kathy Fitch
I'm not a huge fan....but it works...and like I said for a whispe send DMs on FF
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Colin: wake me up when Twitter adds these features, then we'll talk. @ev says he doesn't want to add metadata to Twitter (like comments and likes). Why? It would make Twitter more complex.
- Robert Scoble
I'll keep that in mind, Rob, thanks.
- Kathy Fitch
I loathe Face book as well. I dont' get why people like it. I'm much more a linked in person.
- Brandon Wirtz
This is my first time on FF.
- Kathy Fitch
Most social Media Platforms suck.
- Brandon Wirtz
For those who are just joining this argument, er, conversation, you can join in live here: http://beta.friendfeed.com/scoblei... Oh, Brandon, Twitter can't do that.
- Robert Scoble
I use facebook and linkedin alot
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I've avoided developing yet another interest. I need a clone or three.
- Kathy Fitch
ive loved all chat when it works well, IRC, jabber MUC, MUD's, dialup BBS forums.
- rob friedman
Comparative thinking is over rated :-)
- Majento
Colin: Do you really use FriendFeed?
- Nicholas James
What if someone else adds those features, not Twitter itself
- Colin
I use FB some, because it seems requisite, somehow, but I've no affection for it.
- Kathy Fitch
Nicholas, I don't, not until now ;)
- Colin
Rob: chat sucks. I used to help run Leo Laporte's chat room and I can do a thesis of why it never took off.
- Robert Scoble
I do a lot of reading instead!
- Colin
Colin: wake me up when that happens. I figure it's about another month before Facebook copies the new features of friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
pwd!
- Majento
The instant transcript here is nice. It both moves and stays. Easy to reference and return to.
- Kathy Fitch
Robert, granted its not for everyone who is not computer litereate, but that what's software is supposed to do, by lowering the bar. now there is IRC web apps and other craziness
- rob friedman
Kathy: and guess what? Google indexes it! So does friendfeed. You can search for anything in here and find it.
- Robert Scoble
do you yeally think thsat facebook has the infrastructure to run realtimte robert?
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
(sry bad typos)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I see the appeal, Robert. If you hadn't twittered the invitation, I wouldn't have given it a whirl.
- Kathy Fitch
guruvan we all love ya
- Majento
:)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob: yes. Facebook has the infrastructure. They have to rebuild some of its technology, though, because they have 200 million people and not everyone is on the same data center.
- Robert Scoble
Bill: Leo Laporte is doing some of the most innovative media around. And he is making more money off of this stuff than Brandon Wirtz is.
- Robert Scoble
GSLB
- rob friedman
Facebook always seems awkwardly organized to me--especially now--and that's why I hate it.
- Kathy Fitch
Yeah Robert, like Rob, I have doubt if Facebook can follow FriendFeed with real-time. At least in that time-frame you suggest: one month or so. It may take them quite long...
- Meryn Stol
I don't like it for the sutpid apps I gotta block all the time
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Robert you see it as a feature list, I see it as obtainability curve. I don't think you will ever get Oprah on Friend feed. And you would argue you don't want her on it, But.... I would argue that any of the mothers of any of the girls I date would end up on Something Oprah and Ellen are on. And that means I can have a discussion with them. And even if that discussion is hampered by the medium being substandard, it's like clubbing in LA, if I can't get my friend in the Club, Its not a club I will enjoy.
- Brandon Wirtz
Meryn: Facebook had real time running and it's very close to realtime anyway. Their users hated it cause they didn't like the idea that they'd have to deal with a feed.
- Robert Scoble
I not sure the people on Facebook want it in real time, most of the people I follow on facebook are my family and friends from college and they are not ready or wanting real time.
- Kim Landwehr
I loved the old newsfeed....esp the realtime one
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: you would have said the exact same thing to me about Twitter two years ago and you would have been wrong.
- Robert Scoble
Agreed Brandon
- Colin
Brandon: celebrities show up when large audiences and hype shows up.
- Robert Scoble
Twitter is a good place to get a conversation started, but a lousy place in which to conduct it.
- jcunwired
I like the pre-celeb days of tools. Way more fun. Sigh.
- Kathy Fitch
Hmm yes, well maybe I'm mistaken. I'm not an expert on these matters.
- Meryn Stol
jcunwired--well put.
- Kathy Fitch
Robert: good point
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: Facebook has 200 million users and is far more complex than Twitter or friendfeed.
- Robert Scoble
This is a very nimble thing, isn't it?
- Kathy Fitch
Also very driven by literacy, though.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon: how did Facebook get 10 to 20x more users than Twitter and 100 to 200 times more users than friendfeed if complexity matters?
- Robert Scoble
Colin: Facebook have added some of FriendFeed's items. Also you haven't added anything to your feed once you add items to your feed and engage in converstation etc you'll realise the value of FriendFeed as a conversation agent which you can declare by "liking" something or commenting on the particular content. Which unlike Twitter other people can participate at the same time without the "@" constantly which is hard to keep up with especially if there are as many people involved & as many comments like this
- Nicholas James
Regarding Twitter two years ago... You and I are in agreement... I am saying of all the gin joints of all the world, I'll hang in the one with the crowd that gets me the most bang for the buck. And While that makes me a lemming... It makes me a lemming who is well fed.
- Brandon Wirtz
That should keep the celebs away in droves. This is also a very cool platform for just organizing things, isn't it?
- Kathy Fitch
FF needs to put in a way for you to mark where you left off in comments, for when you have to afk, like I do now.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
Shoot--I'm going to end up putting time in here, too, now.
- Kathy Fitch
But I also think that I could have as much of this discussion on Twitter with little loss in the quality of the conversation
- Brandon Wirtz
Lots of the academics on FB use it for conversation, but Brandon, I've never seen a conversation at all like this on Twitter.
- Kathy Fitch
Agreed, Leather.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon: What would be the mechanism for easily tracking conversations in Twitter? @? #? For a small group, maybe.
- CAJ, somewhere else
Kathy, You must follow the wong people, I have these debates daily on twitter
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: You seriously think that this many people can participate, with this level of conversation and actually keep up?
- Nicholas James
The #groups can kind of foster it, though. That seems to be growing.
- Kathy Fitch
Kathy there is celebrity at all levels of interaction. We all follow a group mentality to some degree.
- rob friedman
Brandon: link me to one.
- Robert Scoble
Oh, yes, I enjoy following all of the wrong people. ;-)
- Kathy Fitch
it doesnt work that well tho kathy
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Leather, you are right. it' too noisy in twitter.
- netvista
people have to remember to use the tags
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I had a debate about AmazonFail the other day with a good 15 people and another 20 popping in and out.
- Brandon Wirtz
and not mis type them
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
you can't possibly have the huge debate on twitter if you follow 3k people
- Brandon Wirtz
I agree, Rob--you have to visit the page. So conversation via Twitter is always about moving someplace else.
- Kathy Fitch
Not much conversation in a club, Brandon--you have to head to the kitchen, for that. This spot is very kitcheny.
- Kathy Fitch
The comments go by to quickly. but on twitter lots of times I am in two debates at once.
- Brandon Wirtz
very correct kathy
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
These Scoble Salons are really cool: lots of interaction in hundreds of comments over a really short time. And they provide a wealth of information on using Friendfeed. We're having a great conversation on FF, but it's about FF itself. Nothing wrong with that, but it leaves me hungering for more conversation on more subjects. Just sayin'
- Tom Landini
mmm speaking of kitchen, im kinda hungry
- rob friedman
Brandon: right. Twitter conversations are where information goes to get lost.
- Robert Scoble
I can do more than one conversaton at a time on FF brandon
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
POPup windows!
- rob friedman
laughing
- Kathy Fitch
lol@ Scoble Salons heh
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Kathy, its all about who you are going to dance with :-) And many of the lounges in LA are pretty quiet off the dance floor. Aqua Lounge in Beverly Hills, has plenty of quiet corners.
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: You can engage in several conversations constantly on FriendFeed. Infact you can also participate with 100+ people in a conversation on FriendFeed. Try doing that on Twitter.
- Nicholas James
Well, I've certainly never happened into a long conversation via Twitter--folks seem very intent on the RT there, and on building followers, and pushing blogs.
- Kathy Fitch
Not a lot of room for conversation in that.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon--this is a quiet corner, no? And you are here.
- Kathy Fitch
I've had some long conversations on twitter but they're usually one on one and irritate other people
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
And here, I've spoken with you for the first time ever, a thing unlikely to have happened in Twitter.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon you've even said you can't have a conversation on Twitter when you follow 3k people. Twitter isn't a conversation agent - FriendFeed is.
- Nicholas James
I would have to say that trying to watch more than 30 ppl chatting at the same time on FF could get very messy and scroll the bottom down way too much if you can't keep up. it would be nice if the comment textarea was a static bar at the bottom of the page
- rob friedman
nite bill
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Mostly I don't want to debate 100 people at once. I want to pick 4 people and pick the points that matter. 100 people is a mob. I can't change 50 people's mind at a time, I can change 2-3
- Brandon Wirtz
rob mine is
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
rob - click on the timestamp if you want to watch a fast-moving conversation like this one. I'm looking at a page with a textarea that stays at the bottom.
- Bruce Lewis
My Follow list adds and subtracts relevant people based on the conversation, or I use Groups
- Brandon Wirtz
Yeah--real conversations require conversation sized groups.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon: we're just talking 1:1 here.
- Robert Scoble
@Rob Friedman: I was thinking the exact same a minute ago
- Nicholas James
If I group the eco nuts, and am in an eco nut mood I go argue with them
- Brandon Wirtz
NO, my text area is at the bottom, I'm on the page for this thread
- rob friedman
Robert, that statement above may be true, but twitter is also a very good place where conversations may be found. Again - not conducted. FF is the place to conduct a conversation (if comparing the two).
- jcunwired
I think you pick one person to go up against and work on them..... Like Robert! ;)
- Colin
I just want to be able to read scroll back and type an entry at the same time!
- rob friedman
If I'm in a What is Robert and Jason Calacanis and Guy talkign about I tune to that channel
- Brandon Wirtz
@Bruce Lewis - Thanks!
- Nicholas James
Pauses to wonder what an "eco nut mood" might look like.
- Kathy Fitch
Brandon: please link to one of those Twitter conversations. I want to get something out of it, but I can't figure out how to find the conversation.
- Robert Scoble
Would like to see that link, too.
- Kathy Fitch
twitter is a place where some good ideas are found...but not conversations usually
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
We are talking 1:1 here robert, and this doesn't suck. But going back to the club analogy... We're hanging in the quiet corner but there is not dance floor. I can get my intelectual needs fulfilled but much less of my Friend / Social Needs.
- Brandon Wirtz
Often, I just let things roll by, scanning for interesting patterns or differences--one of these things is not like the others. But on Twitter, there's a whole lot of echo chambering going on.
- Kathy Fitch
Or, at least, I can't figure out how to find the entire conversation. By the time I see Brandon saying something the other side has already disappeared and it's too hard to engage. Here? No. You can engage on this thread in six months. It will still be here.
- Robert Scoble
This starts to feel like IRC again. fun. :) Instant chat rooms for anyone, though they are not really rooms, but more like "meetings". The thread is the meeting. And each meeting gets its url.
- Meryn Stol
#journchat might be one of those robert....but you have to use it via 3rd party web page to use it well
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Meryn: very good point
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Good night, Bill.
- Kathy Fitch
rob: that's just three grunts, not a conversation. Where's a conversation on Twitter?
- Robert Scoble
and without all the kicks and bans
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Good night Bill Heslin. I would never hear you loved us on twitter since I'm not following you. FriendFeed is where the party is and I can mingle with everybody.
- Bruce Lewis
You know that joke about social media expert with 70 phone apps for the different mediums? well most normal people have one realtime App, and one What ever "time" we are calling Facebook
- Brandon Wirtz
Robert, don't ask me I just performed the search query based on the topic of the conversation he said he had on twitter.
- rob friedman
Rob: you do realize I can delete your items here, right? So if you get out of hand I can clean up your mess. I can also block you, in which case you can't even see this to engage on it again.
- Robert Scoble
Good Night Bill. And Brandon why don't you just admit that FriendFeed is the place for conversations - we all know its true - Twitter its practically impossible to do so.
- Nicholas James
People are either Myspace, or Face book. they are Twitter, or FF
- Brandon Wirtz
If a conversation can't be found or revisited and reconsidered, then . . .
- Kathy Fitch
Rob: this decentralized moderation is VERY powerful.
- Robert Scoble
I know that but it's not a games here robert
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: not true. I know thousands of people who are on all of the social networks.
- Robert Scoble
on IRC it's a game
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Robert, part of what you are saying is that conversation (to the extent that it can occur at all) loses value, disappears, may as well not have happened.
- Kathy Fitch
Robert, I know you can block me, that's fine if you choose to do so. I'm just here participating, if you'd like me to go just ask k?
- rob friedman
What's decentralized moderation?
- Tom Landini
And I know Millions who are on only 1.
- Brandon Wirtz
Tom: no central admins
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
each person responsible for the threads they create
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: I am all. I know alot of people who are also on all.
- Nicholas James
Kathy: right. I had a lot of conversations the night of the Chinese Earthquake. I can't get to those anymore. They never existed if you can't get to them again.
- Robert Scoble
Tom: you can delete things underneath nodes you create. I can delete things underneath nodes I create.
- Robert Scoble
Nodding at Robert. I totally see what you're saying. Value requires that a thing not be utterly ephemeral.
- Kathy Fitch
Rob, it's actually much like moderation of blog comments. And the blog model scales. It has proven to scale.
- Meryn Stol
I don't disagree with you robert on the archive thing... Twitter sucks for that.
- Brandon Wirtz
but you are a trail blazer and you use tools to their fullest
- Brandon Wirtz
Meryn: correct again
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: I guarantee that in a year you'll be saying that Twitter sucks for a lot of things. I notice you tend to follow me by about two years. :-)
- Robert Scoble
So interesting, but I must run. Thanks so much for letting me play in your sandbox.
- Kathy Fitch
hagn Kathy :)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Kathy: I'll come over to your sandbox next time! :-)
- Robert Scoble
And you'd be welcome there! Night, all!
- Kathy Fitch
Twitter sucks for an amazing number of things.
- Brandon Wirtz
and it's still good for a few...like announcing a conversation on friendfeed
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I see FF sometimes as the realtime blogosphere... The model is quite similar, but MUCH faster. What's really different from blogging is the Friend of a Friend feature (that you see where your friends have commented on, or what they liked). Take that away, and it's like blogs, but then realtime.
- Meryn Stol
but... Twitter can get me paid, and Twitter can get me Laid. I dont' know of to many people who find dates via FB, or who have been able to monetize it.
- Brandon Wirtz
Scobleizer, I think you're wrong.
- Bruce Lewis
In a year Brandon won't be talking about twitter at all.
- Bruce Lewis
Bruce: that's possible. Even probable.
- Robert Scoble
brandon, the conversation here drives tons of traffic ON twitter...
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: I know people who have monetized Facebook - they run some applications there ;)
- Nicholas James
you can tweet right from FF too ...and drive the traffic to your blog...
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob: Twitter is good for a LOT of things. Starting conversations is one of them. Building text-based apps like the Washington State Department of Transportation did to tell you how long waiting times are at the border, is another.
- Robert Scoble
Robert I am ahead of you on monetizing every medium you had a 2 year lead on.
- Brandon Wirtz
thats a great app robert...theres all kinds of cool things that can use twitter as a transport
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: I don't debate how well I'm monetizing but I will put my tax return against yours anytime.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, yes, but this all would work just as well on FriendFeed. Plus this would take away the 140 chars limit.
- Meryn Stol
Win vs Linux, FF vs FB, FF vs Twitter, anything else? it sucks!
- netvista
@netvista: FriendFeed and Twitter are not competitors. Nor are Facebook and FriendFeed.
- Nicholas James
Ok I'm really off to bed now... This thing is addictive as crack. ;)
- Meryn Stol
That might be interesting. I'm pretty sure I made more at MSFT. and This year I'll approach 7 figures.
- Brandon Wirtz
Hmmm...netvista has a point. Scoble, when are you going over to Disqus?
- Bruce Lewis
Meryn: it's worse than crack.
- Robert Scoble
If not surpass it
- Brandon Wirtz
Bruce: soon, soon!
- Robert Scoble
is that all that matters though brandon? money?
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: congratulations. Unfortunately I can't discuss my Fast Company deals in public. Let's just say I'm very happy.
- Robert Scoble
Robert, sure you are "replying," here, but in a linear comment thread which is useless when you have 300 comments like this. People can't auto-thread, or remember what they replied to. And I was not knocking this, only clarifying differences. As I read most of your points, you want to mash all the best features together, and frankly, I do too. But where that happens is still an open issue. You seem convinced it should be here, and perhaps you're right.
- Shoq
That will be cool. As much fun as I had saying, "Scobleizer, I think you're wrong", it's more fun to get coverage of cool tech, which Disqus definitely is.
- Bruce Lewis
Shoq: I can see what everyone is replying to here. Oh, you mean if someone came in right now and they wanted to reply to something said an hour ago? Well, it's not that hard. Want me to demonstrate?
- Robert Scoble
Observation: When threads like this get popular, the interaction on other parts of FriendFeed gets pretty dead. This didn't seem to happen as much with the old UI.
- Mike Doeff
Rob Nelson: no. but if I can do what I like to do because it pays the bill I don't ever have to "work"
- Brandon Wirtz
That may be a yes.
- Brandon Wirtz
Every moment we argue who is the best, no result! just like win or linux, even Qt vs Gmome in Linux world.
- netvista
Mike Doeff: That will change as more communities adopt FriendFeed.
- Bruce Lewis
but it keeps coming back down to just that for you brandon
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Has anyone heard of TweetChat? http://tweetchat.com/ It turns the concept of those # tags into a chat atleast somewhat resembling this.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
Well the crux of the argument was "is twitter a great place for conversation"
- Brandon Wirtz
I hold that it is people who make a great conversation
- Brandon Wirtz
Rob: Brandon does things for money. Except I'm wondering what he's doing here. Heh. Brandon: no, the argument is that Twitter sucks for having conversations. There's no way we could have done this over on Twitter.
- Robert Scoble
and I find that less and less on twitter by the day brandon
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Same Difference. I say FF sux for conversations because Oprah, can't or won't come.
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: FriendFeed isn't "mainstream" like Twitter is.
- Nicholas James
Brandon, FF is where I meet people for great conversation. Retweets aren't as useful for finding interesting people as open comment threads like this one.
- Bruce Lewis
you say Twitter sux, because it lacks features and not as many peopel can participate
- Brandon Wirtz
Yes Robert, I would like to see that demo. Still new to FF, mostly
- Shoq
You know what we are both right.
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: I don't judge things are good only because Oprah uses them. If that was the case then Twitter sucked until this morning and I've been on that for three years.
- Robert Scoble
Once it hits "mainstream" which it eventually will especially with the new BETA then it will be alot better then Twitter infact it already is - just the celebs aren't using it because, they have their aids running their accounts and the can't "like" and "comment" in the way the real celeb will.
- Nicholas James
Brandon, Scoble has no problem admitting when he's wrong. Just give a link to a conversation on twitter made great by Oprah's participation and he'll admit your point in a heartbeat.
- Bruce Lewis
Twitter is the dive bar that lets everyone in, and is a little crowded, and a little noisy, but everyone is welcome, and your more likely to run in to some one you wanted to have a conversation with.
- Brandon Wirtz
Shoq, here you go. Let me argue with something Christian Anderson said "my challenge with FF is it or its community don't see it as a conversation engine." Christian: the "belief" of the community about what friendfeed is is about to radically change, particularly when we get live search feeds here.
- Robert Scoble
Oprah may be a bad example she was just top of mind.
- Brandon Wirtz
she tweeted he lunch order today
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Brandon: you have not been able to back up your points with proof. Just link to a good conversation you had back and forth with other people and where i could join in and also be seen.
- Robert Scoble
And the problems with looking back in history on twitter is not lost on me
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: if you had a good conversation and we can not see it did that conversation really happen?
- Robert Scoble
Robert if you had a good conversation and we can not see it did that conversation really happen?
- Brandon Wirtz
By the way, we just passed 375 comments here. Try THAT on Twitter and see how many "unfollows" you get.
- Robert Scoble
It's like human memory, not very good ;).
- Colin
You have history, I have reach
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: Show me one Twitter conversation with a conversation like this, with as many participants and with people not being confused.
- Nicholas James
Acutally everytime I have good debate on twitter my follow count goes up
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: you have two followers here on friendfeed. I have 33,000. By the way, will you add some tweets and blogs into your friendfeed account please?
- Robert Scoble
I have no idea how I have 2 followers. That's like 800x as many as I should
- Brandon Wirtz
Brandon: one of them is me. Heheh.
- Robert Scoble
heh
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Increasing your follower count does not equal good conversation
- Christian Burns
Anyway, this conversation is no longer more interesting than me getting a glass of Merlot, so I'll leave you and see ya later.
- Robert Scoble
enjoy your wine robert :)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Robert, I think another part of the problem is the user paradigm. Professionals who want to have focused discussions like this, can adapt to this linear style of pseudo-chat. The music freaks love meembo's real time chat, the JustinTV people are using twitter-style chat AND real time at the same time. This conversation is getting to the point where it's more of a chat. But none of this is what Twitter users are doing with @aplusk, or even their co-workers. They aren't discussing. Just tweeting :)
- Shoq
Christian: true, but he was saying he has more reach. Not in today's world. I have more followers on friendfeed than he does on Twitter.
- Robert Scoble
Technically, this whole thread could have started at http://tweetchat.com/room... instead and everyone could have followed every comment just like they are here. The only problem is everyone else not in the room also sees it.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
Tony: tweetchat isn't nearly as satisfying and if I tried doing back and forth like this I would have gotten at least 1,000 unfollow messages.
- Robert Scoble
I don't know about the more reach. I could be thsat if I asked around to my friends online, they would mostly know the name Scoble, and not Wirtz
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Shoq: Oh, you can use friendfeed to broadcast out URLs and self-serving tweets too. I do that all the time! :-)
- Robert Scoble
regardless of blog derived income
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
Rob: I know a lot of rich people who don't blog at all. Imagine that!
- Robert Scoble
haha...most of the rich people I know don't blog robert
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
friendfeed is wonderful for the selfserving tweets I'll second that
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
@Robert The satisfying part, thats personal preference. The resulting unfollows, yes I agree that's still lacking in the alternative. But it is evolving and that issue could be addressed. But thats my whole point, its all evolving.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
Rob: even better, with one self serving tweet on friendfeed you can hit both friendfeed AND twitter. So, if you are a lazy monetization engine like Brandon you get a two for one special! :-)
- Robert Scoble
Robert, don't forget to add in ping.fm to add to the distribution of the social networks. :)
- rob friedman
Tony: yeah, it's evolving. Friendfeed is an addon to Twitter right now. You did notice how effectively I got Brandon to come here instead of wasting my Twitter follower's time with an esoteric argument, right? Right?
- Robert Scoble
OK, 400 comments is enough. I'm going for that glass of wine now and am off to think about Obama's new CTO.
- Robert Scoble
You can do wine and FF at the same time, can't you? I'm cleaning the kitchen and still participating.
- Bruce Lewis
Exactly on all points. :)
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
does anyone know how many items in FF come from twitter? if twitter isn't exit, how about FF?
- netvista
Bruce: yes, but Milan wants to play too. Anyway, I'll see ya all later.
- Robert Scoble
@Robert Admittedly I hadn't thought one way or the other about Brandon. I just remember you asking for an example of how a conversation could be followed on Twitter the same way it is here. So I gave one. Though the execution does need more work.
- Tony, Paradox of FF
Alright Robert. Looking forward to Disqus.
- Bruce Lewis
have a good night robert...
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
It's not possible to have conversation with multiple people on a topic(simultaneously) because of no threading and Thanks Majento for your comment:)
- Mayank Dhingra
it is possible but you have to pay closer attention. touch typing skill helps
- guruvan (Rob Nelson)
I really think Twitter is a great place for conversation, just not a great place to converse.
- Michiel Sikkes
twitter is a better place to START a conversation not have one. Surprising what can be said ion 140 characters, though.
- Sheryl
Sheryl's onto it...More and more I find conversations start on Twitter and then pick them up here on FF. Or - sometimes a thread is sparked on FF and then I find new peeps joining in when they catch the feed in Twitter or FB. A lovely, tangled mesh, innit?!...
- Thom Kennon
OK, late to the game, but isn't the only point here that we have conversations where the people are almost regardless of the technology? FriendFeed is in my opinion for the power user far more useful for reasons above. But Twitter is media hyped and very direct to get into.
- Mark Aitken
I'd also like to see Google make sense of Twitter for indexing. Might be a very good reason it's not bought it yet.
- Mark Aitken
Twitter launches a sign-on system for Web sites similar to Facebook Connect http://www.readwriteweb.com/archive...
Ahmet Yükseltürk, Carlos M. Gomes, Nicholas James and 18 other people liked this
This is gonna be like competing credit card agencies, I think.
- Meryn Stol
I'd personally rather sign in with Twitter than with Facebook. FriendFeed would be optimal. :)
- Meryn Stol
That's awesome. I was hoping they were going to be launching something like this soon.
- Alexander Grundner
so the question is, for future projects should we use sign in with Twitter or Facebook connect?
- Sarp Erdag
20 things about friendfeed http://m.kyte.tv/ch...
Kisha, Well Conditioned, Keith - @tsudo, K.D. and 123 other people liked this
Told you he'd be posting before the hors d'oeuvres were served...
- MVB (Curmudgeon of FF)
hor d'oeuvres? where?
- Michael VanDervort
I'm watching your video right now
- sofarsoShawn
Robert, I am unable to watch your video (never been) in kite.tv with GNU/Linux and Flash 10. Although I have no problems in any other video platform.
- Ricardo Galli
It is the first service to bring all our content into one place
- paul mooney
Watching your video. Definitely learning a lot. Much to take in.
- Marty McPadden
This is a great tuturial Robert, I am learning about all kinds of features I never knew about. Too bad Friendfeed doesn't have a video/visual tutorial like this for all the newcomers (albeit more concise for them).
- Brian
Yes - and screencasted, not video of screen.
- Hal
Have they ever come up with a good way to sync my twitter follows as imaginary friends without having to add each individually?
- Hal
Was it just blurry for me or is it blurry for everyone? I think I could have learned way more from it if I could see what you were was doing. Looked like you were doing some cool stuff.
- MarkCarras
awesome job Robert - watching it right now. It's great you're not over the top in describing it's usefulness...rather a sensible overview of it's benefits.
- Zee.
That's great info, Robert. Thank you. Lots of stuff I didn't know.
- Drew
Thank you for taking the time to put this together.
- Rob Michael (Atmos Trio)
Love it Robert, thanks, I learned a lot.
- Ginger Kenney
Great vid. Really showed off some awesome capabilities.
- Joe Brinkman
Robert: Either I'm losing my mind or you're double-clicking on links.
- Chris Luckhardt
Chris: my computer is messed up. :-)
- Robert Scoble
I love FF and have been using it for a few months (though not exclusively), but I still picked up a few powerful tips that I didn't know or understand before. Thanks, Robert!
- Helen Hoefele
Robert did you make this video for Arrington? I hope so, that way he'll start participating more...same goes for Guy Kawasaki too. :)
- Susan Beebe
Nah, just trying to explain the features.
- Robert Scoble
This friendfeed thing confuses me to no end. Maybe I'm just dense, but I've never been able to figure out how to organize things here so that the cool stuff perks to the top, then there's keeping track of things I like or whatever. I hope your vid is damn good cuz it's downloading now over a dialup line. yup, they still haven't fixed my highspeed yet. :-) Edited to put a smiley after that last statement, hehe.
- Eddy Cole
It's a really good introduction to both basic and advanced FriendFeed use. Perhaps more interestingly, helps explain how Robert manages his massive inbound data flow.
- Michael Krigsman
Ross the Friendfeed intern did some tutorials a while back, but FF sure failed to keep up with creating new ones as the feature set (and interface) evolved. Ross's videos here: http://www.vimeo.com/rossmil...
- Mitch
I think that if I knew that I could see all of my twitter activity from within friendfeed, then I would use it in leui of a twitter client - but I don't feel like taking the time to add imaginary friends.
- Hal
What we really need is a "Friendfeed Tour" room which is added by default to ever single new account. It could be moderated by the FF crew and include links to a whole bunch of goodies for new friendfeeders.
- Mitch
Next installment: 20 ways to being a bigger FriendFeed monster than Robert Scoble? =)
- deepikaur
Comprehensive. Needs a screencast treatment instead of pointing vid cam at the screen.
- Tom Landini
This should go on the ff homepage
- Michael Fidler
2009 is the year I start really drinking the FF Koolaid. I started a week early, technically, but then the good resolutions are the ones worth getting ahead of right away. This video was helpful for understanding how to make the most of the service, Robert. I'll be sharing it with others, especially if I slip into the social media rabbit hole that this service can be for many users. As always, thank you for sharing your experience.
- Alex Howard
I find that friendfeed has a lot of passive users. Their activity comes from the aggregation of other media, not from any attention on friendfeed itself. Robert is very active on FF and so gets a lot of immediate conversation going, but many have it set on auto-pilot. I find this is less the case with twitter. Perhaps it will change.
- Marcel LeBrun
Robert, I love the down to earth presentation on this. Very approachable method of video, and informative.
- Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
I've been waiting for this video. Good stuff.
- Andrew
Thanks for this - its great to have a practical 'how to' guide.
- Graham Hills
Nice! Didn't really get Friendfeed until now. It would be phenomenal if I could manage and write to everyone of my aggregations via friendfeed. Hate to have 3+ Backends for my Blogs etc
- Sebastian
Robert, I've been using FriendFeed for a while now. Thanks! This was superb.
- Pilgrim Five
"Hide" feature!? I have no "Hide" link under my entries - how did you get one of those?! I want one! I have "Comment", "Like" and "More".
- Isha (Marysia)
Thanks for posting. I never knew that Friendfeed could be so useful. I didn't even know there was a like feature till you pointed it out. I just thought it was another one of those lifestreaming aggregators.
- Thao Ly
Marysia: "Hide" is only available on entries if you are in the home screen. So click on "Home" and now you should see Hide.
- Robert Scoble
"Hide" is available in any list at the top level. For instance, if I create a list called "Tech Bloggers" and add six people to it, "Hide" is visible if I click the Tech Bloggers list on the left side. If I open the reveal triangle and click on one individual's ID, then "Hide" is not available.
- Will King
Thankfully this was a tutorial. I still expect Robert to use a computer nearly as fast as Commander Data.
- Kevykev
Great video Robert. Really enjoyed checking out all the features on FriendFeed. You seem to have it set up really well. I wondered why you didn't use a screencast recording program so we could watch what you were doing on your screen a bit more easily. I don't want that to sound like a criticism though because I really appreciate the effort you went to, recording the vid.
- Paul Richards
I'm bumping this post, because this video is so good. Just sent it to a friend who just signed up to help explain the experience along with the FFundercats Episode 25 podcast. These are great resources. http://www.kyte.tv/scoblei...
- Eric @ CSTechcast.com
I'm uploading a 24-minute video about friendfeed. Demonstrates it does too much. :-)
zeroinfluencer, TobiasVerhoog.com, Robin Good and 91 other people liked this
white board?
- sean percival
looking forward to it, may help :-)
- Patphelan
sean: no, just 20 things demoed about it. I don't know that it'll help. Probably just bore everyone. UPDATE: the video is here: http://www.kyte.tv/scoblei...
- Robert Scoble
Stop motion?
- Andrew Trinh
I cant wait to see how you keep up with so much while keeping your sanity
- Bobbi Newman
Um... sorry - new at friendfeed. Where do I find the video?
- Suzi Dafnis
Stay tuned, Suzi - I'm confident Robert will post the link.
- teleken
I just got into using ff so it'll be cool to see what I am missing out on using.
- Thomas Swift
Totally. Until this real time thing launched I had no clue what to do with Friend feed. This video will be very helpful.
- MarkCarras
That's funny, because I was just going to tweet to see if anyone had good advice on FreindFeed...
- Lee Stranahan
It is up at http://www.kyte.tv/scobleizer
- Robert Scoble
Bummer that Kyte doesn't seem to work in FF on Linux :(
- James D Kirk
great video, very helpful, never knew about the double tap for hide, thanks Robert
- Patphelan
I got video, no audio, Kubuntu 810, Firefox.
- kevin
Listening to it now. Thanks for the renewal of my amazement of Friendfeed.
- Tyler (Chacha)
watching now - this is something i need - a video tutorial (won't say the 'dummies' word LOL)
- planetMitch
Seems to work in Ubuntu with Firefox.
- Steven Perez
Steven, I use several Ubuntu's (8.10, 32 and 64 bits), perhaps too low bandwidth to Spain?
- Ricardo Galli
It will only play the first 5 minutes, but they were a good 5 minutes... Edit: seems to work now.
- xero
I'm watching it now, Ubuntu 8.10 Opera 9.62
- Alejandro
very good- watching now
- anna sauce
I have to say, the only time I can really express the value of FF is when people get annoyed with Twitter, and I say, it'd be nice to have an aggregator, right? And then, they get it. Or a big bubble diagram showing RSS feeds and overlaps
- anna sauce
Thanks Robert. Great overview of FF. Where do I send a check? :)
- Joe Lima
Great, I'm going back and forth from the video as I set up a friendfeed account. Thanks!
- David Creelman
Good work. Thank you. I want to know more about the email to FF tip you mentioned. What will part 2 have in it? ;-)
- Amani
Amani: that info is here: http://friendfeed.com/share...
- Robert Scoble
thanks for making this! Its got me looking at FF again - aggregation is good.
- Casey
Very informative and useful video. Thanks for putting this together!
- Laura Zickus
Robert, I will invest some time in FF thanks to you!
- Alex Doman
Great intro - been thinking about signing up for a while but didn't know where to start!
- Mark Warren
Thanks for this! Great information about hiding & searching.
- Thomas Swift
Great video, Robert. Thank you! :)
- Heidi Jeffers Thibodeau
Good video, now we need an advanced FF user video. ;-)
- Kol Tregaskes
Great video. Thanks for posting, Robert. :)
- Kali
Arrington just called and wanted to know what the best new company of 2008 was. I told him one of the iPhone app companies.
Orli Yakuel, Kipp Bodnar, Tyler (Chacha) and 13 other people liked this
I have few in mind... maybe you should open a whole discussion on that Robert.
- Orli Yakuel
Orli: there is a discussion in here: http://bit.ly/9Mvq
- Nir Ben Yona
"Arrington just called" WOW. Did he say anything about your intervention?
- Roberto Bonini
I am glad you guys remain good friends despite all the crazy crap :)
- Susan Beebe
Is the Crip/Blood feud over?
- Derrick
Susan: who said we are friends, or good, for that matter? :-) Derrick: Arrington told me fights happen in the absence of news. So, more fights ahead! :-)
- Robert Scoble
did FF launch in 07 or 08?
- Morgan
Morgan: friendfeed launched in october 07.
- Robert Scoble
damn - it's like a film that misses the oscars just as a factor of its release date.
- Morgan
Interesting question, Chances are we wont know till 2010. :P
- Geoff Schultz
I'd say Tapulous, Dropbox, or Boxee.
- Brandon Titus
Some guy who writes closed source software that runs on proprietary hardware is the "best new company of 08"? Maybe 1988, but I thought we were supposed to be past that nonsense.
- Mr. Gunn
I'll take a well supported walled garden any day.
- Geoff Schultz
Treetree app inspired by Dave Winer really is nice (threaded twitter w/ online media / photo)
- Susan Beebe
What is your favorite new company of 2008?
Amani, Dario Salvelli, Michael Wuensch and 13 other people liked this
Evernote probably
- Adi Rabinovich
Evernote was my first thought as well, but have a feeling that as a company, they were not 'born' in 2008, it's just the year they seemed to explode. Maybe largely due to their superb iPhone app???
- Patrick Jordan
Logical Awesome (creators of GitHub)
- Eric Florenzano
Gosh, I'm trying to think of 1st yr co's that are a hit.
- Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
I'm a big fan of Evernote, too, but I have notes going back to 2007 so I think that disqualifies them here.
- Akiva Moskovitz
Ping.fm probabl
- Francisco Espinoza
great question. NextBus (older than 2008, but to me I started using heavily in 2008)
- anna sauce
"Sunnyvale, CA – Oct. 20, 2004 – EverNote Corporation today announced the release of EverNote 1.0 beta for Windows, an easy to use, yet powerful note-taking solution. EverNote gives users a single place for all types of notes and information and makes them instantly accessible at any time, in any place. "
- Ken Sheppardson
"Emeryville, California – August 10, 2000 – NextBus Information Systems, Inc... has successfully taken the frustration out of using public transportation. On August 10, 2000, San Francisco's half-million transit riders will be able to access real-time vehicle arrival information, not schedules, on their wireless devices."
- Ken Sheppardson
OK, OK... sorry... :-)
- Ken Sheppardson
Robert, changed my mind. Totally slipped that my friend started his design firm and it rocks! Tribute Media @corey_smith.
- Ken Stewart | ChangeForge
I would have said TripIt, but I just checked and they launched at the end of 2007, so don't quite make it.
- John
Mr. Tweet... or tweetdeck? that's this year. FF is last year, right?
- anna sauce
One of my favorites would be blip.fm. I like being able to share my musical tastes one track at a time and having them broadcast over twitter / friendfeed and other services.
- Jon, the Chilled Beartato
Nobody agrees with me about Logical Awesome and GitHub? EDIT: FWIW I agree ping.fm is pretty awesome too.
- Eric Florenzano
Social | Median, Peoplebrowsr, Google street view, Brightkite, new Facebook, star walk (iPhone app)
- Susan Beebe
Animoto! Their service is awesome
- Jay
12seconds.tv, oh yeah, Evernote.
- Ian May
Snapily.com - this startup has a unique technology, which was developed for 7 years and bringing something fresh and new to the this huge market of Photo Marchendising
- Yaron Orenstein
from twhirl
i.TV
- Jesse Stay
Evernote doesn't count, they've been around a while now and already had a good product before entering the cloud. I'll go with Tapulous. They make Twinkle and the Tap Tap rhythm game series on the iPhone. They've already set up downloadable tracks and licensed songs.
- Rodfather
I don't know how they make money, but I use the AirMe app for iPhone more than any other new company's product.
- Andrew
Already did this one! Socialmedian was the highest ranked independent co. With them purchased, I pick BackType.
- Louis Gray
definitely Tweetdeck, one guy working incredibly hard
- Patphelan
Nanosolar is my company of the year, even tho it was founded 2002, they got funding/released products this year, n they're real.
- Will Higgins™
Digsby?
- Aaron Myers
Meebo - but that may have been 2007 - vote up TweetDeck too.
- Hal
How about the GreaseMonkey guy(s)?
- Bryan R. Adams
@Hal - Meebo is a great company too, I think they were more '07. They keep getting better though, now with their introduction of Facebook and MySpace IM.
- Aaron Myers
Dropbox.
- Eric P
I'll second Eric Florenzano with github. It's changed my interactions with the world more than anything else and has done so in a way that could outlast the company.
- Dustin Sallings
DropBox
- Brad Nickel
I also vote for dropbox. Totally seamless and knowing I can revert back to any version of a document helps me sleep better.
- Dylan Parker
I like dropbox. My only complaint about them, and it is neglible is the size of uploads and total remote size. Other than that, very nice.
- Robert Miller
HP. I'm biased. No they aren't new. I don't care. shut up. I love you.
- Bwana ☠
Wordpress
- Jeremy Chone
I think people are missing the "new" part. I'd say Animoto, Boxee, Blip.fm and HelloTxt.
- Orli Yakuel
Semantinet, Boxee and Innovid.
- Dror Gill
ZocDoc.com - i think they are awesome and on track to be a household name.
- Adam Boalt
Tweetdeck
- Jason Goldberg
Popurls is My Pick for the Best Web Site of 2008 - http://www.micropersuasion.com/2008...
Michael Wuensch, Bibi, Marcel Weiß and 17 other people liked this
Hrm, never used this before. Guess I'll check it out.
- Rahsheen ™, Coach Rah
A lot of people don't know about it. That's too bad
- Steve Rubel
from IM
agree.
- Kurai (ff)
yeah i haven't really either as I thought alltop was supposed to be a "new and improved" version - guess i was wrong...will check it out again no doubt.
- Zee.
Isn't it 3 or 4 years old? I think its a cool service but its fundamentally the same as it was from day one (which is a good thing).
- Jamie
It is a few years old but Jamie, it has grown. Check it out,
- Steve Rubel
Making money! Does that mean turning a profit or just generating revenue?
- AJ Kohn
Thomas rocks.
- Allen Stern
Re the money you would need to ask him.
- Steve Rubel
from IM
Interesting but not a bad choice. (also Guy's imitation alltop is worst service of 2008)
- Erhan Erdogan
@AJ: profit - it's a one man show
- thomas marban
Thanks for the recommendation, Steve. I've found a new 'toy' to play with...
- Josh Karpf
Not very useful for me, but the interface is interesting.
- \/\/\/ ...загуголина
totally agree. i love popurls
- Thao Ly
http://friendfeed.com/popurls - he ports the data here too. (Hi Thomas!) :)
- Tamar Weinberg
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